Military Review

Yuri Krupnov: The extra population is in Moscow, in the villages - its critical shortage

109
The level of labor productivity in Moscow exceeds the national average 2,5 times, and compared to rural settlements in Russia - 5-7 times. This was announced by the Mayor of the capital, Sergei Sobyanin, during a discussion with the head of the council of the Center for Strategic Research, Chairman of the Committee for Civil Initiatives Alexei Kudrin at the All-Russian Civil Forum. 15 million people living in rural areas, according to Sobyanin, "superfluous", "not necessary for the production of agricultural products, taking into account new technologies." The mayor of Moscow blamed the reason for the lack of quality workplaces in villages and small towns for the authorities to “natural trends,” mainly urbanization. “Without concentration in large metropolitan areas, we cannot raise labor productivity, high technologies, science, education, health care, or human capital,” the mayor of Moscow, a city, is believed unfairly considered to be a “parasite.” The postulates voiced by Sergey Sobyanin were refuted by the Chairman of the Supervisory Board of the Institute for Demography, Migration and Regional Development Yuri Krupnov.




He shared his expert opinion with Nakanune.RU:

- First, about labor productivity. When in August I discussed the doctrine of “raskosvichivaniya”, I made several calculations about the attitude of the hypermegalopolis of Moscow and such a million-plus city like Omsk. The budget security of Omsk per inhabitant is 13 times less than in Moscow. This means that, even if we imagine that in Moscow at 2,5, labor productivity is higher than the national average, then it turns out that Moscow is living beyond its means seven times. And if we compare the budgetary security of poor villages to one resident, then even if there is less labor productivity in the village in 10, then in Moscow this ratio is not 1 to 13, as in Omsk, and 1 to 100. Therefore, all these calculations about labor productivity do not reflect any reality. This is a fiction, a fairy tale or, as Sergei Semenovich likes to speak recently, “fake”. These are fake figures about labor productivity, which reflect nothing, except for the desire to completely disproportionate the distribution of funds in favor of Moscow to pass off as a development driver. In reality, Moscow is in its purest form a parasite on the body of both villages and small towns, and the rest of the megacities of Russia. In this sense, all the fantasies of a successful mayor in one minute can end if we move the capital from Moscow, remove the large corporations from there, and build industry in Moscow’s neighboring areas, and tomorrow it will suddenly turn out that Moscow is a big depressed city. This is absolutely artificial prosperity, moreover, parasitic. It deserts and depletes the country.

Secondly, about "15 millions of extra people." This figure is also taken from the ceiling, because even if we take the share of the rural population to the urban, and it is about a quarter (75% is urban, 25% is rural), then Sobyanin confuses people engaged in agricultural work and rural people. Even if we take the tale that in the US 3% of people provide the country with food, they are about people engaged in agricultural work. And in the village live people engaged in various kinds of work! In the developed world, the share of the rural population is approximately from 18 to 27%, we have 25%. In this sense, the Russian Federation looks normal. But given the fact that our population density is four times less than in the US, and compared to the UK or Germany - 100 times, then our population in the countryside is absolutely not enough. Not that we have it too much, we have a critical shortage of this population! Another thing is that the extra population is in Moscow. If artificial conditions of prosperity are removed in Moscow in the form of corporate accounts, budget allocations, near-budget "little firms", then 15 million in this Moscow region, which covers Moscow and neighboring regions where 35 million people live, will be "redundant". Sergey Semenovich confused. Not looking under the lantern. 15 million people are superfluous, not in rural areas, there is just a deficit, and the extra ones are in Moscow. If we deal with these "extra people", then with Sergei Semenovich and we must begin!

Finally, the third point. All these discussions are shocking to all but the rare strange adherents of the doctrine of further "osmosvivchivaniya." People say that if we don’t continue investing in small towns and villages, then, of course, it will be even worse there, and the entire population will be “odd” in 10 years. It is necessary to develop industry, infrastructure, invest in small cities, and not to discuss that everyone either moved to Moscow or died from boredom in the villages. It is necessary to develop the country. But for some reason, this simple for the state man thought that it is necessary to develop the country, and not fantasize on the topic of "extra 15 millions", the highest official of the subject of the federation Sergey Semenovich and his advisers does not occur.

Also taken aback is from the words about "natural trends". Imagine that a person comes to a doctor and says: “I have a hernia in the body, it naturally grew and grows further,” and the doctor instead of taking a knife and operating it, says: “You know, you have such a natural hernia in your natural body, so it should continue to grow, let it grow further. Why do you want me to cut it out? " The task of the state manager is not to be led by natural tendencies. We have a natural extinction in the country, we have a demographic collapse. Let's then go to the graveyard for natural trends! The task of the state manager is to build counter-trends through the design of completely different forms and ways of life. When a person speaks about natural tendencies, being a public servant, it is strange. Natural trends are an inappropriate subject matter of management, at a minimum.

We need to create jobs. The creation of 2020 million jobs at the highest level by 25 was announced. Where are they? We need an infrastructure, industrial breakthrough through the creation of millions of jobs in the regions, small towns and villages. Putin requires this, and officials say to him: "Yes, this is a natural tendency, let the village die, and we will write dissertations on these natural tendencies!"
Originator:
https://www.nakanune.ru/articles/113491/
109 comments
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  1. Vasya Vassin
    Vasya Vassin 3 December 2017 06: 57
    11
    That's about how everyone turned upside down the drill, he needs to open his eyes surgically.
    1. Chertt
      Chertt 3 December 2017 07: 35
      61
      Do not offend my neighbors Buryats .... But seriously
      "In reality, Moscow is in its pure form a parasite on the body of both villages and small towns" - Standing applauds all the "zamkadye" The imbalance of Moscow-Russia is the same problem in our country. like corruption
      1. My address
        My address 3 December 2017 09: 02
        42
        hi Alexey!
        You will get acquainted with the pearls of the largest representatives of Elita (Chubais about extra people, Gref about the downfather country, Sobyanin about how M-VA feeds the whole country and other curly-colored ones) and recall the anecdote:
        In a dispute with Ivan Vladimirovich Michurin, Lavrenty Pavlovich in the heat of the moment said: “What can you know about pests!”.
        1. turbris
          turbris 3 December 2017 11: 38
          +2
          Haha Funny and very similar.
      2. antivirus
        antivirus 3 December 2017 11: 30
        +8
        The mayor of Moscow attributed the reason for the lack of high-quality jobs in villages and small towns to the counteraction of the authorities to "natural trends", mainly urbanization
        THE GUYS HAVE ARRIVED, THE PRODUCT HAVE MADE THE SOBYAN, THE GRANT-EATING RESIDENTS WERE NOT FILLED IN ITS STATISTICS AND DISTRIBUTED THIS LABOR PERFORMANCE IN MOSCOW

        it's time to think about the federal prospects of the CCC - how does Chukotka live after Abramovich? - it is necessary and there to raise 2,5 times everything and everyone
      3. Sling cutter
        Sling cutter 3 December 2017 11: 58
        24
        Quote: Chertt
        The imbalance between Moscow and Russia is the same problem in our country. like corruption

        I agree.
        In fact, we have two countries with different living standards and different motivations. We have Moscow and St. Petersburg, everything else, our “helmsmen” are called peripherals or regions, people still live in the capitals, but they survive in the regions with a lack of medicine, education and infrastructure.
        1. iouris
          iouris 4 December 2017 00: 38
          +2
          Quote: Stroporez
          In fact, we have two countries

