Military Review

Prototype T-50-11 with glider Su-57 made the first flight

174
Informational portal naked-science.ru reports that the first flight of the fifth-generation prototype of the T-50-11 aircraft took place. As you know, the plane a few days earlier received the official name of the Su-57.

Flight tests began machine with tail number 511.

It is noteworthy that the T-50-11 was the tenth prototype of the Russian aircraft of the new generation, rising into the air. Why is it about marking "11"? The fact is that this prototype turned out to be completed before the previous prototype "T-50-10", which was supposed to rise into the sky before the 11-th copy.

Prototype T-50-11 with glider Su-57 made the first flight


It should be noted that the T-50-10 and T-50-11 are copies of the PAK FA, after which the so-called pre-series production of fifth-generation aircraft should begin. According to the latest data, 12 of such vehicles will be supplied to the troops in the coming years.

The specialists of T-50-11 attract the most attention in comparison with other prototypes. The reason is that the Su-57 production aircraft will have exactly the same glider as the T-50-11. Since the creation of the first prototype, the airframe has undergone significant changes. The Su-57 on-board equipment will be the same as that of the prototype T-50-9.
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  1. vch
    vch 7 August 2017 16: 12
    +17
    Would already be sooner! Very necessary car!
    1. cniza
      cniza 7 August 2017 16: 20
      +15
      This is not a quick process, but I want it as soon as possible ...
      1. vch
        vch 7 August 2017 16: 22
        +19
        Yes, I understand everything! Look, how many years have the Americans been unable to bring their 35th to mind, although they have already had it in a series for a long time ......
        1. maxim947
          maxim947 7 August 2017 19: 51
          +2
          The photo is successful, you will not recognize it right away))
          So we will finish it a few more years, this is a common practice
    2. NEXUS
      NEXUS 7 August 2017 16: 40
      +10
      Quote: vch
      Would already be sooner! Very necessary car!

      It was stated that a serial vehicle will go to the troops in 18 ... by the year 20 they promise to launch the production of engines of the second stage already ...
      1. KKND
        KKND 7 August 2017 16: 44
        +12
        Quote: NEXUS
        It was stated that a serial vehicle will go to the troops in 18

        Hello Andrei. hi
        Remember in 2016 You told me that the car will go to the troops in 2016. Statements were made by officials ..
        Do not remember anything? winked
        1. NEXUS
          NEXUS 7 August 2017 17: 00
          +20
          Quote: KKND
          Hello Andrei.

          Good afternoon! hi
          Quote: KKND
          Remember in 2016 You told me that the car will go to the troops in 2016. Statements were made by officials ..

          So what? I remember that I told you about this, based on statements by developers and Mr. Rogozin ... what's next? Or did you decide to catch me in a lie? winked
          If your EGO requires some kind of satisfaction, in recognizing deadlines ... well, console yourself, who is against it. lol
          1. aKtoR
            aKtoR 7 August 2017 17: 28
            +19
            And he also said the commander in chief of the Air Force - 2016 two aircraft. There were problems with the airframe and it’s great that they didn’t take a wet plane. What's bad about it?
          2. KKND
            KKND 7 August 2017 17: 29
            +10
            Quote: NEXUS
            Or did you decide to catch me in a lie?

            I’m not trying to catch you in a lie, but to point out your naivety.
            Do not believe everything that they say.
            Although a person believes in what he wants to believe, it’s hard to fix it.
            1. aKtoR
              aKtoR 7 August 2017 18: 05
              +8
              You can not understand lying on the couch and little understanding in aviation
              1. KKND
                KKND 7 August 2017 18: 10
                +6
                Quote: aKtoR
                You can't catch lying on the couch

                So I did not try to catch Andrei. He is a good person, but what he often writes just amazes me.
                Quote: aKtoR
                and with little understanding in aviation

                I will tell you a little secret: those who understand something in aviation, as a rule, do not write here.
                1. NEXUS
                  NEXUS 7 August 2017 18: 39
                  +5
                  Quote: KKND
                  He is a good person, but what he often writes just amazes me.

                  I voiced the statement of the designers and Rogozin ... and marvel at them. And as regards the postponement of the terms ... it’s better to adopt a tested and modified car after spending two more years than later to arrange circus mattresses with your 35th ...
                  Quote: KKND
                  I will tell you a little secret: those who understand something in aviation, as a rule, do not write here.

                  Oh you... laughing Does the nickname Ancient tell you something? By the way, the person with whom you communicate with the nickname aKtoR, for your information, has a direct bearing on aircraft construction ... this is so, regarding your bold statement. I can also name a couple of names if you wish ...
                  1. KKND
                    KKND 7 August 2017 18: 44
                    0
                    Quote: NEXUS
                    Oh you ... Does the nickname Ancient tell you something?

                    Before that, he was a waf.
                    Different people write, happen and understand something.
                    But this is supposedly an exception.
                    But I don’t know aKtoR and I can’t speak, he understands something or an ordinary patriot. So far, he has not written anything serious (I have not seen).
                    1. NEXUS
                      NEXUS 7 August 2017 18: 47
                      +4
                      Quote: KKND
                      Different people write, happen and understand something.

                      They understand much more than many people sitting here ... for example, such a person under the name SSI, who took part in the development of the first TU-160 and displayed the first prototype on the concrete ... is that enough for you? wink
                      Quote: KKND
                      But I don’t know aKtoR and I can’t speak, he understands something or an ordinary patriot. So far, he has not written anything serious (I have not seen).

                      And he won’t write ... maybe he doesn’t have the right ... but take my word for it, this person is not very simple.
                      1. KKND
                        KKND 7 August 2017 19: 07
                        +4
                        The funny thing is that those who understand do not engage in cheer-patriotism.
                        I noticed this by reading this forum for years.
                        But it’s possible to have fun with the patriots, they have the knowledge "mother-negoruy" wink
                  2. ava09
                    ava09 8 August 2017 03: 45
                    +1
                    Quote: NEXUS
                    I voiced the statement of the designers and Rogozin ... and marvel at them. And as regards the postponement of the terms ... it’s better to adopt a tested and modified car after spending two more years than later to arrange circus mattresses with your 35th ...

