Military Review

"Syrian shaft" and tank carousel

58



Speaking about innovations and innovations in our army, it makes sense to talk not only about new technology, but also new tactical techniques that really enter into everyday work. And if tank the carousel, which was shown to us during the BTU of one of the parts of the ZVO, is not new, then the "Syrian rampart" is really not an old thing.

Let's start in order.

Where do any battalion tactical exercises begin? That's right, from arriving at the place of training and setting the task.









The tanks are dispersed in the forest belt and disguised, the personnel, having received the task, began to prepare for its implementation. That is, tanks need to be charged.









Ammunition received, delivered, loaded. All ready. The carousel begins. Naturally, with the command of the battalion commander.



Further, in general, everything is pretty monotonous. A tank flies out of the forest belt, flies into a prepared position at full speed, fires a shot and goes back as fast as possible. The element of surprise is to guess from which position the tank will jump out in the next minute.











It is quite difficult to guess. The dust, roar of engines and the roar of shots are somewhat disorienting. In general, the first three or four cars raised such a cloud of dust that you could not worry about the smoke curtain. Dust reliably hid everything, and in the place of a potential enemy it would be possible to peel only on the areas.

I liked the fact that the crews acted quickly. How about accuracy, it was difficult to say (see above about dust), and the targets were at a distance of about a kilometer.

After all the crews had fired, an intermediate summing up was carried out. Without departing from the scene.



I honestly tried to sneak up and hang my ears, but Comrade Major snarled no worse than a tank gun. Then the exercise was repeated, but the faces of the commanders became really more satisfied.



After a short break, it was the turn of the "Syrian shaft".

The essence of the reception, as they explained to us, lies in firing at stationary objects (artillery and mortar positions, warehouses, etc.) with a tank group from the course and under cover. In Syria, the ramparts were made with the help of construction equipment, from sand it is very easy to do.

The fact is that such a layer of sand not only ensures the secrecy of the actions of tanks, but also makes it very difficult to respond. Tanks are firing through the gaps in the bulk barrier, and do not stand still. The distance between the machines varies from 20 to 100 meters. In addition, the sand - a great barrier to modern laser and infrared guidance systems.











In our case, the shaft was not sandy, but, nevertheless, allowed to work out this element to the extent necessary.



In general, the fact that this not so long ago developed technique is already being mastered in parts is very, very good. This means that the advantages that he gives, and moreover they are run-in in real combat conditions, are significant, since the "Syrian wave" has already gone to the troops.

You can, of course, discuss the feasibility of learning this technique and notice that in our country there are not too many places where there is so much sand. I will say that yes, we have little sand and desert. But our allies in the CSTO have them, and our experience may well (do not bring, of course) be useful.

By the way, Donbass dumps rocks are not inferior to the sand masses of Syria. But it is, by the way.
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  1. kg pv
    kg pv 10 October 2017 07: 33 New
    12
    The last line smiled))) good
    1. Uncle lee
      Uncle lee 10 October 2017 07: 37 New
      14
      Quote: kg pv
      Last line smiled

      And gave a boost of optimism! drinks
      1. ydjin
        ydjin 10 October 2017 09: 15 New
        +1
        Quote: Uncle Lee
        Quote: kg pv
        Last line smiled

        And gave a boost of optimism! drinks

        Restrained optimism. hi
        1. bratchanin3
          bratchanin3 10 October 2017 11: 47 New
          +5
          so what to restrain, you still have to fight the fascists, you can’t leave such an abomination. They do not touch the Baltic states, they (the Nazis) came to Ukraine, and then to Belarus ....
          1. John Doe
            John Doe 10 October 2017 12: 31 New
            +1
            Quote: bratchanin3
            so what to restrain, you still have to fight the fascists, you can’t leave such an abomination. They do not touch the Baltic states, they (the Nazis) came to Ukraine, and then to Belarus ....

