We have never been brothers ...

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We have never been brothers ...


I carefully review the media in Ukraine. And that's what recently caught my eye. A question is being discussed there - will their country be able to establish normal relations with Russia after the Crimea and the Donbas? Most experts and analysts believe that no, can not ...



The main argument - they say that the Russians were considered by our brothers, the closest people. And then Russia suddenly came and took the Crimea for itself, and then also launched a war in the Donbas. Well, what then can be close, fraternal relations?

You know, all these experts remind me of the characters of the famous Ukrainian anecdote, when one toupee offered another to go fill the face of Moskal. "And if he stuffed us?" - The second asked cautiously. “And why do we need something ?!” - the initiator of the fight was amazed.

This anecdote in the juicy Ukrainian language recently in a television interview with the famous journalist Dmitry Gordon in Kiev was told by the wonderful Soviet composer Vladimir Bystryakov. At the same time, he added the following: Ukraine all the years of its independence constantly teased, and at times openly humiliated its powerful northern neighbor. That got down to the Donbas and the Crimea ...

I’ll add on my own. It would be nice if the matter concerned only our economic or purely political contradictions - such as disputes over the price of gas, integration into Europe or the Customs Union, disagreements over the stay of our Black Sea fleet in Crimea ... But after all, Ukrainians - with the direct assistance of their own authorities - also openly fought against Russia, killed our soldiers and officers!

Alas, for some reason Ukraine does not want to remember this today ...

How cannon fat in the Caucasus went

It all started back in the 90s, as soon as the Soviet Union collapsed, when the nationalistic organization Ukrainian National Assembly, the Ukrainian National Self-Defense (UNA-UNSO, appeared in Ukraine, is now banned in Russia). Its militants have participated in almost all the local wars in the former Soviet Union.

In 1993, UNSO members went to war on the territory of Abkhazia, as part of the Georgian army. The reason is that Abkhazians are guided by Russia, which, according to the leaders of the UNSO, is "historical an enemy of Ukraine. ” There is such a documentary shot by the Ukrainian journalist George Gongadze, it is called "Shadows of War" (the film is easy to find on the Internet). So, one of the leaders of the UNSO Igor Mazur right there says that he is fighting in Abkhazia precisely with “Russian imperialism” ...

And next year, the Unsovites resurfaced in rebellious Chechnya, as part of gangs of Chechen militants. This is what Segodnya.ru website writes about:

“... a number of leaders of the UNSO, led by its then leader, Dmitry Korchinsky, arrived in Grozny. And although it was not possible to meet with Dudayev, meetings were held with Zelimkhan Yandarbiyev and Aslan Maskhadov ... It is known that at the time of the storming of Grozny by the opposition 24 on November 1994. Korchinsky was there, and subsequently took part in the interrogations of Russian tankers taken prisoner by the militants. After the outbreak of hostilities, a squad “Prometheus” was sent from Ukraine to Chechnya, the backbone of which was militants trained in Georgia. According to the Russian special services, the main mass of Ukrainian mercenaries in the rebellious republic were not "ideological" party extremists, but marginals, recruited to participate in hostilities by special UNSO structures. "

Particularly in Chechnya, militants such as Alexander Muzychko (nicknamed Sashko Bily) and Oleg Chelnov (call sign Berkut) “distinguished themselves”. If Muzychko was a native of Western Ukraine, that is, a typical Bandera, then Chelny was a typical Russian degenerate from Kharkov, whom the ideology of Ukrainian nationalism pretty much littered his head. Both were awarded the highest Chechen orders “Honor of the Nation” for numerous murders of Russian servicemen. They are no longer alive today, both were shot like dogs - Chelnova in March 1996, in the area of ​​Grozny Minutka Square (allegedly came under fire from the Nizhny Novgorod SOBR), and Muzychko was slammed down by Ukrainian police for gangsterism, immediately after Euromaidan.

In total, according to various estimates, at least 300 Ukrainian militants passed through the Chechen war ...

In addition, UNSO was active in the information direction of the Chechen war. Today.ru:

“Along with direct participation in hostilities, members of the UNSO provided Chechen rebels with powerful propaganda support. On the basis of local organizations of the UNSO, committees “in support of Chechnya” and information centers “Chechen-press” were set up in major cities of Ukraine ... In 1998, Dmitry Korchinsky organized the “Institute of the Caucasus”, whose goal was to create a broad anti-Russian front in this region ... The Institute of the Caucasus and the Eurasia Center closely cooperated with the center of the Caucasus, the famous Chechen Wahhabi Movladi Udugov, as well as with the Congress of the Vainakhs Ruslan Akayev, who controls the activities of the Chechen communities in Europe ... ”

Another anti-Russian attack by the UNSO falls on the Russian-Georgian war in South Ossetia, in August 2008. Even after the end of hostilities Investigative Committee of the Russian Prosecutor General's Office made the following statement:

“On the side of the Georgian armed forces in the armed aggression against the Republic of South Ossetia ... at least 200 members of the UNA-UNSO participated.”

From the reports of Interfax news agencies from 5 of September 2008:

"Attorney General of South Ossetia Taimuraz Khugaev presented the facts of the participation of mercenaries from the UNA-UNSO in military actions against South Ossetia ...

During the investigation of the criminal case about the attack of the Georgian army on South Ossetia, they managed to find and withdraw a large number of documents about plans to seize the republic. These papers indicate that the participation in the hostilities on the side of Georgia was attended by mercenaries, said South Ossetia’s Attorney-General Taimuraz Khugaev on Tuesday. According to him, when studying these documents, "an almost complete picture of Georgia’s attack on South Ossetia has been established."

“With absolute certainty, I can say that members of the Ukrainian organization UNA-UNSO took part in the hostilities against South Ossetia on the side of the Georgian army,” the prosecutor general said.

According to him, the investigation established that one of the UNA-UNSO groups was preparing on the territory of the Tamarasheni village of the Georgian enclave in South Ossetia. On the base subordinated to the Georgian Interior Ministry, photographs of mercenaries were found, the staffing table of the so-called anti-terror center of the “shadow government” of South Ossetia, which was called the anti-terror center of the South Ossetia’s interior ministry, where the UNA-UNSO group was called Brothers .

According to prosecutor Taimuraz Khugaev, “this“ anti-terror center ”had nothing to do with the Ministry of Interior of South Ossetia, since it was formed by the puppet government and was completely under the control of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Georgia.

What and who was discovered by Ossetian prosecutors, was recently told by the Ukrainian political analyst Oksana Skoda, who visited South Ossetia in 2008 year:

“The fact of participation of Ukrainian citizens in hostilities in South Ossetia on the side of the Georgian aggressors has been irrefutably proven by the Prosecutor General's Office of the Republic of South Ossetia. That in tankswho shot Tskhinvali were Ukrainian mercenaries, it became known even before the end of the war. Then the secretary of the Security Council of the RSO Anatoly Barankevich said that among the killed enemy soldiers, the bodies of at least three Ukrainian mercenaries were found. One of them is Gennady Viktorovich Borisenko, born in 1966, a native of Lviv, the names of the other two are Burdenko and Prokopenko. As for the captive Igor Petrenko, a native of Dnepropetrovsk region, I saw him personally: before he was sent to Vladikavkaz, he was held in the building of school No. 6. During interrogations, he said that the Georgian troops included about 300 mercenaries from Ukraine, mostly nationalists. Indeed, traces of the UNA-UNSO “stay” were found in the former Georgian enclave of Kkheti-Tamarasheni (Dmitry Sanakoev’s “patrimony”).

Portraits of Roman Shukhevych, printouts of the program of the Congress of Ukrainian Nationalists, textbooks, symbols. The staffing table of the Georgian Anti-Terror Center, where five immigrants from Ukraine - Shapoval, Kucherenko, Shevchenko, Matviyuk and Zhovtokon, are separated into a separate subdivision “Brothers”, an order to assign the UAZ to the Ukrainian Kucherenko, etc. ”.

“Sprinkle the earth with evil blood” (from the work of “humanist” Taras Shevchenko)

It may be objected that all this was a private initiative of the nationalists, to whom the Ukrainian state allegedly had nothing to do. But it really wasn't like that ...

I will begin with the fact that Ukrainian nationalism crawled into power at all not after Euromaidan, but literally immediately after the formation of an independent Ukrainian state. Because at the Foreign Ministry of Ukraine, geopolitical theories of the founding fathers of Ukrainian nationalism were immediately in demand. The expert on this issue, researcher Vladislav Gulevich writes about this:

“... The ideologists of Ukrainian nationalism developed in vain an innumerable variety of theories and methods of dividing Russia along national“ seams ”, and expanding the borders of the Ukrainian national state to the east.

