Military Review

USC: Frigate "Admiral Gorshkov" will not be accepted by the Russian Navy this year

108
The head frigate of the 22350 project "Admiral Gorshkov" will not be accepted by the Russian Navy this year, Alexey Rakhmanov, the head of the United Shipbuilding Corporation (USC), told reporters.


Earlier, Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov expressed the hope that the head frigate with anti-aircraft missile system (SAM) "Poliment-Redut" will be transferred the fleet this December.

Tests of the new missile weapons frigate continues. Therefore, the ship will not be handed over to the fleet this year. We hope that this will take place in 2018
- said Rakhmanov.

USC: Frigate "Admiral Gorshkov" will not be accepted by the Russian Navy this year


According to him, the second ship of this project (and the first serial) "Admiral Kasatonov" will enter the combat strength of the Russian Navy until the end of 2018.

Shipbuilders have no questions for the head ship, but "the fleet has questions for the new rocket arms, which produces holding "Almaz Antey"
- noted Rakhmanov.

As Borisov noted, depending on the deadline for the delivery of the Polymer-Redut air defense system for the Admiral Gorshkov, the situation with the Admiral Kasatonov will be clear.

The 22350 frigates have a displacement of thousands of tons in 4,5, a length of 135 meters and a width of 15 meters. The frigates will be armed with A-192 Armat naval artillery of millimeter caliber 130, launchers for 16 of Onyx or Caliber-NKE anti-ship missiles and Polimer-Redut air defense missile system. It is planned to build eight frigates of the project 22350, transmits RIA News
Photos used:
http://www.globallookpress.com/
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  1. svp67
    svp67 25 December 2017 14: 57 New
    11
    The lead frigate of project 22350 Admiral Gorshkov will not be accepted by the Russian Navy this year,
    Sadness. But taking a warship without reliable air defense is clearly not worth it ...
    1. 79807420129
      79807420129 25 December 2017 15: 54 New
      +7
      Again, "Polement Redoubt" disgraceful? Let them bring to mind and then take the composition of the Navy, than to hand over now and continue to saw. yes
      1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
        Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 25 December 2017 15: 56 New
        0
        And the Shtil air defense system on Admiral Makarov with a new missile can be cut for a couple of years.
        1. Alexander War
          Alexander War 25 December 2017 16: 20 New
          +2
          SAM "Calm" do not need to cut, there are all the rules!
    2. NEXUS
      NEXUS 25 December 2017 15: 59 New
      +8
      Quote: svp67
      Sadness. But taking a warship without reliable air defense is clearly not worth it ...

      This is the question of whether we have a serial construction of frigates and corvettes ...
      As Borisov noted, depending on the completion date of the Poliment-Redut air defense system for Admiral Gorshkov, the situation with Admiral Kasatonov will be clear

      This Poliment-Redoubt has already become across the throat ... well, we can’t nag it, we would have long given the task to another design bureau to create a complex similar in tasks, and most likely it would be faster than sawing this Poliment-Redoubt.
      1. alexmach
        alexmach 25 December 2017 17: 15 New
        +9
        Firstly, it’s not a fact that there is another design bureau capable of performing such a task. Secondly, what if all the problems lie in the unrealistic technical specifications?
        1. Tusv
          Tusv 25 December 2017 17: 28 New
          +1
          Yes, just new Wishlist. For example, to land in automatic mode. Schaz is a new trend. After all, the shell is coins. So everything is real
          1. alexmach
            alexmach 25 December 2017 17: 32 New
            +3
            I don’t think it’s possible at this stage to introduce new requirements. Most likely, old ones still cannot confidently satisfy.
            1. Tusv
              Tusv 25 December 2017 19: 02 New
              +5
              Quote: alexmach
              I don’t think it’s possible at this stage in principle to introduce new requirements

              I already spoke to Andrey Nexus in the summer, I repeat once again. We did not see the Raptors and Penguins before Syria, we did not bind to these pepelats. And the data we received only recently. That is, the requirements have fundamentally changed.
              And what needs to be done in order to experience the new guidance system? First, make a target with stealth characteristics, and then train.
              Further. Some mistakenly think that Polement and Polement - Redoubt are one and the same. Misconception. A completely different complex. This is a continuation of Korean development, but for ours and on the Korean element base. And Vladimir Vladimirovich said nefig for import substitution. As a result, we replace, to the best of our ability hi
              1. alexmach
                alexmach 25 December 2017 19: 59 New
                +1
                This hypothesis does not sound realistic.
                Firstly, although the raptors were not seen, there were some estimates about their characteristics 20 years ago. Nothing fundamental should have changed, and the most important thing in the finished system is hardly possible to radically change anything.
                Secondly, as I said, it’s just not wise to change the requirements at the product ready stage.
                Well, and the last - if you follow your logic, then you need to redo all radars in general, and not just on Gorshkov, both ground and air and observation of the situation ...
                1. Tusv
                  Tusv 25 December 2017 20: 11 New
                  +2
                  Quote: alexmach
                  but some estimates about their characteristics were 20 years ago

