Military Review

100 years of guilt before the Russian soldier

178



In just over a year, Europe will mark a hundred years since the end of the First World War. The victors - with pathos, the defeated - just pay tribute to their dead.

But will celebrate. And not because that war in Europe is called the Great War. Although this too.

As always, we will have silence, perhaps, of course, something disturbed. Attempts are made from time to time, but ... It is difficult to talk about what 100 was silent for years.



Even in school textbooks today, a couple of paragraphs are allotted to that war at best. So it was all 70 years of Soviet power, so there is almost 30 years of democratic.

Yes, it is difficult to clearly speak about the war, in which, being in the winning coalition, Russia turned out to be the losers. There were many reasons for this, which we will definitely analyze in detail, but the basic idea is absolutely not about that.

Russia was drawn into that war, not having (unlike the allies) no territorial claims or a desire to stop the development of opponents. First Russia declared war only on the Ottoman Empire, from the rest it took up the challenge.



And the Russian soldier again, like 100 years before, in the war against the European team under the command of Napoleon, became the savior of Europe. And not only Europe, speaking of the battles of the First World War, for some reason, we completely forget about the Caucasian front.

If it were not for the stamina of the Russian soldier, if not for the Eastern Front, which had become a bloody meat grinder for the troops of the Central Powers, we have no doubt about the outcome of the war. England, of course, would sit behind the strait, bristling with its instruments fleetand France would be a bat. How was beaten by the Germans shortly before this war.

For some reason, for some reason, we do not take alliedies like Italy and Romania.

The Russian soldier became the shield that the troops of the Fourth Alliance (Germany, Austria-Hungary, Bulgaria and the Ottoman Empire) fought against. And shield reliable. What happened in 1917 year is a separate conversation, but before the October events Russia was a reliable ally, and the Russian soldier was an honest ally of the British and French.



Unjustly forgotten, even in their own country.

Having arranged a simple poll in my own social circle, I interviewed more than 40 people. From 20 to 50 years. The results are terrifying. I will not give results, it is too shameful.

We simply do not know anything about that war and about the role of our ancestors in it. Shameful bleating - that's what I heard from the majority of respondents.

Blame it? If it is to blame, then our Soviet and Russian educational systems, which over the course of 100 years, preferred to keep silent about the role that our ancestors played in that war.

So, something needs to be fixed, even in 100 years.

Russian soldiers and officers are not to blame for forgetting about them. They simply fulfilled their duty, for faith, the king and fatherland, performing feats in the name of these simple truths.



And this, we note, were the fathers and grandfathers of those who, through 23 of the year (only!), Got in the way of the fascist hordes. And there were those who took the second time weaponand again became a world war soldier.

We with the Belarusian colleague and historian Alexander Prokurat decided to publish here a series of materials on stories Russian army in the First World War. And thus give at least part of that bit of respect to our ancestors who honestly fought for Russia in the fields of that war.

This is the minimum that requires us to respect the stamina and spirit of the Russian soldier, his honor.

We hope that these articles will be interesting to readers. We were joined by people who are not indifferent to this topic from Russia, Belarus, Poland and Germany, so there is confidence that we will be able to slightly open up previously unknown pages of our history.

In the name of honor and glory of the Russian soldier.
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  1. parusnik
    parusnik 10 October 2017 07: 28
    14
    before the October events, Russia was a reliable ally
    ... In October, the Bolsheviks made the February revolution ...
    1. Amurets
      Amurets 10 October 2017 07: 50
      +6
      Quote: parusnik
      ... In October, the Bolsheviks made the February revolution ...

      And order number 1 issued. http://www.hrono.ru/dokum/191_dok/19170301prikaz1
      . Php
      ORDER No. 1
      PETROGRAD COBETA WORKERS AND SOLDIER DEPUTIES ABOUT DEMOCRATIZATION OF THE ARMY.
      1 March 1917 city

      Order No. 1 of the Petrograd Soviet was adopted on March 1, 1917 at a joint meeting of the working and soldier sections of the Council. A special commission was formed to develop the order. It was headed by a member of the Executive Committee of the Petrosoviet, N.D. Sokolov, who left interesting memoirs on how the text of the order was created.

      According to the garrison of the Petrograd district, to all soldiers of the guard, army, artillery and navy for immediate and accurate execution, and to the workers of Petrograd for information.

      The Council of Workers 'and Soldiers' Deputies decided:

      1) In all companies, battalions, regiments, parks, batteries, squadrons and individual services of various military departments and on the ships of the navy, immediately select committees from elected representatives from the lower ranks of the above military units.

      2) In all military units that have not yet elected representatives to the Council of Workers' Deputies, elect one representative each, who will come with written certificates to the State Duma building by 10 a.m. on March 2 this morning.

      3) In all its political speeches, the military unit is subordinate to the Council of Workers 'and Soldiers' Deputies and its committees.

      4) The orders of the military commission of the State Duma should be executed, unless they contradict the orders and decisions of the Council of Workers 'and Soldiers' Deputies.

      5) All kinds of weapons, such as rifles, machine guns, armored vehicles, etc., must be at the disposal and control of company and battalion committees and in no case should be given out to officers even upon their requirements.

      6) In the ranks and in the discharge of official duties, soldiers must observe the strictest military discipline, but out of service and in their political, civil and private life, soldiers cannot be diminished in anything in the rights that all citizens enjoy. In particular, standing in front and obligatory giving honor outside the service is canceled.

      7) The title of officers is abolished in the same way: Your Excellency, Honor, etc., and is replaced by an appeal: Mr. General, Mr. Colonel, etc.

      Rude treatment of soldiers of any military ranks and, in particular, appeal to them on the "you" is prohibited, and of any violation of this, as well as of all misunderstandings between officers and soldiers, the latter must inform the company commanders.

      Read this order in all companies, battalions, regiments, crews, batteries and other combatant and non-combatant teams. <...>
      1. parusnik
        parusnik 10 October 2017 07: 52
        10
        After this order, the army rallied its ranks and remained a reliable ally until October 1917 .. wink
        1. Mikado
          Mikado 10 October 2017 10: 07
          11
          so rallied that she didn’t want to fight from the word "completely", only she "bred" advice. what But I understand them perfectly! hi
      2. Monarchist
        Monarchist 10 October 2017 09: 49
        +7
        For this order, Kerensky must be in the book of records: a man who ditched his army!
        Agree that this ruined the discipline, and the army without discipline. Apparently "especially gifted" made up this masterpiece of stupidity
        1. Mikado
          Mikado 10 October 2017 10: 08
          +7
          man ditching his army

          this was done before him, allowing the February Revolution. After February, everything was pointless.
        2. ammunition
          ammunition 11 October 2017 03: 15
          +3
          Quote: Monarchist
          Apparently "especially gifted" made up this masterpiece of stupidity


          Order No. 1 is not stupidity, but a clearly thought out action! This order was not in a hurry for nothing!
          1. mat-vey
            mat-vey 11 October 2017 06: 22
            0
            Sorry, but you can read more about "a clearly thought out action" ...
            1. ammunition
              ammunition 11 October 2017 09: 53
              +2
              It was necessary to make the revolution irreversible. A disciplined army at the front could be used to suppress February.
              Either Milyukov .. or Guchkov (I don’t remember) in the 23 year, he spoke directly about this.
              1. mat-vey
                mat-vey 11 October 2017 09: 58
                0
                Well, IMHO of course, but it seemed that by that time one could only dream of a “disciplined” army, which served as one of the reasons for February ... and they tried to play “democracy” to keep the soldiers in the trenches ...
                1. ammunition
                  ammunition 11 October 2017 11: 00
                  +2
                  Quote: mat-vey
                  but it seems that by that time one could only dream of a “disciplined” army


                  It is a myth.
                  Only parts standing in Petrograd partially decomposed. And long standing in Petrograd idle. At the front, discipline was normal at the time of February.
                  1. mat-vey
                    mat-vey 13 October 2017 18: 55
                    0
                    Then it is not clear why Kerensky was called not the Commander-in-Chief, but the Chief Enforcer?
                    1. ammunition
                      ammunition 13 October 2017 22: 59
                      0
                      Quote: mat-vey
                      Then it is not clear why Kerensky was called not the Commander-in-Chief, but the Chief Enforcer?