There was no unity on the issue of the expansion of Ukraine among these ideologues. Each of them wrote what his imagination pushed him to. The nationalist poet Oles Babiy (1897 — 1975) in 1929 in the “March of Ukrainian Nationalists” (adopted as the hymn of the OUN - the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists) in the last verse inserted the lines “The Catholic Ukrainian Power, free and powerful, from Sanaa to the Caucasus ".

Mikhail Kolodzinsky, founder of the military doctrine of Ukrainian nationalism, referent of the OUN regional executive secretary (1902 — 1939) went further, and wrote in the Ukrainian Military Doctrine: “We, building the Ukrainian state, must move the border of Europe to Altai and Dzungaria. Europe is just missing this space. Ukraine is called to connect this space with Europe politically, economically and culturally, and the phrase “on the verge of two worlds” will have a real meaning ... As Caesar, gaining Gaul, opened the whole of Europe for Roman culture and civilization, so our nationalist revolutionary armies should open for Western European culture, a space extending to the south and south-east of Ukraine. ”

And further: “It was a magnificent task of our life, as a people, as a race - to get a steppe over the Black and Caspian Sea and to build here, on the verge of two continents, the center of a new world civilization. When the policy of Ukrainian nationalism seeks to establish the borders of Ukraine on the Volga and extend its influence to Central Asia, the military doctrine of Ukrainian nationalism cannot be limited to focusing only on the ethnographic Ukrainian lands. A person who refuses this struggle and calls for pacifism is a rotten growth on a healthy body. The revolutionary struggle is not only the arming of the masses, but also the beginning of the creation of military force, the beginning of the organization of the Ukrainian army for the tasks that await us in Eastern Europe. ”

The propagandist of the OUN Panteleimon Koval (present name Panteleimon Sak) in 1942 in the brochure “Ukraine, what it was, what it is and what it will be” dreamed that it would cover “land from the Volga to the mountains of the Caucasus and the Black Sea to the source of the Dnieper, occupying space in 1 million square meters. km. "

Yuri Lipa (1900 — 1944), who is now called the founder of the geopolitics of Ukrainian nationalism, argued that the fate of Ukraine is to dominate in the area from the Balkans to the Urals.

When you read about these plans, you wonder how their authors have been able to live so long in the company of normal people — after all, what they have stated is wild and divorced from reality. But it is these clinical characters that are doing intellectual weather in Ukraine now. In a stupid time, the need for stupid people is sharply increasing.

Lipu is especially often remembered. Probably, because of the frank name of one of his opus - “The Section of Russia” (“Rose of Russia”), where particular attention is paid to many Russian regions, including the Caucasus ...

It is symptomatic that Lipa's book was reprinted in New York in 1954, and the author's preface to it is dated 22 June 1941. Apparently, the nationalist Y. Lipu was so impressed by the attack of the Third Reich on the USSR that he immediately sat down for the preface to his brochure . In it, he outlined ideas very similar to the ideas of the Nazis in relation to Russia.

In works of this type it is difficult to understand where common sense ends and fantasies begin. Lipa paid a lot of attention to racial issues. In his presentation in the European part of Russia there are only two centers of the tall population - a small center near the borders with the Baltic States, and a much larger “Ukrainian-Caucasian center” in the south.

The expansion of Ukraine at Y.Lipy "from thousands of years" was aimed at getting the Black Sea shores. Where he found Ukraine thousands of years ago remains a mystery. But this is not the case, but how Y. Lipa saw the process of separation of Ukraine and Russia through the activization of Ukraine’s nationalist policies in the south, including the Caucasus.

An example of a wise Caucasian policy for Y. Lipa is English General Forestis Walker. In 1919, Mr. Walker outlined three formats for solving the Caucasian issue:

1) the creation of independent, unrelated Transcaucasian republics;

2) federation on the rights of federations to the North Caucasus, which must also be separated from Russia;

3) autonomy of these republics within Russia (the most negative scenario for London).

“The Caucasus is a gateway to very important territories. Not to mention the oil-rich Iraq, we are talking about Iran, an important platform from the Caspian Sea to the Caucasus to free sea routes. For the young energetic peoples of the Black Sea basin, first of all, for Ukrainians with Caucasians, the routes through Iran are the only ways to a great future. The Black Sea is an inland lake for the Black Sea peoples, ”writes Y. Lipa.

And calls to go to the Persian Gulf: "The road through the Caucasus and northern Iran to the waves of the Persian Gulf is very difficult. Such a tradition is to some extent common in the Caucasus, in Central Asia, and even in the folklore of the peoples of the Black Sea basin, the tradition of the trips of Alexander the Great may be an analogy for the movement to the Persian Gulf. But the main content of expansion through the “Iranian bridge” can be only one thing: the search for a natural way out for the productive forces of Ukraine, the Caucasus and other Black Sea peoples. ”

In other words, the inflamed imagination of Yuri Lipa called on Caucasians to participate in the expansion of nationalist Ukraine in the direction of the Persian Gulf, armed with the ideology of Russophobia. Without taking into account the ratio of the capabilities and abilities of such Ukraine and the dreams of Y. Lipa himself with geopolitical realities ... ”.

And although there is still no serious opportunity for Russia to spoil Russia in the Caucasus from an insignificant from a military-economic point of view, these attempts were made more than once according to the precepts of the founding fathers of ukronacism.

For example, let us pay attention to when exactly the UNSO went to war in Abkhazia. This is the spring of 1993 of the year. But at the same time, “by coincidence,” the Ukrainian-Georgian relations at the highest level suddenly became more active. 9 April 1993, the Georgian President, Eduard Shevardnadze, flew to Kiev, where he met with his Ukrainian counterpart Leonid Kravchuk. And before that, Shevardnadze gave a great radio interview where he praised Ukraine in every possible way and spoke of the growing role of this country in Europe.

During that summit, Kravchuk announced that he showed great interest in resolving the Abkhaz conflict and wanted to end it as soon as possible. The historian Aslan Avidzba in his book “Problems of the Military-Political History of the Patriotic War in Abkhazia” writes that all this Georgian-Ukrainian “fraternization” took place against the backdrop of another conflict with Russia over the division of the Black Sea Fleet:

“In Kiev, an open letter was distributed to the President of Ukraine L. Kravchuk signed by deputies of the Verkhovna Rada urging to unilaterally denounce the Yalta Agreement of 3 of August 1992 of the year and build their own naval forces. At the 4-th Congress of the Union of Officers of Ukraine 10 on April 1993, the Minister of Defense of this country K.Morozov said: “We must quickly divide the warships of the Black Sea Fleet and withdraw the Russian part from the Ukrainian ports and bases and in no case agree to rent by Russia Ukrainian territory. And if the Russian side demands just such a price for the division of the Black Sea Fleet, the question of withdrawing the entire Black Sea Fleet from Ukraine will be raised. ”

In general, the Ukrainian-Georgian rapprochement on Abkhazia from Kiev clearly pursued the goal of pressure on Russia with the aim of dividing the Black Sea Fleet under the terms of Kiev. But not only. As a person told me, who worked for several years in the presidential administration of Ukraine, Kravchuk in 1993 seriously considered the option of introducing Ukrainian peacekeepers into the zone of the Abkhaz conflict, precisely in order to press Russia in the Caucasian direction. For this, the “voluntary” detachment UNA-UNSO was sent, so to speak, for “reconnaissance in force”.

Nothing happened with Kravchuk then - the Georgian army was defeated in a matter of months, and the UNSO had to quickly get out of the combat zone, losing at least 10 people killed. However, cooperation on an anti-Russian basis with Georgia Kiev was laid down - it continues today ...

Plowers and power reshaly

And now let's call the patrons of the UNSO in the highest authorities of the Ukrainian government.

The organization itself was created with the direct assistance of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the Kiev Patriarchate (UOC-KP), a schismatic structure that separated after the collapse of the USSR from the Russian Orthodox Church in order to create a “national Ukrainian church independent of the Muscovites”. The “Patriarch” of this “church”, pop-rastiga Filaret (Denisenko) established a special military structure during his diocese, the so-called “Rite of Saint Hilarion”, which became the official cover of the UNSO, the source of its funding. Meanwhile, Filaret himself was always entrusted to the highest circles of the Kiev authorities, where important decisions were made, including on Ukrainian politics in the Caucasus.

Another patron of the nationalists was SBU General Alexander Skipalsky, who oversaw military intelligence in Ukraine — it was along this intelligence line that UNSO was heading to Chechnya. It was General Skipalsky who, in a conversation with journalists of the Top Secret newspaper, in the 1997 called the famous Chechen terrorist Salman Raduyev his personal friend in XNUMX. According to some reports, Skipalsky, through the officers and Chechens, not only led espionage against Russia, but also engaged in the transportation of drugs from the Caucasus to Europe.

But Skipalsky was not so alone there. My source in Kiev said that employees of the Council of National Security and Defense of Ukraine (NSDC), who were wearing shoulder straps, worked directly with Dmitry Korchinsky - and worked until the 2009 of the year ...

