Military Review

On the Day of the draftee about the words of the president to withdraw from the conscription service

71
Less than a month ago, speaking at the Russia Calling! Investment Forum, President Vladimir Putin made a statement about the future structure of the Russian armed forces. According to the president, the number of servicemen under contract already exceeds the number of conscripts. A further statement by the president caused a wide public response. Here is the very statement:


We must keep in mind that we are gradually moving away from the conscription service altogether.


It was the phrase "we leave at all" and led to the emergence of questions, chief among which was the question: Is our country really going to switch completely to a professional army - an army that does not have a call for military service?

Public opinion, as usual, divided. Some took the statement with a fair amount of positive, presenting the thesis that the modern army is not at all what it was customary to understand under the army for several decades. The main arguments here are as follows: only people who perceive service not so much as a constitutional duty, as much as daily work with the improvement of skills and abilities, can actually contribute to the all-Russian security system.

Others (and among them the author of this material, your humble servant) do not believe that the final and, as they say, irrevocable departure from the service of conscription will play a uniquely positive role. And the matter here is not at all in the traditions, which in any business can undergo certain changes. It’s a matter of understanding the fact which country’s heirs we all are.

One may say that only a professional army is capable of responding to all modern challenges from the point of view of encroachments on the security of the Russian Federation, but in fact it is more complacency. Perhaps a fully contract army is exceptionally well suited to states where, in order to get from one side to the other, you can take a scooter and warm up for an hour or two on a perfectly flat asphalt road. It is possible that a fully professional army is suitable for countries where the main danger to the population is ripe coconuts falling from the head of a palm tree. Our situation (and historically), as if to put it mildly, is somewhat different. Ideally smooth asphalt roads can end quite unexpectedly, with palm trees on the lion’s share of the country’s territory in general “not everything is in order”, but there are a lot of “friends” and other “well-wishers”.

There are so many of these "well-wishers" that they say in plain text: "we expect only one thing from Russia - when it collapses." The following is a set of idiomatic expressions, for which reason, a holistic Russia, you see, is simply obliged to cease to exist.

Someone will say, and where are these Wishlist "partners" and the destructiveness of a complete withdrawal from the conscription system? The connection is actually direct. If a citizen of the country initially perceives the defense of the Motherland militarily not at all as his duty, but solely as an opportunity to earn money, it will unwittingly act even at a subconscious level - “all ultimate responsibility is on the employer, and the employer can be changed”. And here you can be at least three times a patriot - the financial issue in any case will make certain adjustments.

This is not a stone in the garden of those who today chose military service under the contract. Honor and praise. This is about the internal perception of conscription service and service on the basis of contractual obligations. And there is a difference in perceptions, can confirm any person who is familiar with the question, as they say, firsthand.

Another question is that the content of the exclusively "draft" army today is dubious pleasure. Young people want to serve (and this is, in principle, a normal desire) less, and during this “time less” mastery of modern military equipment to the average modern draftee is too tough. For 12 months, of course, learning is possible. And in less time studied and learn. But it becomes unacceptable for the state to “lose” a person who has filled his hand (and head) in the operation of equipment and is sent “to demobilization”.

So why reinvent the wheel when a way out is, in fact, found. This is a mixed system - call / contact. After all, the country's armed forces need not only military aces, but also those who, in every sense of the word, offer ammunition.

On comparisons with other major armies of the world, dozens of materials came out on the "VO", and therefore the conclusion is short: the army of a modern country of the world is the golden mean between recruiting and contractual personnel formation systems. It would be desirable to hope that Russia will not chase after unwarranted experiments.

On the Day of the draftee about the words of the president to withdraw from the conscription service


And now, actually, about why this material comes out today. And today in our country - the Day of the recruit. While there are still draftees ... And there is a day ... And this is the day in which the younger generation, the generation of future defenders of the Fatherland, talks about what the profession of protecting the homeland is.

It is gratifying that with each passing year an increasing number of military units open their doors to schoolchildren and students, enabling them to see the life of modern servicemen with their own eyes and form an opinion about the Armed Forces of a country glorious for its remarkable victories. It is necessary to see how the eyes of the boys change, who for the first time in their life have the opportunity to touch the real martial arms, sit at the helm of a military aircraft, be in the compartment of the existing ship.

This means that no one, thank God, has canceled the concept of “military-patriotic education”, and that thanks to these simple, at first glance, public events, a young man can actually have a real goal in life - to serve the Motherland. Otherwise, we ourselves often reproach today's young people, stating that they only have smartphones and low humor on their minds. In fact, young people, as always, are addicted. But what will she be fascinated about in the end - this is the main task of the representatives of the middle and older generations - that is, you and me. And the leadership, I think, is also well aware.
Author:
Photos used:
Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation
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  1. raw174
    raw174 15 November 2017 07: 24
    +6
    I agree with the author. In modern conditions, of course, the role of a professional contractor is enormous; you cannot entrust a conscript to modern missiles and ships. First: To fulfill tasks abroad, contractors are also needed, but unskilled maintenance of equipment, infantry and other masses are urgent. The same motorized rifle, airborne, marines, to train their rank and file to the level of a confident user, it is real, they don’t perform special point tasks, but for mass work it’s the most. Second: men should have a chance to hold a weapon in their hands, get the basics of handling it, understand if he needs a contract service? Taste barracks life. And thirdly: we are the defending side, we don’t want to attack anyone, But defense will require large human resources, they must be trained at least something ...
    PS: my son is 5 months tomorrow, I hope that by his time the call will not be canceled and he will join the army.
    1. Finches
      Finches 15 November 2017 09: 05
      +5
      I, as a man who served in military service, then studied at a military school, commanded a platoon, company, battalion ... I am openly convinced and believe that military service is good for any boy and it’s good for the country! And no one, including the Supreme, This is not convincing! Term is simply a necessary and useful thing, even without abstruse reasoning about the mobilization component, etc.
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 15 November 2017 09: 22
        +5
        Quote: Finches
        Term is just a necessary and useful thing.

