Military Review

What is worse for "Almaty": "Javelin" or EGE?

145
Speaking at the military college and referring to the results of inspections in military districts in 2017, Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu as a whole positively assessed the results. However, once again the minister noted that the slow development of modern military equipment by military service personnel is a phenomenon that, unfortunately, has not gone anywhere.




And there is something to think about.

Shoigu, by the way, has more than once said that a year is not enough for the normal training of a modern soldier. And here there is a double-edged sword: on the one hand, the reluctance to “lose two years” can again lead to the wholesale flight from the army, on the other, it is already clear that a year is sufficient only to train those fighters who are not associated with sophisticated modern equipment.

Many will reasonably argue: he himself, he says, has repeatedly said / wrote that a year of military service is enough to test a candidate for a contract. And then - welcome to the contract service, where they will teach everything and quality.

I agree, wrote. And he thought that way, but then, looking at some exercises during a visit to the exercises, he became thoughtful.

The fact that today the youth is going to a contractual service with quite normal quantities is good. And with contentment, now everything is not so sad as ten years ago, and a beautiful bonus in the form of a housing certificate, too.

As for the numbers, even in 2015, Shoigu stated that the number of contractors exceeded the number of conscripts. And today, these numbers are approximately the 400-450 of the first thousand and about the 300 of the second thousand.

And if with contract soldiers everything is clear and understandable, then here is the problem of conscripts. Moreover, I watched it with my own eyes. Even after six months, for the most part, conscripts are universal sorrow. No, there are exceptions, I saw, for example, in Valuyki, as the guys after the 3 months of service were already capable of very meaningful and precise actions. But it really was an exception.

Pros from the contract. Having studied and mastered the technique of any complexity, be it an air defense system, an airplane, a tank, and so on, it is good that they are not limited in time. These are those who will be on the first line of defense in case of anything. The case can be anything: international terrorism, neighbors that have pulled out of coils, intervention in local conflicts within the CSTO (the most probable, by the way), “partners” from the West and their ambitions.

400 thousands of trained and competent professionals - this is a very tangible figure. However, who is the first to go to battle, he will be the first to lose. Proved long ago and spelled in blood.

Who will change them is a good question. And the other, no less, and, probably, even more burning: who will change tomorrow those who provide combat work?

For example, give airfields. I watched the process of preparing airplanes at three airfields in the Golden Military District this year. I was amazed that there are young pilots, but alas, among the technical staff. From the category 35-40 are found, but very rarely. Mostly for 40.

This year we wrote about the expansion of admission to the academy of Zhukovsky and Gagarin. 1612 cadets. Some part will not reach the finish line, of course, but a certain number will become technical staff at the aerodromes. Good.

Probably, the academy specialists did a good job, selecting 1612 people from almost 10 thousands who want to enroll.

There is, however, a nuance. Few people know that what is called today VUNC Air Force "Air Force Academy named after Professor N. E. Zhukovsky and Yu. A. Gagarin" is a conglomerate of several components.

In addition to the Academy named after Professor N. E. Zhukovsky and the Academy named after Yu. A. Gagarin, the following were included:
- Borisoglebsk Higher Military aviation School of Pilots named after V.P. Chkalov;
- Voronezh Higher Military Aviation Engineering School;
- Irkutsk Higher Military Aviation Engineering School;
- Stavropol Higher Military Aviation School for Pilots and Navigators of Air Defense;
- Tambov Higher Military Aviation Engineering School of Radio Electronics;
- Voronezh Military Institute of Radio Electronics;
- Federal State Research Center for Electronic Warfare and the evaluation of the effectiveness of reducing visibility.

So, two academies, two flight schools, two aviation engineering schools and two radio-electronic ones. NIIC EW does not consider it so, to heap.

8 military universities have teamed up to work in the training of engineers for the videoconferencing. The result - 1612 man and former commander in chief Bondarev did not hide his satisfaction. 12 faculties are 130 people on each. Plus, not everyone will finish training, fact.

Perhaps all is not so bad.

For 10 years (5 in teaching and 5 initial practice) you can end up as an engineer person.

For the year of the term - it is unlikely. But such tasks are not set.

Plus, we will not discount the terrifying level of our secondary education. By the way, then Bondarev said in an interview that "we would have scored three thousand, but better quality than quantity."

Translate? Or is it clear that the frank sacrifice of the USE is better not to allow planes?

But this is an officer corps, we will assume that they learn. Let's return to conscripts.

At the very least, it would seem like a year for a civilian youth to make a fighter, let's say, second-rate. That is, to learn to act in battle, to shoot from a machine gun, grenade launcher. Seen, you can. Shoot, fall. Already not bad.

More complex things that require specialized knowledge such as artillery, which for some reason cannot do without mathematics, is more difficult. Yes, ballistic computers and all other useful gadgets, this, of course, yes, are present.

About very complex things such as air defense, RCBZ, EW, you can already worry. There are electronics in bulk, even in the new RCM, wherever you put your head, everywhere there are touch screens and high-rise units. About "Armata" just silent.

And do not even think about some general computer literacy. Laiki in social networks and working with complex (really complex) electronic complexes are two different things.

What is the result? We have contract soldiers who are ready to go and show their knowledge and skills at the first call. Apply, so to speak, in practice. But the contractor must be protected, in him money and efforts are planted in full and from the heart. And, most importantly, who will replace him in case of what? Same contract? And it is still necessary to grow and learn.

The same is true in terms of those who will serve "Almaty", "Kurgan", "Boomerangs" and everything else, "not having an analogue in the world."

And, it turns out, like two armies, right? One is the professionals who know the technology to the screw and are able to do everything and the second, from the conscripts, who seem to be able to be even worse than the contract, but in the long run to be replaced.

But it does not work. If for the third year Shoigu grumbles on the topic that they do not really have time to master the technique, it means that he has grounds for it.

It turns out that those who went through military service, for the most part - again “cannon fodder”, honed under AK-74, BMP-3 and BTR-80? I don’t even want to talk about such things as communications and EW; every year there is something new for the troops.

Someone will say that we globally do not seem to be fighting with anyone. Well, yes, only someone will ask, if that? What’s around, inside the country of places where such a struggle for independence and interests can go, just carry out the shells ...

It seems that the army has a reserve. Not running from the service, not writing at night and mentally normal. On the other hand, this reserve is purely nominal, because for the year of service, nothing serious has been taught. Well, in general terms.

Double-edged stick. I understand Shoigu, on the one hand, he wants the reserve to be a real reserve. Reliable rear, not a cold ass.

Increase service life? Yes, a logical move. Technique is becoming increasingly difficult, it must be mastered, studied and understood. But then all the “soldiers' mothers” will definitely be vzvuyut and the like, and again begin dancing around the military registration and enlistment offices and medical commissions. Bribes and stuff. Even in our time, when peace and tranquility are relative, in the recruiting offices of the queue of those who wanted “to the south” were to roll, and only contract soldiers went there, there are those who prefer “not to lose the year”.

I personally knew those. Sick patriots. That is, they are patriots and will stand up directly for the Motherland if necessary, and on Sundays they strike airsoft no worse than the American Marines. But to serve: "Their bin is sick."

Increase the service life - will increase the number of "patients" at times.

But those who go to the army today are not very healthy either. In terms of the head. There is such a stupid malware, the USE is called. Everyone knows the essence of the program. Make a person as stupid as possible so that the look of a modern ATGM can arouse in him. He is not in “counter” and “battle”, as a result - a complete rejection of the world and understanding of the situation. Full collapse.

I myself have observed more than once, unfortunately.

Meanwhile, as the Minister of Defense again noted, a new technique is flowing to our army. And she really goes. And the contractor successfully mastered it.

But what will happen to those who (don't bring, of course) suddenly find themselves in this army after serving ten years ago? No, it is clear that in a couple of months, by analogy, studied earlier ...

And if these months will not be? There were also such situations in our stories.

A year of study, “a gallop across Europe”, if the first six months go to make a monk out of a monkey to make at least a fighting baboon - a luxury.

But today they come not only without any idea, AK-47 was not holding in their hands. I am silent about knowledge of exact sciences. And the officers, who every six months begin the process not even from the zero level, but are also silent from the “minus second”. Mostly obscenely silent.

On the problems of our education, by the way, it is best to talk with officers. They can tell a lot on how replenishment comes. And how you have to fight with him so that by the end of this year, they could at least know something and could.

And the conflict is resolved very simply. And I think that here I will not reveal the truth. Return to the Soviet system NVP in high school. And the previous defeat of the sabotage hotbed, called the modern education system.

