Military Review

Bloggers showed photos of a prototype combat vehicle 2С38 complex "Derivation-Air Defense"

78
A photo of the prototype of the 2C38 self-propelled anti-aircraft artillery system for the OCR "Derivation-Air Defense" with the 57-mm automatic gun appeared on the web.


The sample was presented during a visit to JSC Uralvagonzavod Scientific Production Corporation by the deputy chairman of the board of the Military Industrial Commission of Russia Oleg Bochkarev, the bmpd blog reports citing the press service of the corporation.

Bloggers showed a photo of a prototype 2S38 combat vehicle of the Derivation-Air Defense complex


Recall that the materials on the 2C38 combat vehicle were presented in August 2017 at the Army-2017 International Military-Technical Forum at the stand of the Chief Rocket and Artillery Directorate of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation. The materials reported that this product is being created as part of the "Derivation-Air Defense" development work, which implies the appearance in the troops of the advanced 57-mm mobile artillery complex with passive reconnaissance and tracking air targets.

The 2C38 combat vehicle is based on the BMP-3 and is designed to engage air targets such as unmanned aerial vehicles, cruise missiles, air-to-surface missiles, and tactical aircraft aviation, fire support helicopters. Anti-aircraft installation is also capable of shooting down rockets of multiple launch rocket systems, destroying ground and surface targets.

Key Features:

The maximum range of destruction - 6 km.
The maximum height of the lesion is 4,5 km.
The rate of fire - 120 shots per minute.
Full ammunition - 148 shots.
Vertical guidance angle - 5 degrees / + 75 degrees.
Horizontal pointing angle - 360 hail.

Maximum speed of targets hit - 500 m / s

Calculation - 3 people.

The 2C38 combat vehicle is equipped with an optical-electronic detection and aiming system for the IES OP, developed by Minsk JSC "Peleng". It allows you to carry out panoramic observation of the terrain at 360 degrees, as well as keep a sector review. The detection range through one of the television channels of a small unmanned aerial vehicle of the Berd Eye 400 type in the viewing mode is stated in 700 m, in the narrow field of view mode - 4900 m. - in 10 6400 m. The thermal imaging channel allows you to detect 12 x 300 m targets with a 2,3% probability at a distance of 2,3 80 m and recognize them at a distance of 10 000 m.
Photos used:
JSC "Scientific and Production Corporation" Uralvagonzavod "
78 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must to register.

I have an account? Sign in

  1. Sonet
    Sonet 27 January 2018 14: 42
    +3
    It looks impressive.
    1. MIKHAN
      MIKHAN 27 January 2018 15: 00
      13
      Bloggers showed a photo of a prototype combat

      Quote: Sonet
      It looks impressive.

      There is nothing to see at all .. And these "bloggers" I would, well, you know the peasants themselves ... Clickers! negative
    2. Dante
      Dante 27 January 2018 16: 41
      +3
      What nonsense, why take this? if such a thing was offered before!

      Domestic gunsmiths return to the army a forgotten caliber of 57 mm. And this can be considered a real Russian miracle. The new gun has already become a worldwide sensation, and will be one of the stars of the Russia Arms Expo-2015 arms exhibition in Nizhny Tagil. A combat module with a 57 mm automatic gun AU-220M. Developed it in the Nizhny Novgorod Central Research Institute "Petrel" for installation on light warships. And then they adapted to the ground conditions. And it turned out a real miracle gun.

      Rate of fire - 300 rounds per minute. The horizontal range of defeat is 16 km. Ammunition - more than a hundred shells. It perfectly affects all types of air targets and almost any type of armored vehicles, including tanks.

      The 57 mm caliber may not even penetrate the frontal armor of the Abrams and Leopard, but a flurry of powerful enough high-explosive shells will simply blow down all external devices - first of all, optics and antennas, tear apart the tracks, and jam the tower.

      The attractiveness of the gun is not only in its rate of fire, but also in its almost instant reaction. A heavy gun rotates 180 degrees literally in a second, and the barrel is precisely aimed at the target. However, here we are not talking about the gun itself, but about the combat module, which includes an uninhabited tower, various drives, protection systems, including active ones, and an excellent fire control system, of domestic production, by the way.

