Soviet economics and quality - why does our market succumb to them?

138
Soviet economics and quality - why does our market succumb to them?


Among the myths spread by anti-Soviet myths about the horrors and decadence of the Soviet Union, a special place is occupied by the stories that the USSR did not produce quality products. Allegedly, they used Soviet goods and products only because there were no others, and it was enough to appear imported - all the Soviet people stopped buying and producing.



I will not go into the opposite direction and argue that all Soviet products were good, but there were quality goods and products. And they were not so few.

1. Food

Boiled sausage, milk sausages, ice cream, bread, cheese, butter and much more, including candy and chocolate. All this was of high quality, because sausages and sausages were made from meat, cheese and butter from milk, bread from high-quality flour, and chocolate from cocoa.
Today, manufacturers, trying to reduce costs, go to different tricks, as a result of the output are solid surrogates.

Sausage can not only relieve soy, but also made from imported frozen meat, which sailed from some of Argentina.
Palm oil, which began to be used after the introduction of sanctions on European agricultural products - is generally harmful to health. And it is now used everywhere.

Bread in the USSR was of high quality, because the flour was not made up with anything and used the best types of flour. Today, the most qualitative grain of Russia is exported, and bread is baked from low-grade flour, and yes even with improvers.

And Soviet chocolate was of high quality, because cocoa was not saved. The countries of Latin America, to whom the USSR supplied equipment and armaments, were paying off cocoa supplies with the Union.

The mass of products manufactured today is styled as Soviet - precisely because high-quality Soviet products remain in people's memory.

And I gave an example with food, because they occupy a central place in the consumption system. Most people spend half their income on food. And we used to eat every day, three times. Quality food is not only taste and good mood, but also health - the most important component of quality life.
However, not only food products in the USSR were of high quality.

2. Soviet cinema

I have already written about this more than once: Soviet cinema successfully competes with modern, and we continue to watch good old films - comedies, tragedies, films about war. The list of Soviet films that are still shown on television can be compiled into several pages.

And why does TV continue to play Soviet films? Yes, because they are watched - and more willingly than modern film production. This is a quality indicator.

It may be objected that cinema is not exactly a commodity.

Product! A very good product! Even this term is - film production.

If the cinema were not a product, money would not be invested in its production, but they would be invested. And in the US, film production is a very important source of income.

Separate conversation deserve cartoons, which are not just a spectacle for children, but also perform an educational function, which is also very important for improving the quality of life.

If a person is not well educated and educated from early childhood, then he himself will not live a quality life, and will not let others - will turn into a drug addict and an antisocial element, poisoning the lives of others.

But the list of high-quality Soviet products does not end there.

3. Education

Some will say that I cheat and education is definitely not a product.

Product! Very much a product! Do not believe - ask any certified manager or economist. Any trainings, courses, seminars - educational products. Higher education, vocational and secondary education is also a comprehensive educational product.

The quality of life depends on the quality of education, because those who have received a good education have more opportunities to find a good job and receive a higher salary.

And the quality of Soviet education was very high - this was recognized even in the USA. Diplomas of Soviet universities were accepted in the United States and Europe without retake exams. And President Kennedy openly declared that the Soviet Union had won the space race at the school desk.

So: bread, cinema and education went over - is there anything else? There is!

4. Books and magazines

Books and magazines, depending on the subject, perform both educational and entertaining functions. But at the same time they stand somewhat apart.

This class of products includes Soviet textbooks, which are still used in many universities.

Soviet literature has been translated into other languages ​​and is published abroad. Therefore, Soviet books are not just products for internal use, but also export goods, and one of the most successful ones.

If Soviet bread is in the past, and Soviet cinema is watched mainly in the post-Soviet space, books and textbooks of Soviet authors are still published in different countries.

And not only Soviet books and textbooks were of high quality content, but also magazines. Or do you want to say that "Technology - Youth" and "Science and Life" were of poor quality? How many more interesting magazines are published today, even network ones?

However, we proceed to the next product.

5. Football, hockey and other sports

You say that this is not a product?

If football is not a product, then why has PSG paid Barcelona 220 million dollars for the transfer to Nani?

These are products too! And not just products, but superfoods that are sold in several forms at once - in the form of tickets, broadcast rights, advertising in stadiums, T-shirts, scarves and other symbols, as well as in the form of transfers, one of which I mentioned.
True, there was no transfer market in the USSR, but stadium tickets were sold. And on TV, football with hockey was shown - albeit free of charge, but this does not negate the fact that the broadcast was the same product as the movie - a media product.

At the same time, a high level of Soviet sports again influenced the quality of life. First of all, like any high-quality media product, sports broadcasts raised the spirits and promoted rest. Secondly, the sporting success of clubs and teams attracted children and young people to sports, and this is health and a decrease in the level of crime, which again affects the quality of life.

Was the Soviet sport quality? Of course. And not only hockey. Even football in the USSR was much better than today. The highest achievements of the national football team fall on the Soviet time - a victory at the Olympics 1956 of the year and the European Championships of 1960 of the year.

In Soviet times, we have to play our famous goalkeeper Lev Yashin - the only goalkeeper in stories football, received the Golden Ball.

And it turned out so interesting - there was less money in Soviet football and hockey than today, there was no transfer market at all, and the quality of the output product was higher. However, the exact same story with books and cinema - Soviet writers and directors received less than Fyodor Bondarchuk and Daria Dontsova, but they shot and wrote better.

Someone will say that everything is clear about Soviet cinema and education, nobody argues with their quality, as well as the quality of Soviet bread, hockey and chocolate.

But there were no other quality products - televisions, tape recorders, iPhones and iPads, clothes and shoes, cars, decoration materials, etc.

But is it? Maybe it was you who hurried to forget them, yielding to the popular point of view that the Soviet technology was never competitive?

I will give examples.

1. Cars

The Soviet car industry is considered to be almost the most striking example of the lag of Soviet civil engineering from the foreign one. Here Mercedes is yes, and Zhiguli is a bucket with bolts.

However, many people forget that the Soviet auto industry is not only a Lada. There was such a car as Victory, which was not inferior to its foreign contemporaries, and even surpassed them in some characteristics.

The Moskvich car in the 60 and 70 years was also considered very worthy. It even held a rally.
And the Lada themselves at the time of its appearance were quite a modern car. It's no secret that the first-model Zhiguli is the Fiat 124, which the USSR bought from the Italians. But the VAZ was not an exact copy of Fiat, but its modernization, which, according to many experts, was very successful. On road performance, the VAZ 2101 was superior to the Fiat 124, it had a reinforced suspension and increased ground clearance - this was done to improve the permeability that is important for operation in the Russian conditions.

Thus, the owners of the first Zhiguli became the owners of not just a modern European car, but its improved version.

In addition, there was still such a car as the NIWA - also not bad for its time, in fact the Soviet SUV. Some appreciate this car to this day, and at the time of the appearance of the NIWA, the more enjoyed success.

And about the nine, too, do not forget - after the release of this car quickly gained popularity and was in demand even after the collapse of the USSR. In Ukraine, it was assembled from vehicle sets up to the 2011 year. And it is in a market economy!

Kamaz, on which post-Soviet Russia has repeatedly won Dakar (14 times!), Competing with Mercedes (5 wins), Iveco and other Tatras - this is a Soviet development. Of course, modernized KAMAZ vehicles participate in the rally, but the foundation itself and the plant itself were built in the USSR.
However, not a single auto industry ...

2. Cameras, watches, aircraft

The most famous series of Soviet cameras is FED. The fact that these were high-quality devices, will confirm any experienced photographer who shot on film.

Yes, the FED is a copy of the German Leica II apparatus. But the copy was only the first FED, which was produced from 1934 to 1955 year, and after that modifications and completely new models were produced (FED-2 and FED-3).

Today Rolex, Tissot and other Sweats are well known to everyone, but in the Soviet Union they also produced high-quality watches. I will not undertake to compare now the watches of the Soviet factories with the Swiss ones, but the fact that Soviet citizens were provided with watches and these watches showed the correct time is a fact.

The quality of the aircraft is not only the comfort of passengers in the flight, but also safety. And the price of the ticket, which is important.

I can notice that the Tu series aircraft were distinguished by a high accident rate and cannot be counted among the high-quality equipment. However, Tu was not the only ruler, there were two more rulers - Il and An.

IL-86 - one of the highest quality passenger aircraft of its time and in general in history aviation. An series aircraft were also very good.

The myth that the Soviet industry did not produce high-quality technology, based on several factors.

Soviet products are usually compared with the best examples of the entire Western world, which was much larger in terms of economy and population. Western Europe, the United States and Japan in total is almost a billion people. Soviet Union - 250 million. Agree, not quite correct comparison turns out. Why not compare the products of the USSR with France alone. Or with a single UK. The result is a strictly opposite picture - in the USSR more diverse products were produced than in a single European country.