Well, after all, utter nonsense, spend half a year of time and government money to acquaint a young individual with a gun, gas mask and OZK. This can be taught in advance. Not only collect-disassemble the machine for speed (although it is also useful), the store to teach equip! OZK correctly fasten on yourself.

Well, not every school. In the center of primary training, one per district to do.

I spied the idea on the training ground of the 20th Army. They made a huge training ground. They brought a dozen there tanks, Armored personnel carriers, infantry fighting vehicles and guns. And now only soldiers are brought in for training.

The same is in the cities. What do you need such a center? A dozen old machines, a bucket of training cartridges. Machine gun. And the old BTR or BPM, to learn to sit down, land. So that already in the army they would not break their foreheads. And OZK. Everything. And a couple of normal retirees.

And the opportunity at least once to shoot five patrons. In the Kursk region do so, I saw.

And at the output we will receive not a vegetable hodgepodge, which the basics should be taught, but at least something that understands "ordinary untrained". But the savings of three months are obvious. And this time can be used on more necessary things.

But for this you need to do something with the Ministry of Non-Education. And we must do it today. Shoigu clearly understands this.

What is the point, that we have “Armata” and many other scary words, if there are no intelligent crews and technicians for them? And again a bad picture is drawn with T-72 and other Soviet attributes?

Not “Javelin” is terrible “Armata”, no. A modern tank is terrified with bulging lamb eyes of the one who, in theory, would have to sit in it and complete the task. Fighting.

By the way, this rake in the Donbass normally came in due time. Tanks naotbivali, and sense? There are tanks, there is fuel, there is a BC. Crew no. The tractor driver, of course, will move the tank, the question is how? Not very good.

In general, if you recall Lenin's phrase, about the fact that you need to learn military science in this way, then you need to learn. And you need to learn. In advance, as it was in the Soviet Union.

Then, exactly with the successors of Sergei Kozugetovich, the head will be much less sore.
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  1. bandabas
    bandabas 21 December 2017 06: 14 New
    13
    Technological progress is undeniably a good thing. But you need to be able to multiply and divide without gadgets.
    1. Finches
      Finches 21 December 2017 06: 20 New
      27
      Only 2 years is the most optimal period of military service! Half a year of intensive training in training, a period sufficient to learn how to operate complex models of military equipment! The training methods developed from the time of the Soviet Army are unmeasured - they only need to be reanimated and that’s all! The exam has nothing to do with it at all!
      1. 210ox
        210ox 21 December 2017 06: 47 New
        16
        Eugene, I completely agree with you! And they’re not afraid that “the soldiers will howl” and “their sick” will run away. They don’t have such defenders in the army.
        Quote: Finches
        Only 2 years is the most optimal period of military service! Half a year of intensive training in training, a period sufficient to learn how to operate complex models of military equipment! The training methods developed from the time of the Soviet Army are unmeasured - they only need to be reanimated and that’s all! The exam has nothing to do with it at all!
        1. Grandfather
          Grandfather 21 December 2017 06: 52 New
          15
          year of service with a "quiet hour" - money down the drain ...
        2. krops777
          krops777 21 December 2017 08: 10 New
          19
          And they’re afraid that “the soldiers will howl” and “their sick” will run away. They aren’t in the army for such defenders.


          Quite right, but that would run less and better even fly a bullet to the draft board, the state should create all the conditions, preferences, benefits, etc. for those who have served.

          Personally, I am for the revival of the NVP, instead of this misunderstanding born in the bowels of the mine. education called OBZH.
          1. marline
            marline 21 December 2017 12: 34 New
            +9
            Quote: krops777
            Personally, I am for the revival of the NVP, instead of this misunderstanding born in the bowels of the mine. education called OBZH.

            As far as I remember, from those times when I worked at school: OBZH - taught from grade 5. НВП - structurally should be included in OBZh for grades 10-11. In fact, there is an NVP only if the teacher is a retirement, then the kids both shoot and take apart the machine, collect, and throw grenades ... Only this rarely happens ...
            1. Dedall
              Dedall 22 December 2017 01: 17 New
              +3
              Merlin, but in my school years I was led by the most active officers on the network. One, I remember, was the paratroopers, who had been treated for a year after a spinal fracture. Another served five years in Yakutsk and then taught with us for three years. That is, approximately in this way and restore everything. If you served on Alexandrovsky Island, then go to school or college if you wish. Or after injuries, injuries, illnesses, too, do not fire immediately, but wait a year or two and ask them to teach the children.
              1. marline
                marline 22 December 2017 09: 59 New
                +1
                Quote: Dedall
                If you served on Alexandrovsky Island, then go to school or college if you wish. Or after injuries, injuries, illnesses, too, do not fire immediately, but wait a year or two and ask them to teach the children.

                This is what I had in mind. When he was in high school, he himself was introduced by a retiree - he was a severe man. And most importantly, he interestingly told, drove to the shooting and military schools and then we liked this subject. I think even now it will be more interesting for young men to learn from a person with army experience.
        3. My doctor
          My doctor 21 December 2017 11: 38 New
          +2
          But those who go to the army today are not very healthy either. In terms of the head. There is such a stupid malware, the USE is called. Everyone knows the essence of the program. Make a person as stupid as possible so that the look of a modern ATGM can arouse in him. He is not in “counter” and “battle”, as a result - a complete rejection of the world and understanding of the situation. Full collapse.

          Smart youth in Belarus do not join the army, they mow their priorities and tasks.
          For me, calling a kid into the armed forces is generally stupid to expect something good from him. The conscript will always find a way to express his attitude to the service, or at best turn on the toggle switch "".
          1. Pancir026
            Pancir026 21 December 2017 16: 51 New
            +7
            Quote: MyVrach
            Smart youth in Belarus do not join the army, they mow their priorities and tasks.

            Somehow I saw a sketch in the military registration and enlistment office .. mother. I need the military commissar - I need my son to serve, the answer is there is no reason not to serve. Yes? In this case, let him go to a psychiatric hospital, in prison but not to the army. in TWO years, the mother of the same one, with the same intonations, but already in a psychiatric hospital, tried to convince Glavrach, to flaunt her miracle back, because she needed a military ticket, without which he was ordered to get work, and her schizophrenic child remained.
            HERE is the price of your mowers from the army.
            1. bandabas
              bandabas 21 December 2017 19: 45 New
              +1
              Yah. A. Look at our governors, Duma members, and ministers. And they all feel great. Well, sometimes, they will hold on to the TV channels or take the BAR. Where or what is the question. Allegory, however.
            2. Inzhengr
              Inzhengr 25 December 2017 00: 56 New
              0
              A similar case is a little more than 20 years ago. Symptoms of dementia "put" a lad, attracting a familiar psychiatrist. Delivered, successfully "slanted" - received a white ticket with the corresponding entry. Now, being an 40-year-old man, he does not even dream of getting a job more than a courier. And even by courier far from everywhere they take it. From his own words: "I picked up the whole 1.5 of the year, but lost my whole life."
          2. ARES623
            ARES623 21 December 2017 21: 31 New
            0
            Quote: MyVrach
            Smart youth in Belarus do not join the army, they mow their priorities and tasks.

            It is necessary to put a filter in the civil service and in career growth - through military service with the following service characteristics, and something will go. You can, like the United States, give a privilege for admission to a university and free preparatory courses. If desired, you can reasonably well motivate for the service. But this should be a state concern, and not the initiative of single fanatics.
        4. hohkn
          hohkn 21 December 2017 15: 22 New
          +5
          Quote: 210ox
          Not in the army they have a place for such defenders.

          There is an alternative - logging. And no porters of "medical ducks."
          You declare that 3,14dor is only for logging. They are very loved there.
          1. Pancir026
            Pancir026 21 December 2017 16: 52 New
            +5
            Quote: hohkn
            There is an alternative - logging. And no porters of "medical ducks."
            You declare that 3,14dor is only for logging. They are very loved there.

            Five years. Not less.
      2. avt
        avt 21 December 2017 11: 03 New
        18
        Quote: Finches
        Only 2 years is the most optimal period of military service!

        Nonsense. The optimal and minimum service life, well, when you really prepare a fighter for military high school and he also serves in the troops - 5 (five) years. The rest is murky sobs. That is, in fact the same contract. With conscripts of the year for the eyes in the acting units, BUT on the condition that you prepare it according to the same VUS BEFORE serving in DOSAAF and military departments fully, as was conceived even in the USSR since OSAVIAHim, and then, after a year urgent, ascribe it by profession, as it is in the USA in the National Guard. Here you have the mobile reserve. But this is a constant, boring work with personnel, it’s easier to recruit “soldiers”, and then whine - the school did not prepare them for the “school of life.”
        1. Finches
          Finches 21 December 2017 11: 26 New
          11
          2 years are needed not only for the preparation of a higher education institution, but the most important thing for the psychological breakdown and alteration of the psychophysical qualities of a person from a citizen to military tracks! Well, for this we need two years! Then all this will remain with the person for life!
          1. NEXUS
            NEXUS 21 December 2017 12: 31 New
            11
            Quote: Finches
            Then all this will remain with the person for life!

