Military Review

Operation "Albion"

48
100 years ago, September 29 (October 12) - October 7 (20), 1917, the German armed forces conducted an operation to seize the Russian Moonsund Islands. The victory was won at the cost of significant losses of the German fleet. The Moonsund operation was the last major operation of the Russian army and navy in the First World War.


For the Russian army, this battle turned into another major defeat after previous defeats. It was all the more bitter because of the Russian enemy intelligence preparing for the islands of Ezel and Dago (now Saaremaa and Hiiumaa), Russian intelligence was known until the hour of its landing, and the Baltic Fleet was ready to fight this time and heroically defended the islands as close approaches to revolutionary Petrograd.

Prehistory Situation in the country

Russia, after the February coup, continued to plunge into turmoil. A. Kerensky, who actually became a dictator of Russia, worked for the “backstage world”, fulfilling the task of destroying Russia at Stakhanov's pace. Part of the conspiratorial feudalists who became “rightist” (in the Russian empire were monarchists, traditional Black Hundreds), this camp included Cadets, Octobrists, the big bourgeoisie, a considerable part of the generals, tried to seize control in order to stabilize and restore order. The right wing of the feminists believed that the main goal of the coup was fulfilled - the autocracy was destroyed, the power seized by the owners of capital and large owners. It is necessary to stabilize the situation, “calm down” the mob, victoriously end the war and build “New Russia”. And for this, a “strong hand” was needed. A talented general, popular among officers and soldiers, L. Kornilov was prophesied for this role.

However, the left wing of the revolutionaries, continued to carry out the plan of the owners of the West for the complete destruction of Russia. The masters of the West needed a semi-colony, the collapse of big Russia into many "independent" republics and national Bantustans, which could be easily plundered. Strategic zones and cities were subject to occupation. Russia was divided into spheres of influence.

As a result, the Kornilov troops, which were to take control of Petrograd, failed. The troops, finding themselves without decisive leadership and without clear objectives, were quickly laid out and disarmed. A conspirator generals arrested. 14 September 1917, Alexander Kerensky appointed himself as the new Supreme Commander and in order to overcome the government crisis he changed the structure of the government, creating the so-called “Council of Five” or Directory (similar to the Great French Revolution). The Directory, in addition to Kerensky, included four more ministers - Finance Minister Mikhail Tereshchenko, War Minister General Alexander Verkhovsky, Maritime Minister Rear Admiral Dmitry Verderevsky and Minister of Post and Telegraph Alexei Nikitin. On the same day, 14 of September, the Directory declared Russia a republic (having eliminated the Russian empire de jure), legalized the defeat of the tsarist police apparatus, the abolition of penal servitude and exile. A broad political amnesty was declared, under which the Bolsheviks were accused of organizing the July insurrection. It was also promised to introduce all other political freedoms characteristic of democratic countries to convene a Constituent Assembly.

Thus, the collapse of the "old Russia" was continued, unrest and chaos gained momentum. The “right” flank of the Februaryists was completely discredited and crushed, including even the liberal party of the Cadets that participated in the Kornilov revolt. As these and subsequent events showed, the “rightists” (in fact, the Liberal Democrats, capitalists and proprietors, and their hangers-on) had minimal support in the workers' and peasant masses of Russia. The masses mostly supported the Left, a socialist project. This predetermined the future defeat of the "white" armies and governments. Tips and the Red Guard (in her hands got a large number weaponsissued by Kerensky himself, on the contrary, restored their positions lost after the July insurrection, exposing themselves as true “defenders of democracy”. Bolshevization of the Soviets took place, and the Bolsheviks, consistently and not particularly hiding, prepared for a new uprising. On September 22, the Bolsheviks took control of the Petrograd Soviet - Leo Trotsky, recently released from the prison of Kresty, became its chairman. Vladimir Lenin and Grigory Zinoviev, who were hiding from the authorities of the Provisional Government, were also elected members of the council.

The growth of the national separatist movement continued. In Kiev, put forward the idea of ​​a law on the federal structure of the state. In connection with the threat of the seizure of Petrograd by German troops (the fall of Riga), the evacuation of a number of ministries from Petrograd to Moscow began (foreign affairs, public education, confessions, posts and telegraph). The most important archives of the ministries were sent even further to the cities of the Volga region. At the same time, the Provisional Government, fearing panic, avoided the very term “evacuation” and spoke only of the “unloading” of the city. Army decomposed completely. The authority of the generals, after the failure of the revolt of Kornilov, finally collapsed. The soldiers controlled the headquarters of the fronts and military districts and themselves appointed commanders.

