Military Review

"General forward"

64



His military career began in World War I. He went from private to marshal. Service in the royal army lasted just over a year. Soviet Armed Forces given 55 years.

In the civilian thugs Kolchak, fought in Transbaikalia and the Far East. At the exercise in 1927 in the Moscow Military District, then his commander Boris Shaposhnikov admired Konev's regiment so much that immediately after graduation he said to him: “You have the makings of troop driving, it is felt that you can become a master of maneuver.”

In 1934, he graduated from the special department of the Military Academy named after MV Frunze. With the release it was noted: "... the academic course has mastered perfectly and is worthy of being promoted to the post of commander and commissioner of the rifle corps."

Konev commanded a regiment, division, special group of troops in Mongolia, the 2-th Separate Far Eastern Army, and troops of the Trans-Baikal and North-Caucasian military districts. In July, 1938 was given the rank of com-commander, in March, 1939 was commander of second rank.

With the beginning of the German invasion, Lieutenant-General Konev led the 19 Army. The first combat test was the Smolensk defensive operation. The skillful actions of the commander predetermined his promotion. Since 12 September 1941, Colonel-General Konev heads the Western Front. And soon he was appointed commander of the newly formed Kalininsky.

It is from the actions of the troops of this front on December 5, 1941 that the counterattack phase of the Moscow battle begins. Marshal Vasilevsky, then the deputy chief of the General Staff, subsequently testified that Konev showed good intuition, skillfully combined the power of artillery and aviation with the speed, onslaught and suddenness of the blow, he strove to see the battlefield with his own eyes, carefully prepared the operation.

On the dramatic days of December 41, the advantages of the com-front listed by Vasilevsky predetermined the victory over the troops of the 9 German army, the return of Kalinin, the rapid approach to the Rzhevskiy ledge.

Significant event in stories Steppe Front under the command of Konev - the battle of the Kursk-Oryol arc. “Stepnyaks” fought and won under Prokhorovka, August took Belgorod 5, Kharkov took 23. 26 August 1943, the year the commander became an army general.

Due to the fact that the theater of operations on which the formations of the Steppe Front operated, began to coincide with a part of the territory of Ukraine, it was renamed and in the fall of the 1943, the history of the 2 of the Ukrainian Front began. Important milestones of his combat path are the Pyatikhatskaya, Znamenskaya and Kirovograd operations.

The real triumph for Konev was the participation of front troops in the Korsun-Shevchenkovsky operation. He was opposed by Field Marshal Manstein, who had the reputation of being a military genius of the Reich, a master of encirclement. Konev took the troops entrusted to the German into the ring and at the same time did everything so that he had no reason to suppose that the Red Army had plans for a strategic offensive operation. Once surrounded, Manstein hoped for a miracle, looking for gaps. There was a moment when it seemed to him that a solution was found. But no, Konev again drove Manstein into a corner. There, where the German planned the breakthrough site, the 5th Guards quickly advanced tank army, whose soldiers showed miracles of heroism in the battle of Prokhorovka.

After the Korsun-Shevchenko 20 operation in February 1944, Konev became the Marshal of the Soviet Union.

The first two months of 1944 in the spring were conducted by the Uman-Botoshan offensive. The 8-I German army was crushed in it, the Soviet troops liberated a significant part of Right-Bank Ukraine, and Moldova. 26 March 1944, Konev's troops were the first to cross the Soviet border and enter the territory of Romania.

A month later, with a little Marshal received a new appointment - to command the 1-m Ukrainian Front. The summer Lviv-Sandomierz operation 1944 was outstanding both in design and execution. As a result, the final point in the battle for Ukraine was set, the enemy was expelled from southeastern Poland, and strong control was established over the strategically important Sandomir bridgehead.

The contribution of Ivan Konev, who in the troops was called “the general forward”, is not limited to the liberation of Europe. The brilliant victories in the Vistula-Oder, Berlin and Prague operations are connected with his name. 57 times Moscow saluted the troops, which led the commander. His military genius largely predetermined the outcome of the Lower Silesian and Upper Silesian operations. The opening of the monument to Konev in 1987 in Krakow was quite logical. But after a few years, local authorities will disgrace to the whole world, dismantling the monument.