            Here the question should be divided into two parts. First: Training of officers, sergeants and ensigns. The army then rests on the latter. Schools for the training of such sergeants and warrant officers are needed with a balanced and effective program, without the Unified State Examination and the rest of obscurantism, that is, on the basis of Soviet developments, of which there are three wagons and a cart. According to the officers ... Suvorov and Nakhimov schools need more. At the same time, raising the level of training in them to the level of good universities. That is, again, the question of the prestige of such institutions in general arises. In tsarist Russia and in the USSR it was prestigious, now not.
            Second question: this is a question of training soldiers. But here the problem arises of the entrepreneurial level of knowledge. And we return to school, where the current training program for future recruits is in a deplorable state. And here I agree with the respected AVT ... you need to revive DOSAAFs, popularize this movement, return the TRP standards, work towards historical and patriotic movements, such as the NEMAN group . Again, perhaps this looks ridiculous and wild for someone, but I am convinced that it is necessary to return the pioneer movement in the same way, the October Communists and Komsomol members ... let it be called differently, but the idea itself is very correct. It is necessary to direct young people in the direction that will give us a good conscript, and not a disabled person with the platypodia of the third eye.
            1. Andrey NM
              Andrey NM 21 December 2017 13: 19 New
              +2
              Quote: NEXUS
              Suvorov and Nakhimov schools need more. At the same time, raising the level of training in them to the level of good universities.

              These schools have never been higher. They were a kind of vocational school (not a very correct comparison) before entering the higher military school.
              Quote: NEXUS
              to popularize this movement, return the rules of the TRP

              The TRP standards were returned, but they made a little noise, and everything calmed down. Upon admission to some universities, the "Golden Badge" gives additional points.
              1. NEXUS
                NEXUS 21 December 2017 13: 32 New
                +7
                Quote: Andrew NM
                These schools have never been higher.

                And I don’t say that these schools are at the level of universities, I’m saying that they should (due to the training program) try to make them as close to universities as possible ... as much as possible.
                Quote: Andrew NM
                The TRP standards were returned, but they made a little noise, and everything calmed down. Upon admission to some universities, the "Golden Badge" gives additional points.

                The rules of the TRP, which were under the USSR, 60-70 years and those that are now are different concepts in principle. A rare student will pass the TRP standards of the 70s. It's not about the badges, but about physical education and the health of young people.
                1. basmach
                  basmach 21 December 2017 14: 10 New
                  +5
                  And you are aware that now after Suvorov schools their graduates on GENERAL grounds enter military institutes. Well then Kozhukhetovich will not change anything. Can not or does not want. And now Suvorov already 26 schools. In the USSR, their graduates without exams went to combined arms and passed engineering (but there were preferences).
                  1. NEXUS
                    NEXUS 21 December 2017 14: 13 New
                    +5
                    Quote: basmach
                    And now Suvorov already 26 schools.

                    26 schools in all of Russia ... well, a lot are straightforward.
                    Quote: basmach
                    Well then Kozhukhetovich will not change anything.

                    And this is a question not only for him, but also for the Guarantor ...
                    Quote: basmach
                    In the USSR, their graduates without exams went to combined arms and passed engineering (but there were preferences).

                    In the USSR, the level of training was much higher. I served 2 years, my father spent 3 years in the missile industry, and during his tenure in the Navy, he served 4 years. Therefore, it turned out beautiful soldiers.
                2. Andrey NM
                  Andrey NM 21 December 2017 17: 18 New
                  +4
                  Now the TRP is also difficult to pass. In the 80s I passed both the TRP and VSK level 1, my son passed the “Golden Badge” the year before last. Now the order for the mark is signed by the Minister of Sports. And pass is problematic. I have a young guy living above the floor, ZMS for wrestling, European champion, so he couldn’t pass the gold badge, he didn’t manage to swim. I also asked: why do you need it? Well, that was ... By the way, passing to swimmers is much easier. My "child" with a large margin fulfilled everything. True, he is an MS in swimming.

                  According to the military education system, it seems to me it was more correct as in the 50-60s. Military schools were average 3-year, and only naval and some were higher. Then the academy, 5 years old, higher education, and then everything else. My father went through this scheme. When his father studied at the Academy (Kharkiv VIRTA, the head was the artillery marshal Bazhanov), participants in the Vietnamese and Cuban events, order-bearers studied with him in a group. Not blind copying, but the principle of gradual education would be correct to apply, well, it seems to me that way.
                  For example, when I was studying (beginning of the 80s), flight and political schools had 4 years of study, higher education. Naval, engineering and a number of command schools - 5-year. Aerotechnical - average 3 year. I was always surprised that for a "tower" it could be for 4 years, especially among the political leaders.

                  Below I read about the number of Suvorov schools. At the beginning of the 80s there were few Suvorov schools, Nakhimovskoe was generally one in St. Petersburg. Upon graduation, the students entered specialized schools without exams, and were distributed according to the results of their studies. Suvorovites entered the naval with passing exams, we had several of these guys. The name of the Nakhimovites was funny - "crucian carp" (first year, corresponded to the 9th grade of the school) and "pythons" (graduates).
                  1. Dedall
                    Dedall 22 December 2017 01: 29 New
                    +3
                    Respected Andrey NMYou probably forgot that in schools you gave higher education in a civilian specialty, and a higher military officer had the right to name in the column about his education only after graduating from the academy. As for civic education in schools, our Novocherkassk Higher Military School of Higher Education and Science gave the country communications engineers. Even my classmate always laughed that he became a pilot minus an engineer (a diploma engineer pilot).
                    1. Andrey NM
                      Andrey NM 23 December 2017 10: 16 New
                      0
                      Well I do not know. In my diploma both specialties are recorded, both military and civil. But the diploma supplement is still in the personal file. When we entered the second higher, we were made an extract from the application on the necessary subjects with the permission of the competent authorities. I then wrote a report on permission to study. This was already in the early 90's. The three of us then went to the economy, including the commander of our unit. They passed everything externally, instead of 3 years they studied a little over a year. Well, here the commander was a locomotive, thanks to him, studied at night.
                3. cariperpaint
                  cariperpaint 21 December 2017 19: 55 New
                  +1
                  let me tell you so-90 percent of those who studied with me at IED these children of officers. and then our children began to study there. their meaning, which was at creation, was transformed into a very good tradition of promoting dynasties. there are few people from non-military families. so to evade their number rather minus than plus.
                  1. Andrey NM
                    Andrey NM 21 December 2017 20: 37 New
                    0
                    Well, we also had a dynasty developed. I have classmates at 70% in the second or third generation of the military. It often happens that teaching officers with your father either studied, or served together, communicate. And if you mess up, it’s not only what you get from the commanders, but then he’ll fly from his father. And even more so if there are specific specialties such as submarine rocketers. Then there were few of these ships, but now there are very few of them, everyone knows each other ... In general, they tried not to come across :).
              2. Ayratelinsion
                Ayratelinsion 22 December 2017 12: 10 New
                +1
                Yes Yes. Points for admission for the badge. Cool. And preferences for athletes, yeah. As a result, part of the faculties where this is a bunch of physical strong idiots.
            2. Maksim_ms
              Maksim_ms 22 December 2017 14: 19 New
              +1
              Totally agree with you.

              Fundamentals need to be taught at school and at the institute. Then the term will already have basic knowledge.
          2. avt
            avt 21 December 2017 13: 06 New
            +3
            Quote: Finches
            That takes two years to do this!

            And how many served after the war? Do not strain - army -3, fleet -4. This is despite the fact that Stalin proposed 5 and 7. But it was considered unnecessary to take out such an amount of the male population from the national economy, and Kuznetsov said it was certainly good in the Navy 7, but a lot for conscripts. So the magic of 2 years appeared only in 1967.
            Quote: Finches
            2 years are needed not only for the preparation of a higher education institution, but the most important thing for the psychological breakdown and alteration of the psychophysical qualities of a person from a citizen to military tracks!