October 3, the War Minister Alexander Verkhovsky, wrote in his diary: “The further, the harder it is to work in an environment of sharp contradictions and the lack of a unifying national idea among the masses. The Omsk, Kazan, and Turkestan military districts are “self-determined,” they choose their own commanders themselves and do not accept those whom the Provisional Government appoints. An anarchic outbreak at once in three places of the Moscow District is suppressed today by force of arms, but the commander of the troops reports that if such an outbreak recurs, he will hardly be able to achieve the same results. ”

There were riots in the country, armed anarchist speeches. Thousands of people fled from the front, and in arms. Many soldiers poured into gang formations, another revolution was advancing - the criminal one. Marauders and deserters kept entire cities in fear, smashed wine shops and food depots. The old law enforcement system was completely destroyed by the Februaryists, and the new one was just being created, there were not enough experienced personnel, experience, information - the card files and archives were destroyed and burned. In the village, the peasants fought their own war — a peasant war that had been accumulated for centuries (for social injustice) broke out. Peasants burned estates by the hundreds, refused to hand over grain at government rates, smashed warehouses. In the cities there was a shortage of food, caused by a general collapse in general, and chaos in the transport system, on railways, in particular. In some places, especially in areas where there was a poor harvest, famine began.

On September 27, the All-Russian Democratic Conference of Representatives of Russian Parties and Public Organizations opened in Petrograd. The purpose of its convocation was an attempt to unite all democratic forces after the actual failure of the idea of ​​the Moscow State Conference at the end of the summer. Then they honored General Lavr Kornilov, who later revolted. But the meeting did not have much success. Representatives of the Bolsheviks, who were rapidly gaining strength, pointedly left the meeting.

On October 8, following the results of the Democratic Conference held in Petrograd, the Third Provisional Government was formed. The posts of minister-chairman and supreme commander were kept by Alexander Kerensky, his deputy and at the same time the cadet Alexander Konovalov became minister of trade and industry, Foreign Minister Mikhail Tereshchenko, military minister Alexander Verkhovsky. Now the Provisional Government included the 4 Cadet, the 2 SR, the 3 Menshevik, the 1 Trudovik, and three non-party ministers.

Operation "Albion"

Head of the Provisional Government A. Kerensky

Operation "Albion"

The capture of Riga prompted the German command to seize the Moonsund Islands in order to strengthen the left wing of the Riga grouping and get a springboard for future operations in the Gulf of Finland (the seizure of Petrograd). 18 September 1917, the rate of the German High Command ordered the islands to be taken. The operation was called "Albion". The special expeditionary corps, subordinate to the command of the 8 Army, was to carry out the landing. It consisted of about 23 thousand soldiers, 54 guns, 12 heavy mortars and 150 machine guns. Corps commanded by General von Caten.

The landing was planned in Taga Bay, in the western part of the island of Ezel. Under cover of naval artillery, the forward detachment of 4,5 thousand men was to land, and then the main forces of the corps. To divert the attention of the Russians from the Taga bay, the Germans planned a demonstrative operation on the Svorb peninsula (also on Ezel), in which battleships were to take part. Further, the plan provided that after the seizure of this peninsula from land (a landing force landed in Taga bay) and the elimination of batteries on Tsereli, the German fleet would enter the Gulf of Riga through the Irbensky Strait. There, the ships will support with fire an assault landing on Ahrensburg, the main city of the island, and at the same time block the Moonzund Strait. Fearing the attacks of the Russian fleet from Kassar Reservoir (between the islands of Ezel, Dago and Mawn), the Germans planned to seize the Russian batteries at Cape Pamerort to ensure control over the isthmus.


Admiral Ehrhardt Schmidt (fifth from left) with his headquarters on the deck "Moltke"

To solve this problem, the German command created a special fleet compound under the command of Vice-Admiral E. Schmidt. It consisted of the Moltke cruiser, two battleships, two reconnaissance groups, four fleets and one semi-flotilla of destroyers. The overall composition of the group consisted of: 1 battleship, 10 battleships, 9 light cruisers, 58 destroyers, 6 submarines. This fleet was supported by more 80 minesweepers and minesweepers, dozens of auxiliary vessels. In general, around 300 warships and ships participated in the operation. Thus, taking advantage of the inaction of the British fleet, for the first time in the entire war the Germans concentrated in the eastern part of the Baltic Sea up to their naval forces.

The troop transports were 19. They were divided into four units with one light cruiser at each. The 10-I fleet of the submarine fleet, the 7-I and 16-I destroyer semi-flotilla also guarded the transports. 19 transports could not simultaneously land the entire invasion corps with weapons and supplies, so the delivery was divided into two stages. In addition, more than a hundred combat aircraft and 6 airships provided support and air cover. The float base of hydroplanes was "Saint Helena". Air reconnaissance data allowed to find two convenient landing sites in Taga Bay - on the east and on the west bank. This allowed the landing on two sites simultaneously.

