Completed tests BMP-3 "Dragoon"

The Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation and the concern "Tractor Plants" completed the tests of the newest infantry combat vehicle BMP-3 "Dragoon", according to News.

The concern “Tractor Plants” told the newspaper that the BMP-3 “Dragoon” with the engine UTD-32T was ready for production, but refused to comment further.

According to Sergey Suvorov, a military expert in the field of armored weapons, the Ministry of Defense is discussing several concepts for the development of infantry combat vehicles and the installation of various weapon systems on them.

On the BMP-3 "Dragoon" an additional case protection is installed, there is a dynamic and active protection "Curtain". This led to an increase in the total mass of the BMP from 18 to 21 t. This required the creation of a new super-powerful engine for it. At the same time, "Dragoon" not only retained the mobility characteristic of the BMP, but also the ability to independently overcome water obstacles,

told the expert.

He noted that "until recently, infantry fighting vehicles of the BMP-3 family were equipped with UTD-29 and UTD-32 engines with power from 500 to 660 hp." These are atmospheric engines with no turbines in their design. It was with such engines that the vehicles of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation were purchased, exported to Greece. The engine UTD-32T has a gas turbine supercharging, because of which the power is increased by 200 hp. This allows the Dragoon to reach speeds on the highway in 70, and on the water 10 km / h.

Three types of combat modules can be installed on the machine: standard for BMP-3 with 100-mm 2А70 gun and 30-mm automatic 2А72 cannon and 7,62-mm PKTM machine gun or 57-mm uninhabited AU-XNX unit gun, which is uninhabited by the AU-XNX unit gun unit, which is uninhabited by the PKTM machine gun or 220-mm uninhabited AU-XNX unit gun, which is uninhabited by the AU-XNX unit gun unit, the unguided AU-XNX unit gun unit, the XNX machine gun, or the 125-mm machine gun, or the XNUMX-mm machine gun, or the XNUMX-mm or gun XNUMX-mm.

The existence of several types of BMP-3 indicates the search for new concepts for their use on the battlefield. The Ministry of Defense wants to see her almost a tank. On the other hand, an infantry fighting vehicle is an infantry vehicle and should not go ahead of tanks or instead of them. She's just a delivery vehicle for infantry and her fire support. Its capabilities should be wider than the armored personnel carrier, it should be able to fight with tanks, but the main task is still to suppress the fire weapons that prevent the infantry from moving forward,

said Suvorov.

Comments

[maxim947]

Good news and a great car with a major upgrade, but judging by the saying: ... BMP-3 "Dragoon" with the UTD-32T engine is ready for production, however, they refused to comment further.[i] [/ i] with orders neponyatka.

[svp67]

Quote: maxim947

BMP-3 "Dragoon" with an engine

Actually the BMP-3M was called the "Dragoon" ... This is a machine that is structurally very different from the BMP-3, at least in that it has an MTO FRONT, like on the BMP-1,2 and at the back it has a very convenient ramp

And, in my opinion, it must be supplied to the army now, while the issue with Kurgan-25 is suspended in the air

[maxim947]

There the problem is different, there is not enough money. And so, already Kurganets were launched.

[self-propelled]

BMP-3 was named "Dragoon" with the front-mounted MTO

the classic layout of the BMP-3 with the 57-mm gun "Derivation"

[svp67]

Quote: self-propelled

the classic layout of the BMP-3 with the 57-mm gun "Derivation"

"Derivation" is a combat module with a 57-mm gun, it can also be installed BMP-3M "Dragoon"

[Topotun]

And what is incomprehensible? The divider, as far as the article suggests, is not new, but seriously modified. And how reliable it is is a big question. So, MO is not ready to invest immediately. Especially when you consider that the budget has already been cut and where to get the extra money from? Yes, and the mass of infantry fighting vehicles has increased, which is also not good. It is unlikely that we will fight on the roads .... And on our soils - especially the north-west ....