                    By default (from your words - to the statements of designers and Rogozin), in 2016, the car had to be tested and finalized. And you fool your head, dragging here the "mattresses" and the Ego ... Pierced, broadcasting the lies or errors of the designers and Rogozin - admit the mistake and do not get out like in a frying pan.
                  3. Black Colonel
                    Black Colonel 9 August 2017 18: 45
                    +2
                    "Ancient" - he is a former "VAF". A worthy specialist in aviation, God grant him health.
                    KeKeNeDe It seems recently appeared here, and adults expresses opinions.
            2. Nick
              Nick 9 August 2017 15: 29
              0
              Quote: KKND
              I’m not trying to catch you in a lie, but to point out your naivety.
              Do not believe everything that they say.

              Of course, you don’t have to believe everything, but how can you not trust the specialists responsible for this particular issue? What does naivety have to do with it? He didn’t cite the words from the grandmother from the market!
        2. Philip Staros
          Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 15
          0
          How many years I have been following the topic - I don’t remember what they would seriously promise IN THE MILITARIANS before 17-18. Everything is on schedule! For those I didn’t notice - TEN planes are already flying. The engine promised the second stage to the 19th year ... And then, it seems, it’s not yet in the series ... Here it is necessary to raise quotes and nuances - because it will “fly up”, “go into the series”, “enter service”, “the first stage "," second stage ", etc. - many of these nuances are not noticed by many, and the time difference between them is YEARS!
      2. Mystery12345
        Mystery12345 7 August 2017 17: 28
        0
        Quote: NEXUS
        It was stated that a serial vehicle will go to the troops in 18

        I bet no ... not earlier than the 20th .... there is no point with the old motor ...
        1. aKtoR
          aKtoR 7 August 2017 18: 03
          +10
          What are we arguing about? If you are wrong, you can hardly call yourself a divine forumchanin?))) PUBLICALLY my memory is good
          1. Seryoga Gord
            Seryoga Gord 8 August 2017 02: 32
            +1
            the dispute is useless, this device will not go into series, max. 50-60 dryers will be blinded and they will be blown in, all resources will be thrown to the 6th generation, so as not to overtake mattresses, but ahead of the board, because after 2020 drones will come to the fore and pilots will not be in demand ...))
            1. Philip Staros
              Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 17
              0
              Something tells me that the sixth generation SYSTEMS will simply consist of several gliders, of which ONE or several will be PILOTED (in other words, optionally).
              1. Vlad.by
                Vlad.by 12 August 2017 10: 21
                0
                Well, it started ...
                Not only are we facilitating the work of the Western special services by pointing fingers directly at experts, but they have begun to make bets on fantasies about the “mainline” development path of military aviation. And like adults.
    3. Maz
      Maz 7 August 2017 17: 36
      +3
      Quickly, just all sorts of rubbish such as an urgent loan - a loan is obtained. Again, the US Air Force troll, then our devices are cheaper, but much. Again, China does not wait for t-50, the Americans will definitely not give them a raptor or fi35 to copy. And we will give. Fuck at the US Air Force pilots armpits will turn gray in the crotch when the Chinese begin to chase them over the Pacific Ocean
      1. Stabilization
        Stabilization 7 August 2017 18: 17
        +1
        we will give ... in 15-20 years, when the replacement will be ready.
      2. Aaron Zawi
        Aaron Zawi 7 August 2017 18: 50
        +3
        Quote: Maz
        Quickly, just all sorts of rubbish such as an urgent loan - a loan is obtained. Again, the US Air Force troll, then our devices are cheaper, but much. Again, China does not wait for t-50, the Americans will definitely not give them a raptor or fi35 to copy. And we will give. Fuck at the US Air Force pilots armpits will turn gray in the crotch when the Chinese begin to chase them over the Pacific Ocean
        according to information from Hindus, Su-57 should cost at least 100 million $ if they are released at least 250. There are no miracles. R&D of such equipment is extremely expensive.
        Why do the Chinese need your plane? They already have their own two models at the pre-launch.
        1. Setrac
          Setrac 7 August 2017 22: 01
          0
          Quote: Aron Zaavi
          Why do the Chinese need your plane? They already have their own two models at the pre-launch.

          So at the pre-launch ???
        2. Vlad.by
          Vlad.by 12 August 2017 10: 24
          0
          Cost for Hindus and the cost of development are not the same thing. In addition, the same f-35 has already "exceeded" the bar of 100 million apiece long ago. And he’s definitely not a T50 equal
    4. Incvizitor
      Incvizitor 7 August 2017 18: 47
      0
      Dviglo 2nd stage there?
    5. SergF123
      SergF123 8 August 2017 16: 53
      0
      Xs, necessary for show off more. But on the other hand, progress should not stand still! Why for show-offs, but because they rolled it out early, with engines from the Su-35, firing points for old missiles and an unfinished body ...
  2. KKND
    KKND 7 August 2017 16: 14
    +4
    Well, if by 2020 we begin to deliver to the troops.
    The lag behind the Americans is only 15 years. in the 5th generation.
    1. Solomon Kane
      Solomon Kane 7 August 2017 16: 23
      +8
      I would not say that the stripes on this issue are all “chocolate” .... In the pursuit of invisibility, other characteristics necessary for a combat vehicle have significantly decreased ...
      1. KKND
        KKND 7 August 2017 16: 30
        +4
        Quote: Solomon Kane
        . In pursuit of invisibility, other characteristics necessary for a combat vehicle have substantially decreased ...

        And in the Su-57, therefore, they did not pursue invisibility wassat
        What characteristics have decreased? More details please.
        Why, suddenly, the concept of the Su-57 is "muffled" with the F-22?
        Hint: The 5 generation is primarily an engine, namely heat-resistant materials, since all thermal cyclic engines are subject to the principle of the "Carnot cycle".
        1. Solomon Kane
          Solomon Kane 7 August 2017 16: 47
          +16
          About the shortcomings of "Raptor" has been repeatedly written on the pages of this site.
          The concept of the 57th was, as YOU say, “licked” with the Su-47 and MiG Project 1.44, which were designed much earlier than the F-22.
          And the 5th generation is not just an engine (the MiG-25 has not yet been surpassed), namely the aviation complex in conjunction with all the performance characteristics.
          1. KKND
            KKND 7 August 2017 17: 19
            0
            Quote: Solomon Kane
            And the 5th generation is not just an engine (the MiG-25 has not yet been surpassed), namely the aviation complex in conjunction with all the performance characteristics.