        However, "urgency" harms the readiness of units to conduct hostilities.
        So this contradiction must be removed. Fully contracted field army and mobilization reserve training system. Two different structures.
        Then, finally, the “combined BTGs”, which are unacceptable from a military point of view, will finally recede into the past.
        1. Finches
          Finches 15 November 2017 09: 25
          +4
          All this is nonsense! The mixed principle of manning and you need to return two years of service - the problem voiced by you will disappear by itself!
          1. Lopatov
            Lopatov 15 November 2017 09: 32
            +2
            Quote: Finches
            The mixed principle of manning and you need to return two years of service - the problem voiced by you will disappear by itself!

            Not “fall away”, but “weaken”. Replace a quarter of the personnel, also "not a fountain." And where to get them from? Traditionally play the third battalion? At the same time, the need for repeated combat coordination remains.
            There is war, there is a motorized rifle brigade. And she must go to this war in full force with all her luggage. And do not create a “hodgepodge” national hodgepodge called the “motorized rifle battalion reinforced to impossibility”, which requires either a brigade commander or his deputy to command.
            1. Finches
              Finches 15 November 2017 09: 39
              +3
              You are right in many ways, but there is no other way, better. Now BTG is “fighting”, and who will replace the motorized rifle brigade will understaff in a full-scale war - when will it fulfill its mission of covering the state border?
              1. Lopatov
                Lopatov 15 November 2017 10: 05
                +8
                Quote: Finches
                but there is no other way, better.

                Well, why, there is another way. Fully staffed contract team.
                From strength - the fourth, “training” battalion as part of the brigade and training companies / batteries as part of the battalions / battalions of “specialists”, if you really want to train recruits in the army, and not in training centers (as far as I know, this method was previously used in the Bundeswehr).
                At the same time, with this option, it will be possible to withdraw the training group of equipment from the combat units. Well, it will be possible to quickly fill a few "vacancies" with trained conscripts upon departure of the brigade to the database area. Yes, and will protect the PPD to someone
                1. Finches
                  Finches 15 November 2017 10: 11
                  +2
                  By and large, this is exactly what I had in mind! hi
                2. alstr
                  alstr 15 November 2017 12: 19
                  0
                  Unfortunately, this will not be enough, because Battalion controls cannot be deployed to the brigade. In theory, they can be "stretched" only to the regiment.

                  In the USSR, cropped units, i.e. a purely officer corps with equipment, plus a number of draftees to service the equipment. And in the case of mobilization, these parts at the expense of the mobilized turned into full-fledged parts. Moreover, exercises on such a transformation were specially conducted.
                  The only thing that far from the best shots got there. ALAS.

                  Those. theoretically, it is necessary to create cropped parts with the functions of a training center. In peacetime, such a part is engaged in the preparation of draftees, and in wartime it is filled with the same draftees.

                  At the same time, one must clearly understand that, in addition to people, the proper technique is also needed. And this can also be a problem.
                  .
                3. strannik1985
                  strannik1985 15 November 2017 15: 32
                  0
                  The Americans, the Germans (at least earlier), the British, supplement the regular army with territories, the same contract soldiers, only on a “weekend”.
                  1. Lopatov
                    Lopatov 15 November 2017 17: 46
                    0
                    Quote: strannik1985
                    the same contractors, only "day off".

                    And this is another topic. The theme of maintaining the mobility reserve in a combat-ready state
                    1. strannik1985
                      strannik1985 15 November 2017 19: 42
                      0
                      Not really, with the Americans, every major deployment of troops is complete without reservists.
                      1. Lopatov
                        Lopatov 15 November 2017 19: 52
                        0
                        Who cares? It’s a reserve anyway.
              2. Lopatov
                Lopatov 15 November 2017 10: 16
                0
                Quote: Finches
                and who will replace the motorized rifle brigade will be understaffed in a full-scale war

                And there’s no one to “understaff,” thanks Medvedev and Serdyukov.
                There are parts and units of a high degree of readiness that will go to the border. There are parts and formations formed from scratch that are completely made up of reserve troops, from division commanders to the last shooter. Which still need to be trained and conduct combat coordination. And for whom it is necessary to give birth to machinery in agony.
                Between them, a failure in N months, because we do not have either reduced parts or personnel. "We cannot afford it." Lithuania can, we cannot.
                1. Finches
                  Finches 15 November 2017 10: 19
                  +1
                  I don’t even want to talk about it, especially knowing the situation from the inside ...
          2. lukewarm
            lukewarm 15 November 2017 11: 38
            +2
            Quote: Finches
            the mixed principle of manning and you need to return two years of service

