Military Review

Future machine THOR A1

76
The number of different options for a handgun weapons striking in its diversity, and the more you begin to learn about various interesting and unusual designs, the stronger becomes the understanding that an unusual and experimental weapon is just a huge amount and it is simply impossible to cover everything. Of course, everyone who knows the weapon at least a little bit is aware of the weapons that were made at least for the demonstration. But how many more interesting ideas are left on paper?


This “paper” weapon should not be treated with disdain, because the fact that a machine gun or pistol with a non-standard design was not produced does not mean that the structure itself is not viable. Often a person has a bright head full of the most daring and useful ideas, but he cannot realize them due to the lack of his own skills in working with his hands or in the banal absence of the necessary materials and tools. Legislation is also a serious stopping factor. It remains only to knock on all closed doors, which, most often, remain closed, and the designer acquires the status of a local jester.

Future machine THOR A1


For the sake of justice, it should be noted that not everyone understands, for the sake of weapons with slightly superior characteristics, no one will do anything. A lot of unrecognized geniuses, whose proposals were rejected due to the fact that a couple of percent of the improvements in one or another of the parameters are not worth the increased costs of production. They are trying to improve their own weapons and ammunition, develop their own unique designs, but the result is only time spent and frustration.

Even in spite of the fact that modern inventors do not need to sit in the library for hours, do each calculation manually, redo blueprints ten times and try to make at least some resemblance of a final product layout from wood, about new talented gunsmiths "from the people" Can not hear. Nevertheless, they exist, although now, more often than not, they are designers and artists.

Let's try to evaluate the work of one of them, namely, to get acquainted with the machine gun, which exists only in digital form and in it, the fastest will remain.

History nonexistent machine THOR A1

Information about the new machine appeared in 2014 year, many online entertainment resources posted not only images of the new weapon, but even its characteristics. Nobody reported anything about the origin of the “weapons of the future”, neither the designer’s name nor the company that was going to release this novelty to the market was known. However, it soon became known that the new machine is nothing but a simple idea and beautiful drawings of a young designer from Germany, so it was necessary to make an addition to all materials on this weapon, that it was not real, as well as its characteristics.



If we consider the design of the weapon itself, it becomes clear that the person loves and is interested in firearms, since most of the solutions that are used in the machine gun are rare, but not new. At the same time, it is possible to notice that a person did not attend to an in-depth study of the design of various types of weapons, since individual units are not worked out, and some simply will not work in the form that was proposed. In other words, a concept was developed, not a finished product, prepared at least for the assembly of an experimental sample.

Ergonomics and appearance of the machine THOR A1

Talking about the appearance, as well as the ergonomics of weapons, the lesson is not the most rewarding, because everyone has different tastes, and ease of use is determined rather by habit and a reasonable arrangement of controls within the capabilities of the human hand. However, something needs to be highlighted.

If we talk about the appearance, then I think many will agree with me, a beautiful, elegant weapon, but not for field operation. The point is not even that dirt can get stuck somewhere or individual elements will be inconvenient when held. It’s just that a truly full-fledged, mass-produced military weapon for mass weapons does not have a single extra bulge that would not carry any particular function in the operation or production of these weapons. In this case, you can observe the good work of the designer and the milling machine headache. By the way, the author proposes the receiver to be made of titanium alloy, which in itself causes a smile.



Despite the fact that the appearance of the machine THOR A1 is more suitable for a fantastic action movie or a computer game, some solutions are very sensible. First of all, you need to pay attention to the controls of the weapon. The fuse switch is located in front of the release button, that is, the automatic release of the circuit breaker takes place literally in a fraction of a second, while the palm of the hand does not move anywhere and does not make unnecessary movements. The switch of fire modes is located at a more familiar place for automata - above the handle to hold the hand holding the thumb. The switch itself is duplicated on both sides of the weapon. It is separately noted that the ejection of the spent cartridge case can be configured both on the left and on the right side of the weapon, although this moment is not worked out and how this switching can be realized incomprehensibly, since there are several options.

A separate advantage of the machine is to highlight the fact that even with a folded butt the weapon remains fully functional. Speaking of the butt. The butt itself is not just an emphasis for firing; it is supposed to place weapons care products in the butt. For us, this is more likely a routine or even an obligatory phenomenon, but judging by comments from abroad, many consider such a decision almost revolutionary, apparently unaware that it was used in weapons that are older than the Great October Socialist Revolution.