1-th Ukrainian Front also distinguished itself during the Carpathian-Dukla operation. Note that in modern Czech Republic, no one talks about the dismantling of the monument to Konev. They pay tribute to his role in the liberation of the country from the Nazis.

Twice a Hero of the Soviet Union, Marshal Konev for many years held high positions in the control system of the Soviet army, was a member of the CPSU Central Committee, deputy of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR.
Author:
Originator:
https://vpk-news.ru/articles/40596
64 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must to register.

I have an account? Sign in

  1. Cartalon
    Cartalon 30 December 2017 07: 00
    +5
    Since September 12, 1941, Colonel General Konev heads the Western Front. And soon he was appointed commander of the newly formed Kalininsky.
    And what happened between these events, the story is silent.
    We take the wonderful reference book The secrecy stamp is removed. There, for each front, the average daily losses and the strength of the front at the beginning of the operation are indicated and it is easy to find that the brilliant Marshal Konev per thousand people of the initial composition always has the highest losses.
    1. 210ox
      210ox 30 December 2017 07: 41
      +5
      The directions in which he commanded were always the most difficult ... To take the same encirclement near Vyazma .. He miraculously escaped the fate of captivity (like General Lukin, we bow to him, he’s a brave man) and execution (like General Pavlov). Next, the Rzhev operation. .About it, everything is clear in the sense of losses. He pulled upon himself the large forces of the Wehrmacht during the Battle of Stalingrad, practically without support .. So he could not do without large losses Unfortunately, although he really was often too hot. .
      Quote: Cartalon
      Since September 12, 1941, Colonel General Konev heads the Western Front. And soon he was appointed commander of the newly formed Kalininsky.
      And what happened between these events, the story is silent.
      We take the wonderful reference book The secrecy stamp is removed. There, for each front, the average daily losses and the strength of the front at the beginning of the operation are indicated and it is easy to find that the brilliant Marshal Konev per thousand people of the initial composition always has the highest losses.
      1. Cartalon
        Cartalon 30 December 2017 08: 24
        +1
        Only he and the Berlin operation put more Zhukov, this is a system.
        1. dSK
          dSK 30 December 2017 16: 31
          +4

          Marshal Konev Ivan Stepanovich, an honorary citizen of the city of Belgorod, which he released. On our street Konev installed his bust, there are always flowers.
        2. badens1111
          badens1111 30 December 2017 18: 39
          +2
          Quote: Cartalon
          Only he and the Berlin operation put more Zhukov, this is a system.

          These are your errors.
          Look where, how and in what conditions his troops acted.
          1. Cartalon
            Cartalon 31 December 2017 07: 39
            0
            In the same as the troops of the neighbors, but his losses are always higher.
            1. badens1111
              badens1111 31 December 2017 10: 43
              +3
              No.
              If you operate on the "facts" from here, then you do not understand ANYTHING in the war.
              https://sapojnik.livejournal.com/2413585.html
              And this is a crutch for you, for correction, a poisoned historical memory.
              http://www.sovross.ru/articles/375/6209
    2. 210ox
      210ox 30 December 2017 18: 36
      +3
      Do you think that in that terrible war it was possible to defeat a strong and cruel enemy with little blood? And history is silent about it ... The armies of the Western Front were encircled and destroyed. And this is not Konev's fault, this is the strategic mistake of the General Staff.
      Quote: Cartalon
      Since September 12, 1941, Colonel General Konev heads the Western Front. And soon he was appointed commander of the newly formed Kalininsky.
      And what happened between these events, the story is silent.
      We take the wonderful reference book The secrecy stamp is removed. There, for each front, the average daily losses and the strength of the front at the beginning of the operation are indicated and it is easy to find that the brilliant Marshal Konev per thousand people of the initial composition always has the highest losses.
      1. Cartalon
        Cartalon 31 December 2017 07: 40
        +2
        Somehow, other front coms managed to incur smaller losses, of course not Pavlov’s trial, but Konev well done.
        1. 210ox
          210ox 31 December 2017 07: 50
          +3
          If you don’t believe me, take books on the Great Patriotic War and read who and under what conditions. Only God spare reading Ouspensky ... I do not say that he was "brilliant." But the fact that the armies he commanded were at the very edge of the strike or often performed the role of a cover as in the same Kalininsky. They were in slightly different conditions. Here you are wrong. Pro Pavlov was brought to justice ... Koneva was saved by Zhukov. And that would have been a bullet in his forehead.
          Quote: Cartalon
          Somehow, other front coms managed to incur smaller losses, of course not Pavlov’s trial, but Konev well done.
    3. Ham
      Ham 15 March 2018 10: 39
      0
      Well, Konev’s only for the Vyazemsky catastrophe when 600000 were taken prisoner could be shot ... Zhukov saved him
      but of course this is one of our outstanding military leaders, and at 41 they all looked bad
  2. moskowit
    moskowit 30 December 2017 07: 00
    +3
    Marshal Konev an outstanding commander! His life and deeds deserve a deeper analysis and wide coverage than the set of general phrases in this weak article ....
    1. Chichikov
      Chichikov 30 December 2017 07: 51
      0
      Do you offer to submit material "wider and deeper"? Then it is necessary, on April 22, to place at Lenin the full assembly of Lenin?
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. Chichikov
          Chichikov 30 December 2017 13: 47
          +1
          On the account of what the materials were in the early years of VO, I completely agree! But, apparently, you won’t get it back anymore ...
        2. MOSKVITYANIN
          MOSKVITYANIN 2 January 2018 13: 26
          0
          Quote: moskowit
          If you, my dear, are satisfied with this kind of information about an outstanding person, then it’s good ... And my opinion is that by publishing such weak materials, a reputable site degrades and loses its well-deserved reputation ....