          As if they were no more. Things are going to this. And whether I am a pessimist or an optimist, let everyone decide for himself.
        2. Zefr
          Zefr 6 December 2017 16: 03
          0
          They also bomb me a little when the announcer (!) On television says: "in the regions." So it is heard: "in the territories of the Papuans."
      4. ando_bor
        ando_bor 3 December 2017 23: 06
        +4
        Quote: Chertt
        In reality, Moscow is in its pure form a parasite on the body of both villages and small towns

        The Horde is clearly to blame for everything - Tver, Vladimir, Veliky Novgorod - and where did Moscow come from? - the tender in the Horde won the collection of tribute in Russia, on which it rose, - The Horde has long been kicked out, and Moscow still collects tribute, and corruption from there, it is not corruption but feeding from the place of tribute collectors, some abuse of power performing direct duties.
    2. siberalt
      siberalt 3 December 2017 07: 39
      45
      Moscow in fact sucks resources from the regions. And in order to somehow cover up, they declare their high performance. Their main productivity is speculation, entertainment and entertainment.
      1. alekc73
        alekc73 3 December 2017 09: 02
        30
        Move the capital to Novosibirsk. All cash flows there. What will Sobyanin say then. Re-educate him late. Send somewhere to conditional Uryupinsk, where the whole industry is standing or half-living. All taxes are taken away by Moscow and less money is allocated back. Then turn around the mayor hi
        1. Greenwood
          Greenwood 3 December 2017 09: 58
          17
          No need to Novosibirsk. It is better to build a small city from scratch with purely administrative functions, or take as a basis some very small town that does not suffer from traffic jams and overpopulation. IMHO in the Krasnoyarsk Territory is optimal. Equidistant from the western and eastern borders of the country.
          1. antivirus
            antivirus 3 December 2017 11: 34
            +3
            Kasimov, New Wasyuki or Elabuga
          2. kaon3000
            kaon3000 4 December 2017 00: 43
            +7
            I completely agree with you! Only now to build this city and should begin the "Sobyanin" with the "Chubais" ..... Let them start with deforestation .... a chance tool !!!
        2. avt
          avt 3 December 2017 10: 44
          11
          Quote: alekc73
          Move the capital to Novosibirsk.

          After three years, howl how about Moscow now about Novosibirsk.
          Quote: forester
          Krupnov did not say anything new - all these are people who are not living in Moscow, and so they know

          Yes . Moscow was fanned to disgrace, destroying two-thirds of industry and science. And they did it the same large ones. That's where he broadcasts three times guess. I heard his ravings ala Navalny about the transfer of the capital. NOTHING specific in terms of the cost of transfer, accommodation options and generally the organization of work. The main movement. and screams - ,, Look at the border cities of China and ours on the other side! "And ask this ..... chairman-observer the question - Did China Beijing, as the capital, transfer to the Russian border opposite Blagoveshchensk? Once again, Stalin, when He planned the restructuring of Moscow, ordered to rebuild it for a maximum of 8 million people, and the institute of registration was introduced for a reason. By the way, you can ride anywhere in the same “blessed USA”, but please be kind enough to provide the tax office with a mail address. a separate FMS. In short, he’s a balabol who longs to be included in the category A category. There is a character on TV selling his face, imagining himself to be a general of civil service, well, he registered directly in Nikitos, 60 minutes. bully Krupnov is the same NO specifics — some slogans are driving around your ears, but people are hailing. So all the gadgets are carriers, and you friends, no matter how you sit down ... "you’ll succeed in one thing,
          but the view from the side.
          Quote: rotmistr60
          We get red fish from us, and it comes to the shelves, funny, but through Moscow.

          I’ll tell you more - quotas for catch are distributed in Moscow ........ BUT only after your local brother determines who actually will catch it and how much. Moreover, at the time of Jam and Ishak this was determined not in Magadan or Vladivostok, namely in KHABAROVSK. And the fish with a pass in the sea-shore went straight for the cordon and the money did not go to Moscow, but to the same place. ,, Cashier "was sitting on the west coast of USA ... But no matter how not in Moscow.
          1. IS-80_RVGK2
            IS-80_RVGK2 3 December 2017 19: 11
            +2
            Quote: avt
            Yes . Moscow was fanned to disgrace, destroying two-thirds of industry and science.

            "Rio de Janeiro is the crystal dream of my childhood, do not touch it with your paws." laughing
            Quote: avt
            In short - he’s a balabol who longs to get into the category A category. There is a character on TV selling his face, imagining himself to be a general of civil service, well, he registered directly in, 60 minutes, Nikitos. Krupnov has the same NO specifics, one day slogans on the ears driving, but people hawala. So all the gadgets are carriers, And you friends no matter how you sit down ... "you’ll succeed in one thing

            Exactly. And urbanization will go further. Because the growth of labor productivity. And the population scattered over a vast territory with a worthless demographic situation. What Krupnov offers is fierce nonsense, even conceptually. His whole position rests only on the basis of cheap populism, so he says for the people against the liberals, if the liberals say "A", I will say "B". Liberals stoke for urbanization, he is against. Liberals say many villages and small towns are not promising, he shouts that everything is wrong. And a stupid slogan about moving the capital.
          2. Sling cutter
            Sling cutter 4 December 2017 23: 09
            +4
            Quote: avt
            The main movement.

            yes, only Astana is annoying belay on yoke to them such a city? request

            how the balalaika bolt is basking in skillful hands ...
        3. ALEA IACTA EST
          ALEA IACTA EST 3 December 2017 15: 59
          +1
          The new capital, embodying the power of the country and the greatness of civilization, the capital in front of which all the other cities of the world fade.
    3. forester
      forester 3 December 2017 08: 41
      24
      Krupnov did not say anything new - all these are people who are not living in Moscow, and so they know. In general, in order to save Russia, it is necessary to burn Moscow - although a joke, but in every joke, there is only a fraction of the joke.
      1. Freeman
        Freeman 3 December 2017 14: 54
        +8
        Quote: forester
        In general, in order to save Russia, it is necessary to burn Moscow - although a joke, but in every joke, there is only a fraction of the joke.

        To joke - so to joke.
        Ryazans have already tried, but something did not help. wassat
  2. rotmistr60
    rotmistr60 3 December 2017 07: 02
    22
    15 million people living in rural areas, according to Sobyanin, "extra"
    Familiar findings, which are often voiced by the liberal stratum formed in the 90s. Therefore, Sobyanin-Kudrin does not surprise at all. And the fact that Moscow lives beyond its means and often at the expense of the country, having accumulated cash flows, is not news. While in the government and large megacities the so-called "liberals" the economy will not develop. And the fact that the economy is holding steady in the slightest degree today is not due to the "liberals".
    1. Chertt
      Chertt 3 December 2017 07: 43
      10
      "if we do not continue to invest in small towns and villages, then, of course, it will be even worse there, and the entire population will be" superfluous "in 10 years."
      Pink dreams of our "Western partners"
    2. Esoteric
      Esoteric 3 December 2017 07: 45
      28
      Quote: rotmistr60
      And the fact that Moscow lives beyond its means and often at the expense of the country, having accumulated cash flows, is not news.

      And I "like" the production of canned fish in Moscow or nearby ... lol I did not know that salmon and saury roam in the Moskva River. belay I have a longtime buddy. Somehow, a conversation started about trade (he pays a large rent for a minuscule area). He says that everywhere, with whomsoever he concludes an agreement, the owners sit in Moscow. request Probably, labor productivity is increasing. And in the Moscow news, price counters sometimes flash across, so in Kemerovo prices are higher ... what
      1. rotmistr60
        rotmistr60 3 December 2017 07: 54
        20
        with whomever he concludes an agreement, the owners are sitting in Moscow

        In Khabarovsk the same thing. Almost all profitable companies, all banks - all through Moscow (rarely Peter).
        We get red fish from us, and it comes to the shelves, funny, but through Moscow.
        1. forester
          forester 3 December 2017 08: 48
          23
          Quote: rotmistr60
          with whomever he concludes an agreement, the owners are sitting in Moscow

          In Khabarovsk the same thing. Almost all profitable companies, all banks - all through Moscow (rarely Peter).
          We get red fish from us, and it comes to the shelves, funny, but through Moscow.