            I see another problem on the surface: a contract of 3 years and term 2. The difference is not in favor of term. Only a year less, but a completely different status. Again, there is no problem with conscription just because it is only one year to serve, and of course the conditions of service have changed, yes. And they will return 2 years - the situation will return to what was plus the howl of human rights defenders and professional "soldier mothers"
      2. Greenwood
        Greenwood 15 November 2017 15: 33
        +6
        Quote: Finches
        A term is simply a necessary and useful thing, even without abstruse reasoning about a mobilization component, etc.
        I have a bunch of acquaintances and friends who have served in the army, in various branches of the army. It's funny that everyone at the mention of their service only spit and say something like "I spent a year of my life on some unnecessary garbage." At the same time, no one complained about the irregular relationship with colleagues or, for example, poor feeding, but nevertheless regretted the wasted time that could be spent on career growth or study.
        1. The_X_Factor
          The_X_Factor 21 November 2017 23: 54
          0
          Yeah, for career growth and study.
      3. aiden
        aiden 16 November 2017 00: 31
        0
        you say everything correctly, and many will agree with you
  2. andr327
    andr327 15 November 2017 07: 24
    +3
    Easier - the mobilization readiness of the country is one of the components of the country's security. Our professional army can provide security only with a maximum of 2-3 conflicts, and in a global war, a millionth army is zilch. comparable to the regular army though neighboring China.
    while mobilization readiness, something is not observed either in people or in industry and transport. These events were entrusted to the governors and mayors, but they had no time: you need to collect a collection of watches, provide the company with contracts for your wife, and make a safe haven for yourself at a safe distance from a possible place of conflict ...
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 15 November 2017 08: 54
      +3
      You raised the right question, mobility. One of the most disastrous effects of Medvedev-Serdyukov’s reform was precisely its almost complete loss.
      No, the idea was at first glance correct, and very long overdue: to increase the readiness of the army to participate in local conflicts. That is, wars that are waged without mobilization. But in the conditions of mixed manning, this task cannot be completed, it is an axiom (the service life is one year, it is allowed to participate in military operations of conscripts who have served for at least six months, that is, half of the conscripts of the unit must be replaced, which leads to the need for a second process of combat coordination).
      That is, neither one nor the other. And they did not reach the readiness for local ones, and having completely abandoned the reduced units and reduced-form units, they practically increased the army’s mobility by zero.
    2. lukewarm
      lukewarm 15 November 2017 11: 49
      +1
      The issue of readiness for a global war is very acute and everything is very bad with us. Another thing is that with the existing system of resources, this will NEVER. True, in the current situation, the probability of a global conflict is unknown. If so, then immediately the nuclear and huge armies will not be useful? It is difficult to imagine war on the fronts as World War II. Though...
  3. alex-cn
    alex-cn 15 November 2017 07: 28
    +5
    The contract part of the army with the current technology, of course, is necessary. But excuse me, without the "Vanka with a gun" no army is combat ready. Therefore, I believe and will consider that in the presence of a contract army of constant readiness, it is necessary to have a developed network of training centers for the preparation of a significant number of military schools. ALL eligible young people should go through them. In the future, it is necessary to maintain their skills with short-term training once every 3-5 years. In principle, in many specialties you can prepare for six months, if not distracted by "side work".
  4. Letnab
    Letnab 15 November 2017 07: 49
    +4
    Everything around, but about the topic. If you look radically?
    Gradually, schools are increasingly moving to a paid basis, and the level of education is getting lower. Given the living standards of most of the population, in the future this significant part of the population will become illiterate, which is quite enough for a society. From this we can conclude that to train the defender of the country will require considerable time and a lot of effort. Accordingly, it will become more profitable to maintain a professional than to train a mass of people.
    And if again, in many ways, return to the Soviet version of the education of the defender of the homeland? let it also be compulsory, free, secondary education, including vocational. Higher education for example 50 to 50 is free to paid. I am silent about medicine, since there are many variations, but basically maintaining the health of the population should be on the state. Then, the citizen will be largely obligated to the state, including in the matter of its protection. Yes, and it will be easier to train a soldier with some kind of vocational education than to teach him from scratch.
    T e requires a systematic approach, and not throwing from side to side. Either draft army, then fully professional. In view of the foregoing, the mixed principle of manning an army will be optimal.
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 15 November 2017 09: 16
      +2
      Quote: Letnab
      Gradually, schools are increasingly moving to a paid basis, and the level of education is getting lower. Given the living standards of most of the population, in the future this significant part of the population will become illiterate, which is quite enough for a society.

      I had to take part in the preparation of abnormal calculations of portable ATGMs at one time (you can remove the “launcher” from the BMP-2, and supplement it with a tripod, use it as a portable one, which is often in demand during operations in the mountains)
      Well, an unexpectedly strangely difficult task was to draw up a fire card. And here the dependence was clearly traced: the higher the level of education, the faster the learner realized what was required of them.
      In no case do I want to portray those who have 8 classes behind them, stupid. Often, "guys from the plow", in their practical estimates, far exceeded even former students. But various kinds of abstract concepts were difficult for them to access.