          What is the problem write your article more extended, at the same time write the ratio of losses of the Red Army and the Wehrmacht based on the results of the operations led by Konev ....
          1. badens1111
            badens1111 2 January 2018 13: 28
            +2
            Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
            at the same time write the ratio of losses of the Red Army and the Wehrmacht based on the results of the operations led by Konev.

            And what will it give you? For what is this fuss for you?
            The result is one, May 1945, the entire Wehrmacht is in captivity, the combat losses of the armies are almost equal, what are you trying to discuss here?
            1. MOSKVITYANIN
              MOSKVITYANIN 2 January 2018 14: 15
              0
              badens1111 combat losses of armies are almost equal

              Sober up, then we'll talk ...
              For a long time in the USSR they did not talk about direct irretrievable losses of the Red Army. In private conversation Marshal Konev in 1962 year called the number 10 million people
              In view of the foregoing, throwing back the deliberately understated and overstated estimates of losses, we obtain: Krivosheev’s commission - 8,7 million people (with prisoners of war 11,994 million data of 2001 g.), Maksudov - losses even slightly lower than official ones - 11,8 million people. (1977 −93 gg.), Timashev - 12,2 million people. (Xnumx). The opinion of M. Harrison can also be included here, with the level of general losses indicated by him, the losses of the army should fit into this period. These data were obtained by various calculation methods, because both Timashev and Maksudov, respectively, did not have access to the archives of the Ministry of Defense of the USSR and Russia. It seems that the losses of the USSR Armed Forces in the Second World War lie very close to such a “heap” group of results. Let's not forget that these figures include 2,6 – 3,2 million destroyed Soviet prisoners of war.

              https://topwar.ru/11444-poteri-sssr-i-germanii-v-
              vov.html
              Losses of the Wehrmacht and SS troops
              The Third Reich sun lost about 5,6-6 million people during a campaign to the East. According to these calculations, the irretrievable losses of the Armed Forces of the USSR and the Third Reich (without allies) are correlated as 1,3: 1, and the combat losses of the Red Army (data from the team led by Krivosheev) and the Armed Forces of the Reich as 1,6: 1.

              see there ...
              Source (so you do not rage once again) site ....
              Let's analyze any operation of the Second World War, which was led by Konev ....
              For example, as indicated in the article
              The real triumph for Konev was the participation of front troops in the Korsun-Shevchenkovsky operation.

              Here is the operation itself, we are interested in the outcome of it:
              Korsun-Shevchenko operation
              Losses of the parties
              Soviet troops lost for all reasons during the operation 80 188 people, including 24 286 killed, dead and missing. Losses in armored vehicles are estimated from 606 to 850 tanks and self-propelled guns. During the period from January 20 to February 20, the 1-th Ukrainian Front lost 1 711 guns and 512 mortars, and the 2-Ukrainian - 221 guns and 154 mortars, but not all of these losses (especially the 1-th Ukrainian) are attributable to Korsun-Shevchenkov operations.