The additional handle to hold a weapon causes a question, it seems to someone an integral part of a modern weapon, this additional handle is inconvenient and unusual for someone, but the main thing in it is that it is not removable. That is, the machine loses the ability to install even a flashlight, not to mention the grenade launcher. It would be much more sensible to place an attachment bar under the barrel that allows you to install exactly what an arrow needs on a weapon.



But on the entire length of the receiver is a mounting plate for sighting devices. The weapon does not have its own non-removable pillar and front sights; instead, convenient gunners are installed instead. On the one hand, this is convenient, if desired, you can install what you are used to, especially the rear sight and front sight do not interfere with the addition of an optical or collimator sight. In practice, the open sights will obviously be forgotten. And they will begin to remember about them when more sophisticated aiming devices fail, and the weapon becomes useless.

Well, the most important thing that catches your eye is a curved, transparent weapon shop, which is adjacent to the machine from the back of the receiver. If you look at this detail objectively, it is obvious that such a store has both advantages and disadvantages only from the side of ergonomics, not to mention the technical side of the issue. An obvious plus is its capacity in 50 cartridges, plus the fact that the amount of ammunition is convenient to control and the balance of the machine does not change as the cartridges are spent can be considered a plus. Minus is the procedure for changing the store. In principle, you can get used to anything, once and dulnozarynym weapons used and did not complain. However, when changing a box magazine, you need to relate the store only with its upper part to the receiver; in the case of the THOR A1, the store should enter not only the receiver, but also the slots from the back of the handle to hold. That is, in a stressful situation, the store can be installed incorrectly with a bias, and this is the time spent on its proper installation, and if something else breaks or sticks ... In general, in order to take advantage of the store with a larger capacity, you need a long and hard to train in his replacement, up to automatism.

The design of the machine THOR A1

Machine THOR A1 has not only a remarkable appearance, but not the most common design. To be honest, there is nothing revolutionary in the design of weapons, separate solutions were used in various models, nevertheless, no one collected all this together in one weapon.



Given the not quite conventional design of weapons, you need to immediately understand the designations of individual parts. In the original, the red part on the animation of the weapon is labeled as a shutter; blue as a slide frame; green as a dust cover. I propose to call the green detail as a slide frame. A blue mark as a feeder.

You need to start with the cartridge supply unit from the magazine to the chamber, as well as the reasons why it will not work in this form. Due to the location and design of the magazine, the cartridges in it are located perpendicular to the axis of the barrel of the weapon, therefore, in order to feed the cartridge into the chamber, it must be rotated 90 degrees. In general, the problem is quite solvable, but in this case it is somewhat more complicated. As can be seen from the animation of the automatic weapon system, the rotation of the cartridge is implemented similarly to the ZB-47 submachine gun, but in this case the cartridge is much longer than the pistol and is located down the bullet. That is, gravity plays against such a system of turning the cartridge, which means that the cartridge during rotation should be firmly fixed. If, however, it is not fixed, then at some point it will simply be rested against a bullet and figure out, rather than turn by 90 degrees. How will the fixation of the cartridge is not shown.

After the cartridge is rotated 90 degrees, the feeder (blue detail on the animation of the automation system) picks it up and places it coaxially to the barrel channel, so that the shutter can send the shutter to the chamber. The interaction of the entire bolt group is carried out using protrusions and grooves in detail, which hints at the sensitivity of the weapon to contamination, temperature extremes, and so on.

The shutter itself moves not in a straight line, but in an arc, which, in the opinion of the author of this work, should have a positive effect on recoil in firing. It is difficult to argue with this statement, but looking at the dimensions of the bolt carrier, it is easy to guess that it will weigh a lot, but this frame moves along the usual straight line. The only thing that really justifies such a shutter device is the implementation of the supply of cartridges, since the shutter leaves the ammunition supply line.



Automation weapons, apparently built on the removal of powder gases from the barrel and their use to actuate the bolt group of weapons. It is precisely because the powder gases act on the green part, I propose to call it a slide frame, and not a casing to protect against dust. It is a little unclear how the barrel bore is locked, since changes in the trajectory of the bolt are clearly not enough for normal work with relatively powerful ammunition. The fastest blocking of the bore is due to the interaction of the blue part with the bolt carrier and the bolt. It is not clear how this happens, and the author of the design is unlikely to have thought through this moment in detail.



A separate advantage is the air barrel cooling system. So the bolt carrier, in the course of its movement, should perform the function of a pump that will capture cold air from the muzzle end into the receiver and release it already pleasantly and warmed in the face by the shooter from the back of the weapon. How pleasant it is, when a warm breeze blows in your eyes especially when aiming, we will not argue. But as it seems to me, if the weapon overheats when firing, then there is a shoal of the shooter or, more rarely, a designer.