            Please, in more detail, about the theory of turbojet engines, in particular, about why the MiG-25 has such large nozzles?
            P.S. this is not ur-scream. laughing
            1. Mystery12345
              Mystery12345 7 August 2017 17: 29
              +5
              Quote: KKND
              about why does the MiG-25 have such large nozzles?

              because 25-31 don't care ... there's nothing to hide, he's an interceptor.
              1. Solomon Kane
                Solomon Kane 7 August 2017 18: 52
                +5
                Hint: The 5 generation is primarily an engine, namely heat-resistant materials, since all thermal cyclic engines are subject to the principle of the "Carnot cycle".

                ...... do not add, do not decrease
              2. NEXUS
                NEXUS 7 August 2017 23: 34
                +4
                Quote: Mystery12345
                because 25-31 don't care ... there's nothing to hide, he's an interceptor.

                There was nothing to hide 30 years ago ... maybe his main task was to intercept the CR ... and now he has increased his work, as well as his tasks. Well, 30-year-old radars and today's radars are like T-34s compared to T -14. And in this regard, the nozzle section, today, is a very important point.
            2. NKT
              NKT 7 August 2017 20: 31
              0
              Are you leading to the critical section of the turbojet nozzle?
          2. Blackmokona
            Blackmokona 7 August 2017 17: 35
            0
            SU-47 first flight in 1997, the F-22 in the prototype YF-22 took off in 1990.
            1. Solomon Kane
              Solomon Kane 7 August 2017 18: 54
              +4
              No one wrote about the "soared" The question arose about plagiarism. And the fact that the sheep were sitting in the government - the designers are not to blame .....
              The crisis that erupted in 1991 put an end to the fate of the aircraft. MAPO-MIG was never able to organize project financing under the new conditions. On September 25, 1997, a prototype of the S-37 front-line fighter (Sukhoi Design Bureau) took off - the MiG 1.44 had not taken off by this time.
          3. okko077
            okko077 7 August 2017 18: 18
            +4
            The 5th generation airplane is the central transmitting element of the information system based on certain properties of the airplane, which everyone loves to argue and love to list .... Why do we need an airplane with the properties of the 5th generation airplane if we don’t have such information systems? ... Amers have problems with information support, with software, with issues of information exchange within the framework of global information systems .... We do not have such systems and there are no such problems, and there are no 5th generation airplanes either. So why argue about the properties of single aircraft. A single aircraft without entering the developed information system will not be a 5th generation aircraft, whatever properties of invisibility, super-maneuverability, whatever engines and OFARs it possesses ..... Is this clear to everyone? So we work for the distant future ......
            1. Muvka
              Muvka 7 August 2017 18: 34
              +7
              That is, do you think our A-50s just fly like that? And can not direct fighters at targets?
            2. EvilLion
              EvilLion 13 August 2017 01: 24
              0
              The 5 generation plane is a PLANE. And it is determined by flight performance. And the information system can be put on An-2, when finally this obvious thing reaches you. Yes, and there is nothing new and unique in information systems for 20 for years, and the MiG-31 worked on the network at the link level back in the 1980.
              1. okko077
                okko077 13 August 2017 21: 14
                0
                I already understand everything, you have problems with understanding and with information systems in terms of network-centric warfare ....
          4. atesterev
            atesterev 8 August 2017 05: 04
            0
            MiG-25 has not yet been surpassed

            SR-71 not?
        2. aKtoR
          aKtoR 7 August 2017 16: 59
          +3
          Well, about invisibility has not yet been officially announced. Let's wait ...
          And what do you dislike if the system of this object detects the fact of exposure before the enemy himself detects the target)))
          1. KKND
            KKND 7 August 2017 17: 23
            +2
            Quote: aKtoR
            Well, about invisibility has not yet been officially announced. Let's wait ...

            And why the inner compartment? Yes, and the very form of the glider as it hints ..
            1. Mystery12345
              Mystery12345 7 August 2017 17: 30
              +3
              Quote: KKND
              And why the inner compartment?

              ammo ... are you so stupid, or pretend to be?
              1. KKND
                KKND 7 August 2017 17: 39
                0
                Quote: Mystery12345
                under cartridges

                Do you need to hide cartridges to reduce aerodynamic drag only?
                Trick wassat
            2. aKtoR
              aKtoR 7 August 2017 18: 00
              +8
              It's bad when they don't think like they write. I repeat it for you: the official parameters of the EPR are not voiced, we cannot compare it with something. The technologies used for the manufacture of exterior panels are not officially announced. Partners waiting in the future a few surprises. That is what was meant in the previous message)))
              1. KKND
                KKND 7 August 2017 18: 04
                +1
                Quote: aKtoR
                I repeat for you: the official parameters of the EPR are not announced, we can not compare it with something.

                The official parameters of the EPR f-22 are not announced. And f-117. This is classified information.
                So it will be with the Su-57.
                I am not a specialist in the field of radar, but even I can see that they tried to reduce the EPR.
          2. KKND
            KKND 7 August 2017 18: 49
            +1
            Quote: aKtoR
            And what do you dislike if the system of this object detects the fact of exposure before the enemy himself detects the target)))

            Suddenly, a direction finding is also possible on the MiG-29 before the enemy’s radar detects this MiG. Depends on Radar and MiG STR
          3. voyaka uh
            voyaka uh 7 August 2017 23: 15
            0
            "Well, about invisibility has not yet been officially reported. Let's wait" ////

            Because prototypes fly so far without a radar absorbing coating.
            But the form can already be estimated. This is not the first stealth, there is nothing to compare.
        3. SPACE
          SPACE 7 August 2017 17: 33
          +3
          Quote: KKND
          Hint: The 5 generation is primarily an engine, namely heat-resistant materials, since all thermal cyclic engines are subject to the principle of the "Carnot cycle".