      Our ancestors were not stupid at all when they put gymnasiums above real schools, humanitarian education "educates the brain." And this is very important even for "techies" and other specialized specialists. And including very important for the army
  5. Pacifist
    Pacifist 15 November 2017 07: 56
    +2
    In general, it is written of course correctly, with one remark. The contract army is a peacetime army. Without a draft army, war cannot be won. Studying the history of wars shows that the first stage of the war knocks out the most trained personnel, and then the one with the most trained and motivated reserves has the advantage. Where they come from, in the context of “prepared”, in significant volumes, in the absence of conscription, is a question. It remains to be hoped that in the current period of the history of the war they will limit themselves to options as in Syria and will not grow into something more significant. Only now the chuyka suggests that all this is, so to speak, dreams.
    1. Galleon
      Galleon 15 November 2017 09: 43
      +6
      You speak correctly, in a modern spirit. You can get by with a contract army where war is an argument in a conversation with the elite. Endanger the opponent’s bank, source and depository of his income, and he will be forced to fulfill your requirements. But with us is a special case. With us, a war will be waged only for our destruction, because we are carriers of an alternative civilization to the west. Collaboration with the West will consist in accepting its values, working to destroy our ideas and values, and to participate in the physical destruction of people. When I look at these Ksyusha, Bozen, Kasparov and the rest of the Holy Lot, I think that they have only a little left to the policemen and Sonderkommando. Only reason is not enough.
      If we switch to a fully contracted army, the country's war will cease to be a common misfortune! And this is unacceptable to our spirit.
      1. Greenwood
        Greenwood 15 November 2017 16: 00
        +1
        Quote: Galleon
        the country's war will cease to be a common misfortune!
        Well, now we are fighting in Syria. Do you really think that a lot of Russian citizens care about this? Well, planes fly somewhere far away, but they bomb something, and what's next?!?!
        1. Galleon
          Galleon 15 November 2017 16: 16
          +2
          Really think Greenwood.
          1. Greenwood
            Greenwood 15 November 2017 16: 19
            +1
            I will disappoint you. I have many acquaintances who only know that they are fighting somewhere far away in the Middle East, and for what and for what they have no idea. What happens there at 10000 km is not interesting for many.
            1. Galleon
              Galleon 15 November 2017 16: 36
              +2
              Do not disappoint. I really think, but for myself and about my friends, about my son. I don’t think about you - you are not interested, but you do not attract attention. Try to take off your pants, maybe someone else will attract.
              1. Greenwood
                Greenwood 15 November 2017 16: 38
                +1
                Quote: Galleon
                but for myself and about my friends, about my son
                And what about the war?
                Quote: Galleon
                I don’t think about you - you are not interested, but you do not attract attention. Try to take off your pants, maybe someone else will attract.
                Is personalization a sign of a civilized dialogue?
          2. Lopatov
            Lopatov 15 November 2017 17: 52
            +2
            My platoon ride from the database area to take the session, studied in absentia. The very beginning of the second Chechen. He came and said the following: "you know, men. And there all do not give a damn about the fact that we are at war." It really bothered him ...
    2. Greenwood
      Greenwood 15 November 2017 16: 01
      +3
      Quote: Pacifist
      Without a draft army, war cannot be won.
      If you imagine the war in the Second World War template with millions of armies advancing on cities and villages, then yes. Now wars do not lead this way, leave these fantasies already.
      1. Pacifist
        Pacifist 15 November 2017 16: 27
        0
        I have no fantasies. These are just reflections. If you read carefully what I wrote, the question would not be.
        It remains to be hoped that in the current period of the history of the war they will limit themselves to options as in Syria and will not grow into something more significant.
        1. Greenwood
          Greenwood 15 November 2017 16: 31
          +2
          Ok, I didn’t read to the end.
          Quote: Pacifist
          will not grow into something more meaningful
          Something more significant will be the exchange of cruise and ballistic missiles, and the army of conscripts here again will not help.
  6. brn521
    brn521 15 November 2017 11: 27
    +2
    Nonsense. The real duty to the Motherland is to give birth and raise at least three children. Then it will be normal, one serves, and the other two feed him and provide consumables. And if there are two or fewer children, then congratulations, all your thoughts on the country's mobilization readiness are worthless. Unless you can figure out how to import some Negroes and Chinese into the country, and then prove to them that it is now their homeland and it must be protected.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 15 November 2017 15: 51
      +1
      Quote: brn521
      The real duty to the Motherland is to give birth and raise at least three children.
      It remains only to find a job with a salary of 100 thousand or more, to adequately support his wife (who will naturally stay at home and raise children) and three children. Many people here in Russia earn so much?!?!
      1. Galleon
        Galleon 15 November 2017 16: 20
        +3
        Quote: Greenwood
        Quote: brn521
        The real duty to the Motherland is to give birth and raise at least three children.
        It remains only to find a job with a salary of 100 thousand or more, to adequately support his wife (who will naturally stay at home and raise children) and three children. Many people here in Russia earn so much?!?!

        You are just looking for an excuse, speak honestly. If you had a salary of 100 ty, you would need housing, a good car, travel, a nest egg for a rainy day, and not 3-4 children. Who needs children, has children without regard to salary. Believe me, I have the right and reason to say so bully
        1. Greenwood
          Greenwood 15 November 2017 16: 34
          +3
          Quote: Galleon
          Who needs children, has children without regard to salary.
          Well, and in what conditions will these children grow up ?! Thank you, I would not want my children to have such a childhood, when parents refuse everything to themselves and their children, just to survive.
  7. lukewarm
    lukewarm 15 November 2017 11: 33
    +1
    Urgent need unconditionally. For the very reasons that the author called. In general, a 2-stage system looks logical. I served a year of urgency, I learned something, I realized that this is YOUR (at least for the next 3-5 years). Forward to the contract. How else? Contractor learn from scratch? As an conscript, but for a lot more money? Well, in general, let's say bluntly: the situation in the economy (especially in small towns and villages) is such that for guys the contract is almost the only way out after traveling to work from Zamkady to non-rubber.
  8. would
    would 15 November 2017 12: 58
    +1
    Well, first you need to remember that the elections are on the way, already in March 2018. For real and not very good reasons, young people don’t like the army and mow down with all their might, now it’s put on stream and for 70-120 thousand the lawyers will absolutely lawfully and legally recruit the conscript from the army. They will find the disease and stretch it if necessary, and they will win the court if necessary. Including because lawyers in the military enlistment office are such that they have not been dug up from where. The times of running away through the fire escape or downpipe have passed, now everything is according to the law and is reliable, just pay the money. This is also why the number of official draft deviators is so small.