                  We had estimates according to 117 and perfume in 1989. Now they already have a completely different skin hi
                  1. alexmach
                    alexmach 25 December 2017 21: 20 New
                    +1
                    Well, let's say we saw that the skin is different, let's say that it is very different from what they expected, and so what? Will they remake the complex already existing in the iron to catch these raptors in a different skin? And how is that?
      2. midivan
        midivan 25 December 2017 17: 36 New
        +1
        Quote: NEXUS
        This Polement-Redoubt has already become across the throat ... well, we can’t nag it, we would have long given the task to another design bureau

        Isn’t the other design bureau just like that “a cut above” Almaz Antey? It seems that the office is serious and even very. And since you understand this topic (sea), you could not answer a question that torments me for more than one year - why are there so few weapons on ships? It seems like a huge colossus. Is it rationality (in a battle, it will live a little and drown with all the good), can it no longer be accommodated (limitation in area) or something else? And most importantly, is it possible to get into such a ship and wander in order to see with your own eyes and understand repeat In the fleet, do not offer, served on the ground and is already old for the army laughing
        1. NEXUS
          NEXUS 25 December 2017 18: 54 New
          +7
          Quote: midivan
          they couldn’t answer the question tormenting me for more than one year - why are there so few weapons on ships?

          Not enough? Are you kidding? Our corvettes and frigates, on the contrary, are overloaded with weapons.
          1. midivan
            midivan 25 December 2017 19: 54 New
            +2
            Quote: NEXUS
            Not enough? Are you kidding? Our corvettes and frigates, on the contrary, are overloaded with weapons.

            Ah, here it is even, I’m silent then.
        2. vredlo
          vredlo 25 December 2017 19: 19 New
          +1
          I’m certainly not a pro, but on the ships it’s not the area, but the displacement decides (that is, so as not to be drowned with all this economy) if it’s interesting, look at the battleships of the times before and the beginning of World War II so the ship’s floor is not occupied at all (the armor of the turbine gun is all heavy, and you need a hull so as not to drown) it was then they began to stick air defense wherever possible and the free areas remained
      3. Pirogov
        Pirogov 25 December 2017 18: 42 New
        +2
        Quote: NEXUS
        This Poliment-Redoubt has already become across the throat ... well, we can’t nag it, we would have long given the task to another design bureau to create a complex similar in tasks, and most likely it would be faster than sawing this Poliment-Redoubt.

        Good evening Andrey. And what other OKB? And this transfer will not work by shifting the deadlines for another 10 years?
        1. NEXUS
          NEXUS 25 December 2017 18: 58 New
          +2
          Quote: Pirogov
          Good evening Andrey. And what other OKB? And this transfer will not work by shifting the deadlines for another 10 years?

          Greetings ... I don’t know about another OKB, but I’m sure that you can dig ... And about the deadlines ... how much do we saw Poliment-redoubt? And nothing has changed. This infection does not want to mess.
          1. rudolff
            rudolff 25 December 2017 19: 11 New
            +4
            In this situation, the ship must be accepted without Redoubt. Let the boat drive in the north until the air defense system is finished. It is impossible to keep it further at the factory wall.
        2. rudolff
          rudolff 25 December 2017 19: 06 New
          +4
          Perhaps the Marine Research Institute of Radio Electronics "Altair". They worked with Calm. By the way, Calm, as a temporary measure, is not so bad. After all, it is only a frigate, not a destroyer.
          1. NEXUS
            NEXUS 25 December 2017 19: 15 New
            +3
            Quote: rudolff
            Perhaps the Marine Research Institute of Radio Electronics "Altair". They worked with Calm. By the way, Calm, as a temporary measure, is not so bad. After all, it is only a frigate, not a destroyer.

