US criticized in Baku for accepting the head of the Nagorno-Karabakh Republic in Congress

In Transcaucasia, they actively comment on the visit of the head of the Nagorno-Karabakh Republic Bako Sahakian to the United States. During his visit, Sahakyan held a number of meetings, including a meeting with Executive Director of the Armenian Assembly of America, Brian Arduni. In addition, Sahakyan attended the US Congress, which, for obvious reasons, caused a wave of indignation in Baku.

Azerbaijani media cites the comment of the Deputy Chairman of the Parliament of the Republic, Bahar Muradova, regarding the reception of Sahakian in the US Congress (quote Aze.az):

We see the US attitude to other countries on this issue. However, with regard to Azerbaijan, we see the exact opposite. In the world there is practically no policy that is based on the principles of international law. Expressing unequivocally on this issue is difficult, since contradictions in the foreign policy of the largest states do not allow expressing a concrete opinion. That is, now we do not specifically know about the unequivocal attitude of a large state, which is the co-chair of the OSCE Minsk Group, and specifically the United States, towards separatism and the territorial integrity of countries. I don’t think that there they would not know about the separatist regime created in the occupied territories of Azerbaijan. The United States cannot but understand that the invitation of the head of the illegal regime in the United States, his participation in various events and receptions, the appeals made by him do not comply with the mandate of the OSCE Minsk Group and contradict the norms of international law. By this they question their position in Azerbaijan, undermine confidence in the efforts being made to solve the problem.

Bako Sahakyan himself highly appreciated the American interest in the situation in Transcaucasia and thanked the Armenian Assembly of America for organizing meetings with the American congressmen.

Earlier, journalists asked Maria Zakharova to comment on the visit of Bako Sahakyan to Washington, DC. The official representative of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation answered that it was better for journalists to address this question to the American side. At the same time, Maria Zakharova noted that this visit is probably part of a great diplomatic work.

Azerbaijan states that the outcome of Saakyan’s visit to the United States may be a new aggravation of the conflict.

Comments

[Safevi]

This is an indicator that officials who are not very smart and inexperienced in politics are sitting there now. Why aggravate relations with us out of the blue? How aggravated relations with Turkey, its faithful ally because of the Kurds, who, like a weather vane, are ready to sell to anyone.

[Hunter 2]

Quote: sefevi

This is an indicator that officials who are not very smart and inexperienced in politics are sitting there now. Why aggravate relations with us out of the blue?

Opachki, you’re straight Mr. Evidence!
And - with Us. Why ???
Moreover, in almost all directions!
Given that, unlike you, we can send an answer!

[Bakht]

In what areas are relations with Russia spoiled?
If not difficult, point by point ...
And what kind of "answer" are we talking about?
Chatting, not tossing bags ....

https://ria.ru/spravka/20170721/1498936906.html

[vorobey]

Quote: Bakht

In what areas are relations with Russia spoiled?

You didn’t understand Bakhtiyar ... there is no talk about Russia in the commentary .. we are talking about US-Azerbaijan relations

[Bakht]

So I misunderstood ... Guilty ...

[Okolotochny]

This refers to the USA - Russia, and not Azerbaijan - Russia. The point is that the United States is very unstable ....... partner.

[vorobey]

Quote: sefevi

Why aggravate relations with us out of the blue?

very smart people are sitting there ... it’s already clear which game they will begin to play against the backdrop of losing in Syria. exacerbate your situation in order to indirectly strain relations between Turkey and Russia. Karabakh is a pawn in their game ... and people's lives in case of aggravation are just dust.

[vlad66]

Quote: sefevi

Why aggravate relations with us out of the blue?

Are you however the navel of the earth? Why aggravate? It’s so simple that everything would be pushed together by the foreheads and again to stir up the bloodshed in Karabakh to distract Russia from Syria. The next will be your official and they will say that they will support us too, but the Azerbaijanis and Armenians will die in Karabakh.

[RUSS]

Quote: sefevi

This is an indicator that officials who are not very smart and inexperienced in politics are sitting there now. Why aggravate relations with us out of the blue? How aggravated relations with Turkey, its faithful ally because of the Kurds, who, like a weather vane, are ready to sell to anyone.

In the USA, the strongest Armenian lobby and that’s it.

[Yujanin.]

This is an indicator that officials who are not very smart and inexperienced in politics are sitting there now.

Obviously, this is the White House’s response to Russian-Azerbaijani military cooperation.

[INTER]

Quote: Yujanin.

Obviously, this is the White House’s response to Russian-Azerbaijani military cooperation.

Sense to answer someone? Armenia is a country controlled by Russia, where there is our base and all smart people know that without Russia Armenia will not survive even a week. So this can be a simple visit because it does not make much sense, and he is not the president, and he cannot make decisions.
Few Azerbaijani politicians visit NATO member countries? So what, let it be!

[Yujanin.]

INTER

Sense to answer someone?

In light of US sanctions against Russian military-industrial enterprises, the sudden flirtation of the White House with the Armenian separatists is aimed at limiting new deliveries of Russian weapons to Azerbaijan. But this fact is in our hands.

[INTER]

Quote: Yujanin.

In light of the US sanction against Russian military-industrial enterprises, the White House flirting with the Armenian separatists is aimed at limiting new deliveries of Russian weapons to Azerbaijan.

This does not affect the supply, Russia supplies arms to Azerbaijan and Armenia keeping the balance, while not making someone dominant. A kind of wise Kremlin policy, with each side knowing that the enemy will respond symmetrically.

[Yujanin.]

This does not affect supplies, Russia supplies arms to both Azerbaijan and Armenia

You may not be aware, but
In the USA, they announced possible “surprises” for Azerbaijan because of Russia

New US sanctions against Russia, in particular, its military-industrial complex, can affect countries that are developing a military-technical partnership with Moscow.
http://minval.az/news/123754092
US sanctions threaten Armenia over ties with Russia
The U.S. reportedly notified Armenia and other countries that sanctions could be imposed on them if purchases of Russian military equipment continue.
https://inosmi.ru/social/20180222/241541651.html

[INTER]

Quote: Yujanin.