              The losses of the encircled German troops amounted to approximately 30 thousand people, including about 19 000 killed and captured. The combat losses of the units and formations of the 1 Tank Army during the 1-20 of February amounted to 4 181 people (804 killed, 2 985 wounded, 392 missing). The combat losses of the 7th Army Corps for January 26-31 amounted to approximately 1 000 people. The losses of the 8 Army on the outer front of the encirclement for January 20 - February 20 amounted to approximately 4 500 people. Losses in armored vehicles amounted, according to Frankson and Zetterling, to the order of 300 tanks and assault guns, of which about 240 were on the outer front of the encirclement, and about 50 were inside the boiler. However, the last number contradicts the number of tanks and assault guns inside the boiler, given above. Accordingly, according to the Russian researcher A. Tomzov, the losses were higher, namely about 320 cars.

              http://www.encyclopaedia-russia.ru/article.php?id
              = 788
              1. badens1111
                badens1111 2 January 2018 15: 18
                +2
                Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
                Sober up, then we'll talk ...

                Well, if you're drunk, then what are you muttering here?
                The irrevocable losses of the USSR Armed Forces in the Second World War constitute 11,5 - 12,0 million people irrevocably, with the actual combat demographic losses in 8,7 – 9,3 million people. The losses of the Wehrmacht and the SS troops on the Eastern Front are 8,0 - 8,9 million people irrevocably, of which purely combat demographic 5,2 – 6,1 million (including those who died in captivity) people. Plus, the losses of the German Armed Forces on the Eastern Front need to add the losses of satellite countries, and this is neither more nor less than 850 thousand (including dead in captivity) people killed and more than 600 thousand prisoners. Total 12,0 (the greatest number) million vs. 9,05 (the smallest number) million people
                The logical question is: where is the "filling up with corpses," about which Western, and now domestic, "open" and "democratic" sources speak so much? The percentage of dead Soviet prisoners of war, even by the most benign estimates, is no less than 55%, and the German, by the largest, no more than 23%. Perhaps the whole difference in casualties is due simply to the inhuman conditions of prisoners?
                This is from your own link.
                But what have the private operations that you brought to justify your babble?
                Then what do you bother me with a link to some kind of muddy source?
                This, as is consistent with your calculations, “on February 17, 1944, the entire encircled group of Nazi troops ceased to exist. As a result of fierce fighting, the Germans lost 55 thousand killed and over 18 thousand prisoners. 40423 Germans managed to escape. Our irreversible losses amounted to 24 people. Only the troops of the 286nd Ukrainian Front captured: 2 aircraft, 41 tanks and self-propelled guns, 167 field guns of various calibers, 618 mortars, 267 machine guns, 789 thousand cars, 10 steam locomotives, 7 wagons and tanks, 415 tractors and other trophies. " http://www.opoccuu.com/127 .htm
                So who has the loss and what?
                1. The comment was deleted.
                  1. The comment was deleted.
                    1. The comment was deleted.
      2. wax
        wax 30 December 2017 18: 06
        +2
        Actually, the Red Army owes its birth to Lenin,
        1. MOSKVITYANIN
          MOSKVITYANIN 2 January 2018 14: 17
          0
          Quote: Wax
          Actually, the Red Army owes its birth to Lenin,

          And she owes her victories primarily to former officers and generals of the Imperial Army ...
          1. badens1111
            badens1111 2 January 2018 15: 21
            +2
            Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
            And she owes her victories primarily to former officers and generals of the Imperial Army.

            Loud, but not smart. With their victories over you, the white rabble and the Entente, the Reds owe their will and ability to drive you out at that time, and the talent of that part of the officers and generals of the Republic of Ingushetia who did not go against the people, unlike you, the rabble different serving the interests of ANTANTA at that time.
            1. The comment was deleted.
              1. The comment was deleted.
          2. Prosha
            Prosha 4 January 2018 11: 53
            0
            All victories are achieved by heroism and perseverance SOLDIERwho clearly and in a timely manner fulfills the orders of his commander and correctly evaluating the situation takes the necessary initiative. And all your fabrications about the former are lobud! You need to properly shoot and prick with a bayonet at the right time.
            1. MOSKVITYANIN
              MOSKVITYANIN 4 January 2018 13: 00
              0
              Prosha
              All victories are achieved by the heroism and stamina of the SOLDIER