            Project 11356, let’s say so, is not very successful ... and in this regard, I’m afraid that these ships would not be able to serve the entire period without the Poliment Redoubt. And for me, I think we should lean on project 22356. At the same time, look for an alternative to Polent, and very quickly, even on the run.
            1. Alex777
              Alex777 25 December 2017 19: 25 New
              +2
              We must begin with the fact that Altair has not been around for more than 4 years. Ate it AA.
              The article is a real leaf about 8 ships 22350 in a series. It has long been limited to 4 pieces. Then 22350M will go ... in an unknown year. hi
              1. rudolff
                rudolff 25 December 2017 19: 35 New
                +2
                Yes, Altair, as a separate structure is no longer there. Well, then, Almaz-Antey, this is our everything.
            2. rudolff
              rudolff 25 December 2017 19: 45 New
              +2
              Project 11356 is a very good project, but of its time. It’s just yesterday.
              A ship without full air defense is better than a fleet without a ship at all. Or let them take it to an experienced one, although this is not an option. It will be a kind of BOD.
              1. RASKAT
                RASKAT 25 December 2017 22: 40 New
                0
                I am not enthusiastic about 11356, there seems to be anti-submarine weapons, and there are not enough means of detection. towed HOOK is not at all. The ammunition in 8 missiles is clearly not enough. How to form it? Two missiles are permissible against boats, two against coastal targets, and four against ships. How weak is it on a pair of missiles for some purposes? That ammunition in 16 missiles is already something. Especially a ship with such a displacement.
            3. Dart2027
              Dart2027 25 December 2017 22: 12 New
              0
              Quote: NEXUS
              And for me, I think we should lean on project 22356

              This?
              http://www.oaoosk.ru/products/project-22356/
    3. RASKAT
      RASKAT 25 December 2017 17: 22 New
      0
      Damn the leadership of this design bureau (we will not point the finger), first Tulyakov and Armor failed, then the Vityaz air defense system, now Redut. I hope for a stake who should be planted, so for prevention. am After all, they plan to install this type of air defense system not only on frigates of this series, but also on 20380 corvettes, and they will be built on a much larger series. In the old days, the General Designer was shot for this, and it happened ###.
      1. NEXUS
        NEXUS 25 December 2017 19: 06 New
        +2
        Quote: RASKAT
        first, Tulyakov and the Armor failed, then the Vityaz air defense system, now Redut.

        They forgot about the Morpheus project ...
        1. sivuch
          sivuch 26 December 2017 17: 28 New
          +2
          This is called - do not pour sugar on my salt (it's about Morpheus).
          By the way, I am a little behind life - on the third Beeches there are SAMs with an active head, but how is it with Calm? If there is, then why is this intense and ineffective c-cs (not skipping) with PR?
      2. antivirus
        antivirus 26 December 2017 07: 02 New
        0
        Take all of you out and put it on me.
        I'm not a gunsmith
        read and missed writing answers from yesterday
        YOU WILL NOT HAVE ANYTHING.
        WHICH 20 PEOPLE ARE NECESSARY, DRAW AND COUNT FOR ALL PERFORMANCE AND DO NOT PAY THEM FOR 300 T P YES IT DO NOT "SAW"
        A RESPONSE FOR SCAMS - WITH THEM
        - SO "ABOVE THE MIDDLE IN THE REGION" ENOUGH THIS .. FUN.
  2. 210ox
    210ox 25 December 2017 14: 58 New
    +6
    Unfortunately, this became a regularity. Maybe it was not worth it to show hope and still just wait for the fact?
    1. Jedi
      Jedi 25 December 2017 15: 11 New
      +6
      Hello Dima! hi It would be better to wait for the ship's full readiness to become operational with fully combat-ready systems, than to report on paper, and then bring it to mind without knowing how much.
      1. Hariton laptev
        Hariton laptev 25 December 2017 15: 22 New
        +2
        Everything is right, all the more so since this is not a union. Now everyone considers money, not only in his pocket but also in his neighbor’s pocket, which means that you sign the acceptance and bring everything from your pocket.
      2. kapitan92
        kapitan92 25 December 2017 15: 41 New
        +4
        Quote: Jedi
        It’s better to wait until the ship’s full readiness to become operational with fully combat-ready systems, than to report on paper, and then it’s unclear how much it will bring to mind

        Maxim, welcome! The topic with the "polymer" is not new. There was an article in September 2016 on NVO.
        In mid-July of this year, the head of the Main Directorate of Armaments of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation, Lieutenant General Anatoly Gulyaev officially announced that “so far there has been no positive result on the subject of Piment-Redoubt.” And the matter is not only in the ship’s anti-aircraft guided missiles (SAM) of this complex, which, according to eyewitnesses, “are lying on the third second of the flight”, but also in the functioning of the systems for detecting targets and providing guidance for missiles on them.

        : in early August of this year, “for the loss of work and loss of confidence,” Vitaly Neskorodov, director general of the Almaz NGO, was dismissed, under whose authority there are “redoubts” and “polyments”. But a loud resignation, alas, will not solve the problem of naval air defense systems. Apparently, here is a system error. And to understand it and find a solution, it will take time.
        They will bring it, only when !? hi
        http://nvo.ng.ru/realty/2016-09-09/12_leader.html
        1. Jedi
          Jedi 25 December 2017 15: 52 New
          +5
          Vyacheslav, welcome! hi Polement-Redoubt has enough troubles, and not all of us know. But after all, “Admiral Gorshkov” without an umbrella somehow does not release “ice” into the sea. Is there anything else to put on it like an ARIO? What do you think?
          1. kapitan92
            kapitan92 25 December 2017 16: 13 New
            13
            Quote: Jedi
            But after all, “Admiral Gorshkov” without an umbrella somehow does not release “ice” into the sea. Is there anything else to put on it like an ARIO? What do you think?