Pros and cons of the machine THOR A1

The main advantage of the machine is its increased capacity store, but you need to understand that changing the store with this design is more difficult, not to mention the significant complication of the design of the weapon to be able to power from such stores. Assumptions that recoil when firing will be softer due to the fact that the bolt moves in an arc can hardly be considered true, since the slide frame moves in the same way as in common weapon models, and the bulk of the moving parts . The advantages include a reasonable and convenient arrangement of controls and the fact that they are available both when held with the left and when held with the right hand.

The main drawback of weapons is the complexity of its design and the implementation of the interaction of the elements of the bolt group. Since there are only two springs in the design (combat and return), everything is connected with the help of protruding elements and grooves in which they move. Accordingly, the weapon is very sensitive to pollution and lubrication depending on the ambient temperature and even a large mass of moving parts will not save the situation. Of course, everything can be done with huge gaps, so that the machine guns out like a rattle, but then the life of the weapon will diminish, not to mention the reliability of the supply of ammunition.

Conclusion


Of course, the gun THOR A1 weapon is very interesting in its design. In general, any non-standard and unusual designs have the right to life. Even if they are not applied here and now, they can be applied or taken as a basis in the future. In the extreme case, such constructions show how to do it is not necessary, which also has some benefit, because it is better to learn from the mistakes of others.



As mentioned above, there is nothing new in the weapon itself; all the solutions were somehow implemented in other samples. In other words, everything that the author of the design seemed most interesting was collected in the THOR A1 submachine gun. As a result, the design is interesting, but unnecessarily complicated.

Is it possible to implement all this in metal and bring it to more or less acceptable results at work? In my opinion, everything is completely realizable, but what the final cost it will pour out, it remains only to guess. At the same time, the weapon has only one clear advantage - a larger magazine. So even a person like me, who loves everything unusual in weapons and even somewhat perverted, admits that two stores with tapes look more profitable than the THOR A1 machine gun. Apparently, this is the main reason why these weapons are of interest only to Internet users, and not to the manufacturers of weapons.



Despite this, it should be noted that the work of the author of this concept is worthy of respect. In the end, not everyone can combine even ready-made ideas in one design. Let the individual nodes are not worked out, the design itself has a lot of problems and such a weapon will be “golden” in production, but the person spent his time, painted really beautiful pictures that many accepted as real and existing machine guns. At the same time, it is necessary to take into account the fact that the author is not a gunsmith, but a designer who is only interested in firearms. At the same time, there are a lot of people with education who either sit on their pants for years, or put their diploma on the shelf and work in another specialty. It is terrible to imagine what kind of “vandervafli” would have been developed by this designer with the appropriate education, knowledge and opportunities.
Author:
Photos used:
fishki.net
76 comments
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  1. bunta
    bunta 27 December 2017 07: 12
    12
    Concept concept, but a store of this design, with such an arrangement of cartridges will not work. Even in principle.
    1. igordok
      igordok 27 December 2017 08: 09
      +6
      Yes, and carrying, and storage of such arcuate shops is difficult.
    2. Dead duck
      Dead duck 27 December 2017 14: 32
      15
      Quote: bunta
      Concept concept, but a store of this design, with such an arrangement of cartridges will not work. Even in principle

      Of course, there was no Shosh machine gun ... after all, in principle, it cannot be
      1. bunta
        bunta 27 December 2017 16: 09
        +7
        And you compare the cartridges in geometry, their number in the store and location. And determine how the feed force from the cartridge to the cartridge is transmitted at what place on the sleeve.
        1. Dead duck
          Dead duck 27 December 2017 16: 25
          +6
          The principle of operation (and appearance) is important.
          The cartridge there may be different, as well as the fact that the materials have changed over the century.
          Yes, and the picture is a picture. There is much pure beauty done.
          "Steyr AUG" is still not all accept for weapons. request
          1. dokusib
            dokusib 28 December 2017 11: 33
            +2
            The Shosh machine gun just had big problems with the supply of cartridges.
      2. Simargl
        Simargl 31 December 2017 00: 17
        0
        Quote: Deadush
        Of course, there was no Shosh machine gun ... after all, in principle, it cannot be
        So what?
        If the AK magazine is increased to 300 rounds - the same thing will happen - the rounds do not unfold before being snapped out.
        1. Dead duck
          Dead duck 31 December 2017 11: 30
          +4
          Quote: Simargl
          atrons do not unfold before leaching.