            You are better then these same
            Quote: Finches
            military rails

            lay somewhere else. Two years is not enough to teach, and then to serve in constant readiness units. They just break in for combat coordination - a demobilizer and bast on wood. The contract for 5 years and conscripts is necessary, as the special services do for themselves, when they select from their sections from school, cook in DOSAAF and conduct at least until the age of 27-30 categories
            Quote: avt
            after a year urgent, ascribe it by profession, as it is in the USA in the National Guard. Here you have a mobile reserve.
            1. Finches
              Finches 21 December 2017 13: 21 New
              +7
              I served in military service and I don’t know about magic - but in the training I was not afraid of the T-72 and even aiming to shoot it! They scared me so much in the tank regiment that I went to the Higher Command School ... but the connection! laughing And I have a certain idea about the training of normal rank-and-file specialists! All this army life I’m doing just that! And I’ll tell you - there’s no need to reinvent the wheel - it’s already invented ... The army of conscripts of the USSR drove the “warriors of Allah” trained by instructors from the USA, China and God knows whom, armed with the best examples of military equipment of the West , in the mountains and deserts of Afghanistan, quite confidently! Yes, even if you recall the First Chechen, with all the total mess and betrayal - the army completed its task ...
              1. basmach
                basmach 21 December 2017 14: 15 New
                +1
                In training, you need to change the structure of training. Issuing not a solo specialist, but a trained and coordinated crew team, crew, squad. And it is in this composition that they should decrease in part and the existing units
                1. cannabis
                  cannabis 21 December 2017 14: 47 New
                  +3
                  I disagree. And categorically. Crews, as well as officers and sergeants, must be of different ages for the transfer of experience and quick training on the example of old-timers. Arriving at the service, young officers from the schools know by heart how and what to do, but the old battalion commander takes them to the park or to the director and for half an hour teaches the practical alignment of day and night sights and shooting machine guns at a pretty penny with 4 rounds, a screwdriver and a 19 key on 22.
              2. Usher
                Usher 21 December 2017 14: 34 New
                0
                Here it seems to me not because of, but in spite of. Those. thanks to the mentality of people it turns out that way. Foreigners are mostly very timid.
            2. Andrey NM
              Andrey NM 21 December 2017 17: 31 New
              0
              From my own experience I’ll say that a sailor on a boat started to think something normally after a year and a half of service, i.e. it can be safely left at a combat post, the boys spent their childhood.
      3. Alekseev
        Alekseev 21 December 2017 14: 52 New
        +2
        Quote: Finches
        Only 2 years is the best time

        Optimal or not, but, of course, it’s better to train a soldier from a conscript than a year minus a weekend and leave.
        In addition to quite difficult to master the technique, for military service the young man needs to be tempered morally and physically.
        To make a good infantryman (shooter), given the requirements for his endurance, courage, shooting training for various small arms, is no easier than, for example, a radar operator.
        For a year, it makes no sense to call in combat units, only in training centers. Then, either in stock or on a contract.
        To reduce the burden on the military budget, some positions in the rear that do not determine combat ability (cooks, some drivers, service personnel) can also be replaced in the combat units by ready-made specialists called up from the "citizen" or employees who are called up for a valid military time .
        The problem is not simple, requiring wise leadership: here is the improvement of the organizational structure, and the finalization of the order of service, and financial issues, etc.
        After all, now in the ground forces up to half or more are soldiers of military service, soldiers of them not of the highest rank.
        And, God forbid, a large-scale conflict (with the same banderlogy) happen?
        Here you can’t get by with an air regiment, a military police battalion, and several special forces, albeit well trained ...
      4. SERGUS
        SERGUS 21 December 2017 15: 10 New
        +1
        Quote: Finches
        Only 2 years is the most optimal period of military service!

        Quote: Finches
        The training methods developed from the time of the Soviet Army are unmeasured - they need only to be reanimated and that’s all!

        Yes, the Soviet military training system was almost perfect, it’s a pity, but nobody even thinks to reanimate it today, because the Supreme Commander-in-Chief said that the Russian army was gradually refusing military service at all.
      5. bandabas
        bandabas 21 December 2017 18: 00 New
        0
        And why not 3, 5 or 10. Half a year in training was not enough to know everything. And, finished up in parts. But, I agree completely, Training at the moment, no.
      6. bandabas
        bandabas 21 December 2017 18: 28 New
        0
        It's not even time. Gav ... That's it. Can you even set the task for coal on birch bark? And to whom?
      7. Shukhov
        Shukhov 22 December 2017 10: 20 New
        0
        What is half a year of intensive training? Half a year is the minimum that you would be admitted to the tank. Further, the study of everything else firing, rap, rep, communication. Further, many do not take into account camouflage, survival in the forest, strategy, tactics, etc. This is all 3-5 years of intensive preparation throughout the period and a very large volume of theory. They are not ready to learn such a volume even by profession thinking about their future, but then they should spend so much effort on training as a tankman, and it is quite likely that this knowledge will not be useful from the word at all. Yes, you need to be diversified and be able to the more the better I agree. My opinion is a training ground, a machine gun, a field exit, a charter, a parade ground, a barracks, a company, colleagues, and a year of urgency. More from conscripts will not be extended!
      8. mih_sergeev92
        mih_sergeev92 24 December 2017 01: 01 New
        0
        It’s possible to train a normal soldier in a year, but it’s possible to get only two oxen in two. The author of the article is right, much depends on the initial preparation, both in the army and in the university. And it depends on the command staff. And now, in some military units, conscripts have been doing nothing for a whole year, and the officer is thumping. Of course, this is not often found, but still there, I have come across this and from my comrades I know. And in such conditions, I don’t want to lose two years either. And by the way, to get into the normal treble, the garter also needs money. Unfortunately, there are actually more problems than what is considered in the article.
        1. Finches
          Finches 24 December 2017 01: 05 New
          0
          You have a photo of actor Vladimir Konkin, who played the main character in the film “How Steel Was Tempered,” but I think that you did not read Nikolai Ostrovsky ... Read! And you will understand what I would like to tell you on your comment ... hi
      9. Prosha
        Prosha 8 September 2018 15: 13 New
        0
        Well, let's say six months is only the second half, although m. something had already changed, but when I happened to serve, the first period was recruited up to June, so there were two months left for classes, no more, but the autumn draft was studied mainly for six months. IMHO, you need to balance the time of mastering the equipment and coordinating the units with the specifics and think hard, and then introduce a differentiated service time, and in order not to create a bad trend due to the difference in the service life at some stage, this difference should be compensated with money or other pluses and privileges.
    2. Conductor
      Conductor 21 December 2017 11: 04 New
      +2
      They will soon forget! You did not notice, in the subway, cafe, a lot of people are sitting on iPhones, it’s especially strange in cafes, couples or companies are sitting and many are on the phone, they will not be able to remove a woman without an Internet.
    3. Cruel beaver
      Cruel beaver 21 December 2017 11: 36 New
      +2
      I think that two years is not enough with the current development of technology. Normally (two years) it will be only then, as the author of the article writes, when we return to the NVP system and, in essence, to the Soviet education system.
      1. Per se.
        Per se. 21 December 2017 18: 43 New
        0
        Quote: cruel beaver
        I think that two years with the current development of technology is not enough.
        When the term of military service was reduced in 1967, this was largely due to the reduction of the army. Then the 2 of the year was considered acceptable (it was 3), the Navy was made 3 of the year urgent (it was 4), later, and the Navy was reduced to 2. At the very least, when working DOSAAF, elementary military training in schools, it was possible to manage this, but, in any case, one year for a country like ours is not enough, even considering resuscitation of training before serving in the army. It’s not even the case that the equipment has become more difficult, rather, on the contrary, it has become somewhat easier when automatics, computers, start to solve a lot. The problem is that there are fewer healthy guys suitable for service in the army and navy, and the only solution here is to use the best ones longer, that is, increasing their lifespan to 3-5 years. If you can find healthy and fit to serve under the contract for 5 years, then it is possible to find conscripts for the same period, moreover, with the motivation to serve for the idea, on constitutional duty, and not for the promised grandmothers. Naturally, we need "gingerbread", bonuses and benefits, prestige, which, nevertheless, will be much more efficient and cheaper than contract servicemen, the main thing will be a planned update, replenishment of the mobilization reserve. What to do with the others who are not fit, do not need, simply, a hose and a net, let these 5 years (or more) work out to the army fund, pay to those who really serve. In the end, the constitutional duty concerns everyone, everyone should be affected, if a war happens, all are lame, slanting and even women will work for the front, for the defense of the country, let it be so initially - the best in the army, all the rest for the army, there is a "front" and "rear", this is the best scheme for constitutional duty, including girls. After an emergency, you can recruit and overtime members (if you will, contract soldiers). In addition, those who are not suited to serve on 3-5 urgent years ("Rear") may well take the oath after short-term training courses, such as the course of the "young fighter" at the place of residence, after and work out the army fund, replenishing the military budget , funding those who will serve 3-5 years. That's all, the end of the problem with those who want to "mow and hammer", hemorrhoids with "alternative service", you do not want, you can not - pay those who serve in your place. That's all the decision that you need to see, making a bet on a comprehensive recruitment of the army, with universal conscription, up to the lame and oblique, even to women (who achieved equal rights, so you get, in Israel, women liable for military service, and nothing). Add to this the school military training, DOSAAF, courses in civil defense enterprises, and everything should work out.
  2. igorka357
    igorka357 21 December 2017 06: 21 New
    0
    The correct article, but only someone will allow it ... what kind of money do you need? Yes, and in the West they’ll shout right away .. "yeah Russians accustom children to war from childhood, you see what kind of aggressors" ...
    1. dSK
      dSK 21 December 2017 14: 15 New
      +3
      Hello Igor!
      Quote: igorka357
      What kind of money do you need?
      And in super stadiums like "Zenit - Arena" found.
      Quote: NEXUS
      revive DOSAAFs, popularize this movement, return the TRP standards, work towards historical and patriotic movements, such as the NEMAN group ... we must also return the pioneer movement, the Komsomol members will also be called ... let it be called differently, but it’s the idea is very correct.