            Anti-aircraft missile system "Poliment-Redoubt" was developed since 1991 by the "Marine Research Institute of Radio Electronics" Altair "- the only domestic developer of medium and long range air defense systems. Since in the 90s there was practically no state financing, the development was carried out at the expense of small own funds at a fairly low pace.
            In the second half of 2010, bench tests began with the planned installation date for the ship in November 2011.
            However, in December 2010 Altair was included in the Head Specialized Design Bureau (GSKB) of the Almaz-Antey Air Defense Concern (now PJSC Almaz Scientific Production Association).
            De facto, another seizure of a strategic research institute was carried out, which can be equated with a raider. And this is unanimously recognized by the expert community.
            “And then, according to the classical scenario, the withdrawal of funds in the accounts, deprivation of financing and personnel cleaning (first of all, competent management staff - director, deputy for science, chief designer, deputy for production, deputy for security and regime, deputy for finance, ch. accountant), and everyone else - to be afraid and not to tweet. Then again in the classics - moving, repairs, exemption from “non-core assets”, change of middle managers and the arrival of a new “effective management team”, consisting mainly of Neskorodov’s friends on past topics. They announced at once - "marine subjects" are not important - only "land". The most intelligent of scientific personnel are immediately selected and transferred to “land subjects”. They liquidate production, create a separate subsidiary of Pilot Production OJSC and begin to work with it under contracts.

            In short, no one is engaged in "Poliment". Then the shipbuilders seemed nervous and began to demand their own. I had to somehow complete the bench tests and send to the ship. They installed it there, but they didn’t really work. It came to the ridiculous - people on a business trip to St. Petersburg did not take out an object for months - "there is no money on this order." Well, okay - "not our topic." And more than 5 years, V.V. Neskorodov.
            “The main reasons for the late delivery were the low level of organization of our own work, delays in the supply of components, insufficient production capacity and a lack of qualified personnel.”
            A sort of excursion into the history of our mess!
            According to the developers, the complex includes four phased antenna arrays (AFAR) "Poliment", a radar of the general review, SAM "Redut" with vertical launchers (VPU) for anti-aircraft guided missiles of medium and short range. The air defense system complex will also include unified control systems, electronic warfare systems, A-192 artillery mounts and the "Broadsword" anti-aircraft artillery system, all elements must operate and be controlled in a single air defense system, providing circular anti-aircraft defense of the ship from aircraft and low-flying missiles.
            Maxim! What is the sea here? For days it is necessary to force these "specialists" to work and bring to mind. Yes, it’s high time to ask for an “adult”, to start with Rogozin! hi
            1. Jedi
              Jedi 25 December 2017 16: 19 New
              +3
              Quote: kapitan92
              What is the sea here? For days it is necessary to force these "specialists" to work and bring to mind. Yes, it’s high time to ask for an “adult”, to start with Rogozin!

              I fully agree, but it is unlikely that we will see this in the foreseeable future. That’s why I’m interested in the moment of the Polio-Redoubt VRIO.
              1. Anyone
                Anyone 26 December 2017 02: 18 New
                0
                There are currently no available palliative solutions.
            2. Conductor
              Conductor 25 December 2017 16: 28 New
              0
              Rogozin and? More precisely, as a leader, he must keep his hand on the pulse, but no more.
              1. kapitan92
                kapitan92 25 December 2017 19: 32 New
                +5
                Quote: Conductor
                Rogozin and?

                Mr. Conductor! Fish, as you know, rots from the head. hi
                1. antivirus
                  antivirus 26 December 2017 07: 11 New
                  0
                  DO NOT FIND A PAPER FROM A CUSTOMER ABOUT "WE ARE LAGING OUT ... ON .. MONTHS"?
                  and there was never a "ask to take action"?
                  there is a struggle of lobbyists dry put and water.
                  to climb in America or only in Eurasia.

                  common sense wins — sit at home.
                  ps
                  maybe, according to Aegis, they’ve gotten everything together in a complex? - "
                  "network-centric war for the whole world ocean" is not rushing yet?
            3. Evgeniy667b
              Evgeniy667b 25 December 2017 17: 25 New
              +2
              And after such a situation in the development and production (also their own cockroaches) as another language, someone turns to declare sales on the side. We cannot provide for ourselves, and can we, at all? Suppose now an essentially left export order appears (actually a shabashka). All cash frames are removed and sent there. Everything that on state defense order flies to Opu. This practice exists at UVZ, but what is better about USK, or what? Or maybe we have all the "victims of the exam" at the plants rushed to? Who works ???
              So, the construction of ships, and not only for export, is a crime that causes enormous harm to our armed forces !!!
              1. Dart2027
                Dart2027 25 December 2017 22: 15 New
                0
                Quote: Evgeniy667b
                how else does someone's language turn to declare sales on the side