Accents in the Soviet economy were shifted from consumer goods to industrial ones, so most of the quality products accounted for not what could be bought in stores, but what worked at the enterprises - trucks, helicopters, airplanes, industrial equipment. Most of the high-quality Soviet technology ordinary people have not seen, it was not in the shops, because she worked in manufacturing and in the field of transport.

That is why the steady myth arose that the Soviet equipment was of poor quality and could not withstand competition.

Soviet technology ceased to withstand competition when it was no longer developed and produced.

However, something is still being produced. For example, helicopters. And Kamaz. And the president flies the IL-96. All this is Soviet products, which turned out to be not just quality - it remains high quality and competitive after 25 years!

Are there many similar samples in the world?

There are quite a few such examples, but I will not do that, that’s not the goal.

I do not claim that all Soviet-made goods were of higher quality than imported ones. Goods were different - they were good, they were not very.

But the 3 / 4 products that made up a person’s life and determined the quality of life were high-quality in Soviet times. Moreover, in 50-e, 60-e and 70-e years, this figure reached 90%. The fall of the index began in the 80-ies, in a period of intensive destruction of the economy and the growing backlog. But this period is not indicative and typical for the USSR as a whole.

And now, attention is the question. When 75-90% products of the economy are high-quality and competitive - is it necessary to destroy the entire economy completely and transfer it to a different model?

No, there was no such need.

To fill the lack of quality and quantity of 10-25% of the product range - it was necessary to simply develop the economy that already existed, correct the deficiencies, optimize, eliminate the causes of the deficit and low quality in certain positions.

Instead, the Soviet leadership destroyed the entire economy as a whole and transferred it to a market model, in which Russia in general stopped producing most of the product range, and the remaining types of products fell in quality (with the exception of weapons, helicopter and astronautics, preserved in its present form).

Here you have a market economy in action - before the 75% of the total product was distinguished by high quality, today it is hardly 10%.
A question to all supporters of the market economy: if the market is so good and leads to an increase in the quality of products at the expense of producers' competition, why did the quality of foodstuffs fall after the liquidation of the USSR?

Buyers do not want to eat quality bread?

Why practically all the equipment produced by Russia are remnants of Soviet developments? Why did they stop producing IL-86 - one of the best aircraft in the history of aviation?

Why was Soviet education the best in the world if it was free?

And why do the Dakar Rally win Kamaz, and not Mercedes? How is this combined with the thesis that the market economy is better than planned?

If you are a supporter of a market economy, answer at least one of these questions.
138 comments
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  1. +8
    12 September 2017 15: 13
    The market leads to changes in products, but not to quality. Modern cars rot in a couple of years, unlike cars of the past. A technique is easier to buy a new one than to repair.
    1. +7
      12 September 2017 15: 41
      The quality of the products that are sold. Modern cars are designed for intensive operation for three years. If it continues to move after this, then this is a bonus.
      1. +12
        12 September 2017 15: 49
        iouris and bai so i am about it. Home appliances back in the 90's had an expiration date of 20 years, now 2-3 years. This is a decrease in quality, for the sake of consumption. The faster it breaks, the faster they buy a new one.
        1. +1
          12 September 2017 19: 56
          and why?
          fashion, concept, credit lines and prices, etc. will change anyway
          why lay 10 years in a computer if it will not pull
          to the phone if it is replaced?
          Why lay for 10 years in a car, if its new is more profitable to sell?
          who needs rogues buying second-hand and auto trash in eastern europe? they don’t count on us in the gold billion, they plan to sell it to their own and the rich, and shoving 10 year old stuff is already a pleasant bonus.
        2. +2
          12 September 2017 23: 12
          Quote: Wend
          This is a decrease in quality, for the sake of consumption.

          In the USA, and then in the countries of the "golden billion" a "consumer society" was created. Reducing or limiting consumption means the death of the economic system created by the US administration. The rest of the world is forced to live by consuming the scraps of this economic system.
      2. 0
        14 September 2017 15: 24
        Quote: iouris
        If it continues to move after this, then this is a bonus.

        Back in the 70s, they discussed what to do so that cars were bought more than once every 10-20 years, but more often. Today they want to generally change all cars to electric ones. Marketing.))))
    2. BAI
      +8
      12 September 2017 15: 44
      Modern cars rot in a couple of years, unlike cars of the past

      Not quite correct example. Modern cars, as well as sophisticated household appliances (refrigerators, televisions, etc.) were not originally designed for long-term operation. The manufacturer needs to buy new products from him continuously. I know for sure that in firms like Indesit, Stinol, etc. there are special departments whose task is to make such constructive changes to the products so that the product after the warranty period fails, is not repairable and there are no complaints against the manufacturer. Similarly with cars. Compare the thickness of the Victory metal and any new Kia.
      1. +1
        13 September 2017 07: 50
        Yes, it is true that design changes are made in order to limit the service life and the impossibility of repair. But who cares? Only to manufacturers. And the damage to nature and human health from such an economy is not calculated. Mountains of garbage are growing, water from surface and underground sources is polluted. Is this what people need? In fact, the market should be free, i.e. a mechanism for stimulating the production of products in demand should work; instead, a mechanism for crowding out sales of those types of products that are in demand among the population will work. This is not a market, this is the total pressure of large networks. Does the population have the opportunity to update household appliances every three years, to buy new clothes every season? Therefore, there is nostalgia for the USSR - while household appliances have served for a long time, people could afford to rest and vacation with friends in a favorable climate. Today, no more than a third of the population has a rest; the rest solve endless replacement problems or pay loans with mortgages. But a person must rest, many can not afford it. They work at work, process or earn extra money, are hunchbacked on garden plots, they do all the homework themselves, and they get poorer and sicker.
      2. +1
        14 September 2017 12: 36
        Quote: BAI
        so that the product fails after the warranty period


        What are you doing about gadgets.?
        You talk about food. Food like a thousand years ago, like a hundred years ago .. if good, then good.
        Why is plastic food now, if it was natural in the USSR?
        1. 0
          15 September 2017 11: 15
          Now there is food of any quality, just we are too poor and buy sausage for 200, not 1000
    3. 0
      12 September 2017 16: 56
      This is one of the options for stimulating the sales market .. And the "quality" is really for three years ... Or maybe it is right? Why ride a fifteen-year-old technique (and this is not the limit .. there are thirty and more)? Although with the author I agree 100%
      Quote: Wend
      The market leads to changes in products, but not to quality. Modern cars rot in a couple of years, unlike cars of the past. A technique is easier to buy a new one than to repair.
      1. +9
        12 September 2017 18: 31
        such market stimulation leads to a predatory attitude towards natural resources. what can be used for several generations turns into garbage in a few years. what will we leave to the descendants? deposits of garbage?
        1. +3
          12 September 2017 22: 17
          I totally agree! Artificial demand gives rise to millions of tons of garbage, which practically does not decompose and leads, almost has already led, to an environmental disaster. The price of the product must include the price of disposal.
        2. +4
          13 September 2017 07: 56
          You are right, there is a poisoning of nature and people. Grew up on the outskirts of the city, private houses. We ran barefoot down the street. How nice it was to run through the puddles after the rain. There was no garbage! There were no garbage containers, abandoned bottles, broken glass. For bottles, waste paper, scrap metal, cans, rags were surrendered. And the river was clear. And the street was clean. And there were no janitors. And today there are no such territories, and garbage is everywhere.
          1. 0
            13 September 2017 21: 03
            Of course, part of the population has absolutely no concept of ecology. I’m constantly fighting near the house with a redneck who comes to the woods near the house to thump and leaves behind him piles of garbage. Any city square or park, if it is not in the very center, is littered with household waste. I envy Singapore directly.
            1. +1
              14 September 2017 12: 36
              so there’s no special chewing gum in stores, only by prescription ... and a wild fine for spitting it on the sidewalk ...
  2. +4
    12 September 2017 15: 31
    Quality is not profitable for the capital model of the economy, because leads to a reduction in sales and production in its segment of goods or requires the reconfiguration of the entire production line to a new product that is more attractive to the consumer (and this costs) ...
    1. 0
      13 September 2017 08: 01
      The capitalists' "more attractive product" for consumers is not interested in the opinion of the consumer at all. They can offer a different set of chemicals, a variety of packaging, but today it’s rather impossible to find the right product on the filled shelves, and choosing among the pictures and the E-shek set is a mockery of the consumer.
  3. +7
    12 September 2017 15: 31
    The USSR was a mighty country, if it were not for the rotten elites, who from the 80s began to row for themselves, would live in that country with that quality.
  4. +5
    12 September 2017 15: 32
    Small notes:
    1. We paid for watching TV and Radio. If someone does not remember, then there were such items in the receipt of the TV point and the radio point.
    2. IL-86 stopped flying, because we had a problem with aircraft engines. More precisely with their effectiveness (fuel consumption, power, noise). As soon as these parameters began to tighten, the aircraft stopped flying. But there’s more restructuring podkuzmila
    3. The quality was very dependent on the manufacturer's factory. Caucasian manufacturers were especially poor in quality (it came to the point that the products of certain plants were simply not taken or they were immediately written off for scrap). And to make them work normally there was no political will (well, we will not offend our Caucasian comrades).
    4. At the expense of education. Education was good (although it varied from region to region), but it was only very general. But this helped in future work.

