Military Review

USSR collapse: only Azerbaijan won

70
Almost 26 years have passed since the collapse of the Soviet Union, but looking back, the question constantly arises: was it not better for his people to stay together? And the answer, of course, cannot be unambiguous.


USSR collapse: only Azerbaijan won


Pravda.Ru shared his point of view on the collapse of the USSR with First Deputy Chairman of the State Duma Committee on CIS Affairs, Eurasian Integration and Relations with Compatriots, Director of the Institute of CIS Countries Konstantin Zatulin.

- Do you think that Russia lost politically, but won economically from the collapse of the Soviet Union?

- Russia lost both politically and economically. Here it is necessary to compare both absolute and relative numbers. In a very long period, we could not reach the output of production, similar to what we achieved in 2013 year. There was an absolute drop in volumes, and even the destruction of the production itself.

- For the reason that, under the USSR, all the republics were in "one bundle", including the economic?

- It is clear that as a result of the collapse, there is no ground for prosperity or economic growth. The collapse can not lead to subsequent investments in the economy. And this, in turn, becomes a brake on the way of further development. Over time, any system adapts, and ours is no exception.

Against the background of a common misfortune, there are still certain positive circumstances: we were left with mineral resources, with oil and gas, which helped to fight the decline in living standards and production. But these industries also existed for a long time without renewal and investment funds. And in this regard, at the present time, they are only finalizing their potential, which was laid back in Soviet times. The investments made in them once were already repeatedly depreciated, and now, of course, it is necessary to have the means to carry out a large-scale reconstruction.

- And which republics actually benefited from secession?

- Azerbaijan is the only country that officially surpassed the level of 1990 of the year, but also exclusively by oil and gas production. All the rest, deprived of this pillow, of course, very much slowed down in development. Ukraine, which was a prosperous country from all points of view, today barely pulls out half of what it did before in terms of gross domestic product.

“But each republic specialized in something of its own ...”

“This is a very rough analysis, that one specialized in one thing and the other in something else. The RSFSR practically specialized in the entire product range. However, there were, of course, some insignificant industries where the RSFSR was not present. For example, in the Russian geographical zone, in contrast to Central Asia, cotton is not grown. And in this respect, of course, the republics with monoproducts found themselves in a difficult situation. Because they needed to find a new consumer of their products.

As for any other circumstances, such movements were noted, for example, reversed, or economic regression in different areas, which are generally very difficult to explain reasonably. For example, Moldova is currently importing tomatoes! That is, Moldova, which generally fed the entire Soviet Union with juices, fruits, vegetables, wine, does not even produce tomatoes now because it lost with the collapse of the Soviet Union market. As a result, the cities of Moldova were left without these vegetables and were forced to buy them in the European Union, that is, in Poland and Bulgaria. And this is just a shameful phenomenon, taking into account the traditions of vegetable growing in Moldova.

- Is it possible to turn the clock back?

- In my opinion, today it is unlikely to return to the past in the political sense of the word, that is, to create a state that — though not called the USSR — would include most of this territory ...

Today we are following the path of creating and developing economic unions with the expectation that they can gradually become more and more self-sufficient. Our interest is connected, among other things, with the need for a capacious market.

Experts say that the self-sufficient market begins to grow when 250-300 has millions of consumers. Today we have half of this number in Russia. And we, of course, as well as the Eurasian Union, and all others are trying to solve the issue of the Big Market, which would allow us to restore a whole series of lost or crisis sectors of the national economy. This includes, in particular, the aircraft industry, and a number of other economic areas, which until recently, when they began to develop again, were in a depressed state.

It seems obvious that this economic depression was associated with the collapse of the common market. Moreover, the process was going on not only here, but also on the scale of the entire Soviet Union. The same argument applies to the economic collapse of the Eastern European socialist states united in the Council for Mutual Economic Assistance (CMEA).

So, I remember that the Hungarian Ikarus factory supplied buses to all socialist countries. But today this enterprise does not exist. Or, let's say, in our Baltics, the RAF plant was known all over the country. He produced minibuses. This enterprise also disappeared. Or, for example, a factory that made electronics in Riga.

And in this regard, of course, attempts to restore cooperation are present, but today they are very difficult because of the barriers imposed by the creation of individual states. Often, new sovereign units pursue an independent and conflicting policy. Often they try to integrate into other niches, such as, for example, in the EU niche (the Eastern Partnership program).

And the matter is not only in the states themselves and their desires. In fact, there is a great desire of other players on the world market to pull down any disintegrated parts of the whole Soviet Union into their own system of coordinates. Of course, on subordinate terms: as a sales market, as a source of raw materials, etc. And in this respect Russia is also not free from problems and complaints. So, to recreate in such conditions is not what the Soviet Union is, but to create an effective economic union is a very difficult task. And Ukraine alone is enough for many integration efforts to be compromised.

- Can the CIS be considered a new embodiment of the Soviet Union?

- Of course not. From the very beginning, this was propaganda, a lie, that the CIS will become more modern, alternative to the Soviet Union, but much more effective unification. This could not have been by definition, since a single national economic complex existed before, and as a result of the collapse of the Soviet Union, national economies appeared.

