"Roskosmos" will spend on the sketch of a superheavy rocket over 1,5 billion rubles

Roscosmos plans to spend on the development of a sketch of a super-heavy rocket 1 billion 613 million rubles, the development is planned to be completed by the end of October 2019, follows from the information posted on the public procurement website,

The rocket will have to output more than 80 tons to low Earth orbit and deliver at least 20 tons to the Moon. It is also noted that the project should lay the possibility of increasing the capacity to 140 and 27 tons to the corresponding orbits. In addition, it is planned to send ships and stations to Mars and Jupiter with the help of a new rocket. Flight to the moon should last no longer than five days

- Reported in the application.

In the 2028 year, as follows from the document, flight tests of the rocket should begin from the Vostochny cosmodrome. It is envisaged that up to two launches of an extra-heavy rocket can be carried out a year. A lifetime should not be less than 20 years.

The first stage of the super heavy carrier, created on the basis of the Soyuz-5 rocket, after launch should fall on the coast of the Tatar Strait or in the Sea of ​​Okhotsk, and the upper stages in the World Ocean. They must be equipped with GLONASS and GPS equipment.

Projects of superheavy launch vehicles are implemented only in the United States. Four launches of the H-1 carrier were carried out in the USSR; all of them were unsuccessful. The super-heavy “Energy” was launched in 1987 and 1988, both times successfully. The rocket was created, among other things, for the Soviet orbital spacecraft Buran, and the Energy-Buran program was closed in 1993.

Comments

[Herculesic]

I misunderstood something - Will they spend that kind of money on a drawing on a paper, or is it all blueprints, and R&D? If this is the cost of the drawing, even if you lay out the silhouette of the rocket with diamonds in carats, and the paper is made of solid gold, the cost is still overstated at times! !!

[maxim947]

I misunderstood something - Will they spend that kind of money on a drawing on a paper, or is it all blueprints, and R&D?

You simply absolutely do not understand the essence of this work, and try to draw high-profile conclusions. If they invest in this amount (which is unlikely), then this is absolutely normal. A sketchbook is not just a “drawing”, it is the result of tremendous work, involving hundreds of co-executing organizations,
Only here are the phrases from Roscosmos - it will ... should ... soon ... - the hearing is already cut.

[Proxima]

Quote: maxim947

A sketchbook is not just a “drawing”, it is the result of tremendous work, involving hundreds of co-executing organizations,

But seriously! Again another cut! Why reinvent the wheel when you can reanimate Energy. "Lives and lives" in the city of Samara, the manufacturer of "Energy" Rocket and Space Center "Progress". The manufacturer of the first stage of engines RD-0120 of JSC Design Bureau of Chemical Automation is functioning and not without success in Voronezh. The same can be said about the NPO Energomash, which still produces RD-170 zero-stage engines in the Khimki region near Moscow. And finally, to this day, the creator of this rocket, NPO Energia, is working successfully. There are stands (which in turn went to Energia from N-1) and much, much more. After all, any manufacturer will say that reanimating the old is always easier and cheaper than coming up with a completely new one. Although the energy of the "old" language does not turn to name. Nothing existed better than this rocket in world practice, and in the next 30 years it is unlikely that they will create anything worthy in the world.

[maxim947]

Hold on, Energy is not reanimated, as if this would not be desirable. Although everything on your couch looks pretty optimistic)))

[Proxima]

Quote: maxim947

Hold on, Energy is not reanimated, as if this would not be desirable. Although everything on your couch looks pretty optimistic)))

But I see that you are definitely a sofa specialist! To begin with, in Russian would learn to write. It was recently the anniversary of the flight of "Energy". The developers of this ingenious project gathered there. All unanimously declared that in 5-6 years this super-rocket could be reanimated, there would be a desire and political will. Or rocket developers who are all, thank God, alive and well, in your opinion - sofa specialists?

[maxim947]

And you probably stood nearby and heard everything personally? Not tired of procrastinating such gossip?
And the developers, unfortunately, have not been with us for a long time.