[Mih1974]

"where to get the money from," Satanovsky said today on the radio, "let the MO take the entire composition of the min.fin for fees, for two months, and keep and feed on the funds (volumes) that the ghouls from the ministry wanted to allocate for the MO." I think the survivors in two months will come to awareness And all sorts of bankers, officials that billions are stealing instead of a fine of 800.000 and a suspended sentence - like in China, execution with a reminder for a year, who has time to return ALL the money - the replacement for life, who does not have time or "does not want" - "well, now him a doctor. " I assure you that there will be much more money in the budget at a time, and the roads will stop "dissolving in the spring in the spring" and the rockets will stop falling and the stadiums will be built at the price of starships too.
"Only mass executions will save Germany."

[Topotun]

Well, most Russians would charge such fees! Well, except for those who participate in them ....

[Boris Chernikov]

and what should they say? there will be an order, I’ll say, the only thing that is not very pleasant is the uninhabited tower, with it consider the BC as half as much, i.e. about nothing in fact

[max702]

As for the engine, they didn’t say so clearly L \ C?... the number! Digit sister! Mono can be treated as 450 + 200, but also 660 + 200 .. The phrase about the fact that the UTD-32 aspirator did not understand somehow .. It seemed to be initially turbocharged ... Why did it give 660 l / s torque: 1860 N · m , at 1600 rpm .. although for a 26.5 liter volume this is a very modest indicator; the same YaMZ-536 at 6.7 liter gives out Euro-0 331 kW (450 hp) in the army version, at 2500 rpm
Maximum torque: 1 470-1 568 Nm, at 1300-1600 rpm so this is how poor UTD = 32T looks ..
Let's move on to armament, the “Bahcha -U” complex is by far the most successful armament module, others have nothing of the kind .. All these 57mm, 125mm tank are all highly specialized solutions, and the “triad” closes all questions and directions, let's stop lie to yourself and admit that the main threat of BT is not the enemy’s BT and not Aviation, but an infantryman! Therefore, the weapons should be sharpened primarily against the infantry, and only after that everything else .. Bahcha-U is almost ideally suited to these requirements, except to change 100mm to 120mm from the "Vienna" (but apparently dimensions .. though .. ), but also has 100mm ammunition with a programmable detonation (that is, plans), but today and now, 30mm say that it is also available (maybe they are lying), guided cumulative weapons with 750mm penetration are also available .. What else is needed? HZ ... In the forehead like "Abrams" will not take? And what will he take on his face from normal distances? It was originally done so that nothing would be taken into the forehead with a margin ... So it doesn’t matter what if it keeps bullets forehead (although if the crew flies a 100 mm HE mine into the forehead, even though the crew is alive, the tank will go dead until it is completely inoperative. the board here is sad for everyone .. so there’s no need for a 57mm gun. In the USSR they considered this option and rejected this option because of the low impact on the whole range of targets and rejected it. Not fish, not meat ..

[Pecheneg]

in the 30s of the last century, these machines would definitely be called medium tanks. Probably soon everywhere will come to the concept of tanks-infantry fighting vehicles like Merkava.

[self-propelled]

so now you can equate BMP-3 to light (medium) tanks. About "Octopus" generally keep quiet.

regarding the concept of "like Merkava"- I repeat once again - there is no comprehensive universal platform" ...well Schaub whose Bulo... ". somewhere you need a heavily armored infantry fighting vehicle, but somewhere and MTLB with a machine gun for the eyes is enough

[SMP]

IMHO: BMP-3, -3M are excellent cars, but (!) Provided that the PPE of the soldiers is still increased

I fully share your opinion.
BMP-3 Dragoon is essentially a budget version of Kurganets-25 and both are not suitable for a future war, since both do not protect soldiers from 120 mm mines in the upper projection (roof)our sworn friends for example, from Poles on the border of the Kaliningrad regionwhich the United States began to pump a lot of money into.

Polish BMP with 120 mm automatic mortars.


Armored personnel carriers and infantry fighting vehicles of NATO also with 120 mm mortars.

But the most important thing is the delivery of infantry through an ambush of saboteurs armed with large-caliber rifles.