The point was that in order to calm the masses of the population, who had recently voted in a referendum to preserve the Soviet Union, it was necessary to throw dust in their eyes, and say that "We are not destroying anything, we are creating!" or "We are not destroying the Soviet Union - we are creating the CIS!" This is a rather simple trick, but for many it worked, although not everywhere, since conflicts, as is known, accompanied the entire process of the collapse of the USSR, but were still local, peripheral, and not global, as, for example, in Yugoslavia.

- Do you have a feeling that Russia is repeating something? history THE USSR?

- If you mean the fact that Russia claims to have a significant role in the world and is a great power, which corresponds to the foundations of Russia, then of course! Inevitably, Russia, pursuing its national interests - new or edited after the collapse of the USSR - follows the path of restoring influence in the whole space, which is called Eurasian or post-Soviet. And in this regard there may be external coincidences with the Soviet past.

But at the same time, Russia, in fact, is building its economic system on completely different prerequisites - it has rejected the state ideology in the text of the Constitution, which today may be subject to doubts, but corresponds to the status quo. And she does not confess the former Marxism-Leninism as a guiding line. And in this sense, Russia is different from the Soviet Union.

And if we talk about whether Russia has modern national interests, then yes - they are, but the Soviet Union had them too! And they are set not only by the fact of Marxism-Leninism, but also by the location, character and self-sufficiency or not self-sufficiency of the national economy, as well as the place that the country occupies in the world. By virtue of this, Russia is simply sentenced to play a certain role because it simply cannot be otherwise!

- Do you regret in your heart that everything was destroyed?

- Not everything was destroyed, although a lot. Of course, I have such regret. And this I do not differ from the vast mass of the population of Russia - from those generations who remember the old days and lived in them. Because, of course, the degree of control over a person is completely different now and before. Before, it was much higher: you couldn’t very often express what you think, etc. I consider the change as positive. But, on the other hand, there was also the fact of involvement in a great country that was respected all over the world and which no one dared to subject to sanctions, and the head of this country - to gross insults.

Yes, of course, critical literature and films were issued to the USSR, but this is purely from the sphere of propaganda and not only ... Of course, there were objective reasons for such criticism.

Today, in some cases, we are confronted with the fact that we are neglected. For me, and for many others, this is very painful. And I am ready to agree with the fact that it is necessary to sacrifice some personal well-being or postpone the achievement of some personal goals, if it is necessary to restore the former attitude to us.

The fact that today is the subject of the dispute is statements of the following category: “Here, we quarrel with the West over Syria or Ukraine; why it is necessary; we suffer from this; we are sanctioned from this; we must forget about it; we all agree and give a damn about it. " There is such a line. For me, this political line is unacceptable.
Author:
Originator:
https://www.pravda.ru/expert/18-10-2017/1350991-soviet-0/
70 comments
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  1. Thracian warrior
    Thracian warrior 30 October 2017 15: 38 New
    +3
    Quote: dsk

    If the Orthodox part of Ukraine returns, the USSR will be reborn.

    laughing laughing laughing
    1. Mavrikiy
      Mavrikiy 30 October 2017 16: 48 New
      +2
      Che, without the 16th republic we can’t do it? repeat
  2. Rurikovich
    Rurikovich 30 October 2017 15: 43 New
    +4
    Everyone lost. But some people got a lot of trinkets and still it is whispering anxiously: "I brought peace to the planet" angry
    Turn everything back and put everyone together again? laughing You need a person of the IVS scale to carry out your plan with a firm hand! Now this is not close, but because dreams will remain dreams ... request
    1. MOSKVITYANIN
      30 October 2017 20: 06 New
      +1
      Rurikovich Everyone lost.

      Try to prove to me that my RSFSR began to live worse without other republics of the USSR (without parasites) ...
      with a firm hand to do what was intended! Now this is not close, but because dreams will remain dreams

      But what about Grygorich? You Belarusians will unite with Ukraine, and we will see what comes of this, the experimenters ....
      The Russians have lived too long with a strong hand, often belonging to a non-Russian ..., somehow we survive without
      personality scale IVS
      1. Rurikovich
        Rurikovich 30 October 2017 21: 46 New
        +1
        Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
        (without parasites) ...

        Read more and not worth it No. Smacks of chauvinism hi
        PS How many nationalities in the RSFSR, Russian Are you ours wink ?
        1. MOSKVITYANIN
          30 October 2017 21: 52 New
          +1
          Quote: Rurikovich
          PS How many nationalities in the RSFSR, Russian Are you ours wink ?

          What is the difference, all of ours, and the gorlopans that feed all of Russia, are not among them ....
          To fight for you, yes, to build a common state together, no ...
          1. Rurikovich
            Rurikovich 30 October 2017 22: 53 New
            +1
            Quote: MOSKVITYANIN
            To fight for you, yes, to build a common state together, no ...

            Well, fence yourself off, send everyone away and live as you please wink
            1. MOSKVITYANIN
              30 October 2017 23: 07 New
              +1
              Quote: Rurikovich
              Well, fence yourself off, send everyone away and live as you please wink

              This is how the elders decide ... it will be necessary to put a fence along the Euphrates or ... Bug ...
              It’s a sin for the residents of the former BSSR to be offended by the current RF, they never left you without money, we take your opinion into account, you should not have any enemies .... (everyone wants to live), therefore your comments are not clear ....
              If the wretched from the EU with a strong economy before the confederation has not yet ripened, what can we say about us ...
        2. Setrac
          Setrac 30 October 2017 22: 42 New
          +2
          Quote: Rurikovich
          Read more and not worth chauvinism smacks of
          PS How many nationalities in the RSFSR, Russian Are you ours

          "Freebie" is not a nationality, but a way of life.
          1. Rurikovich
            Rurikovich 30 October 2017 22: 51 New
            +3
            Quote: Setrac
            "Freebie" is not a nationality, but a way of life.