          This world has not heard good fool wassat laughing
          1. KKND
            KKND 7 August 2017 17: 36
            +1
            Sorry, do not indicate what exactly I'm wrong?
            Do you think I came up with this?
            Enlighten yourself.
            https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A6%D0%B8%D0%BA%
            D0%BB_%D0%9A%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%BD%D0%BE
            1. SPACE
              SPACE 7 August 2017 18: 28
              +5
              Sorry, you just forgot to add that the 5 generation is called such an aircraft that flies not only thanks to the Carnot cycle, but also Newton’s laws, aerodynamics, thermodynamics, gravity and quantum mechanics, etc. lol
              1. KKND
                KKND 7 August 2017 18: 36
                +1
                I pointed out that in the 5th generation the main engine and, accordingly, heat-resistant materials.
                What are my complaints?
                1. stalkerwalker
                  stalkerwalker 7 August 2017 19: 40
                  +5
                  Quote: KKND
                  What are my complaints?

                  You must be more modest ... Much more modest ... Your speeches sin with a poor knowledge of the topic along with narcissism ...
                  laughing
                  1. KKND
                    KKND 7 August 2017 19: 48
                    +1
                    Quote: stalkerwalker
                    Your speeches sin with a poor knowledge of the topic along with narcissism ...

                    Specifically indicate where I am wrong. hi
        4. Shahno
          Shahno 7 August 2017 18: 29
          +2
          However, sensor fusion is supposed to be there. And so, yes, close, thdd uses the brighton cycle.
        5. Philip Staros
          Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 19
          0
          The fifth generation is primarily ELECTRONICS, stealth, etc. Even cruising supersonic is not critical (see F-35).
          So just the same engine is NOT the main thing. Moreover, the Su-57 also has cruising supersonic sound with the current engine.
        6. Vlad.by
          Vlad.by 12 August 2017 10: 33
          0
          Sorry, but the 5th generation is not only an engine. The engine provides only thrust-to-weight ratio and cruising supersonic. This is only one of the critical properties of the so-called 5 generations.
          And yes, the Americans really had a gap in materials science and engine building. But it is steadily declining.
          Previously, about 30 years ago, they were ahead of us by 5 goals in terms of electronic warfare. Now it is not clear who is ahead.
          Having finished the second stage, they will gain experience and statistics on it and will greatly catch up with the amers in the engines.
      2. owl
        owl 7 August 2017 16: 32
        0
        Quote: Solomon Kane
        other characteristics decreased

        Yeah ... according to the characteristics of "SHOW" they are not competitors laughing
    2. Days
      Days 7 August 2017 17: 12
      +9
      Quote: KKND
      The lag behind the Americans is only 15 years. in the 5th generation.

      Why does everybody measure generations with American airplanes? Aircraft were not developed in parallel, but as a response to previous adversary achievements (the F-15 was needed as a MiG-23 killer, the Su-27 was built as an F-15 killer and so on). Take the Su-57 for the fifth generation, then the F-22 does not have everything that a 5th generation fighter has, it suddenly became 4+. The same about the F-15, it is only 3+ in comparison with the Su-27.
      1. KKND
        KKND 7 August 2017 17: 42
        +3
        Quote: Dagen
        Take the Su-57 for the fifth generation, then the F-22 does not have everything that a 5th generation fighter has, it suddenly became 4+. The same about the F-15, it is only 3+ in comparison with the Su-27.

        Generations 4 ++, 3, 5+, etc. just tsiferki invented for the entertainment of ordinary people.
        Basically, the aircraft evolves as an aircraft with the advent of new engines, and more precisely with the creation of new materials.
        1. Days
          Days 7 August 2017 21: 48
          +1
          Quote: KKND
          Generations 4 ++, 3, 5+, etc. just tsiferki invented for the entertainment of ordinary people.
          Basically, the aircraft evolves as an aircraft with the advent of new engines, and more precisely with the creation of new materials

          Oh, not for fun, but for the layman, so that then all sorts of Kaptsov and his ilk would write articles and comments about the backwardness of all of Russia. Yes? And airplanes have nothing to do with it. And especially the engines have nothing to do with it, although in Russia they are at the level of the best models. AL-41F1 In some ways, better, but in some worse, F-135. And AL-41F is better in everything
          1. alexmach
            alexmach 7 August 2017 23: 03
            0
            All of these are inferior to the F-135 in traction.
            1. Days
              Days 8 August 2017 01: 02
              +2
              Yeah, the F-135 is trying very hard. He bypasses everyone in length))) Including the ancient NK-22 of 1968, which, however, did not prevent the latter from having a specific consumption of 0.85 kg / kgf * h (which is at least no worse than F-135) and a thrust on afterburner of 22000 kgf.

              I don’t want to seem pretending to be an expert (my sofa doesn’t approve of this), but can still consider the engines by relative parameters and together with the plane?)
        2. Philip Staros
          Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 21
          0
          Again you are about the engines!
          The bison (MiG-21 with modern equipment) and without any engines or even gliders is quite a fourth generation for the results.
          Everything in the complex. But what engine gives the fifth generation ?! And what other elements give ...
      2. jonhr
        jonhr 7 August 2017 21: 37
        0
        this is you pearl issued laughing don't even argue with you laughing
        1. Days
          Days 8 August 2017 23: 31
          +1
          Yes, I also see no reason in the discussion, after I read about your religion - that only Americans can have 5th generation airplanes :)
          1. jonhr
            jonhr 9 August 2017 07: 16
            0
            can not be, but it's just a fact
    3. Lord of the Sith
      Lord of the Sith 7 August 2017 18: 44
      +6
      Will I really upset you if I say that Americans don’t have a fifth generation? I mean F-22 and F-35. Specifically, out of 5 adopted parameters, two - maneuverability and speed without afterburner, does not reach 5 generations.

      And the Su-35 is not the fifth generation only by stealth.
      1. KKND
        KKND 7 August 2017 18: 55
        0
        Quote: Sith Lord
        Will I really upset you if I say that Americans don’t have a fifth generation? I mean F-22 and F-35. Specifically, out of 5 adopted parameters, two - maneuverability and speed without afterburner, does not reach 5 generations.