Also, my source called me the name of the long-term mayor of Odessa, Eduard Gurwitz, who was friends with the UNSO leader Korchinsky and actively helped to wage an anti-Russian information war in favor of the Chechens. This is confirmed by a wide variety of media. So, according to journalist Vladimir Druzhinin:

“In 1996, in Odessa, there were five concerts of Chechen musician Imam Alimsultanov, a supporter of the gene. Dudayev. The then head of Odessa Edward Gurvits (in 1997, he was invited to the "inauguration" of the leader of the terrorists Aslan Maskhadov helped the Chechen fighter in this). But the terrorists are like spiders in a bank. I. Alimsultanov was killed in Odessa as a result of internal Chechen squabbles.

Under E. Gurwitz, a cooperation agreement was signed between Odessa and Dudaevskaya Ichkeria. For this purpose, a whole delegation of terrorists headed by Vaha Arsanov came to Odessa, and the Odessa press published anti-Russian interviews with Ichkerian extremists on the subject of the seizure by Shamil Basayev of the hospital and maternity hospital in Budennovsk in 1995. ”

But Hurwitz was friends with Korchinsky and Chechen gangsters not only on an “ideological basis”. As my Kiev source told me:

- The fact is that the cunning Jew Hurwitz, deeply immersed in crime and corruption, always wanted to have a pocket power structure - the presence of such a force always makes it possible for his "opponents", "allies" and "partners" to offer even with all their desire - they can not refuse. This “argument” in Hurwitz and became the UNA-UNSO. Their “friendship with Korchinskiy” was not interrupted, and after Hurwitz moved from the chair of the Odessa mayor to the position of deputy of the Verkhovna Rada, they were still together - the deputy and his assistant.

Hurwitz, by the way, always entered the party of power that currently rules in the country - so his position always reflected to one degree or another the power policy ...

Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine did not hide its anti-Russian nature. As the Ukrainian journalist Maria Bazelyuk wrote with pride in the 90s:

“The absolute majority of Ukrainians in 1994 clearly supported Chechenia. 105 deputies of the Supreme Council of Ukraine appealed to the UN Security Council with a demand to consider the question of Russian aggression against Chechenia at an emergency session. The Supreme Council of Ukraine did not condemn itself as a shame as some of the “powerful worlds”, avoiding in its statement the vile definition of the war in the CRI as the “internal affairs of Russia”. On the initiative of the people's deputies of Ukraine, an inter-parliamentary committee for the protection of Chechnya was formed, which included, besides the Ukrainian, parliamentarians of Lithuania, Azerbaijan, Estonia and other countries. "

Supported by the Rada of Chechen gangsters not only parliamentary documents. In 1996, a certain Bakievich, who introduced himself as a Ukrainian reporter, said in an interview with Chechen militants on television that Ukraine, through the Verkhovna Rada, had allocated “humanitarian aid for the Russian people” to the freedom-loving Chechen people for 330 millions of Russian rubles (one can only guess if recall that a large number of ammunition for Dudayev gangs came just from Ukraine).

Also, the Verkhovna Rada approved the renaming of two streets in Ivano-Frankivsk and Lviv - they, obviously in the peak of Russia, were named after General Dudayev. Rada’s deputy Mikhail Ratushny personally transported the widow of General Alla Dudayeva from the Caucasus to the Baltic States in 1996, while the SBU then pretended to pass through the Ukraine that she “did not notice anything” ...

But of course, the Ukrainian state took the most openly hostile anti-Russian position during the war in South Ossetia. And it concerns not only the militants of the UNA-UNSO. The Investigative Committee of Russia found that the personnel Ukrainian military specialists served the Georgian air defense systems, namely, Buk-M1 anti-aircraft missile systems, which shot down Russian combat aircraft. From the official statement of the Investigative Committee (I quote from the website Today. Ru):

“So, Ukraine not only sold Georgia at a lower price for the Buk-М1 air defense system, but also sent a group of civilian specialists from the town of Balakley of the Kharkiv region who served these complexes, with the help of which the Georgians fired on Russian combat aircraft ... Officers of the Ukrainian Army Valery Kabanets, Dmitry Pilipchuk, Vladimir Ponomarenko, other specialists who were on the territory of Georgia from 5 to 13 in August 2008 of the year, that is, before, during and after the armed conflict with South Ossetia, they wrote their own explanatory notes about your stay in Georgia ... “.

All this was preceded by a long-term military-technical cooperation between Ukraine and Georgia. According to Oksana Skoda:

“It is not a secret for anyone that the military aggression of Georgia against the RSO was carefully planned and financed by the USA and the NATO countries. An ominous plan to destroy the Ossetians tried to implement for the sake of Georgia’s accession to NATO and fueling the war in the Caucasus. It would seem, what have the non-aligned Ukraine? Alas, in the face of the genocide of the Ossetian people, it is in the person of the unfortunate President Yushchenko.

An analysis of the military-technical cooperation between Kiev and Tbilisi shows: Georgia was armed and its army was trained against the only adversary — Russia. And this was done by President Yushchenko with a long-distance transatlantic optical sight. It was the Ukrainians who created the airspace monitoring system for Georgia’s air defense (it includes the command post in Tbilisi and 8 radar stations, as well as the Kolchuga complex consisting of three passive radar stations). By the time of the attack on Tskhinval, the system was mounted and fully adapted to the combat conditions, controlled by Ukrainian combat calculations.

Formally, the military-technical cooperation of Ukraine with Georgia started in 1998 by L. Kuchma and E. Shevardnadze. Before 2004, it was embodied in the missile cruiser “Tbilisi”, two sailing boats of the “Wall” type and 10 training and combat aircraft L-29 “Dolphin”. Kumovya Yushchenko and Saakashvili went much further: from 2006, Ukrainian supplies to Georgia included the full range of weapons: from T-72 tanks to the OCA-AKM and BUK-MXNUM anti-aircraft missile systems. By 1, Ukraine became the main supplier of military equipment and weapons to Georgia. Only in 2007 did the 2007 of the T-74 tank converted to NATO standards come into service with the Georgian military. During the presidency of Yushchenko, Georgia has been enriched with dozens of armored personnel carriers, infantry fighting vehicles, self-propelled guns, airplanes and helicopters, anti-aircraft missile systems, tens of thousands of Kalashnikov assault rifles. And in May, 72 between Tbilisi and Kiev was contracted to supply more 2008 T-20 tanks "...

I remember then that the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine and its General Staff "indignantly" tried to refute all these facts, and considered the statement of our Investigative Committee "as an attempt of the Russian side to discredit the Armed Forces of Ukraine". And in the SBU, the curator of the UNA-UNSO, the statement of the Russian Federation was directly called "false." And this is despite the fact that the Russian law enforcement agencies were provided with weighty and convincing evidence!

However, today time has put everything in its place. Not so long ago, Ukrainian high-ranking liars "burned" the former president of Georgia, Mikhail Saakashvili, who said last year:

“If it were not for the help of Ukraine, the Georgian state would not have survived ... The reason why we were saved, the main thing is Ukraine’s help ... Because in Ukraine we trained our own military specialists, Ukraine gave us air defense, which was critically important in the first days the invasions, because the Russians could not get a critical advantage in the first days ... Ukraine gave us the Buk and Osa systems and several ammunition kits for each system. Thanks to these systems, we shot down 12 Russian bombers. ”

Want blood? So get it!

In this whole story, I am amazed not even by nationalists with're-rulers. For some reason, the broad masses of this country, the so-called our “brothers”, were indifferent to such Russophobic policy in the Caucasus!

“The participation of Ukrainians in wars in the post-Soviet space after Afghanistan has long been an irrelevant topic for the majority of the people,” writes the Ukrainian edition of Reporter. “There was no massive support or condemnation on television.”

“It was interesting only to those who were in the know,” says political analyst Mikhail Pogrebinsky ...

“Ukraine was then a“ sleeping ”country,” adds political analyst Vadim Karasev ... ”.

Well, here we are ... I guess, the Ukrainian rulers thought that in the future it would be possible to spoil Russia with impunity wherever possible and as it pleases, including shedding the blood of Russians. Well, they are very wrong ...

In 90, the leader of the UNSO, Dmitry Korchinsky, openly said that his people in the Caucasus were bleeding Russia so that the Ukrainians themselves would not then fight for the Donbass and the Crimea, where sympathy for Russia had always been strong.

And God clearly heard him - the seeds of war, which he and others like him had once diligently sowed in the Caucasus, have now grown in Ukraine itself with an abundant and bloody crop!
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  1. +10
    16 August 2017 05: 52
    Muzychko is a native of western Ukraine ..... no comment! the author is burning !!! Alexander Muzychko (his land is glassy) is a native of Kizel, Perm Region. damn, I don’t know whether it’s worth further reading .....
    1. +14
      16 August 2017 07: 10
      Quote: nik-karata
      Alexander Muzychko (his land is glassy) is a native of Kizel, Perm Region. damn, I don’t know if it’s worth further reading ...