                      At the time of Order No. 1, Kerensky was still an unknown figure. Neither the commander in chief nor the chief negotiator could be.
                      ---------------
                      After the release of Order No. 1, the situation with discipline ( naturally ) became catastrophic.
                      ------------
                      I ask you not to ask mocking questions. sad
                      1. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 14 October 2017 07: 28
                        0
                        The question is not "mocking", if everything was okay with discipline, how did it happen that the order for the decomposing parts of Petrograd was so quickly adopted throughout the army ....
                      2. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 14 October 2017 07: 40
                        0
                        PySy and corporal punishment in the army probably returned the same because of perfect discipline ...
    2. Chiropractor
      Chiropractor 10 October 2017 08: 02
      16
      Your thought is either deep, but incorrect, or the word beguiled. In October, the Bolsheviks SHOWN power that no one wanted to take. We picked up and, instead of empty talk, began to act. Tired of war? - Peace Decree. Want to eat? - Decree of the Earth. And since Russia was 95% peasant, the specific actions of the authorities were aimed at the aspirations of Russia. 5% of the intelligentsia could only chat and collect a coin for the cordon.
      1. venaya
        venaya 10 October 2017 08: 18
        +4
        Quote: Kostoprav
        In October, the Bolsheviks SHOWN power that no one wanted to take.

        I think this is just your opinion, I didn’t want to. If you didn’t want to, then why so much money was swollen both in the war itself and the revolutions themselves. V.I. Lenin did not pick up power at all, and he stole it in the most impudent manner from those who organized this very revolution and paid generously. Remember: only the Provisional Government of A. Kerensky from overseas sent a couple of tranches of $ 400 million, not counting the rest of the costs. What do you think bankers for idiots scattering their money? And I personally have a completely different opinion about them, about these hunks.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. Kenxnumx
        Kenxnumx 10 October 2017 08: 53
        +4
        They did not pick up and with the help of the enemy took away. And they deprived the people of the right to choose for many years.
        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 10 October 2017 10: 26
          +9
          Quote: Ken71
          They did not pick up and with the help of the enemy took away.

          Yeah ... and we all know this enemy.

          Who was the most active supporter and “breakdown force” of Order No. 1? Who first ruined the "vertical line of command" of the army, and then began to broadcast about strengthening discipline up to executions (after which deserters poured from the army in a rampart)? Who anticipated the Bolshevik surplus-appraisal - up to the armed seizure of bread from large owners and all producers from the villages closest to the railway stations? Who armed the Red Guard?

          If Nicholas II deserved the Order of the October Revolution for No. 1, then Alexander Fedorovich should have been awarded the same order for No. 2.
          1. avva2012
            avva2012 10 October 2017 10: 36
            12
            Maybe it's a bike, but funny. The correspondent of one of the Western newspapers interviewed A.F. Kerensky and asked the question, "What had to be done to prevent the October Revolution?" Kerensky replies, "it was necessary to shoot one man." Correspondent, "Lenin?", Answer: "no, A. F. Kerensky." Even if the joke is indicative.
          2. creak
            creak 10 October 2017 11: 26
            +6
            When talking about such figures as Kerensky, an oriental proverb involuntarily comes to mind:
            "When the caravan turns back, the lame web lodge is ahead" ...
        2. long in stock.
          long in stock. 10 October 2017 11: 37
          +7
          and before that, the people of course had the right to choose ..
          1. Kenxnumx
            Kenxnumx 10 October 2017 11: 59
            +1
            The constituent assembly gave a chance.
            1. long in stock.
              long in stock. 10 October 2017 18: 54
              +7
              I don’t believe. the same people have the same thoughts. and most importantly, there is no performance ... blah blah blah a lot, there wasn’t much .. tryndet not toss the bags.
              1. mat-vey
                mat-vey 10 October 2017 19: 13
                +4
                So they had all the possibilities and everything in the talking room and their wishes, intentions, they disappeared into the sand, and in the country the mess was growing ...
                1. badens1111
                  badens1111 10 October 2017 21: 04
                  +3
                  Everyone talking about the Constituent Assembly is exactly the same as the Constituent Assembly itself, a collection of talkers about nothing and, accordingly, there was no practical benefit from the Constituent Assembly then, and there is no sense from its fans now.
                  Quote: mat-vey
                  So they had all the possibilities and everything in the talking room and their wishes, intentions, they disappeared into the sand, and in the country the mess was growing ...

                  Therefore, we have a mess because there are too many aching people about the Constituent ...
              2. Kenxnumx
                Kenxnumx 10 October 2017 19: 49
                +2
                You should all walk. Your trend is parliamentary democracy. This is the method of self-government of the people the most adequate of all invented.
                1. mat-vey
                  mat-vey 10 October 2017 19: 54
                  +3
                  Well, what did the Soviets of People's Deputies not please you with? Are there too many people in them?
                  1. badens1111
                    badens1111 10 October 2017 21: 00
                    +1
                    Quote: mat-vey
                    too much

                    Colleague, let’s stop talking to this provocateur troll.
                    His role here is provocation and writing denunciations with subsequent ban ...
                    1. mat-vey
                      mat-vey 10 October 2017 21: 04
                      +1
                      Do you propose that your own bile so to speak?
                      1. badens1111
                        badens1111 10 October 2017 21: 06
                        +1
                        That shit chokes on her.
                        Why feed the troll?
                    2. mat-vey
                      mat-vey 10 October 2017 21: 08
                      +1
                      Well, let's try ...
                2. long in stock.
                  long in stock. 10 October 2017 22: 31
                  +2
                  go to loose .. no one forbids you now either before that .. and real democracy is when a citizen has at least 3 slaves .. to remind who said that? What category do you consider yourself in?
                  1. mat-vey
                    mat-vey 11 October 2017 06: 26
                    +2
                    So still from the counts, well, some are true from the princes, but less often .... less ...
      4. Black5Raven
        Black5Raven 10 October 2017 19: 30
        +2
        Quote: Kostoprav
        Want to eat? - Decree of the Earth. And since Russia was 95% peasant, the specific actions of the authorities were aimed at the aspirations of Russia.

        And for this reason, smart business executives were "dispossessed", and everyone else in collective farms, where the land was not at their disposal? From that aspirations of Russia, that's how help is.
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 10 October 2017 21: 05
          +1
          And bastards instead of gramophones bought machines ...
        2. long in stock.
          long in stock. 10 October 2017 23: 41
          +3
          yeah. and still a few hundred milleins shot. we know. passed. but in fact-
          The well-known agronomist and publicist Alexander Nikolaevich Engelhardt wrote about what the export of grain turned out to be for the Russian peasantry:
          “When last year everyone rejoiced, rejoiced that there was a poor harvest abroad, that the demand for bread was high, that prices were growing, that export was increasing, some of the men were not happy, they looked askance at sending bread to the Germans ... We do not sell bread out of excess, that we sell our daily bread abroad, the bread we need for our own food
          We send wheat, good clean rye abroad, to the Germans, who will not eat all kinds of rubbish. We burn the best, pure rye for wine, and the worst rye, with fluff, bonfire, calf and all sorts of hang-ups obtained by cleaning rye for distilleries - that’s what a man eats. But not only does the peasant eat the worst bread, he is still malnourished. If there is enough bread in the villages, they eat three times; there was a depreciation in bread, breads are short - they eat twice, lean more on a spring, potatoes, hemp pulp are added to bread. Of course, the stomach is full, but people are losing weight due to poor food, getting sick, guys grow tighter, just like what happens with badly kept cattle ...
          Do the children of the Russian farmer have the kind of food they need? No, no and NO. Children eat worse than calves from a host with good livestock. The mortality of children is much greater than the mortality of calves, and if the owner of a good cattle had mortality of calves as high as that of a man, then it would be impossible to manage. Do we want to compete with the Americans when our children don’t have white bread even in their nipples? If mothers ate better, if our wheat, which the German eats, remained at home, then the children would grow up better and there would be no such mortality, all these typhus, scarlet fever, diphtheria would not rage. Selling our wheat to a German, we sell our blood, i.e. peasant children. ”as Minister Visegradsky said at the same time about exporting grain at that time:“ We are undernourished, but we’ll export it. ”and now the myth of intelligent owners - 83 percent of the bread originated in landowners and kulak farms. 17 let's tell us that they were all drunkards and mediocrity. then the hungry ussr bread consumption per capita was higher than the well-fed tsarist Russia. because people began to be fed up, though not immediately afterwards, never our peasant, like everyone else though bread didn’t interfere with quinoa. before yelling at least they got interested in a question.
          1. Chiropractor
            Chiropractor 11 October 2017 07: 05
            +2
            But before the revolution there was always a harvest and the man was lying on the stove and cracking pies .....
            Hunger has always been periodic. In the WWII, several million were put under arms every year - seized from the economy. Who left to plow, sow?
        3. long in stock.
          long in stock. 10 October 2017 23: 41
          +2
          yaw you yaw as it is ..
    3. Orel
      Orel 10 October 2017 08: 24
      14
      I respect the opinion of the author, but I do not think that it is necessary for people to create the image of a “Russian soldier,” to which everyone around must. It was as if there was no Marne and Verdun, and many other multimillion meat grinders in the West, as if only the Russians were at war. Why so frankly mislead people ??? And after the defeat of the Russian Empire, Germany transferred huge forces to the West, but for almost half a year it was not able to break the Anglo-French forces. It was exhausted in the end and defeated. Is such a period short for the "undoubted defeat of France," as the author writes. Or the French and English forces were not exhausted just as well. as are the forces of all the warring parties.
      1. venaya
        venaya 10 October 2017 09: 03
        +6
        Quote: Orel
        and after the defeat of the Russian Empire, Germany transferred huge forces to the West, but for almost half a year it was not able to break the Anglo-French forces. It was exhausted in the end and defeated.