[Proxima]

Quote: maxim947

And you probably stood nearby and heard everything personally? Not tired of procrastinating such gossip?
And the developers, unfortunately, have not been with us for a long time.

This is not gossip, but information. They actually gave interviews. Here's what the VO moderator says, which incidentally worked on the profile:
Banshee
Moderator
143
148 publications
A complaint
Posted November 23, 2016
“I’ll give you an opinion from Energia on the opinion of engineers from KBHA. The blueprints that have disappeared are nonsense! Roughly speaking, they are only on paper for 4 railway wagons. You’ll burn everything. It’s all. Moreover, some are even digitized. A hydrogen workshop under the "Energy" they built, intact. The people who received orders for it are still alive. So there would be a desire, "Energy" will still fly. "[i] [/ i]
PS: And here is the stand
.

[maxim947]

Not a test bench. Many enterprises involved in work in Ukraine, including South Mash, a part no longer exists, etc., etc.
And so, in principle, nothing is impossible, but it will be much more expensive and more complicated, and plus it will be not “that” Energy, but another product.

[Proxima]

Quote: maxim947

... And so, in principle, nothing is impossible, but it will be much more expensive and more complicated ..

More expensive and more complicated than what? Than from scratch designed and made rocket?

[Days]

When designing all new weapons, they use the experience and achievements of all previous projects. Where did you get the idea that it is for the new superheavy that the energy backlogs will not be used?

[zoolu350]

Of course I cut it. The Energia launch vehicle is the only one theoretically capable of delivering 5% of the total mass to the NOO. This is the most advanced launch vehicle on planet Earth in a block design. The decision to develop the Angara launch vehicle range on the basis of the RD-190 engine is to cut, wreck and betrayal in its purest form, since the smallest engine in the RD-170 line was taken as the basis and on its basis to create a heavy class launch vehicle is the ceiling. Even the compromise LV with the RD-180 LV was rejected, although Soyuz spacecraft could be launched on a monoblock, the tri-block was superior in carrying capacity to the Proton-M LV, and on the basis of block 5-7 it was even possible to create a miserable LV of an extra heavy class So that the oligarchy of the Russian Federation will not pull the restoration of the technological chain of the Energia LV. They will go along the simple path of creating a 5-7 block Zenit LV based on the RD-171, although this could have been done the day before yesterday.

[maxim947]

Why compare the single-chamber RD-190 with the four-chamber 170th. ?! This is not correct to say the least ...
190th by the way, this is a derivative of the 170th.

[zoolu350]

Do you read what they write to you? In my post above it is said that RD-190 is a derivative of RD-170. Everything is correct. Initially, the Angara launch vehicle was to be created on the basis of the RD-170. How the oligarchy of the Russian Federation turned the Angara launch vehicle into that squalor that it now has is a separate issue.

[slipped]

And what is the "squalor" of the Angara launch vehicle, please enlighten?

[zoolu350]

The decision to develop the Angara launch vehicle range on the basis of the RD-190 engine is to cut, wreck and betrayal in its purest form, for the basis was taken by the LOWEST POWER ENGINE in the RD-170 line and on its basis to create a heavy-class launch vehicle is the CEILING. This is the key I gave you, since my first post was not read or did not reach. Do you think the transition from 4% LV to NOU (Energy), to 3% LV to NOU (Angara), is it progress or regression?

[slipped]

The Angara launch vehicle in the heavy class is a replacement for the Proton, with the same characteristics. And she copes with it perfectly. To demand more from her is utter stupidity.

[zoolu350]

And the Energia-M launch vehicle could replace the Proton launch vehicle and the Rus and Zenit launch vehicles, and not just the Angara launch vehicle, which has the worst indicators for the mass of those listed on the DOE.

[slipped]

The Angara launch vehicle in the heavy version has the SAME indicators like the Proton in mass-size filling, which is not clear to you? and goes to replace it.

[Proxima]

Quote: zoolu350

Of course I cut it. The Energia launch vehicle is the only one theoretically capable of delivering 5% of the total mass to the NOO. This is the most advanced launch vehicle on the planet Earth in a block design.