    But young people are still opposed to the draft army and, as a result, positively assesses any ideas for canceling the draft. Therefore, this is promised by Navalny, and therefore this statement by Putin can draw a certain number of young votes to his side. Policy. Therefore, I personally would not seriously consider Putin’s statement.

    If a citizen of the country initially perceives the defense of the Motherland militarily not at all as his duty, but solely as an opportunity to earn money, then this will involuntarily act even at a subconscious level - “all ultimate responsibility lies with the employer, and the employer can be changed”.


    The only problem is that a minority has always been ideologically motivated at all times. This is a well-known problem, including for intelligence, which is faced with recruiting agents, a very small part is ready to be recruited solely for ideological reasons. But there are many who are ready for the money. And about conscripts who are 18 years old and have nothing to say.
    1. Greenwood
      Greenwood 15 November 2017 15: 48
      +3
      Quote: rait
      The only problem is that a minority has always been ideologically motivated at all times.
      I don’t understand what kind of idea and ideology some individual overly patriotic individuals are talking about here ?! In modern capitalist Russia there is no state ideology, we have harsh capitalist realities. And if so, then please pay, and not rant about "the homeland is in danger."
  9. Greenwood
    Greenwood 15 November 2017 15: 45
    +5
    The logic of the author is not very clear. Here he writes:
    If a citizen of the country initially perceives the defense of the Motherland militarily not at all as his duty, but solely as an opportunity to earn money, then this will involuntarily act even at a subconscious level - “all ultimate responsibility lies with the employer, and the employer can be changed”. And here you can be at least three times a patriot - the financial issue in any case will make certain adjustments.
    Those. a person who has consciously joined the army and wants to devote his life to the cause of defending the Motherland and professionally develop in this regard (but while receiving money for his activities) will be less useful to the army than an unfortunate conscript, who was shoved to the unit instead of college or working against his will and which all this year of his life will simply count the days remaining before the demobilization. And such an conscript who is engaged in an unloved business and, at times, perceives his service as hard labor, from which he must suddenly feel a surge of patriotism, imbued with the sacred idea of ​​defending the Motherland, etc. wassat The author, wake up already, in the courtyard of the 21st century, the era of globalization, we are in capitalist reality. Now no one wants to do unloved business, if he is not paid for it. Nobody has been working for an idea for a long time, any activity should be encouraged financially. Soviet times are gone.
    I support the idea of ​​moving to a professional army.
    1. brn521
      brn521 15 November 2017 18: 16
      +2
      Quote: Greenwood
      we are in capitalist reality. Now no one wants to do unloved business, if he is not paid for it

      And here he wants, does not want? Making money is a duty. Residence permit will remain, then there will be payment for a communal apartment. There is property - it means there will be taxes. And the draftee, instead of making money or studying, fools around, shaking urgent money. I understand that if a character himself wants to become a security official, urgency for him is like a first course of study. And the rest is wasting time and they still have to pay for it.
      Quote: Greenwood
      and which all this year of his life will simply count the days remaining before the demobilization

      Well, yes, I remember one character when they served for another 2 years. As demobilized the very next day, he ran to look for any job. Until the age of 18, he lived with his mother and sister. Mother lost her job, sister was still in school. It was not clear that they ate, the debt for the apartment ran. So he plowed in two jobs.
      Although this is the case here, if you yourself have served an urgent term, then the rest should be repaid to the Motherland, so it will be fair. This thought or feeling is the true reason for many to defend the need to maintain conscription service.
      1. would
        would 16 November 2017 06: 07
        +1
        Speaking of money and appeal. In Switzerland, which is known for its conscription system when conscripting for military training, a soldier retains wages from his place of work. That is, he is for example at a military training camp, and he receives money as if he continues to work. A fixed monetary allowance is granted only to the unemployed. At the same time, they are not in the army all year round, but the service life is divided into parts that, of course, are formed within certain boundaries, but at the request of the conscript.

        Accordingly, the probability of the described situation with

        As demobilized the very next day, he ran to look for any job. Until the age of 18, he lived with his mother and sister. Mother lost her job, sister was still in school. It was not clear that they ate, the debt for the apartment ran. So he plowed in two jobs.


        Switzerland is sharply lower than in Russia.
  10. Sige
    Sige 15 November 2017 20: 06
    +4
    In addition to cheap labor, there are no pluses to military service.
    In the modern army, conscripts are needed only so that they do not pay money.
  11. MOSKVITYANIN
    MOSKVITYANIN 15 November 2017 23: 16
    0
    It seems that there was already such an article here on this site, many received bans and insults from each other, well, let's start again ....
    I am for a mixed manning system for the rank and file of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation ...
  12. Sofa warrior
    Sofa warrior 16 November 2017 00: 16
    +2
    Again, scoops in the worst sense of the word begin to talk about how useful it is for everyone to drive the boys out from under the stick. The most appropriate option is voluntariness. Provide a choice, if you want - serve, if you do not want - do not serve. Some guys are happy to go, but the meduha does not pass, others shy away from the fire and are caught and sent there anyway.
    1. MOSKVITYANIN
      MOSKVITYANIN 16 November 2017 01: 00
      0
      Sofa warrior Provide a choice, if you want - serve, if you do not want - do not serve.