      Ideas are correct, but "to saw" there is nothing there. hi
  3. The comment was deleted.
    1. Grandfather
      Grandfather 21 December 2017 06: 53 New
      +2
      Quote: Alexey Antonov
      Here he is - a modern warrior. A child of computers, the Internet and ... mother and grandmother.

      but the demobilization will go, in full parade ...
    2. siberalt
      siberalt 21 December 2017 06: 56 New
      +3
      Go, in a year you’ll learn to tie shoelaces. It will be worse if the sneakers go out of fashion. We'll have to change the army for Velcrolaughing
      1. Conductor
        Conductor 21 December 2017 11: 05 New
        +1
        In galoshes and bast shoes, there I just stuck my foot in and went and in winter felt boots
    3. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I 21 December 2017 07: 35 New
      +7
      Quote: Alexey Antonov
      Here he is - a modern warrior

      They used to say, "onion grief!" And now .... "the child of the computer and the Internet." The country must know its "heroes"! Where does this “soldier" come from? And people will probably want to know: did the “warrior" learn to program shoelaces in the end ... (pah ..) lace up programs ....?!
    4. Cruel beaver
      Cruel beaver 21 December 2017 11: 39 New
      +1
      A sad sight ....
      Still, there was a certain benefit and meaning in hazing.
      1. Cyril732017
        Cyril732017 21 December 2017 14: 06 New
        +2
        I thought he was 15 years old, he’ll see such a “grandfather” ... I don’t even know what will happen to him :)
    5. Dedall
      Dedall 22 December 2017 01: 49 New
      +3
      Regarding this film, I can explain that it was shot by military police. They always do this now, in order to fix, so to speak, the fact of violation of the uniform of clothes. and, again, emphasize the need for its structure in the ranks of the Moscow Region. And the soldier in this form most likely simply should have been transferred to the place of his service. after treatment in the infirmary, where he lost everything. And we have such a picture every day near the checkpoint, where the police hang around all the time.
      As for the appearance of the Zoldat, this is largely due to the form. The one that we had, I liked more. The cap with ear flaps with its holes for ventilating the ears is especially scary now. In some ways, she reminds me of the cap of the postman Pechkin. Yes, and winter boots ... Song! An experiment on crossing felt boots with dermantine boots.
  4. Nix1986
    Nix1986 21 December 2017 07: 13 New
    +3
    It all depends on the officers and sergeants, for a year and a bear on a dog they teach to ride, if they really teach. A year for acquiring the skills of an ordinary motorized rifle and other rank and file representatives is quite normal.
    1. PSih2097
      PSih2097 21 December 2017 09: 47 New
      +2
      In principle, yes, one year is enough with intensive preparation, but it is advisable that the conscript arrive at school trained at least the basics (drill, gunnery and the fundamentals of RCHBZ) ...
      The Ministry of Defense independently began to change the situation; at military universities, a special training school (school of the future officer) was created.
      1. Nix1986
        Nix1986 21 December 2017 10: 11 New
        +1
        I agree that this can be taught at school and you don’t have to spend time on this while doing the service.
  5. Fight
    Fight 21 December 2017 07: 45 New
    +1
    Definitely ege
    1. passing
      passing 21 December 2017 10: 20 New
      +1
      Definitely ege

      Here he is, a qualified consumer!
  6. Nikolaevich I
    Nikolaevich I 21 December 2017 08: 07 New
    0
    Eh hehe .... similar thoughts and rustle in my head. Each time I read the next news, which reports on the arrival of the next miracle technology in the troops; I’m wondering: who will exploit and service this miracle technology? Where will a sufficient number of people who are educated enough to quickly master the equipment in the required quality come from? Once there were no such thoughts, but at the beginning of this millennium appeared ... against the backdrop of talk about the "amazing education" of the current generation ...
  7. Maalkavianin
    Maalkavianin 21 December 2017 08: 46 New
    +2
    Yes, these 2 years are useless. And a year is enough. Let them tweak the training program and everything will be fine.
  8. Strashila
    Strashila 21 December 2017 08: 49 New
    +5
    And here again 1941 in all its glory ... it is clear why then the troops began to supply the three-ruler, and not the SVT, which was appreciated by the Germans ... reserves decide everything. And yet ... in the memoirs, Aviation Marshal Novikov wrote ... who said in 1941 we did not have airplanes, there were many, only pilots for them were not. And now it’s not 1941 ... and it would seem that universal secondary education has rolled down in level to a parish school (for its time, it’s not bad at all) ... but it’s not the 19th or even the 20th century in the yard .. ... and the 21st, second decade ... the degradation launched by Gorbachev continues.
  9. SPLV
    SPLV 21 December 2017 09: 18 New
    +5
    Novel, Novel. Victims of the exam. I hope that you do not consider yourself one, so why do numbers become numbers?
    .400 of thousands of trained and competent specialists is a very tangible figure.

    I will list ALL NUMBERS in the modern decimal system: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 0.
    I understand perfectly well that there are problems with this notorious UGE, but do not you think that this reminds you of the search for witches? There are problems with this, but for a start it would be better to understand the essence, and not to swear thoughtlessly. Yes, the USE is not the top of perfection, but if you think about it, do you not remind yourself of some characters who, instead of analyzing the situation and trying to figure it out, immediately appoint the guilty ones? Compare: the Russians are to blame for everything! and: the USE is to blame for everything. I believe that one should not be likened to "partners", indiscriminately blaming the scapegoat appointed in advance.
    And, as the classic used to say: let someone throw a stone at me who says that this is a girl.
    1. Dedall
      Dedall 22 December 2017 01: 56 New
      +1
      Dear SPLV, but you did not try to ask 10 recruits about what is direct and alternating current? If they communicated in the way I have to, then they would agree with the author of the article. And I can say responsibly, as an employee THEN and for 20 years NOW, that there has been a steady decline in the level of just basic knowledge: physics, chemistry, biology and the same Russian language. It’s difficult, you know, to talk about providing first aid if a soldier does not know about the difference between arteries and veins and where the liver and kidneys are.
      1. SPLV
        SPLV 22 December 2017 02: 40 New
        +1
        Quote: Dedall
        there is a steady decline in the level of just basic knowledge: physics, chemistry, biology and the same Russian language.

        I completely agree. But the exam as such is not the root cause. And all the education reforms of these years, the notorious USE is far from limited. The problem is much deeper.
  10. Altona
    Altona 21 December 2017 09: 33 New
    +2
    Quote: Finches
    Only 2 years is the most optimal period of military service!