      I noticed that too. But it’s worth reading. I like it. And so it was. Collected in one. In a structured way. I liked the disclosure of how anti-Russian activity was promoted in Ukraine, but Russia did not notice this point blank! And this is a huge omission, which we ourselves are to blame. And as a result, what resulted from this ..
      1. +1
        16 August 2017 11: 24
        The Black Sea Fleet did not write about the seizures of lighthouses, about the "confrontation" on Tuzla Island. Various Rukhs and other nationalists intensified in the mid 80s. At the end of the 80s they quietly put up their pickets (I won’t tell you about the whole Ukraine, but in Nikolaev they were in the city center and the police I didn’t touch a finger) And I’ll add from myself. I served in Nikolaev (87-89). Everyone who came to study with the RSFSR and other republics studied at BMP, T-54,55,62,72, etc. All immigrants there were only 64 from Ukraine. So, the “roots” and preparation of current events are very, very old.
        1. +4
          17 August 2017 09: 33
          Well, there’s nothing strange there. Obviously, according to mobilization plans, the mobile reserve living in / on the Ukrainian SSR is mobilized from the reserve and sent to Kharkov to form tank units and formations. Do not forget that the plant producing the T-64 is located in Kharkov. So it’s quite understandable why Ukrainians were trained exclusively on the T-64. No one could have imagined, in Soviet times, that it was training specialist soldiers for the army of a potential adversary.
          1. 0
            18 August 2017 13: 56
            Probably the way it was. Of course then it was hard to imagine that we could clash against each other.
        2. +1
          17 August 2017 17: 32
          In the Salt, in the training ??
          1. 0
            18 August 2017 13: 54
            They are the most, with nasty water, a smelly dining room and always with cabbage on the 1st and 2nd. laughing
      2. +5
        16 August 2017 13: 25
        There is so much blood in me ... But, I, my relatives and my daughter are Russian.
    2. +32
      16 August 2017 07: 13
      Born in 1962 in the city of Kizel, Pem region In 1967, the family moved to the Rivne region of the Ukrainian SSR. Those. at the time of moving to west. Ukraine was him 5 years old. So the author is right.
    3. 0
      16 August 2017 07: 27
      Quote: nik-karata
      Muzychko is a native of western Ukraine ..... no comment! the author is burning !!! Alexander Muzychko (his land is glassy) is a native of Kizel, Perm Region. damn, I don’t know whether it’s worth further reading .....

      I did not master ..
    4. +6
      16 August 2017 07: 28
      Quote: nik-karata
      Muzychko is a native of western Ukraine ..... no comment! the author is burning !!! Alexander Muzychko (his land is glassy) is a native of Kizel, Perm Region. damn, I don’t know whether it’s worth further reading .....

      Yeah ... I was a schoolmate born in Born-Sulinovo. When the father served in the SGW. And he told us that he came from the north of Russia, they say, and relatives there, and his father settled there after leaving, and he himself went there on vacation ...
      It turns out that he was lying, a hidden Pole ... Probably, he was carrying far-reaching Great Poland plans 8)))
      You opened my eyes straight to his essence ... 8)))
    5. +16
      16 August 2017 07: 53
      It is you who find fault. He was really born in Russia in the family of the deported Bandera. But already in 5 years he turned out to be in Ukraine. So he is a Bandera geek and family and place where formed.
    6. +13
      16 August 2017 08: 36
      Quote: nik-karata
      damn, I don’t know whether it’s worth further reading .....

      Worth it. Since, in spite of such inaccuracies, the author poses questions correctly. The vast majority of Ukrainians either do not know or do not remember these events. For them, the whole story of enmity began with Maidan, when they were really waiting for the attack of the Russian OMON and consider the snipers "Russian". They will tell you everything about the "curb" and "vacationers", but will have "round eyes" after hearing what is told in this article.
      I do not agree with one:
      We have never been brothers ...
      There were, are and will be. So in OUR GENERAL HISTORY, there are enough moments COMBINING us
    7. +4
      16 August 2017 09: 44
      Quote: nik-karata
      Muzychko is a native of western Ukraine ..... no comment! the author is burning !!! Alexander Muzychko (his land is glassy) is a native of Kizel, Perm Region. damn, I don’t know whether it’s worth further reading .....

      Well, the Tbilisi missile cruiser, also that pearl, I’m generally silent about the supply of the Georgian army to Ukraine - after the collapse of the USSR, Ukraine sold weapons to everyone who pays, from the old Soviet stocks - it has been consistently included in the top ten exporters of the world all these years. So in addition to Georgia, you can find a dozen more countries that the Ukrainians armed
    8. +6
      16 August 2017 13: 20
      Quote: nik-karata
      Muzychko is a native of western Ukraine.


      Hello dear. But the author is still right - “natives” and “natives” have different concepts. Well, about reading or not reading - this will be your choice, the author is neither cold nor hot from this. And the article is correct, I personally read it with pleasure. Yes
    9. +4
      16 August 2017 18: 52
      Quote: nik-karata
      Alexander Muzychko (his land is glassy) is a native of Kizel, Perm Region. damn, I don’t know whether to read further

      And he was born into a family of Western Ukrainians who were evicted from Western Ukraine immediately after the war. So his mentality is precisely Zapadensky and his place of birth has nothing to do with it. moreover, he left for his historic homeland as a child.
    10. +1
      19 August 2017 21: 43
      He was born on September 19, 1962 in the city of Kizel, Perm Region, in the family of a Ukrainian Ivan Dmitrievich (born 1934) and a Belarussian Elena Pavlovna. According to Ivan Dmitrievich, his father’s brother (cousin of Alexander Muzychko) fought in the Ukrainian rebel army, for this in 1947 the whole family was sent "to Mordovian camps, then to settlements, in the Perm Territory." In 1967, the parents of Alexander Muzychko were allowed to return to Ukraine, in the Rivne region. According to Sergei Pandrak, a friend of Alexander Muzychko, Sashko "was an ideological person, a folder with his mother explained to him from childhood what Ukraine is and how our grandfathers fought for its freedom." Dear, it doesn’t matter where he was born, it is important from whom and how he was raised and into whom he degenerated.
  2. +10
    16 August 2017 06: 04
    It would never occur to anyone to come to a “fool” and advise patients how to behave the same way with Ukraine, and it didn’t start in the 90s, but much earlier in the USSR. Then they just laughed, thought they were kidding, and it’s like that -with the great "ukrami" Russia had to communicate "not washed".
    1. +4
      16 August 2017 07: 46
      Quote: ML-334
      with Ukraine, and it didn’t begin in the 90s, but much earlier, in the USSR. Then they just laughed, thought they were kidding, and it was like with the great “Ukrainians” that Russia had to communicate “not washed”.

      During the struggle against the “enemies of the revolution," the fiery rr-e-volunteers "fought among themselves - who is cooler, who is more for the" revolution ": for example, during the fight against the" counter "that organized the Holodomor in Ukraine, Khrushchev requested Stalin’s sanction for spreading either 30000 or 40000 people! ... I received this request back with the inscription “Get down, duhr-ak!”
      ------------------------
      So - yes, it all started much earlier - exactly after 1917 ...
      1. 0
        17 August 2017 17: 32
        >> I received this request back with the postscript "Calm down, do-u-r-ak!"
        And how do you live there? Well, in parallel reality?)))
        1. +1
          22 August 2017 10: 32
          Quote: tanatos49
          >> I received this request back with the postscript "Calm down, do-u-r-ak!"
          And how do you live there? Well, in parallel reality?)))

          This "parallel reality" is on display at a stand under glass in one of the "institutes of political economy" or "economic policy" (in Moscow) - not a very shabby paper autographed by Khrushchev and Stalin ...
          ------------------------------
          ... I won’t tell you the address - you will find it yourself ... in a perpendicular world!
  3. +14
    16 August 2017 06: 30
    "RF" itself led to such a situation. About 30 years ago, dare to confront a direct confrontation with the USSR - it's like jumping into the mouth of a dragon. Now the "successor of the USSR" itself gives rise to the creation of a "gang of jackals" at the borders. Events in the Donbass and Ukraine are a vivid example of such a policy.
    1. +16
      16 August 2017 07: 20
      Now the "successor of the USSR" itself gives rise to the creation of a "gang of jackals" at the borders.