      The exhibition in Nizhny Tagil will also show a new modification of the BMP-3 with a combat module called "Derivation" and equipped with a 57 mm gun.
      1. Grigory_45
        Grigory_45 27 January 2018 19: 17
        +2
        Quote: Dante
        Rate of fire - 300 rounds per minute. The horizontal range of defeat is 16 km. Ammunition - more than a hundred shells. It perfectly affects all types of air targets and almost any type of armored vehicles, including tanks.

        Where did you read this? On the "Derivations-Air Defense" and the combat module "Baikal" (AU220M) is the same gun!
        Quote: Dante
        Horizontal range - 16 km

        yeah, ballistic, i.e. on which the projectile flies. And then 12 km. Only the aiming range really plays a role -.
        Quote: Dante
        Rate of fire - 300 rounds per minute. ... Ammunition - more than a hundred shells.

        This is generally without comment. Nonsense stop
        AU220M rate of fire - 120 rounds / min, 80 rounds of ammunition. Not to mention the fact that there is NO specialized SLA on the BMP for firing at air targets.
        Where do you get the information from?
      2. sedoj
        sedoj 27 January 2018 19: 55
        +2
        Quote: Dante
        The new gun has already become a worldwide sensation, and will be one of the stars of the arms exhibition Russia Arms Expo-2015 in Nizhny Tagil. The combat module with 57 mm automatic gun AU-220M.

        Is it too early? How not to be late for this sale.
    3. Mikado
      Mikado 28 January 2018 00: 11
      +1
      In the 1940s, Grabin developed a good gun, which is still being used ... what soldier
  2. Ratmir_Ryazan
    Ratmir_Ryazan 27 January 2018 14: 47
    +3
    I don’t understand how she does all this ?! How to get into a missile or air-to-surface missile from a 57-mm gun?
    1. New
      New 27 January 2018 14: 50
      +8
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      How to get into a missile or air-to-surface missile from a 57-mm gun?
      Everything is elementary: a homing system is put on the shell. wassat
      1. Ratmir_Ryazan
        Ratmir_Ryazan 27 January 2018 14: 55
        +3
        What other homing system ?! This is not a rocket ...
        1. MIKHAN
          MIKHAN 27 January 2018 15: 04
          16
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          What other homing system ?! This is not a rocket ...

          I will send you the documentation, send your copy of my passport to me in PM ..! hi
          1. Ratmir_Ryazan
            Ratmir_Ryazan 27 January 2018 15: 13
            +3
            Why do you need my passport?
            1. san4es
              san4es 27 January 2018 15: 27
              23
              Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
              Why do you need my passport?

              ... To get a loan on it bully
              1. MIKHAN
                MIKHAN 27 January 2018 15: 33
                +7
                Quote: san4es
                Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
                Why do you need my passport?

                ... To get a loan on it bully

                I have a lot of such passports .. Are you obviously a scammer?
                1. san4es
                  san4es 27 January 2018 15: 35
                  +5
                  Quote: MIKHAN
                  ... Are you obviously a scammer?

                  ... don't blunder stop
            2. MIKHAN
              MIKHAN 27 January 2018 15: 30
              +6
              Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
              Why do you need my passport?

              To verify identity .. And what did you think?
      2. oldseaman1957
        oldseaman1957 27 January 2018 14: 58
        +2
        Quote: New
        Everything is elementary: a homing system is put on the shell.

        - Without pants, we will remain your prayers. There is probably a computer guidance system that summarizes everything (speed-altitude-lead, etc.) And the shells are somewhere on the level of ordinary ones.
      3. zadorin1974
        zadorin1974 27 January 2018 15: 16
        +1
        New good with vigorous battery
    2. figwam
      figwam 27 January 2018 14: 50
      +9
      Most likely, the shell is detonated at the desired range and the target is covered with shrapnel and splinters.
      1. Ratmir_Ryazan
        Ratmir_Ryazan 27 January 2018 14: 54
        +1
        And how can this be calculated by a missile fired from a MLRS ?! Moreover, the MLRS fires as a rule in one gulp and from several BMs ?!
        1. PSih2097
          PSih2097 27 January 2018 15: 05
          +1
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          And how can this be calculated by a missile fired from a MLRS ?! Moreover, the MLRS fires as a rule in one gulp and from several BMs ?!

