The struggle of General Electric (USA) and Siemens (Germany) for the Russian market

Received its development story with attempts to squeeze out the German company Siemens from the Russian market. As you know, representatives of Siemens were accused by the European Commission of violating the sanctions package against Russia. The reason for the steel supply gas Siemens turbines through a third company in the Crimea - for power plants under construction. Earlier, the Military Review has already reported that American companies may be behind attempts to squeeze a German manufacturer from the Russian market.

This week the information actually found its confirmation. It became known about the readiness of the American corporation GE (General Electric) to significantly expand its presence in the Russian market. In particular, there is evidence that General Electric plans to localize the production of power grid equipment in St. Petersburg.

Today, the corporation is represented far not only in the northern capital, but also in such cities as Moscow, Aksai, Kaluga, Kazan, Yekaterinburg, Rybinsk, Penza, Krasnodar, Vladivostok, Yuzhno-Sakhalinsk, etc. The management of the American General Electric perfectly understands that against the background of the scandal with Siemens, which is a direct competitor, it is possible to achieve even greater expansion of its presence in the Russian Federation.

Back in 2016, GE announced a partnership with Russian companies for a total of 1 billion to 2020. As you can see, GE does not pay any attention to any sanctions. The corporation, in particular, decided to invest in the creation of a joint venture in the Yaroslavl region - Russian Gas Turbines. And, it is believed that even if these gas turbines end up in the Crimea, then this will have no effect on GE activities in Russia.

Will German Siemens surrender without a fight with an American corporation for the Russian market?

For reference from the press service GE:
In Russia, GE has been working since the beginning of the 1920s, when large-scale electrification began in the country. Today, GE, in partnership with major Russian companies, is involved in solving key infrastructure problems in the energy, oil and gas, transport engineering and healthcare sectors. More than 1500 GE employees work in Russia and the CIS, the company's regional headquarters is in Moscow.

Comments

[Herculesic]

Here is one of them who will formally decide to put turbines in Crimea, and work with those! !!

[oleg-gr]

Big profits are at stake. For the sake of this, you can drive competitors under the baseboard. Moreover, their politicians are not against it.

[Herculesic]

One fig, let them officially announce the supply of turbines to the Russian Crimea, otherwise we will turn to the Chinese, or worse, we’ll make the turbines ourselves ! According to ancient technology, using an ax, and without a single nail! !!!

[Ivan Ivanov]

Better to work with those who are ready for technology transfer. Although it is difficult to expect Chinese wisdom from our effective managers

[seti]

It is long and expensive to make it ourselves. And there are no necessary technologies. You can if you wish, but still probably not worth it - well, you can’t make everything and everything in one country and at the world level of development ... Even the USA cannot afford it. The market of heavy turbines is quite specific .. It is much easier to continue to do together with those and others. And it is advisable to pit them between each other and further. According to our laws, a turbine made in the Russian Federation is a Russian product. And in the Russian Federation it is possible to work only according to Russian laws and others need to be laid down with a device so that we are not told in the Higher and Highest Courts of America and Europe ..

[Pravodel]

Misconception. In Russia there are and have been technologies for manufacturing gas turbines. Another thing is that in the dashing 90s, Chubais and the company did everything to cut this production in Russia. So it turned out that all the turbine factories now belong to Siemens. Those plants that Siemens could not or did not want to buy were simply destroyed.
Now Russia continues to rake the achievements of traitors-reformers. The only question is whether Russia will be able to do this in a short time to prevent the next victorious invasion of legions of advanced geyropa and friends of mattresses on Russia and give a crushing answer to this invasion.

"People-State-Fatherland" is the slogan of every Russian patriot. A united people in unity with a strong state creates the basis for the development of our Fatherland.

[Arikkhab]

http://geoenergetics.ru/2017/07/24/anatomiya-prob
lem-vokrug-siemens /

[Nikolai Grek]

Quote: The Truth

Misconception. In Russia there are and have been technologies for manufacturing gas turbines. Another thing is that in the dashing 90s, Chubais and the company did everything to cut this production in Russia. So it turned out that all the turbine factories now belong to Siemens. Those plants that Siemens could not or did not want to buy were simply destroyed.
Now Russia continues to rake the achievements of traitors-reformers. The only question is whether Russia will be able to do this in a short time to prevent the next victorious invasion of legions of advanced geyropa and friends of mattresses on Russia and give a crushing answer to this invasion.