    And the main quality problem was that we didn’t have healthy competition (not healthy enough). Therefore, many believed that somehow the plan is feasible, they will all sort it out.
    Alas. but it was a reality due to the fact that it was necessary to produce a wide range of goods and spend heavily on defense.
    1. +9
      12 September 2017 15: 41
      Tv point
      There were radio points, there were no TV points.
      Stop lying about the competition. The best rockets, Kalashnikov assault rifles, can probably be continued for a long time.
      You say defense expenditures, but Putin’s Russia is proud of expenditures on defense. Only the USSR was a people’s state, they tell us, you stay there.
      1. +2
        12 September 2017 15: 58
        Payment was only called either a collective antenna or a television antenna. Depending on the region.
        An example here is http://ussrlife.blogspot.ru/2013/08/blog-post_29.
        htmlhttp: //ussrlife.blogspot.ru/2013/08/blog-post
        _29.html.

        There was no competition as such. If there were several factories that produced the same products. That is this total amount of production planned and distributed among consumers. And the consumer could not choose: the products of which plant were distributed, that’s what you’ll get (well, only if you get very fussed). Moreover, if the products are of high quality, then they were quite competitive in foreign markets. There was no internal competition, because we could not produce surpluses (and competition appears when there is surplus).
        1. +4
          12 September 2017 16: 47
          what kind of competition in terms of quality can we talk about if people don’t have enough money now? the roof over one’s head is alien to many, they don’t buy bread from premium flour ...
        2. +1
          12 September 2017 20: 59
          Quote: alstr
          Payment was only called either a collective antenna or a television antenna.

          Antenna-feeder economy also needs maintenance, and they paid for it.
      2. +1
        12 September 2017 18: 06
        Quote: Gardamir
        There were radio points, there were no TV points.
        Stop lying about the competition. The best rockets, Kalashnikov assault rifles, can probably be continued for a long time.
        You say defense expenditures, but Putin’s Russia is proud of expenditures on defense. Only the USSR was a people’s state, they tell us, you stay there.

        Compare the defense spending of the USSR and Russia - in Putin's Russia, the approach is much less ambitious and more pragmatic. That - what a "people's" state was the USSR, not for me to judge and not for you - no one has a general picture. There were great achievements - just don’t lift your head, the Americans designed the same Gorky automobile plant, built it under their leadership and with their participation, and the first cars were a copy of Ford's (like most of the legendary Soviet industrialization itself).
        1. +4
          12 September 2017 18: 55
          more pragmatic
          This is true the Union had enemies and allies. And now there are only partners around. Turkey’s partner is both aviation and air defense. And the DPRK is not partners, so let them all be killed.
          1. 0
            12 September 2017 19: 48
            This is true the Union had enemies and allies.

            enemies and suckers, second- countries that could take any power for a penny, as soon as the all-union they cut off
      3. 0
        12 September 2017 18: 21
        GardamirWell, you are this, staying there! I hope today a penny on a crust of bread has not only earned agitprop?
        https://topwar.ru/index.php?do=lastcomments&u
        serid = 53851
      4. 0
        14 September 2017 12: 38
        It was. For the collective antenna paid ..
    2. 0
      14 September 2017 15: 29
      Quote: alstr
      we did not have a healthy competition

      This is when hundreds of small chains and shops are closed because of networks. What is healthy competition? Where in the world such a miracle exists?
  5. +4
    12 September 2017 15: 33
    About quality sausage, butter, meat - it's well written! But 90% of the population of these products in stores simply could not buy because of their complete absence on store shelves. Term: "sausage trains" - from the Soviet era! When they were traveling for food to Moscow, Leningrad, possibly Kiev. I saw how in those days the train number 602 Rybinsk came to the Savyolovsky railway station in the capital (this is where NPO Saturn makes engines) -Moscow at about 6 in the morning. And the crowd from the "starving Volga" ran to occupy the cells of automatic lockers. And then during the day they were stuffed with groceries, and in the evening at about 22-00 the “booty” was taken out of the cells, packed in bags, and the people were pleased that they had stuffed with the said “quality food” for a couple of months, loaded onto a train going back to Rybinsk .
    1. +10
      12 September 2017 15: 44
      Quote: nnz226
      But 90% of the population of these products in stores simply could not buy

      But now there is an abundance, but this sausage is only made of anything, but not of meat. This also applies to vodka, cigarettes, beer, etc.
    2. +2
      12 September 2017 16: 10
      However, I remember very well how my father brought Indian tea and other shortages from closed cities.
      1. +1
        12 September 2017 17: 09
        not only from closed cities, from the north each vacation brought tea, coffee, different delicacies, standardly one suitcase bully
    3. +5
      12 September 2017 17: 47
      Well, where it was not, but where it was (in the republics it is “denser”, but in mother Russia itself where it is ..) Yes, there was a jamb of planning, I do not argue. Only for me, the assortment is better, but it’s of higher quality than now, the choice is up-to-date, only made from matches, acorns, shit (food, household appliances, car industry). And then you still Could buy, but now it’s useless that not everyone can buy a lot. no money © ® ™
      1. +1
        12 September 2017 18: 36
        Only for me, the assortment is better, but it’s of higher quality than now, the choice is up-to-date,

        Ie you did not find the Soviet newspapers about trunks, hoofs and a toilet in meat products?

        and then there were but nothing to buy.
    4. +1
      12 September 2017 18: 39
      these products were absent on store shelves, but almost any citizen could purchase from under the counter, but they just had to overpay a little or stand in line for several hours at the right time.
    5. 0
      14 September 2017 08: 03
      Quote: nnz226
      About quality sausage, butter, meat - it's well written! But 90% of the population of these products in stores simply could not buy due to their complete absence on store shelves

      Unfortunately, being in Russia, I realized that nothing has changed since Soviet times. in particular, visiting the capital of Khakassia, Abakan was struck by terrible food (sausage milk bread candy stewed cheese chocolate). Not only do I understand the population and have no idea what these products should be. that is, they have never seen them in their normal form in their lives. that is, there are currently no sausage trains just because people are fed surrogates and, unlike in Soviet times, they don’t even have an idea what these products should look like. I’ll add that in the days of the USSR there was such a word guest. and so it was he who stood on the defense
      Chocolate, bread, condensed milk, sausage, cheese, etc.
    6. 0
      14 September 2017 12: 44
      just don’t please ... I’m just from the starving Volga ... yes, they went to Moscow, but sorry not for meat ... for sausage, yes. Only for smoked. We brought oranges phantom in bottles for the New Year they sold. and mostly they drove too much. here you saw and I went ... although Kuibyshev was not supplied well then .. but I will tell you the secret, everything was ... there was an interdistrict of the ops, we went there as boys, unload wagons so here -There was everything ... but not for everyone ..
  6. +6
    12 September 2017 15: 37
    The author, in the USSR there was no market, and in the Russian Federation there is none either. The Russian economy is uncompetitive because Russia is a northern country. Capitalism is killing our industries and the industry as a whole. Russia is competitive only as a super corporation, an economic project alternative to the TNC project. In addition, after the emergence of TNCs, market competition died because the global economy is regulated globally and tightly from Washington.
    Soviet cars were created for such operating conditions: off-road, tundra, deserts, highlands, dust, dirt. Such a technique is very expensive (relatively) and cannot compete with the American one in the market. Our market does not pass, we do not have it. What was done for defense and outer space was done firmly, but this is not a market product.
  7. +1
    12 September 2017 15: 54
    1. Cars
    Oh, well, no. Of course we love our car industry, because it is OUR. Sweet, pretty. Memories of the era. But by and large ... mediocre overall technology. And at the same time, most of them are copies of foreign samples.
    Cameras
    Well, also debatable. All the same, the Germans do not compete.
    that the Tu series aircraft were highly accidental
    Aircraft of the Tu series did not have a high accident rate even once. At least the average accident rates for an hour of flight are not unique to them even against the background of foreign counterparts, for example, the famous bobik of the 737 series.
    IL-86 - one of the highest quality passenger aircraft of its time
    What does "quality" mean? Does it mean that he has only one disaster for the entire operation? The approach is absolutely wrong. To begin with, the IL-86 was operated quite a bit in time, and the aircraft themselves were released at times less than such emergency (apparently the author thinks) aircraft like the Tu-134, Tu-154. Secondly, accident statistics do not have a direct relationship with the quality of equipment and its reliability, because In addition to build quality, manufacturing defects, and so on, there are so many factors that all statistics become not benign. Weather, errors of pilots, ground personnel, other circumstances. According to accident statistics, the quality of equipment can only be judged indirectly. High accident rate may be one of the signs of poor quality equipment, but may not be. A really problematic technique does not have time to collect any statistics at all simply because it retires very quickly (like An-10 planes, for example). A formally wildly emergency Boeing-737 flies and flies and will fly for a long time.
    1. +6
      12 September 2017 17: 07
      I’ll say about cars - there’s still nothing better than a Soviet jeep or UAZ for moving around the taiga ....
      Niva is the founder of the crossover class (recognized by all)
      1. +3
        12 September 2017 19: 28
        Quote: faiver
        there is still nothing better than a Soviet jeep or UAZ to travel through the taiga ....