      If only at the borders. Enough "jackals" have already bred in the country, who openly conduct their campaigns on TV screens and influence young people. And the leadership all plays in "democracy" and "freedom of speech." About the article. People who were brought up from childhood in hatred of Russia and all Russian naturally appear in all the hot spots associated with Russia.
  4. +18
    16 August 2017 06: 55
    The lack of ideology is the root cause that all the "mongrel" allow themselves to bark at Russia. The power now has a financial-oligarchic group formed during the time of ElBoNik .... Financial flows, of any colors, are cosmopolitan and do not recognize borders ... And above all, they do not allow a tough decision to be made. If you create a ruling, independent political system, the “enemy flock” fostered for many years of “liberal reforms” will immediately show its teeth ... In addition, cast-iron weights, and maybe a pass to the “Western Paradise,” are purchased with stolen money from People, goods and accounts in all forms on various "Cote d'Azur" and in banks ...
    1. +14
      16 August 2017 07: 16
      I do not think that ideology is absent. Rather, it is present, but it does not particularly mean itself. ... Either the icon with the fascists was accepted as a gift and hung in a museum complex, then it is planned to have an ebony center in Moscow, then the Wailing Wall, or monuments to victims of political repressions in every city and in the school curriculum about repressions. This education of humiliation, guilt. ... Reformatting the Victorious People is to blame! THAT'S WHAT!!!!!!
    2. +3
      16 August 2017 08: 02
      Quote: moskowit
      The lack of ideology is the root cause that all the "mongrel" allow themselves to bark at Russia. The power now has a financial-oligarchic group formed during the time of ElBoNik .... Financial flows, of any colors, are cosmopolitan and do not recognize borders ... And above all, they do not allow a tough decision to be made. If you create a ruling, independent political system, then the "hostile flock" fostered for many years of "liberal reformation" will immediately show its teeth ....

      The reinforced concrete support of this same "financial-oligarchic" is not a guy from the gateway, but quite a government bureaucracy!
      ... which, by and large, few won, and not only in Russia! indestructible "formation"!
      -------------------------------
      recent joke:
      Putin threw a fishing rod ... and caught - not, not a pike - but a goldfish!
      “In,” he says, “there will be an ear!”
      The fish spoke here in a human language, said:
      - Come on, man! ear, ear! ... Go to the pizzeria, it will be tastier! Better make a wish - and I will fulfill it ... all the same, I'm the mistress of the sea!
      Putin thought, thought ...
      “Okay,” he says, “let all the officials become honest, fair, so that they do not take bribes and take care of the people and the country!”
      ... saddened fish! ...
      - Yeah-ah ... Let's get better!
  5. The comment was deleted.
    1. +3
      16 August 2017 08: 10
      Well, we are also talking about the Russian world to the Dnieper. Nationalist ideologies inherited from the past. But thinking and balancing needs with opportunities is not fate.
  6. +6
    16 August 2017 08: 18
    we will never be brothers
    lace underwear does not look like a singed Red Banner.
  7. +11
    16 August 2017 08: 19
    Despite the sympathy of some Ukrainian rulers, the country itself was under the complete control of Russian media. We looked at the horrors of terrorism in the Russian Federation, looked at the summaries of the war with Georgia ... and were very worried. And it is clear on whose side there were sympathies .. obviously the people were not in solidarity with the militants of an organization not popular in Ukraine, and not on the side of Georgia.
    However, what do you feel about our experience for you ... If you pay a hundredfold - this is a collective responsibility for any person .. and the article seems to be about the answer. Revenge..
    and now revenge again .. and off it went for ages.
    Hmm .. have never been brothers? .. which is strange, the Russians hammered that Ukrainians everywhere are guilty with terrible force (similar to Ukrainians about Russians) ...
    the bulk is inert to politics, and sympathy was on the side of the Russian Federation (at least towards the Russians and even Putin was popular) before 2014. For the sake of the point answer, they hit the entire inert mass. Like Ukraine and the Russian Federation ...
    However, this is all a consequence of politics. There emotions do not rule .. only calculation and money.
    1. +17
      16 August 2017 11: 02
      Quote: Catherine II
      the bulk is inert to politics, and sympathy was on the side of the Russian Federation (at least towards the Russians and even Putin was popular) before 2014. For the sake of the point answer, they hit the entire inert mass. Like Ukraine and the Russian Federation.

      And then .... Small-town thinking takes place both then and now. I judge by my Ukrainian classmates working in Ukraine. Judging by their "pearls", they are not that unaware - which, and most importantly WHY, is happening in Ukraine today. The main motivation is personal wealth and relative calm, based on the principle of "My hut from the edge." And that there someone was killed in Kiev, they are still killing in the Donbass today. Burned alive people in Odessa? But they don’t burn me. And finally - I would have lace trunks, visa-free travel, a shatok of fat with garlic ...... Life was a success!
      Cattle logic thrives on you there, farmers from birth and in the way of thinking. You, non-brothers, nevermind - what kind of power is in the yard, whose flag is on the village council. If only the pan didn’t pull by the forelock, but he himself, by stealing, then stealing, and the duck, until it was caught.
      1. +3
        16 August 2017 17: 54
        “small-town thinking” is inherent in the whole West, where the majority absolutely do not care who is in power (while the government is working efficiently), people are busy with their “small-town” affairs (where to go to work, how to make careers, where to send children to study, etc.)
        in Russia, the whole country of strategists, but in the end, everything is complete ...
        PS: The main reason for moving to the west of Ukraine is the standard of living in Russia ...
        1. +5
          16 August 2017 18: 54
          Quote: Topgun
          but in the end everything is complete ...

          Well, do not speak for everyone Yes . Speak for yourself, for yourself. wink
          1. +1
            18 August 2017 22: 57
            he climbed there, apparently.
            understands what he is saying?
        2. +4
          16 August 2017 21: 28
          Quote: Topgun
          "small-town thinking" is inherent in the whole west,

          So that’s why “Banderostan is Tse Europa?” Rather, refugees from the Middle East become Europeans than visa-free horses.
      2. +4
        17 August 2017 15: 44
        I don’t know who “hammers” me about the guilty “Ukrainians”, only the service in the Soviet army 80-82 on the Chinese border, where there were no “ordinary” Ukrainians, the “sergeant” was more than “foreman”, and everyone was to blame except for the "Khokhlov", who’s going to get in without a soap in order to grab more, this will always be in my eyes, so that “inertia in politics and sympathy for the Russian Federation” is, mildly saying "noodles on the ears" for the electorate of the outskirts.
      3. +6
        18 August 2017 01: 44
        stalkerwalker. That's right, you noticed everything. My friends betrayed such that Ukraine has only now become truly independent. My reasonable question - why then, the American representatives come with specific solutions and indicate directly how to behave - this is the answer: "Well, we must depend on someone." I will never understand this logic. Therefore, I am no longer there. Living next to such people was scary.
        1. 0
          18 August 2017 23: 15
          antivirus 2 July 29, 2017 13:03 | US Air Force representatives visited an airfield in western Ukraine
          friend, already a pensioner.
          "my Vasya served in the Czech Republic for 76-78. GRU special forces flew to Afghanistan for special missions. Before each departure, his crest friend searched and found reasons (to lie down in the san \ part)"
          A complaint
  8. +4
    16 August 2017 08: 38
    As the ship is called "Hero", so it will sail. In short, as long as Ukraine does not prohibit the mov, until then it will sail.
  9. +8
    16 August 2017 08: 51
    It is precisely after such articles (if they are propagated and given to Ukrainians to read) that the question of further relations and mutual understanding can not be asked.
    I already wrote once - a generation of today's children and youth from our brothers can be safely deleted - they, with their youthful maximalism, forever cursed the “vacationers” who killed their fathers, friends, brothers. The author’s attitude to the “vacationers” —that is, who went “at the behest of the heart” to the Caucasus — organized bandits supported by the then Ukrainian authorities, and to the Crimea and Donetsk - “patriots and just Russian people” is also interesting.
    And finally, "they wrote about Muzychko, but about Bystryakov? Yes, he did not renounce the Soviet past, but he always positioned himself as a UKRAINIAN composer! So the author in the article very juggles the cards ....
  10. +8
    16 August 2017 08: 57
    The gap between us is growing. We diverge further and further. And tomorrow, our children and grandchildren will look at them only as enemies. They do not remember and do not know the singing Ukrainian songs and incendiary dances. Ukrainian humor about the cunning crest and fat. And the Afghan brotherhood sealed with blood, we remember. We all remember. And Georgia and Abkhazia and Chechnya remember the same. Our generation is leaving, the one that remembers other times and the opportunity to fix something.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. +7
        16 August 2017 09: 52
        The gap between us is growing. We diverge further and further.