"People-State-Fatherland" is the slogan of every Russian patriot. A united people in unity with a strong state creates the basis for the development of our Fatherland.

will be able !!

“The modernized engine is completing an engineering test at the Ivanovo State District Power Plant and with the GTD-110M index it will undergo a lengthy test with the end, probably until May 2018. This is the first large-power machine in Russia to replace the engines that were supplied to us by Siemens and General Electric,” said Deputy General Director - Managing Director of PJSC UEC-Saturn Victor Polyakov.

[basmach]

Precisely. About 25 years ago there were the same "wise men", Gaidar and Chubais. They also shouted like that, we won’t buy anything we don’t do, but why do we need oil and gas.
In general, it’s very significant - foreigners are fighting for our market, and our “developed” industry has evolved to a level of light bulb production over a quarter of a century, but we forgot how to make turbines. Excellent result.

[Megamarcel]

By the way, this also applies to ship turbines. After all, the essence is one. Why not produce dual, or even triple, turbines in one enterprise. For civil, military courts and generation.

[Pirogov]

Quote: MegaMarcel

By the way, this also applies to ship turbines. After all, the essence is one. Why not produce dual, or even triple, turbines in one enterprise. For civil, military courts and generation.

Apparently not everything is so simple.

[SergeBS]

Quote: MegaMarcel

Why not produce dual, or even triple, turbines in one enterprise. For civil, military courts and generation.

Will not work. Since the turbine at the hydroelectric power station should work for decades, it takes several years in the gas meter sensor, and half an hour on the dashboard. For instance. Different periods of operation - different materials, strength stocks, etc. ALL DIFFERENT! General only the principle of work.

[Nikolai Grek]

Quote: basmach

and our "developed" industry for a quarter of a century has developed to the level of production of bulbs, but turbines have forgotten how to do it

I advise you not to draw info from dubious sources !!

[gridasov]

It is difficult and expensive to make a turbine with a modern level of knowledge. But it is possible to create turbines simpler but more efficient, which have a fundamentally different design and physical processes in which are qualitatively different.
All talk too much about innovative developments that are fundamental and open up long-term prospects. So you need to listen and consider such developments with full scientific validity. Then Russia can become a country that owns priority technologies for a long period of time. Since new turbines have a fundamentally different concept of their work, it changes all types of turbines in all areas of application where screws are now used. propellers, impellers and actually all types of turbines.

[Alex_Rarog]

Well, you exaggerate too much and I think that you don’t quite understand. I especially liked the simpler and more efficient way) and the new principles also went off with a bang ...

[gridasov]

You have a lot of superfluous arguments that have no direct connection with what I am talking about. I repeat once again that for me there are no authorities, which means that I simply work with objective information, while the vast majority are not capable of this. This means that, firstly, to analyze the processes that determine all levels of interactions medium flow in its dynamic state with outflow surfaces, completely different methods should be used. Yes, we can carry out mathematical calculations of individual details, but all the energetics of the process and physical phenomena in their algorithmic development and transformations must be analyzed as complex large mathematical data. Secondly. Speaking of simplicity, I mean, first of all, that a complex of those processes. which occur in a modern turbine and which are not subjected to exhaustive analysis, is replaced by a complex of completely new organized algorithmic processes, as stages, of transformation of these processes. Of course, the basis of the new concept is somewhat more complicated, but it allows you to surpass all those boundary levels and dimensions in radius and performance, after which the turbine either "locks" or it simply collapses.
What is efficiency? Efficiency is the ability of the device with smaller radial dimension parameters to provide higher flow rate. At the same time, without prejudice to the quality factor of the device, and most importantly, without the need for an increase in the pressure flow at the entrance to it or an increase in fuel consumption for its operation, for example, as in aircraft turbines. This means that the turbine as a device can combine a “reactor”, both the possibility of transforming the potential energy of the substance of the passing stream, and the turbine itself converting the flow energy at the moment of rotation on the rotor shaft, but also an alternating magnetic flux generator. And this complexity of capabilities in one device is determined by what I call an efficient and optimal process in my organization that is provided by a new device. Therefore, I may not be normal, but only that I can distinguish between the real and the far-fetched and unjustified. Believe me. that it’s harder now to find a person with a sober and uncomplexed mind than psychos fanatics or dogmatists conservatives. But the main problem is. that people are not able to control the MEASURE of where and when to preserve conservative ideas and where and when to look for new solutions. . We say understanding not only that. which is discussed on the subject of the essence of the device itself, but also understanding the totality of processes and technological, but also political and military, scientific and educational, which will entail new scientific approaches and the very invention of a new design.