Yes, and not blocky either. How is the block principle different from the tandem? Yes, because it is very flexible in relation to the output payload. "Energy" in the variant "Energy M" displayed on the NOU "only" 35 tons, and in the variant "Volcano-Hercules" - 170 tons! No Saturn 5 ever dreamed of this. Oh! What kind of apparatus are we talking about ... whether!

[Vadim237]

And launching with the help of "such an apparatus" would cost more than a dozen billion rubles.

[Zubr]

No Saturn 5 ever dreamed of that. Oh! What kind of apparatus are we talking about ... whether! negative

Yes, ENERGY, we patted our ears. There was an infa, the Kalashnikov concern bought out 60% of the shares of the Molniya NGO, which means the shuttle case will not be allowed to stall. It remains only to NPO Energia to revive its carrier.

[Vadim237]

The only thing left was to find the extra trillion rubles for all this.

[zoolu350]

Billions of dollars are being "found" for yachts, villas, football clubs, shopping tours for men in Milan, Sechina, Deripaska and Vickselberg, but "there is no money for a modern launch vehicle, but are you holding on?" Soon catch up with Golovan Jack at VO due to the inadequacy of the explanation of the wretched actions of the oligarchy of the Russian Federation.

[Vadim237]

But you don’t count other people's money - count those that are in the budget. And I am generally skeptical of launch vehicles, since an air launch is much more promising and cheaper. And some countries are developing it now.

[zoolu350]

This is not someone else's money, but stolen from ordinary people. I bring to your attention that any super-sophisticated existing and promising BTA aircraft will lift MAXIMUM 250-400 tons to a height of 10000 meters. When launched with existing taxiways, with this mass and such a height, the mass of the payload at the DOE will be no more than 25-40 tons. That is, heavyweight cannot be created at an air launch. And by the way, your favorite oligarch of the Russian Federation, ditched the MAKS project (the one that has an air start), since the oligarch of the Russian Federation does not consider other people's money, it assigns it.

[Svetlana]

Quote: zoolu350

Any super-sophisticated existing and promising BTA aircraft will lift MAXIMUM 250-400 tons to a height of 10000 meters.

Instead of a BTA airplane, you can use a promising thermal airship such as a flying saucer. It has a payload of more than 250-400 tons. When heating the thermal airship plate from below with microwave beams from the HEADLIGHTS, it can be raised to a height of more than 30 km along with the payload, and from there the air start of the payload can already be carried out.

[Proxima]

Quote: Herkulesich

I misunderstood something - Will they spend that kind of money on a drawing on a paper, or is it all blueprints, and R&D? If this is the cost of the drawing, even if you lay out the silhouette of the rocket with diamonds in carats, and the paper is made of solid gold, the cost is still overstated at times! !!

For a sketch, even for a visual 3D model, let Roskosmos turn to me. Ready to work "even" for 1% of the above amount

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: Proxima

For a sketch, even for a visual 3D model, let Roskosmos turn to me. Ready to work "even" for 1% of the above amount

Have you issued an IP?

[Charik]

Do you spit? At least 0,001

[Nikolaevich I]

Roscosmos will serve!

[Proxima]

Quote: Charik

Do you spit? At least 0,001

No questions, dear! I’m ready to share the skin of an unkilled bear and the feathers of a crane in the sky with unprecedented generosity!

[papas-57]

Or maybe for 10% order in Hollywood a video of the landing of Russian astronauts on the moon. They may have preserved the scenery.

[tomket]

So will they spend so much on a sketch, or completely on a development program?

[210ox]

Zhurnalyugi (and maybe in the "Roskosmos" press service) their mother’s mother ..

Quote: tomket

So will they spend so much on a sketch, or completely on a development program?

[Gray brother]

Quote: tomket

So will they spend so much on a sketch, or completely on a development program?

For the entire project, along with the construction of production facilities, one and a half trillion.

[Piramidon]

And the project "Energy" can not be revived?

[maxim947]

Not that which is impossible is impossible.