US sanctions threaten Armenia over ties with Russia
The U.S. reportedly notified Armenia and other countries that sanctions could be imposed on them if purchases of Russian military equipment continue.

If they threaten, they can enter, but is Armenia heavily dependent on the United States?
Turkey buys S-400 from Russia as a member of NATO, and what have they done in addition to concerns about the threats to Turkey?
But the Saudis want to buy them from Russia, what will stop buying oil?
Rather, on the contrary, Azerbaijan and Armenia will become even closer to Russia if something happens, because relations with Russia are closer than with the United States, there is no other way out, and it will be more likely.
For the United States, these countries are a bargaining chip, and Russia needs peace in this region.

[Yujanin.]

If they threaten, they can enter, but is Armenia heavily dependent on the United States?

Armenia practically sits on dependents (50/50) of the West and Russia. So, in this story, Armenia can really suffer.

As in 2016 and 2017, in 2018 the organizations of the European Union also remain the largest donors of Armenia.

Find out more at: http://www.aravot-ru.am/2018/02/09/264258/

[INTER]

Quote: Yujanin.

Armenia practically sits on dependents (50/50) of the West and Russia. So, in this story, Armenia can really suffer.

Everyone survives as best he can and Russia is not a threat to this fact.
Armenia and Azerbaijan are interesting for Russia to the extent that these countries meet the interests of our country.
It's like troubled housemates constantly swearing, but the head of the HOA prevents them from setting fire to the house.

[Yujanin.]

It's like troubled housemates constantly swearing, but the head of the HOA prevents them from setting fire to the house.

If you go into details, it is reasonable to give an opportunity to evict a non-tenant, a neighbor who is without a right to housing, than to provide conflicting parties with combustible materials and wait for the weather by the sea.

[INTER]

Quote: Yujanin.

If you go into details, it is easier to give the opportunity to evict a non-tenant, a neighbor who is without the right to housing, than to provide conflicting combustible materials and wait for the weather by the sea.

Here, everyone has their own truth and their documents issued by different bosses, until the office was disbanded.
For Russia, this alignment is beneficial, otherwise we will get a major competitor in the person of the Turkish-Azerbaijani state. Do we need it? These two states buffer the southern borders and even if some country has territorial disputes with its neighbors, they cannot be members of NATO .....

[g1v2]

Because Azerbaijan is tied more to Turkey, and here they have a chance to compete for Armenia.

[Bad_santa]

I would not say so about American officials. What, what, but they know how to conduct their policies. Yes, in methods they do not limit themselves. If for their benefit it is necessary to burn Azerbaijan and Armenia in the flame of war, then they will do it.
They themselves should already understand that neither Russia, nor even the USA can reconcile you if you yourself do not want to

[PSACI]

Transcaucasia is actively commenting on the visit of the head of the Nagorno-Karabakh Republic, Bako Sahakyan, to the United States.

Nothing good will come of it ... Again, blood can be shed!
Well, there the Russian division is standing and everything else .. There will definitely not be a slaughter! But the Russians would be better off taking this all into account ..

[Serge Gorely]

The worst pictures after the collapse of the USSR are the Armenian-Azerbaijani conflict. What both sides did with children and women is a nightmare. In the 90s a lot of videos went.

[ul_vitalii]

Everything is simple. Azerbaijan is not going anywhere, Kukan, and it’s time to hobble up Armenia, and very competently they started from Karabakh. And then they will proceed from the one who is more obedient.

[PSACI]

Quote: Serge Gorely

The worst pictures after the collapse of the USSR are the Armenian-Azerbaijani conflict. What both sides did with children and women is a nightmare. In the 90s a lot of videos went.

The massacre was terrible there .. But the fact that then on all the outskirts the Slavs did the "former", this is not advertised anywhere .. And no one counted the number of victims of the genocide! (Jews are aware of the Russians in their suffering and sacrifices for the truth, and not for usury and deception ..)
Azerbaijan, in vain panics .. Armenia under the Russian protection was and will be! There the Orthodox faith and the ancient churches .. Let them try, if not afraid!

[lesnik1978]

Armenians are not Orthodox.

[genisis]

What did you get it from?

[lesnik1978]

They are just Christians. The head of the church is the Catalikos. (not the patriarch). There are differences in rites.

[genisis]

Differences with whom?
You probably want to say that there are differences with the Greek church tradition that the Russian church inherited?
So, from the point of view of the Armenian church, just the Greek church tradition is not Orthodox, for it carries the heresy of Nestorianism.

[lesnik1978]

Yes. That is exactly what I wanted to say.

[genisis]

I wanted to say that the statement that the Armenians are not Orthodox is not true.

[lesnik1978]

I’ll be in the church asking the priest.

[genisis]

In addition to questions to the priest, you yourself have to delve into the theological debate between myaphysites and diophysites.

[garnik]

It is clear that Ar.ts is a "toy" in the hands of great powers. Some use confrontation to control the two warring states. Others want war in order to get one of the two countries in their "piggy bank."
SAR (Union of Russian Armenians) does not fit AAA (Armenian Assembly of America).
Ar.tsakh street appeared in Glendale, and it is forbidden to use the historical name of the province on the VO resource. Probably through the efforts of the Belvedere.

[RUSS]

Quote: garnik

it is forbidden to use the historical name of the province on the VO resource. Probably through the efforts of the Belvedere.

Rather, through the efforts of the late administrator-moderator of the site under the name Appolo.

[garnik]

You are right Maxim, I had in mind (land rest in peace). There are still Talysh people living in the so-called Azerbaijan and those not recognizing the local authorities, the descendants of the Medes, who are marked as errors on the VO.
Therefore, moderator administrators should be recruited only from Russian.

[Yujanin.]

it is forbidden to use the historical name of the province on the VO resource.

Not only do you find that on this resource, contrary to the legislation of the Russian Federation, the name of a non-existent entity is placed without quotation marks?