[r4space]

I fully support back in the 80s invented membrane turbines with unrealistic efficiency up to 96% (I read science and life in the journal)

[Msta]

It is expensive to buy everything abroad and it is dangerous. It’s best to do both the Czech Republic and Spain, which have purchased technology from Volkswagen and produced the same Volkswagen under their Skoda and Seat brands, at the hands of their workers and in their own factories, which have a full production cycle and are not dependent on any sanctions.

[Nikolai Grek]

Quote: Herkulesich

One fig, let them officially announce the supply of turbines to the Russian Crimea, otherwise we will turn to the Chinese, or worse, we’ll make the turbines ourselves ! According to ancient technology, using an ax, and without a single nail! !!!

in principle, testing our turbine is in full swing !!!

“The modernized engine is completing an engineering test at the Ivanovo State District Power Plant and with the GTD-110M index it will undergo a lengthy test with the end, probably until May 2018. This is the first large-power machine in Russia to replace the engines that were supplied to us by Siemens and General Electric,” said Deputy General Director - Managing Director of PJSC UEC-Saturn Victor Polyakov.

https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/97518

[soroKING]

yeah ... like "get away from the stall! you’ll get the alarm"

[win]

Big profits are at stake

Power is money
and patriotism for the people ...

[DEPARTMENT]

The struggle is not for life, but for the death of Western companies for markets in Russia, this is certainly great! But I hope our nevertheless such developments should be! And then again we’ll relax and the BACH of sanction .. Everything should be “from needles to orbital stations” Only in this way Russia will survive among these sharks

[210ox]

Come on! The turbines are already delivered .. But as for the medical equipment (tomographs, X-ray machines and the like), you need to look

Quote: Herkulesich

Here is one of them who will formally decide to put turbines in Crimea, and work with those! !!

[Mih1974]

It is necessary to "look" at officials more closely with the same tomographs there was an unpleasant story (overpaid for not the best 10 or so times) and there were reports about the development and start of production of some of the tomographs (or MRI) in Russia.
And the one who blurted out stupidity "you can’t do everything in one country" - let him look at China. Here is who, not only in terms of volume (cost) of all the rest, has surpassed everyone, but also in terms of payroll, he is soon devoting the entire planet.

[siberalt]

Until Chubais is imprisoned, nothing will change in the country.

[win]

And Kvachkov is still sitting.
So Chubais will not be imprisoned ...
And Serdyukov and Vasilyeva will not be imprisoned ...

[Msta]

I don’t think that anyone will officially go for it today. But Russia needs to work with those who agree to transfer to Russia the entire production and technology cycle, and then these turbines can be delivered anywhere in the Russian Federation, already under our brand.

[g1v2]

There are already turbines for Crimea. PM is not an indicator. In general, the general electric is really rushing to our market. For example, all network stores are littered with their bulbs. This has never happened before. But siemens are not just turbines. This is a lot to fill any equipment. For example, the same controllers. I encounter a wide variety of imported equipment all the time, and so in almost any equipment - at least something is Siemens. Mostly controllers. And this area of ​​import must be replaced. The filling of modern industrial equipment in terms of electronics is essentially a designer, where the desired configuration is typed from standard elements. And it is precisely these elements that Simens do. That is, the robot or equipment can be Japanese, German or Finnish, but the electronics inside the box are most often Siemens, or, for example, Mitsubishi.
What you need is emphasis on your production of these bricks, which make up the stuffing of any equipment - controllers, chastotniks, relays, all kinds of sensors, thermal controllers, etc.