              There is a saying: "Generals win wars, and soldiers lose" .....
              1. Prosha
                Prosha 5 January 2018 16: 44
                +1
                Strange sayings at you, what school did you attend? Wars have always been won by soldiers. Not a single general can do anything without a soldier, it has always been like this, it may always be the role of a soldier with robots, but before that a lot of soldier’s blood will be shed ...
                1. KVIRTU
                  KVIRTU 5 January 2018 21: 08
                  0
                  Stupidity at headquarters breeds heroism in the trenches. Every army knows this.
                  Man did not serve, apparently.
              2. Alexander Greene
                Alexander Greene 7 January 2018 14: 07
                0
                Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
                There is a saying: "Generals win wars, and soldiers lose" .....

                That's right: "Soldiers rent cities, generals take them!"
        2. Prosha
          Prosha 7 January 2018 08: 03
          0
          The Red Army owes its appearance only to the prevailing circumstances, and Lenin or someone else is not so important anymore.) The template worked here - they hurried, dispersed, got, sorted out - it was necessary to rebuild.
          1. Alexander Greene
            Alexander Greene 7 January 2018 14: 20
            0
            Quote: Prosha
            Here the template acted - they hastened, dispersed, received, sorted out - it was necessary to rebuild.

            Dear, you are wrong with your template, everything is done according to theory: a bourgeois state is an apparatus of violence in the hands of those in power, the socialist revolution, in order to resist, must destroy the old organs of power and create new ones. And this was done, the control apparatus was replaced by soviets and executive committees, the old army was replaced by the rebel armed people (Red Guard), so it would have remained, this was enough to suppress the counter-revolution, but since the military started immediately after the revolution intervention, it was necessary to create a regular Red Army to protect the already socialist state.
            1. Prosha
              Prosha 7 January 2018 21: 14
              0
              These are not my templates. the workers' state has no enemies, because the proletariat of all countries is one by nature and the workers of other countries will not fight with their like, which means that the army is not needed .... something like that, however this is not a serious justification and my remark was about that anyone could be in place of Lenin, there could be any signature on the decree - circumstances forced us - we have no disagreement about this -....
              after the revolution, military intervention immediately began, it was necessary to create for protection
  3. parusnik
    parusnik 30 December 2017 07: 41
    +5
    Army General S.M. Shtemenko, in his book "General Staff during the War," writes about Konev: "In military circles, Konev always enjoyed a reputation as a firm and decisive commander. Many of us envied his energy and activity in a good way. any circumstances, he sought to see the battlefield with his own eyes and carefully prepared each operation. Trying to delve into all its details, Ivan Stepanovich literally drove his subordinates into a sweat. "
  4. bistrov.
    bistrov. 30 December 2017 08: 46
    +3
    Marshal Konev, according to eyewitnesses, had great self-conceit; in matters of military strategy he considered himself infallible, although, for the sake of justice, we must admit that he really knew how to organize work on the site assigned to him.

    He was also sharply jealous of Zhukov’s national fame, and in this matter he considered himself undeservedly bypassed.
    1. moskowit
      moskowit 30 December 2017 11: 07
      +3
      And he did not envy the popular love and glory of JV Stalin ??? When Konev was the commander of the army, of whom there were (commanders) a hundred or more, during the whole Great Patriotic War ... Zhukov was a representative of the Stavka, of whom there were only a few ... Is there a difference? ....
    2. Proxima
      Proxima 30 December 2017 14: 56
      +3
      Quote: bistrov.
      He was also sharply jealous of Zhukov’s national fame, and in this matter he considered himself undeservedly bypassed.