            An interesting opinion, of course (a joke), but what gives you the right to call the parliamentary-presidential republic a fascist system?
            Read who the Nazis are, and you will learn a lot of new things about them and about you and me))
            1. d ^ Amir
              d ^ Amir 10 October 2017 12: 42 New
              10
              Unknown!!!
              what gives you the right to call the parliamentary-presidential republic on the fascist system
              the policy of separation (apartheid), carried out by this very republic, for example .... and yes, it has a very indirect relation to fashio B. Mussolini ... well, then it is DIRECT to nationalism, that is, Nazism - !!!!
              1. Fitter65
                Fitter65 11 October 2017 14: 50 New
                +4
                Quote: d ^ Amir
                separation policy pursued by this republic

                Well, you can bring a lot of people under separate accommodation. For example, the female half of the house and the male in many eastern and Arab countries, and even in some European countries. Until the end of the 60s in the USA there was a separation according to skin color. But they are still a flash of democracy . But in the totalitarian Stalinist USSR, all nations, nationalities and nationalities could live wherever they wanted (in the crust-baked Russian Empire for some nations there was also a qualification of settledness, and a qualification for the posts held), but it is the USSR that is considered a prison of peoples, and not a country where until now we remember the signs in public places with the inscription "for colored people" ... Well, or where do the policemen shoot blacks ...
                1. d ^ Amir
                  d ^ Amir 11 October 2017 18: 39 New
                  +5
                  Well, if it fits in your head how the male half can announce to the female half something in the spirit of "and we will hang later" ???? alternative thinking you rolls over ...
            2. bratchanin3
              bratchanin3 12 October 2017 10: 06 New
              0
              Being called and being, these are two big differences. Is Germany from 1936 to 1945 a democracy or fascism? As for fascism, I have been reading about this since 1956. I emphasize the fascists I read since 1956. By the way, I read a lot about American democracy and I am SURE that in the USA, anything, but not democracy. Of course, we can debate if there is a desire.
          2. Klimenko P.A.
            Klimenko P.A. 11 October 2017 10: 46 New
            +3
            Do not offend the Nazis in vain, with all due respect, but the Ukrainian national battalions are not Wehrmacht, but policemen. At least because the Wehrmacht practically did not surrender, it was necessary to try there to take the group. But they can also go to the construction site for summer in the country.
    2. Arthur Evnevich
      Arthur Evnevich 13 October 2017 21: 17 New
      0
      brother............... yes

  2. Lopatov
    Lopatov 10 October 2017 08: 15 New
    +9
    This is all, of course, good, but when deploying a tank on board to the enemy, tankers increase the likelihood of it being hit by a TOU-2V rocket.
    She doesn’t give a damn about all these shafts, she works from above on the span
    1. Blue fox
      Blue fox 10 October 2017 08: 46 New
      +2
      Is logical. In this case, it’s worth training together with chemists who will arrange aerosol curtains and smokes so that the tanks do not spend their kits. By the way, are there any items in the nomenclature of artillery shells in service with us that are equipped with aerosol curtains?
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 10 October 2017 09: 03 New
        +3
        Quote: Blue Fox
        Is logical. In this case, it’s worth training together with chemists who will arrange aerosol curtains and smokes so that the tanks do not spend their kits.

        Then the tankers will not see where to shoot. You can try to put an EM trawl on each tank, it is likely that in this case the laser altimeter and rocket magnetometer will take the shaft as the target

        Quote: Blue Fox
        By the way, are there any items in the nomenclature of artillery shells in service with us that are equipped with aerosol curtains?

        Of course. Everything from 82-mm mortars to 152-mm guns have smoke ammunition as part of their ammunition. For the most part, yellow phosphorus as a smoke-forming substance. That is, they will interfere with thermal imagers
    2. vomag
      vomag 10 October 2017 09: 28 New
      +6
      Quote: Spade
      She doesn’t give a damn about all these shafts, she works from above on the span

      Well, if you do not care, then what difference does the tank go forward back to the left or to the right sideways, etc. ... according to your logic, there is no place for the tank from the word at all ...
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 10 October 2017 09: 40 New
        +7
        By my logic, 6.7 is more than 3.4. Therefore, the probability of a missile flying over a target with a width of 6.7 meters is higher than over a target with a width of 3.4 meters.
      2. mat-vey
        mat-vey 10 October 2017 13: 09 New
        +2
        And if the enemy has no problems with MLRS and helicopters, then what is the effectiveness of these shafts and roundabouts?
  3. Blue fox
    Blue fox 10 October 2017 09: 11 New
    +1
    Quote: Spade
    Everything from 82-mm mortars to 152-mm guns have smoke ammunition as part of their ammunition. For the most part, yellow phosphorus as a smoke-forming substance. That is, they will interfere with thermal imagers

    Thank. He doubted the effectiveness of counteraction to smoke thermal imagers.
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 10 October 2017 09: 16 New
      +2
      Quote: Blue Fox
      Thank. He doubted the effectiveness of counteraction to smoke thermal imagers.