At the beginning of 2003, on the basis of the basic model of the M82A1 rifle, a prototype of the largest-caliber sniper rifle in the world (25 mm) was developed, called "Barrett Payload Rifle" (abbreviated as AM PR) and the designation XM-109. The KSV uses a 25x59V ammunition developed for the OCSW (Objective Crew Served Weapon) group service weapon, designed to destroy enemy targets at a distance of up to 2,000 meters.

That is, since 2003, the BMP-3 Dragoon is out of date, since a 25 mm USA Green Beret armor-piercing cartridge will penetrate its armor from any distance.

An infantry fighting vehicle is required to hold a shot of this 25 mm rifle in the frontal, side, and aft projection, and 120 mm mines in the upper projection, only in this way can an infantry fighting vehicle bring a soldier to the front line to support tanks.

[SMP]

Sorry, Romario_Argo

[Romario_Argo]

BMP-3 Dragoon is essentially a budget version of Kurganets-25 and both are not suitable for a future war, since both do not protect soldiers from 120 mm mines in the upper projection (roof)

I would proceed from the worst, for example, our rifled mortar "Nona" 120 mm
mines heavier than 20 kg
ZOF-49 projectile fragment fragmentation velocity - 1800 m / s
number of fragments - up to 3500 pcs.
weight from 0,5 to 20 grams.
penetration, max. - 20 mm at point blank range
"Ratnik-3" with an integrated exoskeleton and an increased area and thickness of ceramic armor protection, class BR 6, has resistance to 152 shards of mm in the "emphasis"

[SMP]

penetration, max. - 20 mm at point blank range
"Ratnik-3" with an integrated exoskeleton and an increased area and thickness of ceramic armor protection, class BR 6, has resistance to 152 shards of mm in the "emphasis"

At BM-21 Grad, the remainder of the fuel burns during an explosion, I do not know, but the Warrior will not protect him from a spacesuit from burns.

Worse is the other when a land mine breaks through the roof enough cracks a centimeter wide and heavy concussion is ensured for everyone, and maybe worse without eardrums remain.
We need a BMP that will protect at least 122 mm HE, 122 mm BM-21 and 120 mm min, including caterpillars with closed screens, since the BMP that has lost its course becomes a target and is finished off.

Plus microwave weapons are just around the corner, which means a tower like Terminator 2 besides video cameras with additional optical periscopes, if the microwave pulse burns all the electronics, the weapon will be controlled through optics.
And on Kurganets and Dragoon, the control is moved forward next to the mechanical drive, and if the microwave missile is damaged, the gunner and commander will go blind and it will be impossible to control the combat module.

We must pay tribute to the designers of Terminator-2, there this problem is solved, due to the successful layout of both an external module and periscopes.

So Warrior-3 is good, but from BM-21 Grad it is still better to hide in a BMP protected from HE mines.

[Mih1974]

I advise once again to review the "Pentagon Wars" The article specifically for you recorded "BPM generally should not go along with tanks, its task is to quickly deliver people to the battlefield and cover them a little with fire." The key word is a LITTLE, because the last joke “from Putin” is recalled right away — why should I fight alone in the army?
The task of the BMP is not to crawl like a turtle, I have more armor than the tank, because the tanks are also de-attacking, and quickly slip through a dangerous section and land infantry on the attack line. Watch carefully the video from Syria (Jobar), it’s very puzzling how exactly the behi run at speed, and even if it “got a bit” it manages to jump into the protected zone. Now project the same situation on the "ravings" , I’ll be a reptile - this barn wouldn’t be successful even half way there, it would have already been burned by RPG-7.
Look at the pro-American, and in fact the Americans themselves, fighting - they simply bombard the enemy with shells and bombs. Yes, this is also a method, but only against the "Papuan" partisans, for this is a recognition of the inability to wage war against an equal enemy, because an equal enemy simply will not allow months to grind its defenses. "otvetka" will be a "pleasant surprise" and then will mattresses do?
Well, to hell with her with Syria, let's try to "project" Western or even Javrez infantry fighting vehicles to Ukraine (Donbass). As soon as the enemy “landed” all your aircraft, when his art covers both yours and you in the first line, there’s no talk of ultra-modern Bradley or Yavrei bmp about any “pokatushki”. For a package of hail covering you on the march or even already entrenched - carries even the tank in the caponier "to the very tracks". So if the armor still doesn’t save “why pay more” (ride slow).