          Well, here in Bratsk we have the largest in the branches of the timber industry and BrAZ (aluminum plant) and the mighty hydroelectric power station, and the money in Moscow and St. Petersburg, even environmental payments for the damage to the environment of these very serious pollutants, and they go not to the location of the enterprises, but to the place registration of companies - to Moscow and St. Petersburg.
          1. Greenwood
            Greenwood 3 December 2017 09: 00
            17
            We have the same nonsense in Vladivostok. One of the largest enterprises in the city is the Far Eastern Shipping Company (FESCO), and with it the Vladivostok Commercial Sea Port were acquired by the Moscow company Summa, controlled by oligarch Magomedov. FESCO headquarters is located in Moscow, but it’s ridiculous.
            1. sabakina
              sabakina 3 December 2017 09: 37
              10
              enterprises say .... Muscovites bought all the land in a radius of 500 km. And not in the bastard they dangle for the weekend?
              1. Maria
                Maria 3 December 2017 14: 03
                +7
                Quote: sabakina
                enterprises say .... Muscovites bought all the land in a radius of 500 km. And not in the bastard they dangle for the weekend?

                they didn’t buy it, but companies registered all sorts of wicked things from all over Russia, and Moscow receives the loot, and as a result, the inhabitants of Kozlohrad live beyond their means and their contribution to the country — I worked for 40 years in the far north and retired 17 thousand - compare with Moscow
            2. avt
              avt 3 December 2017 15: 20
              +3
              Quote: Greenwood
              The Far Eastern Shipping Company (FESCO), and with it the Vladivostok Commercial Sea Port, were purchased by the Moscow company Summa, controlled by oligarch Magomedov. FESCO headquarters is located in Moscow, but it’s ridiculous.

              And when in the 90s the merchant fleet was snarled there on the spot, did you also grin? But why didn’t they present them to Seryozha, “Shepelyavyi”, for example? Was it bothering me? I understand that it was really possible to wait for the guys from “Winnipuh”, a feather there on the side, a banner on the door. bully But the main thing was that it didn’t make any sense that they were flying under Panamanian and even Mongolian flags, and just a year ago they started translating under Russian, from tutochka and broke through about the hated Moscow. bully
              1. Greenwood
                Greenwood 3 December 2017 15: 57
                +4
                Quote: avt
                when the fleet in the 90s

                Quote: avt
                Seryozha ,, Lisping "for example did not throw then?

                Quote: avt
                really boys from ,, Winnipuh "could wait
                Under Seryozha Shepelyavy and under Winnipuh, the order in Vlada was many times greater and half a city of long-term construction projects was not abandoned. Moreover, there was no waterfall of Summit budget grandmas then. And the people themselves chose these comrades, and not Moscow appointed. It is believed that Winnipuh was arrested precisely for opposing Moscow businesses, which he did not want to let into the city. And he did it right. A lot of social programs worked for him, which they have successfully scored now. If he was running for mayor, he would gladly vote for him. From Moscow proteges really sick.
                Quote: avt
                walked under Panamanian and even Mongolian flags, and as literally a year ago they began to translate under Russian, from tutochka and broke through about the hated Moscow.
                It sticks out that almost all the large enterprises of the city do not belong to the city.
                1. avt
                  avt 3 December 2017 16: 15
                  +1
                  Quote: Greenwood
                  And the people themselves chose these comrades, and not Moscow appointed.

                  wassat Seryozha ,, Lisping "!? bully Hour relatives from the Ruins do not have? Well, it’s painfully consonant, about the Kremlin’s hand " bully
                  Quote: Greenwood
                  It is believed that Winnipuh was arrested precisely for opposing Moscow businesses, which he did not want to let into the city.

                  bully And ,, amateur diver in law "is also direct Putin from Moscow drowned in a pane ??? bully Don’t Moscow intervene, you would have extinguished each other there before zeroing.
                  Quote: Greenwood
                  It sticks out that almost all the large enterprises of the city do not belong to the city.

                  And that is about the steamers already no gu-gu bully I also talk about the mayor, well, that in a woman’s dress I danced, anneal like
                  Quote: Greenwood
                  And the people themselves chose these comrades, and not Moscow appointed.

                  and the Korean that was for him bullyAnd finally
                  in Vlada there were many times more and half a city of unfinished construction projects was not standing. Moreover, there was no waterfall of Summit budget grandmas then.
                  bully Chop yourself what you want - when building the pyramid ... ANY, the fat foams are removed first (Winnipuh is the same) but the latter are paid for the unfinished. So these ,, dealers "ALWAYS and EVERYWHERE! And in Moscow, in particular from St. Petersburg Polonsky, to the mastodon in this matter - the Su-155. Well, well, Shepelyavy had to steal less and not roll his lips onto the bridge and the Russian as a whole You look and would sit, and even as one Olympic builder from the Region would get to federal ministers. bully Like, he stole it, but he built it and the ceiling does not flow, and in general the oceanarium with fish stands and it does not die. bully
                  1. avt
                    avt 3 December 2017 16: 33
                    +1
                    By the way, like Khabarovsk’s special builders. Well, you’re spending budget money, but if you strangled the toad so much that you rebuild the shopping center in Khabarovsk for the “colored” cosmodrome money, and you’re also reaping your salary and stupidly disrupting the deadlines, but yours, day-to-day "from ,, garbage dumps" in Minsk from a casino to a casino in cars driving pastes pasted with rhinestones ...... That's aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! ,, This is the choice of the people! " bully
                    Quote: Greenwood
                    arrested precisely for opposing Moscow’s businesses,
                    bully And certainly, well, if ,, in a fraction swim "
                    Quote: Greenwood
                    From Moscow proteges really sick.

                    bully
      2. Freeman
        Freeman 3 December 2017 15: 13
        +1
        Quote: Esoteric
        Quote: rotmistr60
        And the fact that Moscow lives beyond its means and often at the expense of the country, having accumulated cash flows, is not news.

        I have a longtime buddy. Somehow, a conversation started about trade (he pays a large rent for a minuscule area). He says that everywhere, with whomsoever he concludes an agreement, the owners sit in Moscow. Probably, labor productivity is increasing.

