Prospective engine X-3 set a new power record

NASA experts conducted a test of the promising ion engine X-3, which they said set new records of power, thrust and current, reports PolitRussia.

Archive photo

It is reported that the engine was developed by engineers at the University of Michigan, its principle of operation is based on the Hall effect. “Ions deviate from their trajectory when exposed to a magnetic field. Because of this, there is a current perpendicular to the main direction, "explains the publication with reference to the portal" Popular Mechanics ".

Engine weight - 227 kilograms. It is equipped with three plasma output channels, which has significantly reduced its dimensions. The X-3 is powered by the XR-100 electrical propulsion system.

“During the test, the engine demonstrated power over 100 kilowatts and thrust in 5,4 Newton. These figures are a record for such power plants, "- said in a statement.

NASA hopes that ion engines will be able to replace classic powertrains, which require a large amount of fuel for normal operation. Next year, the X-3 tests will continue - its endurance will be tested under maximum load conditions.

Comments

[bagr69]

Of course, something, but the Enterprise is still far from the Warp engine ...

[maxim947]

Not weak, here along with the engine itself - an effective power installation is equally important.

[tol100v]

Quote: maxim947

less important is an efficient power installation.

And ways to deliver all this canoes into space!

[maxim947]

There are no problems with this.

[RASKAT]

What will they feed him in space? Need a nuclear installation, solar panels can not do here. And if you explore deep space there generally the light from the stars for the panels is insufficient. No, you need a powerful and constant current source. Considering how much uranium fuel, shell, steam generators, etc. weigh, it’s several tens of tons, minimum. I would first make a rocket in place of the Americans that could deliver all this stuff to orbit.
It seems to me. Although the idea is good.

[bagr69]

Ilon Mavrodievich Mask has already come up with everything! It is only necessary to give him money, but more.

[jjj]

Yeah, citizen Mavrodi never dreamed of

[Blackmokona]

NASA has long been developing SLS new super-heavy rocket

[gridasov]

But dreaming is not harmful. Just not, even the prerequisites, the implementation of such a process. We reached a critical level when weight gain disproportionately reduces usable weight. And in order to solve this dependence, fundamental, at least ideas are needed, not to mention solutions in the field of mathematics and analysis.

[Blackmokona]

Dreaming of an almost finished rocket?

[Dead duck]

Quote: RASKAT

steam generators, etc.

this will not happen there, we have long learned how to make "nuclear batteries" for satellites (and not only).

[MOLODCHIK]

these "batteries" output several tens of watts.

[Dead duck]

were several kilowatts (we definitely had before 7)

[Orionvit]

Quote: RASKAT

Need a nuclear installation, solar panels can not do here

Hello. Since the 60s, many satellites are equipped with nuclear power plants.

[Awaz]

Duck someone from Roskosmos has long been talking about the same engine, and so far everything depends on the delivery of the unit to space. From the ground, then do not start on it (well, so far, anyway)

[edge]

Quote: RASKAT

I would first make a rocket in place of the Americans that could deliver all this stuff to orbit.

why, in space, there are enough different types of radiation, disturbances and anomalies than no way to ensure the operation of the equipment

[Tartary]

Steam generator in space?)) Funny ...

[bogart047]

well, well done. Not everyone is dumb and live on benefits

[hrych]

Another unpromising nonsense, where inert gases, less often mercury, with terribly low thrust are the fuel

[andranick]

The fact that the prospect is not visible to you, only says that you have your own bell tower.
Deadlift, yes. But:

The main advantage of such engines is a high specific impulse - about 40 kilometers per second. Conventional liquid fuel rockets develop only 5 kilometers per second.

https://www.popmech.ru/technologies/news-392212-n
asa-ispytalo-rekordnyy-ionnyy-dvigatel

[iConst]

Quote: andranick

Low thrust

So far, this will be used to disperse research probes within the solar system and to correct orbiting satellites. And there it will be seen ...

The spacecraft is still far from orbiting.