        I ask you only to note that this is NOT OUR initiative !!!! NOT OUR !!!!!!! this is a deliberate choice of the former once .... compatriots ???? fellow citizens ??? ... pass away, then pass ... we will talk and agree ... no ??? well, let them live as they want ... only for themselves !!!! without those who don’t want to live like that !!!!! Donbass, I mean ...
        1. +1
          17 August 2017 18: 21
          this is a deliberate choice of the former once .... compatriots ???? fellow citizens ??? ...
          This is a conscious choice of Ukrainian, and some Russian, so-called the elites. The nations have nothing to share ... the foam will be washed away - we will make peace.
        2. +1
          18 August 2017 09: 58
          It may well be over, but what about the young Ruguli grown in Ukrainian education, where they were hammered every day about the Russian threat ....
          What is the percentage of maidanutyh there? 30% or 40% or 50? And these are tens of millions of people. For our safety, do not be brothers with them ....
    2. +1
      16 August 2017 13: 05
      Quote: vladimirvn
      The gap between us is growing. We diverge further and further. And tomorrow, our children and grandchildren will look at them only as enemies. They do not remember and do not know the singing Ukrainian songs and incendiary dances. Ukrainian humor about the cunning crest and fat. And the Afghan brotherhood sealed with blood, we remember. We all remember. And Georgia and Abkhazia and Chechnya remember the same. Our generation is leaving, the one that remembers other times and the opportunity to fix something.


      Do not worry. Everything will go back to normal. After all, Britain and the United States fought among themselves. And more than once.
      1. 0
        18 August 2017 10: 01
        During the wars, there was no Overseer Pahan in the role of the USA. These were conflicts over the division of influence ....
    3. +6
      16 August 2017 19: 34
      Is it all right and what? Again, to understand and forgive how they forgave the punitives who burned Khatyn at 45 (and it was the Balts and heroes from the UPA who were noted there) or finally to take off the pink glasses and look at the World, and he is not at all the way we would like to see him and they see Russians in us not as Brothers but as a dairy cow, or simply Lokhov whom God himself ordered to milk or how for the Caucasus horsemen we’ll ram them the Wolves will always slaughter. Well, how did you fail to want to fix something and turn the other cheek (or maybe you need to take off his pants and bend) is it not time to remember who took Berlin and how much yes and Paris is exactly the same (it’s a pity they didn’t get to London at the owl), If they don’t want to love, even if they’re afraid, alas, it’s not possible otherwise
      1. +1
        17 August 2017 09: 07
        Any war ends in peace.
        1. 0
          18 August 2017 10: 02
          Not any, it’s a conflict between superpowers, and such conflicts never end .... Example - Korea.
  11. The comment was deleted.
  12. +2
    16 August 2017 09: 47
    Until 2004, it was embodied in the missile cruiser Tbilisi»

    what is this miracle wonderful ???? colleagues who something about this e-eeeee ..... floating thing .... knows ???? and where did it go afterwards .....
    1. +2
      16 August 2017 15: 30
      what is this miracle wonderful ???? colleagues who something about this e-eeeee ..... floating thing .... knows ???? and where did it go afterwards .....


      Most likely rocket boat Project 206MR (Black Sea Fleet of the USSR - "R-15") - (Ukrainian Navy - "Konotop") - (Georgian Navy - "Tbilisi").
      1 - 7,62 AK-176
      1 - 6x30 AK-630
      2 - PU PKR "Termite" (P-15M)
      4 launchers MANPADS "Strela-3" (total 16 missiles)

      13.08.08/XNUMX/XNUMX destroyed by Russian troops, sank at the pier of Poti (previously burned)
      1. 0
        16 August 2017 19: 43
        but cruiser!!! so I thought - HOW! WHERE! ??!? Thanks for the consultation....
    2. 0
      17 August 2017 18: 29
      Maybe I mean TAKR (heavy aircraft carrier cruiser) "Tbilisi", which was being built at the Black Sea plant in Nikolaev. So, as far as I remember, the team, when the Union collapsed, successfully took him to Russia, where it was completed and now, if I am not mistaken, this is Nikolai Kuznetsov ???
  13. +4
    16 August 2017 10: 03
    All of them (Poland, Georgia, Ukraine, etc.) are slowly being prepared for slaughter. Again, as in the old days, thinking that having gathered together, with the help of the Anglo-Saxons, it would be possible to deal with Russia, they would become pawns in another overseas scam. And everyone has their own reason. There is only one defendant - the Russian Federation.
  14. +5
    16 August 2017 10: 23
    As far back as 1989, two Ukrainians tried to beat me in Voroshilovgrad when they found out that I was a Kazan Tatar. And for that I could not recognize them due to their insensitive state.
    1. +1
      16 August 2017 13: 34
      I can assume that about the Tatar-Mongol yoke passed in the history lesson. They tried to present the Mongols, but it didn’t work out, the guys seem to be your turn.
  15. +7
    16 August 2017 10: 40
    Quote: Leader of the Redskins
    The author’s attitude to “vacationers” —that is, who went “at the behest of the heart” to the Caucasus — organized bandits supported by the then Ukrainian authorities, and to the Crimea and Donetsk - “patriots and just Russian people” is also interesting.

    Only Ukrainian nationalists went to support the bandits and militants who staged the genocide of the Russian population of Chechnya and raided the neighboring regions, and the "vacationers" went to defend the cities and villages of innocent people who were leveled by the artillery of such nationalists who were organizing genocide.
    1. +2
      16 August 2017 10: 50
      Yeah ... Ah of citizens Which country were the artillerymen and tankers of two Chechen wars wiped off the ground? The question is CITIZENS? Not nationality, nor religion, nor criminality ...
      1. +3
        16 August 2017 11: 07
        And what country’s citizens are exterminating in Syria?
      2. +9
        16 August 2017 12: 38
        Quote: Leader of the Redskins
        And the citizens of which country were erased from the land by artillerymen and tankers of two Chechen wars?

        Gunners and tankers in two Chechen warriors "erased from the ground" nonhumans, the one that decided to make themselves the arbiters of the fate of the citizens of this country. And you know this very well, but, nevertheless, distort the investigation and are silent about the causes of the “erasure”. And this is called meanness.
        1. +3
          16 August 2017 12: 57
          I specifically emphasized the word CITIZENS. Bother to answer.
          1. +2
            16 August 2017 15: 35
            So be it, work hard. Due to the fact that you specifically emphasized the emphasis, the essence of your comment does not change. And what is it called, I told you.
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              1. The comment was deleted.
    2. +1
      17 August 2017 11: 43
      Quote: Blue Fox
      Only Ukrainian nationalists went to support the bandits and militants who staged the genocide of the Russian population of Chechnya and raided the neighboring regions, and the "vacationers" went to defend the cities and villages of innocent people who were leveled by the artillery of such nationalists who were organizing genocide.

      The beginning of events in the Donbass is purely internal graters between Ukrainian oligarchs. The struggle for assets, under the guise of federalization. The same thing happened in 2005, after the "orange" revolution. Who does not remember - look at the congress in Severodonetsk (2005). Then frayed among themselves, - to whom and what is departing, and on that it all ended. The same would be in 2014. The world would have been established back in May 2014 if Shooters with the "volunteers" hadn’t climbed. And no one then used artillery on a peaceful basis. The second chance to stop it was in August 2014. Then the Russian army already climbed in.
      So, thanks for the 3 years of the war, it is precisely "vacationers-defenders" that are necessary.
      1. +2
        17 August 2017 15: 57
        The world would not have been established in 2014, there is no need to distort it, since everyone saw the result in Crimea, all the “Ukrainians” also wanted to solve all their problems with the wrong hands (due to more than once in the history), due to the “green men”, but it didn’t work, and it didn’t work out not because of Strelkov, but because of the “mentality” of “my closeness” - i.e. "Mene has a hog, so it’s my hog, and" Muscovites "let them" fight "for my hog
      2. 0
        18 August 2017 10: 10
        The world would not have been established anyway, because Kiev and its Masters needed a civil war and therefore it continues now and the "Minsk Agreements" do not work on this. The war was planned by Kiev as an urgent need, where, in any situation, Kiev receives its dividends. And on this, no peace talks will lead to anything, for survival, Kiev needs either war or an unconditional bloody victory ....
  16. The comment was deleted.
  17. The comment was deleted.
    1. +7
      16 August 2017 15: 56
      You might think - bring facts to it with surnames, appearances, passwords, as in the article. I, too, might think that you fought in the PMR on the side of Moldova.
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. +6
          16 August 2017 22: 52
          For Budanov, not for you to judge - time. The second - in my commentary, there are Ukrainian personnel who were behind the Buk button. Do you catch the difference? Personnel military and volunteers? And this is proved not only by the IC of the Russian Federation, but also by deputies of the Verkhovna Rada. Third, injured terrorists were also treated, including in Ukraine. Without the assistance of the authorities, all of the above is impossible. And now they are reaping the fruits of their politics - political prostitution.
      2. +2
        16 August 2017 16: 51
        And what's wrong with fighting on the side of the Moldavians?
        1. +7
          16 August 2017 22: 48
          The bad thing is that he fought against the interests of Russia and is trying to bend his fingers on the Russian patriotic resource. Anderstand?
      3. +1
        16 August 2017 22: 57
        Quote: Okolotochny
        You might think - bring facts to it with surnames, appearances, passwords, as in the article. I, too, might think that you fought in the PMR on the side of Moldova.