      Or maybe you don’t need to envy, but just be grateful to George Konstantinovich, who saved him in the 41st from the fate of General Pavlov? Konev's military operations resembled a pendulum - successful alternated with failures.
  5. cannabis
    cannabis 30 December 2017 08: 47
    +3
    Directly tears of tenderness evoke the words "see the battlefield"! Yokarn Babai, a frontal offensive operation has a range of up to 400 km along the front and the same depth. Duration over 20 days. What can you see from the Front from the observation post at the forefront? That's right - the front is 3 km and 2 km in depth. And we hear such an assessment from the Chief of the General Staff! This is the work of the regiment, climbing the front end, and a normal division commander must constantly be in the advanced battalions in order to feel the rhythm of the battle.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. badens1111
          badens1111 30 December 2017 19: 26
          +1
          Quote: cunning
          Give us one

          Just send you to BUSV h1.
          1. cannabis
            cannabis 30 December 2017 19: 32
            +2
            You advise you to read the Combat Charter of the Airborne Forces, where in one paragraph you will find the instructions for the actions of the Airborne Brigade and a separate paratrooper. Laugh! The combat charter is written for those who themselves do not know how to act.
            1. badens1111
              badens1111 30 December 2017 20: 03
              0
              Quote: cunning
              Laugh! The combat charter is written for those who themselves do not know how to act.

              Well, yes .. of course, it is written in blood ......... you will understand who. Yes, and your cries clearly indicate that you are not engaged in military operations, ensuring them ,..was on another resource , he screamed as he “fought” at the castle-and-door plant, the staffs and commanders interfered with him .. but in fact .... ZERO.
              So learn something so as not to look so awkward.
              1. cannabis
                cannabis 30 December 2017 20: 14
                +4
                Empty words. Our military manuals are read in all military schools of the world. And they are well aware of their content. So, in order not to be beaten, you need to make decisions not on the basis of the charter, but as the situation tells us and the capabilities of equipment and weapons allow. At one time I read the field charters of the US Army, and so there is a specific set of stamps. Why did the Israelis beat the Arabs, because they knew how our advisers would advise. Where our advisers acted outside the statutes, the Israelis suffered losses. My tactics teachers at the time were officers who returned from the Arab-Israeli war. So the best combat charter is practice. Now about what the Charter is "written in blood." One is the charter of garrison and guard duty.
        2. Alexander Greene
          Alexander Greene 30 December 2017 19: 43
          +2
          Quote: cunning
          And we hear such an assessment from the Chief of the General Staff!

          Inspired by the association.
          Fabulist: Ah yes hell, knowing is strong, since he criticizes Marshal Shaposhnikov!
          Common man: And no matter what, Marshall has one star in pursuit and one hemp in one right!
          1. cannabis
            cannabis 30 December 2017 19: 53
            +1
            In his youth, he reread the brain of Shaposhnikov’s army a couple of times. Beautiful, with a claim to rivalry with Clausewitz. But when he finally "got" to Army General Ivanov and read the initial period of the war, he realized that Shaposhnikov was simply explaining Stalin’s plan. And as a result - the defeat of the personnel of the Red Army. Regarding the stars on the shoulder straps - the difference between Major and Colonel is 8 kopecks, how much two stars on shoulder straps cost. Most stars on the captain's shoulders - 12 on each shoulder (shirt, tunic, overcoat)
            1. Alexander Greene
              Alexander Greene 30 December 2017 20: 54
              +2
              Quote: cunning
              But when he finally "got" to Army General Ivanov and read the initial period of the war, he realized that Shaposhnikov was simply explaining Stalin’s plan.

              In order to criticize Marshal Shaposhnikov it is not enough to read General Ivanov, for this you need to have at least the Academy of the General Staff and the corresponding experience in commanding the troops.
              1. cannabis
                cannabis 30 December 2017 21: 34
                +3
                Since the General Staff Academy appeared in Russia, its army and navy began to lose the war and in the end it fell apart. Neither Suvorov, nor Rumyantsev, nor Kutuzov studied at the Academy. An independently thinking person does not need diplomas as "certificates of the mind." They said in our infantry: "The Academy does not give mind, it gives temporary knowledge and a float that will not allow you to drown." You probably have a lot of experience in command and control. Which regiment was commanded?
                1. Alexander Greene
                  Alexander Greene 30 December 2017 22: 26
                  +2
                  Quote: cunning
                  A self-minded person does not need diplomas as “certificates of intelligence”

                  With these words, you reminded me of the infamous Victor Rezun, who likewise showed his self-confidence and superstition. I have an engineering and technical staff, so I respect knowledge very much.
                  Quote: cunning
                  They said in our infantry: "The Academy does not give a mind ...,