          You, somewhere in the dialogs about the reversal of cartridges found words?
          About the form was.
          It is clear that the cartridge will not be deployed just like that, and if it is, it will not be reliable.
          "Millennia years ago" came up with super-slip coatings and materials ... the cartridges would fly out with a "whistle".
          Happy New Year.
          1. Simargl
            Simargl 31 December 2017 12: 41
            0
            Quote: Deadush
            You, somewhere in the dialogs about the reversal of cartridges found words?
            .
            "Millennia years ago" came up with super-slip coatings and materials ... the cartridges would fly out with a "whistle".
            AlexMark provided the video - there the "mechanics" are shown ...
            Just the cartridge turns around 100 degrees.
            The cartridge snatches ... just for the place that should be lubricated.
            If you miss the store, the cartridges will be remembered.
            ***
            Happy New Year!
    3. AlexMark
      27 December 2017 17: 57
      +6
      If you do not rotate the cartridge in the middle as suggested here, but with the seizure of the liner at the bottom, you can lead to a working variant, but there are several negative moments. The mechanism itself, which will turn the ammunition will stick with a hump, either on the store or on the weapon. If, during the turn, the cartridge finds something to catch, then at best the whole thing will stick, at worst the bullet will jump out of the cartridge request And all this is done only in order to feed the weapon from the shops with a capacity of 50 cartridges, do you need such difficulties?)

      Here is the animation of the proposed work of automation. And I repeat once again that this is just a concept, and not a valid model of a weapon, even though its performance characteristics are present, which were apparently taken from the ceiling.
      1. Dead duck
        Dead duck 31 December 2017 11: 33
        +4
        Quote: AlexMark
        but there are a few negative points.

        In any case, the nuna will apply the reversal mechanism, because it relies on maybe lower.
        And rotary mechanisms have been used for a long time ... current is not reliable all ... request
        1. Simargl
          Simargl 31 December 2017 12: 45
          0
          In G-11, with the reliability of the mechanism itself, everything seemed to be normal.
          The problem is that with long continuous firing, the cartridges self-ignite.
          1. Dead duck
            Dead duck 31 December 2017 14: 23
            +5
            Count it up to date! yes
            The more complex the mechanism, the more likely it is to break.
            1. Simargl
              Simargl 31 December 2017 15: 35
              0
              In fact, self-ignition did not occur through the fault of the mechanism, but through the fault of the cartridge (combustible sleeve). This is the problem of all sleeveless ones: when firing intensively, the chamber heats up. By the way, not only the manual one - the guns have the same thing.
    4. Jerk
      Jerk 6 August 2018 01: 33
      0
      And how do you imagine yourself stuffing such a store in the field stop
  2. inkass_98
    inkass_98 27 December 2017 07: 52
    +7
    Neither from an ergonomic nor from a constructive point of view such a prodigy is adapted to life.
    The store and the method of supplying cartridges delivered especially. I’m not a techie, but even it’s obvious to me that such an arrangement of cartridges in a store is wrong, and as a practical user it would be absolutely not convenient for me to use such weapons. Well, there are a lot of architectural excesses, including even a pistol grip. In weapons of this type, almost all structural elements must carry a certain functionality.
    Z.Y. And it’s painted beautifully, I don’t argue.
    1. Jedi
      Jedi 27 December 2017 10: 40
      +8
      I fully share your opinion, I will add: the more complicated the more unreliable. Thanks to the author for the article about an interesting flight of engineering! hi
  3. dok123
    dok123 27 December 2017 08: 02
    13
    Automatic haute couture ... You cannot say otherwise ...)))
    I directly represent two gays - corporals, in a trench, one asks the other:
    - What color of the store are you going to attack today?
    )))
  4. omit
    omit 27 December 2017 08: 43
    +6
    Not an article, but solid guesses. To be honest, I didn’t understand anything. The author of the article also knows nothing, so there’s nothing to do with writing. The most frequently mentioned expression is “Apparently”.
    1. AlexMark
      27 December 2017 16: 38
      +4
      This machine is not even made as a model, it’s a concept, so to speak, some nodes are absolutely not worked out, hence the frequent use of “apparently”. And then I keep quiet laughing
    2. Raphael_83
      Raphael_83 27 December 2017 18: 48
      +2
      Quote: omit
      Not an article, but solid guesses

      What do you have to guess ?! The author tried to analyze how such an aggregate would work if it existed in nature, being embodied in metal and plastic. And the content of the article repeatedly indicates the obvious fact that it is more a design than an engineering concept! So do not throw labels (especially since you seem to be looking diagonally at the material), especially in relation to a person who has been noted more than once by worthy reviews and reasoning. You can do it better - do it, otherwise there’s nothing to talk about! stop
      1. Grid
        Grid 28 December 2017 15: 10
        0
        And the content of the article repeatedly indicates the obvious fact that it is more a design than an engineering concept!