        And we use the American definitions of what the 5th generation is. laughing
        What's up there. AFAR radar, cruising supersonic, over-maneuverability, stealth ...
        Live the "American" brains, your right.
        1. Lord of the Sith
          Lord of the Sith 7 August 2017 19: 02
          +2
          Am I American brains? God with you! In my opinion, I did not defend the American aviation industry, but quite the opposite. Here you are rightly written that the Americans do not have a fifth generation. no matter what you call it for ordinary people or for specialists. There is a fact.
          1. KKND
            KKND 7 August 2017 19: 15
            +1
            Quote: Sith Lord
            In my opinion, I did not defend the American aviation industry, but quite the opposite.

            Well, one must also be able to criticize ...
      2. jonhr
        jonhr 7 August 2017 21: 39
        +2
        what’s most interesting, both fly super-sonic without afterburner and the raptor is super-maneuverable laughing
        1. Shahno
          Shahno 7 August 2017 22: 05
          +3
          Yes, the F22 and F35 have cruising supersonic sound. I'm just tired of already answering. You can’t stop the viral thoughts anyway. And someone constantly forgets about avionics. Because it’s not a camilleph about her.
          1. jonhr
            jonhr 7 August 2017 22: 11
            0
            why should they remember if they have viral thoughts? wishful thinking and live on.
            and somehow it’s not at all patriotic to recall that the 5th generation is a single information field. which, as I understand it, the t-50 is not observed
            1. Philip Staros
              Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 24
              +4
              I do not understand ... Why is not observed? Actually, the USSR was PIONEERS for the creation of network-centric systems ... And they were (and are) at the beginning of the 4th generation.
              Our air defense system of the decade is a SINGLE INFORMATION FIELD the size of a COUNTRY, where interceptors have been included since Brezhnev's time.
              1. jonhr
                jonhr 8 August 2017 08: 54
                0
                Oh really? As far as I am aware of the pioneers, my alien system appeared 15 years later than the Americans. or do you naively believe that problems with the f-35 so arose on an empty field with its 8 million lines of program code?
          2. Days
            Days 8 August 2017 22: 57
            +1
            Quote: Shahno
            Yes, the f22 and f35 have cruising supersonic. I'm just tired of already answering. You can’t stop the viral thoughts anyway.

            It seems you have not answered me yet :) Here is a good site for you: www.jsf.mil, and to be more precise, this page: http://www.jsf.mil/contact/con_faqs.htm

            This page is printed in black and white:
            Does the F-35 supercruise?
            No, the F135 is not designed to supercruise

            Here is another screenshot:

            The F-35 does not have a cruising supersonic sound. All that a penguin can do is a short supersonic sound with a sharp increase in specific consumption. Because the Pratt & Whitney F-135 is built for subsonic operation.
        2. SergF123
          SergF123 8 August 2017 17: 02
          +1
          Something I have not heard about that the F-22 is super maneuverable, akromya, both from the Amerzot and the like, who holyly believe them ....
    4. SergF123
      SergF123 8 August 2017 16: 56
      0
      Amersota does not have 5th generation aircraft, with a maximum of hints for it, the only plane that meets the signs of the 5th generation, if not paradoxically, is the Tu-160, just in case I’ll enlighten .... What would patriotism be, if you are Russian develop!
      1. jonhr
        jonhr 8 August 2017 20: 03
        +1
        I can say that only Americans have 5 generation aircraft. and if you want to learn about the super-maneuverability of the raptor, then you can help you. and I truly believe in what I see with my own eyes
        1. Days
          Days 8 August 2017 23: 29
          +1
          In American terms, supermaneuverability is just the use of maneuverability, which is not possible with conventional aerodynamic maneuverability, for example, through the use of OBT.

          But this does not mean that he is super-maneuverable within the framework of the term adopted in the USSR. On the contrary, the same YouTube convinces the opposite :) Although your point of view religion also has a right to exist, as well as the church of the pasta monster, however.
          1. jonhr
            jonhr 9 August 2017 07: 18
            0
            everything is more serious than I thought laughing
  3. 3officer
    3officer 7 August 2017 16: 14
    +5
    So you look soon the whole squadron of prototypes will form wink And soon, we’ll bring down an entire armada of opponents soldier
  4. DEPARTMENT
    DEPARTMENT 7 August 2017 16: 14
    +7
    Competition is a good thing .. (I'm the only thing I understood from the article)))) Good luck to aircraft builders!
    1. Solomon Kane
      Solomon Kane 7 August 2017 16: 20
      +5
      Vitaliy, Salute! One thing is not clear - is the issue of engines on the T-50 resolved?
      1. The comment was deleted.
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  5. voyaka uh
    voyaka uh 7 August 2017 16: 23
    +6
    Do I have to redo the glider again when completed
    test and mount new engines? They are more powerful: other vibrations, weight?
    1. bk316
      bk316 7 August 2017 16: 32
      +4
      Who knows ...
    2. aKtoR
      aKtoR 7 August 2017 16: 33
      +1
      Do not have to
    3. Solomon Kane
      Solomon Kane 7 August 2017 16: 37
      +8
      The glider is essentially perfect. The power plant will be designed specifically for the constructive structure of the airframe; in principle, it will not differ in size and weight from the previous one, the number of blades on the turbine (or the number of turbines on HPC or KPD) will be changed. And tolerances for overloads, vibrations, etc. with a huge margin ......
      1. KKND
        KKND 7 August 2017 16: 51
        0
        Comrade Ura-patriot, excuse me for being a skeptic, but I didn’t understand anything you wrote.
        Quote: Solomon Kane
        (or the number of turbines on HPC or KPD)

        So how many turbines can be on HPC or KPD ???
        More than one lol ?
        1. Shahno
          Shahno 7 August 2017 17: 08
          +2
          I propose to make it a three-circuit.
          1. KKND
            KKND 7 August 2017 18: 39
            0
            Quote: Shahno
            I propose to make it a three-circuit.

