Military Review

Siberia and the Far East - the territory of oblivion

286
It is interesting to observe what is happening in our country. Russia is huge. On the map. But in fact? Open any news portal, turn on any talk show, with the possible exception of broadcasts about bad parents and unbearable living conditions, and what will you see? And you will see that Russia, in fact, fits quite comfortably in the European part and the Urals.


We are concerned about the protection of our borders from several NATO battalions in the Baltic States. We deal with geopolitics in Asia. We close the sky from the missile systems of the likely enemy over the industrial centers of the European part. And at the same time we constantly say that no one will fight. I agree. Will not be. Why, if half of Russia just disappear. Not territory, people.

And the region in 400-500 km from the capital is considered to be a deaf province. A province where it is absolutely impossible to live from the point of view of the same talk show participants. At the same time, many, especially from "immigrants from the USSR", talk with nostalgia about their childhood in some Siberian or Far Eastern village, about beautiful sunrises and sunsets, about beautiful people.

The leaders of the country periodically express "concerns" about the economic, military and other conditions of the regions. Fly to some cities. Meet with young people and "economic assets". Offer programs for the development of territories.

Fly airplanes ... Do you know why? Try to take the high-speed train and cross the Ural mountains. Will not work! Russia ends in Kazan. Further ... Soviet Union. The quieter you go, the further you'll get! And the plane is a pleasure for many residents of the Ural Russia, the business is expensive. Many airfields have long disappeared. Not needed.

So what happens? Why are the most important regions for the country today in the pen? Why are even million-plus cities, like Omsk, thrown at the mercy? Why are huge territories abandoned? Life in that Russia exists only along the Trans-Siberian Railway. Where there are industrial cities and enterprises.

In any place, you can safely roll back to 100-200 km from the “piece of iron” and you will get into the remote, unexplored terrain of the times of Ermak. Well, maybe the time of Peter Stolypin. With a well-preserved way of life, with traditions, with customs. A sort of ethno reserve. Old Believers, Cossacks, idolaters ... Shamans and herbalists ... Well, at least forgotten how to weave bast shoes.

Many times in the press and at a high state level it was said about the urgent need to solve the problem of the settlement of the eastern territories. It was said by industrialists. It was said by the military. It was said by all who have ever visited the Urals.

The first to understand the futility of conversations and all these innovations are business people. Then they are business. They do business, but they do not scratch their tongue with boredom. And do not defend a thesis.

If the mountain does not go to Magomed? .. It is quite logical to bring this very "Magomed" to the mountain. That’s all. From the point of view of the state, it would be great to bring and leave to live there. And from a business point of view?

A businessman will build new houses in cities? Build infrastructure? Ensure the implementation of numerous, scientifically based government initiatives? Yeah. He quit everything and began to spend money on "nonsense." It is cheaper to hire workers in the inhabited areas of the country and transport them to the workplace on a rotational basis. See cities in oil producing areas. There are almost no locals left!

Very many media outlets spoke with delight about the great initiative of the President with the Far Eastern hectare. Here it is, here is a revolutionary solution! An idea that simply gives rise to a mass exodus of the population to Siberia, and especially to the Far East. Free hectare! A whole hectare of land!

And then there was a "constipation". Somehow, the stream of praise to the presidential initiative stopped. How cut off. What is the matter? What did not work out or, on the contrary, did so many people respond to the initiative that local officials simply cannot cope with the flow of immigrants?

To understand what is happening, we had to talk with many people from the Far East. In place, it is much clearer that what our clever people from “European” Russia are silent about.

Many ordinary people believe that the “Far Eastern hectare” is a creative continuation of the idea of ​​Peter Stolypin about settling the eastern territories of the empire. Then, at the beginning of the last century, the peasants also received land, enjoyed the benefits and loans of the state, settled on previously uncultivated lands.

But there is one, but very significant "mote", which scholars from government and near government smart institutions do not want to notice. It is inconvenient to sit on a bitch, but do not want to notice. Then the whole beauty of the idea will be crushed.

So, ask about the need for resettlement at the beginning of the past and this century. Why did Stolypin have to solve this problem? And in what conditions? And the answer is on the surface. The agrarian regions of the center of Russia in the last century were overpopulated! Simply put, the peasants really did not have enough land! There are people, but there is no place to work.

Today? In the same European part of Russia, how much land is abandoned? How many workers are needed for peasant labor? And this is with modern methods of tillage, with a bunch of cars to help, with the proximity of industrialized cities, with a quite tolerable road network. There are not enough peasants now!

But it is rather a state approach to the problem. But there is simply human. The approach of those who in the last century were called fists. Strong owners who absolutely do not care about the opinion of scientists. They are masters and want to manage. And most importantly, these people have learned to count their own money!

“Free hectare you say? And for whom is it free? For a city dude who will raise ostriches on this hectare of boredom and excess money? Or for a forester who wants to grow seedlings for sale? I don’t need it. I’m a local. those who sit on the ground in Russia, and even more so.

Have you seen our land? I'm not talking about the taiga. I mean the land that was thrown into 90 and later. Just imagine, you took this free hectare of the former collective farm land. Are the firs already sprouted? Sprouted! Any taiga vegetation too. Need to clean up? Need to! How long will you do this? The year is lost.

Another year that you plant? Oats for horses! She watered the earth with acid. Not really grow anything. Another year.

The third year, what are you going to do? Vegetables to grow. Or rather just potatoes. Now calculate how much all this will cost ... ".

I certainly did not count. Just turned to open sources of information. It turned out absolutely incredible figure. It will cost 300-400 thousand rubles to restore a hectare of land to use it for agricultural purposes. Wow free hectare is obtained. And you will not scout cows per hectare ...

And this is despite the fact that everyone can use the land, with the exception of animal husbandry, only three or four months a year. And not for six months, as in central Russia. Yes, and all sorts of cataclysms, such as river flooding, and the like are not uncommon here. And where is the attractiveness of Zauralye? A widely advertised bunch!

So, both components of the economic solution to the problem of population decline from the eastern regions of the country turned out to be a bluff. The state, seeking to use private business to solve the problem of depressed regions, for some reason "forgot" the essence of private business. "Nothing personal, just business." Just make money. Everything.

It may not be correct, but I will compare two regions that are not leaders of economic and other development in the country. One, the Voronezh region, is located in the European part of Russia. And the other, the Amur region, it is clear that this is not the Moscow region.

So, to eliminate all sorts of "reports" of local officials on victories, let's compare the kill rate. What is not an indicator of depression? So, the Voronezh region-4,3 on 100 000 people! Amur region-25 on 100 000! Impressive? And what do you think, a talented young man or a talented girl, in any field of activity, will remain in the Amur region? And the residents of the Voronezh province jerk rush to the Far East and Siberia?

In order not to tell us about the desire of the country's leadership to improve the lives of Siberians and Far Easterners, life shows that this desire is not yet visible in business. In the words, yes. In business, no! Siberia and the Far East today the territory of catastrophic depopulation!

It is catastrophic. Most of the settlements, from large cities to very small zaimok, decreased in population! And the decrease is really akin to war. Up to a third of the population over the past 35-40 years!

For comparison, look at the statistics of migration in the regions of the world where real hostilities are taking place. Look at the same Syria. And what about war behind the Urals?

The development of industrial centers of Siberia and the Far East is good. The development of science is also good. Everything that develops is alive! But cities and villages are empty. Earth returns to a wild state. Again, crime, drug addiction, and alcoholism are growing. The Urals turns into a "house of veterans". The youth is running. Remain old.

The geopolitical position of our country is such that there is practically no region to which, on occasion, the neighbors will not entangle. These regions are too rich and too weak to defend themselves. This requires people. Those who in the first days will defend their own homes.

Otherwise, we will not even need to fight. For the second time, Siberia and the Far East will be “conquered by the Cossacks Yermak”. Just come to the desert land and all. There is no land! Without creating favorable, even comfortable, living conditions for Siberians and Far Easterners, we risk spending much more money in the future to defend deserted territories.

There is a problem. Are the words of the great Lomonosov forgotten? "Russian power will grow through Siberia and the Northern Ocean!" May we no longer need power? Can it be easier to get bored to the size of the European part? Only now before the ancestors it will be a shame ... They did a great power from Russia, and we?
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  1. Chichikov
    Chichikov 8 March 2018 07: 15
    +11
    What do we want? Russia, at 181 place in population density!
    1. Olgovich
      Olgovich 8 March 2018 07: 44
      +9
      Quote: Chichikov
      What do we want? Russia, at 181 place in population density!

      Today, Russia's population density is LESS than a hundred years ago under the Russian Empire (8,5 h / km2 at 9,5 h / km2).
      The neighbors grew at times.
      The situation is extremely difficult. Is there a way out? request
      It was before: you just had to leave the Russian people alone, without the “great turning points” of the 1917-1930s, and Siberia would be inhabited today: in just 22 years of Nikolai’s reign, the population of the Far East grew FIVE times to half a million people.
      Where to get today the barbarically over-consumed human resources is unclear ... request
      1. Boris55
        Boris55 8 March 2018 08: 57
        +34
        Quote: Olgovich
        The neighbors grew at times.

        Because neighbors came to us to destroy us as a biological species on earth, and we came to them to calm them.
        Quote: Olgovich
        in just 22 years of Nikolai’s reign, the population of the Far East grew FIVE times

        And under Stalin (not counting the camps) - how many times? Do not remember what great construction sites were at that time and how many people worked for them? And during WWII how many factories were evacuated there? So your king is quietly resting on the sidelines.
        Quote: Olgovich
        Where to get today the previously barbarously overspended human resources is unclear ..

        Where to get, where to get ... From 10 pm to 6 am all over Russia, turn off the lights and the problem will resolve itself. Yes, and leave only two TV channels: about animals and about nature. And I completely forgot - the Internet is the same for the night to cut down.
        1. Olgovich
          Olgovich 8 March 2018 09: 14
          +2
          Quote: Boris55
          And under Stalin (not counting the camps) - how many times? So your tsar is quietly resting on the sidelines.

          For the following 36 Stalin's years, just .... TWO times!
          Now compare: FIVE times in 22 years and TWO times in ...... 36 years!
          So your leader is resting on the sidelines.
          Quote: Boris55
          Where to get, where to get ... From 10 pm to 6 am all over Russia, turn off the lights and the problem will resolve itself.

          The number of abortions will increase.
          1. Boris55
            Boris55 8 March 2018 09: 29
            +19
            Quote: Olgovich
            Now compare: FIVE times in 22 years and TWO times in ...... 36 years!

            In order to get from "0" to "5", you need only "5", but to get from "5" to "10" twice as much than with the king.
            Quote: Olgovich
            The number of abortions will increase.

            But the number of births will increase and the people will have time to look into each other's eyes ...
            1. Olgovich
              Olgovich 8 March 2018 10: 20
              0
              Quote: Boris55
              In order to go from "0" to "5" - you need only "5"

              belay IN RUSSIAN express ts "thought"! yes
              Quote: Boris55
              but what would be from "5" to "10" you need twice as much as with the king.
              The growth rate of the population under the Emperor grew was almost FOUR times higher than with the leader.
              Able to calculate how many times the population would be larger by 1953, with normal power than with the leader? hi
              1. Boris55
                Boris55 8 March 2018 10: 31
                +14
                Quote: Olgovich
                Able to calculate how many times the population would be larger by 1953

                Do you need to start with the circular of Alexander the 3rd “On the Cooking Children”, thanks to which the revolution of 1917 took place and the subsequent genocide of the Russian people, the civil war and the Great Patriotic War? Or maybe start with the Decembrists, who wanted to take the land from the peasants?
                1. Olgovich
                  Olgovich 8 March 2018 10: 53
                  +1
                  Quote: Boris55
                  You start with the circular of Alexander the 3rd

                  belay
                  Theme-demography of Siberia and the Far East.
                  Did you find the leader’s failed numbers?
                  1. Boris55
                    Boris55 8 March 2018 12: 57
                    +7
                    Quote: Olgovich
                    Theme-demography of Siberia and the Far East.

                    You still did not understand that everything that happened with demography in Russia (the USSR) was to blame for the kings.
                    1. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 8 March 2018 15: 13
                      +1
                      Quote: Boris55
                      You still did not understand that everything that happened with demography in Russia (the USSR) was to blame for the kings.

                      It is impossible to understand what was NOT at all.
                      Under the Emperor, the population of Russia increased on 50% for 22 years, with the leader for 22 years already .... 13%. Russian Cross-92 year.
                      AGAIN does not reach who and what?
                      1. Boris55
                        Boris55 8 March 2018 16: 01
                        +22
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        It is impossible to understand what was NOT at all.

                        One king blocks the social elevator, which leads to the degradation of the elite and a general stupor of the people. Another king does not cope with the rusty stupid elite and signs the abdication ... In the end, it was the kings who brought the country to a state of chaos of the 17th and civil war ... All the consequences of the demography of the last century lie entirely on the tsarist regime, which could not cope with their responsibilities.
                        I understand that it’s convenient for you to snatch a piece of history and blame the one you want, but that’s not the case in life.
                      2. TechnoID
                        TechnoID 8 March 2018 16: 47
                        +1
                        Can you give data in absolute units with the exact indication of time intervals?
                      3. KaPToC
                        KaPToC 8 March 2018 22: 19
                        +3
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        When the Emperor, the population of Russia increased by 50% in 22 years, while the leader for 22 years already .... by 13%. Russian Cross-92 year.

                        Sorry, what do you think? People or interest?
                      4. Evgeniy667b
                        Evgeniy667b 9 March 2018 17: 41
                        +4
                        In fact, the inhabitants of Russia, whom it was impossible to defeat by military force, were led like papuans from the mumbo-jumbo tribe, on candy wrappers with the image of President Lincoln and an easy carefree life. and of course on the Chinese deshovka and Japanese used. Yes, and mattresses fussed in time. So what is already the population and prosperity of the Power in the regions east of the Ural Mountains? Or even a hundred kilometers beyond the Moscow Ring Road, there is also relevant. But it’s well known that a holy place does not happen empty, so the masses of Chinese “predatory explorers” moved to empty lands and cut down Siberian forests in a row, often with the hands of our home-grown lumpen. And they began to buy land, especially around Lake Baikal. On satellite images, everything is clearly visible. Fresh water in China is also not enough, but where to get it, so only with us. And then they will talk about Baikal like this, This is the great Chinese sea, on the banks of which Russians once lived! If Russia wants to survive, first of all it is necessary to squeeze out the mercantile spirit, and work on their own sweat, not tapping on the "clave", but say cultivating their land. And everyone should, otherwise they will soon forget about us, and the future victims of the USE will strain the memory, remembering what “Russia” is and where it was located.
                    2. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 9 March 2018 10: 26
                      +1
                      Quote: Boris55
                      One king blocks a social elevator, leading to elite degradation and a general dull people.

                      Stupidity of the people ?! fool lol
                      And Soviet science HOW HERE, honey, man?
                      From imperial science and imperial universities, Kurchatov and Korolev came out, ALL scientists of atomic and space projects
                      Quote: Boris55
                      .. Ultimately, it was the kings who brought the country to the state of chaos of the 17th and civil war ..

                      The war was-UNEXPECTED in the history of mankind. And the weakening of the state (EVERYWHERE it was). Hit in the back in such a situation -
                      betrayal.
                      Stalin, knowing this - destroyed all potential New Bolsheviks, "peace fighters."
                      Quote: Boris55
                      . All the consequences of the demography of the last century lie entirely on the tsarist regime, failed with your duties.

                      Fully managed, population growth of 50% in 22 years - this was not later and never will be
                      Quote: Boris55
                      I understand that it’s convenient for you to snatch a piece of history and blame the one you want, but that’s not the case in life.

                      WHAT is torn out? All in order. to argue is impossible. hi
                      1. onix757
                        onix757 9 March 2018 10: 40
                        +11
                        And where did Soviet science come from, my dear, man? Kurchatov and Korolev, ALL scientists of atomic and space projects came out of imperial science and imperial universities

                        Come on you. There were no atomic or space projects in tsarist Russia. It was the Soviet government that created these industries, and Kurchatov and Korolev became what they became.
                      2. Boris55
                        Boris55 9 March 2018 10: 53
                        +9
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        Completed completely

                        If I could handle it, there would be no shocks.
                      3. Alf
                        Alf 9 March 2018 14: 36
                        +4
                        Olgovich in his repertoire, all the troubles from the Bolsheviks. If they (and whether they were?) Didn’t dismiss nicholas from work, Russia would be hoo ...
                    3. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 9 March 2018 16: 56
                      0
                      Quote: onix757
                      Come on you. There were no atomic or space projects in tsarist Russia. It was the Soviet government that created these industries, and Kurchatov and Korolev became what they became.

                      You are illiterate, alas.
                      Read about Commission for the Study of Natural Productive Forces of Russia (KEPS)., about the academicians Vernadsky, Khlopin, Mysovsky, Ioffe, and other scientists of the RADIUS Institute — they ALL made a name for themselves BEFORE the THIEF, Kurchatov — their student. He and his ilk are graduates of the imperial university, like Korolev. And they were taught by imperial scholars.
                      Kurchatov
                2. Sergej1972
                  Sergej1972 8 March 2018 21: 24
                  +1
                  Circular of Minister Delyanov. It was recommendatory in nature, there was nothing terribly reactionary in it. He did not achieve his goals, in view of the indignation of wide sections of the public. It was not actually executed.
                  1. Boris55
                    Boris55 9 March 2018 10: 59
                    +2
                    Quote: Sergej1972
                    It was not actually executed.