The landing plan was as follows: first, subunits stationed on battleships (one company on each ship) landed under the cover of ship artillery, then troops arrived on destroyers and minesweepers. The paratroopers of the first wave reached the coast in motor boats and boats. Only after the creation of a wide and deep bridgehead on the shore would the main forces of the corps have landed. September 23 transports were concentrated in Libau and active exercises began - the troops were preparing for the landing force. The next day, ships of the High Sea Fleet (Hochseeflotte), the main navy of the German Navy during the First World War, arrived in the eastern part of the Danzig Bay. They were allocated to participate in the Moonsund operation. All preparations planned to complete October 6.


The cruiser Moltke on the German postcard 1912 of the year

Island defense system

The archipelago of four large islands (Ezel, Dago, Moon and Worms) and many small islands have been constantly strengthened since the beginning of the war. So, on the islands 57 of powerful guns were installed: 8 guns of caliber 305 mm, 5 guns - 254 mm, 32 - 152 mm, 4 - 130 mm and 8. The Moonzund Mine Artillery Position consisted of minefields, 120 coastal and 9 anti-aircraft batteries. The islands were defended by General Ivanov's reinforced infantry division — about 12 thousand infantry and 10 thousand cavalry. The commandant of the Moronsund fortified area was Rear Admiral Sveshnikov, his headquarters was located in Ahrensburg. The defense of the most important sector - the Svorbe peninsula was commanded by the captain of 2 rank Knupfer.

Russia had significant naval forces in the Gulf of Riga area: the 2 of the old battleship, the 3 cruisers, the 3 gunboats, the 26 large and medium destroyers, the 7 small, the 3 British submarines, many minesweepers and auxiliary vessels. There are more than a hundred warships and ships. Vice-Admiral Mikhail Koronatovich Bakhirev commanded these forces. The main task of the Russian fleet was to protect the Strait of Irbene and interact with the army.

However, despite the impressive Russian coastal and naval forces, the defense of the islands and the Gulf of Riga had a number of significant drawbacks. The weakest point was the bay of Taga on the west bank of Ezel. The bay was practically the only place where the landing of an enemy landing on the island was to be expected. Wide enough and deep, this bay was accessible to the Germans, as other places convenient for landing from the Gulf of Riga were inaccessible due to the mining in the Irbensky Strait. The most reasonable thing was to create the most powerful defense here. But the bay was protected only by two batteries (8 mm caliber 152 guns) and a small minefield. True, the defense of the bay was tried to be strengthened with the help of destroyers and submarines that came on duty from the Kassar reservoir. The lack of fortifications from the land on the Svorbe peninsula was also a major drawback. This made three batteries defenseless at Cape Tserel.

The general disintegration of the Russian armed forces and the situation in the field of command also had a negative effect on the defense of the islands. A week before the start of the battle, Vice Admiral M.K. Bakhirev and Rear Admiral V.K Stark (the commander of the destroyer squad) resigned, explaining their decision by the incompetent intervention of ship committees in the operational plans of the command and the decline of discipline on ships. Resignation is not accepted. At the beginning of the battle for the islands, Rear Admiral Sveshnikov fled to Gapsal (Hapsalu), and Rear Admiral Vladislavlev (chief of staff of the submarine division) hid in an unknown direction.



To be continued ...
Author:
Articles from this series:
1917 Campaign

The transition of the Central Powers to a strategic defense
Entente plans for 1917 year: bet on a decisive victory in the war
Russian army to the beginning of the 1917 campaign of the year: the approach of the general collapse
Attack without shot: Mitav operation
How Germany began the unlimited submarine war
German submarine vs UK
How the German submarine fleet tried to crush the "mistress of the seas"
The United States used the myth of "inhuman" submarine warfare to oppose Germany
Caucasian front in 1917 year. Baratov corps offensive in southwestern Persia
Mosul operation. How the British, until recently, tried to use the Russian "cannon fodder"
The war of the USA and England against Europe and Russia for absolute power on the planet
USA and World War I
How did the USA profit from World War I
"War will end wars." USA in the First World War
World War I turned the United States into a leading world power
"Nivel Meat Grinder"
Tenth Battle of the Isonzo
The failure of the "offensive of Kerensky"
"It was no longer the former Russian"
As Greece at gunpoint forced to go to war
The revival of the Romanian army: the battle of Marashti and Maraseshti
48 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must to register.