            For that matter, it was under the USSR that the then BSSR was not a "parasite"

            wink hi
            1. Setrac
              Setrac 30 October 2017 23: 32 New
              +3
              Quote: Rurikovich
              For that matter, it was under the USSR that the then BSSR was not a "parasite"

              Therefore, the only Belarusians have no hatred of the Russians for the loss of freebies.
            2. Seal
              Seal 31 October 2017 13: 56 New
              +2
              Georgia and Armenia are impressive. The most like the then said "welcoming and hospitable" Soviet republics. If even their "cordiality" and "hospitableness" would have been provided for by their own labor .... And so, at someone else's expense, why not be "cordial" and "hospitable".
  3. vlad007
    vlad007 30 October 2017 15: 52 New
    +8
    The USSR was not a union of equal republics. Almost all republics existed through subsidies from the RSFSR. I am sure that Russia won or will benefit in the future from the collapse of the USSR. Zatulin did not say that Russia took upon itself all the debts of all the former republics of the USSR and this year fully paid them. What achievement of the 1990 level of the year can be discussed in such a situation. This year, Russia has harvested a record for the entire existence of the USSR grain harvest - 130 million tons, without Ukraine and Kazakhstan. When was this? As far as I remember, the USSR always bought grain in Canada.
    1. Mavrikiy
      Mavrikiy 30 October 2017 16: 46 New
      0
      So then +. But about Canada, no trash. They bought their wheat in Canada. So our TseKisty laundered money or "earned" schemes .....
    2. Doliva63
      Doliva63 30 October 2017 16: 51 New
      +8
      "This year, Russia has collected a record for the entire existence of the USSR grain harvest - 130 million tons ...."
      In the 70-80s, as far as I remember, they collected for 200 million tons. Of these, 100-120 million tons accounted for the RSFSR. What is the breakthrough? recourse
      1. insular
        insular 31 October 2017 02: 37 New
        0
        Quote: Doliva63
        Of these, 100-120 million tons accounted for in the RSFSR

        Forage share?
        Quote: Doliva63
        grain crop - 130 million tons .... "

        Same question...
      2. Seal
        Seal 31 October 2017 14: 04 New
        +2
        Russia will harvest a record grain harvest this year, Minister of Agriculture Alexander Tkachev said with confidence at a government meeting. The harvest, according to him, will exceed the historical record of 1978, when 127 million tons were collected. It is about collecting grain only in the RSFSR, recalls Dmitry Rylko, director general of the Institute for Agricultural Market Studies. In the USSR as a whole, according to the State Statistics Committee, the grain harvest that year exceeded 238 million tons.
  4. Zaurbek
    Zaurbek 30 October 2017 16: 38 New
    +3
    Won Azerbaijan. That's for sure. But under the USSR, a lot of resources were invested in it. Oil and gas production, Petrochemical complex in Sumgait, Oil equipment factories, Tire plant, Bakkonditsioner (of national importance), Electronics plant in Kirovobad .. and much more.
  5. Kirsov93
    Kirsov93 30 October 2017 16: 40 New
    +6
    An article from the category: "Longing for the USSR - now let us" unite "again - (translated from Russian chauvinism, we will capture you and will rule you)." Why no one to say - who left the first of the USSR. Correctly ! RSFSR, followed by all the others. The USSR collapsed due to two factors: 1 The elite, which without control from the bottom (and indeed without control) simply simply rotted 2. The people who listened to propaganda (which was half the truth about capitalism, democracy, freedom and other things in the West) and perceived this half-truth as a lie! No rotten West in life would destroy the USSR (a self-sufficient superpower), look at the examples of North Korea and Cuba (I’m not saying that you need to strive for their way of life, it’s just that no one could ruin them surprisingly). No one on the site "military review" and did not say a word about "direct democracy" and "anarchy" - the future lies with them.
    1. already a Muscovite
      already a Muscovite 30 October 2017 17: 44 New
      +3
      Quote: Kirsov93
      "We yearn for the USSR - now let us" unite "again - (translated from Russian chauvinism, we will capture you and will rule you)"

      Who needs you now laughing Do not flatter yourself ... Nobody will unite with your circus bully all your clowns are sick and contagious ..
    2. ukoft
      ukoft 30 October 2017 17: 59 New
      +1
      direct democracy is applicable in small communes such as Athens. How do you see direct democracy in a country like Russia? 145 million people.
      Anarchy is of course the mother of order, but it is only partially applicable at the level of courtyards and cities or city districts. and then he cannot take all the powers on himself. only local government.
      Let me remind you that it was direct democracy that killed Athens. populism took over strategic plans
    3. Aleksandr1981
      Aleksandr1981 30 October 2017 18: 27 New
      0
      An article from the category: "Longing for the USSR - now let's" unite "again - (translated from Russian chauvinism, we will capture you and will rule you)"
      If you look at the map of Ukraine since the time of Bogdan Khmelnitsky, then there are no questions who won what. After all that you got from the Russians, you still constantly pour mud on them. It's good that we no longer need to feed you !!!!!
  6. Mavrikiy
    Mavrikiy 30 October 2017 16: 42 New
    0
    Azerbaijan is the only country that has officially surpassed the 1990 level,
    So that's who brewed everything (see who won)
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 30 October 2017 17: 48 New
      +2
      Quote: Mavrikiy
      Azerbaijan is the only country that has officially surpassed the 1990 level,
      )