      Again scoops (from sergeant staff) in the worst sense of the word begin to talk about how useful ....
      Well, if you take your thought as justice in the last resort, then you can start by making amendments to the current Constitution of the Russian Federation:
      namely, article 59, but for now:
      1. Defense of the Fatherland is a duty and obligation of a citizen of the Russian Federation.
      "" 2. A citizen of the Russian Federation carries out military service in accordance with federal law.
      "" 3. A citizen of the Russian Federation, if his convictions or religion is contrary to military service, as well as in other cases established by federal law, has the right to replace it with alternative civilian service.

      Part 1 Art. 1 Federal Law of 28.03.1998 N 53-ФЗ (as amended by 26.07.2017) "On Military Duty and Military Service"
      1. The military duty of citizens of the Russian Federation (hereinafter - citizens) provides:
      military registration;
      compulsory preparation for military service;
      conscription;
      military service on conscription;
      stay in stock;
      call for military training and the passage of military training during the stay in the reserve.

      One of the side effects of "sick" and "crippled":
      Civil Service Restrictions
      part 1 n.11), article 16 Federal Law of 27.07.2004 N 79-ФЗ (as amended by 29.07.2017) "On the State Civil Service of the Russian Federation":
      11 ) recognition of him not having completed military service on conscription, without legal grounds, in accordance with the conclusion of the draft board (with the exception of citizens who have performed military service under the contract) - within 10 years from the date of expiration of the deadline set for appeal of the specified conclusion to the draft board of the relevant constituent entity of the Russian Federation, and if the specified conclusion and (or) decision upon appeal of a citizen to the specified conclusion, the draft committee of the relevant subject of the Russian Federation was appealed to the court, - within 10 years from the date of entry into legal force of the court decision, which recognized the rights of the citizen in making the said conclusion and (or) the decision of the draft commission of the Russian Federation of the corresponding subject of the complaint of a citizen to the above conclusion has not been violated;

      Change the current law of the Russian Federation and faster to our forum, and we are “scoops” by this time, we’ll just be suitable for your target audience about the “wisest” ...., but most likely we’ll send you dear with your imposing thoughts ....

      If the muzzle does not want to fulfill its constitutional duty in any of the ways provided for by the Constitution, then it must sit (serving time can be replaced by an unreasonable fine or community service in mines), and when it does not have the right to work in the state and municipal services ..... as in principle now is ...
  13. First iron-faced
    First iron-faced 16 November 2017 04: 45
    +2
    By the way, the units and subdivisions of the US National Guard, when deploying troops, act only in the second echelon of the group or as part of the occupying forces after the completion of the main phase of the military operation. The main work remains with the regular troops uniformly (recruitingly) staffed.
    1. MOSKVITYANIN
      MOSKVITYANIN 16 November 2017 07: 26
      0
      A link to a specific Field Charter can be FM -......?
      1. First iron-faced
        First iron-faced 16 November 2017 08: 06
        +1
        You do not need to be clever, shocking FMs, this is not spelled out in the field charters, but is practiced during the database, starting with the Gulf War, operations in the former SFRY, Iraq and Afghanistan. Study. Other business will be in a large-scale war.
  14. Sofa warrior
    Sofa warrior 16 November 2017 08: 47
    0
    Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
    Sofa warrior Provide a choice, if you want - serve, if you do not want - do not serve.

    Again scoops (from sergeant staff) in the worst sense of the word begin to talk about how useful ....
    Well, if you take your thought as justice in the last resort, then you can start by making amendments to the current Constitution of the Russian Federation:
    namely, article 59, but for now:
    1. Defense of the Fatherland is a duty and obligation of a citizen of the Russian Federation.
    "" 2. A citizen of the Russian Federation carries out military service in accordance with federal law.
    "" 3. A citizen of the Russian Federation, if his convictions or religion is contrary to military service, as well as in other cases established by federal law, has the right to replace it with alternative civilian service.

    Part 1 Art. 1 Federal Law of 28.03.1998 N 53-ФЗ (as amended by 26.07.2017) "On Military Duty and Military Service"
    1. The military duty of citizens of the Russian Federation (hereinafter - citizens) provides:
    military registration;
    compulsory preparation for military service;
    conscription;
    military service on conscription;
    stay in stock;
    call for military training and the passage of military training during the stay in the reserve.

    One of the side effects of "sick" and "crippled":
    Civil Service Restrictions
    part 1 n.11), article 16 Federal Law of 27.07.2004 N 79-ФЗ (as amended by 29.07.2017) "On the State Civil Service of the Russian Federation":
    11 ) recognition of him not having completed military service on conscription, without legal grounds, in accordance with the conclusion of the draft board (with the exception of citizens who have performed military service under the contract) - within 10 years from the date of expiration of the deadline set for appeal of the specified conclusion to the draft board of the relevant constituent entity of the Russian Federation, and if the specified conclusion and (or) decision upon appeal of a citizen to the specified conclusion, the draft committee of the relevant subject of the Russian Federation was appealed to the court, - within 10 years from the date of entry into legal force of the court decision, which recognized the rights of the citizen in making the said conclusion and (or) the decision of the draft commission of the Russian Federation of the corresponding subject of the complaint of a citizen to the above conclusion has not been violated;

    Change the current law of the Russian Federation and faster to our forum, and we are “scoops” by this time, we’ll just be suitable for your target audience about the “wisest” ...., but most likely we’ll send you dear with your imposing thoughts ....