                  And after these words I have the feeling that you were commanded there: "Hay - straw!", "Hay - straw!"
                  1. cannabis
                    cannabis 31 December 2017 07: 25
                    +2
                    I don’t know your age and level of professionalism, but the lack of argumentation and the set of speech turns to a conclusion - I read the “teasers” of an unreasonable schoolboy at best or a computer resonator on a salary, and even I don’t try to talk an opponent to gather information. As the sailor Volodya from the movie Red Square said: "How stupid it characterizes you!"
                    1. badens1111
                      badens1111 31 December 2017 10: 44
                      +1
                      Quote: cunning
                      unreasonable schoolboy at best

                      Cool you characterized yourself. But just why?
                    2. Alexander Greene
                      Alexander Greene 31 December 2017 13: 08
                      +1
                      Quote: cunning
                      How stupid that characterizes you! "

                      It’s just that you need to be more modest, because if you criticize one of the great ones, this does not mean that you are also great, but rather the opposite.
                      1. cannabis
                        cannabis 31 December 2017 13: 28
                        +2
                        Alien! And who are you to advise me how to think, what to say and how to act? Who are you to give grades to someone? There is something to say on the topic - say it, but nobody is interested in reading your obsessive nonsense. About such, my grandmother said: "I stuck like a bath sheet to my ass." Everything is free ....
                      2. Alexander Greene
                        Alexander Greene 31 December 2017 15: 47
                        +2
                        Quote: cunning
                        Who are you to give grades to someone?

                        And who are you to criticize Marshal Shaposhnikov? To do this, you need at least a level of training how to have it, and judging by your statements, you are a self-confident upper guard, "you didn’t study at academies."
  6. captain
    captain 30 December 2017 19: 06
    +5
    It is good that we had more people than Germans. And then they would have reached Vladivostok. With such great generals.
    1. Alexander Greene
      Alexander Greene 30 December 2017 19: 47
      +3
      Captain: It is good that we had more people than Germans. And then they would have reached Vladivostok. With such great generals.

      Also inspired by the association.
      Fabulist: Ah yes captain, strong to know, since he criticizes Marshal Konev!
      Common man: And no matter what, Marshall has one star in pursuit and one captain in the captain’s!
      1. cannabis
        cannabis 30 December 2017 21: 36
        +3
        With military knowledge, my friend is a disaster! The captain in the Russian army had a pure epaulette, without stars.
        1. Alexander Greene
          Alexander Greene 30 December 2017 22: 14
          +2
          Quote: cunning
          With military knowledge, my friend is a disaster! The captain in the Russian army had a pure epaulette, without stars.

          And you see, I didn’t understand anything. I compared the real marshal stars Shaposhnikov and Konev with your fake stars (“major under the nickname Konoprav” and “major general under the nickname captain”), “assigned” in this forum, so that readers pay attention to the difference between the values ​​of the critics and those who criticizes.
          1. Prosha
            Prosha 30 December 2017 23: 32
            0
            to the topic - slightly different things of the BUSV all units and the operational command and control of the troops, the organization of interaction of all forces and means of the army and the front. Your dispute is about nothing you neither understand nor argue about, you were especially touched by the mention of the General Staff Academy and I suspect that the rest of the higher military schools are meant ... Well, gentlemen, you will go far ...
            1. cannabis
              cannabis 31 December 2017 07: 43
              +2
              Well, well done - I came, saw, inherited! I have seen enough of your graduates of the General Staff Academy, who, in the period of threat, set the border cover regiment to defend one kilometer from the border, and even after 30 km of advancement with the entire regiment overcoming the only bridge across the Elbe. To me personally, one of the graduates of your Academy set the task to occupy the line not at the height, on the crest of the ridge or at the return line, but in the lowland before the height, and even in the forest with the ability to observe no more than 50 meters. And this is the BMP-2 battalion with a range projectile flight 13 and a half kilometers. So: well, well, scratch your chest ...... organizing the interaction and the fire system.
              1. badens1111
                badens1111 31 December 2017 10: 51
                +2
                Quote: cunning
                To me personally, one of the graduates of your Academy set the task to occupy the line not at the height, on the crest of the ridge or at the return line, but in the lowland before the height, and even in the forest with the possibility of observation no further than 50 meters.