      Kazakhstan is also on this list that exceeded the level of 90 g. What is interesting, the Russian Federation located Iskander complexes at the borders of Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan, probably just a coincidence. repeat
      1. Zalym
        Zalym 30 October 2017 18: 34 New
        0
        And where can you see this list?
    2. ukoft
      ukoft 30 October 2017 18: 01 New
      0
      in fact, like Uzbekistan surpassed real industrial production, Belarus surpassed Armenia too.
  7. Geronimo73
    Geronimo73 30 October 2017 16: 47 New
    0
    Ikarus exists and functions successfully .... its sales market has narrowed - this is undeniable
    http://www.ikarus.hu/
    1. Sars
      Sars 30 October 2017 17: 03 New
      0
      There is no Ikarus, like hundreds of CMEA plants.
      However, the general people arranged the same for us.
      1. Geronimo73
        Geronimo73 31 October 2017 15: 26 New
        0
        I was at the Szekesfehervar factory last year. everything is working. in addition, you can follow the link above and see
  8. Selevc
    Selevc 30 October 2017 17: 56 New
    +1
    you could not very often express what you think, etc.
    Yes - nothing that the ass is naked and that there are only solid ruins around - the main thing is that now you can say whatever you think !!! It remains only to understand who to say? what to talk about ? and who needs this saying?
  9. Horseman without a head
    Horseman without a head 30 October 2017 19: 03 New
    15
    Interesting statement
  10. midshipman
    midshipman 30 October 2017 19: 48 New
    +3
    Over the years 1978-1988, 14 airfields were created in this republic (4 for the USSR Air Force). For these airports, the MCI of the USSR (6 GU, which I headed) was responsible. During the years of "freedom" in this country, high-tech enterprises and airports, airfields have not been created. We had jokes about the father of the current Head of this country. You can’t bring, they are not censored. Remember how he led the construction of the BAM, criticized him constantly. In vain boast, you lost from the distance from Russia. See in the future. I have the honor.
    1. mariusdeayeraleone
      mariusdeayeraleone 30 October 2017 20: 37 New
      +3
      Our problems are 3 neighbors behind which are 3 sovereign states of the world.
      1. Cossack 471
        Cossack 471 30 October 2017 22: 09 New
        +1
        Marius Is it possible to decipher the idea of ​​three neighbors? It is not otherwise China and America, well, Russia. how without it! In general, Azerbaijan is an interesting state: most of the people live in a hated neighboring country. this is normal ?
        1. mariusdeayeraleone
          mariusdeayeraleone 30 October 2017 23: 18 New
          +3
          Georgia, Armenia and Iran represent the interests of 3 state powers. We are healed by their lack of fear and a corrupt geo-position. One is saved by the brothers around and their friends)))
          1. aws4
            aws4 31 October 2017 08: 43 New
            0
            oh how ??? Do you want Georgia, Armenia and Iran to be afraid of you ???
            1. mariusdeayeraleone
              mariusdeayeraleone 31 October 2017 12: 52 New
              +2
              You know these countries have different kinds of policies against Azerbaijan! Nap Armenians are crushed by religion and fictional characters in whom they believe. They call the cities of Azerbaijan by their own names, inventing history and heroes. And they themselves live in the western lands of Azarov. Georgians are waiting for the moment to invite amers, but these reptiles need to be crap, this is their essence.
              And the Persians lead imperial intentions under the guise of religion and sects in which it is contagious to the country. Some problems are not neighbors. Or those corrupt Turks who think I would sell more expensive, but they themselves swear allegiance.
              Understand our neighbors do not deserve the state. Because all that they have gained or will gain are used for evil by others.
              1. aws4
                aws4 31 October 2017 13: 18 New
                0
                Thanks for the information .. or rather for your opinion !!!! I really wondered without jokes that you answer ...
        2. mariusdeayeraleone
          mariusdeayeraleone 30 October 2017 23: 21 New
          +3
          Russia is a friendly and peaceful country! In the 2 world wars we were there and helped everyone there. It’s just that you don’t have a choice, it’s understandable why.
      2. MOSKVITYANIN
        30 October 2017 22: 46 New
        0
        Quote: mariusdeayeraleone
        Our problems are 3 neighbors behind which are 3 sovereign states of the world.

        I wonder who is behind Iran?
    2. Scorpio05
      Scorpio05 1 November 2017 13: 24 New
      0
      Do you know over the years of the USSR how much oil and gas was pumped out of Azerbaijan? The airfields were left to us in an uprooted state. They were almost all (!) Repaired. There are several international airports in Azerbaijan, and the main one is named. G, Aliyeva is one of the most beautiful airports in the world and a major transport hub. And jokes about respected people are not good to tell ... so, my personal opinion and advice. Tell me about which leader of the USSR and Russia (except for I. Stalin and V.V.P naturally :) there are no jokes. Moreover, most of them were really anecdotal personalities (knocking shoes), senility and just weak personalities, and then possible renegades like Yakovlev and so on. Now imagine what would happen if in the place of Gorbachev and Yeltsin at that moment there would be that very respected and strong personality, the only moment that probably confused the Politburo was that he was not, let's say, of Slavic nationality. You understand. that everything would be different ...
      1. MOSKVITYANIN
        1 November 2017 19: 51 New
        +1
        Scorpio05 Do you know over the years of the USSR how much oil and gas was pumped out of Azerbaijan?