            Yes, you can stir up a five-loop
        2. Solomon Kane
          Solomon Kane 7 August 2017 19: 19
          +6
          I agree, it was described, the slip went out, ... meant turbine wheels ..... recourse
      2. voyaka uh
        voyaka uh 7 August 2017 17: 00
        +5
        The glider has been redone 2 times. Fighter with internal compartments
        for missiles and bombs is done in Russia for the first time. Internal compartments reduce
        fuselage strength. Maybe it is in its current form and perfect. I will not argue.
        In any case, there is nowhere to retreat. It is a carrier of new technologies, materials,
        electronics. Must complete. good
        1. Philip Staros
          Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 25
          +2
          But the bombers with internal compartments are not the first to do ...
    4. owl
      owl 7 August 2017 16: 43
      +3
      Quite possibly. I remember when the first “blueprints” of the T-50 appeared, some “left engineer” on the site commented on the speed characteristics (at that time something around 2.5M, I don’t remember exactly) this miracle, then literally “he doesn’t at that speed a weak ridge will fly off (from behind the compartments) "that the most important thing soon the" designer "themselves started talking about speed limits laughing
      1. Operator
        Operator 7 August 2017 17: 07
        +1
        The power circuit of the Su-57 airframe is a one-to-one power circuit of the Su-27, only worse: the fuselage of the first has a huge cutout in the form of wings of the internal weapons compartment, which naturally weakened the monocoque design.

        After several years of work on this problem, reinforcing elements made of titanium and carbon fiber were added to the Su-57 fuselage, and they solved the problem.

        The F-22 solved the same problem in a simple way - they placed air intake boxes on the sides of the fuselage (on the model of the MiG-25), reinforcing the layout layout, but at the same time worsening aerodynamics compared to the Su-27 / Su-57.
        1. owl
          owl 7 August 2017 17: 24
          0
          Quote: Operator
          After several years of work on this problem, reinforcing elements made of titanium and carbon fiber were added to the fuselage.

          But what about the rumors about the "weight problems" of course I also heard smile
          You just don’t worry the plane is essentially crude to recall at least an epic, and with the same Su-27, everything can be done, the main thing is desire, competence and ECONOMY, but with that ... time will tell in short. In the meantime, it shows about 200 tons of F-22 and almost doped F-35 and which F ... is waiting for us tomorrow?
          1. Operator
            Operator 7 August 2017 18: 16
            +3
            F-18 Super Hornet, of course - to compare F-35 with Su-57 is possible only in the fantasies of Russophobes, and F-22 is hopelessly outdated and unable to withstand even Su-35С.

            The Procrustean bed, in the form of limiting the length of air-to-air missiles deployed in the internal arms bays, brought the Raptor to a zugunder in the fight for air superiority with the Su-35С armed with an external airborne suspension (+ 300 km range, however )
            1. owl
              owl 7 August 2017 18: 38
              +2
              Quote: Operator
              compare F-35 with Su-57

              Quote: Operator
              and the F-22 is hopelessly outdated

              Quote: Operator
              with the Su-35S, armed with a RVV-DB on external sling (+300 km range, however).

              These are the loud conclusions of the "operator-machine milking" you already excuse me if I offended hi
              I do not compare anything (what kind of fantasies request ) there’s simply nothing to compare with laughing but to prophesy this to Rogozin and others ...
              1. Operator
                Operator 7 August 2017 18: 44
                +2
                Quote: gufo
                I don't compare anything

                Yes, yes, yes: "Practically finished F-35", - gufo (C) laughing

                PS Gufo from Italian translates as an owl, isn't it?
                1. owl
                  owl 7 August 2017 18: 52
                  0
                  Quote: Operator
                  Yes Yes Yes:

                  That's right, here I am talking about the fact that our partners have already had “5 generations” flyers who would not blaspheme them. If I compare something here, then only quantitative indicators!
                  1. Operator
                    Operator 7 August 2017 18: 58
                    +1
                    Compare the number of "Penguins" with the number of fighters laughing

                    F-22 - FSE, thank you all, everyone is free, the processing lines for the knife, suppliers of materials and equipment have reoriented to other products.
                    1. owl
                      owl 7 August 2017 19: 06
                      0
                      Quote: Operator
                      Compare the number of "Penguins" with the number of fighters

                      I can not but rejoice at your optimism laughing
                      Quote: Operator
                      F-22 - FSE, thank you all, everyone is free, the processing lines for the knife, suppliers of materials and equipment have reoriented to other products.

                      Visited a sense of deja vu laughing and here I understood that the great “Ukrainians” describe the state of industry (and not only) in the Russian Federation in the same way, without having ours, in this sense I’ll see we are brothers laughing
            2. Philip Staros
              Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 28
              0
              Well, there is no need to overlap ... F-22 also flies in stock ... Radars, electronics, etc. changed already.
              And the internal compartments, etc. give real advantages. If a large missile is needed, then some F-15 drags it behind it ... Can it be that it can not be hung from the outside, has it not been tracked?
        2. KKND
          KKND 7 August 2017 18: 14
          0
          Hello Operator hi
          Where did they find the power circuit of the Su-57?
          1. Operator
            Operator 7 August 2017 18: 21
            +3
            The power circuit of the Su-57 (a glider with a monocoque fuselage, an integrated wing, spaced engines and air intakes under the wings, and not in front of them) is visible to the naked eye.

            The internal power set of the airframe is not really visible, but it is derived from the power circuit.
            1. KKND
              KKND 7 August 2017 18: 31
              +1
              Che looked, looked ... thought, thought, the Y-23 is more like the Su-27. No.
              About missiles +300 km. cool of course, but it’s strange that the Americans don’t use them, although there were projects. What this means is little understood. But on the Su-27, for example, the radar operating mode indicates the range for maneuvering and non-maneuvering targets for the R-27 about 2 times. I have a suspicion that everything depends on the methods (algorithms) of missile guidance. And there I do not understand anything. It is clear that an actively maneuvering target can be brought down by a missile only from a much shorter distance.
              All the same, it is not clear why the Americans do not use them.
              1. Operator
                Operator 7 August 2017 18: 54
                +2
                The experienced YF-23 almost matches the power scheme with the Su-27 / Su-57 (the latter have more engine spacing), but since the Americans themselves rejected it (by stupidity), then our Drying rules.