        Well, those who have not ridden the Pinzgauer probably think so. Love for our car industry is often based on a lack of ability to compare. In this particular case, nevertheless, you are close to the truth - UAZ is really a good car for its tasks, like Niva. We went, we know. Over the Ural ridge in the Niva jumped, everything is so. There is still the Ural-4320, how it climbs where it climbs - amazing. This is all right, these are good examples. However, this is not enough to put the entire Soviet auto industry on a par with the United States or Germany. Not that scale.
        1. +2
          12 September 2017 19: 59
          the question is not in comparison, but in practical application, that a gazik that a UAZ from the Soviet era will either get where it is needed, or if it breaks down will be repaired by your own hands and such and such a mother, and you can’t repair imported cars and the current UAZ hunter in the taiga in most cases. .. hi
          1. 0
            12 September 2017 22: 06
            Taiga is not only in our country. Nothing people in Canada and Alaska cost.
          2. 0
            13 September 2017 12: 50
            Quote: faiver
            or if it breaks will be repaired with his own hands and such and such a mother

            Well, how can I say))) We have a hub on the Niva wedged to zero. Bearing in a mess. Duck couldn’t fix something in the taiga, he had to spy on the second car all night on the forest paths to Severouralsk to collect a new hub there in the morning and drive back to save the crew of the first car without sleeping and eating. Okay, they had already gone down from the mountains to the bottom, and if there, above, the saga would have been stretched for three or four days. So all this is relative. If you did not take, for example, a spare timing belt, then it will not work to repair a ragged one with the help of taiga gifts of nature - cones and twigs. But the gas cable at UAZ was restored with the help of a rope skipped from the outside. )))
            1. 0
              13 September 2017 13: 25
              Well, so I was talking about gas69 or UAZ, well, no matter how not about the Niva :)
  8. +7
    12 September 2017 16: 10
    Among the myths spread by anti-Soviet myths about the horrors and decadence of the Soviet Union, a special place is occupied by the stories that the USSR did not produce quality products. Allegedly, they used Soviet goods and products only because there were no others, and it was enough to appear imported - all the Soviet people stopped buying and producing.


    I didn’t see consumer goods - shoes, clothes, furniture, electronic devices.
    what Soviet goods could compete even with the CMEA countries?

    and the fact that silt 86 is awesome it can be like that, that was nothing to me from this, I don’t wear it and don’t eat it.
    If you are a supporter of a market economy, answer at least one of these questions.

    if you’re so straightforward for the USSR - throw out the plasma from the house, the computer on which you are at war, bed with pastels, fashionable kitchen, perfume, shampoos, razors, pastes.
    and, yes, the cell phone too, and the same foreign car, in short, all the victims of damned capitalism.
    ̶Н̶а̶й̶д̶и̶ ̶н̶а̶ ̶п̶о̶м̶о̶й̶к̶е̶ buy old Soviet clothes and after that dare to broadcast to us, otherwise all such finished steel.

    And why do the Dakar Rally win Kamaz, and not Mercedes? How is this combined with the thesis that the market economy is better than planned?

    deer, have you seen this kamaz? there is only half of Kamaz.


    again another youngster dreams of a country which he did not find
    1. +5
      12 September 2017 17: 03
      do not tell people what to do and then they won’t tell you where to go .... hi
      1. +1
        12 September 2017 18: 36
        here you go, go where you went, there they are waiting for you
        1. 0
          12 September 2017 18: 53
          only after you oh wisest hi laughing
          1. 0
            12 September 2017 19: 49
            Well, no, I didn’t intend to go there, but you were already very late, a good riddance
            1. 0
              12 September 2017 20: 00
              don't be shy bully
            2. The comment was deleted.
  9. +6
    12 September 2017 16: 23
    The quality of the products varied significantly depending on the place of its production. For example, it was impossible to compare KAMAZ with Kolkhida (Vyser of the Georgian automobile industry was assembled from components from ZiL) or a machine tool from Ivanovo with a craft from the Oktemberyan Machine Tool Plant. If it was necessary to gag the stubborn turner, they put him to work for the "Armenian" - there is no plan, no money.
  10. +4
    12 September 2017 16: 35
    I will say this: in the USSR there was a lot of quality goods, but there was frank trash. For example, metal-working machines were and are brittle trash (those who worked at the plant know this). I saw a German milling machine of the 60s which is intensively operated and without a single cap. repair so far. About the current quality of Russian machine tools, I better not say anything at all.
    1. +2
      13 September 2017 19: 09
      Quote: frezer
      For example, metal-working machines were and are brittle trash (those who worked at the plant know this)

      Machine tools to machine strife. I worked on 1A62 made on the Red proletariat in 1950 and its Astrakhan clone made in 1970. Worked like a clock. Major repairs judging by the nameplates were carried out on schedule. A little later, in a different place, 1K62 was also from the Red proletariat, and its Chelyabinsk version was standing nearby. They worked like clockwork, poured on them like that ... the hand held steady near the red zone. I also had a chance to work on 16K20, so there the cars on the site generally rotated in 2 shifts,
      Quote: frezer
      German milling machine of the 60s which is intensively operated and without a single cap. repair still
      As for intensive use, strong doubts are gnawing at me; there, in any way, the guides and screw pairs wear out. If the machine is intensively exploited for 15 years due to wear and tear, there will be no accuracy. And repair guides, this is capital.

      From the milling machines I saw the whole series of Gorky machine tools working, they worked like clockwork. So the fragility of Soviet machine tools is greatly exaggerated
  11. +1
    12 September 2017 16: 35
    Rusin has an excellent text "Putin is not shit," I recommend.

    PS “Taking into account the views expressed by Angela Merkel, the Russian leader noted his readiness to supplement the functions of the UN mission proposed in the Russian draft Security Council [UN] resolution. It is understood that the protection of OSCE observers by the UN can be carried out not only on the contact line after the separation of forces and means of both parties, but also in other places where the OSCE special monitoring mission conducts its inspection visits in accordance with the Minsk complex of measures ”
    NATO troops on the border with the Russian Federation? what a grand victory
  12. +2
    12 September 2017 16: 48
    It is completely unprofitable for the market to produce high-quality and reliable products. The main thing for the market is to spend less, sell faster and, accordingly, get more income. Any "fenka" is just a find for the market to raise the price and, accordingly, "draw in" the population!
  13. +9
    12 September 2017 16: 51
    Those who are trying to criticize the Union, what has become better? We are getting worse now. Meat from kenguryatina, milk from palm tree, bread from flour 4 grades. The so-called consumer goods are all Chinese. The notorious cars are all screwdriver assembly, and China by the way bought a Volvo. What about medicine and education?
    1. +3
      12 September 2017 22: 12
      Quote: Gardamir
      What about medicine and education?

      Putiners will soon triumph over these rudiments of socialism ...
  14. +5
    12 September 2017 16: 54
    Quote: nnz226
    About quality sausage, butter, meat - it's well written! But 90% of the population of these products in stores simply could not buy because of their complete absence on store shelves.


    From my childhood I remember - and this was the beginning of the 80's - yes, empty shelves and a complete shortage. But judging by the stories of older people, in 60's and even 70's (first half) there was no shortage. Who is there among the senior comrades - let him say!
    1. +5
      12 September 2017 17: 25
      It's true. I found the 70s, there was sausage, and fish, and meat, and high-quality ones, there was no shortage.
      1. 0
        12 September 2017 21: 07
        Quote: lubovusm
        I found the 70s, there was sausage, and fish, and meat, and high-quality ones, there was no shortage.