        Another orphan was found, in line for the Republic of Belarus ...
        We know that the Union budget and the Azerbaijan SSR received more from the RSFSR than the amount of pumped oil from Azerbaijan, provided that without the USSR and the Azerbaijan SSR / Azerbaijan there would have been no nature ...
        1. Scorpio05
          Scorpio05 1 November 2017 22: 32 New
          0
          How do you know the sick? Did you have a dream? Without the USSR, there was an Azerbaijan Democratic Republic, it was quite successful for itself and oil would have remained in the country. Dubai seems to have disposed of oil rather well) and if they began to develop already in the 20-30s, instead of feeding Soviet hegemony repeat
          Michelle Colon Describing the importance of Azerbaijani oil for the Soviet Union, he writes: “During the existence of the USSR, he occupied first place in the world in oil and natural gas production. Most of the oil and gas deposits were located in the Caspian basin, and the volume of production exceeded the total volume of Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and the United States. Proceeds from the sale of oil and gas on the world market made it possible to carry out large purchases of technologies and food products.
          Revenues from the sale of Caspian oil played a huge role in the development of the Soviet Union: both the Russian Federation and the other 14 republics. For 1917 years these semi-feudal and poor states have become the second power in the world for economic development. ” Former Russian ambassador to Azerbaijan Vasily Istratov: “Without the natural resources of Azerbaijan, there would have been no victory in the Great Patriotic War.
          4 out of 5 tanks, planes and cars were refueled with Baku oil. As N.K. Baibakov, who headed the USSR oil industry in those years, wrote: “The Soviet combat vehicle was set in motion by 75–80% thanks to the valiant work of the Baku people. The fate of the war largely depended on their work.
          1. Scorpio05
            Scorpio05 1 November 2017 22: 50 New
            0
            In addition, as a result of the barbaric, extensive development of deposits, as well as the application of backward technologies in the petrochemical industry, the ecology of the Absheron Peninsula as a whole (soil, air, Baku Bay), the cities of Baku and Sumgait was in a disastrous state. All these plants and factories are heaps of hopelessly morally (and very quickly physically) obsolete when building iron (very long ago already rusty) ...
            1. MOSKVITYANIN
              2 November 2017 07: 27 New
              +1
              Scorpio05 (very long ago already rusty) ...

              I’m talking about what, after the departure of the Slavs, only that ..... in fairness, such a picture is not only with you, let's not cough ....
          2. MOSKVITYANIN
            2 November 2017 07: 25 New
            +1
            [Quote]Scorpio05 How do you know sick? [/ Quote]
            So talk with your colleagues at the Velozavodsky market in Moscow or with your sheep from a flock ....
            They tell you that your Azerbaijan could be, besides the USSR, part of the Islamic Republic of Iran or the Turkish Republic, .....
            Independent Azerbaijan in the middle of the 20's [quote] Had a dream? [/ quote]
            [quote] [Revenues from the sale of Caspian oil played a huge role in the development of the Soviet Union: both the Russian Federation and other 14 republics. / quote]
            Tales of Bazhov? Who refineries built Martians in Azerbaijan?
            If you look at the table of another orphan Rurikovich you’ll understand that Vashinsky consumed twice as much from the budget of the Union as they did there ....
            1. Scorpio05
              Scorpio05 2 November 2017 12: 25 New
              0
              This is the usual argument for the Sharikovs, a reference to the bazaar, to the rams (the Armenians love it more))) I have deep respect for the Russian people, their culture, history and so on. but sometimes there are typical types of Sharikov, limit. I usually do not answer the cattle serf, not having a culture of discourse. but still ... for the last time. They need another vocabulary, the one they understand ... Don’t spread your fingers. Well, you're not a hawthorn mutant. Although ... I don’t know. No. Where are you like I saw in the market)) .. In any case, you’ll be talking to your scumbag bros, homeless people and birdies from Lyubertsy. Although some kid from Birilevo ... another provocateur from a neighboring republic or some provocateur of an unknown nation)) ... Okay, hundreds of such refineries pumped out of Azerbaijan could be built))) This refinery works so-so, very weak, producing low-quality petroleum products that are not in demand abroad. And a long time ago, because the petroleum products that were produced on it could only be sold ... in the former USSR and other technologically undeveloped countries. Technological equipment did not allow to produce high-quality products there, it is so outdated already.
              Then, you have this KP table, in which no actual sources are indicated ... well, I understand. But for the clinical explain, in principle in 1990 there could be such a difference. It is evident that only in 1990 there was such a picture for Azerbaijan, before that the trend was the opposite. that is, consumption was less than production. I explain why. In 1989-90 were held in a practically ongoing general strike and strikes in Baku and Sumgait over the attacks of Armenians on Azerbaijani villages in Nagorno-Karabakh and Armenia. Then, in January 1990, the introduction of parts of the SA in Baku, the city was practically under siege. The curfew, the enterprises did not work for a whole year, and the union center began to appease the republic after the January assault on the city, and enterprises began to be restored. In parallel, the center began pumping money into the Special Management Committee under the leadership of Arkady Volsky. That is, all together, this created a distorted economic picture for Azerbaijan in 1990.
              1. MOSKVITYANIN
                2 November 2017 19: 37 New
                +1
                Scorpio05 You do not spread your fingers. In any case, you’ll talk like that with your scumbag bros, homeless people and birdies from Lyubertsy.