        But didn’t it occur to a friend that these so-called “Muscovites” are his former “fellow countrymen”?
        That is, those who "raised the dough" at the expense of their fellow countrymen and left to "live in the capital"?
        Or do you really think that residents of the capital travel specifically throughout the country to buy every “station toilet” in a “province”?
      3. Dedall
        Dedall 3 December 2017 17: 50
        +3
        I completely agree! I can even say that it is from these considerations that price tags are covered up in reports from EU countries. Everything will be cheaper for them there than for us, and with their salaries this looks especially sad for the Russians.
        As for the "pumping" of imports through the Moscow budget, it was somehow to study in St. Petersburg and, as always, without subsistence and apartment, so I had to look for a loader. We unloaded containers that came by sea. From St. Petersburg, everything goes to Moscow, and from there to the country. It was especially funny when a customer from Khabarovsk loaded Vietnamese bananas into the car.
      4. Skarpzd
        Skarpzd 4 December 2017 03: 22
        +2
        Countryman, and Mariinsk, the fact that in the Kemerovo region prices are higher than in Kemerovo or in Novosibirsk. and those who can be purchased on a large trip there. that is, to bring the child to school, even taking into account the cost of gasoline, is more profitable in Kemerovo, even more profitable in Novosib.
    3. alekc73
      alekc73 3 December 2017 09: 07
      25
      In Russia there is no extra population. Every person counts. Such mayors must be driven to places where their money, children and homes. We do not need colonial managers.
    4. Pax tecum
      Pax tecum 9 December 2017 07: 01
      0
      Remember how in KVN:
      - Why is Moscow "golden-headed"?
      - Ah, because Russia is "long-suffering"!
      And you can’t argue! The population of Moscow (one (!) City), officially according to statistics = 15 million individuals or 10% of the total population of the country! Country! Great Countries! The largest and potentially wealthiest in the world!
      Not frail, imbalances, right?
      And this is only official data, unofficial, of course, more.
      + This is a financial and industrial concentration.
      And, most importantly, this is the territory of the harmonious existence of "enemies of the people" and concentrated power.
      Therefore, one should not be surprised that the Russians (the majority of Russians!) Want to eliminate this “neoplasm”.
  3. Dr_engie
    Dr_engie 3 December 2017 07: 24
    +6
    Weak hospadi, have seen. Still, now I would bring this idea to the top.
    1. Chertt
      Chertt 3 December 2017 07: 37
      +4
      Quote: Dr_Engie
      Still, now I would bring this idea to the top.

      To the top of Muscovites?
      1. andrej-shironov
        andrej-shironov 3 December 2017 09: 22
        +9
        wink Top about it in the know! We are all for them, adherents of neoliberal capitalism, just a function. Open your eyes at last!
    2. Esoteric
      Esoteric 3 December 2017 07: 37
      12
      Quote: Dr_Engie
      Still now bring this idea to the top.

      If only with bayonets? belay
  4. Mar.Tirah
    Mar.Tirah 3 December 2017 07: 41
    24
    Moscow turned into a hotbed of corrupt officials, the thieves of the Caucasus, and Central Asia, as did Peter. When I showed who these Moscow people who are buying all these candle factories of Gazprom and Rosneft in Siberia, I just got numb. Caucasians ?????? Ideas of the best friend and mentor Putin Chubais live, and come to life.
    1. Esoteric
      Esoteric 3 December 2017 07: 51
      17
      I have already said how to raise the rating of a presidential candidate. We must promise that Chubais will sew slippers in the zone for the rest of his life. Such ones should be planted only for words ... stop For cases like this "nano-member", under Stalin they were shot ... belay
    2. alekc73
      alekc73 3 December 2017 09: 09
      +5
      Do not print it ....- already sick of only the sight of "redhead wise guy"
  5. Greenwood
    Greenwood 3 December 2017 07: 50
    24
    It is amazing why Nazarbayev in Kazakhstan had the willpower to move the capital from the large overpopulated (by the standards of Kazakhstan) Alma-Ata to God-forgotten Tselinograd and build a new capital from scratch. A great example and incentive for the development of the state. And in our country all the country's resources are pumped into one tick inflated to lawlessness, sucking juices.
    1. Glory1974
      Glory1974 3 December 2017 09: 45
      +7
      Nazarbayev in Kazakhstan had the willpower to move the capital

      In Ingushetia, the capital was also transferred from Nazran to Magas. Matvienko at one time, in order to fill Peter’s budget with money, asked to be transferred to the city of Gazprom so that he would pay taxes here.
      So the top is well aware of everything.
      1. Greenwood
        Greenwood 3 December 2017 10: 02
        11
        Quote: glory1974
        Matvienko at one time, in order to fill Peter’s budget with money, asked to be transferred to the city of Gazprom so that he would pay taxes here.
        But the city of Omsk, which previously had taxes from Sibneft (later renamed Gazprom-Neft), lost its largest taxpayer and became subsidized.
        1. Glory1974
          Glory1974 3 December 2017 11: 13
          0
          lost the largest taxpayer and became subsidized

          the largest taxpayers are not enough at all. It is necessary to develop further
  6. Vintovkin
    Vintovkin 3 December 2017 08: 02
    +8
    Quote: Greenwood
    surprisingly

    nothing surprising .. from the point of view of their logistics, it is more convenient to first “stack the greens” for subsequent distillation to the west.
  7. vfqjh
    vfqjh 3 December 2017 08: 26
    17
    I read it, I wanted to comment on it somehow, spat and refused, except for obscene words it doesn’t come to my mind ... I’ve traveled around Russia in recent years, seen enough .... My, yours, ours !!!
    1. alekc73
      alekc73 3 December 2017 09: 10
      +7
      I agree .. Moders will not miss.
  8. andrej-shironov
    andrej-shironov 3 December 2017 09: 18
    14
    So Sobyanin, like some on the site, adepts of economic efficiency, and dreams that everyone lived near Moscow, and all the resources in the country were mined on a rotational basis! wink Is this not a dream of the government of Medvedev and the Guarantor! According to their holy faith, everything in the world should be subordinated to the FACTOR OF ECONOMIC EFFICIENCY / EXPEDIENCY. This is the quintessence of neoliberalism.
  9. Vard
    Vard 3 December 2017 09: 21
    18
    Is it our low labor productivity !? In 2015, for one salary, for four I worked hard ... yes, so I got cancer ... and got and kicked out of work, no one needs the sick ...
    1. alstr
      alstr 3 December 2017 20: 45
      0
      To be honest, labor productivity in big cities (including Moscow) is a different thing and depends on the motivation of workers. Unfortunately, the motivation of the indigenous inhabitants of cities in the second and more generations is often lower than the plinth - there is an apartment, parents support financially, you can also find a dusty job. Another thing is nonresident (even from nearby suburbs). The motivation is high - money is needed both for an apartment and for a decent life, and parents can support it differently than urban ones. Plus, such salaries are usually not paid in the outback. Therefore, they have something to "kill."
      Hence we can say that even if labor productivity is higher in Moscow, but at the expense of whom. And if you analyze, it may well turn out that such productivity was due to visitors to a greater extent than to the indigenous people.

      It is time.

      Secondly, labor productivity is an insidious thing. It is, firstly, finite (for example, a programmer cannot well encode more than 100 characters per minute - those typing speeds here are a hard limiter, but you have to think there and not only type the text).
      Those. There are ALWAYS technological limitations. (Well, you can’t paint the wall with a second layer immediately. It must be dry).
      But besides this, there is still optimal productivity, which provides a more uniform and often longer production process (well, it is well known that equipment working with overload works with large interruptions and breaks more often).
      Therefore, the optimal values ​​of the equipment load and therefore productivity usually determine from 70 to 80% of the maximum power.

      As for the deprivation of the population.
      Here the question is not this, but where we can apply all these people. One side. And on the other hand, where the state considers it necessary to develop. And also in the fact that the level of accessibility and quality of the same services does not vary many times, but by orders of magnitude in large cities and not in them.
      And the reason that people travel to a large city is one - there is no work and no decent living conditions.

      In this sense, the USSR tried to distribute industry more evenly throughout the country, even to the detriment of economic feasibility. Hence, there are many dead cities now.

      If we return to the rural population, then with modern technologies (at the same time be limited only to directly employed in agricultural, but also to the same doctors, teachers, etc.), not enough for us is 25% (i.e., about 35-40 million ), and 20 percent, i.e. about 25-30 million.