    ---------------------------
    I think that 1,5 is enough, because the remaining six months are devoted to embroidering epaulettes, sewing axelbands and carefully collecting archives about their military exploits, which the Ministry of Defense and the Commander-in-Chief ignored. Well, and if, according to the article itself, then in Soviet times the quality of draftees varied greatly. But then there were more rural and provincial youth in general, and the army actually stood on it. In general, I found myself in a unique situation when in the training half of the platoon was from Muscovites and half from Ukrainians, though from the eastern and central regions. A couple of Muscovites, moreover of Jewish nationality, were generally little adapted to this life. For Simakovich, ceremonial boots were a revelation, my mother bought him then fashionable Velcro sneakers, and I had to learn to tie shoelaces. Another already had some degree of obesity and the unit commander ordered him to just wind circles on physical exercises and by the end of training he noticeably built, the regiment was proud of this result. There was also a shot from some Vinnitsa collective farm like Kalinichenko. He was already 24 years old, he was ill with leg motility, his legs were cut by the reaper, yes, don’t be surprised. How did he get into the army? I went to the district, "piishov to the military commissar and having said, take me to the army. Wuxi (in the sense of friends) also served men of treba." And so, "having been on the combine, smag beer and women having," as they say. And there were two of them, Yukhnevich (who themselves understood) and Kalinichenko, who marched as in break dance, the gait of a robot. In general, here's a sketch from 1988.
  11. vladimirvn
    vladimirvn 21 December 2017 09: 47 New
    +3
    It seems to me that among a certain part of young people there is an opinion that it is enough to get (buy) a diploma of higher education once and that’s all, you don’t need to learn more. Understand that you need to learn constantly, throughout life is not until everyone reaches. In the army, as elsewhere, we need qualified specialists who are ready to carry out their duties efficiently and improve their knowledge and skills. The mentality of people needs to be changed. And we do not know more than half of the doctors of science in a foreign language.
  12. cannabis
    cannabis 21 December 2017 10: 10 New
    +6
    We consider the study month 25 days. Ten hours a day is 250 hours. For three months, 750 hours. 750! Learn only practice. The pinnacle of soldier's science is skills in working with weapons or with weapons. Skills should develop automatic (sensory). And excess knowledge will only interfere. Only teach what is needed in battle. Therefore, of course, the soldier is told about the "thousandth" formula, but they are not allowed to bring the machine to normal combat. Until now, I don’t know how the “linearization” block works and where the “weight compensation” signals come from in ATGMs, but this did not prevent me from making launches at the time. And how do you tell me the difference in this from me who are not able to read bearded men - operators from the Near and Middle East? “Warfare is very simple, but difficult to fight” is a familiar phrase?
    1. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I 22 December 2017 02: 50 New
      0
      In the “training” we were “driven” quite well ... as a result, six months later, I, a specialist of the 3 class, could independently work with the ZAS equipment, “pair” it with various communication means, and also could shoot from a machine gun and get in in a PCP kit We also studied equipment block diagrams (not secret), and it came in handy! I had to urgently repair the control panel myself. So .... to know your "weapons", from the inside "is highly desirable!
  13. GRIGORIY76
    GRIGORIY76 21 December 2017 11: 06 New
    10
    Recently returned from the ranks of the armed forces of the Russian Federation. served in the motorized infantry brigade ZVO, I won’t write the part number, I’ll just write in the brigade 2 battalions on the BTR-82A and 1 battalion on the BMP-3 (who in the subject will understand what kind of part). Position held all year and in reserve: deputy commander of a combat vehicle - gunner operator. I have never seen a BMP-3 live, I wasn’t inside; in general, these posts are staffed by military personnel “half-year-olds” who arrived from Mulino. From the AK-74M fired only at the KMB. Weapons were seen only by servicemen entering the guards and garrison outfits. Most of the service was occupied by stupid sitting on the Central Committee or in the KD, conscript sergeants were engaged in educational work. Every month I handed over 1000 rubles for the needs of a company. The processor that was issued at the military registration and enlistment office was immediately taken away and I didn’t see it anymore, dry packs too (they are later sold in units of 200-250 rubles). If you wanted to go on dismissal, you had to pay the company commander, or the political officer of the battalion. VKPO bought the summer uniform for himself, since he didn’t want to go in a torn Serdyukov figure; her soldiers called it “elephant”. By the way, summer berets (who were issued at the military registration and enlistment office) were already killed by March, they had to buy new ones, they survived until early July. So comrades, all the same, most of you have a rather vague idea of ​​today's armed forces (namely, infantry, this is really meat), everything is much worse than the author of the article describes. If I have specific questions about the service, I will answer with pleasure.
  14. Naum
    Naum 21 December 2017 11: 06 New
    +2
    Yes, we need reform of the school, we need NVP, DOSAAF. All this was, was, was ... New - long forgotten old. Trite, but it is. It's time to collect stones.
    Nuclear (even local) war will not last very long. A professional contract army in it will quickly disappear. And then what? ..
  15. Altona
    Altona 21 December 2017 11: 28 New
    0
    Quote: GRIGORIY76
    So comrades, all the same, most of you have a rather vague idea of ​​today's armed forces (namely, infantry, this is really meat), everything is much worse than the author of the article describes.

    ------------------------------
    What to do? Will have to be the old guard of Napoleon, who is now from 40 to 60. request
  16. Zounds
    Zounds 21 December 2017 11: 41 New
    0
    But in principle, can a non-combatant army be combat-ready? No matter how you look at the history, they seem to cook, teach, do the best weapons (according to the creators) in the world, but the war begins and the army is not ready, and as always for absolutely objective reasons, you see the war was not the way we imagined it )))

    I think it would be interesting to compare the effectiveness and cost of training programs that are used in different armies of the world.
  17. ROM1077
    ROM1077 21 December 2017 12: 08 New
    +1
    and what is armata? oh this is a prototype in the amount of a few pieces well yes it's cool .... ahahahahahaha
    1. Vasya Vassin
      Vasya Vassin 22 December 2017 21: 39 New
      +3
      So in such an idiotic state of affairs, he still offers to extend the service life "so that a soldier can take it apart by a screw." Is this in battle? Under enemy fire? Will the soldier there solder the microcircuit on a ballistic computer?
      ON, XRP, ON such a technique that it becomes more difficult to maintain? The equipment should not be more complicated, but EASIER in servicing by the driver, by the operator.
  18. penguin
    penguin 21 December 2017 12: 19 New
    +1
    professionals who know the technique to the screw and can do everything
    - frankly, you got excited
  19. vlad007
    vlad007 21 December 2017 12: 51 New
    +3
    For some reason, the author did not address the question of how much time IN THE YEAR it is precisely the training of young soldiers. I would like to know the specific number of hours for vocational training, combat training, etc. The article is too general, as always there is little specificity. As for school education, it should be noted that in the school curriculum there is not a single subject that would familiarize students with TECHNOLOGY. Many (not all) modern schoolchildren have absolutely no idea how a diesel engine differs from ICE, etc. Technical illiteracy is becoming the norm in modern life, but in the Army, a technically illiterate person poses a real danger to others.
  20. masterovoy
    masterovoy 21 December 2017 13: 03 New
    +3
    Until recently, he worked as a teacher in one of the centers for training specialists for the Navy. A four-month course in my specialty is 90 hours, of which 50 hours are theoretical training and 40 hours are practical classes. In the best case, I was given 10-15 hours for theory and 5-6 for practice, the composition of the students rarely exceeded 50% of the composition of the trained group. The rest of the time, cadets built something, ground paths and parade ground, provided competitions and prepared contests, worked at summer cottages of the Navy Research Center of the Navy, were ill, etc. Of the total number of trained cadets capable of perceiving military science and somehow working with weapons , there was no more than 25-30%, the rest were completely "sucks", but almost everyone passed the final exams (the heads of the training cycles, following the instructions of the leadership, chose 1-2_x "doubles", and not always the worst, declared them not passing the exams, but all equally released to the fleet Why and who needs such "warriors"?
  21. Skipper
    Skipper 21 December 2017 13: 08 New
    +3
    I don’t know how in the army, but I have not enough service for two years on the submarine. Someone comes to the ship, half a year of training is behind him, and in his eyes is a complete “zero”. For six months now, with this goblin, you have been studying equipment, systems, maintenance of compartments, its management. You take offsets on "admissions to the shift", "stand alone. Management of your office," you recall physics and mathematics with him. Another control is from constant to periodic, what it knows and how it can do. And after a year of crawling through the holds, you understand that his report from the compartment means that he is no longer a Goblin, but a fighter and did everything as he reported. And then you realize that he has 1,5 years behind him and after 6 months he will leave you. AND EVERYTHING FIRST. New goblin.
  22. Sergey824
    Sergey824 21 December 2017 13: 33 New
    0
    We are paying for the populism of our predecessors. After all, the hedgehog is understandable, the equipment will only become more complicated, and the service life has been taken and reduced. Earlier and for six months, training was not assy obtained. Yes, study in them also needs to be changed, made specific, intensive ... Remembering my first 6 months, I can say that you can meet 3-4. But 6 was determined, regardless of the complexity of the specialty. There is nothing wrong with increasing the service life, only on one condition - the SOLDIER must engage in combat training.
  23. sokoljlga
    sokoljlga 21 December 2017 13: 35 New
    +1
    It’s not just NVP, It’s real, if you want, before the army, to teach the basics of military specialties at school. Boys. Girls, wishing. It’s necessary, together with the Ministry of Education, to develop METHODS for intensive training of soldiers. CREATE CENTERS FOR TRAINING. . Allocate a day a week and start preparing children from 10 years old. Sport. Technical. Then you can organize a practice in part. That is, you need to do ORGANIZATION of the case.
  24. Glory1974
    Glory1974 21 December 2017 13: 38 New
    +3
    The problem of training military personnel is long overdue. They only try to solve it by half measures, but radical transformations are needed.
    A fighter in the Chechen Republic who completed the 3-month training course in combat ability was equal to our soldier 2's year-old, and trained in the 5 monthly program was in no way inferior to a military university graduate - lieutenant, or even exceeded him in practical actions. True, in the fighting of the 95 spring in the mountainous part of Chechnya, our conscripts showed themselves very well, which Maskhadov noted with surprise for himself.
    Therefore, training methods we may have, as Zyablitsev writes, but there is no training itself. Only war takes into account. It's a shame, comrade officers.
  25. Poppy
    Poppy 21 December 2017 13: 40 New
    0
    Quote: avt
    And how many served after the war? Do not strain - army -3, fleet -4.