                Nevertheless, I was right:
                So talk with your colleagues at the Velozavodsky market in Moscow or with your sheep from a flock ....

                Yes, it was in Biryulyovo, you see, you still can’t forget
                from Birilevo

                Further, I see no reason to communicate (I see provocateurs a mile away), due to the lack of information from you ...
                And you will believe the tales about the standard of living in the RSFSR and Azerbaijan, they will believe the young generation, they did not live with the Union, at the same time tell me why you go to work in Russia if you and we have the same natural resources in terms of hydrocarbons, and yours is also better than ours oil will be ....
                1. Scorpio05
                  Scorpio05 2 November 2017 22: 44 New
                  0
                  C'mon, I started it myself)
                  Tired of answering these questions, "they say, why then are you going to Russia?" Since the expansion and referrals to the bazaar are no longer foreseen, so be it, I will answer this as well. In the United States and Australia, there was a constant flow of emigrants from Ireland, Italy, Greece, and other European countries. Both in good and bad times for these countries. Italians have better pizzas and pastas, like dolma, kebabs, baklava, kutaba, etc. among Azerbaijanis. There are industries in which the population of the country itself is not interested in working (or simply does not work out well :) and migrants enter this niche. It’s just different opportunities, more countries, a working population is required. Annual gas oil production in Russia is 1106 million tons. oil equivalent, and Azerbaijan 65 million tons. This is without other types of raw materials (wood, coal, metals, energy) and other products (grain, etc.) supplied by Russia to the world market. I think the difference is significant. The country is much richer than Azerbaijan. In addition, an important factor in Azerbaijan is 1 million refugees due to the conflict with Armenia. This greatly aggravates the economy and social opportunities of the state. In addition, large areas, in the past with developed agricultural, remained under occupation in the war zone.
                  The next reason, Russia is a large country, the presence of large megacities with a population with good purchasing power. There is no language barrier and strict visa requirements. The Russian Federation has a predominantly raw materials economy that requires services. Including: trade, service and logistics centers, food industry, restaurants, cafes. Probably visited the Azerbaijani restaurant?) Also, the Russian Federation needs high-quality agricultural products. The proximity factor between the two countries makes logistics relatively inexpensive. These factors, and most importantly the quality of agricultural products in Azerbaijan, make the sale of fruits and vegetables attractive for both farmers and sellers / traders. In short: the Russian Federation is a large (much larger than Azerbaijan) and relatively rich market (it was), which attracted enterprising people, and Azerbaijanis have always been distinguished by this. And finally, the outflow from Azerbaijan to Russia practically stopped, at least 2 years ago people were returning from there, now the ex-situation in Azerbaijan has become worse. In Russia, those Azerbaijanis actually remained who became and were citizens of the Russian Federation.
                  1. MOSKVITYANIN
                    3 November 2017 00: 09 New
                    0
                    Scorpio05 In Russia, those Azerbaijanis actually remained who became and were citizens of the Russian Federation.

                    As a result of the collapse of the USSR, the means of communication between some of its peoples are lost, language barriers arise, I think that in Azerbaijan one can’t hear Russian, but this is understandable, 1 / 4 centuries have passed since the collapse of the Union ...
                    I personally do not like the USSR, because The RSFSR and the BSSR were funded on a residual basis, although they were never parasites ...
                    The more time passes, the more people from the former republics who want to sit on the neck of the Russian Federation again, with the exception of Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan (self-sufficient states) ...

                    The above is undeniable and seems to be true.
                    1. Scorpio05
                      Scorpio05 3 November 2017 00: 45 New
                      0
                      It seems, but not in everything. You can hear Russian speech in Azerbaijan quite often. Today in 683 kindergartens, communication in Russian is accepted. In 379 secondary schools, teaching is conducted in Russian, and in 16 schools - only in Russian. The number of students in secondary, secondary specialized and higher educational institutions receiving education in Russian in a country with a population of nine million exceeds 100 thousand. These figures were announced at a meeting of the presidents of Azerbaijan and Russia.
                  2. Sasha71
                    Sasha71 3 November 2017 00: 41 New
                    +2
                    wink At first:
                    Scorpio05 How do you know the sick?