[Mikhail Zubkov]

Our defense industry complex produces controllers, and any foreign ones are faster in terms of speed. Turbines have also been manufactured and are manufactured for a long time, incl. energy special power for nuclear power plants. We almost figured out the quality of the blades, and this is the very core of the problem. While there is no seriality on the grains, it was mined only by world brands of the USA and Germany. In a year or two, we’ll pick up this hitch. If they deal with Medvedev’s “market” brake. Power engineering spread rot in the bud to please the Germans.

[Maz]

This is a turn in the case of Simmens! Ah yes the general electric!

[KCA]

So it seems like here, there was information in VO that German journalists in a picture from the Crimea next to Siemens turbines saw GE turbines

[svp67]

Quote: Herkulesich

Here is one of them who will formally decide to put turbines in Crimea, and work with those! !!

The turbines are already there. Here the question is already about other orders. Over the next five years, we need about 60 turbines ... The jackpot is more than fat. And I would very much like that it went to our companies, and to foreigners.

[Nikolai Grek]

Quote: Herkulesich

Here is one of them who will formally decide to put turbines in Crimea, and work with those! !!

[Pereira]

I bet on the Americans.
Although the recent refusal to ship products to Northern Gabon is a good move by Siemens.

[Herculesic]

Pereira and I lie on the Americans they are tired already, worse than the bitter radish

[Pereira]

It’s as if I, too, betray them an air phak across the ocean, but it’s not very similar to them. It’s fun to watch him ride around Russia, declaring it to be his enemy before this.

[svp67]

Quote: Pereira

I bet on the Americans.
Although the recent refusal to ship products to Northern Gabon is a good move by Siemens.

And I'm on the Japanese ....

[Amurets]

Quote: Pereira

Although the recent refusal to ship products to Northern Gabon is a good move by Siemens.

So Ukraine seems to have been thrown. Representatives of Siemens refused to supply equipment for the modernization of the gas transmission system (GTS) of Ukraine. According to the head of the board of NAK Naftogaz Ukrainy Andriy Kobolev, this happened due to the reluctance of the German manufacturer to lose an order in Russia.
He stated this, speaking at the forum Yalta European Strategy, reports "European truth."
https://strana.ua/news/92971-siemens-otkazalsja-o
t-postavok-oborudovanija-dlja-hts-ukrainy-iz-za-n
ezhelanija-poterjat-rossijskij-rynok.html

[Will]

As always - "What is permitted to Jupiter is not allowed to the bull." But who and when decides who is who?

[Abigor]

It is always decided by the laws of the jungle - who is stronger ...

[Nyrobsky]

Quote: Will

As always - "What is permitted to Jupiter is not allowed to the bull." But who and when decides who is who?

It will be decided by those who will curtail the activities of the European Commission, which is 100% managed from the United States in the interests of developing the European market, in the field of energy, and in migration issues.

[Lelek]

Quote: Will

"What is permitted to Jupiter is not permitted to the bull."

Hey. "Business and only business." And the Russian market is large and very tasty, so it’s not up to politics. Let them fight for our market, and we need to set two conditions - the lowest price and the highest quality (well, plus technology, of course).

[32363]

Siemens interrupted the supply of equipment to Ukraine so as not to lose the Russian market

More details: http://www.newsru.com/world/16sep2017/siemens.htm
l

[Mountain shooter]

Large-capacity combined cycle plants are the future of Russian thermal power plants. A fight has already begun for the Russian market, and here all the means are good.
Only ours do not sleep. Slowly they are squeezing this market from the bottom, supplying small and medium power plants. And in this matter, we have good “progress”. Decentralization of electric generation - complicates the management of the power grid, but small towns and villages need to be heated. And if there is a gas pipeline ...

[weksha50]

Quote: Mountain Shooter

Decentralization of electrical generation - complicates the management of the power grid,

I agree with you ... BUT !!! At the same time, it does not make it possible for each redhead to fall apart at one moment to unite a single energy system ...

[aszzz888]

It became known about the readiness of the American corporation GE (General Electric) to significantly expand its presence in the Russian market.

... continue to "tear the Russian economy to shreds" ...