[zoolu350]

Perhaps, as said above. Just the oligarchy of the Russian Federation is pathetic and flawed for such a breakthrough project. He would only saw and roll.

[slipped]

It is impossible.

[Proxima]

Quote: zoolu350

Perhaps, as said above. Just the oligarchy of the Russian Federation is pathetic and flawed for such a breakthrough project. He would only to nag и roll away.

Perfectly! The order will be when every Russian official will ensure that he knows how and loves. Do you like to cut - please drank taiga in places "not so distant", you know how to work with kickbacks - no problem, roll out trolleys with the breed in the same places!
And then we will have super-heavy rockets flying and the "winter cherries" will not burn.

[donavi49]

A simple example - Hartron made brains. Even if it is returned with brute force along with Kharkov, it will not take off. Hartron has died. A long time ago.

It has already come out - the task is to make new brains for the rocket.

Next comes the task of replacing / restoring the production of 100500 small parts. From gaskets from special compounds to all kinds of functional blocks and fasteners.

And in the end, we come to the need to actually make the rocket anew. Under engines and calculated documentation (which will also have to be recounted 30 years have passed, many small breakthroughs and innovations should be added).

Well and the main thing. Missile is not cheap. In the USSR, the launch pulled by 160mln rubles. Now it is only getting more expensive. The same Havik stands today 90-120 with return or 150 at full load without return. That is, the payback of the project is immediately in question when a competitor already has a rocket cheaper, and not only market pressure puts pressure on you, but also not market circumstances (sanctions, pressure on corporations not to conclude contracts with the Russian Federation, etc.).

[Proxima]

Quote: donavi49

A simple example - Hartron made brains. Even if it is returned with brute force along with Kharkov, it will not take off. Hartron has died. A long time ago.
It has already come out - the task is to make new brains for the rocket.

Why do you need this, but do you need to develop “brains” for a new missile?

Quote: donavi49

Well and the main thing. Missile is not cheap. In the USSR, the launch pulled by 160mln rubles. Now it is only getting more expensive. The same Havik stands today 90-120 with return or 150 at full load without return. That is, the payback of the project is immediately in question when a competitor already has a rocket cheaper, and not only market pressure puts pressure on you, but also not market circumstances (sanctions, pressure on corporations not to conclude contracts with the Russian Federation, etc.).

The declared cheapness of Felkne Heavy launches is another bluff of the Martian con man Mask. Moreover, the rocket itself starts with 27 engines, plus with a sophisticated system of fuel transfer from the sidewalls to the central unit - a priori obviously stillborn. And this is the only launch of Khivik, nothing more than an attempt to once again pump money from NASA's budget.
And since you touched on the topic of money, ask how much it costs to build a launch pad for super-heavy. Well, we are going to build it on the "East" - is not it idiocy ?! What is the table from "Energy" not satisfied? (which by the way was inherited from N-1).

[donavi49]

In general, the Heavy program came to him without the significant participation of NASA. And the second - NASA does not look at Heavy at all. She has her own cash cow SLS, as well as a very powerful lobby of Orbital and YULA - which basically remove the load of NASA.

Here's what flies to Heavy:
2018 summer - a certification flight for the US Air Force + with a dozen satellites in passing (mostly commercial).
the end of the year - the largest Arab satellite Arabsat6 + with a dozen more in passing.

orders for 2 rockets are formed in the 2019 year. Also mostly commercial load.

Why do you need this, but do you need to develop “brains” for a new missile?

It is necessary. But I only mean that there is no Energy. She died inside (the majority of allies, cooperation fell apart, even those enterprises that have not lost their competence, produce products in demand for other missiles). If it is resurrected, it will be actually another rocket with all stages of development. By time and money.

[papas-57]

'' Not that which is impossible, impossible. '' And comrade I.V. Stalin would say that for the Russians there is no word `` impossible ''. He would be warmly supported by comrade L.P. Beria. And two years later the rocket would fly.