        But why this concept is needed?
        You can do it better - do it, otherwise there’s nothing to talk about!

        Baby, “concepts” I can do to hell and more, and such that your glamorous awareness does not even dream of, what's the use of this?
        1. AlexMark
          28 December 2017 17: 29
          +3
          Well here you are not right a little. Any idea has a right to exist, even if a similar “vundervafl” machine does not go into production, another designer will look at it, find something for itself, draw conclusions. Even if these conclusions fit into the phrase “it is not necessary to do so”, there is also a benefit from this, the person will not waste time thinking in the wrong direction. Somehow it works, or rather should work.
          Well, if you have the opportunity to create - create smile Out of a thousand ideas, at least one can "shoot" and improve your contribution to the development of weapons business and improve your financial situation if the idea is worthwhile.
          1. 4thParasinok
            4thParasinok 12 January 2018 20: 56
            0
            Quote: AlexMark
            Well, if you have the opportunity to create - create
            get acquainted with the Code of Criminal Procedure for starters, it prohibits the creation of weapons if you do not have an extra lemon bucks and connections in the FSB-MVD. And anyone can masturbate on the image of the blue dream, so the children will not be born from this.
            1. AlexMark
              20 January 2018 05: 23
              +1
              Quote: 4-th Paradise
              Meet the Code of Criminal Procedure

              Is there a mention of production somewhere?
              1. 4thParasinok
                4thParasinok April 13 2018 21: 54
                0
                Quote: AlexMark
                Is there a mention of production somewhere?

                Duck, then why bother writing this? Personally, I can’t understand what is the point of such creativity except getting money for an unwanted job? Admit you get paid for every comment? If so, then I will write the same on the forum, money will not hurt me ...
                1. Grid
                  Grid April 14 2018 03: 23
                  0
                  Personally, I can’t understand

                  Consider it beyond your comprehension. Bo has not yet matured.
                  1. 4thParasinok
                    4thParasinok April 18 2018 16: 29
                    0
                    Quote: Grille
                    Consider it beyond your comprehension. Bo has not yet matured.

                    laughing On the contrary, it grew over another 35 years ago ... It was then that I understood the difference between anan ** mom and a woman. But that doesn't seem to be your way. repeat
                    1. Grid
                      Grid April 19 2018 08: 08
                      0
                      On the contrary, it grew over another 35 years ago ... It was then that I understood the difference between anan ** mom and a woman.

                      How young are you ...
        2. Soho
          Soho 9 January 2018 05: 10
          +2
          Grille December 28, 2017 15:10 p.m.
          Baby, "concepts" I can do to xren and more

          lover of "yakat" - do it first, and only then show off. And then there are many such "in one fell swoop seven beatings" ...
          1. Grid
            Grid April 16 2018 10: 20
            +1
            lover of "yakat" - do it first, and only then show off.

            Baby, laurels of Shpakosky, I’m clearly not in size. And what he did, what he did not ... I have not yet been imprisoned, but you don’t need to know.
            1. Soho
              Soho April 16 2018 11: 39
              +1
              Grille (Vyacheslav) Today, 10:20
              I have not yet been imprisoned