                So on the side they sell built on existing technologies.
                1. Evgeniy667b
                  Evgeniy667b 26 December 2017 14: 23 New
                  0
                  What is the difference, there are some capacities, frames are not rubber either. Soon, Tajiks will have to take the defense industry to the main production. There will be a passage! Therefore, GOZs have been doing so long
                  1. Dart2027
                    Dart2027 26 December 2017 19: 49 New
                    0
                    Quote: Evgeniy667b
                    Therefore, GOZs have been doing so long

                    Really? The problem with the refinement of new equipment, and this is another matter.
    2. Lexus
      Lexus 25 December 2017 15: 42 New
      +2
      Too many cooks spoil the broth

      I always watch with rapture when the officials bookmark the bookmarks, moreover, they are not related to the event by anyone ... And then the facts are then lonely whispered.
  3. Herculesic
    Herculesic 25 December 2017 14: 58 New
    +1
    Something was made wise with this redoubt, how much time they could not bring to mind! During this time, it was possible to recreate another complex from scratch instead of a redoubt!
    1. Topotun
      Topotun 25 December 2017 14: 59 New
      +5
      It is unlikely that any truly NEW complex will require refinement. And a new ship with unfinished air defense is somehow not right.
    2. 210ox
      210ox 25 December 2017 15: 00 New
      +4
      They will certainly bring it to mind. It was just necessary to wait for the fact, and then express hope .. This applies to the senator ..
      Quote: Herkulesich
      Something was made wise with this redoubt, how much time they could not bring to mind! During this time, it was possible to recreate another complex from scratch instead of a redoubt!
    3. Burbon
      Burbon 25 December 2017 15: 09 New
      +2
      Quote: Herkulesich
      During this time, it was possible to recreate another complex from scratch instead of a redoubt!

      no ... you can’t ...... I know that there are already no smart frames in diamond antea ... the old ones left, the young ones didn’t come ... that’s the problem .... and modifying s300 to s-400 is difficult maybe ... there a long-range missile when it learned to fly without problems? who will tell?
      1. PSih2097
        PSih2097 25 December 2017 16: 01 New
        0
        Quote: Burbon
        there is a long-range missile when it learned to fly without problems? who will tell?

        She knew how to fly before, the problem was hitting the target.
        1. Burbon
          Burbon 25 December 2017 16: 10 New
          0
          Quote: PSih2097
          knew how before, the problem was getting on target.

          Yes? who cares? belay
          1. S-kerrigan
            S-kerrigan 26 December 2017 05: 43 New
            0
            Well, it is obvious - if a rocket cannot fly, then it happens ... in short, have you ever seen a rocket thrown out of a container, and it falls onto a launcher (and a huge bang-bang-bang)? Well, this is a "rocket does not fly." Could you understand the difference?
            1. Burbon
              Burbon 26 December 2017 08: 44 New
              0
              Quote: S-Kerrigan
              and she falls on the launcher (and a huge bang-bang-bang)

              laughing laughing Are you serious? ... but not really ?. lol .... I thought it was a sinful thing that I can’t fly - when it flies wherever it pleases, but not where it should be ...
              Quote: S-Kerrigan
              Well, this is a "rocket does not fly"

              the rocket does not fly - when it misses the target! and enough nonsense to post about women after a powder discharge from a container
              Quote: S-Kerrigan
              Could you understand the difference?

              do not post nonsense anymore
              1. S-kerrigan
                S-kerrigan 27 December 2017 09: 45 New
                0
                Read the explanatory dictionary before writing nonsense yourself.
                “Flies,” “falls,” maybe you’ll become smarter.
                Or, in your opinion, the bullet does not fly if it does not hit?
                Ay, urgently to the headquarters! Explain to them that all fools (bullets don’t fly, rockets don’t fly when they don’t hit the target) - there’s one wise guy here.

                about broads after powder discharge from the container

                We open YouTube / Google and search - there it is all clear, shown in all its glory. On our installations.
    4. Kurare
      Kurare 25 December 2017 15: 54 New
      +5
      Quote: Herkulesich
      Something was made wise with this redoubt, how much time they could not bring to mind! During this time, it was possible to recreate another complex from scratch instead of a redoubt!

      The problem is that Poliment-Redoubt on Almaz-Antey was done on a residual basis. They threw all their forces into the development of the S-400 and the development of the S-500. And there were just a few resources allocated to the fleet, they thought "it will do." But no, it didn’t come down.