Therefore, moderator administrators should be recruited only from Russian.

We need to go even further, and on the example of Russian television, to appoint administrators from among the Armenian nationality. Only in this case the forum users on this site will be able to find an objective picture.

[Butchcassidy]

Not only do you find that on this resource, contrary to the legislation of the Russian Federation, the name of a non-existent entity is placed without quotation marks?

And you do not confuse your fantasies and Russian legislation?

[Yujanin.]

There are still Talysh people living in the so-called Azerbaijan and not recognizing local authorities

Yes, there are many ethnic groups living in Azerbaijan, which cannot be said about Armenia, in a country where the concept of independence is perceived only as a method for squeezing out other peoples and creating an area with 100% mono-ethnic Armenian population.

[KVU-NSVD]

There is practically no policy in the world that is based on the principles of international law. It is difficult to express ourselves unequivocally on this issue, since the contradictions in the foreign policy of the largest states do not allow us to express a concrete opinion. That is, now we do not specifically know about the unequivocal attitude of a large state, which is the co-chair of the OSCE Minsk Group, and specifically the United States, towards separatism, the territorial integrity of countries.

Well, in a nutshell, then: "We are in a stupor" (this is a soft option ) It's time to realize that the US does not think about their "partners" and their concerns .. And here, probably, they didn’t think about anything at all, except for the generously lobbied Armenian diaspora of the meeting ...

[Dormidont]

Biting a nursing hand

[Vlad5307]

And you look back more at them and they will arrange a civil / interethnic war. All according to the principle - divide and conquer. No need to be kept on their "cookies" \ promises and everything will be the way.

[Yeraz]

But Azerbaijan has nowhere to go, at one time they created this stupid format, now you can’t change it.
The conflict between Christian Armenia and Muslim Azerbaijan is resolved by three Christian countries. A balance on the face. Moreover, one of them is the Ally of Armenia-Russia, which has a military base and a powerful Armenian diaspora there and the other 2 are also among the countries where there are powerful Armenian diasporas. In fact, there are 5 most powerful Armenian diasporas in the world. USA, RF, France, Lebanon and Syria (for the most part these were expelled and deprived of the economic basis)

The conflict will bomb. As long as Aliyev is with all normal relations in general. But if, for example, the US needs to use the conflict, it will ignite it, if the Russian Federation suddenly needs to do it too, although it is less likely that the current format is completely in its interests.

[Serge Gorely]

No need to juggle. The Armenian-Azerbaijani conflict began in the USSR. The vast majority were either atheists or do not care (I wear a cross, but I don’t know a single prayer). Religion has nothing to do with it.

[Yeraz]

Quote: Serge Gorely

No need to juggle

you don’t need it. Religion also has its place. Do you think the Frenchman, the American or the Russian, the Azerbaijanian and the Armenian are the same in perception ?? No Muslim is more alien to him than an Armenian Christian. You will never forget the face of people when Azerbaijan just started joining all European and when the eyes of people were announced in a dance competition in Azerbaijan, they were hatched with surprise at the sight of a crescent moon, which is still on a red background.They jerked at the sight of the Turkish crescent against a red background, and at the sight of another one the same shock was at 100.
And right now, the conflict is even more religious than before.

[RUSS]

Quote: Yeraz

Do you think the Frenchman, American or Russian Azerbaijani and Armenian are the same in perception?

Here it’s fundamentally wrong, for the West, Russian Orthodoxy is like a bone in the throat, but for many Russians, the same Muslims are closer in spirit and mentality than any Baptists and Protestants.

[Yeraz]

Quote: RUSS

Here is fundamentally wrong

what does it mean fundamentally wrong ?? For a Frenchman and another Westerner, even a Pole, a Russian with a cross cannot be the same as a Muslim.

[RUSS]

Quote: Yeraz

what does it mean fundamentally wrong ?? For a Frenchman and another Westerner, even a Russian Pole with a cross cannot be the same as a Muslim

A silent war is waged against Orthodoxy, beginning with the Crusades, Catholicism is creeping all the way to Russia.
Well, for the French, an Arab or an African is any closer than a "wild" Russian.

[Serge Gorely]

That is, according to your logic, the Christian USA, England, Germany adore Russia and hate Turkey ??? And which of these countries is a member of NATO? Could you tell?

[Paranoid50]

Quote: Yeraz

And right now, the conflict is even more religious than before.

What is - that is, in this case, religion is one of the most effective tools. Yes, the 21st century is in the yard, and people continue to tear each other on the basis of veneration of fairy-tale characters. Well, and, as usual, various puppeteers, ghouls from big politics and big money competently use these human "weaknesses" ... And in this regard, the 21st century is not far from the 14-15th, yeah.

[RUSS]

Quote: Yeraz

the benefit of these is mostly expelled and deprived of the economic basis)

Fortunately, the Armenians and other Christians came under persecution and extermination in Syria? Do you report in your own words?

[Yeraz]

Quote: RUSS

Fortunately, the Armenians and other Christians came under persecution and extermination in Syria? Do you report in your own words?

Yes, if you didn’t want, indirectly Azerbaijan benefited from this. A powerful blow was inflicted on one of the strong pillars of the Armenian lobby, both physically and economically. Azerbaijan utilized 1000 fighters of a radically religious nature there and Turkey strengthened geopolitically, which is also a plus for Azerbaijan. Azerbaijan decided they should grieve over the fate of Armenians, Christians of others in Syria and even Muslims ??? These same Muslims allowed the Armenians to turn around. It’s a pity only the Turkman brothers. And the Palestinians in Azerbaijan are not sorry, because both Arafat and the current one are in kents with Armenians. Yes from - Islamic solidarity on the off-line expresses support for show, and in fact many also dislike the Palestinians either neutrally or for Israel.

[Serge Gorely]

Quote: Yeraz

Quote: RUSS

Fortunately, the Armenians and other Christians came under persecution and extermination in Syria? Do you report in your own words?