    They are ordinary, and sergeants / foremen served more than a year
  26. sokoljlga
    sokoljlga 21 December 2017 13: 43 New
    +1
    The training of soldiers begins with the training of officers. People who know how to teach are not frequent. IT IS TIME TO INCREASE, if desired, the service life of the trainers. And the younger commanders too. And the selection of cadets to conduct stricter. Selecting stable, calm guys. Organize the possibility of a problem-free transfer from universities wanting .V Military schools. It is necessary to organize, probably, a development department in the Ministry of Defense, and it is not possible to solve problems within its framework. It is IMPOSSIBLE to increase the time. But it is necessary to work with conscripts on concluding contracts. Perhaps, within the framework of dividing the training in military specialties into skill levels.
  27. armenk
    armenk 21 December 2017 13: 43 New
    +3
    I don’t understand what the problem is, give privileges to study at universities, for those who agree to serve another year extra? I think it would motivate many. Especially those who are from the regions and have little chance of entering decent educational institutions.
  28. seos
    seos 21 December 2017 13: 46 New
    +4
    The author’s suggestions are bullshit, I explain on the fingers:
    1) The author proposes either to increase the service life to 2 years, or the creation of military regional training centers (or all together).
    Why do I think that this is nonsense - the army has discredited itself in the 90s and it will never be able to wash off from it, they rowed everyone in the military enlistment offices, including invalids, drug addicts and lunatics ... to prove that you were not fit, it was impossible to take conscripts with me without me, with a broken spine, once I saw how a conscript was taken in the vegetative state, so the "doctors" opened the champagne for joy and screamed in full throat that this plant will serve the motherland ... You all know about the attitude to conscripts in the military enlistment office, conscript = disenfranchised having no rights. (I was recently at the Moscow military registration and enlistment office, so there on the bars and the door to the castle locks remotely from the cell, as I went to prison). If the conscript is treated like a slave, then what attitude will he have towards the army?
    About 2 years of service is nonsense, first of all, that for 1 year, that for 2 years they won’t teach how to shoot from a machine gun, because they won’t teach (this is about 5 rounds of ammunition at a shooting range, etc.), okay, you can still prepare a soldier somehow, but there is NO specialist , should not be taught in the army but in special military schools. And the youth does not want to study in such schools, not everyone likes voluntary slavery and barracks in these schools ...
    About 2 more years - 18 years is the time when a young man should get on his feet, build his life, and he will be sent to the army, from where he comes dumb and unable to work in the specialty he studied, after the army he will either go to the police or to the guard , can do nothing else ...

    Regarding regional training centers, the author suggests forcibly bringing meat to these centers and forcibly training them there. I think from under the stick the effectiveness of such training will be zero. Of course, he doesn’t directly say that they will drive kicks to these centers, but in fact it is. This will be a cluster of embittered masses pulled out of their comfortable little worlds and forcibly shoved into this center, I think the situation there will not be conducive to learning ...

    How to do it right:
    It is necessary for the government to fork out and create shooting clubs (many subsidized clubs) where children will go voluntarily and free of charge, where they will be trained in shooting, tactics and arrange war games, training can be organized according to the type of life safety with an in-depth study of the techniques of means of destruction and survival in a military conflict , survival in the forest, hiking, etc.
    People need to be interested and learn, they will want themselves with the appropriate quality of training.
    Incidentally, the creation and spending on such clubs will be less than the cost of training soldiers in the barracks ...
    1. Nikolaevich I
      Nikolaevich I 22 December 2017 03: 14 New
      0
      Quote: seos
      About the 2 service of the year, this is nonsense, first of all, that for the 1 year, that for the 2 of the year they will not be taught to shoot from the machine gun, because they will not be taught (this is about 5 cartridges at the shooting range, etc.), okay, the soldier can still be trained somehow, but there is NO specialist , should not be taught in the army but in special military schools.

      For six months I became a specialist in the 3 class in the “training”, I could independently work with the ZAS equipment, “pair” it with various means of communication, I knew the principle of the equipment, I knew the block diagrams, I could carry out minor repairs - what else is needed for the “half year” ?

      Quote: seos
      18 years is the time when a young man should get on his feet, build his life, and he will be sent to the army, from where he comes dumb and unable to work in the specialty he studied, after the army he will either go to the police or to the guard, do nothing else can not...

      18 years- when a “kid” after school “comes out” with “mother’s pies at zopé”, often without knowing life (without life experience), without a specialty, without a specific concept: “which university to enter” ... ( just to act, but in some it doesn’t matter)! What is there, on the fix, "degradation" !!! ??? And the army will teach a lot, tell a lot! Teach to effectively solve problems in life, to stand up for yourself. I know for myself.
    2. Vasya Vassin
      Vasya Vassin 22 December 2017 21: 32 New
      0
      I agree completely. smile everything is correctly described.
    3. syndicalist
      syndicalist 23 December 2017 08: 46 New
      0
      Well, I would add the NVP at school and the retraining system of reservists
  29. Santor
    Santor 21 December 2017 13: 58 New
    0
    An article in the subject ... I’ll also add that somehow conscripts have recently been sent to serve not far from home, and mothers are besieging those on Saturdays ...
  30. rus-5819
    rus-5819 21 December 2017 14: 00 New
    +1
    Even six months later, conscripts in their bulk are the universal sadness.

    My son served in the communications forces. On the next visit, I begin to "torture" him: - "Well, warrior, tell me what you learned?"
    - "Yes, dad, I'm sitting looking at the screen, if so, (draws a clumsy sinusoid), then this is normal, but if so (the same clumsy straight line), then this is bad, I need to call an officer!"

    In terms of the head. There is such a malicious program for stupidity, the exam is called.