      In addition, bad traditions have passed from Russia to the Soviet Union. Completely new technologies must first be installed and brought up on test platforms (ships), and after fine-tuning, install the finished system on combat units. And then they drive Gorshkov to no avail, only the resource of the warship is burned.
      1. Anyone
        Anyone 26 December 2017 02: 32 New
        +1
        Now the principle of operation of any defense industry enterprises (from design bureaus and research institutes to factories) is as follows: for the sake of contracts and financing, they agree to any, even completely non-core, development and production. I myself know how research institutes that completely lost their starting, production, and personnel bases received orders. And then they issued under the guise of new developments compilation of blocks of old Soviet satellites with the same elemental base, but in a new "package". No specialists. Catastrophic condition with design engineers, not to mention the people behind the machines. But the heads, financial directors, managers, legal advisers, etc. - 10 per 1 engineer.
  4. Alexey-74
    Alexey-74 25 December 2017 15: 01 New
    0
    I agree. Of course, I want to quickly see "Admiral Gorshkov" as part of the Navy, but this problem with the "Polymer-Redoubt" can not be eliminated. Of course it is sad. But I'm sure in 2018 everything will be fine.
    1. cormorant
      cormorant 25 December 2017 15: 22 New
      0
      Correct would be "Polent-Redoubt" hi
      1. Svarog51
        Svarog51 25 December 2017 18: 43 New
        +9
        This is such a joke - polymers are all about ... in general, bye-bye. And here the "Redoubt" was polymerized. wink
  5. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
    Andrei from Chelyabinsk 25 December 2017 15: 01 New
    +7
    There is only one plus in all of this - recently there has been a slip of information that the Vityaz S-350 has climbed out of nonexistence and is actively completing the state defense order. And Vityaz is an analogue of Polement, in a coffin, law, one and a half thousand icons, God's grandmother and the afterlife sobbing Reduta (sorry - escaped, it's hard to talk about this opupy without a mat).
    On the other hand, I heard that there were problems of the marine version (difficulties with transferring a rocket from one of the headlights to another), then ... then I don’t know, maybe not 2018.
    1. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 25 December 2017 15: 06 New
      +4
      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
      On the other hand, I heard that there were problems of the marine version (difficulties with the transfer of missiles from one of the headlights to another),

      Shaw, again? belay
      I heard about this problem in relation to the S-300F - supposedly because of it, instead of 4 fixed canvases of the PARA a-la “Tika”, I had to put a “tit” on 1164 and 1144 with an electronic scanning sector of 90 degrees and mechanical extension of the entire AP to move to another sector.
      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
        Andrei from Chelyabinsk 25 December 2017 15: 29 New
        +2
        Quote: Alexey RA
        Shaw, again?

        I definitely heard about it with reference to Gorshkov about 5 years ago. Done or not - I can’t know, do not report angry
    2. Burbon
      Burbon 25 December 2017 15: 11 New
      +1
      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
      then the S-350 Vityaz got out of nonexistence and is actively completing the GOS. And Vityaz is an analog of Polyment

      Yes, I would very much like to believe it, but the land one differs from the sea one and is not weak ((...... there is a problem with smart personnel .... this is a fact ...
      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
        Andrei from Chelyabinsk 25 December 2017 15: 31 New
        +4
        Quote: Burbon
        Yes, I would very much like to believe, but the land one differs from the sea one and is not weak ((..

        Absolutely agree. But still, if it works at least on land ... then you can vouch that sooner or later (well .. in 5? 7 years?) It will work at sea. Until now, I have lived with the strong feeling that Polement Redoubt may never work at all
        1. Alexander War
          Alexander War 25 December 2017 16: 30 New
          +1
          https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/101862/ Ремонт кораблей дальней морской и океанской зоны
          1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
            Andrei from Chelyabinsk 25 December 2017 16: 36 New
            +2
            Excuse me, what does this have to do with it? The link, by the way, does not lead anywhere, I hardly found the article. The article, by the way, is ugly-lying.
            1. Alexander War
              Alexander War 25 December 2017 16: 40 New
              +1
              48N6DMK with an active homing radar and a range of up to 250 km I wonder what kind of missile?
              1. san4es
                san4es 25 December 2017 16: 54 New
                +3
                Quote: Alexander War
                48N6DMK with an active homing radar and a range of up to 250 km I wonder what kind of missile?