[badens1111]

Quote: SMP

An infantry fighting vehicle is obliged to hold a shot of this 25 mm rifle in the frontal, side, and aft projection, and 120 mm land mines hit the upper projection, only in this way can an infantry fighting vehicle be brought to the front edge to support tanks.

Warhammer to help you, fantasize there ...
Is your Yusov Special Forces a mass regular army? Do you even understand what you are writing about?

[Andrey Fuchs]

You once did not mention that every NATO soldier is armed with this rifle ?!

[Boris Chernikov]

1) getting a "mine in the roof" is possible either by luck, or due to guided ammunition, an AMOS tower, which in your photo, if put on an infantry fighting vehicle, turns an infantry fighting vehicle into a self-propelled mortar, it will not carry infantry, nowhere to land, about " the defeat of objects at 2000 meters, "the fact that they get into the car from 2 meters does not mean that they will destroy the same armored personnel carrier, if only to the side at an angle close to 000 degrees ..

[parkello]

SMP and you, dear. Whenever you shot a 25 mm rifle? otherwise it seems to me that after that shot, the green beret will spill out into the underpants, and the shoulder will be torn off from the hip joint.

[Vadmir]

Again spent a lot of time, resources and money, instead of starting the production of Kurgan 25

[Engineer]

Kurgan is a raw machine, a machine that has not yet passed state tests. Let's start it in a series, and then we will send it in batches from the troops to the factory for the completion and repair of components and assemblies not verified by lengthy tests. We do not live in the Union; MO has no such luxury. The budget of the Moscow Defense Ministry is already being bitten by government liberals from all sides.

[svp67]

Quote: Vadmir

Again spent a lot of time, resources and money, instead of starting the production of Kurgan 25

“Dragoon” is already 15 years old, it has been rolled in at the factory for a long time, so a well-developed design based on the components and assemblies of an already manufactured machine, but “Kurganets-25” has not passed the test yet. Not only that, in order to accelerate the launch of Kurganets into production, it makes sense to start producing Dragoon, as Kurganets grew out of Dragun

[gorgo]

On the BMP gun 125 mm? ... And does this happen? And where is there to stuff this gun? What about ammunition? I don’t understand ...

[svp67]

Quote: gorgo

On the BMP gun 125 mm? ... And does this happen? And where is there to stuff this gun? What about ammunition? I don’t understand ...

Yes, somehow there was a place ...

[gorgo]

Quote: svp67

Quote: gorgo

On the BMP gun 125 mm? ... And does this happen? And where is there to stuff this gun? What about ammunition? I don’t understand ...

Yes, somehow there was a place ...

Yes, but this is not a BMP, this is an SPG! Well, I’m saying how to push such an instrument there that it still remained BMP?

[svp67]

Quote: gorgo

Yes, but this is not a BMP, this is an SPG! Well, I’m saying how to push such an instrument there that it still remained BMP?

No, there’s just one thing or a landing or a 125-mm “piglet”. But you also need to understand that they take up a lot of space, and also it's a lot of weight ... otherwise you can say goodbye to the ability to swim

[Boris Chernikov]

to be precise, it’s not self-propelled guns, but a self-propelled gun according to our classification, or a light tank according to the western one, but nobody has more than 105 mm for them,

[Romario_Argo]

On the BMP gun 125 mm? ... And does this happen? And where is there to stuff this gun? What about ammunition? I don’t understand ...

called 2С25 self-propelled guns "Octopus-SD", gun 125-mm 2А75, BC 40 shells.
based on infantry fighting vehicles, the mass of 18 tons, has the ability to parachute landing

[Boris Chernikov]

Octopus-C is a norm thing. For the ground forces it is possible to strengthen the reservation, but how in the Second World War the technical training consists of Rapier, and here at least 125 mm will be self-propelled ..

[tchoni]

An infantry fighting vehicle is an infantry vehicle and should not go ahead of tanks or instead of them.

I have news for this hero: BMP is not an armored personnel carrier. She SHOULD go TOGETHER with the tanks, and in some cases, FORWARD them. Under the cover of gun fire is such. And must withstand everything that holds the tank.