          I don’t think that I will take any similar systems from Grad, but Smerch, Hurricane and Tornado, which are long-range, are very complete, but we don’t forget that such an installation alone does not work + a rate of 120 fps, yes and a projectile most likely with radio detonation.
          1. Dreamboat
            Dreamboat 27 January 2018 15: 28
            +2
            It is surprising that the possibility of setting obstructive fire on the flight path of a projectile / rocket is 57 mm. the gun is in doubt, and everyone believes in the American small-caliber C-RAM. By the way, the Germans in their system decided to use generally 152 mm. howitzers.
            The notorious "rate of fire" for remotely detonated shells is needed only to ensure the delivery of a larger mass of explosives and fragments to the point of intersection of the trajectories (and taking into account the duration of the volley, even for very rapid-firing systems, the indicated point must be adjusted).
            The rate of fire of small-caliber air defense systems is important for NOT detonated shells - there it provides the necessary density of fire, and dispersion compensates for flaws in aiming.
        2. figwam
          figwam 27 January 2018 15: 25
          +8
          To do this, he has a guidance system, but of course she will not be able to work against a volley.
          1. Vadim237
            Vadim237 27 January 2018 19: 54
            +1
            She just lacks the Willow containers.
        3. Piramidon
          Piramidon 27 January 2018 15: 48
          +3
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          And how can this be calculated by a missile fired from a MLRS ?! Moreover, the MLRS fires as a rule in one gulp and from several BMs ?!


          Of course, it will not work to calculate a column on a piece of paper, for this a computer serves. The trajectory of the RS is calculated, the projectile from the cannon is detonated along the flight path of the rocket and a cloud of fragments meets it. Like that.
          1. figwam
            figwam 27 January 2018 17: 22
            +2
            Here are the Yankees experiencing.
            1. Dreamboat
              Dreamboat 27 January 2018 23: 06
              0
              This is different (although the principle is the same), look at C-RAM. Already a lot of videos have been posted, they are faster at times, it looks prettier ...
        4. Grigory_45
          Grigory_45 27 January 2018 16: 24
          +2
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          And how to calculate this on a missile fired from MLRS

          MLRS shell flies along a BALLISTIC (i.e. predicted) trajectory, does not make maneuvers. Enough "quick-fire" computer will calculate the path for one or two. How do missiles aim at supersonic aircraft? Or, all the more, for warheads? There, too, the MSA of the complex calculates the tractor
          1. Ratmir_Ryazan
            Ratmir_Ryazan 27 January 2018 23: 41
            0
            Have you seen a volley of hail at all ?! The trajectory is ballistic, but projectiles fly above the ground at a low altitude and the time from a shot to a target’s strike is a second, a maximum of a minute ... What do you compare with a plane that can be detected hundreds of kilometers from air defense systems and it’s not a shell that is guided and aimed at him ... And what will this derivation generally detect with shells? She that the radar was hidden somewhere, something is not visible ... Maybe you see? The same Shell also has a radar station and it shoots a missile by giving a volley of shells, in fact a swarm of 30-mm shells to meet a missile shell, a high density in any way hooks something ...

            Then the navigator in the car hangs for a few minutes, can’t calculate the road, and you think that there is some kind of system that is capable of sowing a hail rocket and so calculate everything that can get into it with a 57 mm shell? ))))))))))))))))))))
            1. Grigory_45
              Grigory_45 28 January 2018 01: 00
              +2
              Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
              What do you compare with an aircraft that can be detected hundreds of kilometers from air defense systems?