      But before you change something in the village, you must first draw up development plans and only then do something.
  10. Eurodav
    Eurodav 3 December 2017 09: 35
    +3
    Quote: Esoteric
    Quote: rotmistr60
    And the fact that Moscow lives beyond its means and often at the expense of the country, having accumulated cash flows, is not news.

    And I "like" the production of canned fish in Moscow or nearby ... lol I did not know that salmon and saury roam in the Moskva River. belay I have a longtime buddy. Somehow, a conversation started about trade (he pays a large rent for a minuscule area). He says that everywhere, with whomsoever he concludes an agreement, the owners sit in Moscow. request Probably, labor productivity is increasing. And in the Moscow news, price counters sometimes flash across, so in Kemerovo prices are higher ... what

    Although earlier (during the USSR) the supply (food) was like Moscow, I am in Prokopyevsk, Kemerovo region. I judge ... The miners didn’t go to Moscow for sausage, they lived pretty well ...
  11. Brigadier
    Brigadier 3 December 2017 10: 00
    13
    To listen to the "connoisseur of agriculture" Sobyanin about labor productivity outside the Moscow Ring Road - do not respect yourself!
  12. Vintovkin
    Vintovkin 3 December 2017 10: 09
    +4
    Quote: Greenwood
    But the city of Omsk, which previously had taxes from Sibneft (later renamed Gazprom-Neft), lost its largest taxpayer and became subsidized.

    Otherwise, there would be nothing to bring down a sucker in St. Petersburg)) St. Petersburg residents without offense - this is my favorite city!
  13. midshipman
    midshipman 3 December 2017 10: 10
    16
    Discussion held incorrectly. There are no superfluous people in Russia, there are leaders to whom the fate of the country means nothing. I will begin to give examples from practice.
    1. In Primorye, there has been a reduction in mines. Immediately received the task of finding the opportunity to create new enterprises. We prepared all the documentation for the creation of a radio plant in Partizansk. But tagged came with a drunk and everything was canceled;
    2. An unoccupied population appeared in Tatarstan. Factories in Leninogorsk and Almetyevsk were created. The problem was solved;
    3. In Western Ukraine, it was necessary to create a plant in Chervonograd to help Lvov PO named after V.I. Lenin.
    I can give examples in other regions. These are examples of the work of my 6th Main Directorate of the MCI of the USSR. I have the honor.
    1. Reserve officer
      Reserve officer 3 December 2017 12: 25
      +2
      Yuri Grigoryevich, you have the only comment that was said without foam at the mouth in relation to Moscow. Sobyanin said not at all about the extra people that he is now credited with distorting the meaning. He said about superfluous in relation to agricultural production. And it was primarily about officials.
      I am from St. Petersburg, but I lived in Moscow for a long time. There is a different rhythm of life, far from all fit in, not all withstand. But there are more earning opportunities. With all my love for Peter, I’ll say that the pace of anything in our country is much slower than in the capital. On the long-suffering Gorokhovaya Street in the very center of St. Petersburg, repairs were done for two years (!), But with me the asphalt on Vagonoremontnaya Street was changed in two nights. I’m generally silent about the interchanges under construction, there has never been such a pace. Therefore, do not smear Sobyanin with shit.
      What is absolutely correctly written in the comments here - there is much more finance in Moscow. Well, she is the capital, where a lot of money goes into the economy of the regions. The bad thing, in my opinion, is that all major monopolies have a legal address there. And, accordingly, the main income tax goes to the budget of Moscow. Nothing prevents registering these monopolies at the place of their actual work, and then the regions will have many times more money. And people will have the opportunity to earn money on the spot, there will be no need to go to Moscow.
  14. Stepan Kudinov
    Stepan Kudinov 3 December 2017 10: 11
    17
    It’s not clear what the argument is about? Have they still not realized for themselves that in the country, under such rulers and these types of "economists", everything, TOTAL !!!!!!!!!!!!!, has developed, two spheres of "industry": trade and trade protection. All!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Therefore, talking about "extra" people is possible only from the point of view of the GLOBAL REDUCTION of the capital leaders. Today, wherever you look, ministers, presidents and other riffraff, and industry will restore who will ??????????????????? And, B, do not wait for Stalin - he won’t come.
  15. Stas
    Stas 3 December 2017 10: 32
    14
    The main parasitic center of Russia is located in Moscow. By pumping out financial and human resources from all over the country, the rulers created a state in the state. If the center begins to parasitize at the expense of the province, then the result will be disastrous for both Moscow and the country as a whole. After all, it is enough to read the history, at least of the same Roman Empire.
  16. vladimirvn
    vladimirvn 3 December 2017 10: 57
    +2
    We have forever extremes. Out of the frying pan into the fire. "The road to the taiga dead end cost 300 million rubles."
    https://www.kp.ru/best/msk/doroga-v-taezhnyj-tupi
    k/
  17. Mar.Tirah
    Mar.Tirah 3 December 2017 11: 00
    +3
    Quote: alekc73
    Do not print it ....- already sick of only the sight of "redhead wise guy"

    I think it’s nice ????? But as long as it exists on this earth, it’s necessary to show it. Inhuman it.
  18. The comment was deleted.
  19. prior
    prior 3 December 2017 11: 19
    +1
    No one is able to carry out "impotent substitution" in Russia!
    And therefore: "They wanted the best, but it will be as always ...."
  20. 1536
    1536 3 December 2017 11: 22
    +6
    Thatcher, in my opinion, said that in Russia, 15 million people should be left in total to maintain extractive industries. So her "students" and followers are much more humane, counting out of 150 million citizens of the country only 15 million "extra" people. In fact, after such statements, managers submit their resignation. But it’s there, among the adversaries, and today they don’t send anyone to their homeland even in “exile”, the “dust” simply got into the “vacuum cleaner”.
  21. Severok
    Severok 3 December 2017 11: 26
    +7
    The list of enemies of the people has replenished: Sobyanin, Matvienko, Kudrin, Siluanov, Chubais, Miller, Sobchak, Makarevich ...
    We are waiting for the next bully of another enemy of Russia.
    1. andrej-shironov
      andrej-shironov 3 December 2017 15: 40
      +5
      smile Do not expect a solo performance. The Government and the Guarantor sing in unison.
  22. Vintovkin
    Vintovkin 3 December 2017 11: 34
    0
    Quote: midshipman
    1. In Primorye, there has been a reduction in mines. Immediately received the task of finding the opportunity to create new enterprises. We prepared all the documentation for the creation of a radio plant in Partizansk. But tagged came with a drunk and everything was canceled;
    2. An unoccupied population appeared in Tatarstan. Factories in Leninogorsk and Almetyevsk were created. The problem was solved;
    3. In Western Ukraine, it was necessary to create a plant in Chervonograd to help Lvov PO named after V.I. Lenin.
    I can give examples in other regions. These are examples of the work of my 6th Main Directorate of the MCI of the USSR. I have the honor.

    This is perfectly all respected, but where did the products of these enterprises go?
  23. Karen
    Karen 3 December 2017 11: 38
    +6
    Right now, a MOSCOW CITIAN will come here and make you love your Motherland in the person of Moscow :)
    15+ years ago, at one of the Russian forums, I wrote that MegaMoskva is death for the Russian ethnic group (and gave an analogy with Yerevan for us). In general, your then pecked me.
    I recall how at the beginning of our independence, the true patriots in power proposed to reduce the population of Yerevan by 10 times.
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 3 December 2017 19: 22
      +2
      Quote: Karen
      15+ years ago, at one of the Russian forums, I wrote that MegaMoskva is death for the Russian ethnic group (and gave an analogy with Yerevan for us). In general, your then pecked me.