[Boris Chernikov]

you have a strange concept about the advance of technology. The charter clearly states that tanks are advancing under the cover of motorized infantry, i.e. tanks attack, followed by infantry with BMPs and crush identified firing points by means of reinforcement, in the most extreme case, infantry goes in front, tanks and BMPs behind and crush OT .. BTRs generally move somewhere in the second echelon and, if necessary, fire support. By the way, therefore, all of us think about the BMPT, to take it or not, because BMPs with tank armor are only in the plans and in any case they will be inferior in terms of security to BMPTs

[tchoni]

Quote: Boris Chernikov

you have a strange concept about the advance of technology.

Vital. Do you know.

Quote: Boris Chernikov

you have a strange concept about the advance of technology.

Exactly. this extreme case is now the main one. It is enough to glance at the brave Syrian soldiers, who first place tanks (or their firing positions) at the prevailing heights, then they request air support or artillery raid, and only then, and even better during the raid, they try to advance as quickly as possible, catch on the buildings. But, catching a little. Success must be developed. And this requires the supply of reinforcements, resources, evacuation of the wounded. Who does this - right - BMP (or any other available armor)
The same was observed in Ichkeria, when a platoon of wolfhounds was given to the tank, which car was the shore and scouted for it. But, as the ammunition came out - a dilemma arose - either to drive the BMP for the ammunition, or the tank itself and with his bare back to sit with his bare ass and pray that the box would not be burned during the play.

Quote: Boris Chernikov

you have a strange concept about the advance of technology.

These plans are already millennial. I saw the first BTR-T project based on the t-55 in 98. In a picture book, because of the poverty of its Internet at that time did not have. Alas.
The dynamics of modern combat are distinguished by the absence, as a rule, of a clear front line and therefore it is not clear who there is a second echelon and why there is fire support.

[Mih1974]

I support. Long gone are the days of "the green whistle" the whole crowd fleeing the attack on machine guns. Now or a) they are grinding the front line of defense, then infantry is being thrown for stripping b) a hidden passage for specialists to be put on surprise and forced to flee from the defensive line.
Therefore, looking at the teachings - I want to cry (literally), because the shop assistants are taught to "die beautifully" and not to win. A real video from modern wars completely refutes such tactics of the "grand attack."
It would be better if we bought bulldozers for the Army, as in Syria - we got to the captured or abandoned positions and immediately digged in. And no "sapper blades", it's time to forget about this nonsense, as well as about the "self-extracting log" . The tank shouldn’t walk alone, the Stone Age should be all the same, it should always be either MTLB or others who would "pull the poor fellow out".

[Boris Chernikov]

yes? you’re contradicting yourself, then your BMP must go ahead of the tanks, you’ll decide behind you, Syria is not an indicator, the Arabs have always been known for their curvature. Relatively, “chasing a tank for ammunition” is where you stood so high that there were only enemies around?

[gorgo]

Quote: svp67

No, there’s just one thing or the landing or the 125-mm "piglets".

Here you go. And I say - either a BMP, but not with an 125-mm gun, or it’s not a BMP, but a light tank or self-propelled guns. Terminology however ... However, in fairness I reread the article, it says "the machine can be equipped", and not BMP. So okay, let's leave it.

[Boris Chernikov]

dragoons with 125 mm in neb. tower, but there will only be 22 shells

[Bronevick]

Well, everything in a series then. Bundle stamp.

[SMP]

Quote: Pecheneg

in the 30s of the last century, these machines would definitely be called medium tanks. Probably soon everywhere will come to the concept of tanks-infantry fighting vehicles like Merkava.

Pecheneg the composition of Merkava the Israelites tore off the facility number 120, and the layout itself appeared during the Second World War in 1943.