                The tactical and technical parameters of the Forts are planned to be raised by improving the software and mathematical control algorithm for 4P48 radar, including increasing the throughput and energy potential of PFAR, as well as by introducing into the ammunition complex not only 5V55RM, 48N6E / E2 anti-aircraft missiles, but also completely new long-range missiles 48N6DMK with active radar seeker

                https://topwar.ru/86252-obnovlennyy-admiral-nahim
                ov-kogda-ogayo-i-zumvalty-ne-strashny.html
                1. Alexander War
                  Alexander War 25 December 2017 16: 56 New
                  +2
                  48N6DMK with an active radar seeker, as I understand it is an analogue of the land 48N6E3 but with an active radar seeker?
      2. Alexander War
        Alexander War 25 December 2017 16: 26 New
        +2
        Already built Frigates pr 22356 with "Calm" am
        1. Burbon
          Burbon 26 December 2017 08: 46 New
          0
          Quote: Alexander War
          Already built Frigates pr 22356 with "Calm"

          and ??? ... fool Teach a materiel? or just write a gag ...? ... well, would they stick in the calm and then what? .... would stand by the wall and wouldn’t put them into operation ..... so what's the difference ??
          1. Dart2027
            Dart2027 26 December 2017 19: 50 New
            0
            Quote: Burbon
            would stand against the wall and would not be put into operation

            And why not?
    3. PSih2097
      PSih2097 25 December 2017 16: 17 New
      0
      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
      And Vityaz is an analog of Polyment

      And if you take into account that the polymer and calm have almost the same performance characteristics and at the same time the calm is finished, why are you dancing these dances with a redoubt that you still have to work on and work on.
      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
        Andrei from Chelyabinsk 25 December 2017 16: 37 New
        +4
        Quote: PSih2097
        And when you consider that the polymer and calm have almost the same TTX

        Well, I would not say that. In theory, Polyment is much better.
    4. Alexander War
      Alexander War 25 December 2017 16: 25 New
      +2
      48N6DMK with an active homing radar and a range of up to 250 km. What kind of missile is anyone in the know? S-400F?
    5. alexmach
      alexmach 25 December 2017 17: 25 New
      +1
      On the other hand, I heard that there were problems of the marine version (difficulties with transferring a rocket from one of the headlights to another), then ... then I don’t know, maybe not 2018.

      Well, besides that, the sea conditions - pitching there, fogs, humidity.
      In addition, in the ground-based system, if anything can be relatively simple, let's say increase the size of the radar, or add something auxiliary.
  6. Romario_Argo
    Romario_Argo 25 December 2017 15: 02 New
    +1
    Well, what is there to write ......?! - the Bastions in the Kuril Islands alone will not repel the Japanese ....
  7. ul_vitalii
    ul_vitalii 25 December 2017 15: 04 New
    +7
    Let them bring to mind, we'll wait!
  8. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 25 December 2017 15: 11 New
    +2
    It is terrible that such an ambush turned out to be with air defense. And on the other hand - a frigate without air defense - is it a target?
  9. family
    family tree 25 December 2017 15: 13 New
    +1
    what they wanted, as usual, was smooth on paper. While the technology will work out and straighten out, after all, the pre-series in the series
    (I'm leaving singing)
    Coachman, don’t drive horses what
  10. Mihanishche
    Mihanishche 25 December 2017 15: 25 New
    0
    And right !!! Well, they will surrender in January - but with full armament, so that everything works from top to bottom! The main thing is that ships bake like pies.
    1. The Siberian barber
      The Siberian barber 25 December 2017 15: 39 New
      +1
      Like pies ?? (We are not in the Soviet Union, for an hour ??? It was then that the ships were built, with the speed of spawning of fish. Now the raid tugboat or RTOs are launched, with the pathos of an aircraft carrier ((About the ships of the 1st rank (except for the nuclear submarines), I’m silent, for not one is laid
      1. Mihanishche
        Mihanishche 25 December 2017 15: 45 New
        +1
        So what, that raid tug !!!
        In addition, not everyone tells you, we do not know everything ...
        1. The Siberian barber
          The Siberian barber 25 December 2017 21: 16 New
          +1
          Except how to shout “Hurray”, I can’t find words ((Only from these “hooray”, the fleet (which is already not very big) will not become stronger, alas
  11. The Siberian barber
    The Siberian barber 25 December 2017 15: 34 New
    0
    About the same thing, in the next branch ((
    The impression that they are paid for the number of promises (
    1. Mihanishche
      Mihanishche 25 December 2017 15: 38 New
      +1
      Not true. Su-57 accepted? Accepted! Armata accepted - accepted! Landing Alexander Gray accepted - accepted! Not always just promises.
      1. next322
        next322 25 December 2017 16: 00 New
        +5
        and what is Alexander Gray? and who and when accepted it? heard bdk ivan gren, but no one has accepted him since 2004
      2. Sam_gosling
        Sam_gosling 25 December 2017 16: 00 New
        +1
        I remembered the video from the test. The landing ship, the hero of Alexander Gray, simultaneously receives several large-sized craft at once into his landing compartments. Learn ponaduser sopodsponniki!
        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 25 December 2017 17: 36 New
          +2
          Quote: Sam_gosling
          The landing ship, the hero of Alexander Gray, simultaneously receives several large-sized craft at once into his landing compartments.