[SPACE]

that's for sure, Siemans and General Electric are ready to tear each other's throats, for the torn apart Russian economy. As V.I. Lenin said, "The bourgeois themselves will sell the rope on which we will hang them later."
But the "ediot patriots" vseravno continue to prepare for the land

[Machete]

Whoever doubts, the mericatos will immediately rush to occupy a niche.
For this, everything was started.

[weksha50]

"Will German Siemens surrender without a fight with an American corporation for the Russian market?"...

Where will it go? Too different weight categories ...
One more extra proof that powerful corporate capital didn’t spit on all sorts of presidents and government-senate-congresses ...
However ... The question of choosing "partners" still remains with Russia ... What is not the lever of pressure on Germany, which is nevertheless closer to US in mentality than the United States ???

[keeper03]

To impose sanctions on GE and to expel from Russia !!!

[Thunderbolt]

Forgive us Germans, but the Americans are ordering them to buy --- that's how it turns out.

[Megamarcel]

Well, Trump promised American business orders. That's the promise. The process has begun.

[Popovich]

Here is an example of double shit democracy (Democracy is a slave system. Slavery through Money.)
such as similar to their turbines in the Crimea put-ah-yay in court ... They sent them ... we will buy from others!
so again, ah, don’t give us, we will give you discounts and we will provide a service ...

[Jurkovs]

The Americans have already taught us the basics of a market economy. Now it's Germany's turn.

[Megamarcel]

Is it expensive to release your own? And turbines for the fleet? They are not needed? The principle is the same. Thus, profitability will increase and efficiency.

[Monster_Fat]

Well, as if 2016 were not 2017 at all, so much “water has flowed” in terms of sanctions during this time. Well, and as if the "electric grid" equipment is not at all that it is "energy-producing". The law on "eternal sanctions" against Russia has virtually destroyed all current and future contacts of American companies with Russian companies - no one in the US will have a good sense of risking their reputation, even for the sake of good profit, and in addition, exposing their business to various checks that are now provided for , virtually any contract with Russian companies. I would generally say that kirdyk came to American business in Russia ... everything, besides playing games on the stock exchange with futures ...

[vovanpain]

Quote: Monster_Fat

The law on "eternal sanctions" against Russia has virtually destroyed all current and future contacts of American companies with Russian companies - no one in the US with their right mind would risk their reputation,

Yes Yes Colleague It’s time for them to expel the Mazurics from Rybinsk and you see, the plant was built here, the monsters did not give a damn about their reputation riveting their turbines with us you see The Eternal Sanctions Act is violated by mazuriks, while Monster Fat’s colleague

Quote: Monster_Fat

I would generally say that kirdyk came to American business in Russia ...

Damn sure to give them, the poor fellow do not know that they kirdyk In Kaluga, too, they don’t know what kind of nonsense they are being driven home, but they don’t want to. Burn further colleague

[Monster_Fat]

Do you know how to read? And if you know how to read, then you know how to understand what you read? In my post it is clearly written that from 2017 everything will be different. It is from 2017. Congress passed a law on “eternal” and severe sanctions against Russia in almost all areas of heavy industry, mining, machine tool construction and banking. Your notorious "factory in Rybinsk" when built? What is his form of ownership? Who does he belong to?

[vovanpain]

Quote: Monster_Fat

Your notorious "factory in Rybinsk" when built?

First respected in Rybinsk, for the illiterate, the names of cities are written with a capital letter. Secondly, the year 2017 will end soon and the Americans will not gather together, despite all the wet Russophobian dreams and laws on eternal sanctions, the plant has been operating for the third year and is not experiencing any problems, and you dream further respected.

[Monster_Fat]

Once again, "who is the owner of the enterprise"? Americans? The name of the company (legal entity) and its owner, please. And by the way, what are the products of the plant. Only then will there be substantive conversation. And so, this is not an argumented argument, it is only a “patriotic” run over on your part.

[vovanpain]

Quote: Monster_Fat

Once again, "who is the owner of the enterprise"? Americans? The name of the company (legal entity) and its owner, please. And by the way, what are the products of the plant.

Avona how Do not give the director’s phone? A joint venture of the American corporation General Electric (GE) and the Rostec state corporation and the Inter RAO group. And I don’t know who owns what shares, look for it and find it true. produces gas turbine units 6F.03 (6FA) with a capacity of 80 MW and provides their service. Satisfied, but what a patriot to be so bad? Oh well.