        I think that about the defeat of the Kaiser army, you are very excited here. Look: at the time of the “surrender” of the GI there was not a single soldier of the army hostile to them on the territory of this empire itself. Is it possible in this case to speak of a certain defeat? There they happened exactly the same as in the Republic of Ingushetia "katavasiya", Kaiser Wilheim was simply removed from the administration of the country by the method of imprisonment in the castle, after which his cousins ​​managed to completely sign the surrender. It is a pity that we are so fond of studying the history of neighboring countries so as not to know such nuances from our neighbors. They fought, fought, but no one won and no one lost, there was a simple and elementary "agreement". This is usually done by big politics, and not at all on the battlefields.
        1. Orel
          Orel 10 October 2017 10: 14
          +6
          Quote: venaya
          There they happened exactly the same as in the Republic of Ingushetia "katavasiya", Kaiser Wilheim was simply removed from the administration of the country by the method of imprisonment in the castle, after which his cousins ​​managed to completely sign the surrender.


          The economy is at war, and it is in Germany and went into crisis because of the war. I could not stand it. There is no fundamental occupation. After all, Germany did not occupy the whole Russian Empire, and in past wars, as a rule, the enemy’s capital was rarely occupied. Usually before the war ended.
          1. mat-vey
            mat-vey 10 October 2017 12: 38
            +5
            Well, in the Republic of Ingushetia there was a complete order with the economy - not that there weren’t any machine gun rifles, there weren’t enough sheepskin coats, only heroism left, but heroic when you don’t know why (but you guess), if you’re hungry wives children in the rear ..
            1. Gopnik
              Gopnik 10 October 2017 15: 43
              +4
              Quote: mat-vey
              Well, in RI with the economy was a complete lock


              Well, everything is better than that of the same Austria-Hungary, for example. And better than the USSR during the Second World War.
              1. mat-vey
                mat-vey 10 October 2017 15: 57
                +4
                Is this humor not so intricate? Or don’t you know that even a rifleman was bought by more than a third? Can’t I say more seriously .. But can you read more about "better than the USSR during the Second World War"?
                1. Gopnik
                  Gopnik 10 October 2017 16: 05
                  +4
                  Quote: mat-vey
                  Or don’t you know that even the rifleman was bought by more than a third?


                  And the muse, in turn, is aware that RI produced rifles more than anyone except Germany?

                  Quote: mat-vey
                  But about "better than the USSR during the Second World War" can be more detailed?


                  Can. At least not dead from the rear in the thousands.
                  1. mat-vey
                    mat-vey 10 October 2017 16: 12
                    +3
                    “that RI produced rifles more than anyone else,” so what then did every third “Arisaka” in the Far East also come with American-made pickaxes from RI’s order? And what was there about machine guns ... “You can. At least not dead with hunger in the rear by the thousands. " “Do we continue to petrosyan? Or did the bill go for millions, then the peasants got bogged down?”
                    1. Gopnik
                      Gopnik 10 October 2017 16: 18
                      +4
                      Quote: mat-vey
                      well then what every third "Arisaka" was

                      Oooooh, how's it going ...

                      Quote: mat-vey
                      and in the Far East, the interventionists with the American-made loafers from the RI order arrived?


                      Would you decide who were with the purchased rifles - soldiers of the Russian army (by one third) or interventionists?

                      Quote: mat-vey
                      And what was there on the machine guns ...


                      With machine guns, everything was on par, about the same as with rifles - a little less than in Germany. And the production of manual ones did not have time to launch until February, although they built a plant. Then at this factory the Bolsheviks were already making weapons.

                      Quote: mat-vey
                      Or was there a bill for millions, then the men got bogged down?


                      In WWI there were no mass deaths from starvation, unlike WWII.
                      1. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 10 October 2017 16: 26
                        +3
                        "Would you decide who was with the purchased rifles - soldiers of the Russian army (by a third) or interventionists?" - but misinterpretation is not good ....
                  2. long in stock.
                    long in stock. 10 October 2017 18: 56
                    +4
                    and you know how many machine guns Astro-Hungary released and how much the Russian empire? Well, read it. At the same time, look at the heavy artillery and planes. You look stupid ....
                    1. badens1111
                      badens1111 10 October 2017 19: 07
                      +2
                      Quote: Long in stock.
                      and you know how many machine guns fired astrovyng and how much the russian empire?

                      He’s not up to it .. the main thing is to blurt out as always, that if something is what we are .. but here’s a revolution, to the Briam ... then the Bolsheviks let out ..
                      And realities, they are.
                      In April 1915, the GAU raised the question of bringing the number of machine guns in the infantry regiments to 16 and the Cossack and cavalry regiments to 8. That the staff was brought up to 616 infantry (2 per company or 32 per regiment) and 256 Cossack and cavalry regiments (8 each ) it was required by the end of January 1917 to put 19564 machine guns into the army, 720 into reserve battalions and 10886 into reserve. In just 16 months - 31170 machine guns. Naturally, the only machine-gun department of the Imperial name of Peter the Great of the Tula Arms Plant could not cope with such volumes. On July 24, 1914, the Head of the artillery technical institutions ordered the production of machine guns to be increased to 80 units per month (from the current 60), and on September 23, the Supreme Commander increased this requirement to 180-202 per month. However, until the end of 1914, ITOZ issued only 828 machine guns.
                      In March 1915, with great efforts, the daily production of machine guns on ITOZ was increased by 3 times. On average, 10,5 units were produced (in the pre-war time, this figure was 3,5). Sokolov's machine tool production was increased 4 times (6 units per day versus 1,5). If ITOZ for the whole of 1914 produced 1,3 thousand machine guns and only 800 machine tools, then in 1915 these figures were 4,3 thousand and 2,5 thousand, respectively, in 1916 -11,1 thousand and 8 thousand ., in 1917 - 11,4 thousand and 5 thousand. Of course, the number of machine guns delivered was slightly less: in 1914 - 1184, in 1915 - 4251, in 1916 - 11072 machine guns. For comparison, in 1914 only 287 machine guns were fired in England, and 6102 during the next year; Before the war in Germany, up to 200 units were produced per month, by August 1916 the monthly output was 2300 machine guns, and by the spring of 1917 this figure was 14400.https: //topwar.ru/13549-postavki-pulemetov-
                      v-armiyu-rossii-v-hode-pervoy-mirovoy-voyny.html
                      They are too lazy to read the published information once, if only to engage in verbiage ... then write complaints that they were offended ..
                      1. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 10 October 2017 19: 45
                        +1
                        So I still didn’t understand the order was with the economy, or how it didn’t happen and it didn’t appear .. well, until the commies have not built bloody factories and prepared specialists?
                      2. Gopnik
                        Gopnik 11 October 2017 11: 58
                        +1
                        Exactly, RI in 1915 issued 4251 easel machine guns, England 6102 easel and MANUAL (Lewis). Germany by August 1916 produced approx. 2300 easel and manual machine guns, RI 1100 easel. Those. the production of easel machine guns of the Republic of Ingushetia was comparable to the production of the most powerful industrial powers in Europe, the Republic of Ingushetia did not produce light machine guns, yes.
                      3. badens1111
                        badens1111 11 October 2017 15: 29
                        +1
                        Quote: Gopnik
                        Exactly, RI in 1915 issued 4251 easel machine guns, England 6102 easel and MANUAL (Lewis). Germany by August 1916 produced approx. 2300 easel and manual machine guns, RI 1100 easel. Those. the production of easel machine guns of the Republic of Ingushetia was comparable to the production of the most powerful industrial powers in Europe, the Republic of Ingushetia did not produce light machine guns, yes.