    If the muzzle does not want to fulfill its constitutional duty in any of the ways provided for by the Constitution, then it must sit (serving time can be replaced by an unreasonable fine or community service in mines), and when it does not have the right to work in the state and municipal services ..... as in principle now is ...

    So this is not my thought, this is the president proposing, in which I absolutely support him. He is an intelligent person and understands perfectly well that there is more harm than good from the sub-fingernails. The conscription system is just a money transfer, but some really want to serve, I know such, but not all. The state loses money, businessmen earn. So it is necessary to give the opportunity to serve those who want and stupidly lag behind those who do not want.

    I don’t know who you need to be in order to trust your defense to the “face” that does not want to do this and is forced to do so only with a fine or a sentence. Now is not the Soviet time, if you really really smell fried with a real risk of getting a bullet, these draftees will simply scatter. Well, there it’s already as lucky, MB is just home to mom, and MB is looting with weapons.
    1. MOSKVITYANIN
      MOSKVITYANIN 17 November 2017 00: 38
      0
      Sofa warrior I don’t know who you need to be in order to trust your defense to the “face” that does not want to do this and is forced to do so only with a fine or a sentence.

      I offer a mixed recruitment system, as in all countries, but it is better to have a selective set that was with the Union before the 39 ... without a prepared mobilization reserve it is impossible ...
      Even the “rotting” USA and Great Britain have such a thing as an army reserve (not to be confused with units of the National Guard and the Territorial Army, respectively), I don’t know now, and in the 15th century the USA had 300 thousand people in the army reserve.
      if it really really smells fried with real risk of getting a bullet, these draftees will simply scatter. Well, there it’s already as lucky, MB is just home to mom, and MB is looting with weapons.

      Wake up. We have two Chechen companies passed, all the burden just fell on conscripts ....
      1. brn521
        brn521 17 November 2017 11: 21
        +1
        Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
        Wake up. We have two Chechen companies passed, all the burden just fell on conscripts ....

        First moment. It's actually about protecting the country. Sending fines to somewhere is much easier - they have nowhere to run. Yes, and the Soviet legacy was still drawing, and now it's late, a quarter of a century has passed, people have changed. Homeland? And what does the current ruling regime have to do with it? . Defend the homeland? From whom? From Moscow in the first place, from the White House and the Duma. But if it comes not to separatism, but to alternative power and civil war? Well, why drive the draftees into the army, preparing the soldiers for a future uprising?
        Second moment. For some, the homeland is not the Russian Federation, but only Siberia, Tatarstan or a native village. Who were the Chechen fighters? Yesterday's conscripts. Yesterday they were very willing to serve, trained at public expense. And now these are separatists. Well, and who will the ruling regime really teach without fail under the guise of a line service? Rebels and separatists.
        For example, the Chinese will attack us. What will they declare, like return them to the Far East with Sakhalin, or even all of Siberia? No, they will begin to hang noodles on our ears that they want to rid us of the oligarchic regime, return socialism, etc. They’ll just say so: step aside, you can’t even give up your weapons, but rather, let’s go with us to Moscow, at the same time you can pinch the oligarchs.
  15. First iron-faced
    First iron-faced 17 November 2017 20: 49
    0
    I offer a mixed picking system, as in all countries ...

    In which militarily developed countries
    1. First iron-faced
      First iron-faced 17 November 2017 21: 30
      +2
      There is no desire to give his son conscripts, but he wants to serve as a regular military officer or professionally train for at least 3-5 years, then please, this is his choice.

      Look, the "butcher" wanted the untrained! And again, drill, disassembly-cleaning-assembly AK - the top of the military (okoloboyskautsky level).
    2. MOSKVITYANIN
      MOSKVITYANIN 17 November 2017 23: 29
      0
      Quote: First iron-faced
      I offer a mixed picking system, as in all countries ...

      In which militarily developed countries

      Wrong question?
      In which economically developed countries ....
      1. First iron-faced
        First iron-faced 18 November 2017 09: 20
        0
        - Demagogy. Only the primitive will not understand that militarily developed countries are not in terms of numbers, number of divisions / brigades, tanks, etc.
  16. M. Michelson
    M. Michelson 18 November 2017 06: 38
    +1
    Settled contract, contract! Atu her!
    The contract army model was first proposed by the "democrats" in the 90s. So they are discussing it.
    Meanwhile, Shoigu has now proposed another, interesting model. The young conscript concludes a contract and goes to serve a year as a contract soldier; and not concluded - for half a year conscripts.
    The main plus of the conscript contractor is the salary plus the human attitude - such as to be an overseer, and not like a green cattle, obliged to go everywhere only in formation.
    Here I see the key to solving the problem. It’s not a contract, but a transition from universal Service to universal training military affairs.
    Universal conscription in the USSR was needed to constantly keep a huge army under arms. Which was needed so that in the event of a major war, without regard to losses, reach the Atlantic (and make the war from the West pointless).
    Such was the military doctrine (which was not particularly discussed). In short, it was necessary to scare enemies with a huge army.
    Now Russia scaring enemies with a quantity is simply pointless. Hence, the call to the service not needed.
    Full military service involves breaking personality; without this it is impossible: a soldier should be afraid of a corporal's stick more than a retinue of bullets. And here to educate military affairs without such a break is quite possible; the conscript must simply be trained in the basics of subordination and discipline, so that he knows what awaits him in future military service or in mobilization, and is ready.
    It is this breakdown in isolation (with hazing, etc. manifestations of lack of control) that many draftees are afraid of. Therefore, the current draft contract is a step in the right direction. But he is even redundant. You just need to radically restructure the training system for draftees. Then the contract will remain only for the professional military.
    1. MOSKVITYANIN
      MOSKVITYANIN 18 November 2017 07: 36
      0
      The IDF is equipped with conscripts mainly, but this does not mean that the Israel Defense Forces are not combat-ready ....
      Meanwhile, Shoigu has now proposed another, interesting model. The young conscript concludes a contract and goes to serve a year as a contract soldier; and not concluded - for half a year conscripts.