                Americans up to the RVV-DB as to the moon - faith, that is, the dimensions of the weapon compartments F-22 and F-35 do not allow counting on more than AIM-120D with 180 km range.
                1. KKND
                  KKND 7 August 2017 18: 59
                  0
                  They would have muddied on the F-15 or even implemented their A-12.
                  Still strange are the overloads on the P-33 \ 37. Little ones.
                  Any thoughts on this? It doesn’t reach me.
                  1. Operator
                    Operator 7 August 2017 19: 01
                    +1
                    I can not say anything about the P-33 / P-37.
                    1. KKND
                      KKND 7 August 2017 19: 10
                      0
                      If I figure it out, I’ll inform you, we’ll think about my version.
              2. voyaka uh
                voyaka uh 7 August 2017 23: 45
                0
                "About the +300 km missiles. Cool of course, but it is strange that the Americans do not use them" ///

                Why is it strange? Such a missile can only be aimed at an airplane like AWACS or B-52. Of course, they also need to be shot down, but for the sake of dragging such a bandura under the wings?
              3. Philip Staros
                Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 30
                0
                The missile part of the distance flies by inertia. And not a small part ... So it turns out that you can shoot down a maneuvering target only with the engine turned on. And non-maneuvering - it is possible and "fly".
            2. jonhr
              jonhr 7 August 2017 21: 45
              0
              spaced engines first appeared on f-14. Do not tell me why the Americans abandoned this scheme?
              1. Operator
                Operator 8 August 2017 13: 47
                +1
                By stupidity.
                1. jonhr
                  jonhr 8 August 2017 20: 05
                  0
                  and now more about this stupidity. really want to hear a reasonable answer from a specialist laughing
                  1. Operator
                    Operator 8 August 2017 20: 56
                    +1
                    Su-27 has a unique glider:
                    - the engines are lowered down the wing, the fuselage is raised above the wing (high wing);
                    - the air intakes are carried back beyond the wing edge.

                    The F-14, with its lowered fuselage (low wing) and forward-facing air intakes, was not standing nearby.

                    Spaced on both sides of the wing, the fuselage and air intakes allow the Su-27 to achieve super-maneuverable evolution in the yaw plane without surging engines.

                    Neither the F-14 nor the F-22 have this - when turning, one of the air intakes is necessarily shielded by the fuselage.
                    1. jonhr
                      jonhr 8 August 2017 21: 45
                      0
                      and the disadvantages of spaced engines? I asked about it
                      1. Operator
                        Operator 8 August 2017 22: 21
                        0
                        There are no shortcomings.
        3. SPACE
          SPACE 7 August 2017 19: 17
          +7
          Quote: Operator
          The power circuit of the Su-57 airframe is a one-to-one power circuit of the Su-27, only worse: the fuselage of the first has a huge cutout in the form of wings of the internal weapons compartment, which naturally weakened the monocoque design.

          Nonsense, Su 57 has a better power circuit than 27, in fact 57 further evolution of 27 development where the concepts of the fuselage and wings are already completely erased, in fact 57 is one solid carrier wing, where the load is not only carried by the wing, but it is evenly distributed over judging by the flattened flat-layered body, it’s less prone to local, local overloads than the 57, which means it is stronger. And the internal 27 longitudinal compartments have a power partition, if it is removed, the caliber will fit there. But the main highlight of Pakf, all the same, is the unique first and only in the world controlled influx, controlled vortex! In general, the 2 aircraft is in many ways unique, it will be able to fly both slowly and quickly like a corncracker and 57 interceptor ... its appearance, appearance, contours, aerodynamics, directly say that absolutely all aircraft, including the FNUMX and FNUMX, are completely outdated. He will surprise many, many more ... wait ... remember these words ...
          1. Operator
            Operator 7 August 2017 19: 36
            0
            Quote: SPACE
            this is one solid carrier wing

            You confuse PAK FA with PAK YES.
            the main highlight of Pakf, all the same, this is the unique first and only controlled influx in the world

            Aerodynamics is not a power plan for a glider.
            1. SPACE
              SPACE 7 August 2017 19: 53
              +2
              Quote: Operator
              You confuse PAK FA with PAK YES.

              I do not confuse.
              Quote: Operator
              Aerodynamics is not a power plan for a glider.

              We are talking about an airplane, these concepts are inextricably linked.
          2. KKND
            KKND 7 August 2017 19: 44
            0
            Quote: SPACE
            in fact, 57 this is one continuous supporting wing, where the load is not only carried by the wing, but it is evenly distributed throughout the entire fuselage,

            Quote: Operator
            You confuse PAK FA with PAK YES.

            He's talking about B-2 and his ancestors did not hear ...
          3. Philip Staros
            Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 31
            +1
            Wow ... It generally looks ... like a flying blade - very flat.
    5. san4es
      san4es 7 August 2017 18: 32
      +6
      Quote: voyaka uh
      Do you have to redo the glider again?

      ... yeah-well ... and so it will come down hi
    6. Incvizitor
      Incvizitor 8 August 2017 11: 18
      0
      It seems to me that they will redo it when the ROFAR is finished, or it will be new aircraft.
  6. Alexey-74
    Alexey-74 7 August 2017 16: 23
    +2
    All this is good. So far, we would have to please our people with the pre-production version of the SU-57 .... well, finally complete the endless tests ............... and then we are testing that it is time to test the 6th generation aircraft
    1. tanit
      tanit 7 August 2017 16: 39
      +3
      Quote: Alexey-74
      otherwise we’re testing that it’s time to test the 6th generation airplane

      And without the tests of the 5th, to experience the 6th, what's the point?
    2. spirit
      spirit 7 August 2017 19: 01
      0
      Something tells me that 6 in the USA it will be just a mix of RAPTOR with heavy shock drones. They are testing them in full in the hostilities, but with us it is rather weak (so I think 6 will not be soon
      1. Philip Staros
        Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 33
        +1
        Su-57, judging by the hints, will actually be an OPTIONALLY-manned aircraft. Like ALL of our latest technology. They will finish off the AI ​​and the squadron of cars will fly ... and from which the pilot (commander) will be in one ... And ANYWHERE ...
  7. Hadji Murat
    Hadji Murat 7 August 2017 16: 29
    +4
    light wing, handsome!
  8. aKtoR
    aKtoR 7 August 2017 16: 30
    +3
    Well, so we learned almost the new name of the aircraft))
  9. v1tz
    v1tz 7 August 2017 16: 32
    +2
    as I understand it, the 11th last chain of evolution of the T-50 ...
    1. tanit
      tanit 7 August 2017 16: 41
      +2
      Quote: v1tz
      as I understand it, the 11th last chain of evolution of the T-50 ...