                    Three classes of church parish?
                    1. Sergej1972
                      Sergej1972 12 March 2018 02: 05
                      0
                      There are articles on this topic in the "Questions of History", and in "Domestic History", and on the Internet.
              2. KaPToC
                KaPToC 8 March 2018 22: 14
                +3
                Quote: Olgovich
                IN RUSSIAN express ts "thought"!

                The point is that people are counted in pieces, and not in percentage terms, so that one and a half digger does not work out.
          2. Vladivostok1969
            Vladivostok1969 8 March 2018 15: 27
            +23
            I live in the Far East. And I’ll say as a doctor that my acquaintances are "flying" to the European part of Russia. And they are being replaced by guys from Central Asia. massively.
          3. KaPToC
            KaPToC 8 March 2018 22: 12
            +4
            Quote: Olgovich
            The number of abortions will increase.

            The problem of Russia is the egoism of its citizens who do not want to give birth and support children.
            1. gaura
              gaura 9 March 2018 06: 47
              +8
              Here it is cho)) abortion is an abominable act, as if these fools didn’t know what would happen if their legs were raised. But keeping and raising children is not a potato planting per hectare. Everything is designed to make the most money. Until the annual rewriting of textbooks, so that every year they buy new ones
        2. the most important
          the most important 8 March 2018 12: 42
          +27
          Quote: Boris55
          Where to get, where to get ... From 10 pm to 6 am all over Russia, turn off the lights and the problem will resolve itself.

          And where is the light luxury ??? It is true in the article that the Ermak era is already beginning 100 km from the piece of iron. Although ... there is no Ermak there ... A complete feeling that a herd of mammoths will come out from behind the forest! The landscape is only spoiled by the ruins of villages and the ruins of cowsheds, and rickety crosses on the graves of rural cemeteries .... But Uryakaly, sitting in bright offices or on large sofas, tell everyone here how good it has become to live in the country in recent years! They certainly feel good, but where to put the ruins of villages and arable land overgrown with forest ???
          1. Boris55
            Boris55 8 March 2018 13: 00
            0
            Quote: the most important
            They certainly feel good, but where to put the ruins of villages and arable land overgrown with forest ???

            Did you hear the president’s message well? If you missed something - in the internet it is: kremlin.ru/events/president/transcripts/56957
            1. vlad_vlad
              vlad_vlad 8 March 2018 14: 16
              +22
              message ... 100500 promise ... 18 years already the record is spinning

              you just need to give people free will. from my own experience I know Siberian peasants are special, entrepreneurial and bossy. to give them freedom, not to interfere, not to beat on their hands, to remove all kinds of bloodsuckers and all kinds of "pointers" so they will turn the mountains.
              Previously, they called such "fists", but in reality they simply were not lazy people.
              1. Victor N
                Victor N 8 March 2018 17: 02
                +10
                Will to give? So deforestation and poaching will quickly turn everything into the desert. Maybe not this?
              2. KaPToC
                KaPToC 8 March 2018 22: 20
                +6
                Quote: vlad_vlad
                you just need to give people free will.

                Yes, just give me your will - cut everything out, take it out, fuck it up.
                1. zyablik.olga
                  zyablik.olga 10 March 2018 02: 44
                  +12
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  Yes, just give me your will - cut everything out, take it out, fuck it up.

                  Apparently everyone judges by themselves! negative
                  Come see what becomes of the taiga river after the gold miners pass through it, or how the taiga turns into a desert after barbarous logging. Maybe local people do this? No. All firms and companies are registered in the "expensive" capital, well, and also the Chinese are renting out sections of the taiga. The workers are working on a rotational basis, they are all in parallel, what remains after them, since they do not live on this earth. In Soviet times, this was not, chemicals on the rivers were not used and were engaged in reforestation. the impression is that invaders are now on our far eastern land.
                  1. KaPToC
                    KaPToC 10 March 2018 22: 52
                    0
                    Quote: zyablik.olga
                    Come see what becomes of the taiga river after the gold miners pass through it, or how the taiga turns into a desert after barbarous logging. Maybe local people do this?

                    Local-non-local does not matter.
                    1. zyablik.olga
                      zyablik.olga 12 March 2018 05: 41
                      +3
                      Quote: KaPToC
                      Local-non-local does not matter.

                      So it can reason, only that to whom in their homeland do not care! negative For you who do not live in the Far East, it may not matter! And those who live here do not do this!
                      1. KaPToC
                        KaPToC 12 March 2018 08: 38
                        +1
                        Quote: zyablik.olga
                        So it can reason, only that to whom in their homeland do not care!

                        Such as - you do not care. First, you divide people into “friends” and “strangers,” and then divide the state into specific principalities for “yours.”
          2. Vladivostok1969
            Vladivostok1969 8 March 2018 15: 35
            +23
            This is all the lyrics. But really, 130 km from Dalnerechensk (Primorsky Krai) there is the village of Polyany. More than one and a half thousand people live in it. There’s not that there is no gas. There they give electricity twice a day. In the morning 3 hours and in the evening 3 hours ( there’s a diesel engine). The president promised to get the Internet there. And why the hell is he needed without electricity .. And there are many such villages in Primorye.
            1. Alf
              Alf 10 March 2018 20: 18
              0
              Quote: Vladivostok1969
              . And why the hell is he needed there without electricity.

              That they would know that the government will not abandon them, and take care of them.
        3. New Year day
          New Year day 10 March 2018 00: 21
          +4
          Quote: Boris55
          From 10 pm to 6 am throughout the whole of Russia, turn off the lights and the problem will resolve itself.

          and the number of foundlings and abortions will jump. Newborns need baby food, diapers and more. Without this, childhood is now unthinkable. It’s just that these goods are very expensive.
          a large pack of diapers (90 pcs) costs from 700 to 1.5 thousand. How many babies are sent for themselves per day?
          1. raw174
            raw174 12 March 2018 10: 35
            +5
            As the father of a six-year-old daughter, a nine-month-old son and the husband of a wife who, in the fifth month of pregnancy, I will say competently smile
            Quote: Silvestr
            Newborns need baby food

            Not so much ... a week I spend about 500 rubles on baby purees and lures, half (about 230 rubles) is a children's milk substitute, because stopped breastfeeding at 5 months., after six months, the child eats the same as me, only chopped.
            Quote: Silvestr
            a large pack of diapers (90 pcs) costs from 700 to 1.5 thousand. How many babies are sent for themselves per day?

            1-2 diapers per day, only at night. 10-15 sliders, daily washing, there is nothing complicated and expensive, from 7 months. we get accustomed to the pot, the flow of sliders fell to 3-7 per day))) Of course, children are a serious expense item, but not so much as not on the budget ... My family’s income is average, about 35 thousand (my salary + maternity wife), we pay a mortgage, we live quite well. In general, he is not as scary as he is painted wink
            1. New Year day
              New Year day 12 March 2018 13: 20
              +1
              Quote: raw174
              1-2 diapers per day, only at night.

              you are just lucky with the baby.
              Quote: raw174
              In general, he is not as scary as he is painted

              Well done boys
      2. 210ox
        210ox 8 March 2018 09: 03
        +7
        What should I do, what should I do? Administrative measures? Where was I born there and useful? Settlement censorship? Maybe, although I myself left Smolensk (the regional center 400 km from the capital, what is the Amur region) to the Krasnodar Territory .. Yes in the center taiga countries will grow up soon .. With high salaries? But the capitalist is looking first of all in his pocket. I believe that a whole range of preferences is necessary, but I'm afraid that the country will not pull it.
        1. Evgeniy667b
          Evgeniy667b 9 March 2018 18: 03
          +2
          Moreover, for Moscow, introduce a new limited residence permit, otherwise it has grown to disgrace! And who is not there. Only Azerbaijanis are hundreds of thousands.
      3. basmach
        basmach 8 March 2018 09: 38
        +18

        Just do not rubbish about the great fractures. And during the Soviet era (taking into account the population decline in the Second World War), the population grew from 500 thousand to 5 million-10 times. And if you are talking about the Stolypin reforms. For the period 1906 — 1914. 3040333 people moved to Siberia, 529835 people returned, or 10,8%. The largest number of “followers” ​​occurred in the 1910 — 1911 years, amounting to 238501 people, or 2,6% of all migrants. Data from the Chelyabinsk registration show that for 1896 — 1914. because of the Urals, 27% of the total number of people who passed beyond the Urals returned from Urals, and only 13% of family migrants. Most of the return migrants fell into the category of unauthorized: their specific gravity for the 20-year period fluctuated between 43 — 87%, while in the direct movement “self-wills” amounted to 30 — 45%. From the number of those settled to plots for 1909 — 1914. only 9,2% left them .. But there is still no data on those who have never been able to return anywhere, that is, those who died on these resettled lands
        1. Olgovich
          Olgovich 8 March 2018 10: 39
          +1
          Quote: basmach
          Just do not rubbish about the great fractures.

          So do not write, who forces you? yes This nonsense, for example:
          Quote: basmach
          And during the Soviet era (taking into account the decline in population in the Second World War), the population grew from 500 thousand to 5 million 10 times.

          FIVE times, not ten, and that's for .... 74 years!
          Those. five times 22 years in Russia and five times for .... 74 years under the "people's" power!
          The difference is no, yes. lol ...
          Quote: basmach
          .For the period 1906—1914 gg

          What year is 1914 ?! belay Resettlement continued during the Second World War and even by inertia after the BOP month, the bald tourist canceled the last migration tickets with a special decree.
          Quote: basmach
          Data from the Chelyabinsk registration show that for 1896-1914. from the Urals, 27% of the total number who passed beyond the Urals returned from the Urals, and only 13% of family migrants.

          Bley research on this topic, and so: a huge amount of so-called. the “returnees” were HODOKI from village societies: having studied the situation and the conditions, yes, they returned to Russia, but only in order to take their families and leave the whole family to Siberia and the Far East.
          And over the past few years there, on horseback and the great work of the Russian peasant and with the help of the government, almost as much virgin land was mastered as the wild costs and devastation of the Non-Chernozem Region "mastered" power "raising" virgin soil in Kazakhstan, with tractors, cars, etc. ..
      4. SK70
        SK70 8 March 2018 10: 45
        +11
        Quote: Olgovich
        Where to get today the barbarically over-consumed human resources is unclear ...

        It is better to build roads, enterprises, social programs than in the capital.
        Add more financial "goodies" and people will go.
        1. 210ox
          210ox 8 March 2018 10: 53
          +6
          Well, you turned it down ... Although you should have moved the capital to Khabarovsk ...
          Quote: SK70
          Quote: Olgovich
          Where to get today the barbarically over-consumed human resources is unclear ...

          It is better to build roads, enterprises, social programs than in the capital.
          Add more financial "goodies" and people will go.
          1. domokl
            8 March 2018 16: 48
            +4
            Quote: 210ox
            .Although the capital should be moved to Khabarovsk ...

            Why not? I have not been to Khabarovsk, but I think no worse than other Russian cities
          2. faridg7
            faridg7 10 March 2018 12: 14
            +5
            Quote: 210ox
            Although the capital should have been moved to Khabarovsk ...

            Ek, you grabbed, you are still in the capital of Kaliningrad, and gather all the leadership there, so that anyone could cover with one blow. Khabarovsk from China through the Amur, artillery covers from the border and the city and surroundings. The capital should be kept somewhere in the vicinity of the sources of the Yenisei, so that strategists could only get it, and there wasn’t much space for stolen officials - there was enough space for lumbering (at the same time, they will understand that the living wage in Russia is also the cost of heating and warm clothes. And then they think that they live on the equator)
          3. zoolu350
            zoolu350 11 March 2018 14: 11
            +2
            No, Khabarovsk is practically on the border with the PRC and in case of war will be captured with lightning speed. It is better to make the capital of the new Soviet Eurasian Empire Novosibirsk, it is optimal in location.
        2. Olgovich
          Olgovich 8 March 2018 10: 56
          +3
          Quote: SK70
          and people will go.

          Where from? The population of Russia is rapidly aging ......
          1. SK70
            SK70 8 March 2018 11: 22
            +2
            Quote: Olgovich
            Quote: SK70
            and people will go.

            Where from? The population of Russia is rapidly aging ......

            Family estates.
            People are being built, and the state is EASILY building hospitals, schools, kindergartens, power lines, gas pipelines and roads.
            1. Olgovich
              Olgovich 8 March 2018 15: 16
              +3
              Quote: SK70
              People are being built, and the state is EASILY building hospitals, schools, kindergartens, power lines, gas pipelines and roads.

              WHERE are there too many people in Russia to leave for the Far East, without prejudice to their region? Except the Caucasus? request
              1. m077ea
                m077ea 8 March 2018 22: 38
                0
                yeah) but from the Caucasus they rushed right there with all their legs))))
                and here they’ve fallen to us from the Trans-Urals
            2. faridg7
              faridg7 9 March 2018 14: 26
              +5
              Estate? I filed an application for a plot for building a house (the governor decided to give plots to families with two children) when my eldest in 10th grade was studying. I’m waiting, the boy is studying at the 4th year.
              1. Sergej1972
                Sergej1972 12 March 2018 12: 24
                0
                It is better for yourself and your children to buy normal apartments. Your home is an eternal hemorrhoids, an eternal repair. Children, having matured, will prefer to live in city apartments.
                1. faridg7
                  faridg7 12 March 2018 13: 14
                  +1
                  Well, whoever sees hemorrhoids somewhere during construction either tried to save (where this should not be done), or did not build a house for himself. The apartment is a city, it is a dependency on someone. I want my neighbors to live not across the wall from me, but slightly at a distance (ideally at least a kilometer)
                  1. Sergej1972
                    Sergej1972 12 March 2018 13: 59
                    +1
                    Clearly, Wishlist live away from everyone. That is, you also do not want to become a real villager. Most likely you don’t want to become part of the local society? Probably refuse to participate in self-taxation? And I have to.)) A variant of a small sleeping individual area?)) Work in the city, come to your house for the night, and relax on the weekend. Do not communicate with locals, because among them there are many, to put it mildly, complex people. )) In the village, they don’t like such former townspeople.)) You know, I have a bunch of relatives living in the countryside. They have no particular independence from their superiors, nor from their environment, nor from the local natural environment.
                    And in old age you will still return to the city. Or, as an option, children will come over the weekend to help with the housework, swearing in their souls at a parent who wants to take root on the ground and distracts them from matters that are important to them.
                    This is the irony of course. I wish you success. You only ask the children, they themselves need it. Do they really want to live in this house?
                    1. faridg7
                      faridg7 12 March 2018 14: 22
                      +3
                      Well, my children remember with pleasure the time when we lived in a rural house, despite the fact that life was deeply imperfect. Work in the city? I can work in the city, of course, but I need a small box and a workshop (for now I have enough of the former forge), and this is difficult in the city. I would have a plot on the outskirts, but I’ll figure out what to do in my old age, especially since I’m far from old. And by the way, I somehow did not think about my children living with me all their lives - they have their own way, their dreams. The eldest goes through a military career, the pilot, the younger studies the specialty of building unique structures. I don’t think that their goals in life will allow them to live their whole lives with their parents, but I can work anywhere I live.
                      1. Sergej1972
                        Sergej1972 12 March 2018 16: 22
                        0
                        I wish you success. Just keep in mind that working informally will not work. With this now, even in rural areas strictly. If there will be at least some profit, the tax service will remember you.) At the same time, both the village administration and the local school. There is such a tradition that small entrepreneurs in poor settlements provide some kind of free help to a local school, etc. Refuse - there will be problems with the local authorities, and with local residents.
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      5. naidas
        naidas 8 March 2018 16: 49
        +1
        The beginning of the Russian Far East-1850. (Nevelsky team), 1854-800 Russians, 1855, 2,5 Russians were added.
        For the years 1900-1913. About 300 thousand peasants from other parts of the country arrived in the Amur Region.
        So you downplay not 5 but more times.
      6. Dimmedroll
        Dimmedroll 8 March 2018 19: 44
        0
        Yeah, World War I, Revolution, Civil, World War II, Democracy 90. It's also good that 8,5h / km2
      7. zyablik.olga
        zyablik.olga 9 March 2018 13: 11
        +8
        Quote: Olgovich
        Where to get today the barbarically over-consumed human resources is unclear ...

        It is unclear ... or maybe just to create normal conditions for the life of people in the Far East? During Soviet times, people from the European part of the country actively traveled to the BAM and the North for the "long ruble." Now the trend is exactly the opposite, so from 1991, the population of Komsomolsk-on-Amur, according to official data, has decreased from 330 thousand to 250 thousand people. And note this, "the city of presidential attention." It is terrible to imagine what is happening in the territories to which Putin is "inattentive."
        But seriously, the Far Easterners do not need help, it is necessary to reduce energy tariffs and taxes. Equalize at least the price of electricity for local enterprises with the one for which we supply to China.
        1. KaPToC
          KaPToC 9 March 2018 21: 25
          +2
          Quote: zyablik.olga
          It’s not clear ... maybe it can just create normal conditions for the life of people in the Far East?

          What should this express? Creating normal conditions! Gulf Stream to make it warmer?
          1. zyablik.olga
            zyablik.olga 10 March 2018 02: 21
            +9
            Quote: KaPToC
            What should this express? Creating normal conditions! Gulf Stream to make it warmer?

            Do you really understand nothing or are you pretending? Maybe you should time to live with us to feel? There are several large enterprises in Komsomolsk, including an aircraft factory on which Su-35С is being built, a shipbuilding plant where nuclear boats, metallurgical production and oil refining were built before. This is something that still works, and not ditched like dozens of other enterprises. But, what do the locals have with it? Salary on aviation 30 thousand, despite the fact that prices in stores are very different from the European part of the country. If at least half of the money earned had been left in the Far East, the region would have developed. For now, only a talking room and empty promises. Our conditions are very hard, prices are high, and earnings are low. Because the people and leaves.
            1. KaPToC
              KaPToC 10 March 2018 23: 02
              0
              Quote: zyablik.olga
              If at least half of the money earned was left in the Far East, the region would develop.