        Nobody caught the Russians who fought for the Chichiks at the prosecutor’s office. No one will present the facts. Who will sign his own sentence? And Bandera, too, no one handed over to prosecutors.
        1. +6
          17 August 2017 09: 32
          The issue is not nationality. Yes, the Russians also fought for the militants, the main part of the incentive is money, less clogged brains. But the STATE did not support them. And behind the ukrov stood their state and their special services. That is the difference.
  18. +6
    16 August 2017 13: 24
    "We will never be brothers"


    I was born in 1990. For me, Ukraine has been a separate state all its life, like almost two hundred other states on our planet. Another country, people, laws. Their choice, their actions and their decisions aimed at THEIR future. To be honest, the information flow about how “poor“ brothers ”live in Ukraine is already annoying? We need to help, support, protect them ... we need to negotiate! Get super gas discounts, take Minsk1,2, 3, etc. Only live in peace and joy. The funny thing is that this fuss with Ukraine, as with a small child, is hiding with this Dumb phrase "we are fraternal peoples"
    We are strangers. We live a quarter of a century in different countries. We are different.
  19. +4
    16 August 2017 13: 40
    We have never been brothers ... The whole question is with whom we have never been brothers and sisters. Of course, we have never been brothers with Ukrainian frostbitten nationalists. With corrupt, corrupt, Russophobic pseudo elites, they were also not independent. But, as for example, my Ukrainian cousins, aunts, friends of my childhood, they were, are and will be close to me people and no dill propaganda does not affect our relationship. And I know that there are more than one million such people in our country and Ukraine. I am sure that today's vector of Ukraine’s development based on the ideology of nationalism is a road to nowhere, a temporary factor. It is simply impossible to create a community of the peoples of Ukraine on the basis of nationalism. What they managed to do was powder the brain of part of the population and youth especially. But as the classic being said, it determines consciousness. Already yesterday activists who believed in the slogans of nationalism are starting to ask questions, but how did the revolution come about, Bandera came, and there was no order. While some of them believe that Russia is to blame, the aggressor is waging war against Ukraine, and therefore there is no success and life is getting harder. And tomorrow, of course, except for the most frostbitten. they will ask the same question, but where is it? And then, for them, the nationalists and their patrons, the capitalists, the traitors of their people, will become not brothers, but the worst enemies. When it will be, I think not tomorrow, but it will be necessary. Therefore, it is necessary to separate not brothers in Ukraine and brothers. The former are not only our most real enemies with which we must fight by all available means, but also the enemies of the people of Ukraine, the latter are people of the same blood, culture, faith. In essence, they are us. And they need support and help from us.
    1. +1
      17 August 2017 16: 10
      I don’t know, I don’t know ... Again, "they need from us ..." I also have relatives there, only they have long forgotten about family relations, because they live "There" (in the outskirts) always, and always thought RUSSIA "cattle Moskalsky", they only had to "slightly" push towards Maidan, which was done in 1991, and not in 2014, so to say that someone from the "great ukrov" will ask about the appropriateness of the Maidan is UTOPIA, and in the future we need to build our relations only from the standpoint of "EXPEDIBILITY" (exactly like with all other countries) nor any concessions, only a bare calculation "you to me - I tell you"
      1. 0
        18 August 2017 10: 34
        On the one hand, you are right, but the United States surrounds us with Enemy states, for 30 years we tried to buy the friendship of our neighbors, as a result, they turned into extortionists. They made Ukraine an enemy, now they have taken Belarus.
  20. The comment was deleted.
    1. +4
      16 August 2017 21: 44
      This kindling has been going on since 2014. And if we ourselves hate Ukraine, then how are we better than the Ukrainian Natsik, shouting "Moscow on knives" or "Ukraine ponad a mustache"?
      1. +2
        16 August 2017 23: 01
        Quote: 0255
        This kindling has been going on since 2014. And if we ourselves hate Ukraine, then how are we better than the Ukrainian Natsik, shouting "Moscow on knives" or "Ukraine ponad a mustache"?

        I do not hate Ukraine. Banderlog is a separate issue. And with the Ukrainians, we Russians are of the same blood.
        1. +3
          16 August 2017 23: 25
          Quote: Sergei Medvedev
          I do not hate Ukraine. Banderlog is a separate issue. And with the Ukrainians, we Russians are of the same blood.

          But the current Russian propaganda makes all Ukrainians enemies
          1. +1
            17 August 2017 04: 54
            Who are Ukrainians?
            1. 0
              17 August 2017 17: 40
              Ukrainians (Ukrainian. Ukrainian; until the beginning of the XNUMXth century the self-names “Little Russians”, “Rusyns”, “Cherkasy” and “Cossacks”) prevailed - the East Slavic people living mainly in Ukraine, as well as as part of large diasporas in Russia, the USA, Canada and other states.
              Among the Slavic peoples is the third largest after the Russians and Poles. Citizens of Ukraine are also called Ukrainians, referring not to ethnicity, but citizenship.
        2. +1
          17 August 2017 04: 58
          Who you are? Do not forget that not only Russians live in Russia! As well as in the occupied territory of the former USSR, not only "Ukrainians" live.
      2. +1
        17 August 2017 16: 24
        0255, you were born not so long ago, and are already trying to judge the history of how you put it, “the incitement has been going on since 2014”, you are at odds with either the history of RUSSIA or the history of the USSR, because “ukroindustriya” originates from the first years of the 20th century, and if Lenin and Stalin had not in time laid this mine, now the regional centers of the RSFSR (Kiev, Kharkov, Odessa, Dnepropetrovsk, etc.) would live and work "Well in the prime of life" (Carlson )
        1. 0
          17 August 2017 18: 52
          something always hurts a bad dancer
        2. +1
          17 August 2017 19: 07
          Do you think that Lenin, Stalin created national republics as part of the Soviet Union, united state. Together they raised the national economy, together won the Great Patriotic War, and restored our common homeland. But with the advent of the hunchback with his liberalistic "new thinking", "bazaar", the Russian drunk state was broken up into national pieces and started ... EBN and Brokeback - these are the culprits of all the troubles. Even if three people (Kazakh, Ukrainian, Belarusian) gathered in Bialowieza and signed an agreement on the CIS, they would have been arrested in an hour ... Who immediately after the collapse reported to the American president about the collapse of the Union, please remind ...
          1. 0
            17 August 2017 19: 12
            Quote: Sewer Krainiy
            EBN and Brokeback are the culprits of all troubles

            if the people of the USSR did not joyfully support them, they themselves would never be able to ruin anything
            1. +1
              18 August 2017 10: 44
              I don’t remember what the people would support them ....
              They tried to shoot people in the square in general .... and they beat his face ...
              Muscovites brought power to power in general .... they didn’t even show on TV that something was happening ... in fact they later announced that there was a putsch and now you are Russians ..
      3. 0
        18 August 2017 10: 40
        For 30 years, Ukrainian propaganda exposed Russians as enemies. For the Russian language they killed, beaten, humiliated, etc. ... In western Ukraine, if a stranger comes to the store but the saleswomen do not understand Russian, it was in 2000.
        In 200X there was news that raguli in Kiev attacked passers-by, started beating, and eventually drove them into the river, where half of the victims drowned .... and there is a lot of such news ...
        When they hate you fiercely, it’s perfectly normal to hate you back ... We only in 2014 found out that Ukrainians hate us. In 2005, I tried to explain to one woman from work that the Balts hate us, I couldn’t prove it, she came from Lithuania on vacation and told me how polite and kind everyone is ....
    2. +2
      17 August 2017 16: 15
      This is where you, "amiable" saw incitement to hatred, apparently you did not have to communicate with the "great Ukrainians" and the saying: "Crest was born - a Jew burst into tears" is an empty phrase for you. You are still young, "old man", to hang up labels on historical realities!
      1. +1
        17 August 2017 17: 49
        .
        Quote: iva1962
        This is where you, "amiable" saw incitement to hatred