              Firstly, the comparison with the aircraft was only in the sense that the LMS of the air defense system is capable of calculating the estimated flight path of the aircraft and SAM and bring them together. If this can be done by the CMS "Shell", for example, why is it incapable of making the CMS "Derivations"? Moreover, you yourself agree that the missile trajectory is ballistic. That is predicted. The task of calculating the anticipated meeting point of ZAK shells and the Grad shell, for example, is not particularly difficult.

              Defeat - naturally, not a direct hit. 57-mm, especially single-barrel, corny lacks rate of fire to create the required density of fire. there is only one option - shells with remote detonation, their fragmentation field.

              Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
              She has that the radar is hidden somewhere, something is not visible

              Not her radar. Optics only. In principle, the only problem for such ZAK with a passive detection system is target designation. Here, of course, they take doubts that Derivation will be able to independently find and manage to fire at a high-speed low-flying target. As it could not really do "Shilka" and the more so ZSU-57-2. External target designation required
    3. Genry
      Genry 27 January 2018 16: 10
      +2
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      I don’t understand how she does all this ?! How to get into a missile or air-to-surface missile from a 57-mm gun?

      How to shoot down planes (you can also use rockets) using a cannon on a caterpillar chassis is shown in the passage below. True technique of the times of the 2nd world ...
      1. ustinov.yuri
        ustinov.yuri 27 January 2018 21: 06
        0
        What the hell!
    4. Grigory_45
      Grigory_45 27 January 2018 16: 21
      +1
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      How to get into a missile or air-to-surface missile from a 57-mm gun?

      It's all about the MSA (fire control system) and ammunition - they must be either remotely detonated or adjusted (controlled). To put a shell directly hit this ZSU rate of fire is not the same.
      1. Ratmir_Ryazan
        Ratmir_Ryazan 27 January 2018 23: 46
        0
        How will this Derivation even detect these missiles from hail ?! Do you see her radar ?! About remote detonation, and even on the path of missiles of a hail of 57 mm shell, this is generally fantastic ...

        It’s one thing here to lay out infantry shooting, to which you can measure the distance with a range finder and to program a fuse and a very different combing flying missile at low altitude and try to do something with it there ...

        From this derivation, you can only get into the MLRS missile in one case, shoot at the MLRS itself before it gives a salvo))))))))))))))))))))))
    5. Genry
      Genry 27 January 2018 22: 43
      0
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      I don’t understand how she does all this ?! How to get into a missile or air-to-surface missile from a 57-mm gun?

      Guided projectile:

      Read more information:
      https://kbtochmash.ru/press-center/articles/artic
      les_26.html

      (remove the gap)
      1. Ratmir_Ryazan
        Ratmir_Ryazan 27 January 2018 23: 53
        0
        Well, that’s all theory for now, but where to see in practice how from a 57-mm cannon they get into a rocket from MLRS ...
        1. Genry
          Genry 28 January 2018 13: 20
          +1
          Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
          Well, this is all theory,

          There is such a kind of people who do not know anything, and then authoritatively declare that it is “all theory”.
          And they call such people "school."
          1. Ratmir_Ryazan
            Ratmir_Ryazan 28 January 2018 20: 49
            0
            I am a military pensioner, and you?
            1. Genry
              Genry 28 January 2018 21: 42
              +1
              I’m not military and retired, about ten years later, I’m going to.
  3. KVU-NSVD
    KVU-NSVD 27 January 2018 14: 50
    +4
    to destroy air targets such as unmanned aerial vehicles, cruise missiles, air-to-surface missiles, tactical aircraft, and fire support helicopters.
    For UAVs, it’s quite possible, but for the rest it’s unlikely. Density of fire at long ranges is small.
  4. Herculesic
    Herculesic 27 January 2018 14: 59
    +1
    For effective fire, she needs to have paired machine guns, and accordingly, paired trunks!
  5. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 27 January 2018 15: 02
    +3
    The gun is dashing! For helicopters, UAVs and attack aircraft - that’s it! The missile is much cheaper than a rocket, and the installation has a passive detection and aiming system. So, it can crash unexpectedly from an ambush. Surely good calculators are, all sorts of amendments are made when aiming. And on land, if that is a very powerful tool. wassat
    1. Separ DNR
      Separ DNR 27 January 2018 15: 20
      +8
      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      Surely good calculators are, all sorts of amendments are made when aiming. And on land, if that is a very powerful tool.