                        For you on purpose, this is what Kaiser Germany has released.
                        Over the years of the First World War, about 260 thousand machine guns of the MG.08, 08 / 15 and 08 / 18 models were released in Germany, of which only 72 thousand were mounted.
                        And this is a reference to you, where the number of machine guns issued by the "strong industry" RI.M and in many armament positions, contrary to your ury / patriotic cliques, is not very important for the number of machine guns. It’s such a harsh one ...
                        You, Gopnik, sometimes at least learn something .. https: //gusev-av.livejournal.com/62378
                        0.html
                      4. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 11 October 2017 15: 34
                        0
                        He so strongly advises others to read something, which is probably why there is no time left ...
                        PySy advise me, and feed yourself ..
                    2. Gopnik
                      Gopnik 11 October 2017 11: 45
                      +1
                      I am aware, yes. And here you are, it seems not. And so look stupid asking stupid questions. There is something to report - inform, no - pass by.
                      1. long in stock.
                        long in stock. 11 October 2017 16: 31
                        +1
                        you probably didn’t get in there .. here knowledge of a pair of books of dubious sense will not allow you to look smart. there are such bison who not only know how many screws are in the Mauser, but even the composition of the gunpowder can be called in the cartridges for this Mauser ... and in different lots. . But by the way, if you want to look stupid, this is your right.
        2. Mikado
          Mikado 10 October 2017 15: 01
          +2
          Look: at the time of the “surrender” of the GI there was not a single soldier of the army hostile to them on the territory of this empire itself. Is it possible in this case to speak of a certain defeat?

          Vyacheslav, it seems to me, the Germans simply acted smarter than our "democrats". When there is a mess in the country and a bacchanalia (note that it was not the lumpen who rose up - the sailors), it makes no sense to continue the war. You can stop the enemy (if you are very lucky), but to win - no. hi did they make sense to multiply their losses?
          1. long in stock.
            long in stock. 10 October 2017 22: 38
            +2
            I wouldn’t just rise up in their place and put the command to the bottom .. the fleet should go to sea and die heroically with honor .. for this it is necessary to hang flags instead of flags ..
            1. Mikado
              Mikado 11 October 2017 08: 21
              +3
              fleet must go to sea and heroically die with honor

              the remarkable phrase was said by the American general Patton (although, judging by his statements, he was ready to be an enemy of the USSR): I want you to remember that not a single y ..doc has won a single war, dying for his country. The one who makes the other poor stupid u..dkov dies for his own. Therefore, all these orders of heroic death - yes, perhaps, the truth was worth hanging. what
              100 years of guilt before the Russian soldier should be because his blood and heroism had to compensate for the disgusting preparation for war. This is the fault of the king, his entourage, ministers, etc. It was impossible to enter this war without heavy artillery, machine guns, but it was not worth entering! I do not regret that Poland and Finland fell away from us as a result of the war - they are strangers to us. I am sorry that after a few more years the Russians killed the Russians. hi
              1. long in stock.
                long in stock. 11 October 2017 16: 33
                +1
                and I'm sorry. the historical process unfortunately is. and nothing can be done about it.
                1. Mikado
                  Mikado 11 October 2017 16: 40
                  +1
                  Yes, I agree .. only we do not breed as fast as the Chinese. We did not need this war. recourse
      2. Gopnik
        Gopnik 10 October 2017 15: 38
        +3
        Quote: Orel
        And after the defeat of the Russian Empire, Germany transferred huge forces to the West, but for almost half a year it was not able to break the Anglo-French forces.


        You would have to pull up the basic knowledge of WWI. The Brest Peace was signed by the Russian Empire, and from the moment this world was signed until the defeat of Germany, not one and a half years passed, but 8 months.
      3. wax
        wax 10 October 2017 21: 25
        +1
        The First World Russian people were not needed at all. The heroism of the Russian soldier is worthy of memory, but it should also be a lesson for the Russian authorities, which should remember that the saving of the people is its true purpose.
    4. Vend
      Vend 10 October 2017 09: 02
      +3
      They are trying to pay tribute to the fallen Russian military in the First World War. In Moscow, in the Victory Park, a monument was erected.

      But the problem is that start to understand the causes of the defeat and the bickering of the two camps begins again. It is time to make a memorable date in honor of the fallen soldiers in the First World War.
      1. Trapperxnumx
        Trapperxnumx 10 October 2017 10: 56
        +5
        Quote: Wend
        But the problem is that start to understand the causes of the defeat and the bickering of the two camps begins again.

        Yes. And this is a very big trouble.
    5. mat-vey
      mat-vey 10 October 2017 12: 30
      0
      parusnik Today, 07:28
      before the October events, Russia was a reliable ally
      ... In October, the Bolsheviks made the February revolution ...
      Looks like those more Experts ...
    6. Gopnik
      Gopnik 10 October 2017 15: 34
      +3
      And where does the February Revolution? After it, Russia entered into a truce and began demobilization, as after October? Until October, the number of German troops remained virtually unchanged, but after it began to decline.
      1. mat-vey
        mat-vey 10 October 2017 16: 00
        +2
        There really is nothing to do with it - only it wasn’t clear with the army, whether it was or not ... Or do you want to "pull up the basic knowledge of WWI."?
        1. Gopnik
          Gopnik 10 October 2017 16: 06
          +3
          Well, if you don’t understand, read books. Or, at least, an announced series of articles. And so the army, of course, was. Although worse than before February.
          1. mat-vey
            mat-vey 10 October 2017 16: 13
            +3
            In short, you will not illustrate your alternative history with pictures ...
            1. Gopnik
              Gopnik 10 October 2017 16: 20
              +3
              Google the "Eastern Front of the WWI in November 1917" and the "Eastern Front of the WWI in 1918", or the "number of German divisions in the East" and you will have pictures
              1. mat-vey
                mat-vey 10 October 2017 16: 30
                +3
                It’s clear that mass desertion and a complete mess with discipline and controllability will never sound anything .. Or the main paper number of divisions, and not their real combat effectiveness ...
                1. Gopnik
                  Gopnik 10 October 2017 16: 54
                  +3
                  the real fighting efficiency is shown by the front line and how many enemy bayonets on this line are opposed
                  1. mat-vey
                    mat-vey 10 October 2017 17: 00
                    +4
                    Well, what was the matter with the front line? And the bayonets are all there is to consider, or only those who agree to fight and listen to the commanders, and not put to the wall?
                    1. Gopnik
                      Gopnik 10 October 2017 17: 07
                      +2
                      The front line for October 1917 is much westward than for March or November 1918. And, surprisingly, even in Minsk, Kiev, Narva and Pskov there are no Germans.

                      Quote: mat-vey
                      And the bayonets are all there is to consider, or only those that agree to fight and listens to the commanders, and does not put against the wall?