I have an account? Sign in

  1. Poppy
    Poppy 10 October 2017 15: 14
    +2
    At the most interesting point sad
  2. Poppy
    Poppy 10 October 2017 15: 14
    +3
    Knjupfera, I recall, Pikul set up a traitor
    1. Rurikovich
      Rurikovich 10 October 2017 19: 24
      +3
      Pikul, whatever one may say, is still an artist, not a documentary yes
      1. Poppy
        Poppy 11 October 2017 15: 14
        +1
        That is why I used the verb "set"
        1. Rurikovich
          Rurikovich 11 October 2017 17: 20
          +1
          Quote: Poppy
          that's why I used the verb "set"

          Offset ... yes hi
  3. parusnik
    parusnik 10 October 2017 15: 55
    +2
    That's always the way ... waiting for renewal ..
  4. 27091965
    27091965 10 October 2017 16: 16
    +4
    Landing was planned in the bay of Tag, in the western part of the island of Ezel




    Photo to the article. The landing on the island of Ezel.
    1. Rurikovich
      Rurikovich 10 October 2017 19: 20
      +3
      In the photo, apparently, the oldest of the German light cruisers "Danzig"
  5. Conductor
    Conductor 10 October 2017 16: 59
    +2
    Interesting, thanks. True, he did not know that the Baltic Fleet could oppose something to Kaiserovsky. Gunboats and minesweepers do not play against cruisers and battleships.
    1. Poppy
      Poppy 10 October 2017 17: 19
      +1
      The battleships Slava and Citizen behind the mine position were defending.
    2. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk 10 October 2017 18: 12
      +5
      Quote: Conductor
      The truth did not know that the Baltic Fleet could oppose something to Kaiserovsky

      He couldn’t do anything. In the open sea, 10 battleships and battleships our 4 Sevastopol would have drowned without stress, and in Moonsund we had 2 armored ships of the Dotsushima project - Slava and Tsesarevich. They alone for happiness from one "Moltke" fight back
      1. Conductor
        Conductor 10 October 2017 19: 36
        0
        Andrey, I respect your opinion with respect. But ... do not miss my comment))) Therefore, as it was.
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk 11 October 2017 07: 52
          0
          Why not miss? :))
      2. not main
        not main 11 October 2017 00: 26
        +1
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        we had 2 armadillos of the dotsushima project - Slava and Tsesarevich

        Everything is absolutely true! But when you consider that they were not even 15 years old! Somehow the language does not turn to call them obsolete! Of course, there were already more perfect ones! Of course they didn’t do the weather, they just fought!
        1. Conductor
          Conductor 11 October 2017 03: 58
          0
          The dreadnought was laid in 1905, and it was somehow different from the battleships, although the concepts of placing artillery
        2. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk 11 October 2017 07: 50
          0
          Just compare the performance characteristics of our battleships with the performance characteristics of the modern German Bayern at that time. I guess more questions will not arise
          1. Grafova Irina
            Grafova Irina 11 October 2017 11: 25
            +2
            Which, nevertheless, was blown up, if memory does not change ... Of course, without any special consequences for itself ...
            Comparison of TTX is a necessary and useful thing ... But, as they say - it was smooth on paper, but they forgot about the ravines. Our EDBs could not oppose this monster with anything, this is a no brainer ... But there are all sorts of accidents and situations at sea, which has been repeatedly demonstrated during the rich history of wars at sea. It’s just now that it speaks of the overwhelming superiority of the enemy in everything - from quantity to quality and “filling.” Here, even rare luck (for example) and the most favorable combination of circumstances for us could not decide anything in our favor. Only how to postpone a few sad results
            1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk 11 October 2017 17: 35
              0
              Quote: Irina Grafova
              Which, nevertheless, was blown up, if memory does not change ... Of course, without any special consequences for itself ...

              Of course, but I propose to compare the performance characteristics in response to the phrase
              Quote: non-primary
              Somehow the language does not turn to call them obsolete!

              A mine blast is extremely difficult to merit TTX "Glory" :)))
              Quote: Irina Grafova
              But, as they say - it was smooth on paper, but they forgot about the ravines.

              Of course. And what’s interesting - sometimes it worked, in the end, “Glory” can be said to have not missed the 7th German EDB alone in their first attempt to enter Riga in 1915. And only after regrouping, introducing the dreadnoughts into the group of direct cover of minesweepers, the Germans achieved their goal.
              So ... it was possible and necessary to fight, just ... As again, you rightly noticed
              Quote: Irina Grafova
              Here, even rare luck (for example) and the most favorable combination of circumstances for us could not decide anything in our favor.
              1. Grafova Irina
                Grafova Irina 13 October 2017 01: 54
                +2
                For some reason, it seems to me that the Germans didn’t get very tense ... An annoying nuisance on the coastal flank - nothing more. It is necessary to respond to it (the army "whines"), but it is unlikely to take risks, even hypothetically, with their "trump cards". Moreover, the mine danger prevailed there, and even two EDBs, together with minefields, represented the danger of the failure of at least one “capital spike”. Vaughn, “Prince Albert” did not participate in Jutland (far from the idea that this would greatly affect the result), but the Germans' desire to have all their linear forces in one “fist” is clearly visible.
    3. Rurikovich
      Rurikovich 10 October 2017 19: 41
      +2
      Quote: Conductor
      I didn’t know that the Baltic Fleet could oppose Kaiserovsky. Gunboats and minesweepers do not play against cruisers and battleships.