      Can you link?
      The main plus of the conscript contractor is the salary plus the human attitude - such as to be an overseer, and not like a green cattle, obliged to go everywhere only in formation.

      Maybe the problem is in the officers and their lack of authority among subordinates .... In constant readiness units and in 90's only we didn’t go in formation ....
      Full-fledged military service involves breaking a person; without this it is impossible: a soldier should be afraid of a corporal's stick more than a retinue of bullets. But to teach military affairs without such breaking is quite possible; the conscript must simply be trained in the basics of subordination and discipline, so that he knows what awaits him in future military service or in mobilization, and is ready.

      Contradict yourself. In pre-draft preparation, is it possible to do without breaking one’s personality, this is the basis for military training of all the armies of the world and pre-army educational institutions .....
      You just need to radically restructure the training system for draftees.

      I completely agree ..... I will add and make some changes to the secondary school curriculum .....
  17. First iron-faced
    First iron-faced 18 November 2017 09: 37
    +1
    Guys, have you seen the territory of Israel, redrawn in a matter of time? For him, nuclear deterrence (unless of course he has this WMD) from the neighbors clearly does not channel. It remains to be overlaid with armed citizens and tanks.
    3 years of service near the home of the father is the norm for a Jewish boy.
  18. First iron-faced
    First iron-faced 18 November 2017 12: 48
    +2
    Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
    ... add and make some changes to the secondary school curriculum ...

    And it’s enough to already “make plans for our children” (especially concerns the residents of Moscow, always sure what is good for the rest of Russia)!
    In the geyrop, the state takes on raising children in cf. secondary schools with tolerance at the exit (here the state and social workers are already higher than the family), the state will go to the forest and in the education of patriotism and "teaching" the so-called NVP, together with their "specialists" -teachers, to instill a love for the motherland is the business of parents. Great importance! - pull the antiviral gas, dismantle the training AK (such manipulations are learned by high school students instantly, they will not dumb by the age of 18-19), or familiarize yourself with the measures of protection against WMD, which for a smart modern brow and child will work at the instinct level (films, Internet, games), coupled with basic knowledge of physics, chemistry, biology. Classes for military recruits will not take much time.
    In the Russian Federation, in my opinion, no one except the incumbent president cherishes this democracy. What a forgetfulness of the lessons of its history and the mistakes of others.
    1. MOSKVITYANIN
      MOSKVITYANIN 20 November 2017 20: 22
      0
      First iron-faced
      And it’s enough to already “make plans for our children” (especially concerns the residents of Moscow, always sure what is good for the rest of Russia)!

      How do you know what Muscovites are sure of? I personally don’t give a damn about those who don’t love them (I live my life), but at the same time those who don’t love “damned masqueals”, but who are unable to transform their constituent entities of the Russian Federation from a donor donated to the region ....
      1. First iron-faced
        First iron-faced 21 November 2017 04: 42
        0
        Heh! Loves, does not love, Poked. The fictional "reformers" scurrying everywhere you do not care, we live and work. Everything has been invented and completed for a long time - when will you learn?
        1. MOSKVITYANIN
          MOSKVITYANIN 21 November 2017 07: 28
          0
          Quote: First iron-faced
          Everything has been invented and completed for a long time - when will you learn?

          I say, 95% of all armies in the world are equipped with a mixed manning system, prove the opposite ....
          1. First iron-faced
            First iron-faced 21 November 2017 08: 09
            0
            Some of the more efficient, and some of the mediocre. It’s not interesting for x-nu to grind about hundreds of countries, and 95% is bold for the I-talker, argue with the supreme.
            1. MOSKVITYANIN
              MOSKVITYANIN 21 November 2017 20: 09
              0
              Quote: First iron-faced
              Some of the more efficient, and some of the mediocre. It’s not interesting for x-nu to grind about hundreds of countries, and 95% is bold for the I-talker, argue with the supreme.

              Well, as I understand it, there’s nothing to tell you on any of my questions (arising from your comments)?
              1. First iron-faced
                First iron-faced 22 November 2017 04: 49
                0
                Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
                Well, as I understand it, there’s nothing to tell you on any of my questions (arising from your comments)?

                “What he said, what he said, hs.”
  19. Loki_2
    Loki_2 20 November 2017 17: 06
    +1
    Mercenary artillery is good for small local conflicts, drafted for global wars. The optimal military doctrine for the Russian Federation I consider readiness for both types of conflicts. Consequently, the army must have units of both types.