      The smoke is hot. So it will nevertheless create a hindrance. It’s just that not the whole cloud will be opaque to thermal imagers. The smoke cools down pretty quickly.
  4. Monarchist
    Monarchist 10 October 2017 10: 25 New
    +1
    A tank carousel is good in a wooded area, but what about the steppe or desert?
    1. DMB_95
      DMB_95 10 October 2017 10: 41 New
      +1
      Quote: Monarchist
      A tank carousel is good in a wooded area, but what about the steppe or desert?

      Apparently use the relief. Where the steppe or desert is not smooth as a table.
    2. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 10 October 2017 12: 35 New
      +1
      Do not do such nonsense, you will be more whole ...
  5. The comment was deleted.
  6. voyaka uh
    voyaka uh 10 October 2017 12: 34 New
    +3
    In Syria, tanks, firing, do not turn sideways towards the enemy. He jumped to the shaft, fired, rolled back - standard tactics. It's time to learn it. T-sheks have poor reverse gear. Therefore, it is more difficult to do this. Merkava has 5 forward gears and 5 reverse gears. Forward and reverse are equally smooth.
    1. mat-vey
      mat-vey 10 October 2017 13: 12 New
      +1
      Yes, do not care - in Syria, Barmolei do not have "Tornadoes" and "Grad" as well as helicopters ....
    2. Michael newage
      Michael newage 11 October 2017 03: 33 New
      +3
      Lol What "means bad reverse gear." The gear ratio is incorrectly selected, or does the selection / inclusion mechanism work poorly? And about 5 reverse gears, there is even a joke on kosher markovi:
      “What is the difference between a German tank and a French one? A German tank has 5 forward gears, one reverse. And the French one forward gear, five backward laughing . "And the smoothness of walking on the number of gears does not depend on the word NO. The suspension is responsible for this yes .
  7. _Jack_
    _Jack_ 10 October 2017 13: 41 New
    +6
    It’s great that our army is being equipped with - the Baofeng UV-5R walkie-talkie for 1500 rubles, naturally bought for my money, because foreign-made equipment cannot be delivered to the army.
    1. GRF
      GRF 10 October 2017 17: 11 New
      +1
      The Ukrainians won their terminator too, only is it a miracle similar?
      1. _Jack_
        _Jack_ 10 October 2017 19: 46 New
        +2
        I'm doing walkie-talkies, it's a UV-5R in a camouflage case, 1500r. on Ali, and even without this photo I know that warriors buy radios themselves, it’s a shame for our army
        1. missuris
          missuris 10 October 2017 22: 58 New
          +2
          supply less than once every 2 years + soldiers and officers about ***** radaeki, I served in the battalion of communications brigade, and we were in charge of the distribution of wearable and manual radeik. The radars wearable on the back came to us with broken antennas, because the soldiers threw them on duty upside down, as this property is not theirs, but of our platoon. With granites, which are tame even worse, they were lost, as one starley dragged us a couple of granites that had been abandoned from the intelligence, because ours lost. For good, everyone in the army should have safes of normal size, with equipment and weapons with personal responsibility. but I think this is if it will be in 20-30 years)
        2. Michael newage
          Michael newage 11 October 2017 03: 36 New
          +1
          If you pay the RFP, so as not to buy for your money, for your convenience. In the USA, cops often buy weapons for their money if they don’t like what they give out. Maybe ashamed then for the US cops?
          1. _Jack_
            _Jack_ 11 October 2017 20: 09 New
            +1
            I’m ashamed of what professional military people use for communication, and even the battalion commander, it’s cheap consumer goods, kids play, and so this consumer goods works better than the granites that our troops are equipped with, I know by hearsay, I sold and asked warriors myself they have
  8. kunstkammer
    kunstkammer 10 October 2017 13: 48 New
    0
    tank carousel? In the presented movie, is this when the tank, after firing from cover (unmasking itself) rolls out into the open space in the hope of getting an ATGM ???
    "Brilliant idea!
  9. ingenera
    ingenera 10 October 2017 14: 57 New
    +4
    Quote: kunstkammer
    tank carousel? In the presented movie, is this when the tank, after firing from cover (unmasking itself) rolls out into the open space in the hope of getting an ATGM ???
    "Brilliant idea!