        Where did you live? In the republics, capitals?
      2. MrK
        +1
        13 September 2017 00: 53
        Quote: lubovusm
        there was no shortage

        By the way. What is the difference between doctor's sausage in the USSR and the Russian Federation.
        The composition of the “Doctor's” sausage according to GOST, which was sold in the USSR: “Veined beef of the highest grade - 25%; semi-fat veined pork - 70%; chicken eggs or melange, milk powder, salt, sodium nitrite, sugar or glucose, nutmeg or cardamom - 5%. ”

        And here is the composition of the modern Doctoral, according to TU: “Poultry meat - 30%; emulsion (chopped offal, bone, skin - 25%; soybean - 25%; pork or bacon - 10%; starch, flavoring agents, stabilizers, preservatives - 10% ”.
        Source: http://publizist.ru/blogs/33/18916/-
        1. 0
          18 September 2017 14: 05
          And also water.
          I remember working at a meat factory (in the early 2000s).
          Somehow I went to the planning department. The recipe was checked.
          Economist to the chief: Something we get is small. 139%, and you need 140.
          Head: Add water.
    2. +5
      12 September 2017 17: 34
      it was so, only in the second half of the 70s the notorious deficit began to appear, but not total, but for some types of goods, but this phenomenon was temporary and not long-lasting, and empty shelves and a complete deficit, this is the merit of Mikhail Sergeyevich, the end 80s
      1. +3
        12 September 2017 19: 03
        end of 80
        I'll add from myself, I’ll clarify. The most terrible lines (in every sense) are the lines for vodka. Already the height of the Gorbachev region. But about 1989-1990 he went to Leningrad, to relax in the cultural capital, rented an apartment somewhere in the vicinity of the artists' avenue. So there on the ground floor, a dairy shop, and there was always cheese, I was still kindly asked how much to cut.
        1. +3
          12 September 2017 19: 23
          I also happened to visit Moscow and Leningrad in 1989-1990, and I didn’t even see empty shelves even in these cities even at that time, although I had to wait in line, but nevertheless I always managed to buy what I wanted in sense of products, but here's the line for vodka, this is a separate "song") who lived at that time, he will understand
      2. 0
        12 September 2017 21: 21
        Quote: San Sanych
        only in the second half of the 70s did the notorious deficit begin to appear

        Well, of course, everyone could walk in jeans and sneakers .....
        If you lived “right”, joined the party, did not abuse your bosses by chance, had connections - then there is no shortage, everything was good ... like many other things - a university, a prestigious job and, interestingly, a dream to drive there into the wild West .... East Germany as the top of the limit, about further, they were afraid to think.
        1. +3
          12 September 2017 21: 40
          Roman, of course, I'm sorry, but you are frankly delirious) It is not strange, but everyone for whom the ultimate dream was to go in jeans and sneakers, they had this opportunity) even in the "totalitarian USSR")
        2. +1
          12 September 2017 21: 51
          and again, at the expense of cursing the "authorities", Brezhnev wasn’t scolded in the kitchens by notorious idlers, and there was nothing for anyone, but now, the same thing about the current "high" power, you don’t please, "criticize", but honestly honestly, do you dare to tell the truth in the eyes of your immediate superiors?
        3. +1
          14 September 2017 12: 58
          jeans cost 100 rubles. I don’t remember anymore, but much cheaper. As for the GDR, I wanted to go. And without having to join the party. My dad, being a non-partisan, went to Cyprus in 1982 to relax. And he was just a hard worker .. and now who goes there? and we in 70-80 every summer and even in winter twice a year flew to the Far East with this family to visit grandmothers and grandfathers. tell me, now you will pull the flight back to Blagoveshchensk 4 people once a year for a salary? and by the way, yes, those jeans were worn for 10 years or even more ... and now?
    3. +3
      12 September 2017 17: 58
      moreover, it should be noted that all these "deficits" began to appear after the state of health of Brezhnev L.I. worsened, somewhere after 1975 (apparently in our country very often a lot is "tied" to one person) Brezhnev before 1975 and after, these are two big differences
      1. 0
        12 September 2017 22: 01
        Until 1973, then he began to have problems, or even in 1972, I don’t remember exactly. This du.ak sat on the throne for another 10 years instead of leaving on time.
    4. +1
      12 September 2017 21: 05
      Quote: gorgo
      From my childhood I remember - and this was the beginning of the 80's - yes, empty shelves and a complete shortage. But judging by the stories of older people, in 60's and even 70's (first half) there was no shortage. Who is there among the senior comrades - let him say!

      Yes there was no economy, what are you?
      Was arms raceif the US spent roughly 1
      / 4 GNP, and ours was almost twice as inferior to the Americans and at the same time managed to maintain parity - THIS is 2 times more on defense than there!

      What kind of economy are we talking about? The military rear in the conditions of the Cold War. To compete with the whole world? And people wanted to live a little, and not drive a dumb ideology about brothers and sisters on earth that our brothers were until we fed them and helped in everything from military bases to grain bought from Americans.

      A centralized economy is utopia. Plan demand? winked
      1. +2
        12 September 2017 22: 31
        So American marketers not only plan, but also artificially create demand. Moreover, not for really necessary goods, but for any rubbish that is a stranger to vparit.

        So a planned, socially oriented economy is incommensurably more efficient and more expedient.
    5. +3
      12 September 2017 22: 10
      Quote: gorgo
      From my childhood I remember - and it was already the beginning of the 80s - that yes, empty shelves and a complete deficit.

      There was no shortage until the 86th year, I personally did not observe !!!
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. +2
          13 September 2017 09: 25
          you work out your nickname by 146% Yes laughing
    6. MrK
      +2
      13 September 2017 00: 31
      In the USSR there was a joke of the main contradictions of developed socialism.
      - There is no unemployment in the country, but no one works.
      Nobody works, and everyone fulfills the plan.
      They fulfill the plan, but there is nothing in the stores.
      There is nothing in the stores, but everyone has everything in the refrigerators.
      Everyone has everything in the fridges, but everyone is unhappy.
      Everyone is unhappy, but everyone is in favor

      If you fill up all the shelves with waste from around the world, then this is called - fed the country ?! Especially if the majority of the population just looks at all this abundance
      1. 0
        13 September 2017 03: 17
        In stores, 90% of Russian products, do not la la.
      2. 0
        13 September 2017 03: 23
        They don’t look, but buy with might and main. Nobody puts the goods on the shelf, if they don’t buy it, it’s not profitable for the seller.
        1. +1
          14 September 2017 13: 00
          Well, yes. But only the components are not ours ... try to buy a regular Russian-made hammer ..
  15. +11
    12 September 2017 17: 13
    "There was a car like Victory, which was not inferior to its foreign contemporaries, and even surpassed them in some characteristics."

    The author, apparently, is not aware that there was nothing to surpass! If we exclude the engine (only), then nothing similar in the West was expected even in the long run. Namely - the supporting body, link suspension, body design, almost perfect aerodynamics.
    "Victory" "torn" all! In 1948, the Tucker Torpedo car became the best-selling car in the United States. From the "Victory" it differed in the shape of the taillights and, of course, the engine. AND EVERYTHING!
    Bottom line: If it weren't for the moronic Nikita the Miracle Worker, who knows whose cars they would buy.
  16. +8
    12 September 2017 17: 23
    In the USSR, refrigerators, washing machines, vacuum cleaners, televisions, machines and tools were very high-quality. The design lagged behind the western one, but the reliability was high.
    1. 0
      12 September 2017 22: 05
      They made fun, everything was the other way around.
      1. 0
        13 September 2017 00: 45
        Quote: Mood Ozwon
        They made fun, everything was the other way around.
        old age is not joy ... crying
  17. +4
    12 September 2017 18: 13
    A friend bought a 51 refrigerator today on occasion - in fact in perfect condition and it works, he found the refrigerator even of Stalin, this is the quality hi
    1. 0
      13 September 2017 03: 27
      Dear? This is already an antique, only rises in price with time.
    2. 0
      14 September 2017 13: 02
      to tear off .chrome all over again. to paint with good paint, just not to be greedy but to give it to the camera for painting. the owners of the libchers will die of envy .. press with the capacity of the problem ..
  18. +1
    12 September 2017 19: 10
    By the way, remember the film "The Adventures of Italians in Russia"? The beginning of the film and what did the Italian hospital look like? This is not a parody, so they lived then.
    It’s just that the West has learned to make beautiful wrappers, so it seemed to us that everything was beautiful there.
    Only life is changing and we will soon envy China.
  19. +1
    12 September 2017 19: 24
    Quote: BAI
    Modern cars rot in a couple of years, unlike cars of the past

    Not quite correct example. Modern cars, as well as sophisticated household appliances (refrigerators, televisions, etc.) were not originally designed for long-term operation. The manufacturer needs to buy new products from him continuously. I know for sure that in firms like Indesit, Stinol, etc. there are special departments whose task is to make such constructive changes to the products so that the product after the warranty period fails, is not repairable and there are no complaints against the manufacturer. Similarly with cars. Compare the thickness of the Victory metal and any new Kia.
    But what does the thickness of the metal have to do with it? and the quality of steel itself does not count? thicker doesn't mean better
  20. The comment was deleted.
  21. +5
    12 September 2017 20: 08
    [quoteA now, attention is a question. When 75-90% of the economy’s products are of high quality and competitive, is it necessary to destroy the entire economy and transfer it to another model?] [/ Quote]
    And then a chorus of "crying princesses" woke up sobbing that in Soviet times there weren’t their loved ones:
    Sachets "UPI"
    Alcohol Royal
    Coca-Cola
    Powder Hamburger
    Soy Sausage
    Palm cheese
    Milk powder
    Pampers
    Allergic synthetic underpants and T-shirts
    Melanin Cookware
    Doshiraka and many, many all sorts of different "nishtyak"!
    Our "favorite market" entrepreneurs "" and interested "market" clans in the Government and the State Duma made food and industrial garbage from the Russian Federation. Rejoice at the layman! You now have everything threshing floor of the world !!!)
    But instead of happiness about the "conquered", why do you often express sadness and anger and wonder why even this most threshing floor rises in price all the time. So this is not a planned economy for you, this is the market and it "steers"!)))
    1. +1
      12 September 2017 22: 10
      Yes, yes - and when the Union was so good that already horror! There wasn’t even toilet paper, they were wiped with newspapers. You tell the young people about the beautiful Soviet paradise, they might even give up, they didn’t live then.
      1. +2
        13 September 2017 00: 12
        Quote: Mood Ozvon
        Yes, yes - and when the Union was so good that already horror! There wasn’t even toilet paper, they were wiped with newspapers. You tell the young people about the beautiful Soviet paradise, they might even give up, they didn’t live then.