              it is understandable, articles in the Criminal Code for idle talk are not yet provided laughing
              1. Grid
                Grid April 16 2018 15: 28
                0
                baby, this is clinical ...
                1. Soho
                  Soho April 17 2018 06: 12
                  +1
                  daaaa? .... that something did not meet precedents that for medical reasons canceled a preventive measure No. can change, but cancel no. But in the case of a verdict that has already entered into force, they may, on the basis of Art. 81 of the Criminal Code can be released from punishment in connection with a disease, such as mental illness. Hmm ... now everything has become clear to you laughing
  5. alex-cn
    alex-cn 27 December 2017 08: 47
    0
    If not star wars, then close to that. The same unlikely fantasy. You can probably do it, but it won’t really work.
    1. igordok
      igordok 27 December 2017 10: 02
      +2
      The more practical FN P90 appeared in later Stargate series. In the first series featured MP-5. And this PP can really get Star Wars.
  6. Spez
    Spez 27 December 2017 09: 03
    +3
    I agree with the first commentator. The cartridge simply will not be able to leave the store, no matter what levers and guides are present there. In the opposite position (bullet out), it may still be somehow possible to contrive to turn the cartridge into the working position. But as shown in the figure - only if you point with your finger. Why not just use the bent magazine with a pistol feed through the handle? A second problem may arise due to the short spring. The first cartridges will be “crammed” into the chamber with excessive force, and the latter, God forbid, if at all squeezed out of the store.
  7. Operator
    Operator 27 December 2017 09: 08
    +1
    With this arrangement (the maximum rear position of the store with the weight changing during shooting), the balance of the weapon will be violated as the ammunition is used up with a corresponding loss in accuracy / accuracy of fire.
  8. groks
    groks 27 December 2017 10: 56
    +2
    If you deploy cartridges in the store with bullets outward, you can organize their traditional supply to the barrel and bolt. It will fit a little less, but all problems are removed, the mechanics become traditional Bulpapov.
    The front handle seems to fold and becomes a forearm in the usual sense. Flashlights and lasers can be stuck in other places.
    In the second photo there is a place under the grenade launcher and a favorite strap under the barrel.
  9. Nikolaevich I
    Nikolaevich I 27 December 2017 13: 10
    +2
    Quote: igordok
    carrying and storing such arcuate stores is difficult.

    Yes nishtyak, in extreme cases, you can hang over the door instead of a horseshoe! wink
    And so ..... the "rally" turned out to be quite good! I remember how in a certain article they wrote about this "ghana" under a "theme" like: weapons of the future are being created today!
  10. garri-lin
    garri-lin 27 December 2017 13: 47
    +3
    Beautiful AdnAka. Give two, under the poralonovye bullets (the youngest) and injuries under the metal balls (to drive the neighbors cats.)
    And if by land for what ammunition is this device? The bend angle of the store does not correspond to the "anatomy" of more than one cartridge that I know of. But he won’t work with famous ones. Good shake and ready to skew.
    The only reasonable idea is to force the barrel to cool. But even here a good idea was brought to the point of absurdity. Air for cooling should be taken in the wound of the shooter's face and released forward downward in parallel with the powder gases when fired.
  11. philosopher
    philosopher 27 December 2017 14: 26
    +1
    I did not notice, or ammunition used is not mentioned?
    1. AlexMark
      27 December 2017 18: 21
      +2
      The author of the idea proposes 5,56х45. In the order of nonsense, you can bring those characteristics that were walking on the Internet:
      Ammunition - mm 5,56x45;
      Efficiency - up to 300 meters;
      Maximum range - 600 meters;
      Height - mm 220;
      Width - 54 mm;
      Length (folded / folded) - 432 / 752 mm;
      Weight (Empty): 2.5 kg;
      Weight (Charged): 3,1 kg;
      The initial speed of the bullet - 820 m / s.

      But since the weapon was not made, these characteristics are nothing more than a set of characters request
  12. Clone
    Clone 27 December 2017 16: 45
    0
    Extravagant ... but practically useless. The essence of the "concept" can be defined in one phrase, - And, why the heck ... and even without a pink bow ???
    Quote: bunta
    with this arrangement of cartridges will not work. Even in principle.