Yes, if you didn’t want, indirectly Azerbaijan benefited from this. A powerful blow was inflicted on one of the strong pillars of the Armenian lobby, both physically and economically. Azerbaijan utilized 1000 fighters of a radically religious nature there and Turkey strengthened geopolitically, which is also a plus for Azerbaijan. Azerbaijan decided they should grieve over the fate of Armenians, Christians of others in Syria and even Muslims ??? These same Muslims allowed the Armenians to turn around. It’s a pity only the Turkman brothers. And the Palestinians in Azerbaijan are not sorry, because both Arafat and the current one are in kents with Armenians. Yes from - Islamic solidarity on the off-line expresses support for show, and in fact many also dislike the Palestinians either neutrally or for Israel.

Hitler, when he destroyed the Jews, also fought for profit.

[RUSS]

Quote: Yeraz

Why did Azerbaijan decide to grieve over the fate of Armenians, Christians of others in Syria and even Muslims ???

Have you heard anything about humanity? About humanism?

[Butchcassidy]

Quote: garnik

It is clear that Ar.ts is a "toy" in the hands of great powers. Some use confrontation to control the two warring states. Others want war in order to get one of the two countries in their "piggy bank."
SAR (Union of Russian Armenians) does not fit AAA (Armenian Assembly of America).
Ar.tsakh street appeared in Glendale, and it is forbidden to use the historical name of the province on the VO resource. Probably through the efforts of the Belvedere.

It is natural that the Armenian diaspora structures of the United States are much more effective than the same in Russia. It is necessary to take into account historical realities - when they appeared in the USA (as structures, it is not about the appearance of Armenians in Russia, but this is the 10th century and Kievan Rus) and when in Russia? In addition, the political structure of the United States is such that there is such a thing in the legislation as lobbying and it is legal - you add money to the party cashier and your congression protects your interests at the legislative level. In Russia, however, the decision-making system does not historically imply any direct influence of any structures, such influence can only be behind the scenes and it is associated with the “Kremlin towers” ​​- political groups, the most influential of which are the siloviki. There are no national groups there and cannot be.

However, in this case, there may also be talk in the context of the US-Russia confrontation, where the Americans are trying to seize the initiative in resolving the conflict, where the previously "dominant" co-chairing of Russia by the United States and France was not disputed. However, now the situation may change taking into account the position of Russia - neither yours nor ours, which the United States can turn in its favor in order to gain a foothold in this very important region.

PS There can be no settlement until the true culprit of the conflict is identified - the racist panturanist position of political fosterlings of the Ottoman Turkey - the Azerbaijan Democratic Republic and its successor with the name stolen from Iran - the Republic of Azerbaijan, which has as its goal the complete dearmenization of the region, which was directly stated at the meeting New Azerbaijan Party President Il.Aliyev. Such dearmenization has already occurred through direct genocide in Western Armenia, Baku province and lowland Karabakh, as well as through "soft" genocide in Soviet times in Nakhichevan. However, on the battlefield, power was on the side of the right - in this case, the Armenians, which is why Baku has been raging for more than 20 years.

[Butchcassidy]

Quote: PSACI

Nothing good will come of it ... Again, blood can be shed!
Well, there the Russian division is standing and everything else .. There will definitely not be a slaughter! But the Russians would be better off taking this all into account ..

And where is the Russian division, if not secret?

But the massacre will not be there for only one reason - this is the Defense Army of N.K. And she has been proving her role for over 20 years.

[RUSS]

Quote: ButchCassidy

And where is the Russian division, if not secret?

He apparently assumed the Russian 102nd military base in Gyumri, numbering 5 thousand people.

[Serge Gorely]

So where is Gyumri and where is Karabakh.

[Ramzay121]

In April 2016, she proved well that the Olympic runners would envy them, they fled in panic with such speed

[Brut]

And why didn’t you “liberate” “your” Karabakh?

[Ramzay121]

Well then, you do not know? Russia immediately intervened, "asked" to stop the offensive. Why, I think you yourself know. Because she benefits from this conflict.

[Brut]

Quote: Ramzay121

Russia immediately intervened, "asked" to stop the offensive.

It’s ridiculous. Have you been preparing, getting ready for 20 years and finally starting and after only 4 days you stopped because Russia "asked"?

Quote: Ramzay121

Because she benefits from this conflict.

This conflict is primarily beneficial to the leadership of your country, which has raised Armenianophobia into a national idea.

[Ramzay121]

Do not pretend to know it, you all know, and there is nothing to lead an empty discussion. Writing something that you yourself do not believe is not necessary.

[Butchcassidy]

Again, Russia is to blame for everything - it’s to blame for Britain, Trump is again to blame, Baku cannot do anything with Stepanakert for 24 years - Russia is to blame again! Oh, this Russia as I understand you;)

[Butchcassidy]

Quote: Yeraz

But Azerbaijan has nowhere to go, at one time they created this stupid format, now you can’t change it.
The conflict between Christian Armenia and Muslim Azerbaijan is resolved by three Christian countries. A balance on the face. Moreover, one of them is the Ally of Armenia-Russia, which has a military base and a powerful Armenian diaspora there and the other 2 are also among the countries where there are powerful Armenian diasporas. In fact, there are 5 most powerful Armenian diasporas in the world. USA, RF, France, Lebanon and Syria (for the most part these were expelled and deprived of the economic basis)

The conflict will bomb. As long as Aliyev is with all normal relations in general. But if, for example, the US needs to use the conflict, it will ignite it, if the Russian Federation suddenly needs to do it too, although it is less likely that the current format is completely in its interests.

Listen, but this is a ridiculous position to present the Armenian-Azerbaijani conflict as religious in attempts to draw Muslim countries to the side of Baku, which is generously flavored with black caviar and manat, as is the case with Pakistan.

The Armenians have never had and do not have any conflicts with the Muslim population and Muslim countries. In general, Iran exposes Armenian monasteries as contenders for UNESCO’s world cultural heritage from Iran, Armenia does the same now, exhibiting the Blue Mosque in Yerevan with the same contender.