                      I wrote about the German bayonets, read what you answer.
                      1. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 10 October 2017 17: 13
                        +3
                        "I wrote about the German bayonets, read what you answer." - So what about the combat effectiveness of which army are you rubbing?
                        "The front line for October 1917 is much westward than for March or November 1918. And, surprisingly, even in Minsk, Kiev, Narva and Pskov there are no Germans." - So there are no Bolsheviks there ... and the same army is no longer there, or will you tell us how the army was gathered and gathered to suppress the St. Petersburg uprising, but didn’t work to collect anything?
  2. Cartalon
    Cartalon 10 October 2017 07: 40
    11
    Some historical whining and not an article, here we are so poor and we were dragged into the war, but we fought for thanks, but we didn’t say thanks.
  3. Conductor
    Conductor 10 October 2017 07: 45
    +2
    I found my great-grandfather still alive, since he had fought since the end of 16, but at the age of 16 he said that our opponents against the Germans were different. Not my words, I just convey.
    1. Gopnik
      Gopnik 10 October 2017 15: 45
      +3
      At 16, he fought ?? 16 year olds did not call for WWI, you probably mixed up with the Second World War.
      1. mat-vey
        mat-vey 10 October 2017 16: 01
        +2
        Uh, can you read more about the appeal of 16-year-olds to the Second World War?
        1. Gopnik
          Gopnik 10 October 2017 16: 11
          +4
          Oooo, Monsieur is not even aware of the history of the Second World War, where is it already before the WWII ...
          For a start:
          "State Defense Committee
          Decision No. GOKO-4322ss of October 13, 1943
          Moscow Kremlin.
          On the draft for military service of draftees born in 1926
          The State Defense Committee decides:
          1. To oblige an NPO (i.e. Smorodinova) to call up to military service all male citizens born in 15 before November 1943, 1926 .... "
          Monsieur himself will be able to calculate what age was born on November 15, 1943, for example, December 15, 1926?
          1. mat-vey
            mat-vey 10 October 2017 16: 20
            +2
            And what immediately to the front?
            1. Gopnik
              Gopnik 10 October 2017 16: 56
              +3
              oh, monsieur decided to distort? It was about the fact that in the WWII, unlike the Second World War, 16-year-olds were not called up at all.
              Although, it is possible that those called up directly by the troops on the liberated territory could also get to the front.
              1. mat-vey
                mat-vey 10 October 2017 17: 08
                +6
                Yes, yes, and armed with cuttings from shovels and halves of bricks ... And on the bill, “distort” - well, I wrote in a hurry instead of “fought” - “called up” ... oh, yes, they only handed the summons and immediately into battle - commies and bloodsuckers , the whole calculation was quicker to exterminate the population and themselves to attack like ...
                1. Gopnik
                  Gopnik 10 October 2017 17: 14
                  +2
                  Quote: mat-vey
                  Yes, yes, and armed with cuttings from shovels and halves of bricks .. oh yes, they only handed the summons and immediately went into battle - commies and bloodsuckers, the whole calculation was quicker to destroy the population and themselves to attack ...


                  Do not clown around. Especially on this topic.
                  1. mat-vey
                    mat-vey 10 October 2017 17: 20
                    +5
                    And why can you? Especially since it’s not mine, but those who aren’t so half-alive and have learned super truth ...
                    1. Laurus
                      Laurus 10 October 2017 17: 43
                      +5
                      Willing to argue with Petrosyan about history? He then knows the story of Svanidze and Mlechin. In the retelling of Novodvorskaya.
                      1. mat-vey
                        mat-vey 10 October 2017 17: 56
                        +5
                        I help open up the talent ... Well, suddenly what a new fairy tale tell ..
                      2. Gopnik
                        Gopnik 11 October 2017 12: 07
                        +1
                        And you, Mr. Nepetrosyan, what can you tell us? The story in the retelling of the Short Course of the CPSU (b)?
  4. Mar.Tirah
    Mar.Tirah 10 October 2017 07: 47
    +3
    Well, are you really guilty? They are guilty again. During World War I, and the participation of the Russian army in the media is written, if not a lot, then it is enough to study. And the main conclusion is that the Russian soldier, like the sailor, by the way, he is everywhere Russian a soldier, and he didn’t have to push him for heroism, they were brought up with such a mentality. With a shield, or on a shield. The most famous episode is the attack of the dead. Well and, as always, the straightforwardness of the royal dynasty who fulfilled their obligations to the "allies". Which easily then betrayed them. But certainly your work will benefit. Thank you, we will wait for something new.
  5. Kenxnumx
    Kenxnumx 10 October 2017 08: 15
    0
    It’s usually good for Roman to write historical articles, so we’ll see. The main thing is not to forget that you should not attach a universal significance to the secondary Russian front, as is customary in our historiography. Nevertheless, I would like an objective consideration of the events.
    1. novel66
      novel66 10 October 2017 10: 49
      +5
      and our soldiers who were sent to die for France? about them there any remember?
      1. Kenxnumx
        Kenxnumx 10 October 2017 11: 01
        +3
        They are just remembered there. They seem to have forgotten here.
      2. creak
        creak 10 October 2017 11: 42
        0
        Quote: novel xnumx
        and our soldiers who were sent to die for France?

        It’s just a masterpiece ... Our soldiers fought for France - and they fought not by the same Germans, but unknowingly with anyone, presumably, exclusively in the interests of the French bourgeoisie ...
        Even the main Soviet ideologist Suslov could be proud of such a conclusion ....
    2. Trapperxnumx
      Trapperxnumx 10 October 2017 11: 00
      +2
      I do not agree. For a single Germany, yes, probably secondary. But if you look at the costs of the Central Block, then you get approximate equality. But this was a war of unions, as I recall.
      1. Kenxnumx
        Kenxnumx 10 October 2017 11: 14
        +7
        The fate of the war was decided by Germany in the fields of France and not by Austro-Hungarian in the east. Of course, without the Russian front, the Entente’s victory was unlikely, but by the forces and means spent by Germany in the epic of battles, the eastern front was secondary. This, of course, does not detract from the heroism of Russian soldiers and officers.
        1. Trapperxnumx
          Trapperxnumx 10 October 2017 11: 24
          +6
          Quote: Ken71
          The fate of the war was decided by Germany in the fields of France and not by Austro-Hungarian in the east. Of course, without the Russian front, the Entente’s victory was unlikely, but by the forces and means spent by Germany in the epic of battles, the eastern front was secondary. This, of course, does not detract from the heroism of Russian soldiers and officers.

          The defeat of AB put an end to all the efforts of Germany to defeat France. A quick defeat AB put Germany’s quick checkmate. That is why, at the end of 1916, both Bulgarians and even Turks fought in AB. The goal is the same - to prevent defeat of AB.
          1. Gopnik
            Gopnik 10 October 2017 15: 48
            +4
            Actually, Germany capitulated when the Austrian front collapsed. They did not wait until they were felt for the udder in Bavaria.
    3. Gopnik
      Gopnik 10 October 2017 15: 47
      +3
      Quote: Ken71
      to attach universal significance as is customary in our historiography.


      This is normal, always focusing on their own. Therefore, the Anglo-Saxons mainly cover their participation in WWII, and their participation in the war of the USSR is a dark forest.
  6. XII Legion
    XII Legion 10 October 2017 08: 16
    19
    Russia was the first to declare war only on the Ottoman Empire, from the rest it accepted the challenge

    If not for the sneaky blow of the German-Turks on the Black Sea ports
    The Russian soldier became the shield against which the troops of the Fourth Union fought (Germany, Austria-Hungary, Bulgaria and the Ottoman Empire). And a reliable shield.

    This is exactly
    Great, God forbid
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 10 October 2017 12: 43
      +1
      The soldier is reliable, but the "defense committee" ...
  7. Basil50
    Basil50 10 October 2017 08: 19
    +7
    Now, the collective * of truth-tellers *. Created by the RED Army veterans of the Imperialist War. At school there were textbooks in which it was said about this. And about how they fought and where it was also said. For my generation, the GREAT PATRIOTIC WAR has become more significant.
    Today the order of power for * hula * is all that is connected with the SOVIET period of the history of our HOMELAND. Hence such articles. But the authors will not talk about how the allies betrayed, how they stole equipment and food from soldiers of the RUSSIAN ARMY. Nor will they talk about the creation of national formations, including from prisoners of war, who, following the will of the allies, robbed and killed the RUSSIANS.
    1. Trapperxnumx
      Trapperxnumx 10 October 2017 11: 03
      +3
      Let us nevertheless first read what they write, and only then we will draw conclusions.
    2. Gopnik
      Gopnik 10 October 2017 15: 56
      +4
      Quote: Vasily50
      For my generation, the GREAT PATRIOTIC WAR has become more significant.