        I do not hang any labels. But in the article, if not directly, then indirectly, some of the following quotation is done.
        I quote the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation:
        "Actions aimed at inciting hatred or enmity, as well as humiliating the dignity of a person or group of people on the grounds of sex, race, nationality, language, origin, religion, as well as belonging to any social group, committed publicly or using the media "
  21. +1
    16 August 2017 14: 48
    Georgia, it’s time to wake up from a hangover. And try to establish relations with Russia. We got drunk on our own head. And we lived like a cat in my bosom. And what didn’t you like?
    1. +1
      18 August 2017 10: 48
      And who will accept them? They spoiled us for 30 years, and finally in 2008 declared war on us (by killing peacekeepers), according to these international rules .... for which they paid.
      They made their FINAL choice. We need to minimize economic and political relations with them even more.
  22. +6
    16 August 2017 15: 53
    For the Ukrainian calculations of "Bukov" in 2008. This is not only our law enforcement officers have proven. There was a dok.film, a deputy of the Verkhovna Rada, a surname in my Kolesnichenko. Proved this fact. Several officers from these accounts received apartments. Alone in Lviv, on the street named after some Ukrainian nationalist.
  23. +3
    16 August 2017 16: 50
    Where is the evidence?
    Cheap everything. Article for the weak-minded. There is nothing concrete.
    1. +5
      17 August 2017 04: 51
      Specifically, with evidence, they will explain to you in South Ossetia! Come and say so, show me the evidence! You will get everything right away, so much so that for the rest of your life there will be no desire to ask stupid questions!
    2. +2
      17 August 2017 16: 27
      Sergo, sitting under a striped flag to demand proof of the obvious, this is as always with fans of all the "American"
      1. 0
        18 August 2017 10: 49
        He was told by CNN that the Russians are lying and that everything was wrong ....
  24. The comment was deleted.
    1. +3
      17 August 2017 04: 45
      And you yourself, do not confuse the case? So while you will cover them, they will sit quietly on assholes in huts from the edge! Because of such defenders, their atrocities were hushed up in Khatyn, then returned from the camps and exiles. Then they kept silent seeing the rampant nationalism, which now grew into mass terror! And now more like you will listen? Let them stand up and protest against all this, then there will be understanding from our side too! In the meantime, go along with those whom you call Ukrainians, and you, and where you yourself know!
    2. +4
      17 August 2017 09: 00
      And just like the defenders of the incredible Ukrainian people a whole company came running. In our country, it was customary to remain silent about the Polish heroes during the war, otherwise it would suddenly be offended and leave. Enough already, to hush up and pretend that we all have forgiven and forgot. Shit on Ukrainians and their sympathizers. Where are the adequate Ukrainians? This, apparently, made VO jump schoolchildren from screams about Muscovites and cook compote with a colorful name about separs. Or suited the fecal processions? After the Maidan, in which cities did you try to resist somehow? Only in large eastern ones, but I read the Khokhlyat rhetoric on the net very well. Why should I worry about torn apart relationships with these people? Yes, to sneeze at them, tomorrow they will start pouring another from the screens, they will change hands.
  25. +1
    16 August 2017 21: 32
    The article is correct. And what to do or what is being done to change something?
    1. +3
      16 August 2017 21: 42
      Quote: steel maker
      And what to do or what is being done to change something?

      At least not to write a similar hreni about what Ukraine is "bad"
      1. Bat
        +4
        17 August 2017 06: 11
        No, she’s not bad. She is sick. Watch and you will not get infected. Bulbonians
  26. 0
    16 August 2017 22: 29
    As a Muscovite saber whistles, so Bender in his pants will cut off.
    We will never be brothers in the Country or of the mother ...
  27. +1
    17 August 2017 04: 33
    Quote: Leader of the Redskins
    Yeah ... Ah of citizens Which country were the artillerymen and tankers of two Chechen wars wiped off the ground? The question is CITIZENS? Not nationality, nor religion, nor criminality ...

    Most remained with old Soviet passports, I personally received in 2000 only! So, do not drive here off topic!
  28. Bat
    0
    17 August 2017 06: 05
    I really want to believe that Belarus will not be such a scoundrel. And dill, those bastards ...
  29. +1
    17 August 2017 09: 31
    we took-because ours, no need to come up with excuses.
  30. 0
    17 August 2017 12: 29
    Quote: Sergei Medvedev
    I do not hate Ukraine.

    It's like in an old joke: I'm not vindictive. Just angry. And my memory is good.
  31. +2
    17 August 2017 13: 18
    In Russia, everything can be the same. People are the same everywhere. Especially affected by national identity.
    1. +1
      17 August 2017 16: 39
      It was you who said in vain that people are the same everywhere, it’s in your brain all the convolutions are the same, if you say so. People are different everywhere, everyone has their own vision of the situation around us, we are all different, but they are trying to make us the same for the sake of religion, for the sake of money, and ultimately slaves in power, when we are all the same, it is easier to manage us. And the national identity, which you call almost a disease, is actually the “quintessence” of the fact that we are all different, but we are RUSSIAN, and that we are different is our strength that no one could break in the whole 1000-year-old history of RUSSIA!
      1. +1
        18 August 2017 14: 16
        Take away money and religion and borders from people, and everyone will become the same. Divide and rule. Self-awareness - this is the separation for control. Decomposition disease.
  32. +1
    17 August 2017 18: 48
    Quote: 0255
    This kindling has been going on since 2014. And if we ourselves hate Ukraine, then how are we better than the Ukrainian Natsik, shouting "Moscow on knives" or "Ukraine ponad a mustache"?

    I agree. It's time to distinguish the Ukrainian "elite" with its banderlogs from the Ukrainian people. And if someone wants to talk about hatred, then let him write - I hate the government. Ukraine and its people have nothing to do with it; they, like all the peoples of the Union, were sold in Bialowieza by a Russian drunk and two Natsiks: Ukrainian and Belarusian. And the joined "guarantor" - "Tagged."
  33. 0
    17 August 2017 23: 33
    Ukraine is a separate state, because Ukraine is Russia and Russians live in Ukraine. It’s just that in Russia, at first as a result of the more than 70-year-old existence of the communist state, private ownership of the means of production and land was first destroyed, and then the anti-communist counter-revolution took place. Only Chubais and Kolomoisky knew how to seize property. Marx said nothing about this.
  34. 0
    21 August 2017 00: 10
    If only it were that simple. black and white, some are bad and others are good.
    The coup d'etat - 1991 (EBN) and 2014 (Poroshenko).
    ATO - autumn 1994 - to the present (Chechnya, Dagestan) and the DPR-LPR (April 2014 - to the present).
    The fact is that neither the Russian Federation nor Ukraine needs a war, as it weakens the economy and aggravates internal contradictions in society. Despite the hybrid war in the Donbas, Russian and Ukrainian oligarchs have a joint business, trade between countries has increased, goods from Ukraine go through Belarus to the Russian Federation, YaMZ supplies engines to KRAZ for APU armored vehicles. For the leadership of the Russian Federation, it is finally necessary to determine priorities. If you fight against fascism, then you need to go to the left bank of the Dnieper, and Poland takes Lviv with Volyn, Romania - Bukovina with Mukachevo. And if the gas pipe through Ukraine is more important, then Minsk 4, 5 ... with a respected partner.
    1. 0
      21 August 2017 00: 39
      about the role of personality in history. On June 12, 1991, Yeltsin was elected president of the RSFSR. it was no coincidence.
      he needed a man who would change the country, if not Yeltsin, then there would be a man like him.
      At that time, he led a part of a vast country, but in order to become the first one needed to cut off the remaining parts in a living manner.
      This was done - a coup d'etat was carried out under the pretext of combating the Emergency Committee.
      however, the GKChP members of the leadership of the USSR, who at that time represented the official power.
      Until September 1993, EBN and comrades rested on their laurels and derbanil state property, simultaneously calling on the regions
      "Take as much sovereignty as you can swallow."
      October 3, 1993 - shooting of the White House from tanks in CNN's live coverage. So the 1991 revolution devoured its children.
      EBN, Rutskoi and Khazbulatov, coup leaders were not able to share power.
      And then went the centrifugal movement of the regions, Chechnya, Dagestan, Tatarstan, Bashkortostan, the Ural Republic of Rossel, the Far East all started talking about privileges
      and independence from Moscow. And for the first time, the interests of EBN coincided with the interests of the state. In order not to lose the place of the first man in Russia, ready to crumble into pieces, he had to start a war in Chechnya.
      Although the rights of the Russian people were violated there, and in other former republics of the USSR, since the late 80s.
      And the Chechens fought with weapons, which, with the knowledge of the EBN, remained in military depots after the collapse of the USSR.
  35. 0
    21 August 2017 00: 50
    Poroshenko is an absolute analogue of Yeltsin. An alcoholic who came to power with the support of the United States and Germany as a result of a coup. It solves two problems: personal enrichment and prevention of the collapse of the country (southeast to Russia, Bukovina to Romania, Lviv and Volyn to Poland. The ATO is an analogue of the counter-terrorist operation from 1994 to the present in Chechnya and the North Caucasus.
  36. 0
    21 August 2017 00: 54
    Putin must finally make a decision. Or fight fascism with access to the left bank of the Dnieper. Or a gas pipe through Ukraine and Minsk 4, 5 ... with a "respected partner" and daily shelling of the population of Donbas
  37. 0
    21 August 2017 14: 50
    Quote: seos
    Not any, it’s a conflict between superpowers, and such conflicts never end .... Example - Korea.

    ..never a simple thought occurred to me - * ... from what fright penguins have been providing monetary allowance (aid) to North Korea, hell knows for what time .., despite the fact that Russia does not deal with this ..

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