The Armenian temple complex was opened several years ago in Qatar under the auspices of the Emir of Qatar, the Armenians have excellent relations with Arabs, Persians, Syrians. Moreover, the Armenians often occupied influential posts in Muslim countries, as was the case with Nubar Pasha, who was the Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs in Muslim Egypt in the 19th century. Or he was the leader of the Persian revolution - Eprem Khan (Eprem Davydovich Davtyan), who was the commander of the Persian Provisional Government in 1900-1912. and which are the monuments in Iran.

So there’s nothing to fool around here and try to drive a wedge between the Armenians and Muslim peoples, it still doesn’t work, centuries of joint history have convincingly proved this.

The Armenian-Azerbaijani Karabakh conflict is purely political and follows from the racist panturanian policy of Baku.

[Bakht]

Strange people are still sitting on this site ....
It is useless to argue, for a person believes. But ButchCassidy carries such nonsense that it is useless to discuss.

[Yeraz]

Quote: Bakht

It is useless to argue, for a person believes.

it’s not just a matter of faith. Initially, the conflict is religious .. Yes, during the Soviet era, religion was suppressed in the beginning of the 90s, and the layer of religiosity went down. It seemed that the conflict was interethnic, but if we take the aggravation of the conflict in the 90s. Now this the conflict is already a much larger religious aspect and will be even tougher.

Quote: Bakht

But ButchCassidy carries such nonsense that it is useless to discuss.

ordinary dashnak melody.

[Bakht]

I do not agree. Initially, the conflict is not religious. The conflict initially had territorial claims and was provoked by Dashnak propaganda, which was carried out for almost a hundred years.
There is practically no religious factor there.

[Butchcassidy]

and what kind of Dashnak propaganda do not tell?

[Butchcassidy]

And you try))) Basically, those who have nothing to say refuse the dialogue.

[Bakht]

The Armenians have never had and do not have any conflicts with the Muslim population and Muslim countries.
It is not true
derives from the racist panturanian policy of Baku.
It is not true
If you have something to say and you know the subject so well, then tell me how the conflict began? At the same time, rummage in your memory and tell me under what slogan the first rallies of Yerevan were. And what slogans did the Armenians have in 1988.

[Butchcassidy]

Quote: Bakht

The Armenians have never had and do not have any conflicts with the Muslim population and Muslim countries.
It is not true

How wrong? Armenians encountered Muslims for the first time during the Arab conquest. And do you think that since then the Armenians have not found a common language with Muslim peoples? Bullshit. And I gave examples of this, of which there are thousands.

derives from the racist panturanian policy of Baku.
It is not true

How is that not true? That in Baku, Armenophobia did not reach schizophrenia? Baku newspaper Echo writes "Including because initially it was clear to everyone that the arrival of any ethnic Armenian in Azerbaijan, regardless of his citizenship and age, would raise questions from our border guards" http://www.echo.az/article.php?aid=101427
Luka Vardanyan is 8 (!) Years old! This did not prevent the “vigilant” border guards in Baku from creating a tantrum about this, detaining them with their mother who came to rest (ie spend money) in Baku from Moscow, at the airport. And there are many such stories when people with an Armenian surname, no matter how they got it — from their ex-husband or else, citizens of any state, including media representatives from Western countries — can all be deported upon arrival (!) In Baku. On the grounds that they have an Armenian surname. I don’t want to comment about an 8-year-old boy, how to measure the degree of political Armenian-phobic schizophrenia if a child threatens national security in the opinion of the law enforcement agencies of Az.R.?

If you have something to say and you know the subject so well, then tell me how the conflict began? At the same time, rummage in your memory and tell me under what slogan the first rallies of Yerevan were. And what slogans did the Armenians have in 1988.

The conflict began in the 19th century, when pan-Turkism and panturinism became the dominant ideology of the Young Turks in the Ottoman Empire and the Musavatists in modern Azerbaijan.

[Bakht]

Not true, because the Armenians lived normally in the Ottoman Empire. In any case, neither with the Arabs, nor with the Turks, no one tried to bring them to Islam. This contradicts the Koran’s standards. The “Armenian Question” arose at the end of the 19th century, when the Dashnaks adopted a nationalist and revolutionary program to build their state on lands where they NEVER made up the majority of the population. This is not my opinion or the opinion of Azerbaijani propaganda. This is the opinion of authoritative historians studying the so-called "Armenian issue"
Hundreds, perhaps thousands of Armenians live in Baku. Just recently, I myself witnessed how two Armenian families freely left Baku. They would not have left, but their quarter came under reconstruction and they preferred to receive money and leave. Alternatively, they could get a new apartment in a new building. But it was their choice. But in Armenia there is a frenzied anti-Azerbaijani hysteria. I don’t think that I can enter Armenia and the border guards will not have any questions. These are all private questions that are usually referred to. when there is not enough knowledge on the matter.
The most important thing. Of course, the conflict arose in the 19th century. The main documents of the Dashnaktsutyun party "the lands of the future Armenia should be abundantly watered with the blood of Muslims." This is the reason for the emergence of the "Armenian issue".
But I asked about the slogans of the "Karabakh movement." The first slogans had nothing to do with self-determination. The first slogan was "miatsum". That is, joining. These are territorial claims. And then in Yerevan people went with the slogans "Lenin-Party-Gorbachev". The Karabakh movement was inspired from abroad, as one of the methods of the collapse of the USSR. That is why Armenia categorically refused to hold a referendum on the preservation of the USSR. Unlike Azerbaijan, where the majority of the population agreed to the preservation of the USSR. By the way, in contrast to the slogan "Lenin-Party-Gorbachev", there was another slogan "Hitler-Stalin-Ligachev".
So you decide which side you are on. On the side of the people who destroyed the Union or on the side of those who tried to save this Union. Starovoitova, Bonner, Yeltsin. That is, those who bet on the collapse of the USSR.

[Butchcassidy]

Hundreds, perhaps thousands of Armenians live in Baku. Just recently, I myself witnessed how two Armenian families freely left Baku. They would not have left, but their quarter came under reconstruction and they preferred to receive money and leave. Alternatively, they could get a new apartment in a new building.