    Actually, this is a drawback of this landfill. Maybe the leaders of the shooting, but rather the first ... The idea is. to quickly take a firing position, quickly shoot and quickly change position. All this to coordinate the actions of the crew. We were taught this in the seventies, when no one knew about the "carousel". But then, apparently, the experience of the Patriotic War was not forgotten. This is me, as the tankman says, although old. laughing
  10. A. Privalov
    A. Privalov 10 October 2017 15: 13 New
    +5
    Novelty - prepare shafts to shoot at stationary objects (artillery and mortar positions ...) Is that a joke?
    Back at the start of the 70, the Israelis used equipped firing positions for tanks - the so-called "ramps". They consisted of earth mounds height from the body of the tank and a thickness of about two meters. Behind the ramp was a ramp, along which tanks climbed the embankment to fire at the enemy. Firing back, the tanks slid down and hid behind the embankment. On each ramp there could simultaneously be 3-5 tanks. Upon receipt of the code team, the tanks had to immediately take positions on the ramps and open fire on the enemy.
    The Syrians, at the instigation of the Soviet advisers, stupidly copied this system and themselves drove themselves into a trap - forgetting that the Israeli tank "Shot Kahl" (converted to fit their needs "Centurion") has a much larger range of slopes of the trunk. This is especially critical in the melee on the ramp. If the T-55 traveled to the top of its “ramp,” it simply could not point the barrel at an enemy who is at its foot. Meanwhile, Shot Kahl could shoot the enemy with impunity. The Israeli tank crews knew tactical tricks like this, they were trained both in shooting at short and extreme distances and maneuvering. As a result, taking into account crew training, the survivability and effectiveness of the Israeli “Shot Kahl” on the battlefield was incomparably higher than that of the Soviet and Arab crews.
    1. Lex.
      Lex. 10 October 2017 17: 46 New
      +2
      It’s a good idea to participate in a tank biathlon, because politics hinders
      1. MadCat
        MadCat 11 October 2017 02: 32 New
        +2
        Quote: Lex.
        It’s a good idea to participate in a tank biathlon, because politics hinders

        the benefits of this show are zero, it’s better to spend money on exercises than on this ballet with carousels.
        1. Lex.
          Lex. 12 October 2017 19: 01 New
          +1
          Why is it that zero showed what was worthwhile in the exercises, for example, the Indians had tanks to blame but not them
    2. Michael newage
      Michael newage 11 October 2017 03: 51 New
      +6
      Israel Homeland Elephants laughing . Do you really think that ... "The Syrians, by the instigation of the Soviet advisers stupidly copied this system "... You just wrote like that, as if these Soviet advisers first learned about such tricks from you, but did not fully understand when they shared it, after which the Arabs filled it. I think it is," the corners are vertical crosstalk "(this is what you called the" greater trunk inclination range ") and various types of tank digging, these advisers knew back in 1945 when they stormed Berlin on their tanks. Where you were at that moment, I think I don’t need to explain to me. As for the Arabs at that moment ... nobody and nothing could help them. They managed to surrender without a fight dozens of new 54-ok, the best tanks of the time in the world. And we managed to donate these tanks to them. It’s as if, now, ISIS would have captured a hundred T14. Those are warriors.
      1. A. Privalov
        A. Privalov 11 October 2017 10: 46 New
        +2
        Quote: Michael Newage
        Israel Homeland Elephants laughing . Do you really think that ... "The Syrians, by the instigation of the Soviet advisers stupidly copied this system "... You just wrote like that, as if these Soviet advisers first learned about such tricks from you, but did not fully understand when they shared it, after which the Arabs filled it. I think it is," the corners are vertical crosstalk "(this is what you called the" greater trunk inclination range ") and various types of tank digging, these advisers knew back in 1945 when they stormed Berlin on their tanks. Where you were at that moment, I think I don’t need to explain to me. As for the Arabs at that moment ... nobody and nothing could help them. They managed to surrender without a fight dozens of new 54-ok, the best tanks of the time in the world. And we managed to donate these tanks to them. It’s as if, now, ISIS would have captured a hundred T14. Those are warriors.


        On the individual go here should not be. This is not an argument. stop
        The USSR has always been able to choose their wards. fool
        Since then much water has flowed under the bridge, but the old lesson did not go to work - its receiver again climbs into a sick bed with a healthy head. The Middle East is such a place that getting there is easier than ever, but getting out ... So, I wish you well. hi
        1. Michael newage
          Michael newage 11 October 2017 11: 45 New
          +2
          Quote: A. Privalov
          On the individual go here should not be. This is not an argument. stop


          I agree. That is why, in my arguments, I NEVER turned to personalities. Give me a quote that shows the opposite. The sentence "first learned about such tricks from you". Under you I mean, not you personally, but the Israeli commanders of that time. What else should you be offended by? I don’t know. In truth, as they say ...