      Could. The only thing that could oppose was brains that could tactically use mines, and submarines, and destroyers, and the same cannons yes But after the February Revolution, it was already impossible to count on the successful management of the ship-refusing ships that refused to obey orders. request But after all, German destroyers didn’t let the same destroyers and boat destroyer through the Kassar reach. Landing could be obstructed by the same submarines. In those conditions, defeating the Germans was certainly problematic, but it was not difficult to create much more problems for them. But decaying discipline could no longer take advantage of the ships. Conclusion - we have what we have winked
      1. Amurets
        Amurets 11 October 2017 04: 35
        +1
        Quote: Rurikovich
        Could. The only thing that could oppose was brains that could tactically use mines, and submarines, and destroyers, and the same cannons

        As well as coastal artillery. For some reason they are silent about her. But we must look: Amirkhanov. L.I. "The Sea Fortress of Peter the Great." "Russian coastal artillery" - Denisov and Perechnev.
        The purpose of Operation Albion was to completely defeat the Russian Empire. The English fleet during this period even ceased its operations against the German fleet.
        In the fall of 1917, the German command, for the first time in the entire war, concentrated over 60% of its fleet in the eastern part of the Baltic Sea. In total, on the side of the Germans in the operation, which received the name "Albion", more than 300 warships and auxiliary ships took part, including 10 battleships, the battle cruiser Moltke (the flagship of the special naval detachment that united all the the operation), 9 light cruisers, 56 destroyers, 6 submarines. The actions of the fleet were supported by 6 airships, 102 aircraft based on air transport, and 25 thousand people of the landing corps. They intended to land troops and seize the Moonsund Islands (Moon and Ezel), destroy the Russian forces in the Gulf of Riga and thus prepare the way for a broad offensive against revolutionary Petrograd.
        I.F. Of flowers. "The Dreadnoughts of the Baltic. 1914-1922gg"
        It should not be forgotten that the Gulf of Finland and the Gulf of Bothnia also took a lot of manpower and resources, although they were not located directly in the combat zone.
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk 11 October 2017 07: 47
          +1
          You are of course a communist, but be afraid of God :))) What other defeat of the Empire? :))) What? :)))
          The landing and capture of Moonsund did not bring this defeat any closer and could not. This operation only insured the flank of the German troops that took Riga, and gave the Germans a couple of operational bases near the Gulf of Finland. Despite the fact that the Germans never considered a breakthrough in Finnish for the purpose of landing a large-scale assault. And do not repeat the nonsense from the article about the Grand Fleet allegedly ceasing hostilities, he did not start them :)))) For the most part, ships stayed in the bases, systematic military operations, in fact, only the Russian Black Sea fought in the second half of the WWII, Well, you can remember the underwater war, but the British never waged any kind of military operations that required the mandatory presence of the Hochzeflotte in the North Sea
          1. Amurets
            Amurets 11 October 2017 11: 09
            0
            Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
            You are of course a communist, but be afraid of God :))) What other defeat of the Empire? :))) What? :)))

            No, it’s not a communist and I won’t be afraid of God. Who insured the German flank? This is 1915 and a breakthrough into the Gulf of Riga insured the flank of the German army. In 1917, the Russian front was already falling apart, thanks to orders from Kerensky.
            Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
            but the British never waged any kind of hostilities that required the obligatory presence of the Hochseeflotte in the North Sea

            And the battle at Dogger Bank, and the battle of Jutland? Is that a game of schoolchildren in a "sea battle?" And the fight against German submarines and the blockade of Germany, are boat trips? Germany was supplied through neutral countries: Denmark, Norway. Trade was conducted with the countries of South America, Argentina, Brazil. The answers to your questions are given by Herbert Wilson's book “Battleships in the Battle of 1914-1918” So he was definitely an ardent Communist.
            1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk 11 October 2017 17: 27
              0
              Quote: Amurets
              No, it’s not a communist and I won’t be afraid of God.

              no problem:)))
              Quote: Amurets
              Who insured the German flank?

              From Russian gunboats and all kinds of armadillos there, who had the dirty habit of having fun shooting at racially loyal Kaiser troops :)
              Quote: Amurets
              In 1917, the Russian front was already falling apart, thanks to the orders of Kerensky.

              It was not Kerensky who destroyed the Russian front, but order No. 1, signed by Rodzianko’s EMNIP, after which it was no longer possible to prevent the collapse of the army.
              Quote: Amurets
              And the battle at Dogger Bank, and the battle of Jutland?