        Was it too lazy to go to the store, that they wiped themselves with newspapers or lived in the tundra?
        1. +1
          13 September 2017 03: 19
          I lived in Moscow, and there was no toilet paper for sale, as well as buckwheat, sprats and many other things. Do you have bad memory?
          1. +1
            13 September 2017 09: 39
            Quote: Mood Ozvon
            I lived in Moscow, and there was no toilet paper for sale, as well as buckwheat, sprats and many other things. Do you have bad memory?

            You already decide "witnesses of the absence of everything" !. Your liberal brotherhood only squealed about toilet paper, and it sounded something like this: "There was nothing in the" scoop "on the shelves of the shops, except for toilet paper." So was toilet paper in the USSR or not, that’s the question!)) _
          2. 0
            14 September 2017 13: 04
            Now it’s full .. but something is the trouble with sprats, as the taste has changed ..
    2. +4
      12 September 2017 22: 23
      Quote: Sovetskiy
      And then a chorus of "crying princesses" woke up sobbing that in Soviet times there weren’t their loved ones:
      Coca-Cola

      It was. For the Olympics, it seems, the issue was established.
  22. +4
    12 September 2017 21: 32
    Do not forget a very simple thing. Market economy, this is such crap, which is aimed at generating income (super-profit). All talk about competition and supposedly quality is purely for avert your eyes, like stories about democracy, where supposedly the people themselves decide something there. The issue of quality is not fundamental at all. Do you think in the same Europe people eat butter made with fresh milk, and sausages with the most tender pure veal ?? Who was in European supermarkets will confirm that there is the same g ..... like in yours around the corner. Richly flavored with flavors. Or when a monopolist sends you quarterly increasing bills, does he start from some mythical laws of the market ?? A market economy is simply the maximum withdrawal of your funds at the lowest cost. Or create conditions so that you have no choice. That is, for example, to wet and nightmare normal farmers, then everyone will eat soy sausage. The Soviet Union adhered to quality solely because it created the GOST system. The departure from which was severely punished. Therefore, if cognac was added to the delicious smoked sausage according to the GOST recipe, then it was added, and in its absence the product was simply not produced. Therefore, the first thing that market reformers did was immediately deduce it and destroy GOST. GOST does not interfere with quality and competition. It interferes with what they call the market. Which proves that it is quality that plays the last role in the market. Russia is a loser in the Cold War. And the winners brought this market here. And so as not to be very indignant, everything is veiled. It seems to you that everything is fine, that this yogurt is produced by Samara there, or the Tambov dairy factory. And the fact that some Nestle company actually owns it and they are forced to add melamine to milk is usually just behind the scenes. The packaging simply says the trade name of the plant, and not to whom it belongs. Because according to market laws, it is just more profitable to sell all the least quality. Because there are fewer costs, and more profit. Namely, this is the only reason for which a market economy has been created. So, in a market economy, forget about quality. Natural juice from a can (and not restored, etc.) and natural meat from sausages have sunk into oblivion along with the USSR.
    1. 0
      12 September 2017 22: 13
      Just for some reason, now the average life expectancy is higher than in the best times of the Union, more than 72 years ago - it means that life has become better yet.
      1. MrK
        +2
        13 September 2017 00: 08
        Quote: Mood Ozwon
        for some reason, now the average life expectancy is higher than in the best times of the Union

        It just died out a lot. And secondly. you can not believe Rosstat.
        1. 0
          13 September 2017 03: 31
          What does the "extinct"? Not understood.
          Second, why not?
  23. +1
    12 September 2017 21: 38
    Among the myths spread by anti-Soviet myths about the horrors and decline of the Soviet Union, a special place is occupied by stories that the USSR did not produce high-quality products.

    You need to evaluate some things as they are in order to draw the right conclusions. And in what civil sectors did the USSR have at least parity with the West? Pharmaceuticals - no. Civil microelectronics also does not. In order to return the TV to a scammer, he had to break down 7 times in a year. What quality can be discussed. Civilian automotive industry is generally an ambush! My friend Dad went to the USSR back in the USSR in 2107, at the end of 0x he bought a new seven, so quality, heaven and earth.
    Yes, unfortunately there was a lag, but tragedies do not need to be done from this, as the liberals like to do. It is necessary to draw conclusions in order to prevent this from happening in the future. There is no need to be afraid to challenge famous brands, since there are plenty of jambs too. As Steve Mattin said: "I will create a design school here no worse than in the west."
    1. +1
      13 September 2017 00: 59
      Quote: TOR2
      Yes, unfortunately there was a lag, but tragedies do not need to be done from this, as liberalists like to do. It is necessary to draw conclusions in order to prevent this from happening in the future.

      Yes, apparently, conclusions have already been made, a course back to the future of the USSR. laughing
      1. 0
        17 September 2017 00: 23
        Quote: MadCat
        Quote: TOR2
        Yes, unfortunately there was a lag, but tragedies do not need to be done from this, as liberalists like to do. It is necessary to draw conclusions in order to prevent this from happening in the future.
        Yes, apparently, conclusions have already been made, a course back to the future of the USSR.

        But who will give him that, not really Zyuganov?)))))
  24. +2
    12 September 2017 22: 02
    Quote: iouris
    Quote: nnz226
    But 90% of the population of these products in stores simply could not buy

    But now there is an abundance, but this sausage is only made of anything, but not of meat. This also applies to vodka, cigarettes, beer, etc.

    You would now try this sausage and a Soviet beer from a stall (or a drinker, if you know what it is?) I think that will carry over from habit. I think that you know about that time from books and such statues.
    1. 0
      17 September 2017 01: 11
      Quote: Deck
      Quote: iouris
      Quote: nnz226
      But 90% of the population of these products in stores simply could not buy

      But now there is an abundance, but this sausage is only made of anything, but not of meat. This also applies to vodka, cigarettes, beer, etc.

      You would now try this sausage and a Soviet beer from a stall (or a drinker, if you know what it is?) I think that will carry over from habit. I think that you know about that time from books and such statues.

      They can and will carry ... But what about the mysterious Russian soul, which is not taken by the Chinese "doshirak", not by the American hamburger :)) Ah, I forgot! There were "raw foodists" who would sell their homeland for cheese. So for you this was done by your "chosen ones", who changed your request, to your "international profit"!))
    2. +2
      17 September 2017 01: 22
      Quote: Deck
      You would now try this sausage and a Soviet beer from a stall (or a drinker, if you know what it is?) To drink. I think that will carry over from habit.

      Something did not carry me. And beer for 22 kopecks was better than now for 100 rubles.
  25. 0
    12 September 2017 22: 11
    The author you have a mistake.

    This is not a market or planning. This is capitalism or socialism.

    The simplest definition.

    Capitalism is the production of goods at the price of which the Surplus value is profit. We sell and resell goods speculatively. Each turn makes a profit. Thus, the redistribution of income, resources. In the end, the system comes to a crisis, a drop in purchasing power (not to be confused with the overproduction of goods, this is a blatant lie, a substitution of concepts).

    Socialism is the production of products of production; surplus value is not included in the price. There is no profit. The price includes a component for the development and updating of production. Under socialism, the concept of sale is absent; redistribution is rightly called. To understand the meaning of the system.

    So.

    Capitalism must be considered as a system to make a profit. Socialism is considered as a system for obtaining the necessary and sufficient social security.

    Hence the quality of the goods. But with a little bit of complexity. There you need to further explain.
    1. 0
      12 September 2017 22: 18
      Under Capitalism, the quality of goods is controlled by state standards and sufficient conditions for sale in order to make a profit.