[hrych]

And you immediately think about how to work with gaseous fuel, which must be ionized, and then you need to disperse it with an electric field. In addition to the complexity of the structure, unreliability, etc., the engine requires energy consumption. Just at the time, when theorized, they decided that the only engine that could accelerate a ship to the speed of light was just that, so science fiction writers everywhere. But in practice, they learned that it was time to throw the idea in the trash. There’s just nothing else but a Chinese bucket True, the bucket has a main advantage, it is at least simple in design ...

[Solomon Kane]

Yes, at the stand we have long reached the Alpha Centauri ...... But in practice? As with the hadron collider or with the American EMR gun - 1 shot and ...... the electricity on the cruiser ran out ... и
Yeah, and creating an EMF around a plasma accelerator ....

[gridasov]

But does anyone understand how much such a magnetic flux distribution scheme is inferior and how many vectors and processes it does not describe. but, in fact, the algorithms of such processes are changing, and what is neglected in the scheme can become dominant.

[Vadim237]

They will make a fuel cell power source - two tons.

[screw cutter]

Intereno, and then what Russian missiles are accelerated to 11-15 km / s?

[rocket757]

A negative result is also a result ... but so far nothing is clear. Experiments, studies are moving forward.
So that science in America rules !!! No wonder they collect promising scientists / researchers from all over the world.
What can I say for the stupid ... in my opinion, there are enough of them everywhere, and with all of these "shy things in the field of science and education, the number of such individuals can turn out to be very frighteningly large.

[dauria]

Another unpromising nonsense, where inert gases, less often mercury, with terribly low thrust are the fuel

Well, not fuel, but a working fluid. The engine itself is eating electricity. This time. The second is a jet speed of up to 50 km / s. That is, an order of magnitude more LRE. This means that the mass flow per second is an order of magnitude less with the same thrust. And that's not it . This "excess" mass of fuel the rocket engine should also drag - so you must first increase the thrust of the rocket engine (and fuel supply). The ion engine has its own niche - acceleration of an unmanned vehicle. And for the LRE it is simply unavailable - the initial mass of fuel and oxidizer will be unthinkable. However, there is the Meshchersky equation and its solution - the Tsiolkosvsky formula. More than a hundred years have passed. Everything has already been proven.

[hrych]

Let us for the future, for there is no alternative to space rocket engines and turbojet engines yet. And with regards to the future, it is necessary to transfer the potential energy of a nuclear reactor into kinetic - reactive motion of the ship. Here, call at least a working fluid, at least fuel, but you need a stock of inert gas in the form of tanks that you need to carry with you. This does not suit us.

[zoolu350]

The most promising area is gas-phase NRE for the delivery of people and a bunch of nuclear weapons + SPD for the delivery of goods.

[gridasov]

Nothing is proven! The mechanism of operation of an engine operating in an atmospheric environment as open. and in space, switching to a closed loop mode is not at all difficult if we only consider it as working on the transformation of the elastic properties of the medium, which can be transformed into the process of an ionization engine. Therefore, you need to understand somewhere why of the existing ones and those that are considered promising engines, none will work. No one sees the whole complex of processes that occur in these engines and which still need to be organized. Therefore, that circumstance looks very funny. that one of the young "invents" engines

[Solomon Kane]

There is an oversight of our super powerful bucket that conquer space, to the glory of the great Mao ...

[Sharansky]

Quote: hrych

Another unpromising nonsense

Your “competency” is immediately visible.
So unpromising that it was suddenly used by the USSR already from 1972 and is still used by Russia.

[hrych]

And your opinion does not interest anyone about me, comrade, who is not our comrade. Moreover, you probably will not have enough qualified arguments to argue with me. The USSR no longer exists as 26 years old, therefore there is nothing to talk about, the state project itself collapsed with a bang. I repeat, practice showed the failure of the topic, maybe in 1972 it was seen differently, but life ... The Prometheus project, meant, to cover the cost of electricity of an onboard nuclear reactor, by the way. Therefore, when the dvigun will be ready to give one and a half - two thousand newton draft, but not 5 Then come and discuss. The thrust of one engine (for you to compare) the Su-27 on the afterburner 122583.125 Newtons, and here 5,4 Moreover, when they look at the perspective of the engine, they look at its efficiency, and it’s only a negligible 60%, which does not hold out for the future

[Sharansky]

Quote: hrych

you do not have enough qualified arguments to argue with me

Why argue. There are facts, but there is your Lala. The fact that ion engines have been used and mass-produced for more than 30 years is an indisputable fact. Therefore, talk about hopelessness is nonsense.