[Monster_Fat]

Ha. Well, this "enterprise" (actually a screwdriver assembly) was opened in 2014. And in 2017, I think GE will revise its cooperation plans in accordance with the new sanctions realities and in the light of the scandal with Siemens.

[XXXIII]

What can I add, let their interests in Russia decide in a market way !!!

Siemens LLC - 1851 Supply of 75 switch telegraph apparatus for the Moscow-St. Petersburg line under construction.

GE has been working in Russia since the early 1920s

[polev66]

in Rybinsk, soon there will be no place for plants near Saturn

[Berkut24]

It is necessary to arrange a competition on the subject "from whom there are less sanctions." And spend it once every half a year.

[Altona]

Quote: seti

It is long and expensive to make it ourselves. And there are no necessary technologies. You can if you wish, but still probably not worth it - well, you can’t make everything and everything in one country and at the world level of development ..

-----------------------------
Oddly enough, there are specialists, and people from Ukraine also want to catch up. And iron is just iron. It would be a desire, our people will master and do.

[Galleon]

Quote: seti

Making it yourself is long and expensive.

But vital!

[Topotun]

The big game continues. Europeans are squeezed out of the Russian market. And for some reason, none of the EU leadership is touching that they lose much more than they get. Masochists straight. Although in my opinion the Germans are much more reliable and better. But, the doctor said to the morgue .....

[Egorovich]

Let each other squabble over the Russian market. The more rodents, the better for us. We need to develop our own production of gas-turbine equipment, but we also need to support the West with their technologies and full production in the Russian Federation.

[pafegosoff]

And where, for example, Siemens will go against Edison Electric Light. The influence of the latter is greater, the effectiveness is stronger. And, it seems, the last turbine scandal happened not without the participation of a competitor who wants to build a fully localized plant in Yaroslavl, in spite of Simensky in St. Petersburg ... In general, the Americans will crush their European competitors with sanctions.

[not main]

Quote: Msta

It is expensive to buy everything abroad and it is dangerous. It’s best to do both the Czech Republic and Spain, which have purchased technology from Volkswagen and produced the same Volkswagen under their Skoda and Seat brands, at the hands of their workers and in their own factories, which have a full production cycle and are not dependent on any sanctions.

Actually, this WV bought Skoda and Seat! And they’re not going to share technologies! It's just that production is cheaper than in Germany and as they say "nothing personal"!

[exo]

As for turbines for this purpose, I will not say. But, GE aircraft engines do very good.

[MadCat]

Fake news, none of these firms will deliver anything to Russia. Losing the US market is much more painful for them ...

[LeonidL]

Business is business and ... nothing personal, because money doesn’t smell, is it?

[l7yzo]

The good news is that the consumer will only win. Those. ordinary people will save a lot of money. New technologies will come (because you have to lure something). And from the East, Japan is pushing them with green technology. Well, the mass crushes China)

[Arikkhab]

from the Internet - a cool article
http://geoenergetics.ru/2017/07/24/anatomiya-prob
lem-vokrug-siemens /

[Hadji Murat]

read the info about both companies, Siemens wasn’t even close by turnover, volume of production and influence in the world with General Electric, that the bull is not allowed, the Jupiter is allowed Quod licet Jovi, pop licet bovi

[ver_]

Quote: Herkulesich

Here is one of them who will formally decide to put turbines in Crimea, and work with those! !!

... you have to do your own ..

[Dzafdet]

Quote: Msta

It is expensive to buy everything abroad and it is dangerous. It’s best to do both the Czech Republic and Spain, which have purchased technology from Volkswagen and produced the same Volkswagen under their Skoda and Seat brands, at the hands of their workers and in their own factories, which have a full production cycle and are not dependent on any sanctions.

So they sold you the technology. Vaughn Pu tried to buy Opel, so immediately ran mattress covers: they say no way! And Opel is a lower class car in Germany ... We must do what we did with the car market: say. that if you don’t open the joint venture before 2020, then u. the violin is over! and let the Germans, Japanese and mattresses run here to race to open enterprises.

[Vadim Sh.]

So everything falls into place - ambition is one thing, and money is another.

[vlad7777kul]

"A holy place is never empty"