      I’ll tell you that KPVT BetaRa is not a gift for the infantry, but here - 57 mm. And since the rate of fire is obviously high, then: "save, who can" yes .
  6. Rusland
    Rusland 27 January 2018 15: 07
    10
    The second time there is a review on this topic, all the same questions and fortune-telling, we are waiting for the third and next descriptor of the topic.
  7. HEATHER
    HEATHER 27 January 2018 15: 12
    +6
    Our names have to be thought out in the corporate event! Soon, "Deviation ..." will also appear. Then - “Analysis” and “Sykerization”. It's really not a flower garden. There are other names. The more powerful the weapon, the more affectionately they call it. Well done! Especially the White Swan ...
    1. MIKHAN
      MIKHAN 27 January 2018 15: 39
      +2
      Quote: VERESK
      Our names have to be thought out in the corporate event! Soon, "Deviation ..." will also appear. Then - “Analysis” and “Sykerization”. It's really not a flower garden. There are other names. The more powerful the weapon, the more affectionately they call it. Well done! Especially the White Swan ...

      Soon there will be the name "Tolerance" (something will be launched into space soon ..)
      Nuclear submarine Donbass, etc. soldier
  8. groks
    groks 27 January 2018 15: 23
    +1
    They would have already written that the bullets were knocked down, which is nothing to trifle about. If the rocket is on the active site, then it will be visible in optics, then it’s up to the electronics and guidance drives. So you can bring down. If in the Second World War our mortar gunner shot down a German plane with a second shot, then why not bring down the rocket with Derivation.
  9. san4es
    san4es 27 January 2018 15: 32
    +4
    2C38 combat vehicle is made on the basis of BMP-3 and is designed to destroy air targets
    soldier

    September 2015
    1. Grigory_45
      Grigory_45 27 January 2018 17: 42
      +4
      BMP "Derivation" and ZSU "Derivation of air defense" - different machines. Although their base (BMP-3) and the gun are the same
      1. san4es
        san4es 27 January 2018 18: 17
        +1
        Quote: Gregory_45
        ... ZSU "Derivation of air defense

        ... There was this topic earlier:

        ... the detection range through one of the television channels of the Bird Eye 400 type unmanned aerial vehicle in the overview mode is 700 m, in the narrow field of view - 4900 m. The A-10 attack aircraft will be visible in the first mode already at a range of 6400 m, and in the second - at 12 300 m
        Optoelectronic detection and aiming system of the OEC OP developed by Peleng OJSC (Minsk), installed on a 2C38 combat vehicle of a self-propelled anti-aircraft artillery complex in the Derivation-PVO OKR
        The thermal imaging channel allows you to detect targets with a size of 2,3 x 2,3 m with a probability of 80% at a distance of 10 m and recognize them at a distance of 000 m. hi
        I rolled my comment repeat :
        https://topwar.ru/133393-aviabazu-hmeymim-mogla-b
        y-nadezhno-prikryt-zsu-2s38-derivaciya-pvo.html
  10. Herculesic
    Herculesic 27 January 2018 15: 33
    +3
    Do we have our own optics of this class? I have nothing against Belarusians, but what will we do if Lukashenka shows us the muzzle from under his elbow and turns his back completely on Russia, towards the European Union ???
    1. Grigory_45
      Grigory_45 27 January 2018 16: 58
      +2
      Quote: Herkulesich
      And we do not have our own optics of this class

      There is such a thing as competencies. They have been working with "Bearing" for a very long time, on various topics, and established ties. Their sights are on the BMP-3, T-72/90 tanks. The sight for a combat vehicle is not only optics, it is optoelectronics) The optics themselves are also made at LOMO and Shvab
  11. svp67
    svp67 27 January 2018 15: 36
    0
    The detection range through one of the television channels of a small unmanned aerial vehicle such as Berd Eye 400 in the overview mode is declared at 700 m
    And now let's look at a small unmanned aerial vehicle such as Berd Eye 400 in the overview mode declared at 700 m