      You are not digging from there. It's not about Moscow or Yerevan, it's about capitalism. In the framework of which problems are often solved as it is beneficial to capital, and not as it should. Instead of creating jobs and paying normal salaries and effective programs to solve the problem of demographics, the delivery of migrants. And so around the world. Europe, USA, Russia.
      1. Karen
        Karen 3 December 2017 19: 34
        0
        The Germans were well aware of the advantages of a uniform development of the territory, so they have such successes ... And they do not care about the problem of migrants. After the battle between the Russians and the Britons, they will spring out of the snuffbox of aggression and declare their arrogant rights.
        1. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 3 December 2017 20: 55
          +3
          Quote: Karen
          The Germans were well aware of the advantages of a uniform development of the territory, so they have such successes ...

          Success so far. That's just the Germans are slowly ending.
          Quote: Karen
          And they do not care about the problem of migrants.

          No, don't give a damn. And the farther the more will not spit.
          Quote: Karen
          After the battle between the Russians and the Britons, they will spring out of the snuffbox of aggression and declare their arrogant rights.

          And Germany as a German state will exist by then? Or will there be a Deutsche caliphate with Turks, Arabs, blacks and other remnants of Islamized Alemans?
          1. Karen
            Karen 3 December 2017 21: 29
            0
            You probably forgot that the Germans live in the V Reich, where their stock during their sex should have decreased from 80 million. up to 50 million So they called sexually active. And then the German car will definitely show its rampage ... they should put the Führer to them just to spit.
  24. ivagulin
    ivagulin 3 December 2017 11: 42
    +9
    There are no production facilities left in Moscow, there is no production left, now this city isn’t even worth it to capture the enemies, because it has no empty factories and factories that can be subsequently exploited, but eats millions of parasites shifting papers or pressing buttons. I worked in many regions of the center Russia, but there was no such pumping of resources to this so-called center
    1. sxfRipper
      sxfRipper 4 December 2017 01: 13
      +2
      PPKS! I myself live in Moscow, a programmer ... I fully admit that the "productivity" of office plankton in Moscow is higher than on the periphery - new technologies are being mastered faster and there is money for them. But I can say one thing about myself - sometimes for days there is not a single line of real code, and sometimes it will trample in such a way that my wife kicks out at 2 in the morning from behind the computer. So it has been so for many years. And the fact that in Moscow, if anything is real, is produced (what you can pick up, plug into an outlet ...) is a minuscule compared to what was once nothing to compare with.
  25. Nemesis
    Nemesis 3 December 2017 11: 43
    +7
    We all saw how Moscow works for us. Even the State Duma is sleeping, in the literal sense of the word, in the workplace ..... Problems in the development of cities in the CIS should be sought in the governors of the authorities appointed from Moscow and in general corruption.
  26. turbris
    turbris 3 December 2017 11: 45
    +9
    To begin with, it is necessary to legally prohibit the registration of offices of large companies in Moscow, only in those places where the main production is located, then to deal with banks - how expedient they are in such numbers in the capital - well, then it will become clear who is the growth driver and who makes money for more comfortable living conditions.
  27. a housewife
    a housewife 3 December 2017 11: 48
    +9
    No capital should be moved anywhere. The new capital, if created, will turn into the same. It is necessary to disperse the central offices throughout the country. And nothing will survive. There were so many screams about the transfer of the Constitutional Court to St. Petersburg. Moved. The catastrophe did not happen. It is necessary to build modern enterprises throughout the country. Large, preferably. The population will be employed, with a salary. But he will not strive for money in Moscow. And where there is a large enterprise - there are houses, clinics, schools, colleges, shops. All this needs to be built - more jobs. Pave roads modern. And it’s not in Moscow to decide whether to pass through it or in a ring. It’s ridiculous to watch in the news how they illuminate all of Moscow - this way and that, and on holidays and for the winter, and with modern lamps and all kinds of garlands. Then Sobyanin comes up with a program to save electricity in Moscow. The trouble is also that if where which enterprise is large and under construction, then again in large industrial centers. It looks like Moscow. But out of the blue to build something - in any way? There will be more costs alone, but other problems will not have to be solved.
    1. QWERTY
      QWERTY 3 December 2017 12: 09
      +2
      Again ravings. Most of the small towns and so formed near any large deposits of something. For example, Kirovsk \ Apatity of the Murmansk region. Both cities live - still live, by the way, due to the extraction and enrichment of minerals. There wouldn’t be any deposits here - to whom and where would cities build, why are they here? Most companies have offices in Moscow, as THIS IS THE CAPITAL. That's all.
      "It is necessary to build modern enterprises in the country. It is desirable to have large ones." - So they were built \ or are being built for the extraction and processing of minerals. Or near large transport hubs, which are Moscow and St. Petersburg. And let's build a cement plant in Tumors, and carry raw materials from Pikalevo? But how many jobs! And to close up weakly a car factory in Magadan, and then to drag finished cars from there along winter roads in auto transporters?
      The logic is understandable - here is some kind uncle SHOULD build something right next to the entrance, I’ll go to work there (and we’ll see if it will be bad for me and I don’t want to), but where will this uncle be to sell and where will the money be taken for my salary - I am violet.
      1. allegro
        allegro 3 December 2017 13: 02
        +5
        Well, not all cities were built near deposits, etc., you don’t have to go too far, in the country there are thousands of small towns founded even under the reign of peas, and now put an end to them
        1. QWERTY
          QWERTY 3 December 2017 13: 15
          0
          And what's the point of maintaining the infrastructure of these towns? In single-industry towns, these expenses are financed by a related company, either directly or indirectly, paying taxes to the budget. If there is no such enterprise, these costs will be borne by the district-region-region, etc. And someone with their taxes contains these towns here, although this money could be used for other, perhaps more necessary purposes.
          1. andrej-shironov
            andrej-shironov 3 December 2017 15: 43
            +6
            wink To support Sobyanin in Moscow?
          2. Greenwood
            Greenwood 3 December 2017 16: 05
            +5
            Quote: ytsuken
            this money could be used for other, perhaps more necessary purposes.
            To build a couple of microdistricts in Moscow. lol
      2. Mordvin 3
        Mordvin 3 3 December 2017 13: 34
        +9
        Quote: ytsuken
        Most companies have offices in Moscow, as THIS IS THE CAPITAL. That's all.

        Yeah, such managers are sitting in Moscow, and they are managing the Sayano-Shushenskaya hydroelectric power station.
      3. Greenwood
        Greenwood 3 December 2017 16: 09
        +6
        Quote: ytsuken
        Most companies have offices in Moscow, as IT IS THE CAPITAL
        How is the status of the capital connected with the location of headquarters ?! Or do we have big business intertwined with power structures? Why are the headquarters of large companies in the United States often located in small sleeping towns scattered across the country ?! But there is a huge overpopulated New York (which by the way is not the capital) and a small unremarkable Washington.
      4. IS-80_RVGK2
        IS-80_RVGK2 3 December 2017 19: 26
        +2
        Quote: ytsuken
        The logic is understandable - here is some kind uncle SHOULD build something right next to the entrance, I’ll go to work there (and we’ll see if it will be bad for me and I don’t want to), but where will this uncle be to sell and where will the money be taken for my salary - I am violet.