[Borik]

[/ i] Roscosmos will spend on the sketch of a superheavy rocket over 1,5 billion rubles [i]

A sketch is just a drawing. Nowadays art is expensive. He painted a rocket for you, and a half billion. I will go to the artists.

[Charik]

current these hu.zhniki in Roskosmos

[Genry]

Quote: Borik

A sketch is just a drawing. Nowadays art is expensive. He painted a rocket for you, and a half billion. I will go to the artists.

Artists, did not hear about the draft design?

[Vkd dvk]

Quote: Borik

[/ i] Roscosmos will spend on the sketch of a superheavy rocket over 1,5 billion rubles [i]

A sketch is just a drawing. Nowadays art is expensive. He painted a rocket for you, and a half billion. I will go to the artists.

You need to consult with the designer first. A draft design is not a sketch. http://www.cb-online.ru/tehnicheskaya-dokumentaci
ya / konstruktorskaya-dokumentaciya / oformlenie-kons
truktorskoy-dokumentacii / eskizniy-proekt /
And to learn one proverb of designers- How tezeknets, and teuketknut.
In the sense that TK is written before ES, and TU after, and the more detailed and justified the Terms of Reference are written, the simpler the implementation. And to write Technical Conditions after this is the work of the first year.

[Mountain shooter]

Serious car ... God grant us ... Achieve the correct result ... This requires iron will and ... responsibility.

[Archivist Vasya]

"Roskosmos" will spend on the sketch of a superheavy rocket over 1,5 billion rubles

They put the wrong word in quotation marks - Roscosmos will "spend" on the sketch ..., well, or cut it, then without the quotation marks.

[Genry]

Quote: Archivist Vasya

Roscosmos will "spend" on the sketch ..., well, or cut it, then without the quotes.

Change the training manual, otherwise it is rotten.

[1536]

Yes, at least something new has been done for the future or in the future. One gets the impression that only money is "mastered" on a cosmic scale, and only museum workers think about astronautics.

[tchoni]

The funny thing is that the basis is again "union" !!! But what about the "hangar"?

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: tchoni

The funny thing is that the basis is again "union" !!! But what about the "hangar"?

Is it possible to lay designer eggs in different baskets?

[Genry]

Quote: tchoni

But what about the "hangar"?

The hangar will not pull such weight. Here we are talking about a superheavy rocket.

[zoolu350]

Not “union”, but “Zenit” launch vehicle. The Angara launch vehicle range, as I said above, is a step backward, wrecking, betrayal, cutting and rollback.

[Dead duck]

Roscosmos plans to spend on the development of a sketch of a superheavy rocket 1 billion 613 million rubles

Done, I agree to 1 / 10

[Nikolaevich I]

Quote: Deadush

Done, I agree to 1 / 10

Let the tender be announced! So that everything is according to the law!

[Dead duck]

Enough for everyone there, the main thing is not to be greedy

[Romulus]

Quote: Nikolaevich I

Let the tender be announced! So that everything is according to the law!

Smiled .. once announced, then there is a sketch and a winner is available)
But the end result is a question of questions
We all live in time with the "goldfish effect" ..

[Gray brother]

Quote: Deadush

Done, I agree to 1 / 10

There is a trifle left - to substantiate why the product should look that way. Good luck to you.

[Dead duck]

Quote: Gray Brother

There is a trifle left - to substantiate why the product should look that way. Good luck to you.

This is the author’s vision ... and there was no technical task.
I can display it like that

[Gray brother]

Quote: Deadush

This is an author's vision ...

This is also the author’s vision, and the practical value is zero.

[Dead duck]

he already has money for cartoons and ideas ... especially strangers (both money and ideas)
our flight of thoughts is also unlimited ... we just look at things more practical ...
enough for us and a little bit, greed does not bring to good

[voyaka uh]

"This is the author’s vision ... and there was no technical task." ////

This is depressive suicidal vision. . After taking the antidepressant pill, rotate the leaflet 180 degrees. It needs to fly up .
And draw the moon above . For clarity.

[Dead duck]

Quote: voyaka uh

This is a depressive suicidal vision. After taking the antidepressant pill, expand the leaflet at 180 degrees. It is necessary to fly up.
And draw the moon above. For clarity.