          Not just accepting, but conducting a multiple I / O operation oversized craft. smile
        2. Spez
          Spez 25 December 2017 22: 59 New
          +2
          Link to the video will not throw?)))))))))))))))))))
      3. Alexey RA
        Alexey RA 25 December 2017 17: 35 New
        +6
        Quote: Mikhanishche
        Landing Alexander Gray accepted - accepted!

        Grandfather Freud fiercely applauding furiously! good
  12. san4es
    san4es 25 December 2017 16: 38 New
    +3
    The lead frigate of project 22350 Admiral Gorshkov will not be accepted by the Russian Navy this year,

    New frigates with enhanced weapons will create on the basis of the ships of project 22350

    1. Alexander War
      Alexander War 25 December 2017 16: 53 New
      +2
      Thanks for the video namesake! hi New frigates what Here for pr 22350 GTA "NPO" Saturn "has not yet done, I'm not talking about the Poliment-Redut air defense system, but I will not say anything about the new frigate, that the armament will be increased there
      1. san4es
        san4es 25 December 2017 16: 58 New
        +3
        Quote: Alexander War
        .... And about the new frigate, I’ll be silent for a while
        wink
        1. Alexander War
          Alexander War 25 December 2017 17: 00 New
          +1
          Waiting for him to 2025
          1. Normal ok
            Normal ok 25 December 2017 18: 52 New
            +1
            Quote: Alexander War
            Waiting for him to 2025

            More realistic, by 2125.
  13. cost 75
    cost 75 25 December 2017 16: 59 New
    +1
    while the polymer is finished potting it will be time to write off
  14. Neputin
    Neputin 25 December 2017 18: 17 New
    +3
    Will not be delivered in 2017 ..... No emotions. Only the dull malice inside and the wild desire to take for the scrotum this whole company with Rogozin at the head. so much so that the water flows. He stopped believing in the surrender of Gorshkov back in September 2017. therefore, he stopped commenting. Everything has already been written before .....
  15. Normal ok
    Normal ok 25 December 2017 18: 52 New
    0
    USC: Frigate "Admiral Gorshkov" will not be accepted by the Russian Navy this year

    As required.
  16. Nemesis
    Nemesis 25 December 2017 20: 54 New
    0
    This trough needs to be rebuilt for the Shtil air defense system ... and transferred to the fleet ... Stop pulling the rubber, it will soon decay on futile tests of the futile Redoubt air defense system
  17. Vladimir SHajkin
    Vladimir SHajkin 25 December 2017 21: 06 New
    0
    Polement-redoubt is an important component, how to protect yourself from NATO's annoying air targets?
  18. kefan
    kefan 25 December 2017 21: 31 New
    +1
    Now this is not at all ridiculous, in general, except for obscene words nothing more comes to mind.
  19. IrOqUoIs
    IrOqUoIs 25 December 2017 22: 24 New
    0
    "launchers for 16 anti-ship missiles" Onyx "or" Caliber-NKE "

    For such dimensions is very small .... Need more.
    1. Kurare
      Kurare 26 December 2017 00: 22 New
      +2
      Quote: IrOqUoIs
      For such dimensions is very small .... Need more.

      Compare with the weapons of "classmates." There is practically no more balanced frigate for various types of weapons. They made the ship universal, and not with a bias only on the Caliber.
  20. huntsman650
    huntsman650 26 December 2017 01: 41 New
    0
    He worked with Altair on a modernized dagger (standing on one of the BPC sf) and did not bring to mind. First, the programmer died, then the Civil Code. The polenta under Aegis was washed down. The problem seems to be that there is no guidance zur self-destruct.
  21. Jack O'Neill
    Jack O'Neill 26 December 2017 02: 07 New
    +1
    Already got this Almaz-Antey! That's real, anger takes! am
    Why do we not have several offices that gnaw on each other's throats? Look, you don’t have to go far for an example - the USA: Raytheon, Lockheed Martin, Northrop Grumman, offices that have a healthy competition for orders US Department of Defense! And we have? And we have one supplier, as a rule ... From here, they turn as they wish, because there is no one else!
    1. S-kerrigan
      S-kerrigan 26 December 2017 05: 51 New
      0
      Money. Huge money needed. I just look at the surrounding engineers and understand that in order for normal specialists to come, they need to pay at least 150k / month.
      Further, the normal micro-team will be in 7-10 people. There are xs such microcommands. For each subsystem it is necessary on command. How many teams, so many subsystems per unit of time will be developed. And this is millions (tens) of monthly salaries only - there will be no money left for drinks!