    for this we need to do something with the Ministry of Education

    In the prewar years (30-40 of the last century, the USSR had a military training program, every citizen was obliged to learn the basics of military affairs .. And the calls were “Komsomolets - by plane”, “Voroshilovsky shooter”, etc.
    And at us DOSAAF lets out packs of drivers (on a paid basis).
    “Yunarmia” may be good, but not everywhere, the TRP is also mainly focused on sports.
    (And schoolchildren without a cell can not navigate in the forest)
    Conclusion: It’s time for our deputies to stop doing crap (such as changing the size of road signs and sticking stickers on cars), and take up the country's defense capabilities, accept and implement the pre-draft training program not on paper but in practice! And in the government there are fewer "managers" and to select professionals by industry. (Madame in education clearly does not pull, although there were certain hopes for her).
  31. loaln
    loaln 21 December 2017 14: 04 New
    0
    What to moan? All this was clear in the process of the collapse of the army. So, it turns out that no one was ruining the army, but simply destroying everything Soviet in it. And for this, they are only grateful if you listen to officialdom. So why is he crying? For that fought for it and ran. Still, Russian proverbs are good and relevant!
  32. Krasnodar
    Krasnodar 21 December 2017 14: 06 New
    -1
    For military forces:
    4 months of KMB, 2 months of interaction with other branches of the army (if motorized infantry, then with tanks and aircraft, etc.)
    Then build up professionalism in his army specialty (another six months) + combat duty somewhere in a "hot" spot (the Caucasus, probably). Another half a year.
    And about complex equipment like Armata - this is only for contractors.
    In Israel, about three years of service for guys, another fourteen years (on average) - reservist service - a month for a year, and if war, then it does not take into account time and rotation. It seems to work.
  33. groks
    groks 21 December 2017 14: 08 New
    +1
    Military equipment has become more complicated - of course. But not towards its use. And of course, the recruits are not annoyed not by 2 instead of 1, but by the conditions of these 2 or 1. Well, let's say - not absolutely annoying.
    The horrors of the exam ... well, otherwise graduates will understand too much. Think about it. And the training system itself somehow does not imply what was under the USSR. When the soldiers for some reason (!) Coped with tanks and self-propelled guns and with everything else. Those. only very talented teachers can be interested in - such are far from the majority. And to force, but how to force? But we continue to strive for democratic values ​​(God forgive me!), And is it really possible for them to leave children on the ass with a ruler or leave after classes?
    The problem is that our government wants the people to be like in the Union, but does not want the Union itself. here they groan and turn.
  34. Captain Angry
    Captain Angry 21 December 2017 14: 10 New
    +1
    The author is right. Just why it wouldn’t be possible to create DOSAAF training centers in every association without state support, without this. To recruit there instructors-reserve officers with normal salaries as in Soviet times and to resurrect the initial training of combined-arms specialties and then specialists of special forces .Because the modern DOSAAF is currently a profanation! Appoint the chairman of DOSAAF as the Deputy Defense Ministry of the Russian Federation, to entrust the preparation of mobilization resources to this organization. In wartime, on the basis of these centers, deploy DOSAAF territorial divisions for local territorial defense in wartime (there is also a complete blockage).
  35. ont65
    ont65 21 December 2017 14: 26 New
    +3
    The topic addressed is by no means a particularity. The author wants to check the fortress of the defense concept, whether he wants it or not. At the top, they decided, they decided, and came to the sad conclusion: there will be no previous wars with a stake on economic power (where will it come from?), So those who managed to prepare and arm will go into battle. And it's all. No second echelons, no evacuations, people and industry, bomb shelters and other things. Well really? - By releasing a dozen aircraft and a hundred Caliber per year of peace time, you can only somehow build up a reserve of the first strike, but in no way carry on a long confrontation with, say, the US Army.
  36. Natalia777
    Natalia777 21 December 2017 14: 36 New
    +1
    Great article. USE really numb. People with normal thinking are needed everywhere, and even more so in the army, where technology is on the verge of fantasy. The modern exam system leaves students thinking at the level of the 3rd grade of the development of the logical thought process. When the country is filled with Unified State Examiners, one will have to switch to prehistoric methods of warfare. Please return the Soviet methodology of education!
  37. Vovan74
    Vovan74 21 December 2017 15: 08 New
    0
    I, as I remember myself in high school, from the 4th grade at each break, ran into the office of the NVP. The military commander kicked out kicks ... When the time came, AK analysis - It’s as if, incidentally ... I became an officer ... I’m trying to teach my son simple army truths ... It remains only to say obscenities about the current education system. Or to the wall?
  38. Yanakolos
    Yanakolos 21 December 2017 15: 19 New
    0
    Not “Javelin” is terrible “Armata”, no. A modern tank is terrified with bulging lamb eyes of the one who, in theory, would have to sit in it and complete the task. Fighting.
    -
    Well said, it’s better not to put it simply ... :)))) (although the laugh is sad ..)

    In general, the army should be professional, time itself and circumstances push it to this - the 21st century, whatever one may say, and to make a cool warrior even in two years, in my opinion, is absurd
  39. The comment was deleted.
  40. Terenin
    Terenin 21 December 2017 16: 02 New
    +6
    Quote: Alexey Antonov

    Here he is - a modern warrior. A child of computers, the Internet and ... mother and grandmother.

    Normal guy. Which hands will fall. Sculpt from it what you want. I see that he has a conscience, and this is not enough.
  41. DRIVEX
    DRIVEX 21 December 2017 16: 03 New
    +2
    Hmmm ... it seemed to me alone that in the article the author substitutes concepts?
  42. Sagan_bator
    Sagan_bator 21 December 2017 16: 06 New
    0
    There is a project called "Last Call" on the Internet, and by the way, it talks about the same problem as in the article above. Although I am a civilian, I understand that an illiterate soldier is a problem for the army and the country as a whole. And in these thoughts you can go far, up to smart conversion and the formation of the 21st century. Yes, one per capita financing of schools leads to a small number of schools in villages and cities, which leads to the final capture of children's minds by thieves' concepts and gangster romance. He grew up in such a village.
    And now I am studying as a manager in education, and there is a whole subject-marketing of educational services! In general, we must move on to the principle of "knowledge for all."
    1. Macross
      Macross 21 December 2017 16: 28 New
      0
      We must move on, I learned it myself, teach a neighbor. And not knowledge for everyone (we can see in some individuals who speak and talk about not the wine of those killed).
  43. Macross
    Macross 21 December 2017 16: 26 New
    +1
    He is the conscript, the contractor is already an officer who must also learn how to manage conscripts. What is the problem? Or should the contractor not communicate with conscripts and must go in parallel?
  44. Igor_1
    Igor_1 21 December 2017 17: 16 New
    +2
    Objective: to prepare competent soldiers in the event of hostilities who can work with complex equipment.
    Solution: It’s all been invented for a long time - students study in technical schools and institutes like that ... To learn how to manage a complex system (for example, air defense), you don’t have to live in the barracks and 80% of the time spent on floor cleaning and other related activities came to the army and until 8:30 you learn to protect the sky.
    Conscripts are a snag for the whole world, like we have a big army, and there’s no one to fight.
    Contractors are soldiers for participating in local wars in peacetime.
  45. Penzyac
    Penzyac 21 December 2017 19: 03 New
    0
    Quote: Conductor
    In galoshes and bast shoes, there I just stuck my foot in and went and in winter felt boots

    With regard to bast shoes, you are greatly mistaken, they relied onuchi ("windings") - this thing will be more cunning than the famous footcloths! ...
  46. Awaz
    Awaz 21 December 2017 19: 11 New
    +2
    to learn how to fight, not so much time is needed. During the Second World War or in Afghanistan, soldiers learned to fight in two three months, after having truthfully completed the course of a young soldier. They served in the USSR for two years, only most of the time they didn’t engage in combat training, but they lurked about nonsense. An average fighter can be trained in six months, who will already be able to make the right decision, if only the process is organized correctly. It would be much more interesting for the boys to drive on tank-fields, to draw squares, not on the parade ground.
    But still, you can teach a soldier to fight only on the front line. The task of military service in peacetime is to learn how to use weapons and equipment. Everything else is comprehended by personal experience ...
  47. true
    true 21 December 2017 19: 24 New
    +1
    I have long believed that the abolition of NWP at school was a blow to the country's defense capability worse than the dismantling of submarines. And NWP had to be returned a long time ago. Since the president delivered the famous speech in Munich in 2004, it was necessary to return immediately. Soviet children, and already at school to separate children according to specialties - to whom, according to physical, psychological, intellectual data, to landing, to whom to tankmen, to whom to submariners, etc. And when a guy with such an initial base comes to the army, in a year, if you do not dig from here before lunch, and do not sweep a platz with a crowbar, do not paint grass, etc., you can make a specialist. And I completely agree with the author about the exam, May 9 begins on September 1, this is a well-known thing, and the level of education in our country today is certainly depressing.
  48. Utlan
    Utlan 21 December 2017 19: 27 New
    0
    Yes, it's time to divide classes in schools, boys separately girls separately. And to start accustoming boys to military affairs from a school bench. As with the king, let all the boys be cadets.
    1. seos
      seos 21 December 2017 20: 20 New
      0
      In geyropa, the same thing in schools was such a division .... here and now, boys are separate and girls are separate ... belay
  49. tank64rus
    tank64rus 21 December 2017 20: 47 New
    0
    The Ministry of Education is just pests, I drive myself with the victims of the exam at the university. Now about the collapse of military education is the "success" of Serdyukov and his team. There are no military institutes included, they simply destroyed under the applause of the liberals. We are having a hybrid war that could just go into the hot phase and that’s it. And we are all afraid or deliberately shout that the international community will not understand us. Really to us doping scandals have not opened our eyes. The clash of Russian and Anglo-Saxon civilizations continues, but here they do not take prisoners.
  50. Severok
    Severok 21 December 2017 21: 05 New
    +4
    I worked. Sensibly.
    But the author has no understanding that the main enemy is not the Unified State Examination, not the Ministry of Education and Science. The main enemy is the one who sits in the government and is called the CAPITALIST. The capitalist does not need educated people. The capitalist does not need people in the full sense of the word, i.e. educated, creative, thinking.

    Look at what is happening in Ukraine - see the capitalists? See who they turned into with the help of the Western capitalists PEOPLE ??? This is what Russia expects if "businessmen" and "entrepreneurs" continue to remain in power. Russia will face the fate of Ukraine if the country's leadership continues to support the owners of stolen socialist property.

    I have the honor.
    1. Alexei
      Alexei 21 December 2017 21: 41 New
      0
      Right. The main enemy is not the exam, but the people with whose filing the aforementioned exam is launched.