    Nuuu, I would not say so categorically, since there are many rifle "mechanisms" that in fact have no right to exist. repeat
    1. bunta
      bunta 27 December 2017 17: 20
      +5
      I have already partially answered this question. The cartridge there is 5,56x45, that is, the sleeve is almost cylindrical, unlike the cartridge for the Shosh machine gun - it has a pronounced conical one. Therefore, in the Shosh store, the feed force of the cartridge is transmitted along the entire length of the sleeve. At the THOR store, somewhere in the area of ​​the dulce sleeve. And this stopud skew is not even from garbage, but from simply shaking the store.
      1. AlexMark
        27 December 2017 18: 12
        +2
        The author of the idea suggests grabbing a cartridge in the middle, apparently a magnet. laughing There probably will not even distortions, and the analysis of the cartridge. The effort for the bullet to jump out of the sleeve is minimal, and at such a speed even a small lump of earth will lead to failures. And in general, without a rigid fixation of the cartridge when turning, gravity (which is heartless with ...), or rather even inertia, will not allow this system to work normally.
  13. Raphael_83
    Raphael_83 27 December 2017 18: 38
    +2
    An excellent balanced analysis of even a non-existent concept. So what, what non-existent. How many analyzes of the same nonexistent, but the most famous sci-fi machine M-41? Remarks about the appearance, design and layout are quite fair.
    From SW. hi
    PS
    If you really wanted a "curly" store, maybe you should do a reverse feed through the pistol grip in the sense of? And it would not be necessary to cope with a rotary unit and automation. request
    PPS
    No, I'm for the P-90 - the design is still not outdated, but the principle of operation and design are quite classic; the ammunition is just hatless. fellow
    1. AlexMark
      28 December 2017 17: 39
      +2
      Well, Р90 is, after all, a weapon more relevant to the special one, hence the non-standard ammunition. Shtaer, when they were conducting research on the topic of arrow-shaped bullets, in general, the body of the arrow itself was reduced to 3 mm in diameter, and they say it was perfectly tumbling in a ballistic gel due to the length request But expensive)
      Well, to be honest, I left a lot of my personal conclusions overboard))) But here’s a fuse before descending, well, that’s just no emotion is enough) In my opinion, that’s where it should be.
    2. tracer
      tracer 29 December 2017 16: 51
      0
      Ammunition awesome. Do not shoot do not say. There is almost no recoil; the barrel is level and the bullet breaks the water bottles into small splashes.
      1. Raphael_83
        Raphael_83 29 December 2017 19: 43
        0
        Quote: tracer
        Do not shoot do not say.

        My criticism of the ammunition concerns not its tactical and technical characteristics, ballistics, etc., but strictly the fact that except for "5-7" and "90" it is not used anywhere else, no other country is produced and its hell in real combat actions, you will get hit, and if you do, there is no trunk for it. Therefore, outside of a number of selected special forces of the Armed Forces and the security forces to which it is supplied, it is useless. 4,7 h & k the same song - one to one.
        1. 4thParasinok
          4thParasinok 12 January 2018 21: 00
          0
          Quote: Raphael_83
          ballistics, etc., but strictly the fact that besides "5-7" and "90" it is not used anywhere else, no other country is producing
          soon the license for the cartridge is ending, in the USA they will quickly establish production, there are many of these trunks.
    3. 4thParasinok
      4thParasinok 12 January 2018 21: 02
      0
      Quote: Raphael_83
      An excellent balanced analysis of even a non-existent concept. So what, what non-existent. How many analyzes of the same nonexistent, but the most famous sci-fi machine M-41?

      masturbation it is masturbation, even mental ... and the analysis is bad, the author does not even know that they refused to place the store behind the arms just because of poor balancing and a shift in the center of gravity as the cartridges were used up. And he has a lot of such “knowledge”.
      1. AlexMark
        20 January 2018 05: 21
        +2
        Quote: 4-th Paradise
        and the analysis is bad, the author does not even know that the placement of the store behind the handle was refused just because of poor balancing and displacement of the center of gravity as the cartridges are exhausted. And he has a lot of such "knowledge".


        Right here refused? If we are talking about the subject of the article, then, I remind you, this is a weapon that exists only in the form of beautiful pictures and nobody has refused anything for no reason, since there is nothing to give up.))) Or are you in general about the layout of bullpup ? If the latter, then continue, develop the idea, and we will evaluate your "knowledge" laughing
        1. 4thParasinok
          4thParasinok April 13 2018 22: 02
          0
          Quote: AlexMark
          Right now refused? If we are talking about the subject of the article, then, I recall, this is a weapon that exists only in the form of beautiful pictures and no one has refused anything for any reason, since there is nothing to refuse.)))
          Yes, and it turns out there is nothing to write about, but you write ...

          Quote: AlexMark
          Or are you generally on the bullpup layout? If the latter, then continue, develop a thought, and we will evaluate your "knowledge"
          It turns out you don’t know that the French have already announced a contest to replace Famas with a machine with the usual layout. In England, we have been talking about this for 20 years, and as far as I remember, they also finally decided to refuse. Only Israel remains, but for some reason, not everyone considers this country a trendsetter in arms. But yes, you are a writer and not a reader ...
          1. AlexMark
            April 14 2018 23: 09
            +1
            With the return, we waited) Nobody refused to build a bullpup where, for a weapon, first of all, small length is important while maintaining a full-fledged trunk, and not trimming. If you do not understand this, then it is pointless to argue with you.
  14. diglator
    diglator 27 December 2017 20: 44
    0
    And the curvilinear shutter stroke is, apparently, the type of South African Vektor.
    1. AlexMark
      28 December 2017 17: 34
      +1
      Exactly. In this machine a lot of things already known, but not used.
      1. 4thParasinok
        4thParasinok April 18 2018 16: 32
        0
        Quote: AlexMark
        Exactly. In this machine a lot of things already known, but not used.