[gridasov]

You are right about that. that the principle itself as an idea has its own logic and scientists cannot be blamed for this. However, the very answer that they have been producing them for thirty years and that there is no result is an indisputable fact. Scientists theorists do not have a whole range of knowledge and methodologies for the analysis of highly potential and highly dynamic processes. Therefore, there is no development.

[Sharansky]

The verse, making a discount on the latency of these relationships, levels the ketone, bypassing the liquid state. The principle of perception, as was repeatedly observed with excessive state interference in these legal relations, anonymously hits acceptance, which significantly reduces the yield of target alcohol. The ideas of hedonism are central to the utilitarianism of Mill and Bentham. Reinsurance is void from the moment of execution

[gridasov]

A person differs from a monkey in that by pronouncing sounds and words he expresses the meaning of what was said. But! An intelligent person differs from others in that he does not teach others, but makes them think and receive answers themselves.

[Sharansky]

Schizophasia, or speech disruption, is a symptom of mental disorders, expressed in violation of the structure of speech, in which, unlike speech incoherence (a stream of unconnected words), phrases are constructed correctly, however, they do not carry any semantic load, and the content of the speech corresponds to the content of delirium. This speech disorder reflects the fragmented thinking of patients.

[edge]

Quote: hrych

The USSR no longer exists as 26 years old, therefore there is nothing to talk about, the state project itself collapsed with a bang.

let's say it did not collapse, but was destroyed by internal betrayal .....

[hrych]

Quote: hert

let's say it did not collapse, but was destroyed by internal betrayal .....

The state must be stable, both to external and internal factors, including the fifth column. If the fifth column is able to destroy the state, then it is not viable. All this is nonsense, but Bolshevny flirted with national minorities, and these were all except the Russians. Nationalism also destroyed the USSR; in the Russian Federation, it was not possible; more than 80% of Russians were there, in one way or another, there would have been enough strength to nail everyone. But everything was decided in Chechnya. It is not paradoxical, but the EBN did not allow the Russian nuclear sword to be destroyed, it did not allow the Russian Federation to collapse, at the last moment invoking the GDP. If it was not a military coup, then EBN is a repentant sinner

[gridasov]

Mercury is not fuel. but a source of ionization of the surfaces of the expiration. . This is a classic that you need to know. Therefore, the idea itself as an idea is correct, but its solution is completely primitive. We need to look not for fuel, but for technologies for increasing energy density. The same nuclear fuel is used by modern technologies only as a source of thermal energy or an explosion. But it is a source of electromagnetic energy and it needs to be condensed and a directed flow created.

[hrych]

Quote: gridasov

Mercury is not fuel

Another wise guy out of year. Do not confuse rocket fuel with the working fluid of non-chemical rocket engines, such as nuclear or electric ones. The working fluid in an ion engine is ionized gas, and xenon or mercury is the fuel. In the LRE, the working fluid is a heated stream of combustion products or a jet stream, and the fuel is kerosene, hydrogen, heptyl. Ion engine rocket fuel is classified as electro-reactive: electricity and working fluids.
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ракетное_топливо#.D
0.A5.D0.B8.D0.BC.D0.B8.D1.87.D0.B5.D1.81.D0.BA.D0
.B8.D0.B5_.D1.80.D0.B0.D0.BA.D0.B5.D1.82.D0.BD.D1
.8B.D0.B5_.D1.82.D0.BE.D0.BF.D0.BB.D0.B8.D0.B2.D0
.B0
Do you want the word that xenon for such an engine is fuel, read here
http://lab-37.com/futures/ion_engines/

[gridasov]

You tell these tales to others. Your concepts are generally primitive and you don’t understand that the fuel is in the atmosphere or atmosphere itself. Therefore, first find the answers. what is energy, electricity. And what is electroreactivity, then this is apparently generally for the underdeveloped.