    Wingspan, m 2.20
    Length, m 0.80
    Maximum speed, km / h 83
  12. Dreamboat
    Dreamboat 27 January 2018 15: 44
    +3
    That’s a weapon in the BMPT Terminator, instead of 2x 30 mm. And local air defense tasks can be solved (especially if you add a couple or four Verba containers to ATGMs), and remotely detonated shells of this caliber will work perfectly against infantry (+ the range of fire will increase), and when solving the issue of selective nutrition, 57 mm armor-piercing. shells can very well fight light equipment and promising robots on the battlefield. winked
    And then 30 mm. guns are very smushchart for efficiency. repeat
    1. Grigory_45
      Grigory_45 27 January 2018 17: 04
      +1
      Quote: Dreamboat
      And then 30 mm. guns me very smushchart on efficiency

      For high-speed automatic guns, it has long been proven that a caliber of 40 mm is optimal. It’s not without reason that the Bofors rapid-firing gun has been living and not going to die for more than 80 years - the optimal combination of projectile power, rate of fire, mass and transportable ammunition.

      For manpower it is better to have an automatic grenade launcher. Type "Balkan"
      1. Dreamboat
        Dreamboat 27 January 2018 23: 18
        0
        Well you say ....
        1. "For a quick-firing automatic gun, it has long been proven that the caliber of 40 mm is optimal. It's not for nothing that the Bofors quick-fire has been living and not going to die for more than 80 years," the most common caliber of fast-firing guns in the world are 25 and 30 mm. 40 and 60 were used only for air defense. But this is due to the difficulties of production in the early stages (some for medium artillery did not master the automatic loader
        1. Grigory_45
          Grigory_45 28 January 2018 00: 46
          +1
          Quote: Dreamboat
          the most common caliber quick-fire guns in the world are 25 and 30 mm. 40 and 60 were used only for air defense

          That's it, that in the air defense, there they just proved their worth. Especially against kamikaze and diving. One or two shells were usually enough to turn a single-engine aircraft into trash. The Americans and the British very quickly threw 20-mm Oerlikons and 28-mm “Chicago pianos” from the decks of ships, replacing them with a 40-mm “Bofors”.
          1. Markedly increases the firing range and reach in height, with a sufficiently high rate of fire. On a cartridge of 40 mm it still does not fall as much as, for example, by 57 mm, at the same time the power of the projectile remains at a height. And the dimensions of the cartridge are not so large so that the carrying ammunition is not critically reduced.
          2. A projectile with a caliber of 30 mm or less is very, very problematic to equip with electronics - at least for the same remote detonation. And so that there is still room for explosives in the shell. All small-caliber are designed only for a direct hit. This is a huge expense of ammunition.
          3. 40 mm BOPS very good gnaw armor. None of the existing infantry fighting vehicles can resist them.
          4. 40-mm OFS is much more powerful than stunted 25- and 30-mm shells. This can be traced both to the guns and to the caliber of the AGS - all switch to 40 mm.

          Now there is a trend just to increase the caliber of automatic guns. See for yourself. 20 mm no one is addicted. 25 mm too. Even 30 mm guns begin to give way to 35 and 40 mm guns. All promising infantry fighting vehicles - with 40 mm guns. In fact, this is the "golden caliber"
  13. bald
    bald 27 January 2018 15: 45
    0
    Much is not clear, the best thing is to send to Syria, then you will not have to argue and guess.
  14. Antidote
    Antidote 27 January 2018 15: 53
    +1
    How much can, maybe coffee brews?
  15. da Vinci
    da Vinci 27 January 2018 15: 57
    +1
    Flies and cutlets must be separated:
    if BMP - good
    if air defense -
  16. Chichikov
    Chichikov 27 January 2018 16: 22
    0
    The rate of fire - 120 shots per minute.
    Full ammunition - 148 shots.
    It may be good, but only for fireworks!
    1. Golovan Jack
      Golovan Jack 27 January 2018 16: 56
      +6
      Quote: Chichikov
      Rate of fire - 120 rounds per minute. Full ammunition - 148 rounds.
      It may be good, but only for fireworks!