With Freud, you would be your favorite patient.
You need to have talent to invent so much from a simple picture.
And why did you decide that it is upside down and will not fly like that ?!! ...
Figurative thinking can deceive ...
"not everything is what it seems"

[Micfoster]

All missiles look like this. They look like a pencil and there are theoretical grounds for this.

[KVU-NSVD]

Now, on the basis of the Union-5..A is the superheavy version of the Hangar all? You mastered the development money and forgot? .. Well, that way you can draw pictures for a long time ..

[win]

A superheavy rocket is usually made in four stages:
1. The sketch.
2. The work itself.
3. Launch.
4. Answers to idiotic questions of mentally retarded people

[Herculesic]

And now, highly intellectual , re-read the article a couple of hundred times, and look for those “idiotic questions” in the comments, for that is only your comment! !!

[win]

I agree. In childhood, was stupid.
But now it’s well preserved ...

PS It was a joke. And emoticons in place

[voyaka uh]

"Superheavy rocket, as a rule, is done in four stages" ////
No. A superheavy rocket is usually made in 6 XN stages:
1. The sketch.
2. Answers to idiotic questions about the sketch of mentally retarded people
3. Getting money to work from these mentally handicapped people
4. The work itself.
5. Launch.
6. Answers to the idiotic questions of mentally retarded people: "why did you fall?"
Repeat the cycle until it flies.

[K-50]

Roscosmos plans to spend on the development of a sketch of a superheavy rocket 1 billion 613 million rubles

Campaign the most expensive picture of our time will be.

[tomket]

Quote: K-50

Campaign the most expensive picture of our time will be.

Something painted Da Vinci, oh, something painted .......

[Alex-a832]

Comments on the primitive understanding of what is hidden in this case under the concept of "sketch" are funny. If it is public procurement and an open tender, then anyone can look into the statement of work. It seems to me that those confident in their artistic abilities will greatly decrease ...

[Micfoster]

I can make a sketch for even the 3D model.

[Dead duck]

Quote: Micfoster

I can make a sketch for even the 3D model.

but-but ... competition is not welcome ...
but we can cooperate and share

[Micfoster]

I am for! 50 / 50! All into space!

[Dead duck]

Quote: Micfoster

I am for! 50 / 50! All into space!

already a couple of people (above) "got on their tail" ... 50 / 50 will not work ...
More precisely, it can happen, but after some they’ll be offended ... and the kickbacks

[gippernano]

I end up making artifacts a little cheaper, but from my Americans, they just don’t gasp, commendable

[Charik]

cartoon for one and a half yards normul-SoyuzMultFilm smokes bamboo

[Andrey591]

One must think, "outline design."

[Golovan Jack]

Keywords -

Quote: Andrey591

Need to think

And the people here struck on a hee hee, a campaign.

[Click]

It is not surprising if 85 billion is allocated for the "development" of a superjet ...

[friend of animals]

The foggy prospect of 2028 is whether there will be a rocket, whether there will be cargo for such a powerful rocket, whether Mars will be needed by anyone at all. So far, the idea of ​​creating a rocket is similar to participating in a space race, in which it is more important not only to come first, but not to be left behind on the way no one knows where.

[Aqr009]

... will there be cargo for such a powerful rocket ...

This is the beauty of the batch scheme, if there is no cargo, then unfasten the heels of the blocks, put them in a warehouse, and fly yourself on a medium-class carrier, and as soon as the cargo appears, quickly fasten them and, voila, ready for overweight

[Vadim237]

"2028" - Will Roskosmos?

[Samara_63]

So there was already information that the director general of the RCC Progress had already made a sketch. The truth was removed ...

[zivXP]

The first thing to do is to deploy air defense on the Russian Moon. And then you never know what.

[senima56]

2028 year? Those. after 10 years? As the famous Haja Nasreddin said: "10 years is a long time. Someone will surely die: either the shah, or the donkey, or me!"