                    Then:
                    C'mon, I started it myself)
                    - No, a decent person in your place would say: "Sorry, I switched to insults, because I am unrestrained, quick-tempered, uncivilized." And your reaction shows that you are either a troll, or a thinking is a snag. But in case you are just an unrestrained and correctable person, I will say that with all my love for Soviet Azerbaijan and Azerbaijanis (beautiful country, incredible musical culture and best friends) I will say that now your policy has turned in a destructive, nationalistic direction. This for all similar modes has common features: 1. Everything you owe in life, in history, in economics. 2. You have been undeservedly offended, oppressed, you are a long-suffering people, and the neighbors are ghouls. 4. You did good to everyone, but answered you with evil. Thus, in any country they form a complex of undeservedly offended by vile neighbors, and so nationalism and mutual hatred are incited. So the foundation is laid for fascism. This is suitable not only for Azerbaijan, but for any country - both in Russia, and Ukraine, in the Baltic states discord was sown according to these simple schemes. Not to consider who owes whom, but to cooperate, make friends, and trade. Otherwise, Russia may also present bills. Almost all of the technical intelligentsia, the engineers in Azerbaijan (and not only) were Russians, they created industry (the largest aluminum plants, chemical plants, hydroelectric power stations, state district power stations, not to mention oil and gas production). What is needed now - to cooperate or to send delegations to each other and find out who gave how much to whom, who betrayed and deceived whom? And this is guaranteed to go into mutual insults, scuffle and stabbing - a great way to communicate cultural and smart people?
                    So this applies to everyone - smart people collaborate and build the future, and fools delve into the past to seek grievances and make claims. It is clear that the second path is chosen by either, or trolls.
                    1. Scorpio05
                      Scorpio05 3 November 2017 02: 07 New
                      0
                      You are late for something, Moskvityaninom and I seem to have settled everything, without mutual claims) Did you even read how our dialogue started? In fact, the exchange was a "courtesy". Misunderstanding, as it were ... Although, consider whatever you want ... The troll is not a troll. I am a lover. For justice) I do not receive money and do not want. Yes, and ours will not give for such things)) Patriotism is not in vogue here now. And there is no one of her own Olginka)) Now to the point: These legends about the creation of heavy industry for backward natives are not entirely applicable to Azerbaijan. This is not Central Asia. Yes, and it smacks of generally shallow chauvinism. Speaking about the role of Russian engineering and technical personnel, I would clarify the Russian-speaking. A large role of scientists and engineers of different origin: Jews (Landau, Gubkin), especially Ukrainians, Belarusians (Khristianovich), Tatars, etc., was in the industrial development of not only Azerbaijan, but the entire USSR. As well as Azerbaijanis. The school of petrochemistry was developed in Azerbaijan, and quite a while ago. The fact that you have no idea about this is not my problem. Back in tsarist times, Baku millionaires sent talented Azerbaijani youth to the best universities in Europe.
                      The technical intelligence was different and they themselves had a mustache) AZI was one of the most famous technical universities in the USSR. You look for information about Farman Salmanov: Farman Kurban oglu (Kurbanovich) Salmanov (azerb. Fərman Qurban oğlu Salmanov; Soviet and Russian geologist, oil discovery in Siberia ... http://www.ugrapro.ru/2017/07/28/on- pervyim-nashe
                      l-neft-v-yugre-28-iyulya-den-rozhdeniya-farmana-s
                      almanova /
                      Academician Azad Mirzadzhanzade. It was he who created and implemented dynamic methods for the development of offshore oil fields. For Bashkortostan alone, he prepared 20 doctors and 40 candidates of sciences. The founder of the petrochemicals industry in Azerbaijan is Academician Y. Mamedaliev (the author of the synthesis on an industrial scale of aviation fuel components).
                      The fate of the other plants and ... even the heavy industry as a whole in Azerbaijan were not subject to restoration, they were so technologically backward and environmentally dangerous. Better to build new ones.
                      1. Sasha71
                        Sasha71 3 November 2017 14: 47 New
                        0
                        You know better than me what quality the Azerbaijani technical intelligentsia was. (Only the poorest (who had no money for bribes) and the rare "white crows" really studied at universities. The mentality in the republic was such that students (even reading books) despised as beggars and losers. The main measure of success was money. In the 80s, admission to the medical profession cost 90 thousand rubles! (Another 25 thousand - for bribes during the course of study), legal - 80 thousand rubles. Technical specialties were considered prestigious, because there it was necessary to study at least a little, and work at work, and not do business). To solve real production issues with colleagues from Azerbaijan, I had to look for a Russian-speaking specialist who studied in Russia. I do not want to slander Azerbaijan - Azerbaijanis are entrepreneurial and talented in trade, they are great in music and art, like friends and comrades, you will not find better. For me, Azerbaijan is practically the second homeland. The point is that finding reasons for resentment and grievances is an unreasonable and unproductive approach for any party. The future is in friendship and cooperation.
  11. The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins 30 October 2017 22: 03 New
    +1
    I do not agree with the author. He somehow “accidentally” forgot about the Baltic states. It is foolish to think that Estonians (as an example) live worse than us Russians. You can laugh at them, you can quote Zadornov, but you can see the standard of living on the Internet or go there (if you live not far and the means allow). I personally wasn’t - but my friends visited Tallinn a year ago. Only positive impressions ...
    1. MOSKVITYANIN
      30 October 2017 22: 48 New
      +1
      It is interesting that there is something that is not in the Russian Federation ....
    2. Seal
      Seal 31 October 2017 14: 33 New
      +1
      Quote: Leader of the Redskins
      but friends visited Tallinn a year ago. Only positive impressions ...