      That's what ... I'll tell you a terrible secret right now:
      Here was such a Shilka, 4 x 23 mm, 3400 rds / min., 2000 ammunition.
      Also, perhaps, "for salutes"? stop
      1. ARES623
        ARES623 27 January 2018 18: 48
        0
        Quote: Golovan Jack
        Also, perhaps, "for salutes"?

        Today, the 23 mm caliber is frankly weak for a reliable defeat of both Apache and Thunderbolt at maximum ranges. So today Shilka is not very good for fireworks ... Exclusively for the destruction of basmachs in the open and camel caravans. Modern armored personnel carriers, infantry fighting vehicles of a probable enemy are already too tough for her.
        1. Golovan Jack
          Golovan Jack 27 January 2018 18: 51
          +5
          Quote: ARES623
          So today Shilka is not very good for salutes ...

          If you did not pay attention, the discussion above focused on ammunition, rate of fire, and their ratio.
          Therefore your
          Quote: ARES623
          Today, the 23 mm caliber is frankly weak ...

          ... here frankly "not at the cash register."
          1. ARES623
            ARES623 27 January 2018 21: 30
            0
            Quote: Golovan Jack
            ... here frankly "not at the cash register."

            You asked, "There was such a Shilka, 4 x 23 mm, 3400 rds / min., 2000 ammunition.
            Also, perhaps, "for salutes"? stop "I expressed my opinion about Shilka. If you cannot formulate a question in accordance with your internal requests, then you, sorry, have a problem with the logic of expressing your thoughts. You need to train ...
            1. Golovan Jack
              Golovan Jack 27 January 2018 21: 33
              +4
              Quote: ARES623
              You asked...

              ... not with you. You climbed in to answer, and you got "off topic."
              More questions?
              PS: About the reasons why Shilka removed their weapons, I am aware.
              1. ARES623
                ARES623 27 January 2018 21: 48
                0
                Quote: Golovan Jack
                ... not with you. You climbed in to answer, and you got "off topic."

                You brought the question into the public space, so get it. No offense....
  17. Captain Nemo
    Captain Nemo 27 January 2018 17: 33
    0
    Interestingly, if it consumes b / c in a minute with a little, then how long does it take to load
  18. tchoni
    tchoni 27 January 2018 17: 36
    0
    The A-10 attack aircraft is detected in the first mode already at a range of 6400 m, and in the second - at 12 300 m.
    sho in the first, sho in the second mode, the a10 attack aircraft has already come out of the attack, and the crew of the woodwork needs to urgently look for a Mayverik or a helper flying in them)))
    1. Grigory_45
      Grigory_45 27 January 2018 18: 53
      +1
      Quote: tchoni
      sho in the first, sho in the second mode, the a10 attack aircraft has already left the attack, and the crew of the woodwork needs to urgently look for a Mayverik or a helper flying in them

      Well, Maverick is a separate song. The use of these missiles during the Gulf War in 1991 revealed insufficient interference immunity of television and thermal imaging seekers. In this regard, the verbal name of the rocket, translated as "tramp", was ironically interpreted as very suitable for such weapons.
      The only modification that does not suffer from these defects - laser-guided - requires illumination before it hits the target, which means either a ground spotter or the aircraft dreamed of maneuverability. And the Maverick flies long enough - its speed is not much higher than that of the A-10.
      Hellfire is more complicated, but in the end it’s the same thing - the attack aircraft is guaranteed to fall into the zone of destruction of the ZSU - it is not a helicopter, it cannot launch a missile from a hovering position and immediately turn around.
      Moreover, in both cases - this is if the pilot launches a rocket from maximum range, i.e. will know for sure that the ZSU is at this particular point. I wonder how he finds out?