Do not tell me, but what do they say in the documents? What nationality and what surnames?)))

You tell tales, take phrases out of context, and de pass them off as confirmation of your words. It’s gross falsification at the level to put beautiful vegetables and fruits on the counter, and when asked to hang them up, give rotten meat from the back room and hang it up. I am for fair trade and here is an example.

The Armenians voted to secede from the Union in protest against the fact that the union authorities, led by Gorbachev, cannot ensure the safety of their citizens of Armenian nationality in the Azerbaijan SSR.

Well, the population of the Azerbaijan SSR voted to preserve the Union. And how did the authorities in Baku do this? By chance, did not wipe?

[Bakht]

Levon Ter-Petrosyan: “The members of the first“ Karabakh Committee ”- Igor Muradyan, Zory Balayan, Silva Kaputikyan and others - thought only of Karabakh. For them, the issues of democracy or independence of Armenia simply did not exist. And this caused a split. Feeling that we were starting to pose a danger to the Soviet system, they retreated. And a natural change occurred. They believed that the Karabakh issue should be resolved within the framework of the Soviet system. We have come to understand the fact that this system would never have solved the Karabakh issue, and that just the opposite is required: to solve the Karabakh problem it was necessary to change the system»
Armenians did not vote On the territory of the Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, a referendum was not held.

[Butchcassidy]

Quote: Bakht

Armenians did not vote On the territory of the Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, a referendum was not held.

Why are you smoking there?)))
Armenia voted on September 21, 1991 at a referendum on independence and to the question "Do you agree that the Republic of Armenia be an independent democratic state outside the USSR?" 99,5% of voters voted to declare independence with a turnout of 95%

And you say-did not vote)))

Better answer the question:

Quote: ButchCassidy

Well, the population of the Azerbaijan SSR voted to preserve the Union. And how did the authorities in Baku do this?

[Bakht]

Since you probably don’t like reading, a couple of quotes are a keepsake
Our party cannot agree with those who wish to achieve their goals only through diplomacy, since pure diplomacy does not consider philanthropy. Our diplomats are guided by their own interest and the right of the strong. Europe is not for us let the Armenians know that they will not receive anything until the Armenian land is saturated with blood.
Facilities. Armenian Revolutionary Commonwealth in order to achieve his goals with the help of rebellion, he organizes revolutionary groups, which, waging a constant struggle against the government, at the same time, they are fighting against those general conditions from which not only Armenians, but Assyrians, Yezidis, part of Kurds and peace-loving Turks suffer.
These are program documents of the Dashnaks. Now tell me soberly how the "Armenian question" began?

[Yeraz]

Quote: ButchCassidy

Listen, but this is a ridiculous position to present the Armenian-Azerbaijani conflict as religious in attempts to draw Muslim countries to the side of Baku,

what Muslims to attract ?? Arabs who slaughter each other ?? Or Persians who are for Armenians ?? Well, Pakistan for Azerbaijan, but there are other historical aspects with the teaching of the Turkic tribes in the life of this region. And the Turkic countries on the topic of blood will be for us.

Quote: ButchCassidy

The Armenians have never had and do not have any conflicts with the Muslim population and Muslim countries.

ahahah))) Well, of course. In Azerbaijan, the identification used to be Muslim or not, you speak Muslim or Turkic or not. And the Armenians also perceived what the Kurds of Vedibasar, Kafan, Lachin and Keldbajar thought so easily assimilated into Azerbaijanis? Including thanks to the Armenians who perceived them as Muslims, part of Turkes.
And the massacre of the north-west ?? Chelzgins then they slaughtered ?? Also because of Islam, the more Muslims were held together in Azerbaijan and therefore all the nations of Azerbaijan hated Armenians equally. Therefore, fairy tales about the lack of a religious element aside.

Quote: ButchCassidy

The Armenian-Azerbaijani Karabakh conflict is purely political and follows from the racist panturanian policy of Baku.

From a racist Dashnak policy dreaming of Greater Armenia and hating Muslims, among other things, which is worth arguing in the Armenian segments about Muslims Armenians.

[garnik]

But the massacre of the north-west ?? Che Lezgin was then slaughtered ?? Also due to Islam, the more Muslims were held together in Azerbaijan, and therefore all the nations of Azerbaijan equally hated Armenians

Read http://lezgi-yar.ru/news/kto_zakhoronen_v_kube_le
zginy_evrei_ili_musulmane / 2012-01-21-607-XNUMX Lezgi website
Listen to the voice of Talyshstan on YouTube.
I do not want to start and fall to the level myself ... like that. Do not provoke.

The Armenians do not claim the Empire of Great Armenia, otherwise there would be talk about the return of Baku, historically belonging to the people of Tata.

[Lekxnumx]

Quote: garnik

http://lezgi-yar.ru/news/kto_zakhoronen_v_kube_le
zginy_evrei_ili_musulmane / 2012-01-21-607

The same source, the same site, just provided by you was written by an unknown author Lezgivi.
"The largest work of M. Melikmamedov is the book Bloody Gorge, born as a result of 26 years of work in the archives of Azerbaijan, Russia and Dagestan and conversations with witnesses of the bloody events of 1918. The book describes the events of the Armenian genocide against the Muslim population of the Guba province of Azerbaijan and the Lezgin resistance "Dashnak bandit formations. In his work he described the heroic life of more than 300 Lezgins from Dagestan and the Guba, Gusar, Khachmas, Divichi regions of Azerbaijan, who distinguished themselves in battles against Armenian outrageous units."