      So what??? Therefore, about all the other wars waged by Russia and the USSR, it is urgent to forget?
  8. avva2012
    avva2012 10 October 2017 09: 01
    +8
    The authors are surprised and resented by the results of the survey on the PMV. Recently showed the results of a survey about who, Alexander Matrosov, Zoya Kosmodemyanskaya. They were interested in the literary heroes of the works of L. N. Tolstoy, F. M. Dostoevsky, A. S. Pushkin. Students were asked about when the Second World War began, and I’m not talking about the date of the Battle of Kulikovo. According to the latest data, we took 11, in my opinion, a place in the mathematical olympiad. I will say more, not all recruits know the multiplication table, and in a nutshell of ten letters, they write with three errors at best. But, the authors are outraged by another. I would like to ask questions: “isn’t this whole catastrophe in education a consequence of too much attention to what attention should not be paid to?”, “Is there a substitution of cause and effect?”, “Can a change in social political system, led to such results? "
    1. Monarchist
      Monarchist 10 October 2017 10: 13
      +3
      Take the magazine “Literature at School” for 75-76 (I don’t remember the year now) and they cited the results of a survey of tenth-graders, then there were 10 classes, first-year students of universities. Among the questions were: who is Chapaev? What happened on the Kulikovo field?
      There were answers about Chapaev: a literary character, he fought Africans with whites.
      On Kulikovo field Spartak was defeated.
      In 1990, a familiar seventh grader told me: Ulyanov-Lenin was born in Kazan and entered the University there, and was serving a link in Sibirsky.
      1. avva2012
        avva2012 10 October 2017 10: 39
        +2
        Do you think this information gives us all hope for a successful outcome? smile
  9. Thracian warrior
    Thracian warrior 10 October 2017 09: 32
    +2
    It’s easy, when the war is going on somewhere, the Russians have itchy hands to shoot! laughing

    On the topic: War for Russia was absolutely unnecessary, but loans from the West had to be paid. This is a war over the stupidity of the Russian Tsar.
    1. avva2012
      avva2012 10 October 2017 09: 50
      +4
      From the point of view of banal erudition, each individual who critically motivates abstraction cannot ignore the criteria of utopian subjectivity.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Trapperxnumx
        Trapperxnumx 10 October 2017 11: 05
        +3
        Quote: avva2012
        From the point of view of banal erudition, each individual who critically motivates abstraction cannot ignore the criteria of utopian subjectivity.

        shine))))
    2. hohol95
      hohol95 10 October 2017 12: 39
      +1
      And the Bulgarian kings are the lights of prudence!
      This is "OUR and we FELL IT"!
      And you, my dear, "FELL YOUR FOOLS".
    3. alatanas
      alatanas 10 October 2017 14: 15
      +1
      Not right, dear. The war was world. It was about the global redistribution of territories and spheres of influence between the "great forces." And the Russian Empire at that time was still considered one of these forces.
      1. avva2012
        avva2012 10 October 2017 14: 54
        +1
        Do you have a banality contest today? Hashtag under the slogan, “let's go to VO and say something!”? Congratulations, dear, you won !!!! “The war was world”, in an article about the WWI, this is 100 percentage hit in the “bullseye”! Here, only, dear, explain to your colleague that you should not be rude at a party. Not good it dear hi
        1. alatanas
          alatanas 10 October 2017 16: 56
          +2
          Explain to him yourself. I explained why RI entered the war - it is against the thesis that RI had no reason to fight. So, your irony at the expense of platitudes is not entirely appropriate. Just you under this
          let's go to VO and say something!
          and show off.
          1. avva2012
            avva2012 10 October 2017 18: 30
            +1
            No, I won’t be able to explain to him, I only understand in Russian, but here the clinical case, apparently, maybe you can, purely in a brotherly way. Well, thanks for appreciating my irony and explaining to all of us, "why RI entered the war."
            1. alatanas
              alatanas 11 October 2017 09: 40
              +1
              Bulgaria fought in the territories with the Bulgarian population, striving for the San Stefan ideal of uniting all the Bulgarians (Macedonia, Dobrogea and Thrace). The rest of the states fought a war imperialist.
              PS Especially for you - lovers of "common" truths.
              1. alatanas
                alatanas 11 October 2017 10: 39
                +1

                Administrative distribution of Bulgaria 1915-1918
              2. Mikado
                Mikado 11 October 2017 14: 41
                +2
                (Macedonia, Dobrogea and Thrace). The rest of the states waged an imperialist war.

                all were "good". There were no people from the countries who did not pursue any goals. Do not smear some with black paint, others with white. what all were "good" ..
                1. Maksim
                  Maksim 12 October 2017 22: 07
                  +1
                  Quote: Mikado
                  all were "good".

                  Well no. All were of a single berry field. Some won, while others did not. The question is whether it is worth watering each other with slop?
                  1. Mikado
                    Mikado 13 October 2017 12: 14
                    +1
                    The question is whether it is worth watering each other with slop?

                    here I am about the same. hi
    4. Gopnik
      Gopnik 10 October 2017 15: 58
      +3
      The war was not needed, but Russia declared it. And since they attacked, we must defend ourselves.
      That's how epic Bulgaria has set foot - yes. I put it on the wrong horse, and even then, when the outcome was clear.
      1. Maksim
        Maksim 12 October 2017 22: 12
        +1
        Quote: Gopnik
        That's how epic Bulgaria has set foot - yes.

        Many were epicly stupid - Bulgaria when it entered into an alliance that was already overthrowing, RI - when it lost as part of a winning coalition, Austria-Hungary - when it bought itself with the promises of Berlin, etc., etc. You-Know-Who were in the win.
        1. Gopnik
          Gopnik 13 October 2017 12: 14
          0
          Quote: Mac Sim
          RI - when she lost while being in the winning coalition,


          then not RI, but the RSFSR
          1. Maksim
            Maksim 13 October 2017 14: 56
            0
            The same eggs sideways. France and Britain managed to record in the winners, but RI did not. Yes, and the RSFSR appeared as a result of the failure of the tsarist government.
            1. mat-vey
              mat-vey 13 October 2017 15: 00
              0
              But did the RSFSR enter the Entente? Something is not entirely clear at the expense of succession ...
              1. Maksim
                Maksim 14 October 2017 06: 58
                0
                Ah, the RSFSR as the Kingdom of God lived on its own and had no relation to the Republic of Ingushetia.
                1. mat-vey
                  mat-vey 14 October 2017 07: 34
                  0
                  And what is not in itself? The RSFSR even geographically differed from the Republic of Ingushetia, especially in the early years ... and the Entente must be assumed to have divided the Republic of Ingushetia solely to comply with previously signed agreements ...
  10. Monarchist
    Monarchist 10 October 2017 09: 54
    0
    Quote: venaya
    Quote: Orel
    and after the defeat of the Russian Empire, Germany transferred huge forces to the West, but for almost half a year it was not able to break the Anglo-French forces. It was exhausted in the end and defeated.

    I think that about the defeat of the Kaiser army, you are very excited here. Look: at the time of the “surrender” of the GI there was not a single soldier of the army hostile to them on the territory of this empire itself. Is it possible in this case to speak of a certain defeat? There they happened exactly the same as in the Republic of Ingushetia "katavasiya", Kaiser Wilheim was simply removed from the administration of the country by the method of imprisonment in the castle, after which his cousins ​​managed to completely sign the surrender. It is a pity that we are so fond of studying the history of neighboring countries so as not to know such nuances from our neighbors. They fought, fought, but no one won and no one lost, there was a simple and elementary "agreement". This is usually done by big politics, and not at all on the battlefields.

    Just saying betrayal
  11. Varyag77
    Varyag77 10 October 2017 09: 56
    +5
    Quote: Thracian warrior
    It’s easy, when the war is going on somewhere, the Russians have itchy hands to shoot! laughing

    On the topic: War for Russia was absolutely unnecessary, but loans from the West had to be paid. This is a war over the stupidity of the Russian Tsar.

    Your opinion "brother" is very important for us. HIGHLY. Gutar ischo.
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 10 October 2017 12: 47
      +2
      Hussing is always fun, but it was really necessary to give loans ...
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Maksim
      Maksim 12 October 2017 22: 05
      0
      Quote: Varyag77
      Your opinion "brother" is very important for us. HIGHLY. Gutar ischo.