              I will answer with your own words
              Quote: zyablik.olga
              Do you really understand or pretend to be nothing?

              Khabarovsk Territory is among the recipients, and not at all donors, that is, it receives more from the center than it gives.
              Quote: zyablik.olga
              But what do locals have with this?

              Who built - that and has, what have the locals?
              1. zyablik.olga
                zyablik.olga 12 March 2018 05: 48
                +2
                Quote: KaPToC
                Khabarovsk Territory is among the recipients, and not at all donors, that is, it receives more from the center than it gives.

                Come on. And taxes KnAAPO, Rosneft and other snacks where they pay? fool In the Far East, or in Moscow?
                Quote: KaPToC
                Who built - that and has, what have the locals?

                Yeah, can you tell me what the owners of the current enterprises have built? They also planted a forest, buried gold and other minerals, pumped oil and gas into the depths? the impression that you are with the current government in the share. negative
                1. KaPToC
                  KaPToC 12 March 2018 08: 40
                  +1
                  Quote: zyablik.olga
                  Come on. And taxes KnAAPO, Rosneft and other snacks where they pay?

                  Quote: zyablik.olga
                  Yeah, can you tell me what the owners of the current enterprises built?

                  In this case, the state has built - the state and distributes profits. This is not your "snacks".
                  1. zyablik.olga
                    zyablik.olga 12 March 2018 14: 31
                    +3
                    Quote: KaPToC
                    In this case, the state has built - the state and distributes profits. This is not your "snacks".

                    French king Louis XIV is credited with the phrase - the state is me. So in our country, too, there are such figures who consider that the common property belongs only to them. And you seem to serve them.
                    1. KaPToC
                      KaPToC 12 March 2018 20: 54
                      0
                      Quote: zyablik.olga
                      So in our country there are also such figures who consider that the public property belongs only to them. And you seem to be serving them.

                      There is no "public property", it's just PR. The fact that the state is not popular. Do not confuse your coat with the state.
                      "Public property" came up with thieves to justify their theft.
      8. The comment was deleted.
    2. krops777
      krops777 8 March 2018 15: 33
      +14
      Siberia and the Far East - the territory of oblivion


      The DAM government will still remove the northern allowances and additional holidays, there will definitely not be anyone to live here, a working group has already been created saying that the business is ineffective.
      Are the words of the great Lomonosov forgotten? "Russian power will grow in Siberia and the North Ocean!


      The oligarchs take these words in a completely different way. Download from Siberia while there is, and after us at least the grass does not grow.
      1. ammunition
        ammunition 8 March 2018 17: 41
        +7


        This is a map of the natural increase (decline) of the population in Russia.

        And this is a permafrost map. Agriculture is impossible in permafrost.
        ------------------------
        This is so ... Cards for thinking .-))
        1. krops777
          krops777 9 March 2018 04: 28
          +3
          And this is a permafrost map. Agriculture is impossible in permafrost.


          You are deeply mistaken, it is very possible that in Siberia, agricultural firms in cities especially flourish, since there are sales markets and the infrastructure is developed.
          1. Sergej1972
            Sergej1972 12 March 2018 12: 27
            0
            In the south of Siberia and the Far East, in the Amur region, partly in Western Siberia.
        2. cariperpaint
          cariperpaint 9 March 2018 11: 02
          +4
          I certainly apologize wildly but I somehow look around and about horror — even watermelons grow in wild quantities) in Far East where the frost is on your map)
          1. ammunition
            ammunition 9 March 2018 11: 28
            +2
            Quote: cariperpaint
            I certainly apologize wildly but I somehow look around and about horror — even watermelons grow in wild quantities) in Far East where the frost is on your map)

            There is a decent wedge on Amur without permafrost. The map is small and not detailed -))
            -----------------
            Of course inaccurately wrote that .. like "impossible".
            The main thing is that. The main thing - the cultivation of wheat. Without wheat - no way. But with wheat then .. only in a small strip along the very south of Siberia. Well, in the Far East.
            ---------------------
            For food supply, you need half a ton of wheat per person. Or somewhere to buy it and bring.
            Well, compare. Chita region In the south of Siberia. It grows .. where is 50 - 100 thousand tons of wheat. Somewhere on 40 kg per person. And you need 400 - 500 kg minimum. And the same Chelyabinsk region, grows on 700 kg of wheat per person.
            And if you take to the north (in Siberia), you can’t grow wheat there at all.
            1. KaPToC
              KaPToC 9 March 2018 21: 28
              +1
              Quote: ammunition
              The main thing is that. The main thing - the cultivation of wheat. Without wheat - no way. But with wheat then .. only in a small strip along the very south of Siberia. Well, in the Far East.

              It is impossible to grow WINTER wheat, and spring - please, wheat can even be grown in Yakutia.
            2. Yngvar
              Yngvar 12 March 2018 07: 10
              +1
              EVERYTHING is growing in Altai !!! The climate is good! Altai is also Siberia, even earlier (under Soviet rule) it was called the granary of Siberia! Livestock has been successful! Enough for Siberia and the Far East, and exported! What now? Factories have collapsed (agricultural machinery, meat and dairy industry, processing of crops), fields (half at least) are overgrown, price tags for everything are just growing. The lands along rivers and ponds were bought by "gentlemen" from Moscow, St. Petersburg and Novosibirsk, even there is no place to graze livestock for the villagers! The cost of electricity, gas, fuel is prohibitive ... As for work, it is clear like everywhere else - it is not! Land is selected for the sake of the "gentlemen", so that even subsistence farming is impossible to live on. Even people from this fertile land are leaving for the Krasnodar Territory, and we are discussing the Far Eastern hectare ... Before you take something, you need to give something! Our rulers so far give only slogans. "Gulag Archipelago" - "Gulag Archipelago" ..
              1. KaPToC
                KaPToC 12 March 2018 08: 44
                0
                Quote: Yngvar
                so even subsistence farming is impossible

                What nonsense are you writing in order to survive by subsistence farming you have to plow like a damn.
                Quote: Yngvar
                Our rulers so far give only slogans.

                I will not speak for the government - it is not on this forum, but you are talking about it with slogans.
                1. Yngvar
                  Yngvar 12 March 2018 20: 03
                  0
                  It would be where to plow! And so we stand out on inconveniences!
                  But the rulers have one task - to evict us from our remaining lands and put it under the hammer ...
                  1. KaPToC
                    KaPToC 12 March 2018 20: 57
                    0
                    Quote: Yngvar
                    It would be where to plow! And so we stand out on inconveniences!
                    But the rulers have one task - to evict us from our remaining lands and put it under the hammer ...

                    What do you think? They will give you the best land? Good arable land is used for large-scale agricultural production, because the country needs to be fed, but you cannot feed the country on pasture.
                    1. Yngvar
                      Yngvar 12 March 2018 21: 26
                      0
                      And where are they? Large commodity production? Weeds, worse than that of birch forests?
              2. Victor N
                Victor N 12 March 2018 11: 18
                +2
                The lands of visitors are sold by local authorities, which YOU elect.
                So figure it out for yourself, why blame someone. Your households, too, were not ravaged by visitors, but YOU just watched.
                With such indifference, no one will come to help restore you.
                1. Yngvar
                  Yngvar 12 March 2018 20: 19
                  +1
                  We do not need to help! If only they didn’t interfere! You can’t give your hectares of abandoned nearby? Why is it necessary to go somewhere?
    3. Deck
      Deck 8 March 2018 18: 58
      +3
      And why did they conquer, kill the locals? Since you were not going to live? So, rob? Colonies? Belgian Congo? In European countries, the colonies were overseas, but in our country
      1. Dimmedroll
        Dimmedroll 8 March 2018 19: 45
        +1
        Yeah, good colonies, do not even compare.
    4. RUSS
      RUSS 8 March 2018 22: 09
      +2
      Quote: Chichikov
      What do we want? Russia, at 181 place in population density!

      Because 80% of the country's territory is not suitable for living.
    5. Alber
      Alber 9 March 2018 19: 22
      +1
      Quote: Chichikov
      What do we want? Russia, at 181 place in population density!

      experiments on the Russian and especially the Slavic people from the "God-chosen" government led to terrible results "
  2. Bouncer
    Bouncer 8 March 2018 07: 15
    +15
    Nutrient medium for whales
  3. Humans war
    Humans war 8 March 2018 07: 25
    +3
    Yeah ... they’ll give the land for free, but you’ll ennoble it not for free ...
    Money, money is needed ...
    1. Mar.Tirah
      Mar.Tirah 8 March 2018 08: 21
      +31
      God forbid from such an exploration of Siberia as the authorities of Russia are doing, and are now doing it. Felling wood for profiles, technological routes, for sale to China, drilling everything that can be drilled, messing with nature, accidents, and chemical components, poisoning taiga rivers. from need, and illiterate land development. Agriculture is not allowed here. Siberia has a different value. Fish stocks, furs, light planets, clean water ... But in general we would be left alone.
      1. GAF
        GAF 8 March 2018 15: 05
        +5
        Quote: Mar. Tira
        In general, they would leave us alone.

        including the author of this opus with his fabrications sofas. If you haven’t been to Siberia, then at least looked into the geographic atlas. Spells - 200 km from a piece of iron and a wilderness. And what did he expect to find. He writes that the village is getting worse, and for some reason the grain harvest in the country is growing. If this is so a fan of the hinterland, then I would go to the village myself 200 km from the railway and organize weaving of bast shoes to attract tourists as a source of income. You can engage in gathering wild plants, fishing and hunting. With the money received, arrange a comfortable life and lay a motorway to the same neighboring village 50 km away, or even 100 km away from its own ... Altai produces 5 million tons of grain, so it is equipped.
        1. Vladivostok1969
          Vladivostok1969 8 March 2018 16: 13
          +12
          You can engage in gathering wild plants, fishing and hunting.

          Only this is the hinterland and is trying to live. That's just it is forbidden to do all of this. Here and everyone walks under the sword. Only 5-10% of residents are provided with work in the village. But I think you don’t understand this.
          1. Vladivostok1969
            Vladivostok1969 8 March 2018 16: 18
            +8
            And further. Look at the GOOGLE map for the relief of Primorye. After that, think about how to grow potatoes there commercially. Primorye is the beginning of the spurs of Sikhotealin.
        2. domokl
          8 March 2018 16: 54
          +3
          Quote: GAF
          If you haven’t been to Siberia, then at least looked into the geographic atlas.

          laughing Not only was, but the author was born and lives in Siberia ... Moreover, it is always far beyond 200 km from a piece of iron ... Have you ever been to Siberia? or from students? Type of Tomsk University?
          1. GAF
            GAF 8 March 2018 23: 35
            +4
            Quote: domokl
            Have you ever been to Siberia? or from students? Type of Tomsk University?

            Well, how did not happen. I live in her darling. In fact, in Tomsk universities, not offices such as uni.
            "It's just that all this is forbidden. That's where everyone goes under the sword."
            I wonder who can ban it ?. They gathered in a taiga and in the taiga, and there the owner is a bear. The main thing is to take out the prepared, the only problem is
            transport. You can't take a lot on the river on motorboats. But in the most evil places, dashing co-operators open legal reception centers. The governor at the beginning of the harvesting season urges residents of the region to collect wild plants. They are in steady demand in Europe. And there is nothing to look for devils in a quiet pool to the author of the opus.
            1. zyablik.olga
              zyablik.olga 9 March 2018 13: 26
              +9
              Quote: GAF
              I wonder who can ban it. They gathered a gang and in the taiga, and there the bear is the owner.

              Last year, my husband, as usual, bought two licenses for catching autumn salmon - chum. For each, you could catch 20 fish. So, even the money spent on the purchase of licenses failed to repel. As in the estuary in the lower reaches of the Amur, with the permission of Moscow, in order to carry out the program “accessible fish”, the river was partitioned off with a steel network, and scooped salmon in narrowness. As a result, a lot of chum just choked and died. If in 2016 a single gutted fish weighing 4-6 kg cost 200-250 rubles, now it is sold in stores at 300-400 rubles per kg. feel the difference am Who needs such "affordable fish"? As a result, the local population in the villages on the bank of the Amur was left without means of subsistence, and many bears did not accumulate fat and became rods.
              As for finding a weapon in the forest, then apparently you are not a hunter. If you fall out of season, or without a license, the weapon will be removed and you will pay a large fine. It doesn’t matter that a hungry crank can gobble you up, the “right guard” is not interested.
              1. Alf
                Alf 9 March 2018 14: 38
                +2
                Quote: zyablik.olga
                It doesn’t matter that a hungry connecting rod can eat you up, "law enforcement" is not interested.

                When it’s devoured, then come for weapons.
                1. The comment was deleted.
                  1. Alf
                    Alf 9 March 2018 15: 22
                    +2
                    Quote: zyablik.olga
                    It is good that my husband is not very law-abiding in some moments.

                    So, soon the greenpeace will come running and imprison (God forbid) your spouse for cruelty to animals. love
                    1. The comment was deleted.
        3. egor670
          egor670 9 March 2018 16: 36
          +2
          What are wild plants? can still start weaving bast shoes?
        4. neofit962
          neofit962 8 August 2018 18: 23
          0
          Equipped ?! Try to drive a car along the roads in the Slavgorod area, along the autobahns and highways there. Then tell and show everyone the arrangement ...
      2. alex86
        alex86 8 March 2018 20: 50
        +9
        Quote: Mar. Tira
        . And in general would leave us alone.

        The main idea! All of us would have been left alone for 10 years (if it’s really impossible for ever in our country) - you see, the second development of Siberia would have taken place, and the GDP would have been doubled.
        And then, when regular people wanting to sell something call me, I - I have a very small company, they will grow up for me; I - for no reason. Logic: if you grow up, they’ll be taken away, or they will make you share. At our previous position, the mayor sent emissaries with a proposal - we don’t need money from you, give 10% of the shares, it will not cost you anything, and there will be no problems. Therefore, I don’t want to grow - no one will be hated on my cutters (I hope).
    2. Alf
      Alf 8 March 2018 10: 09
      +15
      Quote: Humans War
      They will give the land for free, but you will not ennoble it for free ...

      And one more problem. Well, you grow potatoes, but at least you get ostrich eggs or something, and WHERE do you get it? What are you lucky on? Which roads?
      1. KaPToC
        KaPToC 8 March 2018 22: 27
        +1
        Quote: Alf
        And one more problem. Well, you grow potatoes, but at least you get ostrich eggs or something, and WHERE do you get it? What are you lucky on? Which roads?

        Do you propose to asphalt the whole of Siberia?
        1. zyablik.olga
          zyablik.olga 9 March 2018 13: 30
          +9
          Quote: KaPToC
          Do you propose to asphalt the whole of Siberia?

          At least cities and federal highways normally asphalt. Come to us in Komsomolsk-on-Amur, look at our roads. Even in 90, there was no such horror.
        2. Alf
          Alf 9 March 2018 14: 33
          +7
          Quote: KaPToC
          Quote: Alf
          And one more problem. Well, you grow potatoes, but at least you get ostrich eggs or something, and WHERE do you get it? What are you lucky on? Which roads?

          Do you propose to asphalt the whole of Siberia?

          No, this is unrealistic. Just before giving a person shareware land, you should take care of the local infrastructure. What will he eat? Where are Everyday to Coward stores everyday? Where are the kindergarten schools? Where is the electricity-sewer? It turns out like a robinson in the middle of the ocean. If he buys building materials, who and what will bring them to him? What time will he get this delivery? Will he personally work on this hectare? With family ? Try it, take your family to such conditions. How long will they stretch there?
          1. KaPToC
            KaPToC 9 March 2018 21: 21
            +3
            Quote: Alf
            No, this is unrealistic. Just before giving a person shareware land, you should take care of the local infrastructure.

            In general, the "state must", but what about the fact that citizens should? They do not want to give birth to children, they do not want to defend their homeland, they do not want to work, but everything is the same - the state should. We have a paradoxical situation, when citizens do not fulfill their obligations, and the state does not fulfill theirs, but who is to blame?
            1. zyablik.olga
              zyablik.olga 12 March 2018 05: 51
              +2
              Quote: KaPToC
              In general, the "state must", but what about the fact that citizens should? They do not want to give birth to children, they do not want to defend their homeland, they do not want to work, but everything is the same - the state should. We have a paradoxical situation, when citizens do not fulfill their obligations, and the state does not fulfill theirs, but who is to blame?

              And what exactly are we not fulfilling our obligations? We work, pay taxes, what else do you need? And about the "protection of the motherland", so I 2,5 year contract served. And my husband is 25 years old. And you forgive how many years the armed forces have given?
              1. KaPToC
                KaPToC 12 March 2018 08: 47
                0
                Quote: zyablik.olga
                And you forgive how many years the armed forces have given up?

                Two years of military service.
                Quote: zyablik.olga
                And what exactly are we not fulfilling our obligations with?

                Not you specifically, I personally do not blame you for anything.
                Quote: zyablik.olga
                And about the "defense of the homeland," so I served 2,5 years under the contract. And my husband is 25 years old.

                How many children do you have?
                1. zyablik.olga
                  zyablik.olga 12 March 2018 13: 26
                  +3
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  How many children do you have?

                  Unfortunately, I cannot have children for medical reasons. But my husband has three, and I have excellent relations with everyone.
                  As for the rest, if our government will argue like you, after a while the Far East will cease to be Russian.
                  1. KaPToC
                    KaPToC 12 March 2018 21: 00
                    0
                    Quote: zyablik.olga
                    As for the rest, if our government will argue like you, after a while the Far East will cease to be Russian.