[hrych]

Quote: gridasov

you don’t understand that the fuel is in the atmosphere or space itself

What are you raving about?

[gridasov]

No, this is not nonsense. And the problem is not solving such a technical problem as turning air or water, and in general any gas or liquid into an element of the process transformation of the energy of a substance. The problem is the ability to perceive the world realistically and without emotions, of course, when you need it and first you need to learn how to analyze what is hidden from our perception

[hrych]

If you don’t argue about engines on other physical principles, there is nothing interesting yet. We have at least drawn a suitable source of energy - a nuclear reactor, but one hell rested on a working fluid. The inertioids turned out to be a failure, although they would not have spent anything, so for now a stupor and a good old taxiway.

[gridasov]

Quote: hrych

rarer mercury

Mercury is not fuel. It is the source of the formed potential on the surface of the expiration. That is, it is the initiator of the process of forming the potential of not a storage energy source or stored, but a source of energy from the movement of matter flows. But even this is not enough because you need to be able to create a source of high density of stored energy without the possibility of breakdown.

[Herculesic]

In the USSR, the institute was closed with garbotch (pah, pah pah, I mentioned a little), there similar engines had a thrust of more than 500 kilowatts, they were simply very complicated, capricious and expensive to manufacture then. So the Yankees are so far away from us.

[79807420129]

Quote: Herkulesich

So the Yankees are so far away from us.

Colleague, how can I say speak with us

Quote: Herkulesich

The USSR was closed at the garboche institute (pah, pah pah-mentioned a little), there similar engines had a thrust of more than 500 kilowatts,

We were shut down and all the brains left there with best practices.

[Vlad.by]

Those. Is the KBHA just real estate? And there is nobody to work there?

[gridasov]

Quote: hrych

If you are talking about engines on other physical principles

I would not say that the conversation is about something incredible and incomprehensible to the minds of people. We are talking about banal simple, but new algorithms for organizing those physical processes that can be used to create devices for moving in general in any spaces.

[gridasov]

I can definitely say that Russians are much closer to the technologies that I speak of.

[Vasyan1971]

Some name ... Either "x ... forget it," or "x ... know."
As you call a yacht, so she sails.
And by the way, do we have something like that? Not RD-180 as a single ...

[Vadim237]

Ion engines are being produced in Russia, methane RD, DRD and NRE will soon appear.

[gridasov]

So what? This will change the effective parameters. engine work-what? They are engaged in the fact that for obvious reasons it does not open up development prospects.

[proletarian]

I just did not understand, with a power of 100 kW, the draft was 5,4 Newton, they scoff at something with an engine mass of 227 kg. 551 gram thrust?
Well, we can, not we can, but we can !!! Clowns.

[Vadim237]

The ion engine has a very long acceleration.

[gridasov]

Exactly ! And after that it is believed that the engine has the potential of promise. They take up the creation of a device without basic theoretical justification - this suggests that theoretical physics is at an impasse. And mathematics in general is beyond the threshold of not being able to analyze complex high-potential processes.

[gridasov]

Quote: proletarian

Well, we can, not we can, but we can !!! Clowns.

Exactly ! And after that it is believed that the engine has the potential of promise. They take up the creation of a device without basic theoretical justification - this suggests that theoretical physics is at an impasse. And mathematics in general is beyond the threshold of not being able to analyze complex high-potential processes.

[iouris]

I’m probably a layman, but the Hall effect takes place in thin plates and leads to the appearance of a potential difference between the surfaces. In turn, this polarization is due to the action of the "Lorentz force" on an electron moving in a magnetic field. Therefore, it seems to me that the engine does not use the "Hall effect", but the "Lorentz effect".

[bigbambr]

Where is my JetPack for an hour and a half flight? )))