              I'm sorry, but did you carefully read my comment? I wrote to you
              Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
              the British never waged any kind of hostilities that required the mandatory presence of the Hochseeflotte in the North Sea

              What is a Dogger Bank fight? The reaction of the British to the shelling of the coast by German battle cruisers, i.e. they simply reacted to the German initiative and tried to catch those in the sea. This is NOT an initiative of the British. Jutland? It took place only because the Germans went to sea, hoping to lure and break part of the British forces, and the British, thanks to our gift from Magdeburg, knew about the German fleet leaving and tried, in turn, to catch the Hohseeflot.
              Those. in both cases, the British only reacted to the actions of the Germans. They did not carry out such operations, did not create such threats to parry which the Hochzeflotte would need.
              Quote: Amurets
              And the fight against German submarines and the blockade of Germany, are boat trips?

              These are actions that absolutely did not require the presence of the main forces of the xhezeflotte in the North Sea. The distant blockade was not countered by the battleships of the Kaiser in Yad, and the anti-submarine war too.
              I repeat - the British did not do anything that would require the presence of the main forces of the Kaiser fleet in Wilhelmshaven. They did not do the whole war, except, perhaps, for the only raid (it is strange that you did not mention it) - the battle in Helgoland Bay. But one raid is somehow not enough for the whole war, don't you find?
              Therefore, to say that the British allegedly interrupted some military operations, which allowed the Hochzeflotte to concentrate on the Baltic, is absurd. The British did not conduct such actions
              1. Grafova Irina
                Grafova Irina 13 October 2017 01: 42
                +3
                Well, actually, there were two battles in Helgoland Bay ... Or a raid, in your terminology.
                And the fact that the Germans could maneuver their main forces between the two theater of operations is quite rightly noticed. Because the Grand Fleet, with all its splendor, could not directly threaten Germany itself. The Germans simply did not need a large puddle called the Baltic Sea to harness their main forces.
                To be honest - I do not quite understand the same Germans in their desire to take possession of the Gulf of Riga and these islands. Well, they shot at their coastal flank, very irregularly, our not very numerous boats there - and so what? Now, if the Germans were able to lure all of our linear forces there, then these "movements" would be quite justified. And so ... the game was not worth the candle ...
      2. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
        Andrei from Chelyabinsk 11 October 2017 07: 53
        +1
        Dear Rurikovich, the Germans broke into Riga in 1915
        1. Rurikovich
          Rurikovich 11 October 2017 08: 41
          0
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          the Germans broke into Riga in 1915

          Andrei Nikolaevich, I don’t argue. But formally in two years it was possible to draw conclusions and improve defense. One could understand that some minefields were not a panacea, and with good preparation, with German pedantry, they were not an obstacle, which was in the 15th year.
          In any case, Russia loses the battle for the islands with such a balance of power. The only question is at what price can such an victory be given to the enemy. In the 15th, they lost 2 destroyers, in the 17th, 4 ... And the conclusion is that the concept of a mine-artillery position is wrong, if you really fight, and not rely on heaven, maybe they won’t pass hi
          1. Grafova Irina
            Grafova Irina 11 October 2017 11: 10
            +3
            The concept itself is not erroneous with its competent implementation. And if you strictly follow the postulates of the concept itself. But this was just not there.
            Ideally, because - the artillery of the defending side, naval or coastal (or, better, both) do not allow the fence itself to be trawled, and attackers cannot approach the effective fire distance due to the same fence. Firing at extreme distances is an extremely ungrateful task, but the defenders are nevertheless in a better position, because the minesweeper is not a battleship and not a cruiser and the "suitcase" falls in 471 kg in weight (if we take our gun 12 "52klb) even at a decent tidal distance the minesweeper team will not cause enthusiasm.
            But nobody canceled the law of large numbers (as old Napoleon used to say - God is on the side of large battalions), and the strength breaks the straw. At least, therefore, we had practically no chance to resist the Germans during this operation. But with the proper use of available forces and means and proper discipline, the Germans' losses could prove to be much more tangible both at sea and on land. And they could have required more time, which is also a very tangible factor in the war.
            1. Rurikovich
              Rurikovich 11 October 2017 12: 54
              0
              Quote: Irina Grafova
              But this was just not there.

              Same thing yes I agree on everything. But it was at that point in time that the Germans could overcome the TsMAP.
              Quote: Irina Grafova
              Firing at extreme distances is an ungrateful task,

              When one on one. Create a numerical superiority in the number of trunks, and therefore in the weight of the volley - and your number will grow into quality. And if we take the realities with the EDB in the form of defenders of minefields, then modern battleships at that time with more long-range guns, a perfect fire control system and the teams passed by Jutland made such a question irrelevant.
              Quote: Irina Grafova
              But nobody canceled the law of large numbers (as old Napoleon used to say - God is on the side of large battalions), and the strength breaks the straw.