        Tat think why this is not common, but do not start to praise any garbage ...
        1. AlexMark
          April 23 2018 09: 16
          +1
          Because there is no money for adopting new models, this process is not free. AEKI when developed? And when adopted? Questions? Complaints? Suggestions?
          1. 4thParasinok
            4thParasinok April 23 2018 15: 40
            0
            1. AEK has not been accepted into service for so long, not only because of a lack of money, but because it HAS insufficient reliability for combined arms use, and even now, after 30 years, not everything is clear about this. But as always, you know better than others, even the military.
            2. What does the presence in the treasury of money and the "invention" presented by you?
            1. AlexMark
              April 23 2018 16: 42
              +1
              I apologize, but what kind of world do you live in if you don’t see a direct connection between lack of money and rearmament for more promising types of weapons (not specifically this one)?
  15. Gomel
    Gomel 28 December 2017 12: 47
    0
    After watching the video, I have only one question - what kind of mutants is this automaton intended for? for him to even hold uncomfortably hand constantly twisted will be .... the store is in the way!
    1. AlexMark
      28 December 2017 17: 32
      +1
      Hold the same as in PP P90.
      1. 4thParasinok
        4thParasinok 12 January 2018 21: 07
        0
        Quote: AlexMark
        The retention is similar to that of PP P90

        not really, there will be a brush in the right to turn out, ergonomics is simply not thought out. Every time I repeat, mental rumblings.
        1. AlexMark
          20 January 2018 05: 26
          +1
          Quote: 4-th Paradise
          not really, there will be a brush in the right to turn out, ergonomics is simply not thought out. Every time I repeat, mental rumblings.

          But what did you do about masturbation then?))) Argue about turning the brush, and that, too, it turns out ... mental masturbation)))
          1. 4thParasinok
            4thParasinok April 13 2018 22: 03
            0
            Quote: AlexMark
            Well then you started talking about masturbation

            really piercing eyes?
            1. AlexMark
              April 14 2018 23: 11
              +1
              Arguments can not wait, will only verbal masturbation? wink
              1. 4thParasinok
                4thParasinok April 18 2018 16: 38
                0
                Quote: AlexMark
                Arguments can not wait, will only verbal masturbation?

                with whom you will lead .... In general, you simply don’t see the arguments, it is proved in practice, even on the condemnation of this “article”. so it’s not even interesting to talk with you. You do not have a knowledge base on the topic, just the base on which everything is based, there is only your desire how everything should look.
                1. AlexMark
                  April 23 2018 09: 14
                  +1
                  Yes, where are the arguments? You are writing about masturbation here, is this an argument? So would you have found a woman for yourself ...
                  1. 4thParasinok
                    4thParasinok April 23 2018 15: 46
                    0
                    Quote: AlexMark
                    Yes, where are the arguments?

                    Duck read what was written earlier and you will see everything, but it seems that not fate fool . In one good song, originally from the early 90s, if the words: "... If smart, then he will understand, if stupid it will go ..."
                    Quote: AlexMark
                    Are you all writing about masturbation, is this an argument? So would you find a woman for yourself or something ...
                    Well, do not shift your problems to others negative
                    1. AlexMark
                      April 23 2018 16: 58
                      +1
                      Come on, this is the problem you are trying to bring up for discussion here))) Ah! I understood, the brush will turn to the right from the masturbation, that's what you tried to convey to me? So you would be tied up with this case, not a teenager like.
  16. Hog
    Hog 29 December 2017 21: 10
    0
    The cartridge feeding system puts an end to this concept)
  17. Boris Chernikov
    Boris Chernikov 30 December 2017 00: 13
    0
    question .. and what kind of balance does the weapon have? Will it not be at first with a heavy rear end, but with an empty magazine, on the contrary, an advantage on the front?
  18. The brightest
    The brightest 31 December 2017 19: 56
    0
    The fake is not even worth the attention ... You can close your eyes to the layout, balance, but you can’t hold a standing cartridge in a clip.
  19. Forever so
    Forever so 3 January 2018 00: 55
    +1
    Mdya)) when you look at this machine, you immediately remember a joke about three questions for a Jew and the first question why you are circumcising - Well, first of all it’s beautiful ....... the Jew answers.
  20. papik09
    papik09 16 January 2018 12: 36
    0
    And what? Cool machine gun. A beautiful toy for Star Wars wassat