                    We lost the Far East not today and not yesterday, but in 1917, thanks to the Communists, vote for Grudinin and the list of lost lands will expand.
                    1. Essex62
                      Essex62 12 March 2018 23: 53
                      0
                      Well, what G. communist? The same huckster.
                      1. KaPToC
                        KaPToC 14 March 2018 20: 24
                        0
                        Quote: Essex62
                        Well, what G. communist? The same huckster.

                        I understand that very well, I just did not expect that the Communists would sell to the State Department
              2. Victor N
                Victor N 12 March 2018 11: 26
                +1
                With your life and military experience, the hope for someone in solving pressing problems is amazing! Complaining is the last thing, it is necessary to demand, within the framework of the reasonable.
  4. moskowit
    moskowit 8 March 2018 07: 28
    +29
    ..It's good to at least forget how to weave bast shoes.

    And in Siberia they could not weave them ... There was no need for such shoes ...
    The author writes very correctly. Everything that was mastered and built by the people during industrialization is killed and forgotten. Need an Ideology and Program. Indeed, only the sagacity of the Soviet government in the thirties about the creation of industrial double centers in the Urals and Siberia with the Far East helped to withstand and defeat the most terrible war of our country against Europe united by Hitler.
    There will be no development until billions of capital flows abroad, strengthening the economy of potential opponents ... sad stop
    1. Humans war
      Humans war 8 March 2018 07: 31
      +2
      Yeah ... I agree with you.
    2. Rurikovich
      Rurikovich 8 March 2018 08: 32
      +7
      Quote: moskowit
      There will be no development until billions of capital flows abroad, strengthening the economies of potential adversaries ..

      Duc democracy w what
      Quote: moskowit
      Need Ideology and Program

      This is not enough - you need a PERSONALITY in power with faith in what he is doing and the fulfillment of what is needed without regard to what is in the way.
      hi
      1. Victor N
        Victor N 8 March 2018 11: 39
        +3
        Why call?
        Do it!
        Those who are in the taiga need little advice from the couch. I believe that ideology is not in their hurry either.
    3. Victor N
      Victor N 8 March 2018 11: 33
      +1
      Do you need an ideology? - Write.
      Want to build a dam from the flow of billions? - Build.
      1. Greenwood
        Greenwood 8 March 2018 11: 54
        +8
        Quote: Victor N
        Do you need an ideology? - Write.
        Want to build a dam from the flow of billions? - Build.
        These are the tasks of those in power. Not ordinary citizens. Stop fantasizing.
    4. Winnie76
      Winnie76 8 March 2018 11: 48
      0
      Quote: moskowit
      The author writes very correctly. Everything that was mastered and built by the people during industrialization is killed and forgotten. Need an Ideology and Program.

      The author contradicts himself. If such crazy resources are needed for land development - why do these undeveloped lands to the potential aggressor? Reset your budget?
      1. zoolu350
        zoolu350 12 March 2018 03: 33
        +1
        The potential aggressor has in bulk funds, so he can invest them in the resources he needs and will not reset anything, but will only solve a number of other problems along the way (demographic, social, etc.).
    5. Alf
      Alf 8 March 2018 14: 45
      +4
      Quote: moskowit
      potential opponents ...

      These are not “potential opponents,” they are “overseas partners.” How dare you question the words of the Guarantor? laughing
      1. moskowit
        moskowit 8 March 2018 20: 12
        0
        Garant received his upbringing in the "secret police", so he will never "blur" too much anywhere ... And if our eastern border along the Amur and Ussuri is unshakable, then the western border passes along the Dnieper and the Volga Military District became border (during the USSR the most unpromising for the officer district, "hole")
        1. Alf
          Alf 9 March 2018 15: 27
          +4
          Quote: moskowit
          unshakable

          Oh oh Who unfastened the land to China? Who cut off the Viking oil shelf? Who agreed with the Japanese to share the islands?
          Quote: moskowit
          the western one is already passing along the Dnieper

          And whose policies led to this?
          Quote: moskowit
          never and no where "will not blur" ..

          Yes, and useful too, sitting and telling tales according to the zombie man, how soon we will live not only well, but even better, but for now, be patient.
        2. zoolu350
          zoolu350 12 March 2018 03: 37
          0
          Unshakable? Yeah, schaz. There were Tarabarova and Bolshoi Ussuriysky islands on the Amur River as part of the RSFSR, and now there are no Tarabarov islands and part of Greater Ussuriysky as part of the Russian Federation.
          1. Sergej1972
            Sergej1972 12 March 2018 12: 36
            +1
            These two islands until 1929 were part of the Republic of China (de jure, in practice in China there were several "militaristic" regimes). They were taken "under guard" during the Soviet-Chinese conflict of 1929. Prior to this, neither the Russian Empire nor the RSFSR (USSR) were included.
            1. zoolu350
              zoolu350 12 March 2018 16: 13
              0
              An interesting excuse, as far as I know according to the Beijing Treaty, the border passed near the Chinese riverbank.
              1. Sergej1972
                Sergej1972 12 March 2018 16: 25
                0
                This is not an excuse, but a historical fact. These islands were indeed considered Chinese. I know about this provision of the Beijing Treaty. You must admit that it was derogatory for the Chinese side.
            2. zoolu350
              zoolu350 12 March 2018 16: 44
              0
              Before the lantern, which Chinese Republic were they part of. In the agreement with China from 14.02.1950. these territories did not enter as transferred to the PRC and, therefore, belonged to the USSR (RSFSR), Soviet border outposts stood on them. As I understand it, another supporter of the oligarchy of the Russian Federation?
    6. Prospero
      Prospero 8 March 2018 22: 41
      +3
      So you rightly said, the country has survived thanks to Stalin's politics, but now how?
  5. vlad007
    vlad007 8 March 2018 07: 29
    +7
    The Stolypin reform consisted of three parts:
    1. Agrarian reform
    2. Judicial Reform
    3. Local Government Reform in the Western Provinces
    The reason for the agrarian reform was NOT Migration, but the communal nature of land ownership - all members of the community were bound by mutual responsibility. That is, the community was collectively responsible for paying all types of taxes by all its members. Stolypin’s reform provided the peasant with the opportunity to EXIT the community!
  6. moskowit
    moskowit 8 March 2018 07: 39
    +18
    turn on any talk show, with the possible exception of broadcasts about poor parents and unbearable living conditions, and what will you see? And you will see ...

    And you will see the blissful Malakhov, dancing “on the bones”, people who have just left for another world, squelching “unfortunate” fake “stars”, telling those idiots who are watching this, about their hard life and getting a piece of bread in tears and sweat. and about Vitalin, who was lying about Dzhigaharnyan, who in the ninth ten imagines himself to be a "giant" ... laughing laughing what what
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 8 March 2018 10: 45
      +5
      Quote: moskowit
      about Vitalin, who had fooled Dzhigaharnyan, who, in the ninth decade, imagines himself a "giant"
      Hmm, this is interesting ... repeat
  7. Snail N9
    Snail N9 8 March 2018 08: 29
    +5
    Capital "settles" only where it is profitable, where it is possible to "cut down" the dough. This is why capital stretches to the populated part of Russia, where it is in demand in different places. And what should he do in the wilderness? Sawing the forest, you don’t have to live constantly; you’ve brought in the Gaster seasonally and that’s all. Fossils picking? -The shift method rules. The author cares about some “privileges” there for “Siberians” and other “Far Easterners”, but why? So far, keeping the population there is economically disadvantageous; there is no necessary "economic base", that is, that which would not just pay for the population there and its influx, but would also bring profit for further development. When there is a problem with overpopulation in Russia and ecology in the European part is completely ruined, then they will start thinking about Siberia and the Far East, but only then, not earlier.
    1. domokl
      8 March 2018 09: 02
      +8
      This position is good in countries like yours (by flag). Only you forget that Siberia and the Far East are not only the lungs of the Earth, but also a huge pantry. So huge that many people glance at it. Even because of the big puddle bully Really did not hear opinions that belonging of Siberia to Russia alone is unfair?
      In addition to the economy, there is also the issue of the region’s defense potential.
      1. Snail N9
        Snail N9 8 March 2018 09: 27
        +4
        There is a concept of “economic feasibility” (described above), that is, there must be profit — “extra” money that can be invested both in development and in “attracting” capital, and besides, people are usually drawn to where you can earn. In Siberia, this has not yet been observed. Everything is laid on, it is necessary to start practically everywhere, from scratch — that is, to spend money and spend money. And if there is no quick "profit" for which you can develop and build, then you have to spend money at a loss counting "in the future", .. Russia does not have so much "extra" money, and therefore you have to choose: or spend money on urgent needs, or for a “perspective”. The minerals that are explored there require huge costs for extraction, transportation, primary processing and are not yet in demand. Their time will come, but not now.
        1. cats
          cats 10 March 2018 18: 39
          +5
          Quote: Snail N9
          Their time will come, but not now.

          It wouldn’t come longer ..
          Why are we here like you, prudent? ..
          Tell me, what is “economic feasibility” from you personally?
    2. ventel
      ventel 8 March 2018 13: 08
      +7
      Sorry to intervene but for the time being you will think the Chinese will populate it.
      1. cats
        cats 11 March 2018 10: 59
        +2
        Have you ever seen a live Chinese?
        1. ventel
          ventel 11 March 2018 12: 34
          +1
          Yes I saw . Or are you implying that the Chinese are afraid of Siberian frosts so this is complete nonsense.
          1. KaPToC
            KaPToC 11 March 2018 14: 14
            0
            Quote: ventel
            Yes I saw . Or are you implying that the Chinese are afraid of Siberian frosts so this is complete nonsense.

            Nevertheless, according to the official history, the Chinay people had five thousand years to master Siberia, and as a result, they even managed to gain a foothold in Manchuria only with the help of the Russians.
            1. zoolu350
              zoolu350 12 March 2018 03: 52
              +1
              Those were the times of antiquity and feudalism, when agriculture ruled and no coal, uranium, oil, or gas in industrial quantities were needed. Fortunately, the Chinese mainly eat rice, and rice does not grow in the floodplain of the Amur River, so for the Chinese here, Low cha is a hungry land. They came here to finish off some of their next conquerors such as the Huns, Mongols, Khitan, or Jurchen. And in the 17th century. the emperors of the Qing dynasty did not understand what kind of hell these barbarians from the West were pushing to the Kheilujiang region, but just in case they showed their strength (see Nerchinsky Treaty).
              Now, for us, the situation is VERY bleak.
              1. KaPToC
                KaPToC 12 March 2018 08: 52
                0
                Quote: zoolu350
                Those were the times of antiquity and feudalism, when agriculture ruled and no coal, uranium, oil, or gas in industrial quantities were needed.

                Without agriculture, and nowhere, regardless of oil, gas, coal, etc., etc.
                Quote: zoolu350
                And in the 17th century. the emperors of the Qing dynasty didn’t understand what kind of hell these barbarians from the West are driving to the Heilujiang region, but just in case they showed their strength to them

                To achieve a draw with a ratio of one to one hundred - is it your strength?
                1. zoolu350
                  zoolu350 12 March 2018 09: 12
                  +1
                  I say it again. In the 17th century territory north of the river. Cupid was the Qing dynasty "before the lantern" and they easily gave it to the Romanovs, but before that there was a demonstration of power (Albazin seat).
                  1. KaPToC
                    KaPToC 12 March 2018 13: 11
                    0
                    Quote: zoolu350
                    I say it again. In the 17th century territory north of the river. Cupid was the Qing dynasty "before the lantern" and they easily gave it to the Romanovs, but before that there was a demonstration of power (Albazin seat).

                    Learn to study and learn.
                    1. zoolu350
                      zoolu350 12 March 2018 16: 14
                      0
                      Learn who's stopping you?
                      1. KaPToC
                        KaPToC 12 March 2018 21: 01
                        0
                        Quote: zoolu350
                        Learn who's stopping you?

                        Nobody is bothering me ... what about you?
              2. Sergej1972
                Sergej1972 12 March 2018 12: 38
                +1
                A little off topic, but for a significant part of the Chinese, rice is not the main food. Or, let’s say, this is one of the components of nutrition, but by no means the only one.
  8. German Titov
    German Titov 8 March 2018 09: 23
    +3
    I liked the Far East, and the people there are sincere. But in 1987 he was drawn to his homeland. Under the Union, many remained there from the Komsomol-youth construction projects. Of our 500 people, 15-20 percent.
    1. seos
      seos 8 March 2018 09: 41
      +8
      It was before ... now the population is embittered and does not trust anyone ... they live by the principle of man-to-man wolf.
  9. seos
    seos 8 March 2018 09: 39
    +14
    All right!
    In the Far Eastern hectare, it’s clear that the idea of ​​linden ... first of all, this hectare is needed only for officials to be able to pick up forests and turn them into a swamp, destroying the last wealth of the Far East ... these lands are no longer suitable for anything .. .
    On the development of Far East ... The Duma Deloputes here came up with a law and organized the "Fund for the Development of the Corruption of the Far East" - this initiative was invented by Thieves for Thieves ... everyone understood that this money would be stolen like all similar investments in Far East (economic zones, etc.)
    You can make from the Far East a region with normal living conditions .... but nerds from the State Duma (deputies, as you know, are on average 2 times smarter than an ordinary person) for a place to ask residents what they need to come up with some crazy projects.
  10. Anyone
    Anyone 8 March 2018 09: 40
    +22
    The author is mostly right. But the north is still worse than the east. Beyond the Urals - stagnation, depopulation and decline. And in Murmansk, Arkhangelsk, Komi, NAO, Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug - virtually all villages have already disappeared. Together with the population. The thousand-kilometer coast of the Barents and White Seas from Naryan-Mar to Arkhangelsk has actually died out: residential villages can be counted on the finger of a hand. And in half of these villages, 10 houses were left with the elderly. The coast of the Kola Peninsula has already safely died out, left or resettled in connection with the official exercise of settlements.
    Frankly, there are no ways out of this situation today. People will leave their places of residence in the north and partly in the east of Russia and will move to large cities in these areas. In turn, part of the population of these large cities will move to the west of the country - to Moscow, St. Petersburg and so on. And ultimately, the population will concentrate in several dozen large and medium-sized agglomerations, where there are living conditions, transport accessibility, a developed labor market, and so on. Small settlements (villages, villages, urban settlements, transport-isolated cities, cities with stagnating city-forming enterprises, etc.) will die out like mammoths.
    The shift workers of Gazprom, Lukoil, Rosneft, Norilsk Nickel and so on will come to the place of former local residents of the north and east of Russia. They don’t need roads, schools, kindergartens, housing, water supply, sewage, airports, etc. The local population of a significant part of Siberia, the Far East, the entire Russian north, including the circumpolar and polar regions, is today, so to speak, a non-core asset, from which they try to get rid of.
    1. sxfRipper
      sxfRipper 8 March 2018 11: 48
      +7
      I myself come from Kirovsk. I know what you are writing about firsthand.
  11. arlekin
    arlekin 8 March 2018 09: 41
    +16
    Here is the price of gas in December 2017, Borzya, Trans-Baikal Territory.
    If people leave Khabarovsk, then from Transbaikalia, such a feeling, they just run away. I know some who want but cannot leave, because they can’t sell houses for at least some intelligible money.
    1. istealth
      istealth 10 March 2018 16: 27
      +1
      out of 10 my friends left eight, like me
  12. bandabas
    bandabas 8 March 2018 09: 56
    0
    All urgently moving to .....
    1. AUL
      AUL 8 March 2018 12: 47
      +10
      ...London!
  13. groks
    groks 8 March 2018 09: 57
    +6
    Within capitalism and open markets, the problem is not solved.
    The Far Eastern hectare is an analogue of a voucher.
  14. vindigo
    vindigo 8 March 2018 11: 24
    +5
    People are rushing to the Krasnodar Territory in a continuous stream. And it doesn’t stop them from being unimportant here with work. There is work, but salaries are scanty.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 9 March 2018 04: 31
      +5
      Your climate is at least good.
  15. The comment was deleted.
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        1. Alexander Ra
          Alexander Ra 9 March 2018 06: 41
          0
          Name at least one idea, a religion that has not come to us from the outside over the past 1000 years? What is the biological meaning of missionary work in Russia? I hope the word "bio" does not scare you. If you acknowledge the fact of our national catastrophe, it is impossible to avoid the question: what is the role of Christianity (or what is called Christianity), humanism, communism-socialism-liberalism-democracy in the current situation? You don’t see anything dangerous in “All people are brothers,” “State for people,” “Living well, but living well is better,” “I want everything, here and now,” .. And the desire to live your own way of life, according to the rules created by ourselves and for yourself. Do not be manure for cultivation. Self-sufficiency of the state and self-sufficiency of citizens, authorship. The source of wealth is labor, but not parasitism and predation. The property of the Russian breed of bees is hardworking and evil.
          1. Alexander Ra
            Alexander Ra 9 March 2018 06: 56
            0
            Authorship is not my fault, it does not print correctly.
    2. The comment was deleted.
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            1. Anyone
              Anyone 8 March 2018 19: 15
              0
              Quote: Oper
              It was sarcasm on my part ...