      Tallinn has always been a showcase. And that is not all, but its central part.
      The Estonian press joyfully writes that “In 2017, a huge amount was allocated to large families and low-income families - more than 3 euros!”
      However, “Living allowance is received by thousands of poor families. ... 15 families, which in total means about 000 people. "
      If 3 million euros are divided into 15 thousand families, it turns out that on average each family in 2017 can count on .... 200 euros.
      And that’s it !!!
      A person who falls below the “poverty line” is not entitled to receive any additional funds and has the right to live solely on benefits. He can get out of poverty only by getting a job, where the salary will significantly exceed the amount of the allowance, and he can be safely abandoned. All other ways of obtaining additional funds are punished immediately and harshly - benefits are stopped.
      The department keeps track of all customer accounts. “According to part 2 of article 30 of the Law on social security,” explains Mstislav Rusakov, “the social security official has the right to receive additional information about the person from other legal entities and individuals to help. Data on income and expenses in this case are necessary, since the right to the poverty benefit and its size depends on this. Consequently, welfare officials have the right to access this information. "
    3. Sasha71
      Sasha71 3 November 2017 00: 51 New
      0
      I think that, having lived in Lithuania for more than 30 years, I know how they lived and how the Balts live now (and from which more than a third of the population fell and continues to dump from the Baltic states). If you do not live here, then you have an idea depending on the source. If you trust, for example, the Lithuanian Statistics Department (which was quickly transferred to the Ministry of Finance directly interested in the statistics results before the 2011 census) and its calculations, it’s one thing, but if you live here when 60-70% of the income in the heating season goes to communal, the remaining 30-40% on basic necessities, then think about any work in Europe, stepping on the throat of patriotism, pride and education. But if you like from morning to evening listening to continuous Russophobia on all local channels - you are here!
  12. aws4
    aws4 31 October 2017 05: 09 New
    +4
    The article is weak and not supported by any numbers ... narrow thinking (First Deputy Chairman of the State Duma Committee on CIS Affairs, Eurasian Integration and Relations with Compatriots, Director of the Institute of CIS Countries Konstantin Zatulin.) Now you understand why so far Russia has not stood up legs, or this official is covering up the government, or the presence of such directors does not allow the state to develop ... we heard a tale about the minimum number of citizens ... and it contains some truth only how it relates to corruption, medicine, education and science, theft and unwillingness to develop production ... is it possible that if in Russia the population doubles in 10 years, the universities will start releasing specialists, doctors will treat well, the police will stop throwing a minkata and loading commerce on money, commerce will hide taxes and throw workers ???? ? no, my dears, this will not happen and this article is just an attempt to blur the eyes of citizens ... and I’ll say one thing, if someone thinks that Russia got off the hook it’s deeply mistaken .. do you know how much money is exported to the former republics ???? ? you will be horrified !!!! and okay if these citizens were producing something but no, it’s usually buy-sell ... do you understand what is happening ???? one example - citizens of another state come to buy vegetables from collective farmers or Turkish and sell more expensive revenue partially spend here partially send their families abroad .... example number two - citizens come (in hundreds of thousands) from Central Asia with great pleasure they take it to construction sites because local residents are not ready to plow for such amounts (the fact is that they have much lower prices and not that we have only lazy people) and most of the money is sent to their homeland and commerce only needs this and cheaper labor ... it’s like you don’t buy it, it’s like a construction site, but in fact, can a new nine-story building or a shopping center be called production ?????? like about 5 years ago I read a whole article about how much money is transferred and exported to one of the Central Asian republics and was horrified and now imagine how many republics citizens work with us and at the same time we have unemployment ... or go to the construction site for a hat of crackers (which is not crackers in their homeland) or get out unemployment ourselves ... ARTICLE BOLD MINUS !!!!! OBVIOUSLY THAT THE ENEMIES IN THE GOVERNMENT ARE VERY MUCH !!!!! COMRADES cheat on us even worse than under the USSR .. SUCH Cynicism, Lies and Propaganda IN THE UNION WAS NOT !!!!!!!!!!!!!! It hurts to SEE ALL THIS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    1. Sasha71
      Sasha71 3 November 2017 00: 59 New
      +1
      You are right, friend. But recently, Russia has gradually been freed from the burden of sponsorship of neighboring economies. For example, it refuses to use the Baltic ports and railway transit to Kaliningrad, building and expanding its Baltic ports and ferries, responded to sanctions by stopping the purchase of agricultural products and becoming its exporter. (In Lithuania and Latvia it hit so hard that the local government was almost sitting on its suitcases. A couple of years of such development, the Baltic states will either turn into Somalia or ask for the Customs Union, CIS, Russia as in 1940. There are positive trends, friend.
      1. aws4
        aws4 3 November 2017 08: 34 New
        0
        God forbid if I sincerely hope so !!!
  13. Slon_on
    Slon_on 31 October 2017 09: 18 New
    +5
    After serving in the Transcaucasian Military District 1989-1992, I still have no desire to live with any of the Transcaucasian republics in one state, until now. It was from there that they began to "rock the boat."
  14. Scorpio05
    Scorpio05 3 November 2017 20: 53 New
    0
    Sasha71,
    I do not agree with you that it was not prestigious to study at universities. But the issue was not education itself, knowledge, but rather a subsequent career, and education was necessary as a necessary precondition, prerequisite, as the English say). It was prestigious, but bribes existed, I do not deny. True, in my opinion you went a little over the sums) One thing was comforting (if this can be comforting :) that bribes then existed in all republics, it was just a little more or less, as they say. And one more thing, the one who studied himself, did almost without bribes. And the money is yes) This was and is the main thing for many people, then and now! I agree that the future is for friendship and cooperation, confrontation and the search for reasons for resentment are unproductive.