Taking into account the merits of Uralmashzavod, the project received the additional designation Uralmash-1. In March and April, a team of designers led by L.I. Gorlitsky completed the preparation of the documentation, after which the construction of prototypes began.
At the design stage of two versions of self-propelled guns with different weapons, the projects received their own designations. Self-propelled gun with a gun D-10С received the name SU-101, with a gun D-25С - SU-102. It was under these names that the cars went to the test and remained in the history of Russian armored vehicles.
The basis for advanced self-propelled guns was the chassis of medium tanks T-34-85 and T-44. It was necessary to use the aggregates of the latter in view of the restrictions imposed by the design of the “thirty-four”.
https://topwar.ru/63955-proekt-uralmash-1-samohod
ki-su-101-i-su-102.html



It is time, apparently, to bring together everything that is available on the most powerful anti-tank self-propelled guns, "Object 120", it is also "Taran". So, I’ll say right away that, according to the muzzle energy of an armor-piercing projectile, this machine has no equal, it seems to me. 18.5MJ (12.5kg at a speed of 1720m / s) - modern tank guns are noticeably more modest.
And, I note in addition - the modern smooth-bore guns in tanks are also less accurate, but the 152-mm M-69 gun with a rifled barrel is very heaped.
But it all started well. When in the early 60s it became clear that the armor-piercing caliber shells of the tank guns D-10T, D-25 and M-62, which are armed with medium tanks T-54 and T-55 and heavy tanks T-10 and T-10M, to break through the frontal armor of neither the hull nor the turret of the American M-60 tank and the English "Chieftain" - the Soviet military leadership hastily initiated several parallel projects at once. Heavy-duty self-propelled guns, new smooth-bore and rifled guns with OBPS and ATGMs, new shells for old guns - in general, all that could come to mind at the same time. Self-propelled guns "Taran", just in one of these areas and created. The cannon developed in OKB-9 with an incredibly long 59.5-caliber * even by today's standards * (9045 mm without a rather big muzzle brake) pierced a 2000 mm thick armor plate with 290 m, which made the new self-propelled gun practically superweapon - at that time there were no tanks capable of withstanding such a blow.
And even if someone had survived from the new ones, it would hardly have preserved their combat effectiveness after such a blow.

So there is no concept of Merkava-type BMP tanks, we must pay tribute to L.I. Gorlitsky who in 1944 published this concept.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: SMP

Pecheneg the composition of Merkava the Israelites tore off the facility number 120, and the layout itself appeared during the Second World War in 1943.

Previously, in 1941, on the A-44 Morozov tank.

[SMP]

Quote: badens1111

Quote: SMP

An infantry fighting vehicle is obliged to hold a shot of this 25 mm rifle in the frontal, side, and aft projection, and 120 mm land mines hit the upper projection, only in this way can an infantry fighting vehicle be brought to the front edge to support tanks.

Warhammer to help you, fantasize there ...
Is your Yusov Special Forces a mass regular army? Do you even understand what you are writing about?

What the hell? And who talked to you?
Am I chatting with Romario_Argo? Great designer developer, do not write I will not answer.
Lastly, look at the materials on Tskhinval as ours with the 12,7 mm Turkish armored personnel carriers that the Georgians had holes in, a couple of foot soldiers along with the head of the armored personnel carrier entered through the stern, the operator did not show further.

And for the future, no one like you ever asked what to write or ask, and they don’t write such crap, so you can swallow my nonsense and not cough

[Alexey RA]

Quote: SMP

Lastly, look at the materials on Tskhinval as ours with the 12,7 mm Turkish armored personnel carriers that the Georgians had holes in, a couple of foot soldiers along with the head of the armored personnel carrier entered through the stern, the operator did not show further.

EMNIP, there was not an armored personnel carrier, but a "cobra" - a budget armored car.
In addition, 12,7 mm along with 14,5 mm are the most popular calibers of the large-caliber rifle. And from them this BMP-3 is protected.
But the 25 mm is a piece rifle. And shelling a column of equipment from it is to sign a death sentence for yourself. Because there will be no knightly duel here - in response to the area, the positions of the sniper will work for everyone, from 7,62 to 100 mm.

[Boris Chernikov]

taking into account that soon the guard will go to the troops, there will not be a shot there, after the first shots: they are in the tepak, and the turn from the gas station .. and a mustache ... there is no expensive shooter

[SMP]

Our military describing the captured weapons, called this pepelats "hearse." It is made in Turkey.
They knocked him out of a PTR or large-caliber sniper rifle with a special bullet with a core, because there seemed to be no “rose” from a cumulative shot. Nothing was burned inside ..