              It’s strange. For in the message in question, you wrote:
              ... sincerely and without sarcasm, please offer an alternative

              Are you a little confused about your posts? Forgot where sincerely, and where with sarcasm wrote? Not scary. It happens ))
              1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Alexander Ra
          Alexander Ra 9 March 2018 07: 16
          0
          Previously, it was believed that the leader of a flock of birds can be an individual with special leadership qualities. Today, biologists know that in the absence of a leader, a young bird can take its place, not even flying the desired route. Human populations live according to the same laws as birds, worms, etc. .. But do not know - "A village does not live without a righteous one"? Putin certainly has vast experience in administration. It is also true that today, conceptually, Russia lives according to the Western attitudes.
          1. The comment was deleted.
  16. sxfRipper
    sxfRipper 8 March 2018 11: 53
    +8
    To restore a hectare of land to the possibility of using it for agricultural purposes will cost 300-400 thousand rubles. Wow free hectare is obtained. And you won’t scout cows on a hectare ...
    One is possible. A goat. And the idea of ​​a hectare for agricultural production is actually the idea of ​​returning to subsistence farming and direct exchange of goods for goods. A bag of potatoes on a bucket of peas. Or a bucket of milk per liter of moonshine. But no money needed! And someone will order another toilet made of gold.
  17. Victor N
    Victor N 8 March 2018 12: 01
    +3
    Why did the author write this article? There are no own offers at all. Commentators, too.
    Well scolded the "Far Eastern hectare" - why? It is clear that the masses will not rush there - even if some try.
    The most constructive proposal that came to mind was to relocate the advocates of ideology, let them return Grudinin’s money from Switzerland and settle down. And how to finish settling in - then let the programs draw.
    1. Provocator
      Provocator 8 March 2018 16: 27
      +10
      The author does not hold the post of Minister of Economy to give suggestions and deputy of the State Duma to come up with a legislative initiative ....
      In the far east east of the earth there are probably so many that 100 hectares can be distributed.
      But under the current regime, the people are poor and are not able to process even 10 hectares. There is no help from the authorities and will not be.
      Power needs a different one. Which I don’t care. The main threat to the country seems to come from .... What name guess yourself.
      1. Golovan Jack
        Golovan Jack 8 March 2018 16: 29
        +5
        Quote: Provocateur
        What name guess yourself

        (lazily): Darth Vader, probably ...
        (even lazier): "Agitators" are sick of it negative
        1. Provocator
          Provocator 8 March 2018 16: 32
          +1
          Darth Vader, probably ... not exactly! was more talented and his words did not differ with deeds.
          no agitation boring laughing
          notations are tedious am
          1. Golovan Jack
            Golovan Jack 8 March 2018 16: 34
            +5
            Quote: Provocateur
            ... no for sure! was more talented and his words did not differ with deeds

      2. KaPToC
        KaPToC 8 March 2018 22: 32
        +4
        Quote: Provocateur
        In the far east east of the earth there are probably so many that 100 hectares can be distributed.

        In the extreme south, the whole continent is empty, try to grow wheat there.
    2. domokl
      8 March 2018 17: 09
      +2
      That's what I love our people for, so for the ability or desire to choose ...
      Why the hell to think? You tell me how beautiful I will live under your power and enough ... It seems like we are holding a tender .. They offer, and we choose ..
      Or maybe we’ll turn on the thought?
    3. Anyone
      Anyone 8 March 2018 17: 51
      +16
      And why only money from Grudinin from Switzerland need to be returned? Start with the apparatus of the president, the State Duma, the Federation Council, the government, the ministries ... Our statesmen can get more money than the rogue Grudinin. If you return the money of some deputies from foreign accounts, then you can feed them all of Siberia a hundred years with one black caviar.
      1. The comment was deleted.
  18. Anyone
    Anyone 8 March 2018 12: 57
    +8
    sxfRipper, Of course you know then. Right next to you, in Lovozero and Revda, to be frank, complete desolation. Well, in Revda there is a city-forming enterprise - a loparite mine. And in Lovozero only a lake. Whoever got involved in taking fishermen from Semerochka to fishing - at least they live. The rest I don’t know what they are doing if they don’t have their deer. Although I’m not from Kola, I know these places no worse than local ones - I walked from Lovozero to the mouth of Kharlovka and further along the coast to Dalnye Zelentsov. There are no people at all: Polmos - non-residential for a long time, Polmos-Koral - there are still reindeer herders, Kharlovka - only the salmon fishing base for the steep (60 thousand a day), the coast - there are no people to Zelentsov. Zelentsy are officially evicted and do not have the status of a settlement. In the other direction - in the direction of ZATO Ostrovnoy - there is also nothing residential. Gremikha herself looks like the scenery for the film about the apocalypse. Further, the whole Terek coast - three or four half-dead villages. In Sosnovka, if I remember correctly, about 10 people live. There is even less in Kanevka ... There are only tenants (as much as 49 years old!) Of rivers that carry bourgeois on turntables to catch salmon and devour vodka. And once it was a prosperous land of Pomors ...
  19. KERMET
    KERMET 8 March 2018 14: 33
    +3
    Quote: Olgovich

    FIVE times, not ten, and that's for .... 74 years!
    Those. five times 22 years in Russia and five times for .... 74 years under the "people's" power!
    The difference is no, yes. lol ..

    Yeah, roughly 1,6 million arrived during the years of Nicholas, and 29 million under the USSR from 89 to 6,3.
  20. bsk_una
    bsk_una 8 March 2018 16: 07
    +9
    Such wealth is Siberia! But there is no happiness! Taxes are paid at the place of registration of the corporation, and not at the location and functioning of enterprises. All the riches flow now over the hill, then to Moscow ... "They’re sitting on the oil needle. Now Sobyanin has become an intelligible nature for me. In general, all income from the territory should be fully in the territory where the enterprises are located and where people work, then Sobyanin will sit down on his brushes: he will give up building a new Moscow, which, as a vacuum cleaner, absorbs the population of Russia, Then the desire to demolish obsolete houses in Moscow, expand the metro, etc. will end. Then it will start to peer behind the Garden Ring, find out how Russians live behind the rings, and in the outback they’ll live a little better, you look and Moscow will scatter around the country.
    1. KaPToC
      KaPToC 8 March 2018 22: 37
      +1
      Quote: bsk_una
      In general, all revenues from the territory should be in full in the territory, where enterprises are located and where people work

      Why on earth? Will you shout again - “stop feeding Moscow”? But is there enough strength without Washington to beat Washington off? That Ukraine did not have enough.
      1. Golovan Jack
        Golovan Jack 8 March 2018 23: 01
        +5
        Quote: KaPToC
        Will you shout again - “stop feeding Moscow”?

        Will definitely be. Yes, what will be there - they are already shouting. But - like those crocodiles - "low-low" laughing
        And think about security, for example, external, and internal - and why? Select and share, "and paned" ...
        Familiar to the pain, and an example before my eyes, but not good request
      2. ltc35
        ltc35 9 March 2018 18: 02
        +2
        Soon everyone will gather there. And Moscow will be its rings off Washington. And to Siberia blacks from Africa to send on a watch.
  21. sib.ataman
    sib.ataman 8 March 2018 16: 28
    +5
    So that's all it is, but just an example with the Stolypin reform is not entirely successful. That number of immigrants greatly decreased after the 3st MV, the civil war, the 2nd MV. No sooner had the settlers turned around and mastered new lands plainly, little time had passed! But in Stalin's time, yes! In two streams! The first is for the construction of the century, the second for the development of the Gulag. And in this policy, a deep meaning was laid down - to clear the European territory of the criminal and opposition element, and at the same time, to master the undeveloped (many were left after serving in the settlements under the close supervision of the NKVD), by the way for the modern RF this is a very interesting option! The second stream of volunteers is also an interesting option for the Russian Federation. It is time to restore the distribution of work, after vocational training. Any free elections near the mother’s skirt for us today is the criminal intent of the “Danes”! All trade is crammed with these young professionals! And why did the government spend such an amount of our money on their training ?! In the USSR, they spent 3-month courses on and off the counter! Well, and without a return to state planning in the national, I emphasize, national economy, because no volunteers, merchants, comrades and other altruists will ever raise, revive or conquer XNUMX/XNUMX of their native country! Without a return to socialism (and what it should be, this is a creative question!) In our time, this extremely important question is simply unsolvable !!! Only the whole world, as on a subbootnik !!!
    And one more small clarification! MV Lomonosov somewhat broader implied the power of Russia! Not only economic (at that time he didn’t know about minerals at that time, and the factories of Demidov, even under very strong drinking, could not seem like the industrial power of the empire; although, M.V. could have completely assumed this for the future). And here is the geostrategic position (!), With access to two oceans, a direct route from Asia and America to Europe (for which today, by the way, the GDP has grabbed onto it!), And the colossal theater of the VD, on which no one can dance, but but it gives us such an enormous reserve of operational space during defense (which already actually proved at least two world wars, the first was with Napoleon) that our sworn partners have not been able to decide on large-scale nuclear aggression for 60 years, and even our best eastern the partner understands this better than ourselves, with all its economic potential and human resources! And it’s the highest concentration of fresh water, forests, fertile land on Earth, but I’m completely silent about fossils! So, our brilliant coryphaeus of science knew what he was talking about!
    1. Alf
      Alf 9 March 2018 21: 28
      +4
      Quote: sib.ataman
      to clear the European territory of the criminal and opposition element, and at the same time, to master the undeveloped (many were left after serving in the settlements under the strict supervision of the NKVD), by the way for the modern Russian Federation this is a very interesting option!

      Nothing interesting. In this case, the entire population of the Kremlin, Rublevka, Novorizhka, will have to be resettled there, but forcibly.
  22. naidas
    naidas 8 March 2018 17: 09
    +5
    Almost 30 years since the Soviet Union’s death, the result is that besides two capitals, many regions are abandoned and are dying, even neighboring to our capitals.
    1. cats
      cats 10 March 2018 18: 24
      +2
      It was just those who fled who spoke at the talk show, who lacked brilliant shorts ..
      And thank God...
  23. pioneer example to all guys
    pioneer example to all guys 8 March 2018 19: 04
    +8
    The capital of Russia should be beyond the Urals. In Siberia. For example, in Novosibirsk. This will be an incentive for the development of both industry and agriculture in these regions and the Far East.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 10 March 2018 10: 17
      +3
      Quote: Pioneer is an example for all the guys.
      For example, in Novosibirsk.
      Do not need Novosibirsk. We need a really small city, either built from scratch, or based on some thread of the satellite city. And better in the Krasnoyarsk Territory, the geographical center of Russia.
      1. KaPToC
        KaPToC 10 March 2018 23: 27
        0
        Quote: Greenwood
        And better in the Krasnoyarsk Territory, the geographical center of Russia.

        Unless Nizhny Novgorod, there are no other candidates for the political capital. I would like to draw your attention to many countries, although they are removing the capital from the economic center of the country, not far away, no Krasnoyarsk will, in principle, be the capital of Russia.
      2. zoolu350
        zoolu350 12 March 2018 04: 06
        +2
        You're not right. Novosibirsk is ideally suited for the capital of the new Soviet Socialist Eurasian Empire, both in geographical, military, political, economic and other plans.
        1. KaPToC
          KaPToC 12 March 2018 08: 54
          0
          Quote: zoolu350
          You're not right. Novosibirsk is ideally suited for the capital of the new Soviet Socialist Eurasian Empire, both in geographical, military, political, economic and other plans.

          Moscow - the center of the transport system of Eastern Europe, Volgograd - is located at the intersection of transport routes, and Novosibirsk is just a city
          1. zoolu350
            zoolu350 12 March 2018 09: 14
            0
            We are now talking for the Far East, how to raise and equip it. And we are sending Europe to ...
            1. KaPToC
              KaPToC 12 March 2018 13: 13
              0
              Quote: zoolu350
              We are now talking for the Far East, how to raise and equip it. And we are sending Europe to ...

              Transferring the capital to the Far East is not a way to raise it, except where is the Far East and where is Novosibirsk!
              1. zoolu350
                zoolu350 12 March 2018 16: 16
                0
                The Far East is MUCH closer to Novosibirsk than to Moscow.
                1. KaPToC
                  KaPToC 12 March 2018 21: 02
                  0
                  Quote: zoolu350
                  The Far East is MUCH closer to Novosibirsk than to Moscow

                  Tokyo is much closer, and to Beijing.
                  1. zoolu350
                    zoolu350 14 March 2018 04: 49
                    0
                    That is, let the capitals of the Russian Far East be in Tokyo and Beijing? Well, the oligarchy of the Russian Federation fulfills your wish at an accelerated pace.
                    1. KaPToC
                      KaPToC 14 March 2018 20: 27
                      0
                      Quote: zoolu350
                      That is, let the capitals of the Russian Far East be in Tokyo and Beijing? Well, the oligarchy of the Russian Federation fulfills your wish at an accelerated pace.

                      It’s you who chose such an idiotic criterion to justify the transfer of the capital - the distance to the Far East.
  24. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  25. Antonio_Mariarti
    Antonio_Mariarti 8 March 2018 19: 28
    +4
    But nothing, what exactly in Siberia is growing natural population growth? Even the Far East is already starting. So, about extinction and other Heresy, do not tell me the Siberian. And yes, no one wants to go here, the conditions are difficult, especially the climate, so almost all migrants who travel to Russia are in St. Petersburg and Moscow. And yes, many cities in Siberia look better, the same from the Center. Kemerovo, Novosib, Tomsk, Krasnoyarsk ... with the Far East: Vladik, Khabarovsk.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 9 March 2018 04: 46
      +12
      Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
      Even the Far East is already starting.
      That's where, shy to ask? So many friends I have already left for St. Petersburg this year that there aren’t enough fingers on my hands.
      Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
      nobody wants to go here
      That’s why in Vlad the whole sphere of services and trade are already under the Caucasus. You will not see a single Slavic person in the market. There are far fewer Chinese and Koreans in the city than "friends from sunny republics."
      Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
      Krasnoyarsk
      A friend recently arrived from Krasnoyarsk, says that compared to him, Moscow has air like in a village. Continuous smog.
      Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
      Vladik
      Here it is not necessary about Vlad. As was the garbage dump for the past 20 years, so she stayed. Roads are in ruins, pits are everywhere, snow is not cleared, ice is on the sidewalks, only legs are broken. There is nothing to breathe, the city is buried in smog. Everyday traffic jams (which you won’t pass by going down the subway like in Moscow). Trolleybuses, trams in the city are almost completely eliminated. Road markings? No, have not heard. Half of the buildings in the city are, a lot of long-term construction. Rallies of deceived equity holders are constantly held. Recreation areas are mostly in poor condition, one of the largest parks in the city - the park of Minnoy Gorodok is in a state of neglect, at night it is better not to appear there.
      And yes, life in a city is in full swing, I agree. And the population is slowly increasing. Due to moving from the provincial cities of Primorsky Krai (where it’s very tight with work) and a huge flow of migrants from Uzbekistan, Tajikistan and the Caucasian regions of Russia. Only the city did not get better from this. It has become a big cesspool, there is no city comfortable for life.
    2. emwave
      emwave 10 March 2018 10: 55
      0
      You can agree. But a lot of envy from local authorities.
  26. trahterist
    trahterist 8 March 2018 19: 48
    +5
    'Nothing personal, just business' ...
    Or can this very "business" tighten the nuts, but a bit of oxygen to cover up?
    But the fist is not a business executive, and his tongue is not hardworking, but a huckster.
    For this, their Bolsheviks quite rightly transplanted, and the most "enterprising" -fired.
    And this is what is surprising, Russia did not suffer any loss from the loss of this layer (scale) of society.
    1. shuravi
      shuravi 8 March 2018 20: 48
      +4
      Quote: trahterist
      'Nothing personal, just business' ...
      Or can this very "business" tighten the nuts, but a bit of oxygen to cover up?
      But the fist is not a business executive, and his tongue is not hardworking, but a huckster.
      For this, their Bolsheviks quite rightly transplanted, and the most "enterprising" -fired.
      And this is what is surprising, Russia did not suffer any loss from the loss of this layer (scale) of society.


      Exactly. Recall the same literary hero Ilf and Petrov - Koreiko. After all, he did not create this image from scratch.
  27. tank66
    tank66 8 March 2018 21: 06
    +6
    The Japs already had real historical experience in developing Karafutu / Sakhalin /, the southern half of it that we chopped off after the 1905 war. I can lie in the details, but the point was that a hectare of 10 per family was allocated. at the expense of the treasury + about 50000 / for current money / dollars an interest-free loan for 20 years + tax breaks + the ability to "order" elite cattle .. About 20000 families moved. First, they cut down the forest mercilessly, but sawmills and dirt roads appeared. salmon were boiled for fat / fertilizers / for the mother country, but there was a coastal fleet and fishing cooperatives. Already after 10 years, butter in Japan was the cheapest in the world. After 15 from Sakhalin, seafood such as crab sausages with seaweed, chum salmon with caviar and 50 more species, in short, such products that no one even produces now. Moreover, they caught fish species that they didn’t even try to catch in Soviet times, due to the greater availability of other species. I’ll say that I don’t like yellow-faced women, but I don’t think it’s shameful to look at their experience.
    There’s a little fiction. There is such a fish on Sakhalin — rudd — they are local and don’t consider it to be fish, they bite it both in winter and summer. They will start purchasing it from the population at 10 rubles per kg. There, they will start wearing megatons and pioneers. regardless of pink salmon. And the fish is delicious - the type of podust or large dace. Mince with pork twist bacon and know pack sausage gut in cans. And barges along the Northern Sea Route. And frozen carcasses of rabbits, * fuck, there are 2 square meters of burdock. meters - even people can eat them ...
    I am afraid, of course, - there is no money, the treasure is more important to us.
    1. Nehist
      Nehist 9 March 2018 03: 18
      +3
      I hasten to upset you !!! Thanks to the foresight of "our authorities" which the RUZ set where not far from Sakhalin even the rudd is in short supply! Well, the fact that salmon in Moscow is cheaper than where it is caught and I won’t say ....
  28. kytx
    kytx 8 March 2018 22: 30
    +2
    Quote: Boris55
    Quote: Olgovich
    The neighbors grew at times.