        You are right in many ways, but you should not go too far. Otherwise, it turns out that the employee must work 24 hours a day for food in inhuman conditions and still thank the employer for this.
      5. Yarhann
        Yarhann 3 December 2017 23: 01
        +1
        absolutely everything to the point - in our country most of the cotton wool thinks that capital should give them factories and factories in the fly coffins, give them salaries no less than the capital, and they picking their nose will check out whether or not to go there.
        Thank God that financial bigwigs are guided by the benefits and prospects of capitalization growth, and not by the moans of lazy aivans lying on stoves throughout the Russian Federation.
        Megacities will grow and thank God they have one hope that the Russian Federation has a future,.
      6. sxfRipper
        sxfRipper 4 December 2017 01: 18
        0
        And there is also the Kukisvumchorr microdistrict, he is the former Kirovsk-2 aka Kukisvumchorr settlement. I was born there and lived 17 years. Mother, when I was in Kirovsk for the last time, I asked - do not go there ... Bomzhatnik in general. Sin City nervously smokes on the sidelines. Although the Kirovsky and Yuksporsky mines are there.
        1. QWERTY
          QWERTY 7 December 2017 12: 49
          0
          Well, yes, 25 km - "the turn is wrong"))) Although Kirovsk itself is a good town. And it should be noted, much better than the same Apatity. And due to what? And at the expense of the same Apatit JSC, which drinks the blood of innocent babies ....
      7. a housewife
        a housewife 4 December 2017 14: 11
        +4
        this is nonsense! Not everything depends on the processing of minerals and heavy industry. And I don’t have to build near the entrance. Where is the high technology? Where is the radio industry, instrument making? And it’s not necessary to build from scratch. Many enterprises were closed in the 90s. You can use them somehow. Although, of course, hard. Maykop "Friendship" - a furniture factory, exported products. So after all, they dragged into a "bunch of little cubs"! The same thing - Tochmash. And do not say that these were obsolete industries, with poor-quality products. In the 81st year began to build in Novorossiysk "Surf" - a radio factory. Counted on several thousand workers. I worked there from the 81st (The case when "they opened it at the entrance"). We got a good specialty, and helped at the construction site. People came from all over the country - if the state needed specialists, it was easy to lure them - they started giving apartments after 2 years. A microdistrict, technical school, kindergartens, school, shops were built around the plant. Draw a trolley bus line. The products were excellent. I trained more than 15 people in my specialty. Then she went to OTC. Note - this is far from Moscow! And then it brought perestroika ... So, not the uncle should build such things, namely the state.
        1. QWERTY
          QWERTY 7 December 2017 12: 45
          0
          Hmm, the products were excellent ... So what kind of x ... everyone rushed to buy imported, when they opened the border? No, the question of fashion and prestige also took place, but ... but I had a Samsung TV with a remote control, and Vityaz was thrown right away, is it somehow strange? And you know, this can be said about a lot, any household appliances, all these little things - they were better in the West. Do you know why? But because there is competition and the market, and any x ... there was no way. And the Vityaz TV - it was a model for them, rotten - a decade ago. And the Mayak-233 tape recorder, yes, it was not bad. But is any Sonya or Philips much better, more socially oriented, or what? I perfectly understand that in those days it was possible to work quietly near the house, receiving a stable guaranteed salary. And in every Muhosk there were all kinds of different enterprises, just for the purpose of having the locals work there. There was no question of profitability and expediency at all. But in the current conditions, this will not work. Nobody needs a bakery in a village with a population of 200 people. No one needs a ball bearing factory in Taimyr. But you don’t want to understand this, you don’t accept it, because once “it was just like it was”.
          Want a furniture factory? So open, who does not give you? Take a loan, build a workshop, find workers and sales. Why should someone do this for you and for you? Uncle, the state, it doesn’t matter - who, but not you yourself.
          Yes, our power is not a fountain - well, so we ourselves elect it, every 4 years. The paradox is that we ourselves choose the one who must make decisions for us - and then we hack him.
          1. a housewife
            a housewife 8 December 2017 17: 49
            +1
            We had slightly different products. Not consumer goods. And the fact that such a plant was destroyed is a natural betrayal. First, I do not need to open a furniture workshop. Secondly, they were discovered. About a dozen. Small. Only until the last and the salary was small there, and there was no clearance. It’s not at all like working at a plant - no? By the way, a bakery in the village is not needed, a bakery is needed. They are. But the shopping centers are huge - why? And if you live in Moscow, then what kind of neglect of other cities? And thirdly, it’s too late for me to discover anything, retired already. And in the fourth - what kind of power does anyone choose and how - one does not need all to fit in one comb. And then, whoever they choose - all is good for Moscow, the rest is the tenth matter. From your point of view.
  28. allegro
    allegro 3 December 2017 12: 56
    11
    Moscow today is really a parasite on the body of Russia, such as the mayor and his team destroyed all the enterprises in the city, office buildings for loafers are being built on the territory of ZiL that do not do a damn thing and do not produce, Moscow is overpopulated and continues to swell, is it time to stop, And look what is happening in new Moscow, forests were cut down, chaotic buildings around, only barbarians and those who don’t give a damn about everything except their own pockets do this, so on the contrary, rural people are not enough, and those who do lawlessness on our land, solving personal problems at the expense of the country and to the detriment of it
    1. sxfRipper
      sxfRipper 4 December 2017 01: 23
      0
      So is Moscow a parasite, or is the mayor and his team? As for the same car factories - damn it! Well, where else almost in the center of the capital is there such a thing? Or something like Hammer and sickle (a metallurgy plant is even cooler than a car). And, for that matter - then claims for it to YurMikhalych, and not to Sobyanin.
  29. seacap
    seacap 3 December 2017 16: 21
    +2
    Quote: alekc73
    Move the capital to Novosibirsk.

    There you can and even need to transfer the RAS, Moscow State University and other scientific institutions and universities, the same Zhukovsky and Rusnano with Chubais, there is a basis for this, there are platforms, which are not being completed.
  30. ltc35
    ltc35 3 December 2017 16: 36
    0
    "Yes, what can you know about pests!"

    Exactly!
  31. DimanC
    DimanC 3 December 2017 17: 19
    0
    So, and how to chip all, if the people will sit on villages? So it is necessary to drive everyone into the city of millionaires. And at the same time the superfluous will die ...
  32. fif21
    fif21 3 December 2017 17: 53
    +6
    Well, if Sobyanin is such a cool manager, the road to him is in Mukhosk. Let it raise labor productivity there laughing And how corporations drive shifts to work in Moscow and St. Petersburg, I know. They rob Russia and despise its people, despise and rob am Pig under the century old oak
    I have eaten enough acorns to the full;
    After eating, she slept under it;
    Then, having grown up, I got up
    And to dig a snout from Oak roots has become. hi
  33. Yarhann
    Yarhann 3 December 2017 22: 51
    +3
    such a striking nonsense here is seranuli - all over the world GDP is created and generated by millionaires and megalopolises with their agglomerations. And the village is the atavism of the century before last and the rural population will only decrease in the long run in the least developed countries - the reasons are simple - the lack of work for highly skilled workers and development prospects, low wages and a poor service sector in no way comparable to the city, let alone the metropolis.
    and for brainless cattle a simple example of one of the most developed and fastest growing economies in the world - South Korea and the city of Seoul - Half of the country's population lives in seoul and agglomeration - it is such a high population density that the developed infrastructure, the services sector, various public institutions and their accessibility provide effective the growth of the economy, science, quality and standard of living.
    And let this game be rubbed by the brainless cattle that it is necessary to bring down to the villages and live there - now let these savages themselves topple there.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 4 December 2017 06: 08
      +2
      Quote: Yarhann
      one of the most developed and fastest growing economies in the world - South Korea and the city of Seoul
      Ku-ku, sickly. Look at the map, compare the sizes of South Korea with the Russian ones. In small countries, the presence of one large capital city is justified. And now look at the States, where there are a lot of megacities, but also a shitty mountain of small towns, many of which have the headquarters of large companies, they all do not aspire to all of Washington or New York.