              Even if we assume that “Sevastopoli” will defend on the TsMAP, then the enemy had such an advantage in the form of 5 “Kaisers”, 4 “Koenig” and to create a classic land 3: 1 during the attack we add “Bayern” with “Baden” and three “Derflinger.” The question is rhetorical, would it be possible to defend or not request

              Quote: Irina Grafova
              But with the proper use of available forces and means and proper discipline, the Germans' losses could prove to be much more tangible both at sea and on land.

              Alas, after February, such a formulation of the question is not convincing, in my personal opinion. There was no will to fight for something amorphous in the army and navy because of decomposition ...
              And so you are right about everything hi
              1. Grafova Irina
                Grafova Irina 13 October 2017 02: 24
                +2
                "All is well, beautiful marquise ..." laughing
                The Germans did not need to force the TsMAP, in my opinion. BUT! If they took up such a dubious event And! if all our linear forces were involved from our side in the quality as Essen had supposed, then the “gloomy geniuses” would have suffered heavy losses with a dubious final result. By land - it is more reliable. And the German 12 "didn’t pull against our same caliber. Neither for shells nor for range. Why is the second question (I can unsubscribe later). I can just notice that Tsushima’s terrible lesson was at least for the time being in terms of artillery .. .
                So I'm talking about an ideal case. Which almost never happens ...
                How many Germans have a maximum elevation angle ... I remember that it is 13 degrees, sort of. Our EDB had more ... And taking water into the compartments of one side to increase the firing range was a beautifully desperate step, but I’m not sure that the justified Our guns 12 "40klb were not the worst at the time of creation, that for that current period (for commensurate ships). But the Germans dragged their EDB to Jutland (who nevertheless "played" a little there) - the extra 24 mm were not completely redundant ...
                Our gunners knew how to shoot no worse than the Germans (the Black Sea Fleet proved), the problem for the period we are talking about is a mess and collapse, there can already be no talk of organizing "prize" shooting. Although ... A little later, "Andrei ..." shot back at the rebellious fort - so think here what and how ...
                Unfortunately, in my tables there is no column "fleet against the shore" ...
                1. Rurikovich
                  Rurikovich 13 October 2017 08: 41
                  0
                  Quote: Irina Grafova
                  Our gunners knew how to shoot no worse than the Germans (Black Sea Fleet proved)

                  Eeee, a little nuance hi At the Black Sea Fleet, combat training was put much better than rubbing trousers at the bases of Baltic battleships yes . And in the expansion of discipline in the 17th, talking about formidable battleships is no longer No. Therefore, in my opinion, it would not be difficult for the Germans to pass the TsMAP in the 17th year. And do not forget about the fact that at that time the Germans had two “buyers” with toys worse than 12 " winked Because what effect would the water columns above the masts have on the unbridled revolutionary sailors, protected by a thin 225mm skin, the question is still lol So we can only dream about "if, yes if only" drinks hi
          2. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
            Andrei from Chelyabinsk 11 October 2017 17: 13
            +1
            Quote: Rurikovich
            In any case, Russia loses the battle for the islands with such a balance of power. The only question is at what price can such an victory be given to the enemy