    Because neighbors came to us to destroy us as a biological species on earth, and we came to them to calm them.
    Quote: Olgovich
    in just 22 years of Nikolai’s reign, the population of the Far East grew FIVE times

    And under Stalin (not counting the camps) - how many times? Do not remember what great construction sites were at that time and how many people worked for them? And during WWII how many factories were evacuated there? So your king is quietly resting on the sidelines.
    Quote: Olgovich
    Where to get today the previously barbarously overspended human resources is unclear ..

    Where to get, where to get ... From 10 pm to 6 am all over Russia, turn off the lights and the problem will resolve itself. Yes, and leave only two TV channels: about animals and about nature. And I completely forgot - the Internet is the same for the night to cut down.

    Well, the Internet at night to turn it off finally fascism
  29. seacap
    seacap 8 March 2018 23: 52
    +10
    With all due respect to our first-patron as the capital of our country, it still seems to me that such a re-centralization and concentration of everything, human, material and administrative resources in 1 megalopolis is a threat to the integrity and further development of our country. It is not clear why the Eastern Cosmodrome is so they began to build far away, and not on one of the squares. This monster has already turned into a metropolis, sucking out all human and financial resources from the rest of the territory behind the ring, the colony. This is another country, with its subculture, its values ​​and interests, fundamentally excellent from the rest of the territory, little spiritually and mentally connected, whose standard of living differs by an order of magnitude from even their own region, which is generally nonsense. There can be no standard of living in one country, accessibility and quality of life, people's incomes differ by an order. Therefore, they go all young people study and earn money wherever possible — to the metropolis from colonial territories, as from Africa to Europe. Therefore, the whole The question of the continued existence and integrity of territories that the authorities have almost no control over and other laws and other authorities where thousands of Red Book animals are cut out, relict cedar forests and taiga are cut down. And life in the capital beyond the ring is not interesting, and it’s not needed, while the vacuum cleaner is working, it’s running out of its own, there is Asia and the Caucasus. For us and tv, the news doesn’t go deeper than the ring and overseas white houses, in the best case, 2-3 sentences between 10 minutes for the whole country. advertising from bloating. Therefore, it seems to me that the main threat to the existence and integrity of the country comes from the capital, which depletes the regions and loses control over them.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 9 March 2018 04: 52
      +8
      It’s enough to look at any other major country in the world. Everywhere, the capital is a small, unremarkable city with purely administrative functions, which is lost against the backdrop of large PR cities that accumulate the country's cultural, business and financial life. This can be said about the United States, and about Canada, and about Australia, and about Brazil, and even about China (Beijing is a major city - but against the backdrop of Shanghai, Hong Kong or Gongzhou is simply lost).
      1. KaPToC
        KaPToC 9 March 2018 21: 40
        +2
        Quote: Greenwood
        Everywhere, the capital is a small, unremarkable city with purely administrative functions, which is lost against the backdrop of large PR cities that accumulate the country's cultural, business and financial life.

        Moscow, Tokyo, Paris, London, Mexico City - so everywhere, and not as you say. In most countries, the political and economic capital is one city.
        1. Greenwood
          Greenwood 10 March 2018 10: 29
          +8
          Quote: KaPToC
          Moscow, Tokyo, Paris, London, Mexico City
          Now let's compare the sizes of Russia with the sizes of Japan, France, Great Britain and Mexico. All of these countries are small against the backdrop of Russia. They justify the presence of one or two large cities that accumulate resources, they are easily accessible from any part of the country, and even in Japan, the difference in infrastructure between the outskirts of Tokyo or a thread in a provincial city like Morioka (prefect Ivate) is very small. You take large states. The same USA. There is a small 700th Washington, to which there is nothing besides a bunch of administrative buildings. And there is a big congested New York, the business capital of the country. But there is also populated by Hollywood and show business Los Angeles, the cultural capital. There is a tourist Florida. There are industrial Chicago, Atlanta, Philadelphia. And also San Francisco and Seattle, where conferences of developers and computer engineers from around the world are held. Those. In the United States, many cities attractive for living are scattered almost evenly throughout the country. Even in Alaska, Anchorage easily gives Russian cities to the Far East in terms of road quality and infrastructure level. But there are also small towns, sleepy kingdoms, where people live in their two-story houses who do not like vanity. And the offices of large companies in the United States are not concentrated in one city, but are often located in such small little-known towns.
          And in Russia there is one overdeveloped and crowded with money and people Moscow (and a little Peter), located near the western border. There is a relatively populated European part of Russia, where there is already a significant lag behind Moscow both in the quality of life and in the level of infrastructure, and there is Siberia and the Far East, where people are coming from, and where life is warm only in a few large cities.
          Quote: KaPToC
          In most countries, the political and economic capital is one city.
          As I understand it, you are from Moscow. Moscow snobbery and swagger are directly felt.
          1. KaPToC
            KaPToC 10 March 2018 23: 17
            0
            Quote: Greenwood
            Now let's compare the sizes of Russia with the sizes of Japan, France, Great Britain and Mexico.

            What does the size have to do with it? Compare the French colonial empire, or the British Commonwealth. Each nation lives and builds its state within its natural-climatic zone, it is not our fault that their land area is so small.
            Quote: Greenwood
            You take large states. The same USA. There is a small 700th Washington, to which there is nothing besides a bunch of administrative buildings. And there is a big congested New York, the business capital of the country.

            The United States does not have a natural center; the gulf and sausages are not childish. As soon as the world financial elites leave them, this state will fall apart.
            Quote: Greenwood
            Those. In the United States, many cities attractive for living are scattered almost evenly throughout the country.

            The states have a more favorable climate than in Russia, much more, therefore, people are distributed more evenly. In order not to be unfounded - go to Taimyr, live there for a year, you will immediately understand how wrong you are.
            Quote: Greenwood
            There is a relatively populated European part of Russia, where there is already a significant lag behind Moscow in both the quality of life and the level of infrastructure

            In all countries, the province lives poorer, EVERYONE.
            Quote: Greenwood
            but there is Siberia and the Far East, from where people generally fell, and where life is warm only in a few large cities.

            Well, it’s hard to live in a polar climate.
            Quote: Greenwood
            As I understand it, you are from Moscow. Moscow snobbery and swagger are directly felt.

            Here it is the price of your word, you are wrong again, I have never lived in Moscow, not in St. Petersburg, but in the Moscow region I was only in military service. I live in that very province, in a settlement with a population of 14 thousand people - well, nifiga is not the capital of anything.
            1. Greenwood
              Greenwood 11 March 2018 10: 53
              +4
              Quote: KaPToC
              Compare the French colonial empire, or the British Commonwealth.
              We seem to live in the modern world, and not in the 17th century.
              Quote: KaPToC
              Each nation lives and builds its state within its natural-climatic zone

              Quote: KaPToC
              USA has no natural center
              Do I understand correctly, the natural and climatic center of Russia is the Moscow region? It’s not funny for yourself?
              Quote: KaPToC
              Look and sausages them not childishly
              It is now sausage from a stormy imagination.
              Quote: KaPToC
              As soon as the world financial elites leave them, this state will fall apart.
              Yes, yes, yes, "The Rotting West", "America will collapse soon," that’s all ... Since Soviet times, everyone has been talking about it. Already, the USSR has long been gone. And Russia is no longer a competitor to the United States. And each year 250000 Russians are served on US green cards, and not vice versa. And Russia is investing in American securities, and not vice versa. In general, some kind of kindergarten level of reasoning. How old are you?
              Quote: KaPToC
              The states have a more favorable climate than in Russia, much more, therefore, people are distributed more evenly.
              As I understand it, the most favorable climate in Russia in the Moscow region. Or in Leningrad. lol Why is the climate of Sakhalin or Primorsky, Khabarovsk territories worse?
              Quote: KaPToC
              In all countries, the province lives poorer, EVERYONE.
              In the US, a resident of Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle or Houston lives worse than Washington? Are there less wages in Canada in Montreal than in Ottawa? In Australia, Melbourne is a poor city compared to Canberra? In Beijing, the income level is greater than in Shanghai, Hong Kong and Guangzhou?
              So my answer is NO, NO, and NO again. In large developed countries, the standard of living in the capital differs little from the province. And there is no need to cite small countries as an example, in Russia the situation is different.
              Quote: KaPToC
              Well, it’s hard to live in a polar climate.
              In our Primorsky Territory, it is the most polar. Yeah. Or on Sakhalin, where there is really no frost in the winter.
              Quote: KaPToC
              in the same province, in a settlement with a population of 14 thousand people - well, nifiga is not the capital of anything.
              The reasoning of a person who compares a country the size of a continent, not with similarly sized countries of the world, but with small countries of Europe, the size of one Russian region, is very strange.
              1. KaPToC
                KaPToC 11 March 2018 14: 09
                +1
                Quote: Greenwood
                We seem to live in the modern world, and not in the 17th century.

                There is still a British community in the modern world; France still has colonies in Africa. Google "indirect forms of colonial taxation," the whole world is a US colony. Eastern Europe is a German colony, there are many examples, the era of colonialism is in full swing.
                Quote: Greenwood
                Do I understand correctly, the natural and climatic center of Russia is the Moscow region? It’s not funny for yourself?

                All the East European Plain and similar in climate, albeit colder Siberia. And leave your sarcasm for the wife.
                Quote: Greenwood
                Yes, yes, yes, Rotting West, America will collapse soon, that’s all ...

                You understand, I do not want the United States to collapse, I am not a third-party to its collapse, and I will not be happy when this happens. And yes - it will not be soon.
                Quote: Greenwood
                In the US, a resident of Los Angeles, San Francisco, Seattle or Houston lives worse than Washington?

                In all megacities, life is about the same, you don’t consider the province - Peter?
                Quote: Greenwood
                In large developed countries, the standard of living in the capital differs little from the province.

                This is a lie, I won’t even comment.
                Quote: Greenwood
                The reasoning of a person who compares a country the size of a continent, not with similarly sized countries of the world, but with small countries of Europe, the size of one Russian region, is very strange.

                Do you finally get it? Russia is a big country and comparing it with someone as a whole is insanity. And to hope that everywhere in Russia life will be the same is arrogant.
                1. Greenwood
                  Greenwood 11 March 2018 16: 59
                  +7
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  France still has colonies in Africa. Google "indirect forms of colonial taxation," the whole world is a US colony. Eastern Europe is a German colony, there are many examples, the era of colonialism is in full swing.
                  It smacks of the sensations of the Ren-TV channel. Then, include Russia in this list. Colony of the USA, Fed, etc. etc.
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  The entire East European Plain and similar in climate, albeit colder Siberia.
                  Ok, at least Siberia was added. Fine. And even here the population is distributed extremely unevenly, and the unevenness continues to increase in favor of the Moscow region.
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  And leave your sarcasm for the wife.
                  Since when did we become a "you"?
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  You understand, I do not want the United States to collapse, I am not a third-party to its collapse, and I will not be happy when this happens. And yes - it will not be soon.
                  Then I do not understand why to write about it. It is necessary to deal with their problems, not to bury the United States.
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  In all cities, life is about the same.
                  But according to your logic from the post above, it is lower than the capital. And yes, in the USA, as I already said, many large companies set up offices in small sleeping towns, so regarding the thesis about a better life in megacities, too, is not "not so simple."
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  you don’t think the province is Peter?
                  In St. Petersburg, salaries are already much lower than in Moscow. And then, what is the province and what is not ?! Novosibirsk, Yekaterinburg, Omsk, Krasnoyarsk, Khabarovsk, Vladivostok - a province?
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  This is a lie, I won’t even comment.
                  Once again I ask, what is the province for you?
                  Quote: KaPToC
                  Russia is a big country and comparing it with someone as a whole is insanity.
                  Insanity is to have one city in such a huge country with an inadequately inflated budget, inadequate concentration of the head offices of all more or less large organizations and inadequately rapid development to the detriment of other regions of the country. That's what I'm getting at. Russia needs decentralization, as well as a fundamental change in the approach to developing complex territories.
                  1. KaPToC
                    KaPToC 11 March 2018 18: 11
                    0
                    Quote: Greenwood
                    Then I do not understand why to write about it. It is necessary to deal with their problems, not to bury the United States.

                    This is one of the most important problems - to prevent the US from falling so that this ... structure does not bury ourselves under its rubble.
                    Quote: Greenwood
                    It smacks of the sensations of the Ren-TV channel.

                    This is a sensation only for you, there are two options, either you are a dense, uneducated ignoramus, which I do not believe in, or you, as a resident of the USA, are trying in such a simple way to deny your guilt, which is more likely.
                    Quote: Greenwood
                    But according to your logic from the post above, it is lower than the capital.

                    Where above, where below, not fundamentally, not by much.
                    Quote: Greenwood
                    Insanity is to have one city in such a huge country with an inadequately inflated budget, inadequate concentration of the head offices of all more or less large organizations and inadequately rapid development to the detriment of other regions of the country.

                    Centralization, globalization and other nishtyaki of macroeconomic development - the maras do not do this, let's not develop, we will turn into pelts and dance around the fire
                  2. Sergej1972
                    Sergej1972 12 March 2018 13: 02
                    +1
                    We need to have another three or four megalopolises smaller than the Moscow metropolitan area, but approximately comparable to St. Petersburg. Potential most real candidates - Yekaterinburg, Novosibirsk. Smaller agglomerations can be around Krasnoyarsk, Vladivostok, Kazan. Maybe around Voronezh. Nizhny Novgorod, unfortunately, has little chance of becoming an independent center due to the proximity of Moscow. It will soon become the outskirts of the Moscow super-agglomeration.
                    Well, in addition to monocentric agglomerations, it is also possible to develop polycentric ones like Novokuznetsk and Samaro-Tolyatti.
          2. Sergej1972
            Sergej1972 12 March 2018 12: 56
            +1
            Your interlocutor is actually right. Any geographer will tell you that in the vast majority of countries of the world, the capital is located in the largest economic and political center. USA, Canada, Australia are more likely an exception. Small (relatively) Washington is part of the Washington metropolitan area with a population of over five million people (sometimes unofficially referred to as the State Metropolitan Region), which, in turn, is part of the giant supeglomeration (megalopolis) of Boswash with a center in New York with a population of 45 million people. This, in essence, is an over-urbanized territory.
            Well, and do not forget that in the United States the official administrative boundaries of the city are actual in most cases. The urban outskirts and territories that have actually merged with large cities are not formally part of it. In fact, most of the US population lives in a couple of dozen agglomerations that occupy a small part of the country.
  30. kig
    kig 9 March 2018 01: 46
    +10
    A week ago we were in Kholmsk - this is such a city on Sakhalin Island.

    The largest transport center in Sakhalin, which includes a non-freezing sea port with two terminals, three railway stations and a road junction. It is connected with Vanino by sea railway passenger-and-freight ferry Kholmsk - Vanino

    Let's see.
    These are the remains of a canning factory. Since there is no fiber, then there are no preserves, and therefore there are no those who once supplied raw materials for these canned goods.

    The seaport, obviously, also became unnecessary.


    The train station too.



    The population of the city at the moment is about 20 thousand people. When the USSR in 1989, there were more than 50 thousand.
    The country has stability and prosperity.
    1. kig
      kig 9 March 2018 03: 44
      +6
      I continue (I was distracted here, and when I returned to the cabin, my post had already left).
      So, the seaport. It functions, but the front door looks like this:


      The berths have not been repaired for a long time. This is a view of the ferry pier, and the pier is destroyed to the right of it. It is fenced with a rope on which the inscription "The pier does not work" dangles


      The ferry service has faded. Once, 10 ferries ran on it, now there are three left, and there are enough of them. There is no fixed schedule, departure is "on completion". But the Pentagon has no answer to our new weapons.

      A gas pipeline runs through Sakhalin to the city of Korsakov, to the Prigorodnoye complex. There, the gas turns into liquid and is loaded onto gas tankers going to Japan, China, Korea, etc. There are gas stoves in the kitchens of the city of Kholmsk, but the gas is mainly dragged into apartments in cylinders, like 50 years ago. There is a gasification program for the entire region right up to 2020, some amount from the budget has been allocated for it. Although it is strange - if gas is produced on the island, it would be logical to spend part of the gas money on island needs, without waiting for mercy from above. Anyway.
      1. Greenwood
        Greenwood 9 March 2018 05: 01
        +12
        Purely for comparison: the Japanese port town of Wakkanai (in the very north of Hokkaido, near Sakhalin).


        But there is no gas and oil. As they say, comments are unnecessary.
        1. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 12 March 2018 13: 07
          0
          Googled, it became interesting. With a population of only 40 thousand people, an area of ​​about 800 sq. Km. This is a quarter of Moscow (including the annexed New Moscow). This is essentially not a city, but an administrative unit such as our some urban districts, most of which are located outside the city that gave them the name.
          The photo, frankly, was not particularly impressive.
      2. Victor N
        Victor N 9 March 2018 07: 15
        0
        The governor was painfully adventurous there in Sakhalin. Really local did not notice anything? Did you go to the polls? Or was there a lack of fishing time?
        1. kig
          kig 9 March 2018 08: 21
          +6
          It’s not funny for yourself?
          1. Victor N
            Victor N 9 March 2018 10: 58
            +3
            Not at all. The country learned about the outrages on Sakhalin from Moscow. Really didn’t notice anything on the spot?
            And if you noticed - why didn’t they even write on the fence? Now there are many opportunities for disseminating information. But when everyone is silent, nothing can be done.
            1. The comment was deleted.
              1. KaPToC
                KaPToC 9 March 2018 21: 44
                +2
                Quote: Boribasar
                So as an example ..