And my source belongs to Lezgin, an intellectual of his people, a respected historian and journalist. And to the immediate resident where this tragedy occurred. So let's round off the troll.
The conflict in Karabakh is not religious, I agree on this, but scum Dashnaks used to fight against all Muslims of the Caucasus, for which they were defeated.
http://lezgi-yar.ru/news/chiekhi_lezgi_muzaffar_n
izam_ogly_melikmamedov/2011-03-22-156?ssid=362726
434264663303076 & id = 45 & a = 1 & ajax = 814

[garnik]

There is no desire to prove that you’ve been zombified for 25 years and you don’t have to eradicate that bullshit that you got into your head.
Do you want to study the reasons for the resistance of the Armenians?
Or you are not used to being given a worthy rebuff.
Read the article on the site again. There is no evidence to which people the 200 remains in Guba belong. It could be the Armenians, the Jews tortured by the Turks, who at that time were in those places.
Turn on the logic. Let's say this is the work of the hands of the Armenians who did their job and left. They left the corpses and buried in a mass grave in the territory of the Lezghins. I think they just did not have time to deal with burials. And the Lezghins would be aware of the burial place.
But with the advent of the Turks, the massacre of Armenians and Jews in these places began. The Armenians do not attach much importance to these events, in these years only in Baku and Shushi 30 thousand Armenians were killed in each city. Now compare the unknown 200 corpses with the losses of the Armenians and that I can feel the blood of my fellow tribesmen on those hands.

[Lekxnumx]

Is it worth making a polemic with you? I’m too lazy, as Lezgin I already cited the sources of the TsAGAOR, and you began to oppose the figure of 60 people, without even reading about the murder of more than 2 thousand people in the same report.
Further, during the campaign of Gelovani, a group of 120 armed Armenians were killed who joined the Dashnaks. But their number was scanty, and many Armenians left Gelovani, then there were three Armenian villages in Khachmaz.
There are testimonies of the tsarist army officer Zizik Lezgin, who said in his testimony that the Armenians facilitated the resettlement of some Jews, intimidating them that Muslims would destroy you.
But the exact opposite happened, the Dashnaks came and began to exterminate Muslims, Persians, Turks and Lezgins. Then, such as Ziziksky, Chakarvi (I don’t remember everyone) with the help of the Kusar cavalry destroyed the several thousandth Amazasp group.
We also do not like to repeat this, because the Dashnaks who were responsible for these atrocities did not return from the north, but remained in this gorge. This was given a great price, but nevertheless, the scum decayed.
Jews, Persians, Lezghins, Turks still live in that region, you really aren’t happy.
But the Turks simply forced you to answer for these actions. As always, you have empty, unsubstantiated words
I’m honestly too lazy for Baku to argue with the Azs, explaining the obvious and long-proven.

[Lekxnumx]

Quote: garnik

with the losses of the Armenians and what I can feel for the people on whose hands the blood of my fellow tribesmen.

Even Mikoyan shot the Dashnaks, the Dashnaks managed to betray even their Armenians for the sake of Greater Armenia, they wanted to join the British. Therefore, even the Soviet government saw in the Dashnaks the Armenians of thugs, traitors who joined the Bolsheviks for personal gain.
The history is indicative of how ruinous nationalism is, first of all for the Armenians themselves. The Turks with their parish cleared Baku and other regions from the Dashnaks, even the Karabakh war could not clear all Armenians from Baku and now the Armenians live in Baku. You know how Armenians fall to the bottom and wait for the right moment for the next betrayal of your neighbors, do not disdain anything.

[garnik]

Dropping links would read comments of adequate lezgins ..
I think you know the learned historian Dyakonov. Which, by order of Baku, tried to nodify the current owners of Arran and Shirvan. There was an attempt to make Nizami a Turk, but Dyakonov did not go into this search, claiming that the Ganjavi pers.
http://uni-persona.srcc.msu.ru/site/authors/djako
nov / posl_gl.htm
And the better is your Melikmamedov, who is like a moon before Dyakonov.
I repeat the Lezgins to the Armenians were never pathological enemies. And all the skirmishes of the Armenians with the Lezgins were punitive. After the raids of Lezghins in Armenian villages.
You are already talking about Great Armenia, as your tenant, and now the owner. On the left bank of the Kura, the Armenians have no land, calm down. Even if you have Lezgin blood in you, but you think and think like a Turk. The process went irrevocably. .

[Livonetc]

Quote: sefevi

This is an indicator that officials who are not very smart and inexperienced in politics are sitting there now. Why aggravate relations with us out of the blue? How aggravated relations with Turkey, its faithful ally because of the Kurds, who, like a weather vane, are ready to sell to anyone.

No.
This is the work of a powerful Armenian diaspora in America.
Note to you.
I won’t bring any evidence, but your special services should know.
During active fighting on the side of your opponents, American snipers with modern long-range weapons worked very productively.
For a considerable amount of money, not for special trips.
However, whoever needed it in the states was authorized ..

[Bakht]

No conspiracy theories. Mercenaries were on both sides. But no one saw American "snipers" there.

[Butchcassidy]

There were no mercenaries from the Armenians, there were only volunteers, the lion's share of which were Armenians from the diaspora themselves. The Armenians, with all their wishes, did not have the resources to hire mercenaries.

And it’s not the business of mercenaries to defend their homeland. But their business is to participate in aggression, as was the case with Baku.

[Bakht]

Do not tell people .... Armenians had more resources than Azerbaijan. Monte Melkonyan, Arabo battalion ...

[Butchcassidy]

Quote: Bakht

Do not tell people .... Armenians had more resources than Azerbaijan. Monte Melkonyan, Arabo battalion ...

Well, of course))) Armenians have resources, were and will be much better than Turkey or Azerbaijan, this quality of human resources. Which was manifested in the war, when, with your overwhelming superiority in matters of common human resources, 9 million of the population of Az.R. with 150 thousand (!) the population of the Karabakh Armenians, 11 thousand wagons of ammunition, tanks, aircraft, helicopters, etc. inherited legally and partly openly looted from Soviet arsenals, the Armenian side was able to win.

You compare volunteers-Armenians and other peoples - Russian, Ossetians with [b] mercenaries [/ b], who were hired by Baku for money, whose material resources are much better both then than they were in Armenia, which was destroyed by the earthquake and blockade, and now - the flow of petrodollars goes to the budget not bad, although it dipped due to falling prices .