[BAI]

Something I do not really like. More like another cut of money. What did Koptev, the former head of Roscosmos, say there? "This is some kind of nonsense - there is budget money and they have not been stolen."
Although I understand perfectly well that the word "sketch" does not mean a drawing, but a standard stage of development - "Sketch design". For such a rocket - paper 20 pounds will pull. How many volumes is hard to say.

[Micfoster]

Most likely 20 GB of compass files. I do not believe that ours are working in solid or auto cad.

[astepanov]

I didn’t understand something. And a month has not passed since the day when the president announced a space transport system with a nuclear power plant, which is supposed to deliver our devices to the Moon already in 2019, and a little later - to be brought to Mars in a month. Then why build a new expensive superheavy rocket? What is it to launch into space? What kind of Mars will she take us to? Enlighten, citizens, fool, I ask Christ-God ...

[Svetlana]

An ultra-heavy launch vehicle is needed, for example, to protect the Earth from asteroids.
Vice Prime Minister Rogozin proposed a couple of years ago to shoot down Earth asteroids using intercontinental ballistic missiles, and scientists from California proposed making an orbital phased array laser with an area of ​​several square kilometers, capable of “pushing” a large asteroid from its orbit. Billion for the fight against asteroids was proposed by Konstantin Sivkov. According to the scientist, the inhabitants of the planet now need to start creating a thermonuclear rocket capable of carrying a charge of up to 210-100 megatons.
http://emigrados.ru/2018/03/letayuschiy-korabl-dl
ya-unichtozheniya-asteroidov-sozdast /
https://360tv.ru/news/nauka_i_tehnologiya/termoja
dernuju-megaraketu-za-210-mlrd-dlja-borby-s-aster
oidami-predlozhil-sozdat-uchenyj-iz-rf /

[Normal ok]

Roscosmos plans to spend

In as they formulate now, they do not plan to build, but "plan to spend."

[Bypassed]

Creative success.
The cardboard layout of the Federation was already shown to me.
Note - this is not a chuckle - the model was cut out of pressed cardboard in kind.
Perhaps next year they will invite you to see the new layout.
When fly to the moon? (yourself)

[dgonni]

Now, if without any polemics and cries. WHAT FOR? In 2028, this rocket? Falcon heavy has already taken place, one class is practically the same load! Musk plans by 2022 BFR, and this is a completely different class of load and flight range. Purely cut the loot?

[donavi49]

Well, this is a concrete answer to the divine cow of the SLS Congress - funding seems to be the same of course on a scale. The Americans have already mastered 16 billion - they plan to 35 billion by 25 year (with production already, each rocket is 500 million) with the option 7bn of possible additional financing from 2020 year (following the results of the first flight in 2019 year).

One BUT! SLS flies next year, and in 22, people are already on the moon.

[Svetlana]

Quote: dgonni

WHAT FOR?

An ultra-heavy launch vehicle may be needed not only for the exploration of the Moon and Mars, but also for defense purposes. There are points on the surface of the moon, the vertical start from which returns to Earth in the shortest possible time. They need to be protected. Moreover, the international situation is unstable, and "super-heavy" may be required at any time, and not only and not so much for exploring the Moon and other planets "
RIA Novosti https://ria.ru/science/20180328/1517460185.html

[Vadim237]

2028 is only the first flight, and then another 10 years of testing, and as a result we get a 100% finished product in about 2040.

[fa2998]

Quote: Proxima

Again another cut!

Well, as much as possible, once again. At the expense of the government, one more rocket to do. Ten years of trouble-free life. We made Energy, there are not only drawings, there is technology. After all, it flew. Then it’s Angara. It’s light itself, but it was supposed to be connected 1 -3-5 .. depending on the load. Everyone has mastered and forgot money. Who needs it, even if it finances, otherwise the bulk of the projects, and more and more!

[donavi49]

Energy needs to be done anew. Why? So that's it. Collapse of cooperation. There are some parts from Ukraine, for example. She stupidly will not fly. There is a computer from Hartron (which actually died). That is, for example, all brains must be done anew.