      Well, let's all of Russia move to the Moscow and St. Petersburg region. We’ll be in Hong Kong sitting on each other’s heads. But who will live in Siberia and the Far East? Giant spaces of uninhabited territories. Or mb sell them to the Chinese and Japanese? Yes, and the United States will catch up.
      1. Yarhann
        Yarhann 5 December 2017 02: 00
        0
        so no one pulls you into the metropolis of Moscow-Peter-sit in their holes and rejoice. most of the territory of the Russian Federation is an unsuitable territory for living and it’s inappropriate to write about the population here. I speak for megacities - read the definition of a metropolis, see which agglomerations of our millionaires are most similar to this definition. and yes, Seoul and its agglomeration are still a metropolis. And marquees are almost entirely composed of megacities - just go to Wikipedia and read the definition. And we have just a fragmented resettlement in fact across the country - megacities or similar entities with a stretch can be found.
        And no one will live in the territories, these territories didn’t fuck anyone - people want the comfort of a good infrastructure - the territories that are not populated will not be enough - only if you are not a billionaire and you can afford to build a hacienda in the deep taiga with all the pleasures and bring in all the necessary staff including cops firefighters and doctors. And the territories of the Russian Federation are needed for one thing - for the extraction of resources - our territory is our colony - the only thing that stands on this planet is land in which many different useful resources are hidden, as well as many renewable resources).
        And as for how the US megacities are arranged, it’s better to take an interest in this topic and understand that the majority of the US population lives in these zones — one-story America also enters into megacities, so it’s a note to you - because any American millionaire is surrounded by these settlements that smoothly pass into another millionaire - and together all these agglomerations form megacities. Americans do not live on their heads (like in a gokong), not like in our ebony. Although there are assholes and they have the type of Alaska or Canada - one big ass other than the metropolis around large lakes that form along with the American one.
  34. iouris
    iouris 4 December 2017 00: 48
    0
    It turns out that the entire population of the country is superfluous.
  35. Freeman
    Freeman 4 December 2017 03: 39
    0
    From an article or what the author "moans" about -
    ... these discussions are dumbfounded by all but the rare strange adherents of the doctrine of further "omoskvichivanie." People say that if we do not continue to invest in small towns and villages, then, of course, it will be even worse there, and the entire population will be "superfluous" in 10 years. It is necessary to develop industry, infrastructure, invest in small townsrather than discussing that everyone either moved to Moscow or died from boredom in the villages. It is necessary to develop the country.
    It is necessary to create jobs. It was announced that by 2020, 25 million jobs of the highest level. Where are they? We need an infrastructural, industrial breakthrough through the creation of millions of jobs in regions, small towns and villages.

    And now we’ll hear what the participants in the discussion said -
    A sharp and very anticipated discussion took place on the site of the United Civil Front — a dialogue between the head of the TsSR Alexei Kudrin and Moscow Mayor Sergei Sobyanin on the role of agglomerations in the development of the Russian economy. Kudrin began the conversation by saying that: half of the world's GDP is being created in 380 cities, and such a trend for the concentration of resources in megacities will only increase. It means that for successful economic development, Russia must bet on increasing the number of agglomerations in the country. At least a few spatial nodes pretend to be such. In the Urals, these are the cities of Yekaterinburg - Chelyabinsk - Perm, in Siberia Tomsk - Novosibirsk - Barnaul can form an agglomeration. In addition, Volga cities have significant potential for growth and pooling of resources.

    Sobyanin supported this proposal and cited Moscow as an example of a successful model -
    Entering the dialogue, Sergei Sobyanin, first of all, emphasized the scale of the capital. He estimated the population of the Moscow agglomeration at 30–35 million people, adding to it not only the Moscow Region, but also neighboring regions. At the same time, the mayor of the capital insisted that Moscow does not so much take human resources from the regions, but acts as an “outpost” stopping the brain drain abroad. According to him, Moscow is "this is the core of the country, the primordial core, without oil and gas," "not a black hole that draws talents from all over the country, but the driver of the economy." In particular, labor productivity in Moscow is 2,5 times higher than the national average. "And if you take the countryside - then five, six and seven times." However, the success of the capital rests on a number of limiting factors.
    Significantly, the country's development is restrained by the “flawed” administrative division of the regions, which completely does not reflect economic and social realities. The situation is further complicated by the fact that the federal center is trying to unify the requirements for all regions - from Chukotka to Kaliningrad. This circumstance makes Russia not a "federal, but a unitary state."
    https://www.csr.ru/news/grazhdanskoe-obshhestvo-m
    odeliruet-budushhee-strany /


    But everyone has the right to hear only what he wants.
    For example, one blogger is “horny” -
    Sergei Sobyanin plans to develop the territory of Russia, creating millions of agglomeration cities along the entire length of the state border (!), Which, in his understanding, will help strengthen the country's defense capabilities. This, excuse me, how and why? So that on the way to Moscow hordes of [Chinese] troops first "grind" the population of the cities located near the border and get bogged down there, giving the Moscow authorities time for flight?
    http://gubernia.pskovregion.org/columns/sobyanin-
    i-renovaciya-rossii /

    IMHO. It is about these problems that we need to discuss, and not to arrange a "masvasrach".
  36. turbris
    turbris 4 December 2017 10: 15
    +3
    Quote: Yarhann
    we have most of the cotton

    Who do you call it that? We don’t need your ragul jargon here, explain yourself!
    1. a housewife
      a housewife 4 December 2017 14: 15
      +3
      Do not mess with ........! Get dirty yet!
  37. Conductor
    Conductor 6 December 2017 09: 40
    +2
    Exactly Sobyanin, 70% of the bureaucracy is superfluous. Kylo in their hands and digging a canal from Moscow to Magadan.
  38. Stepan Kudinov
    Stepan Kudinov 6 December 2017 09: 44
    +2
    Tell Tyumen that under the USSR, the Moscow City Council + district executive committees all together occupied 400-500 people and the loaf deputies worked in production. Where, with the dominance of his parasites-ministers and deputies, he counted labor productivity. What labor ????????????????? From idleness they don’t know what to do here and compose fairy tales. All the plants are standing, but his growth is not clear what.
  39. noodles
    noodles 6 December 2017 12: 53
    +1
    Guys, my dear ones, take care of your nerves! I lived an old man and in places where I have been superfluous and have lived in Moscow for many years — which has eaten everyone! The first is what Pop is such a coming! The fact that the capital is almost weakly managed is a fact! She at the household level turned into a washing machine, squeezed juices and hello! The fact that ordinary people live in it is softly said not sweet, is also a fact! If there were work in non-resident towns, we would never go to the city! But there are a lot of them coming from here, and squeezing juices and increasing productivity! And what about the indigenous people, where you go everywhere-like grandfather Schukar said OTLUP! And the last criminal practice shows the more volumes - the more money - the more opportunities to saw them and roll back! The country must be developed evenly, taking into account not only demography but also natural resources, historical traditions, and most importantly FOR PEOPLE! These are common truths — but they are clear to us — and they are ridiculous for those who have the main goal of PROFIT!
  40. Naum
    Naum 6 December 2017 14: 06
    0
    Quote: alekc73
    Move the capital to Novosibirsk.

    Transfer the "capital" once every 5 years to a new regional center. How many regions and republics do we have there? Enough for five centuries! But seriously, you WILL GIVE MOSCOW IN THE BORDERS OF RUSSIA !!! "