You have much more material resources - both weapons and money. But your people are different - they don’t want to die for Aliyev and prefer to flee.

[Yujanin.]

INTER,

Here everyone has their own truth and their documents issued by different bosses

No need to distort the facts. Documents (deed of purchase) there is only one guest, which absolutely all bosses recognize.

For Russia, this alignment is beneficial, otherwise we will get a major competitor in the person of the Turkish-Azerbaijani state.

Perhaps I will subscribe to your every word.

These two states buffer the southern borders and even if some country has territorial disputes with its neighbors, they cannot be members of NATO .....

Geopolitical processes in Eurasia are changing as in a kaleidoscope. Obviously, we will soon become witnesses of both Georgia and Moldova, perhaps even Armenia will become NATO members. Therefore, Russia will soon need to decide which side it should be on.

[Butchcassidy]

Why did you get the idea that Georgia and Moldova, and even more so Armenia, will become members of NATO?))

[Yujanin.]

Grants are simply not issued.

[Butchcassidy]

Grants are given to many and to many where, including for dubious purposes. But this does not mean that Georgia, Moldova and Armenia will become NATO members. About Georgia - it has a serious conflict with South Ossetia and Abkhazia, as well as Moldova and Transnistria. They don’t sit in NATO either, Europeans are not interested in getting into a conflict on a foreign side, it will not add security to Europe.
Add fuel to the fire and say: let’s, let’s, we will support you - yes, but to participate on our own? Europeans will not do this.

The population of Moldova is against joining NATO, despite the statements of politicians with Romanian passports. I am generally silent about Armenia - Armenia is seriously integrated into the Collective Security Treaty Organization, created a joint air defense group with Russia, receives high-quality weapons at domestic prices and is now included in the production chains of Russian defense enterprises - why doesn’t it change for what? Well and traditionally the population is pro-Russian oriented.

[Bakht]

"Well, traditionally the population is pro-Russian oriented."
Definitely not living on that planet ....
There was and is such a political scientist Igor Muradyan. Founder and initiator of the Karabakh movement. They don’t really listen to him in Armenia, because he is a Russian-speaking Armenian. But this man was the first to raise the flag of Nagorno-Karabakh. Always advocated cooperation with Russia. And so...
"That's what happens. Anti-Russian sentiments increase in Armenia - this is a fact. Why this happens, there are many questions. Can Russia be an ally of Armenia in the current situation? She is in isolation and blockade and is looking for possible allies in the face of other countries, including in the person of Turkey and Azerbaijan, and these two solvent states are very valuable to her now. The Russian-Turkish alliance is inevitable"- admitted the political scientist."
"Our ally, the restraining force of Turkey and Azerbaijan, is now the Western community, not Russia. Russia is an enemyand everyone here understands this. "
http://eurasiadiary.com/ru/news/conflicts/236683-
v-armenii-noviy-bunt-protiv-rossii

[Butchcassidy]

It is not necessary to consider people as idiots and rudely manipulate information, introducing I. Muradyan as some allegedly authoritative expert.

Firstly, to the Miatsum movement, which advocates the reunification of the NKAR with Armenia, also called the Karabakh movement, Igor Muradyan has no relation since the fall of 1988.
Secondly, he is famous Russophobe and none of his assessments on the issues of national security of Armenia, by definition, can be expert, since they are never objective.
Thirdly, he, apparently, is also not very versed in the issues in question. To write "the Western community, and not Russia, now acts as the restraining force of Turkey and Azerbaijan," and "Russia is the enemy, and everyone here understands this." could only a complete ignoramus, whose mind is clouded by Russophobic nonsense.
Fourth, do not wait for Russia and Armenia, Armenians and Russians to quarrel.

[Bakht]

You each time with your post prove that ABSOLUTELY do not own the material.

[Butchcassidy]

Quote: Bakht

You each time with your post prove that ABSOLUTELY do not own the material.

Those. apart from this phrase, can you object to anything concrete facts that I cite?

[Bakht]

I already wrote that with each of your statements you show FULL ignorance of the question. You have nothing to say, it's not true.

[Butchcassidy]

Quote: Bakht

I already wrote that with each of your statements you show FULL ignorance of the question. You have nothing to say, it's not true.

Yeah, it’s a straightforwardly powerful position - to give cliches and cliches like "untruth, ignorance of the question" to concrete arguments ...

You are well done, defend your position as you can. Only really in fact you have nothing to argue.

[Bakht]

American professor Justin McCartney "Turks and Armenians"
French explorer de Maleville "Armenian tragedy of 1915"
And dozens of scientific (SCIENTIFIC) studies. But this is not available to you. A donkey cannot be proved that he is a donkey because he is a donkey.

[RUSS]

Quote: Yujanin.

Obviously, we will soon witness both Georgia and Moldova,

Read the NATO charter and the conditions for joining this organization, for example, if there is an unresolved border or territorial issue in the candidate country, then NATO should not see this country as its ears.

[Yujanin.]

Read NATO Charter and Membership Conditions

Which country is the initiator of the creation of this union?

if there is an unresolved border or territorial issue in the candidate country, then do not see NATO as your ears to this country.

Nevertheless, Albania, with its unresolved border issues, was nevertheless admitted to NATO. I will not say anything about Greece and Turkey, whose countries according to the charter should have been expelled from the alliance because of the Cyprus issue. Another example: after the Falkland War, England was not expelled from the military alliance.

[Butchcassidy]

Bakht,

American professor Justin McCartney "Turks and Armenians"
French explorer de Maleville "Armenian tragedy of 1915"
And dozens of scientific (SCIENTIFIC) studies. But this is not available to you. A donkey cannot be proved that he is a donkey because he is a donkey.

It is ordinary revisionists on salaries of Turkish or Azerbaijani organizations. All they are marginalized and their significance and scientific citation in a positive connotation tends to zero. Those. they are nobody and there is no way to call them, This is simply proved by the number of links in search engines. They represent them significant only in Baku and Ankara. But this is not surprising.