          Quote: A. Privalov
          The USSR has always been able to choose their wards. fool

          Your truth. But, it’s better to help such unlucky allies than to be an American mongrel yes .

          Quote: A. Privalov
          Since then much water has flowed under the bridge, but the old lesson did not go to work - its receiver again climbs into a sick bed with a healthy head. The Middle East is such a place that getting there is easier than ever, but getting out ... So, I wish you well.


          That's just the same and went for the future and much more. And so you (maybe not you specifically, well, many) it is so annoying. I wouldn’t go, we would give Syria two hundred T-90 tanks that they would lose. And so a few T-62M, for your fight against terrorists, please do not mind taking it. Similarly, you do not get sick hi .
    3. vlad007
      vlad007 11 October 2017 11: 02 New
      0
      Quote: A. Privalov
      The Israeli Shot Kal tank (the Centurion converted to fit its needs) has a much wider range of barrel tilts.

      Hello Alexander. You did not indicate that this was the Doomsday War - October 1973. At that time, the T-55 was far from being the most modern Soviet tank, even the T-64 was not the most modern then - in the 1973, the troops began to receive the T-72 (development began in the 1967 year). In addition, the angle of inclination of the trunk must be correlated with the distance to the target, you know what I mean.
      1. A. Privalov
        A. Privalov 11 October 2017 11: 33 New
        +1
        Quote: vlad007
        Quote: A. Privalov
        The Israeli Shot Kal tank (the Centurion converted to fit its needs) has a much wider range of barrel tilts.

        Hello Alexander. You did not indicate that this was the Doomsday War - October 1973. At that time, the T-55 was far from being the most modern Soviet tank, even the T-64 was not the most modern then - in the 1973, the troops began to receive the T-72 (development began in the 1967 year). In addition, the angle of inclination of the trunk must be correlated with the distance to the target, you know what I mean.

        We are talking about events a little earlier than the Doomsday War - about the little-known War of attrition. It was then that such positional battles took place. During the Doomsday War, everything was much more dynamic - the Arabs unexpectedly attacked and there was no time for the Israelis to build a ramp. As for the tanks, then they fought with those that were - T-54,55. T-62 - in 1973-m beat hard. Hundreds of whole and damaged captured in the form of trophies and long used after additional alterations. I am preparing a special article about it. (will be ready, I can notify you if you are interested)
        The T-72 will appear on the Middle East theater in a decade through 10. The Syrians in 1982 were trying to drive around Lebanon. Faced once or twice with the same old Shot Kahl. Special success, they say, was not on either side. Merkava T-72 never met. Something like that. hi
        1. nafanal
          nafanal 14 October 2017 07: 40 New
          0
          In general, I met publications about T-72 skirmishes with merkavas. The operation was tearing Mir Galelei. It is described how a Syrian T-72 company, making a night march, came across a column of Israeli tanks, among which there were merkava. The Arabs were not at a loss and fired all ammunition around the column. automatic loaders allowed to do this quickly. They were very discouraged that there was almost no burning equipment. But in the morning they checked. The whole column was smashed to pieces. The merkavas received several holes. And the absence of fires was explained by the fire system. The tanks were equipped with IR sensors. They even worked from a cigarette.
          1. A. Privalov
            A. Privalov 14 October 2017 13: 25 New
            +2
            About that war was written by historians and military experts of all stripes and shades of a lot of books and monographs, each episode is broken down. Archives are open, access is free. Do not listen to stories, dear. Use scientific literature. hi
    4. Stiletto_711
      Stiletto_711 12 October 2017 22: 56 New
      0
      Quote: A. Privalov
      In the early 70s, the Israelis used

      According to anyone else, Moses drove the Jews through the wilderness behind the ramp. The only question is why is this important information posted here? An article about new tactics in the Russian army, we are discussing them accordingly.
      And about the brilliant tactics of Israeli tankers, they are also not very interested, the experience of its application is limited to an extremely small theater of operations, against the same enemy using their own equipment. In the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, it is of little use, but no one plans to conduct tank battles against the IDF.
      Well, and as an advice, about Israel’s great victories over their hands ... tell the Arabs not on this site, but for example to your grandmother, maybe she will be interested.
  11. ingenera
    ingenera 10 October 2017 15: 29 New
    +4
    Quote: A. Privalov
    with Arab crews.