      I think that your condition is not being treated. You have to take a break from the comments.
  12. Trapperxnumx
    Trapperxnumx 10 October 2017 10: 52
    +4
    Thank! I will be glad to read these essays. But I join already those who noted this inaccuracy -
    but before the October events, Russia was a reliable ally

    Russia was a reliable ally until the February events. Then no more. October just finally put an end to this matter.
    1. Gopnik
      Gopnik 10 October 2017 15: 59
      +2
      What was the insecurity from February to October? Russia refused allied obligations, entered into a truce with Germany?
  13. Nonna
    Nonna 10 October 2017 10: 56
    0
    Write the authors about our Russian soldier .. Here on the site there are a lot of whiners, defeatists, who simply hate the history of Russia and the Russians, even as the Russians themselves. Again they ached about the Kerensky and Mensheviks with the Bolsheviks. Essentially, nothing.
  14. Curious
    Curious 10 October 2017 10: 57
    +4
    The goal is, of course, positive. What else can I write about in the "History" section of the Military Review website, if not about military history. Let's wait for the execution.
  15. Some kind of compote
    Some kind of compote 10 October 2017 11: 46
    18
    I wish the authors success in a noble cause good
  16. Alex_59
    Alex_59 10 October 2017 14: 01
    +3
    The black hole of our history is the First World War. I know the second, the first is not. Sinful.
    I suppose that it was greatly eclipsed by the revolution, civil, and then the Great Patriotic War. Plus politics - the rotten imperial regime and blah blah blah. Russian-Japanese did not erase like that because it was very out of the ordinary — a naval war with a unique campaign, with a naval battle influencing the course of world history. REV in this sense was lucky. But PMV - no. Everyone just knows that there was something, they fought, not very successfully in general, and they got out of the war, not that. Apparently from the fact that there was no bright victory or defeat, but everything is somehow sad and people have less desire to study it.
  17. captain
    captain 10 October 2017 14: 03
    +4
    Thanks dear authors. This is a very necessary and correct undertaking. Pay attention to some comments, this is written by Ivana who do not remember kinship. And the fact that for almost 30 years our education ministers could not pay tribute to the memory of our soldiers and officers is not surprising. They are the children of those who extinct this memory from the soul of our people. Lenin not only canceled the historical faculties at universities, the Communists do not like to write on this subject, but would be worth it. Stalin restored them in 1932. And the study of the "tsarist" history of Russia comrade Lenin canceled in schools and again Stalin returned the study of Russian history to school, but not to the extent that the historical events of our country deserved.
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 10 October 2017 14: 16
      +3
      And what was to study it (the tsarist) then - almost all the eyewitnesses .... and the memories are not unambiguous - it was necessary that it would subside, be forgotten, sorted out ...
  18. Odysseus
    Odysseus 10 October 2017 14: 30
    10
    The article is full of strange, to say the least, reasoning.
    1) “At best, a couple of paragraphs are given in textbooks on the WWI” I don’t know where the authors found such books, but in reality, not less than a couple of chapters were devoted to all the Soviet and post-Soviet textbooks of the WWI, and the number of scientific and military research of the WWII were estimated in the thousands. In the last 5 years, about WWII they say literally "from every iron."
    2) “Nobody talked about the feat of the Russian soldier.” This is simply not true, the heroism of ordinary Russian peasants and workers was not only not denied, but was always consistently emphasized.
    3) "Russia in the" coalition of winners "was among the losers." The Russian empire ceased to exist in March 1917, that is, it lost absolutely just disappeared before the end of the war .. Soviet Russia simply left this war in early 1918, and this allowed the Soviet government to strengthen and subsequently create the USSR. is there an analogy with the German Empire and Austria-Hungary?
    4) "Russia had no claims and attacked no one." But what about the straits and Galicia? And how did she attack anyone when RI was the first to declare general mobilization by launching the mechanism of world war. If, however, one professes the child’s thought that the attack is the declaration of war first, it turns out that Russia "attacked" the Ottoman Empire (which is simply not true) .
    Now we turn to a very strange thesis.
    5) "If it were not for the Entente, Russia would have lost." Firstly, not a fact, just the United States would have entered the war a little earlier. And secondly, so what? France would lose, and sneeze at it from a high bell tower. She lost to the Germans in 1871 too. Who are the authors worried about for the Russians or for the French? What do we care about France and its problems.
    6) “Analogies with Napoleon and the Second World War.” I recall Napoleon and Hitler invaded the Republic of Ingushetia and the USSR, and in these cases we were not at all “rescuers of Europe”, we defended our state and our country. Moreover, the USSR appeared precisely as a state that denies imperialist war, so the authors need to either remove the cross or put on their pants. Either they glorify the WWII, or the Second World War. But not at all together.
    7) "Fought in the name of simple truths-faith, middle name, King." Suppose, but then, why did the empire cease to exist during this battle? Truths ceased to be true? And then did the WWII end in February 1917? What "truths" were fought for in July 1917.
    8) "Russia saved Europe." Is it at least stand, at least fall. And that Germany is no longer Europe? And how did Russia “save Europe” by participating in intra-European squabbles? And why should Russia save someone? According to the authors, the function of Russians to die in the name of Europe?
    In fact, the Entente simply used the Russians as cannon fodder which is not a pity, just like the United States uses the citizens of Ukraine now. And just like the authors of the article, the Maidan propagandists assure the quickly utilized Ukrainians that they heroically "protect Europe" from Russian aggression . That is, they are not just meaningless cannon fodder perishing in a war they do not need, but entire "savior of Europe" which for some reason does not appreciate their great feats.
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 10 October 2017 14: 39
      +3
      Well, that’s all on the shelves ... and so - they got into shit, so why stir it up and boast - not everyone is happy about it ..
  19. Gopnik
    Gopnik 10 October 2017 16: 57
    +2
    mat-vey,

    So where was the "purchased rifleman", which is important "third" in the troops or among the interventionists?
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 10 October 2017 17: 16
      +1
      "that RI produced the rifles the most," so what then was every third Arisaka in the Far East interventionists with American-made mosquitoes from the order of RI arrived? - maybe once again?
      1. Gopnik
        Gopnik 10 October 2017 17: 22
        +2
        What for? The first time I realized that you are not in the subject absolutely. We didn’t have "every third Arisaka", and, in principle, the troops did not have a third of the purchased rifles.
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 10 October 2017 17: 27
          +1
          Well, bring the numbers - kill them with facts .. and don’t forget about the “Japanese” divisions, both about machine guns and internal combustion engines ... And what did Nesterov fly there for, well, for how many bearings of Russian manufacture there were in engineering. .. ask about the radio?
          1. Gopnik
            Gopnik 10 October 2017 17: 33
            +2
            Those. You are constantly making a jacuzzi from a puddle, but will I enlighten you? Sorry, they don’t pay me for this.
            1. mat-vey
              mat-vey 10 October 2017 17: 40
              +1
              And what do they pay for? For stupid shit? If you are not aware of mass purchases of RI weapons and placing orders for its production abroad, then you’ll enlighten yourself for a start ... And for one you’ll enlighten how you can make military equipment without bearings and electric technical industry.
  20. Gopnik
    Gopnik 10 October 2017 17: 26
    +2
    Quote: mat-vey
    "I wrote about the German bayonets, read what you answer." - So what about the combat effectiveness of which army are you rubbing?


    The third is you, and I write that until October 1917 the Germans practically did not reduce their grouping in the East, which the Russian army held. But after October they began to reduce.

    Quote: mat-vey
    "The front line for October 1917 is much westward than for March or November 1918. And, surprisingly, even in Minsk, Kiev, Narva and Pskov there are no Germans." - So there are no Bolsheviks there ... and the same army is no longer there, or will you tell us how the army was gathered and gathered to suppress the St. Petersburg uprising, but didn’t work to collect anything?


    Of course, there are no Bolsheviks there, so they escaped from there, which was recorded by the Brest Peace. In addition to Pskov, of course.
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 10 October 2017 17: 34
      +2
      "You are the third, and I write that until October 1917 the Germans practically did not reduce their grouping in the East, which was held by the Russian army. But after October they began to reduce it." - And to keep her nafik there if it became clear that there wasn’t any army on that side?
      In order to "get away" you must first get there - or now you tell us about the Bolshevik hordes in 1917-18?
      And on fig, did Trotsky build an army if it was already ready?
  21. Thracian warrior
    Thracian warrior 10 October 2017 17: 51
    0
    Quote: avva2012
    Do you have a banality contest today? Here, just, dear, explain to your colleague that you should not be rude at a party. Not good it dear hi