                What does Kushchevka and Sakhalin have to do with it? There is no argument - who is better!
                1. Greenwood
                  Greenwood 10 March 2018 10: 31
                  +5
                  Moreover, the situation in Russia is about the same everywhere.
                  1. KaPToC
                    KaPToC 10 March 2018 23: 19
                    0
                    Quote: Greenwood
                    Moreover, the situation in Russia is about the same everywhere.

                    The situation is different everywhere, in one place an organized criminal group, and in another the criminal actions of the authorities.
                    1. Greenwood
                      Greenwood 11 March 2018 10: 57
                      +3
                      Quote: KaPToC
                      organized criminal group, and in another criminal actions of the authorities.
                      In Russia, these concepts have long been intertwined. I already know this well. We in Primorye and the governor was from bandits and the mayor of Vladivostok.
                      1. KaPToC
                        KaPToC 11 March 2018 14: 12
                        0
                        Quote: Greenwood
                        In Russia, these concepts have long been intertwined.

                        These concepts are interwoven throughout the world; it does not matter. You will look for differences - you will find differences, you will search for identity - you will find identity, all this is only in your head.
            2. Alf
              Alf 9 March 2018 14: 40
              +3
              Quote: Victor N
              Now there are many opportunities for disseminating information.

              A lot of. There are few reactions, and even that, as it were, so as not to be sent to steam, the wrong way.
            3. Greenwood
              Greenwood 10 March 2018 10: 34
              +4
              Quote: Victor N
              Not at all. The country learned about the outrages on Sakhalin from Moscow. Really didn’t notice anything on the spot?
              And if you noticed - why didn’t they even write on the fence? Now there are many opportunities for disseminating information. But when everyone is silent, nothing can be done.
              Here Mr. Navalny, no matter how I belonged to him, did a great job of studying foreign accounts and real estate of Russian officials close to Putin. With detailed photo and video reports, links to Rosreestr documentation and bank statements. It seems to have even appealed to the prosecutor about this? And did it have any consequences?
              1. Victor N
                Victor N 10 March 2018 12: 47
                +1
                Silence is impossible! The concerns are clear. But one must find opportunities. No other way.
                Any rank is afraid of publicity. And you can’t put a scarf on each mouth.
                1. Alf
                  Alf 10 March 2018 20: 17
                  +2
                  Quote: Victor N
                  Any rank is afraid of publicity.

                  Is it our bureaucrats, especially the highest ones, who are afraid of publicity? It’s funny. Very scared of the iPhone?
  31. Seraphimamur
    Seraphimamur 9 March 2018 11: 10
    0
    And what does the author suggest? What is the solution to the settlement of Siberia and the Far East? Fart article.
  32. cariperpaint
    cariperpaint 9 March 2018 11: 15
    +1
    I don’t understand all this ... all my life is somehow connected with the Far East. I fly very often, which by the way is not so expensive as they say. Now for the sake of laughter climbed 22000 back tickets. houses are built like mushrooms. happy children on the streets, youth engaged in sports ... all who of my friends left all have one reason. they outgrew everything here. they have nothing to strive for. here they’re leaving. which is very bad. but quite understandable.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 9 March 2018 12: 48
      +9
      Quote: cariperpaint
      I don’t understand all this ... all my life is somehow connected with the Far East
      Live for a year or two at least constantly, then you will understand.
      Quote: cariperpaint
      I fly very often
      On trips, even frequent, you do not comprehend life here.
      Quote: cariperpaint
      somehow connected with the Far East
      DV is a loose concept. Where exactly? Primorye, Amurka, Khabarovsk Territory or MB Sakhalin with Magadan? The standard of living is different everywhere.
      Quote: cariperpaint
      houses are built like mushrooms. happy children on the streets youth engaged in sports ...
      Lord, and where is this unearthly paradise?
      Quote: cariperpaint
      all have one reason. they outgrew everything here. they have nothing to strive for.
      This can be expressed in a much more understandable language: "no prospects." And this is an indicator that not everything is so rosy in the Danish kingdom.
      1. cariperpaint
        cariperpaint 9 March 2018 18: 28
        0
        in the service I was from Bopstovo to 49 km in Khabarovsk. served here half of his life. specifically described the city of Khabarovsk in which he raised his child with pleasure. as for the prospects, I didn’t mean them at all. people want more in all areas. they already want everything new from entertainments which are actually more there to the fabulous desire to get 200 thousand and do nothing. but now they get a little more than here and all these entertainments are rarely available to them because there is no time.
      2. KaPToC
        KaPToC 9 March 2018 21: 47
        +3
        Quote: Greenwood
        Lord, and where is this unearthly paradise?

        Do you offer to build houses all over the country? Ten hundred square meters per house, 17 million sq km, totaling 17 (billions - do not mistake) houses - are you sure that our country needs this?
        1. Greenwood
          Greenwood 10 March 2018 10: 46
          +5
          Quote: KaPToC
          Do you offer to build houses all over the country?
          Have I written about this somewhere? No, I didn’t write. But once you remember, ask yourself where you would like to live and raise your children. Here:


          Or here:


          Quote: KaPToC
          Ten hundred square meters per house, 17 million square kilometers
          Do not need 10 acres per house. But to build giant areas of anthills in the largest country in the world, while thousands of kilometers of the territory is idle idle - it is certainly very far-sighted. Here we have neither Hong Kong nor Singapore, which have nowhere to develop in breadth. Even in Tokyo, outside the center, kilometers of private two-story houses begin, the rest of Japan consists almost of all of these houses. But the population of Japan is not much less than the Russian, and the territory is ten times smaller.
          1. KaPToC
            KaPToC 10 March 2018 23: 24
            0
            Quote: Greenwood
            But once you remember, ask yourself where you would like to live and raise your children. Here:

            Quote: Greenwood
            Or here:

            A beautiful house, yeah, I wish you to live in this ... somewhere in Yakutsk, you won’t even reach the new year, you will throw your hooves from the cold. Board and glass houses are suicides in our climate.
            Quote: Greenwood
            We are not here Hong Kong and Singapore

            Quote: Greenwood
            the rest of Japan is almost all and consists of such houses.

            I would like to draw your attention - from PAPER houses, are you sure you want to live in Russia in a paper house?
            1. Greenwood
              Greenwood 11 March 2018 17: 07
              +5
              Quote: KaPToC
              A beautiful house, yeah, I wish you to live in this ... somewhere in Yakutsk, you won’t even reach the new year, you will throw your hooves from the cold. Board and glass houses are suicides in our climate.
              Google "frame houses using Canadian technology." The Russian climate is quite maintained, built very quickly. The cost of a finished house is not much higher than the average apartment.
              Quote: KaPToC
              I would like to draw your attention - from PAPER houses, are you sure you want to live in Russia in a paper house?
              I’m sure that if you wanted, you could have long abandoned the building by anthills, another question is that anthills are cheaper for developers. And the climate here is not of primary importance.
              1. Golovan Jack
                Golovan Jack 11 March 2018 17: 22
                +5
                "Representative of talented youth", you are incorrigible laughing
                They tell you:
                Quote: KaPToC
                you don’t even reach the new year, throw your hooves from the cold

                And you on this:
                Quote: Greenwood
                And the climate here is not important

                Well, firstly, there is no "main value".
                Secondly, what do you think is easier to heat: a lot of small houses, or one big one?
                Ninth, Canada is much warmer than Siberia. Do not believe - check yes
              2. KaPToC
                KaPToC 11 March 2018 18: 13
                +1
                Quote: Greenwood
                Google "frame houses using Canadian technology." The Russian climate is quite maintained, built very quickly.

                The Canadian climate is much milder than the Russian one. In addition, where people live in Canada - it is warmer than in Sochi, most of Canada is simply not populated.
              3. zoolu350
                zoolu350 12 March 2018 04: 29
                +3
                By the way, why doesn’t they consider the survival of the country and the population in the case of large-scale use of nuclear weapons. If the enemy’s industry and population are concentrated in several megalopolises, then it is quite simple to cover it with several munitions with SBN, but if the industry and the population are dispersed over a huge area, then the enemy may not have enough SBN to defeat them. That is, Russia in this regard is practically invulnerable, and after the destruction of the power of the oligarchy of the Russian Federation, it is possible not only to turn the Fed’s owners on a child-bearing organ, but also send the CCP leadership away.
                1. KaPToC
                  KaPToC 12 March 2018 08: 58
                  0
                  Quote: zoolu350
                  By the way, why doesn’t they consider the survival of the country and the population in the case of large-scale use of nuclear weapons. If the enemy’s industry and population are concentrated in several megalopolises, then it is quite simple to cover it with several munitions with SBN, but if the industry and the population are dispersed over a huge area, then the enemy may not have enough SBN to defeat them.

                  The degree of urbanization in Russia and the United States is about the same, another question is that if industry is destroyed, neither we nor the Americans will be able to feed the large population.
                  1. zoolu350
                    zoolu350 12 March 2018 09: 18
                    0
                    So I say, about the fact that if we disperse industry and the population, we will have less vulnerability to nuclear weapons than in the secondary school.
                    1. KaPToC
                      KaPToC 12 March 2018 13: 16
                      0
                      Quote: zoolu350
                      So I say, about the fact that if we disperse industry and the population, we will have less vulnerability to nuclear weapons than in the secondary school.

                      Both here and among the Americans, industry is partially dispersed, everything that can be done in this direction has been done since the USSR, it is impossible to disperse further, the laws of macroeconomics will work against us.
                      1. zoolu350
                        zoolu350 12 March 2018 16: 23
                        0
                        Yeah done. Work is not an edge. But nothing is dispersed in the secondary school, industrial clusters are crowded and tied to transport routes, because there has always been brutal capitalism, and there was no threat until the second half of the 20th century, unlike Russia.
          2. Sergej1972
            Sergej1972 12 March 2018 13: 15
            0
            I do not want to live in any house. I am comfortable with city apartments. Here’s a bigger apartment, I don’t mind getting over time. A small country house exclusively as an addition to the apartment. Exceptionally brick. I hate wooden houses. And I like the skyscrapers (although I don’t want to live in them, I prefer the number of storeys from four to 10 floors). And there are many such people. Our opinion must also be taken into account and respected.
    2. kig
      kig 9 March 2018 12: 49
      +2
      Well, we seem to want people not to leave the Far East, but quite the opposite.
  33. Archon
    Archon 9 March 2018 20: 25
    +3
    Relatives of almost all moved to Vladimir from Vladivostok. 9 people gathered and moved. And now they can’t get enough. Apartments are cheaper, ecology is better, transport is better. There is no sea, but there is no surplus of cars, broken roads, taped from the painted walls of houses, gushing sewers and developing pipes with boiling water, and there are no mayors who go to prison one by one.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 10 March 2018 10: 50
      +5
      Quote: Archon
      Relatives of almost all moved to Vladimir from Vladivostok.
      I have a bunch of friends moved to St. Petersburg. For the price of an average kopeck piece in Vladivostok, you can buy an apartment not much worse in St. Petersburg.
      Quote: Archon
      an excess of cars, broken roads, glued from the painted walls of houses, gushing sewers and developing pipes with boiling water
      Then I agree. Infrastructure problems in the city are colossal.
      Quote: Archon
      there are no mayors who go to prison one by one
      This is already a local tradition. lol Interestingly, the new mayor Verkeenko how much will last ?!
    2. cats
      cats 10 March 2018 18: 13
      +2
      Quote: Archon
      Relatives almost all moved to Vladimir from Vladivostok

      Of course, it's easier to move, it's everyone’s business ..
      But they say New York abruptly Vladimir will not lost?
      1. Greenwood
        Greenwood 11 March 2018 17: 08
        +4
        Quote: Kotovsky
        Of course it's easier to move
        The fish is looking where deeper, the man where better. Now in the era of globalization, this saying has become easier to implement.
    3. Sergej1972
      Sergej1972 12 March 2018 13: 16
      0
      At the same time, Vladimir, to put it mildly, is not very quoted in Central Russia. Lack of excess cars is temporary.
  34. uskrabut
    uskrabut 9 March 2018 22: 15
    +2
    They made a great power from Russia, and we?
    Not us, but a liberal government that has nothing to do with the people. Then everything was brought to Russia from all over the world, and now it is selling everything, if something cannot be sold abroad, then they will not bother.
  35. SCHWERIN
    SCHWERIN 9 March 2018 22: 59
    +9
    Everyone remembers how many people under the king increased and how many under the Soviets. The king ended 100 years ago, the Soviets soon 30 years.
    The world has changed a lot during this time. There is no longer a desire for people in a barn to look after cattle in a northern village. There is no desire to use a toilet like a toilet. Stoke the furnace with firewood or coal for long winters.
    Watch our TV. One glamor. From morning to evening. Even actresses playing military women in WWII resemble models with smooth skin and a hairstyle from the salon. Look at the sleek presenters such as Good Morning Moscow. And you want to say that a resident of the village does not envy them and does not want to be in their place?
    Even living in the Northern Capital, going out into the street you catch yourself thinking, but where do they find such aunts? And there are thousands of them on TV. And the people are looking at the chic life on the screen, where there is a luxurious house, the owner is like a gentleman, he works if there is no roofing felts, he is a man and this is on all channels, he wants to go to master the Far East hectare, poke around in the ground, fight with the authorities
    to understand our intricate laws? Do not tell me, Everyone wants to go to Moscow. Moscow, where 24 hours are light, walking distance to shops, salons, fitness, etc. But Moscow is one. And all this luxurious life stands before the eyes of a provincial when she gets up and goes to her cold boutiques.
    Nobody wants to have 5 children. Not because they don’t want, but simply can’t. Materially, physically. But a normal parent wants good for his child, wants him to be healthy, received a good education, found a good job. GDP said about 20 million. Poor.
    Among them, the vast majority of good people. Can they have big families? The answer is clear.
    And looking at the glamorous screen, many people feel like guests (in the annex) at this celebration of life. I remember Soviet films. They showed a lot about workers and villagers. Where are these movies now? Adapted to our time? They are not here....
    Therefore, one should not expect a rapid increase in the birth rate. And this is not only with us. The industrial revolution was replaced by another wave. Services sector. And these trends will increase. Unfortunately, on TV we received an order for Ukraine and our "partners" in the USA. And probably they’ve been spinning for three years. And he’ll lock up, but the train has already left. But they talk beautifully about the 5th phase of the digital economy and block-chain. And the people probably live in the second, and somewhere in the first.
    Now we are preparing for a jerk. Does the people know which way to tear? After all, people had to be prepared for this in advance.
    But we are not the first in terms of population. There are countries that have long been prepared for this. For example, the United States. There, a citizen lives in that part of the country where they pay more or his specialty is in demand. Housing is rented, eat in a cafe. This is called community mobility. It’s very bad with us. There are many examples.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 10 March 2018 10: 58
      +7
      Quote: SCHWERIN
      For example, the United States. There, a citizen lives in that part of the country where they pay more or his specialty is in demand. Housing is rented, eat in a cafe. This is called community mobility.
      There is such a moment. Extremely important. In the United States, the standard of living in different states is not very different. And the quality of life and the level of infrastructure in New York is not very different from San Francisco, Chicago or any thread of Dallas. And the offices of various world corporations are not crowded in New York, but dispersed throughout the country. For example, IT companies like Apple, Microsoft, Dell, Intel, Adobe, Hewlett-Packard prefer small sleeping towns. And all sorts of newfangled chips for managing urban infrastructure are introduced first in small cities, and then gradually transferred to large ones. In Russia, all life boils in Moscow alone, then beyond the MKAD there is no life.
      1. SCHWERIN
        SCHWERIN 10 March 2018 20: 15
        +1
        I completely agree with you. In small cities (towns), the standard of living is certainly lower than in mega. But people live there having everything they need while avoiding the frenzied rhythm of a big city.
        We are obsessed with Moscow (they probably want to make a showcase in front of the World Cup, as in the Union of the Baltic States. And it is everywhere in Zamkadye, even here in St. Petersburg, worse.
        I have often been to Canada, in small towns, on the coast. Roads cut through the rocks, wild cold and snow in winter, but the towns are clean, well-groomed.
        Now it’s getting worse, many refugees from all over the world have arrived, prices have risen.
      2. Sergej1972
        Sergej1972 12 March 2018 13: 22
        0
        The standard of living in different American cities is not very different. San Francisco, Chicago or “some Dallas” are the most powerful densely populated centers, centers of urban agglomerations. And in the states the standard of living, the level of payment differs quite significantly. But the fact is that in the American outback, which is not part of large urban agglomerations, a smaller part of the country's population has long been living.
    2. Victor N
      Victor N 11 March 2018 11: 14
      0
      There is practically no commodity shortage anywhere, although it sometimes happens, but not for long - there are those who want to earn money and ensure the supply of goods.
      You can also find how to make money almost everywhere, but this is troublesome, which many do not like. And they like to wait, ask, demand help, often without even realizing specifically from whom - simply "from the authorities."
      There are successful and unsuccessful entrepreneurs, very small and very large effective investment projects - you need to write stories, plays, novels and novels about them, shoot movies and TV shows. Which will be VERY DEMANDED! But there are no such works! The Company does not have a positive (and negative) image of an ENTREPRENEUR!
      The negative image of the OLIGARCH is instilled into society, and in Belarus it’s almost a curse, the rejection of entrepreneurship in general is cultivated there; as a result, stagnation of the Belarusian economy.
      Each of us has our own experience in business, or has heard - both positive and negative. LET'S WRITE ABOUT THIS! Wherever you can! We need to educate in society respect for economically active people! admiration for successful entrepreneurial (investment) projects!
      Aw, patriots!
      Awww, culture, creators - do it!
      1. SCHWERIN
        SCHWERIN 11 March 2018 19: 34
        +1
        Let's face it. ANY business is maximizing profit. And there is no red line. And so in all countries. I admit that one out of a hundred entrepreneurs abides by the law and guests. 99 twist, twist and weld well. What awaits this good guy I think everyone understands.
        The role of the state as a control person and a guarantor of the inevitability of punishment is important here. Now Roskontrol claims a lot of cases of counterfeiting among products, especially dairy. And it has been going on for a long time. Those. There are violations, they are being registered, but no one has been punished. At the same time, Medvedev demands not to scare the business! But I’m calm for him, he and his family are eating cross-checked foods. But I and millions of citizens risk their health every day.
        I lived in Japan. You enter the supermarket as if in the operating room. Sterile cleanliness. On the product, the packaging date is indicated almost every second. Let’s say the fish. Fried or smoked. A person walks around, he has a type of cash register, and probably several times a day, changes prices on a perishable. In this case, it is a fish. By the end of the day, the price of this fish falls by 50-70%. And in the evening she no longer remains.
        Here I touched on the topic of products as a mass consumer product. But I think the same problems with the medicine. Counterfeit But I know that in Germany, pharmacies are responsible for counterfeiting and no one wants to pay fines or sit on time.
        Our problem is accepted by the mass of the law, but there is no control over its implementation. A simple example. On each floor of the house where I live there are ads banning smoking on the stairs. Down below, a neighbor constantly smokes at the window on which this ad hangs. Here is your word and deed.
        By the way, after Belarus declared itself the country of avocados and shrimp, the quality of Belarusian products has declined sharply. Friendly remark .....
        1. Sergej1972
          Sergej1972 12 March 2018 13: 24
          +1
          I know people who smoke on stairs out of principle, considering these prohibitions a violation of human rights.
  36. emwave
    emwave 10 March 2018 10: 53
    +3
    It is necessary to introduce new rules of the game. Previously, teachers and doctors after the university were distributed throughout the country - there was an obligation. Testing by distribution - now even within the same city, teachers run from place to place like scalded ones (they look for where more promising and richer are lyceums for the rich). Doctors also flee to private clinics. This garbage needs to be stopped! The hand of the market is blind and stupid.
    1. Victor N
      Victor N 10 March 2018 12: 51
      +2
      The distribution will be useful if the graduate will be required to work for a certain period, but limited, perhaps different for different specialties. Three years - as in the USSR, on average. But enslaving specialists for a long time is impossible.
    2. vindigo
      vindigo 11 March 2018 10: 27
      +4
      Let state employees be forcibly distributed. And then they learn at public expense and bring down abroad. What to take from businessmen? They have already paid for the tuition service. No one owes anyone.
  37. neofit962
    neofit962 10 March 2018 11: 48
    +1
    onix757Korolev and Kurchatov could not appear out of nowhere. They studied with professors of the imperial school.
    1. zoolu350
      zoolu350 12 March 2018 04: 39
      +2
      They could learn at least from Newton, but only the Soviet regime under Stalin could create the conditions under which their talent was revealed and breakthroughs occurred. And what happened under Nikolai No. 2, watch a movie about Zhukovsky.
      1. neofit962
        neofit962 18 June 2018 10: 25
        0
        Your answer is similar to the wishes of Ivan Bezdomny: "I would have had this Kant (Newton) for three years, but to the camps!" Then tell me please, who invented electronic television, video recording, and where did you realize your plans? Korolev fully paid for his services in creating rockets with a prison sentence in the camp and work in sharashka, under Soviet power and the great Stalin.
  38. cats
    cats 10 March 2018 18: 08
    +3
    If the author is a resident of the Urals, as he says, then such emotionality may be excusable ..
    And yet .. What do you want? To talk show came to us? Or think that if the roads were better,
    did it change something?
    What measure do you calculate the happiness of Siberians? Maybe I'm no longer in bast shoes, but all these European
    The glamor for my kids scare me. Those who are truly needed here will not leave here.
    Pull spoiled by civilization here, why?
    Tofalaria, do you know what it is? So my father, a hunter, changes the taiga every two years, to hell,
    speaks too crowded.
    This is all relative, if you really wanted to sell an apartment in Moscow and raise a hectare, you will raise it.
    If you want to be raised for you, stay in Moscow.
    Here we know what difficulties are, and we know what civilization brings along with benefits.
    I am not opposed to moving forward, but let's not get excited, not everything is so bad .. hi
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 10 March 2018 18: 47
      +3
      Let me ask you, where exactly do you live beyond the Urals and how old are you?
      1. cats
        cats 11 March 2018 10: 57
        +3
        What difference does it make where I live and how old ..
        You say that we have the same everywhere and at the same time equal to Tokyo,
        forgetting to mention the thickness of the walls in Japanese homes.
        Put photos of America as an example, the state that lives
        world robbery request
        And you are advertising aleshenka a fool heaped .. negative
        1. Greenwood
          Greenwood 11 March 2018 17: 18
          +4
          Quote: Kotovsky
          You say that we have the same everywhere
          Hmm, I didn’t say that. Chesna ... repeat
          Quote: Kotovsky
          at the same time equals to Tokyo
          In Tokyo, I didn’t offer to equal, I cited Tokyo as an example in the sense that in terms of infrastructure, especially in residential areas (we don’t take an overloaded business district), it practically does not differ from provincial cities. I have lived in Japan, so first-hand information.
          Quote: Kotovsky
          forgetting to mention the thickness of the walls in Japanese homes.
          What is the wall thickness in Japanese homes? request
          Quote: Kotovsky
          Put photos of America as an example, the state that lives
          world robbery
          I am not a fan of the USA, but I see no reason not to take the positive aspects of their way of life and life as a model. In the end, there are many developed countries in the world, all live by robbery?
          Quote: Kotovsky
          And you are advertising aleshenka a fool heaped ..
          Well, finally someone said about Navalny. They watched the video or limited themselves to a loud “fu”, only seeing his face?!?! lol
          1. cats
            cats 11 March 2018 18: 11
            +4
            Quote: Greenwood
            Hmm, I didn’t say that. Chesna ...