      Under socialism, state standards and forms of socialist competition.
  26. 0
    12 September 2017 22: 48
    Damn, how many times was the idea to write here a separate article on the topic "how good it is to live in the West" ...
    Nicot does not argue that there has always been better, fatter, more fun. Is always! Remember even our golden years at the end of the 19 century. The same Turgenev adored Europe. Gogol (my favorite) called Italy a second homeland. Like in the movie "Cruel Romance" (according to Ostrovsky): "Oh, I love abroad!" And after all this was said by a rich merchant ...
    But you need to understand the main thing. What attracts the West, what does it attract? Consumption! There, consumption is erected in a cult, in the meaning of existence. All human life is directed to succeed at all costs and eat, eat, eat. Someone who is simpler - it’s banal to drink beer and have a snack with sausages, someone who is educated - whiskey with high-quality music, someone even more subtle - begins the "high art" and pederasty. There is a simple word for this - hedonism. This is not new, after all.
    Well, how can a simple layman resist this temptation? Well, the vast majority are ordinary people. They have no time or education to reflect on the high. They see the picture and want to "like there." They see what is wrong with us and indignantly ask - why ?! If so, then why is everything gray, poor, cheap? So their system is better! It is more efficient, advanced, advanced. And they are not aware that they are living at the expense of the rest of the world. Including us! Someone can intelligently calculate how many resources and values ​​were exported from the former USSR to the West? Under different types - from direct export at a low price (for kickbacks) to the removal of profits in offshore and import purchases of an infinite number of craps, clothes, machinery, equipment, spare parts, etc.?! Isn't that helping their economy? They say - well, here they are, that means they defeated us, because they worked more efficiently, and now they remove the cream. Yes, but before they robbed too. And Africa, India, America? Are all these colonies endless? Yes, they gave them "independence" only after the Second World War. And that’s purely nominal, you see, agree. Even what is happening in the Middle East, is not there a new round of colonial wars? For 70 years they pretended that there are some independent states there - Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, etc. Only the balance among the strong ones shook, right there this independence and the trace fell cold - they had in mind all these governments, they were bringing in troops, bombing, killing, sharing.
    It’s all how it began, whether from the Crusades, or from the era of “great geographical discoveries,” and does not end to this day! Only expanding and multiplying. But they are silent about the same thing - no, no! They just have a more efficient system, a more developed society, laws are more transparent!
    But no matter how you explain it to a simple man - he doesn’t care, he just wants to "like that"! He just wants to drive a Mercedes and relax in the Canaries! And do not pipett, as they say. Take it out! Here's what to do about it, huh?
    1. 0
      13 September 2017 00: 57
      In the West, it was never better and never fatter.

      If as a result of the robbery of a country, Capitalism received resources and development, then it naturally fell into decline. The economy was stagnating and people eked out a miserable existence.

      USA, knew a lot of crises. But Soviet citizens did not believe what they were told. Because they did not see and did not know that such a thing is possible at all.
    2. 0
      13 September 2017 21: 17
      Very precisely noticed! I can say in all parts. We all love European cities that conquer with the quality of the city structure, streets, squares, buildings, landscaping. There is a huge stratum of styles and eras, all like a layered cake. In most Russian cities, the urban structure is loose, decrepit, low-quality. But developers and customers, instead of managing and making a quality environment, force us, designers to drive as many cheap square meters that are sold at exorbitant prices. After all, they have the task of squeezing as much profit as possible and dumping it into a coveted Europe from this rash- (. And what should I do as a designer?
      This is one layer of the problem.
      The second layer is that for most ordinary people who are not savvy in design and the history of art (architecture), a beautiful city is usually a cheap stylization for historical styles.
      And from the point of view of professional designers and planners, just such stylizations are considered to be a bad and low-quality product itself.
      What to do with this?
      1. 0
        14 September 2017 13: 08
        oh, as I understand you .... but as we later cover with mats designers and builders separately .....
  27. +2
    12 September 2017 23: 31
    The article is 100% correct. Especially about education and products. But I would also add about radio technology. In the shops there were whole racks with TVs. I myself had successively “Record”, “Birch” and “Horizon”, which worked for 12-14 years. For their time, very worthy devices and from those seen once American differed only in the absence of remote channel switching. This is because there was then no modern scourge - advertising.
    1. +1
      13 September 2017 01: 02
      especially good memories of a horizon in which picture tubes burned like bulbs.
      1. +1
        13 September 2017 03: 36
        Three channels, what for the remote?
        And if the telly doesn’t work, you’ll hit the top and laughing
  28. +2
    12 September 2017 23: 36
    Quote: Gardamir
    Tv point
    There were radio points, there were no TV points.
    Stop lying about the competition. The best rockets, Kalashnikov assault rifles, can probably be continued for a long time.
    You say defense expenditures, but Putin’s Russia is proud of expenditures on defense. Only the USSR was a people’s state, they tell us, you stay there.

    In the early 60s there was some very short time and payment for TV. True, then TV were very rare. But it quickly went away. Only the collective antenna fee left
    The lack of competition (here I agree with comrade alstr) did not stimulate the release of new products. A definite minus was not the planned economy itself, but its implementation. And there are a lot of examples. And in the automotive industry, and in machine tools.
    The emphasis on rockets and a Kalashnikov assault rifle is not quite right.
    In general, the author mixed a lot, giving one or another thesis. In particular, with regard to printed matter. The quality of the books was very high. At the level of the 50-60s there were even separate bookstores where a person could receive subscribed editions. These were most often classics, both Soviet and Russian, as well as foreign ones. There was very little “garbage” in terms of quality. But in the 60s and later appeared "His Majesty DEFICIENCY". Often, social and political literature was published in a circulation of 4-6 million copies, and interesting fiction or artistic and technical literature with a circulation of 10 times less. As a result - illegal book markets of the 80s.
    Same thing with magazines. To sign an interesting newspaper or magazine, it was necessary to write out something from political literature. Newspaper or political magazine. Then one could hope that it was possible to sign (at work) the same "Youth Technique", "Around the World", etc. They were at the kiosks of Soyuzpechat, but a very limited number. If there was a "blat" (a familiar kiosk) could get. No - I'm sorry. I don’t remember what month the subscription was opened at the Soyuzpechat agency itself. They occupied the line either in the evening or in the early morning.
    About the same thing happened with household appliances. In order to buy something from the products of the Radiotekhnika plant, people queued, sometimes in the evening.
    Yes, Soviet products were “unkillable” (the ZIL-Moscow refrigerator itself worked for 30–40 years, but the same washing machines were at least as “unkillable.” But for housewives it was sometimes “hard labor”.
    Do not really mix everything. The quality of the products was very high, but again, the system gave rise to DEFICIENCY. And the fact that 10 years before that quietly lay in stores (in the early 70s) after 10-12 years, in the early to mid 80s it became a deficit.

    Quote: Stroporez
    Quote: gorgo
    From my childhood I remember - and it was already the beginning of the 80s - that yes, empty shelves and a complete deficit.

    There was no shortage until the 86th year, I personally did not observe !!!

    And where did you live? From 73 to 87 I lived in Novocherkassk. And this is the South of the country, the granary, along with the Stavropol and Krasnodar territories. So what? Somewhere in 1980-1982, oil coupons were introduced. There are 2 packs per month. Bulk in the store was only "Sandwich" oil. But try to cook something on it. In the same Stavropol Territory there were no coupons (at least in Stavropol itself), but the so-called "customer cards". That is, I was attached to a particular store and in another store in the city I could not buy the same.
    1. +2
      13 September 2017 00: 00
      And here I’ve lived half my life in Uzbekistan and everything was in chocolate there. But this only confirms that our elite always fed and will feed the outskirts so that they do not split. They will never learn that it is necessary to pull everything in themselves to a darling. Only the English can do this. They robbed the whole world, and New Zealanders with all sorts of Australians still consider them benefactors. As for Novocherkassk, I now also live in it, so I won’t ask anyone, nobody has gone to the elections of all levels and is not going to go. And now in this d ... me with the mayor-drunk and live. Such we are by nature, Russian, our mother.
    2. +1
      13 September 2017 23: 32
      Again. What is scarcity and lack of anything? Nobody died of hunger and did not freeze in winter. And he didn’t go naked. The problem of deficit and our "lag" appeared exclusively compared with the West, where the consumer boom began, fever. Ours calculated that an individual comrade needed so many sausages, cheese, butter, bread, he should buy himself pants and a shirt, his wife perfume and lipstick, kids toys - doll girls, boys a car. Hand on heart, this is enough for life. But how can this be satisfied when there are “one hundred varieties of sausages, three cars per family and twice a year Canaries” at hand? The problem compared to sickly hedonism - that's the thing!
  29. 0
    12 September 2017 23: 42
    Then the goods not only in the USSR were of high quality, but also in Western countries.
    Nowadays they don’t do such things anywhere.
    Look, my TV was Samsung in 97 from Korea, it broke only in 2017, I’m sure now their products will not last so much
    1. 0
      14 September 2017 13: 11
      Sonya English bought in 1994. still alive - the antenna jack fell apart only ...
  30. 0
    13 September 2017 00: 45
    Quote: Novel 11
    Quote: lubovusm
    I found the 70s, there was sausage, and fish, and meat, and high-quality ones, there was no shortage.

    Where did you live? In the republics, capitals?