    In short, you don’t deny that I wrote about the loans of the Russian Tsar the Fool and as a result I ruined RI and even paid my life. Facts are facts. hi
    1. avva2012
      avva2012 10 October 2017 18: 42
      +1
      Denial, not always negation, but quite the contrary, is the realization of the internal contradiction that is formed in the process of development. In your case, a dead end.
    2. long in stock.
      long in stock. 10 October 2017 19: 05
      +2
      no, we don’t deny. just like the fool Ferdinand who worked on German loans. how much did the Bulgarians feel better about it? Maybe they brought al the country to a new level to the same level? For the Bulgarians, like for Russia, this war was alien and unnecessary ...
      1. Maksim
        Maksim 12 October 2017 21: 56
        0
        For the Bulgarians, PMV was an attempt to take revenge for the loss in 1913.
  22. Gopnik
    Gopnik 11 October 2017 12: 00
    +1
    mat-vey,
    The economy was in order. The level of industrial production in 1913, "bloody communes" reached only the end of the 20s. The level of agricultural production in 1913 could steadily surpass only in watts. floor. 50s.
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 11 October 2017 12: 51
      0
      I promised people not to feed the fat trolls, so go to the Echo ...
      1. Gopnik
        Gopnik 11 October 2017 12: 53
        +1
        That's right, when there is nothing to cover, the main thing is to merge with a good mine.
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 11 October 2017 12: 55
          0
          On the Echo, on the Echo .... Although you can and on the censor ...
          1. Gopnik
            Gopnik 11 October 2017 13: 09
            +1
            And you go further to let bubbles into the puddle. Only this can
            1. mat-vey
              mat-vey 11 October 2017 14: 27
              0
              To the Echo, to the Echo ...
  23. Gopnik
    Gopnik 11 October 2017 16: 01
    +1
    badens1111,
    Quote: badens1111
    Over the years of the First World War, about 260 thousand machine guns of the MG.08, 08 / 15 and 08 / 18 models were released in Germany, of which only 72 thousand were mounted.
    And this is a reference to you, where the number of machine guns issued by the "strong industry" RI.M and in many armament positions, contrary to your ury / patriotic cliques, is not very important for the number of machine guns. It’s such a harsh one ...


    Comrade, do not try to give out well-known figures for some kind of revelation. Namely, Germany FOR THE WHOLE WAR, i.e. to November 1918 was issued approx. 72 thousand machine guns. True, there is an opinion that this includes pre-war release, and during the war Germany released approx. 67 thousand. easel machine guns. Russia for the war, since July 1914 until december 1917 released more than 28 thousand. easel machine guns.
    Until 1917, i.e. for 1914-1916 RI released 16,2 thousand. easel machine guns, Germany during the same time less than 30 thousand. easel and MANUAL. How many of this number was just easel, I can not say. But the fact is that in both the German and Russian army at that time there was one norm for the number of machine guns - one machine gun per company.
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 11 October 2017 16: 52
      0
      Yes, the very fact that machine guns were not produced already says problems ....
      1. Gopnik
        Gopnik 11 October 2017 17: 06
        +1
        Undoubtedly, no one says that there were no problems. But, in principle, there were few where they were released, and where they were released they did not know what to do with them. Production was already unfolding during the war, having given birth to such rare freaks as the Shosh machine gun and MG 08/15. Russia is no exception. More precisely, the exception is that Russia at least had a handbrake at the beginning of the war. But in launching in-house production this excellent machine gun was 1,5-2 years late from France and Germany (which, in general, is a common thing for Russia), getting purchases was an opportunity.
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 11 October 2017 17: 09
          0
          To Echo, to Echo with his owl and his globe ...
  24. Gopnik
    Gopnik 11 October 2017 16: 35
    +1
    Quote: Long in stock.
    and you know how many machine guns fired astrovengri and how many Russian


    Well, and how much did Austria-Hungary produce machine guns, heavy guns and planes before 1917?
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 11 October 2017 16: 40
      +1
      And who will pay for education? And who will teach you not to selectively read? ... On the Echo, on the Echo there will be many such talk with understanding.
      1. Gopnik
        Gopnik 11 October 2017 16: 57
        +1
        You seem to have cut yourself out here? Decided to return? Tovarisch himself volunteered, famously stepping in from trump cards: "Do you know how much ...". Well, and how much?
        1. mat-vey
          mat-vey 11 October 2017 17: 01
          +1
          And who will pay me for education? Judging by how you perceive and learn information for tutoring, you need to take it in a 10-fold volume ... So there is no reason to “discuss” anything serious with you - the monitor will not wipe the fat ...
          1. Gopnik
            Gopnik 11 October 2017 17: 23
            +1
            You are nobody. You don’t have anything to enlighten, even if you don’t know anything about conscription in the Second World War, it’s stupid to expect any knowledge of the WWII from you. So, you can safely cut back.
            1. mat-vey
              mat-vey 11 October 2017 17: 41
              0
              Chu, offended? .... Or on Echo did not accept? Once again - what was called up and immediately into the battle? So I’ve enlightened the kid (for free) - My grandfather’s grandfather was called up at 17,5 so that only 18 earthwork and construction work was completed, and then an aviation school and yes from the liberated territories, first a mandatory check .. And if there were no light machine guns, then they couldn’t, otherwise we delete the Germans and write down the wishes and projections of the Republic of Ingushetia in the asset — kindergarten ...
              1. Gopnik
                Gopnik 11 October 2017 17: 56
                +1
                Tovarisch, do not cheat, or do you think I already forgot what was going on? It was a call of 16-year-olds.
                Light machine guns were even at the beginning of the war and more than Germany and France, but purchased. And in 1917 there was a plant for its production and the first experimental batch.
                1. mat-vey
                  mat-vey 11 October 2017 18: 24
                  0
                  mat-vey 2 Yesterday, 17:08 PM ↑
                  Yes, yes, and armed with cuttings from shovels and halves of bricks ... And on the bill, “distort” - well, I wrote in a hurry instead of “fought” - “called up” ... oh, yes, they only handed the summons and immediately into battle - commies and bloodsuckers , the whole calculation was quicker to exterminate the population and themselves to attack like ... - mat-vey 2 Today, 16:40 ↑
                  And who will pay for education? And who will teach you not to selectively read? ... On the Echo, on the Echo there will be many such talk with understanding.
                  "but purchased." - And how did the owl scream when it pulled onto the globe? How many internal combustion engines were there? And bearings again (and why did the Germans plan to bomb all bearing factories in the first place) .. And what about the machine guns? eroplanes? And at least one of the developed tanks was put into operation? And where were the ships mostly built? And where did you get the electrical equipment (though they invented the electric engine)? And what did the commies from all over the world buy equipment if everything was before ?
  25. Varyag77
    Varyag77 12 October 2017 16: 49
    +1
    Quote: long in stock.
    I wouldn’t just rise up in their place and put the command to the bottom .. the fleet should go to sea and die heroically with honor .. for this it is necessary to hang flags instead of flags ..

    Then we are surprised that it suddenly moved to Moscow in the Great Patriotic War. They had everything they needed. Greater Army, advanced weapons (according to the statements of the Communists). So maybe they didn’t have one small, but great Honor? What a wonderful opinion, however. It was necessary to run away, to hide, to be saved, but not to die .. what was Svyatoslav with his "we will lie down with bones but we will not shame Russia", "the dead do not have shame." Right? Remember being a coward is easy. Highly. And honor can be lost in an instant. And to recover almost never.
    The Roman legionary Horatio once said, "And there is no greater honor than that which you are ready to accept. For the bones of your ancestors. For the temple of your Gods." Live a coward and rejoice that in Russia there are always people who will die, including for you. And you will be clever, that it was not necessary. Apparently, Leningrad did not have to be defended, and Sevastopol and Novorossiysk and Stalingrad. There was no need to die. After all, it hurts to die. It's forever. But not to be there, and then blaming those who went to death is cool, huh? They also gagged who put the plus. Judah
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 13 October 2017 07: 01
      0
      You already decide - "So maybe they didn’t have one small, but great Honor?", Or "Apparently Leningrad didn’t have to be defended either, and Sevastopol and Novorossiysk and Stalingrad."
  26. ammunition
    ammunition 14 October 2017 15: 18
    0
    Quote: mat-vey
    if everything was okay with discipline, how did it happen that the order .................... was so quickly adopted throughout the army ....


    you can fuck.
    Order, this is discipline.
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 14 October 2017 15: 36
      0
      Yes, it seems already ... elected commanders during the war are not the army, this is a mess ... although if you do not understand this then you can judge and row about something ... ...
  27. Gepirion
    Gepirion 10 March 2018 13: 59
    0
    Dear authors! And why remember the First World War? Because the tsar, in order to please his relatives from Europe, threw a Russian peasant into a meat grinder? What to be proud of?
  28. Terenin
    Terenin 19 March 2018 20: 07
    +5
    ... to give at least part of that little bit of respect to our ancestors, who honestly fought for Russia on the sidelines of that war.. Forgive us, Great Russian Warriors.