      Undoubtedly, for the receiver ZSU attack aircraft are not a priority goal - this is the lot of air defense systems. But even without a trace for an attack aircraft such an attack may fail.
      1. tchoni
        tchoni 28 January 2018 06: 06
        0
        come on you. According to Maiveric, American land investigators reported 90% of hits for a desert storm. Marines - 60% Quite worthy. Hafaire is, of course, a separate topic, but, nevertheless, it is quite feasible. Moreover, there is a time difference between “discovered” and “struck”.
        1. Grigory_45
          Grigory_45 28 January 2018 23: 14
          +1
          Quote: tchoni
          According to Maiveric, American land investigators reported 90% of hits for a desert storm. Marines - 60% Quite worthy.

          ... and also reported on almost all the intercepted Scuds and almost none of the lost Abrams lol
          but no, there was still "by mistake" "shot" his armored personnel carrier and crumbling British. Moreover, missiles were launched not from extreme distances, for targets that could not answer. With a view through the “head” of “Maverick” it is generally extremely problematic to shoot from a long distance. On paper, everything looks dignified, in real life there are “ravines”. Well, 60% - of course, a very high indicator for "precision" weapons
  19. Strashila
    Strashila 27 January 2018 18: 02
    0
    Now all this in the tower allows you to install various types of dynamic and active defenses on the tank chassis. That will be the case. Perhaps a seditious offer ... to cross it with the Pine complex ... add a couple of rockets.
  20. Wolka
    Wolka 27 January 2018 18: 19
    0
    an amusing but miracle fly swatter
  21. XXXIII
    XXXIII 27 January 2018 19: 19
    +2
    Modular all such drinks hi
    The 2C38 combat vehicle is equipped with an optoelectronic detection and aiming system for the OES OP, developed by the Minsk OJSC Peleng.
    Our ally .... fellow
    A new anti-aircraft artillery system with a 57-mm gun is being developed in Russia. This was announced on Thursday by the head of the air defense forces, Lieutenant General Alexander Leonov. “To replace our Tunguska and Shilka systems, we are developing a promising anti-aircraft artillery system in 57 mm caliber,” Leonov said

  22. Sedoy
    Sedoy 27 January 2018 21: 16
    0
    The maximum range of destruction - 6 km.
    The maximum height of the lesion is 4,5 km.
    The rate of fire - 120 shots per minute.
    Full ammunition - 148 shots.


    for air defense something faded everything ...
    especially ammunition - 148 shots ..
    and most air attackers will not even enter the affected area:
    range of defeat - 6 km. lesion height - 4,5 km
    and they will attack from distant positions - an example is our aviation in Syria
    as for
    shoot down multiple rockets of multiple launch rocket systems

    then with such ammunition it’s hardly ...
    1. Grigory_45
      Grigory_45 27 January 2018 22: 33
      +1
      Quote: Sedoy
      for air defense something faded everything

      Air defense is different. Specifically, this thing - for the destruction of cheap flying debris, such as UAVs, on which missiles (even MANPADS, which, moreover, "do not take" some types of UAVs) are expensive to plague.

      Quote: Sedoy
      range of defeat - 6 km. lesion height - 4,5 km

      same as MANPADS

      Quote: Sedoy
      and they will attack from distant positions - an example is our aviation in Syria

      against such targets, there are normal air defense systems. You do not expect the air defense system to be able to do everything all at once?

      Quote: Sedoy
      shoot down multiple rockets of multiple launch rocket systems
      then with such ammunition it’s hardly ...

      Why? It all depends on the SLA. And from the shell. Direct hit - of course, unlikely. And with remote detonation - it’s quite for yourself.
  23. Ratmir_Ryazan
    Ratmir_Ryazan 27 January 2018 23: 56
    0
    Until I see how this system knocks a rocket from hail, at least one - I won’t believe it !!!
  24. aszzz888
    aszzz888 28 January 2018 03: 35
    +2
    Anti-aircraft mount also capable of shooting rockets of multiple launch rocket systems,

    ... a serious request, although the 57th is the caliber, it was necessary to reanimate it for a long time !!!