            Quote: Greenwood
            Moreover, the situation in Russia is about the same everywhere.

            hi
            Quote: Greenwood
            practically does not differ from provincial cities.

            Quote: Greenwood
            What is the wall thickness in Japanese homes?

            We are sawing a bar for the Japanese, they are called tarukhs, 3 * 4cm, they are sawing a lot, when asked why they answer so much, they make a frame out of them, sheathe plywood and make a wall.
            Quote: Greenwood
            I am not a fan of the USA, but I see no reason not to take the positive aspects of their way of life and life as a model.

            Bad example, climate, laws, conditions. Quite another.
            Quote: Greenwood
            Well, finally someone said about Navalny. They watched the video or limited themselves to a loud “fu”, only seeing his face?!?!

            You're right, limited to puckering your nose. A man from the category of Turchinov, Yatsenyuk and Yarosh.
            I know that we are not doing well, and I agree in many ways with both you and the author ..
            I just suggest that you don’t get excited, do not twist on the government, and do not equal those
            who even has a different climate. hi
            1. Greenwood
              Greenwood 12 March 2018 15: 57
              0
              Quote: Kotovsky
              hi
              This was said not in the context of construction, but in the context of the situation with the criminal activity of the authorities. Tokyo and its buildings are here what side then?
              Quote: Kotovsky
              We are sawing a bar for the Japanese, they are called tarukhs, 3 * 4cm, they are sawing a lot, when asked why they answer so much, they make a frame out of them, sheathe plywood and make a wall.
              Most likely for the southern regions. In the north, they are also quite cold.
              Quote: Kotovsky
              Bad example, climate, laws, conditions. Quite another.
              There is Canada, the climate is similar. laughing
              And for everything else? What, in the Third World countries equal?
              Quote: Kotovsky
              You're right, limited to puckering your nose. A man from the category of Turchinov, Yatsenyuk and Yarosh.
              I cited Navalny as an example, as the most famous disclosure of abuses in the highest echelons of power (or the person above complained why this people does not disseminate information, but it is Navalny who distributes it).
              Quote: Kotovsky
              I just suggest that you don’t get excited, do not twist on the government, and do not equal those
              who even has a different climate.
              I am not excited, but dissatisfied with the work of the government. You, of course, have the right to disagree with me. hi I propose to close the topic, for I do not care about pouring from empty to empty.
            2. neofit962
              neofit962 18 June 2018 10: 33
              0
              Well, the climate is different, it is clear that it is not the equator, but as for example Iceland, Norway, Sweden, Finland. Also do not live in the tropics! Of course, the climate here is not the same. Similar conditions in Arkhangelsk, Murmansk! In the Russian North we live better than anyone else!
          2. KaPToC
            KaPToC 11 March 2018 18: 15
            +2
            Quote: Greenwood
            What is the wall thickness in Japanese homes?

            Engage in construction - you will find out how the thickness of the walls and the depth of the foundation change, depending on the climate. According to Malinin - Gurin, two bricks are more than one.
  39. Mig32
    Mig32 11 March 2018 01: 49
    +3
    People also leave Kamchatka en masse. There are shifts and the military, and those who simply can not leave for financial reasons. Only fish factories remain on the coasts. In Soviet times, the system of northern allowances, the provision of housing for young professionals attracted and people went to earn money. Someone left, but more remained. And today, salaries are not much higher than in the central part of Russia, and the prices are hellish for everything. For an apartment of 40 squares 10 thousand. Tomatoes and cucumbers at 800 rubles. And the salary is 40. And how not to leave here. Lifting give visitors to doctors and teachers in the local outback - a million. Units are traveling. And what kind of hectares we are talking about, it’s just not possible to drive up to them, let alone their use.
    1. New Year day
      New Year day 12 March 2018 14: 30
      0
      Quote: Mig32
      and the prices are hellish for everything

      Yes, I looked at the markets and shops of Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky on YouTube - I was impressed. For some items more expensive than in Moscow
  40. cradle
    cradle 11 March 2018 10: 38
    +2
    Quote: Olgovich
    Quote: Boris55
    One king blocks a social elevator, leading to elite degradation and a general dull people.

    Stupidity of the people ?! fool lol
    And Soviet science HOW HERE, honey, man?
    From imperial science and imperial universities, Kurchatov and Korolev came out, ALL scientists of atomic and space projects
    Quote: Boris55
    .. Ultimately, it was the kings who brought the country to the state of chaos of the 17th and civil war ..

    The war was-UNEXPECTED in the history of mankind. And the weakening of the state (EVERYWHERE it was). Hit in the back in such a situation -
    betrayal.
    Stalin, knowing this - destroyed all potential New Bolsheviks, "peace fighters."
    Quote: Boris55
    . All the consequences of the demography of the last century lie entirely on the tsarist regime, failed with your duties.

    Fully managed, population growth of 50% in 22 years - this was not later and never will be
    Quote: Boris55
    I understand that it’s convenient for you to snatch a piece of history and blame the one you want, but that’s not the case in life.

    WHAT is torn out? All in order. to argue is impossible. hi

    Kurchatov: Tauride University 1920-1923, Korolev: KPI 1924-1926, then MVTU im. Bauman .... hde imperial vaunted universities? But no ... That is, there were NO social elevators for the young and gifted before socialism! And so it will be further, until we return socialism.
  41. cradle
    cradle 11 March 2018 11: 24
    0
    Quote: Greenwood
    Quote: KaPToC
    Do you offer to build houses all over the country?
    Have I written about this somewhere? No, I didn’t write. But once you remember, ask yourself where you would like to live and raise your children. Here:


    Or here:


    Quote: KaPToC
    Ten hundred square meters per house, 17 million square kilometers
    Do not need 10 acres per house. But to build giant areas of anthills in the largest country in the world, while thousands of kilometers of the territory is idle idle - it is certainly very far-sighted. Here we have neither Hong Kong nor Singapore, which have nowhere to develop in breadth. Even in Tokyo, outside the center, kilometers of private two-story houses begin, the rest of Japan consists almost of all of these houses. But the population of Japan is not much less than the Russian, and the territory is ten times smaller.

    All these are wet dreams, about individual construction. 1) The cost of 1 square. m in an individual house 2) The cost of infrastructure for ind. development 3) even the difference in the heating of the dwelling in an apartment building and in an individual dwelling, but we do not have Florida more than once ... 4) transport - it is understood that residents in ind. development entirely by private transport. Yes, over time (with the improvement of well-being, and it will come slowly, without the "help of" sworn "friends") people will move to such housing, but we still have enough problems in the country and there is no need to force events!
    1. SCHWERIN
      SCHWERIN 11 March 2018 19: 48
      0
      Do not worry so. America was built for 200 years, but we are not even 30
      1. zoolu350
        zoolu350 12 March 2018 04: 43
        +3
        Is that humor right now with you?
  42. Stanislav Rost
    Stanislav Rost 11 March 2018 15: 28
    0
    This is again a madhouse, a view from beyond Moscow. Dumb hundred
  43. intuzazist
    intuzazist 11 March 2018 17: 34
    0
    Quote: Boris55
    And I completely forgot - the Internet is the same for the night to cut down.

    I would also turn off mobile communications! Only emergency services! Yes, and yet, powerful financial support for people living outside the Urals and those who want to move there ....
  44. zyablik.olga
    zyablik.olga 12 March 2018 13: 21
    +3
    KaPToC,
    Like you "own" - worse than others.
    1. KaPToC
      KaPToC 12 March 2018 21: 07
      +1
      Quote: zyablik.olga
      KaPToC,
      Like you "own" - worse than others.

      We must work and not hope for the state.
  45. Sergej1972
    Sergej1972 12 March 2018 13: 36
    0
    Probably, it is necessary to separate the problems of large cities of the Urals, Siberia, Far East, Amur Region from the problems of small cities (especially single-industry towns) and rural areas. And remember that the bulk of the population lives there, firstly, in the regional capitals, and, secondly, in the cities of hundreds of thousands (with a population of over one hundred thousand). In these centers, the situation is more or less tolerant, but somewhere, as, for example, in Yekaterinburg, is relatively good. But small towns and rural areas ... But even there the situation is very different from region to region. And within one subject, in neighboring urban districts and municipal areas, it can differ dramatically. Our eastern part of the country is a territory larger than Canada. Here in the small Kaluga or Oryol regions in two neighboring cities, the socio-economic situation is very different, to say nothing of such vast spaces.
  46. sergo42
    sergo42 12 March 2018 15: 17
    0
    What is the Far Eastern hectare? In our Samara region, which is quite densely populated, no one needs land for free, further 50 kilometers from the city, the villages are abandoned, and here they offer to go to hell with Easter cakes!
  47. The comment was deleted.
  48. Antonio_Mariarti
    Antonio_Mariarti 14 March 2018 13: 31
    0
    Quote: Greenwood
    Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
    Even the Far East is already starting.
    That's where, shy to ask? So many friends I have already left for St. Petersburg this year that there aren’t enough fingers on my hands.
    Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
    nobody wants to go here
    That’s why in Vlad the whole sphere of services and trade are already under the Caucasus. You will not see a single Slavic person in the market. There are far fewer Chinese and Koreans in the city than "friends from sunny republics."
    Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
    Krasnoyarsk
    A friend recently arrived from Krasnoyarsk, says that compared to him, Moscow has air like in a village. Continuous smog.
    Quote: Antonio_Mariarti
    Vladik
    Here it is not necessary about Vlad. As was the garbage dump for the past 20 years, so she stayed. Roads are in ruins, pits are everywhere, snow is not cleared, ice is on the sidewalks, only legs are broken. There is nothing to breathe, the city is buried in smog. Everyday traffic jams (which you won’t pass by going down the subway like in Moscow). Trolleybuses, trams in the city are almost completely eliminated. Road markings? No, have not heard. Half of the buildings in the city are, a lot of long-term construction. Rallies of deceived equity holders are constantly held. Recreation areas are mostly in poor condition, one of the largest parks in the city - the park of Minnoy Gorodok is in a state of neglect, at night it is better not to appear there.
    And yes, life in a city is in full swing, I agree. And the population is slowly increasing. Due to moving from the provincial cities of Primorsky Krai (where it’s very tight with work) and a huge flow of migrants from Uzbekistan, Tajikistan and the Caucasian regions of Russia. Only the city did not get better from this. It has become a big cesspool, there is no city comfortable for life.

    1. And in my city there is a natural increase of 12 thousand, and? Google, the Internet to help you, everything is already there. Soon there will be a natural increase.
    2. Um, how do you understand what's under it? If a person from Asia sells slippers, or meat. This does not mean that the market is under it. He just works there, as many local people don’t go to work, low salary. In my market, where milk, meat and other food are all local, and where is Chinese: shoes, clothes, flip-flops almost all from Middle Asia, at least thought why?
    3. There is a problem with the environment in Krasnoyarsk, it is already being solved with this, but how did they begin to improve landscapes, sports grounds, kindergartens, schools in a swoop. Even the salary is growing.
    4. The icy weather on the sidewalks is to blame for the climate, of course you can buy a lot of equipment, a bunch of people to bring out, so that they clean it 24/7 for that, will you find so many people? People have gotten more cars, traffic jams have become bigger, the roads to expand to Vladiky with its location and narrow streets are hard and very expensive, many sights will have to be demolished, am I ready to go for it? But the bridge was very unloaded, I have a relative living there, I was there the last time at the end of 2016, so don’t tell me, according to her stories, it’s just heaven and earth that became 18 years ago. If you saw people from Middle Asia on the markets, this does not mean that there are already a lot of them. I was in Vladivostok, I only met the Chinese, but yes, you won’t even distinguish Chinese tourists who like Vladik from people from Middle Asia. What is better comfort for you? Are these roads without traffic jams? Is climate better to do?