                This only speaks of the complete inappropriateness of that officer, who for nothing had taken someone else's place at the General Staff Academy.
                But not about the meaning of BUSW as such, there is no mention of requirements there, like the requirements of your absolute ignoramus with an academic badge.
                1. cannabis
                  cannabis 31 December 2017 11: 17
                  +2
                  Combat manuals are textbooks! They are needed only for learning the basics, as well as the "commander's box" or boxing paws. No experienced commander carries Charters with him. NO! Because his work is the work of a Russian stove - to burn logs of situation data with his mind and issue his decisions in the form of ashes of commands. I allow my last phrase to be outlined.
              2. chenia
                chenia 31 December 2017 18: 27
                +1
                To start. Happy New Year.
                Further, Konoprav you are wrong. BU as you need to know the notes, but what kind of melody you squeeze out is from talent and experience.

                Quote: cunning
                during the threatened period, the regiment's frontier protection regiment was tasked with taking up defense one kilometer from the border, and even after 30 km of extension with the entire regiment overcoming the only bridge across the Elbe.


                Where's the jamb?
                The regiment in the security zone, is being nominated as threatened (this is not the beginning).
                The task is to prevent the breakthrough to the crossing and the capture of the bridgehead by the enemy before the deployment of the main forces.


                Quote: cunning
                He set the task to occupy the line not at a height, on a combat crest or on a return line, but in a lowland in front of a height, and even in a forest with the possibility of observing no more than 50 meters.


                Even if the task is to organize defense over the spillway, (as I understand the graduate -division commander and set the task clearly not platoon (regiment, or at least a battalion), then there are a lot of options for creativity both on the front and in depth, and if the BO, then a couple more kilometers of depth, see BUS "Defense in the Forest".

                In general, then arable "accuracy" always impressive.
            2. badens1111
              badens1111 31 December 2017 10: 49
              +1
              Quote: Prosha
              Prosha

              Prosh, BUSV h 1, for those who do not understand, determines the conduct of hostilities by the commander from the division commander and above.
              And this is a crutch for you, so that you would "remember2 that besides BUSV 2,3, there is something else, I won’t decrypt it; I’ll wait for a little to figure out why these books were written.
              BUSV-89 h. 2 (battalion, company)
              BU Airborne Forces-84 h. 2 (battalion, company)
              BUA-89 (division, battery, platoon, gun)
              PS and UO-83 (division, battery, platoon, gun)
              1. Prosha
                Prosha 31 December 2017 14: 51
                0
                Well, in general, Bushes 2 and 3 can be read by everyone and sundry, and I can agree that for a normal commander, what he was taught for 4-5 years does not require constant peeping into the textbook, but here is 1 part (division, brigade, regiment ) a rather specific volume and has always been secret literature and was not always even in secret parts, so it raises doubts about
                Our military manuals are read in all military schools of the world.

                Happy New Year ! Good luck, health and wisdom!
  7. Dimmih
    Dimmih 31 December 2017 13: 12
    0
    Quote: captain
    It is good that we had more people than Germans. And then they would have reached Vladivostok. With such great generals.

    We also had General Moroz, General Dirt and battle mice gnawing electrical wiring in fascist tanks. Well, really, read Arthur Clark or anyone else on this subject. Yes, the same Manstein with Guderian. By the way, they disagree with you, and call the reason for their loss exclusively Hitler, and not at all the great extent of the territory of the USSR and the number of residents. It’s better for them to see the Manstein-Guderian than you, they personally saw this war and sniffed gunpowder.
    1. MOSKVITYANIN
      MOSKVITYANIN 2 January 2018 13: 23
      0
      And that dirt and frost only caused difficulties for the German army?
  8. Dimmih
    Dimmih 4 January 2018 13: 21
    +2
    Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
    And that dirt and frost only caused difficulties for the German army?

    Judging by the memoirs of Manstein, Guderian, yes, only to them. And ours moved through the mud like a biblical character on the water.
  9. Nemesis
    Nemesis 4 January 2018 20: 10
    0
    And yet others won the war ... Such as General A.V. Gorbatov ...
  10. Freeman
    Freeman 5 January 2018 13: 33
    0
    Quote: Nemesis
    And yet others won the war ... Such as General A.V. Gorbatov ...

    There is a more radical opinion
    “It was not the generals who won the war; the colonels won it.”
    L.I. Brezhnev


    painting "Colonel Brezhnev at the forefront"