    Keywords! The lack of an elevation / declination angle of the trunk is compensated by the elevation / declination angle of the site from which the shooting is conducted. This Russian artillerymen knew (and used) more in the Russian-Japanese ...
    1. A. Privalov
      A. Privalov 10 October 2017 19: 33 New
      +2
      Quote: ingenera
      Quote: A. Privalov
      with Arab crews.

      Keywords! The lack of an elevation / declination angle of the trunk is compensated by the elevation / declination angle of the site from which the shooting is conducted. This Russian artillerymen knew (and used) more in the Russian-Japanese ...

      With Arab crews, yes, but under the strict guidance of Soviet military specialists in Syria. The T-55 are moving back badly, and they are moving back upwards, neither.
  12. Radikal
    Radikal 10 October 2017 19: 32 New
    +1
    You can, of course, speculate on the advisability of teaching this technique and notice that in our country there are not so many places where there is so much sand.
    In addition, such tactics are only good against an adversary who does not have powerful artillery and aviation. laughing
  13. Glory1974
    Glory1974 10 October 2017 21: 17 New
    +1
    In general, the fact that this not so long ago developed technique is already being mastered in parts is very, very good. This means that the advantages that he gives, and moreover they are run-in in real combat conditions, are significant, since the "Syrian wave" has already gone to the troops.

    All these techniques have been worked out in the Second World War. It’s just safely forgotten, like so much more. But as they say, better late than never. Let the guys train, it won’t be worse.
    At the end of the 80-ies on exercises with live firing from the enclosed barrel, the company commander gave out additional ammunition to the tankers. Just in case, for reliability. After a training attack on an enemy stronghold, inspectors in the shields counted more holes than were officially issued. There was of course a scandal, but it was good that tankers were shooting with a high level of accuracy.
  14. Mih1974
    Mih1974 10 October 2017 21: 38 New
    +1
    Let them learn better not to roll out equipment closer than 5 km to the front line "chat". It was enough to watch how the “barmalei” were burning our equipment (albeit donated) due to the fact that the crews came to the front line and stood in the “burn I do not want” field. negative
  15. igorspb
    igorspb 10 October 2017 21: 59 New
    0
    Summing up is fun? We have such small companies?)))))
    1. alexxxz
      alexxxz 11 October 2017 10: 25 New
      0
      And what is wrong? Nine headsets and one cotton field cap. And how much should you think? The battalion commander (or maybe the company commander) gathered 9 company tank commanders (including platoon commanders) and "summarizes." So in a tank company there are 10 tanks, including a company’s tank ... In general, yes, tank troops are perhaps the smallest in terms of personnel.
  16. ingenera
    ingenera 11 October 2017 13: 22 New
    +1
    Quote: A. Privalov
    The T-55 backs off badly, and even backs up - no

    I drove a T-55 and you're wrong. From the tank trench in the back only fly out, and if you take the levers in the first position, gazanut. and drop them then simply jump out. Yes, and in the shelter you can call back with the "gun back". and leave before. Nobody has yet canceled the soldier’s ingenuity. The T-55 generally was a cool tank, - a simple reliable and reliable, and in some places even now they are still running.
    1. Michael newage
      Michael newage 11 October 2017 13: 55 New
      +1
      Well, what do you break off a person’s entire Laf? Well, he wants 54-55 and UVN to have bad mobility ... and you told him the truth and now he’s so upset laughing .
  17. Mobik
    Mobik 12 October 2017 17: 55 New
    +1
    Wot, a map of Kharkov in the corner ... a great place for the Syrian rampart ...
  18. tracer
    tracer 16 October 2017 04: 30 New
    0
    They have modern rockets have long been accustomed to beat them on top of these shafts ... to the lamp one place or nails ..
    1. Vard
      Vard 16 October 2017 14: 56 New
      0
      Before launching, any missile must capture the target ... and if it didn’t see it ... then what’s the conversation about ... this is because the tanks are hiding now ...
  19. Protos
    Protos 6 November 2017 17: 50 New
    0
    Quote: bratchanin3

    An interesting opinion, of course (a joke), but what gives you the right to call the parliamentary-presidential republic a fascist system?
    Read who the Nazis are, and you will learn a lot of new things about them and about you and me))

    The direction of foreign policy, ethnic cleansing, violation of the rights of “non-citizens” will allow boldly equating the Baltic countries with Italy of the Benito Mussolini model soldier