Well, the main trouble. Even in the USSR - 160mln rubles launch. Today, with modernization and other things, the price tag will grow substantially. By 200 million already dollars. Musk offers his full bundle 150mln at full load or 90-120 with return.

[AID.S]

But is it us, the exploration of the moon? If only for military needs to bring that to the near-Earth, some kind of death star. Can we have what?

[Andrey Panov]

Please forgive the wretchedness of my thought, but did the GDP say something about cruise missiles with thermonuclear engines? But is it not from this opera?

[vetlan19]

GDP did not talk about cruise missiles with thermonuclear engines.
Watch and listen carefully at 4.18, 5.04, 5.32
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whPclmHOWRM
And here to understand the operation of such an engine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeSdNJVS658

[Vadim237]

"Fusion rockets" This is a promising area of ​​development - 2060.

[astepanov]

Not thermonuclear, but simply nuclear. He said that in metal, such crap will fly to the moon, possibly until the end of 2019. "It is planned that the model of nuclear nuclear power systems for testing will be created by 2019. And the first flights into space using a similar power plant will take place in the 2020s." - This is here, in the "Space" section, written before Putin’s speech. It is a megawatt-class space transport system with nuclear-powered engines and ion engines. This installation, apparently, is a sister with the fact that on underwater vehicles and a cruise missile with nuclear reactors. How does an extra-heavy rocket fit in - I can’t imagine. Maybe someone from the specialists will explain?

[Old26]

Quote: Proxima

But seriously! Again another cut! Why reinvent the wheel when you can reanimate Energy. "Lives and lives" in the city of Samara, the manufacturer of "Energy" Rocket and Space Center "Progress". The manufacturer of the first stage of engines RD-0120 of JSC Design Bureau of Chemical Automation is functioning and not without success in Voronezh. The same can be said about the NPO Energomash, which still produces RD-170 zero-stage engines in the Khimki region near Moscow. And finally, to this day, the creator of this rocket, NPO Energia, is working successfully.

And this is not a bicycle invention. “Energy” cannot be reanimated in principle. You remembered everything, except that the sidewalls are based on the south-mash Zenit. Moreover, judging by the publications, we have lost the technology for the production of liquid hydrogen. After the last flight of Energia, there has not been a single launch in 30 years, where engines using liquid-oxygen and liquid hydrogen were used. And it would seem, which is better. In its parameters, with the same dimensions, such an engine is superior to competing oxygen-kerosene ones. However, no ....

Quote: Proxima

Although the energy of the "old" language does not turn to name. Nothing existed better than this rocket in world practice, and in the next 30 years it is unlikely that they will create anything worthy in the world.

Yes, stop writing nonsense. Nothing existed better than this rocket - it is true. In terms of their parameters, they had missiles with higher performance characteristics. And even now, the SLS rocket with parameters higher than that of Energia is at the output. But what kind of h.r.ena initial parameters are set worse than at 30-year-old Energy - that’s the question.

Quote: Proxima

and in the version "Volcano-Hercules" - 170t! No Saturn 5 ever dreamed of this.

The only difference is that Saturn 5 flew, and Volcano was exclusively a paper rocket. In addition to the base, there was nothing else in the metal and with the engines. Even Energia-M existed as a model layout

Quote: Zubr

No Saturn 5 ever dreamed of that. Oh! What kind of apparatus are we talking about ... whether! negative

Yes, ENERGY, we patted our ears. There was an infa, the Kalashnikov concern bought out 60% of the shares of the Molniya NGO, which means the shuttle case will not be allowed to stall. It remains only to NPO Energia to revive its carrier.

Well, the fact that they didn’t allow Lightning to finally bend is good. But what for "Kalashnikov" non-core assets ?????

Quote: Proxima

Why do you need this, but do you need to develop “brains” for a new missile?

It's him that you say that restoring Energy is no problem. It turns out there are problems ...

Quote: Proxima

What is the table from "Energy" not satisfied? (which by the way was inherited from N-1).

What didn’t they try to find out with him now at Baikonur? In what condition is it there ???