The bullet hit the most vulnerable spot! At the junction of the armor plates. It was truly a sniper shot.

The bullet got out of armor, and swept away three Georgian soldiers sitting on a bench in the fighting compartment. They sat wearing seatbelts. According to the author of the pictures, the belts are all in sticky blood.

the bullet turned the seat around, injured the driver, hit the dashboard and ricocheted ...

Pictures from the forum, as well as comments copied verbatim, didn’t add anything from myself.

[Old military officer]

Such a reading is a pleasure. The main thing is to put into production, taking into service. I will not discuss the merits of all the options, since I am not a specialist. But the fact that engineering is not awake is wonderful. There is gunpowder in the flasks. Now do not allow traders to resolve military issues.

[Ratmir_Ryazan]

Great news, all infantry fighting vehicles, as well as armored personnel carriers and especially tanks should have both DZ and KAZ !!! Our fighters must have confidence that our equipment is tenacious and will withstand at least a few hits ...

[misti1973]

Good technique! However, there are rumors that the Tractor Plants concern is bankrupt. So, you can hardly expect that this equipment will be in the troops. There’s even a rearmament of small arms has not yet begun.

[SMP]

Quote: Boris Chernikov

1) getting a "mine in the roof" is possible either by luck, or due to guided ammunition, an AMOS tower, which in your photo, if put on an infantry fighting vehicle, turns an infantry fighting vehicle into a self-propelled mortar, it will not carry infantry, nowhere to land, about " the defeat of objects at 2000 meters, "the fact that they get into the car from 2 meters does not mean that they will destroy the same armored personnel carrier, if only to the side at an angle close to 000 degrees ..

Yes, a self-propelled mortar that hits outside the line of sight from behind the forest from behind the building.

I just drew attention to the technique (two barrel automatic mortars) that began to appear en masse in NATO, and if there are drones adjustments, getting BMPs at a rate of fire of even two shots per second from two barrels is already a reality.

Not you, not I, have no opportunity to check it but theoretically we can discuss it.
My personal opinion is that infantry should have a tracked armored personnel carrier and infantry fighting vehicles with a protected upper hemisphere of at least 120 mm min, the opinion was formed after viewing the photo of the broken equipment with 120 mm mortars in the Donbas, and in the Middle East Wars.

[SMP]

Quote: Alexey RA

Quote: SMP

Pecheneg the composition of Merkava the Israelites tore off the facility number 120, and the layout itself appeared during the Second World War in 1943.

Previously, in 1941, on the A-44 Morozov tank.

Only this ATP did not come across .....

[SMP]

Quote: Boris Chernikov

taking into account that soon the guard will go to the troops, there will not be a shot there, after the first shots: they are in the tepak, and the turn from the gas station .. and a mustache ... there is no expensive shooter

That’s the whole point Berezhyok is placed on the BMP-2, when they finish the era, they can put it on the BMP-1, removing the old tower and installing a new module, which is cheaper than the BMP-3 Dragoon, because there are about 6 units in storage. BMP-000.
But I don’t see the point of releasing a BMP which is felled by a sniper rifle, since the cost of a new 25 mm rifle and training of a fighter, how many times cheaper than BMP-3 Dragoon ????

For a war such as Syria and Chechnya, the BMP-3 Dragoon is not suitable, since it does not have strong advantages over
BMP-2 Berejёk and before BMP-1 Age. That’s the whole point, if you create a new, then for future wars and not for today’s. And it is very difficult, it takes time to analyze the war in Syria, and only after its end, adding the experience of Afghanistan and Chechnya, to create the future BMP, as for example, BMPT Terminator designers arrived.

[SMP]

Quote: parkello

SMP and you, dear. Whenever you shot a 25 mm rifle? otherwise it seems to me that after that shot, the green beret will spill out into the underpants, and the shoulder will be torn off from the hip joint.

No, I didn’t shoot, and I’m sure here on VO no one shot with this 25 mm rifle.