            Ahhh, so Wi in that sense :)))) I’m sorry, I didn’t understand right away :) hi
  6. A. Privalov
    A. Privalov 10 October 2017 17: 12
    +2
    The losses in the technology were not great, but the prisoners there lost more than 20 thousand. Now, the whole archipelago Estonia holds. I used to be in those parts (by state need) in Soviet times. Deaf province and boring not transmitted. I don’t think that something has changed there these days.
    1. Conductor
      Conductor 10 October 2017 19: 37
      0
      20 are 000 divisions, aren't they too much?
      1. Rurikovich
        Rurikovich 10 October 2017 19: 56
        +3
        Not too much, because it is. The Germans lost about 400 (four hundred) people killed. The collapse of the Empire began already in the brains of the soldiers and they just stupidly did not fight. Because the capture of the islands was a walking march for the Germans and rich (by land standards) trophies.
  7. Grafova Irina
    Grafova Irina 10 October 2017 20: 34
    +3
    Nothing much new so far ... Let's see what follows ... Although I can imagine. Unparalleled battle of Glory, feat of Thunder, etc. I can’t imagine that the author can “discover” the new here. But ... "we will see."
    1. Rurikovich
      Rurikovich 10 October 2017 20: 43
      +2
      So there will be nothing new wink I read about this battle in different sources and more than once, you own the information, there are still a number of interested parties, but a lot of people will read about the operation "Albion" for the first time yes This is for them. winked
      1. Grafova Irina
        Grafova Irina 10 October 2017 20: 56
        +4
        I'm not against. Let them read and be enlightened. I just would like the author not to stray on cheers-patriotism and hatred, which has already been noted here. I mean the whole VO, although here recently.
        When I was working at CVMM, it was also - the general public was told not about what a minesweeper was and what he should do, but how many party members were on it ... So here I wanted the author to avoid distortions
        1. Rurikovich
          Rurikovich 10 October 2017 21: 05
          +2
          Well, the author may have his own interpretation of events, while all statistics may be correct, but their interpretation may differ from the generally accepted request Although you can see all Samsonov’s articles in his profile and draw conclusions for yourself. Now, democracy in the yard and censorship (at least with us) can only be personal. As they say, write in good conscience smile
          1. Grafova Irina
            Grafova Irina 10 October 2017 22: 13
            +3
            So I’m saying - we’ll see, read, talk about ...
            Its interpretation from the “universally recognized” can differ only in details, since the general course of events and their outcome is known. There is nothing to "turn over." But if Mr. Samsonov manages to "dig out" something new, even in details (with convincing justification), then it is already interesting. good
            1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk 11 October 2017 07: 57
              +3
              The man who wrote in the article that the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was signed by Germany under the impression of the defeat of the Japanese army at Khalkhin Gol? :))) If he digs something up, it would be best to dig it back right away
              1. Grafova Irina
                Grafova Irina 11 October 2017 10: 48
                +3
                Well, if he (didn’t read it herself) managed to write such a thing, then this already gives rise to slight doubts (and suspicions) about his value as a researcher. Because in this case, he does not expose himself as a conscientious plagiarist, but a person who does not know how to draw conclusions from the facts collected, although he tries to do it. A link to this very article do not give?
                1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                  Andrei from Chelyabinsk 11 October 2017 17: 11
                  0
                  Quote: Irina Grafova
                  A link to this very article do not give?

                  Of course I’ll give, otherwise it turns out that I’m not responsible for my words
                  https://topwar.ru/126532-mirovaya-boynya-priblizh
                  ala-nastuplenie-amerikanskogo-veka-mirovogo-gospo
                  dstva-ssha.html
                  This place
                  The catastrophe of the 6th Japanese army in the Mongolian steppes forced Berlin and Tokyo to change their strategic plans. In the Third Reich they realized that it was impossible to fight on two fronts, leaving France and England behind. Hitler proposed non-aggression pact to Moscow
                  1. Grafova Irina
                    Grafova Irina 13 October 2017 01: 25
                    +2
                    Thank you ...
                    The fact that Germany is "harmful" to fight on two fronts is not news to anyone ... But the pact itself somehow depended little on the events near Khalkhin Gol - this is quite obvious. It’s hard to call the defeat of Japanese troops in that area a catastrophe. Unsuccessful military operation - yes, but no more. With the same "success" it can be said that the Spanish events led to the signing of this pact ....
  8. SMP
    SMP 11 October 2017 06: 28
    0
    After the February coup, Russia continued to plunge into turmoil. A. Kerensky, who actually became the dictator of Russia, worked for the “world backstage”, fulfilling the task of destroying Russia at the Stakhanov pace.


    This should be written in capital letters in schools, Nicholas 2 voluntarily renounced power, and Kerensky and the interim government worked for the world behind the scenes destroying the country.

    No contradictions in Russian history on November 7, 1917 were avoidedand the youths inspire them, what would happen if yes, if there hadn’t been a Revolution, then the Russian Empire in economic development was almost equal to the United States blah blah blah and other fantasies.
  9. DimerVladimer
    DimerVladimer 11 October 2017 13: 33
    0
    A. Kerensky, who actually became the dictator of Russia, worked for the “world backstage”, fulfilling the task of destroying Russia at the Stakhanov pace.

    On the first lines - again, the author of Samsonov - guessed?
    Who handed out labels to everyone? Sorted by the shelves of traitors and mercenaries of imperialism - who has a simple story, that would be stupid to understand - Samsonov.
    Yes, so that your children learn history according to Samsonov!
  10. DimerVladimer
    DimerVladimer 11 October 2017 13: 42
    0
    However, the left wing of the February revolutionary revolutionaries continued to fulfill the plan of the Western masters for the complete destruction of Russia.

    Plan to the studio!
    Let me ask you the names of the names of the appearance of these mysterious anonymous "masters of the West"?
    Passwords, addresses, appearances? Who paid, to whom, in what currency, are bills and payment orders? Traces of documents should have remained - where are they?
    Pan Samsonov, as always, is unsubstantiated, having memorized the training manual of the CPSU Central Committee, he did not advance further ...
  11. unknown
    unknown 14 October 2017 11: 12
    0
    Operation Albion is just a sublimation of the German fleet for the battle of Jutland. And no more.