    In ordinary cities. In the same Novocherkassk. But by the end of the 70s and early 80s, the deficit appeared
  31. 0
    13 September 2017 00: 53
    Old26Well, the tales started again. Firstly, subscription to periodicals was completely free. When I went to Soyuzpechat and made out "Around the World" no one forced me to sign up for something else. This is a series of heard ringing, but I do not know where he is. Out of the corner of their ears they heard that teachers were forced to subscribe to Teacher’s Newspaper and crumpled into one pile. Yes, maybe they were forced to write it out, but not in the sense that they would not be able to write “Science and Life” without it. And you don’t remember which month the subscription started, because it never stopped. For it was at 3, 6, 9 and 12 months. That is, he could come in the spring or summer to issue before the end of the year. Therefore, stories about queues for the night for a subscription are ridiculous. Further deficit. A very exaggerated concept. If we are talking about luxury goods, it’s possible. If ordinary, then no. Well, tell me, in what family there was no refrigerator, TV and carpet on the wall? 99% had iron, although now everyone insists that it was a deficit.
    1. +1
      13 September 2017 03: 39
      Buckwheat and toilet paper a luxury item? Didn't know wassat
      1. 0
        14 September 2017 13: 12
        and you would all about grub and outhouse ... tongue
    2. The comment was deleted.
  32. +1
    13 September 2017 06: 28
    Another article on the topic "There used to be milk rivers and jelly banks" .. There were, were, only "flowed from the mustache, but didn’t get into the mouth" .. So what? We, who are older, can still understand where the authors are cunning, and where they are telling the truth. But why create myths? And for what purpose? Ask yourself this question ...

    In order to avoid answers in advance with an angry description of today's life - I do not think that everything is fine now. In addition, I believe that we do not smell of capitalism ...
  33. +3
    13 September 2017 09: 07
    Quote: Self
    Old26Well, the tales started again. Firstly, subscription to periodicals was completely free. When I went to Soyuzpechat and made out "Around the World" no one forced me to sign up for something else. This is a series of heard ringing, but I do not know where he is. Out of the corner of their ears they heard that teachers were forced to subscribe to Teacher’s Newspaper and crumpled into one pile. Yes, maybe they were forced to write it out, but not in the sense that they would not be able to write “Science and Life” without it. And you don’t remember which month the subscription started, because it never stopped. For it was at 3, 6, 9 and 12 months. That is, he could come in the spring or summer to issue before the end of the year. Therefore, stories about queues for the night for a subscription are ridiculous. Further deficit. A very exaggerated concept. If we are talking about luxury goods, it’s possible. If ordinary, then no. Well, tell me, in what family there was no refrigerator, TV and carpet on the wall? 99% had iron, although now everyone insists that it was a deficit.

    Well, of course, stories. How otherwise. Respected. This year I am 63. And I have lived all my life in provincial cities. And while working at the department at the institute in order to subscribe to the Technique-Youth (which is 75-76 years old), in addition to the Komsomolskaya Pravda member obligatory for the Komsomol, I also had to subscribe to the socio-political magazine. We tried to take what is cheaper. And then there was a chance to subscribe to the same "TM" or "Around the World". It was possible, of course, to come to the Soyuzpechat agency in the evening and after standing the night subscribe without restrictions to TM and Around the World.
    Yes, it was for 3-6-9 months and for one year. It was only necessary to find such a d.u.r.ak who would issue such journals for 3 months. This short term was most often used for newspapers. At enterprises, design bureaus, institutes, no one bothered with a subscription for 3-6-9 months. Exclusively for a year. OBLIGATION. Well, in extreme cases - for six months, which was rare.
    In kiosks, these magazines appeared, but in the amount of about 30-40 pieces. And who did not have time, he was late.
    The "Feat" application was generally a terrible shortage. In kiosks, if it appeared, then in an amount of 2-3 copies. So there are queues for subscription NOT FUNNY ANYTHING. Himself in the same Stavropol stood "all-night" at the Union Press.

    I did not claim (read carefully) that there was a shortage of refrigerators and televisions. Or on the carpets. But when the Rigonda store opened in our city where the products of the Radiotekhnika plant were sold, then for certain products there were queues and a record. There was no main consumer goods, but there was something more or less worthwhile. It stayed night to take the same Salyut-001 radio. And the complex (amplifier, turntable, cassette, radio) - too.
    And ordinary consumer goods, such as a dual-diapason, or the same, but with a cassette recorder - it really could be approached and bought. But the products of the highest class - alas.
    So it’s not worth the person who lived in adulthood in the years 70-80 to say that everything was just fine, there was no shortage, come and take what you want. Alas, there was a shortage. Not total, but nonetheless
  34. 0
    13 September 2017 10: 47
    I beg of you. Quality products ....
    At the end of the eighties, standing in line from six in the morning and getting ONE pack of sandwich butter .... then try spreading it on bread - it just crumbled like dry halva ..... And boiled sausage with toilet paper and pieces of bacon ... and beef or pork to which bones were added for weight ...
    Yes, in the end, empty store shelves ....
    Children's, youthful memories - they are bright and the most positive. But not objective.
    It was just an ass: deficit, lines, overpayments ... Maybe in the capitals somehow, but on the periphery of the romance was not enough. Rejoiced at everything that they could get. If something was thrown away (a word of some kind) in stores - they grabbed everything, even the wrong size - then resell or trade with someone. Often these were imported things. High-quality Soviet product calmly lay on the shelves. And the prices were - some Vega 108 player cost the engineer’s monthly salary.
    And to buy a car was just happiness. Already did not look that it is crookedly made and breaks constantly. The main thing is that she is.
    No need to idealize the USSR. There were positive moments, but certainly not the quality of products or goods or education.
    1. 0
      13 September 2017 23: 03
      And what were the positive aspects?
    2. 0
      14 September 2017 13: 56
      That's right, at the end of 80. But still, the sausage with toilet paper is a bust ... here a friend with a clear nickname says that there was no paper .. maybe because it was added to the sausage?
  35. 0
    13 September 2017 11: 48
    This Rusin is an open Troll ... He is unfamiliar with the deficit - this is when you pay for a salary, and then you cannot buy what you would like for that salary, but you have to buy what you "threw away". What is the point of work then? Life? Why work if you don’t get the result you are hoping for. Therefore, vodka was the main antidepressant: people drank. Yes, there were quality goods, but only in the special distribution system.
  36. +1
    13 September 2017 13: 16
    Comrade Rusin, if you believe the information from his page by reference, born in 1976
    By simple calculations, we get the picture: a friend went to grade 1 during the "carriage races". And his only conscious and objective memory of the then USSR was Swan Lake on TV.
  37. +1
    13 September 2017 15: 16
    Society is so mired in the cheap consumption of everything that we can’t even talk about the quality of products and the quality of life. In the USSR, it may not have been a huge variety, but everything was needed, and of excellent quality! It is a fact! The moral of the society was healthy, not spoiled by abundance and other cheap things in beautiful color wrappers. Oh about ..... whether such a country !!!
    1. +1
      13 September 2017 15: 37
      An amazing feature is to draw global conclusions for the era in the 70 years of the existence of the Soviet Union. Moreover, the lesser part of the commentator’s life was spent living in the USSR, the more global the conclusions. smile
      I will not go into a meaningless debate about life in the USSR. But one thing is certain: life was much easier.
  38. 0
    13 September 2017 21: 25
    Quote: Alexey-74
    In the USSR, it may not have been a huge variety, but everything was needed, and of excellent quality! It is a fact!

    What do you mean that everything needed was of excellent quality. And in what period of time
  39. 0
    14 September 2017 13: 58
    Quote: Mood Ozvon
    And what were the positive aspects?

    The most positive thing was the predictability of your life. I knew that after graduating from school you will either go on to study further if you are smart enough, or go to work. This was a positive point that there was no unemployment. Although sometimes even the most notorious drunk and parasite was difficult to dismiss from work. It was possible, but difficult.
    After graduating from the same university, you received a distribution of where to go to work, in which city or town. And as a young specialist, he had certain privileges. You just MUST BE to hire where you had a direction. And now the situation with graduates is most often the following: they don’t take without experience, and nowhere to take experience.
    As a young specialist, you could get housing earlier than others.
    That is, there was FAITH IN TOMORROW. and everything else - everything was. And including and deficit. And low-quality products and everything else, but everything is different everywhere and at different times.
  40. 0
    14 September 2017 15: 26
    1988, the city of Bryansk. Meat in the state. no shops. only bones and trimmings. When chicken is brought in, the entire microdistrict is in line. Meat is abundant in the market from private traders. It is very beneficial to feed piglets on cheap bread. Our family thus fattened nutria. 200 goals. Not a penny of taxes, no payments. You buy cheap bread, you take vegetables for moonshine on the collective farm field, and you sell (meat, skins) expensively. Because there is a deficit. And one hat from nutria costs like a monthly salary (from 120 to 200 rubles). Naturally, such an economy could not exist for long.
  41. 0
    15 September 2017 18: 02
    And why do Dakar rallies win Kamaz and not Mercedes?
    But what about these KAMAZs of their own design? Cummins engines?