      But the tests just show. I hope the same, like everything that last before the series chain.
  10. The comment was deleted.
    1. aKtoR
      aKtoR 7 August 2017 16: 51
      +5
      Do not worry, it's not scary. While not in a hurry, let the systems on the plane register
    2. Mountain shooter
      Mountain shooter 7 August 2017 16: 53
      +4
      Make at least one!
    3. Muvka
      Muvka 7 August 2017 18: 43
      0
      The coming years are until 2020.
    4. Philip Staros
      Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 34
      0
      In fact, production is ALREADY proceeding at the same pace or on-going CONTINUING.
  11. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 7 August 2017 16: 51
    +2
    All is correct. The quieter you go, the further you'll get.
    Our Israeli friends promised to talk about the F-35 - what does it feel like in the Middle East sky?
    1. san4es
      san4es 7 August 2017 17: 00
      +8
      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      ... Our Israeli friends promised to talk about the F-35 - what is it like in the Middle East sky?

      ... They sent a video report bully
      1. DEPARTMENT
        DEPARTMENT 7 August 2017 18: 22
        0
        Quote: san4es
        They sent a video report

        It took off and immediately landed ..)))) It is empty in Iran will try to fly, there they have been waiting for it for a long time ...
  12. Panzermensch
    Panzermensch 7 August 2017 16: 54
    +5
    Clear. Very soon, here it is. Surely immediately with AEGIS and NIFC-CA will be.
    1. Philip Staros
      Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 37
      +1
      I don’t remember this ... Even in 2012. Maybe a slice filtered full of nonsense. Serious people promised otherwise. A long time ago, even before the 12th - somewhere around the year of the 16th they expressed hopes ... But then the deadlines shifted. And then everything went on schedule - the first flight, etc. And the engine of the second stage is generally on an optimistic schedule.
  13. irazum
    irazum 7 August 2017 16: 58
    0
    Beautiful car! The engines are just ...
    1. B-15
      B-15 7 August 2017 21: 58
      0
      It is not easy to make dviguny for the first time in the world.
      Let's wait for the characteristics of the gas turbine engine of the second stage.
      Then it will be clear who is ahead on the dvigunami.
  14. Voyager
    Voyager 7 August 2017 17: 01
    +1
    All this is good, but no one has officially named the Su-57. This leak is a rumor.
    1. polev66
      polev66 7 August 2017 18: 21
      0
      oh well seriously? Already from 2 months this name is well known and no one refutes
      1. Voyager
        Voyager 7 August 2017 23: 00
        0
        There are a lot of things, but there was no official statement.
  15. KKND
    KKND 7 August 2017 17: 33
    0
    Quote: Mystery12345
    because 25-31 don't care ... there's nothing to hide, he's an interceptor.

    Another aviaexperd lol
    This is necessary to achieve high supersonic speeds.
    But it turns out to be extremely low efficiency at lower speeds.
  16. polev66
    polev66 7 August 2017 18: 20
    0
    quietly, calmly, modifying and improving business is moving towards mass production and deliveries to the VKS and for export)
  17. candidate
    candidate 7 August 2017 19: 11
    0
    ... Neither oil nor gas is strong Russia
    And in spirit and thought - God forbid forever! ...
  18. Music
    Music 7 August 2017 19: 14
    0
    And the 10th ?? Does she have another glider? And when will this prototype be built?
    1. samoletil18
      samoletil18 7 August 2017 21: 19
      0
      Maybe never. Maybe they have already collected and started to remodel at -12. Maybe something else. They will tell us maybe. Or maybe they won’t. Or they will say something that does not correspond to the real situation.
  19. Holoy
    Holoy 7 August 2017 23: 56
    0
    And my Air Force doesn’t give me peace at all! For Geometry, I am calm, she is the best in the world! But Avionics campaign worse ...

    We do not have capable guys in Avionics!
    1. Philip Staros
      Philip Staros 8 August 2017 03: 42
      +4
      Avionics is how? What is the most powerful radar in the world on a military aircraft (Su-35S) than you do not like? So that the letter "A" is not in it? Or do our dryers fly poorly? Does the electronics not allow you to control yourself in the air? Or can not direct missiles? Avionics is how?
      The Russians always had their trump cards and their weaknesses. Strengths correctly applied. Weak - not leveled.
      The description of the systems on the Tu-214P generally makes "hair move" everywhere (such as radars displaying UNDERGROUND space for hundreds of km) ... And electrophotonics or whatever it promises that the "second stage" radar on the Su-57 will have equally futuristic capabilities operations, the flights of the Su-35S in super-maneuverability mode look wildly against the background of “normal” aircraft.
      In general, avionics at the level ... Just their trump cards and their cons.
  20. P0LYM
    P0LYM 8 August 2017 09: 00
    +1
    The engine is new where ???
  21. Mestny
    Mestny 8 August 2017 09: 07
    +1
    KKND,
    While there are more of yours, all props and putisilsilnik. Just a little news - right there a slender choir of mourners runs over.
  22. Serzh_R
    Serzh_R 8 August 2017 09: 17
    +1
    Many admire the appearance of the T-50 (Su-57), but technology must be visible from the outside.
    The T-50 has the look of a SU licked and chopped off by stealth technology.
    These eye-catching engine contours are not what people trying to do the 6 generation do.
    T-50 so far, despite the prospects, is just a window dress similar to Berkut (SU-47).
    12 pieces series is just ridiculous.
    Of course, the work carried out is huge and the groundwork has been done, but this is just work without result - the intended series and profitable export.
  23. Serzh_R
    Serzh_R 8 August 2017 09: 44
    0



    It is not enough to produce a good thing, it should not look like a VAZ near Maserati.
  24. Tatarin83
    Tatarin83 8 August 2017 10: 52
    0
    Who knows why the name of the model SU-57?
    What is the logic in choosing numbers?
    1. Nova
      Nova 8 August 2017 11: 13
      0
      I hope not the year of release)
  25. Nova
    Nova 8 August 2017 11: 12
    0
    It would be interesting to look at the changes in the airframe that were mentioned in the article. I can not find with the naked eye in the photo.
  26. askme
    askme 8 August 2017 17: 05
    0
    KKND,
    Poking fun ... Well, this is parasitism, a kind of .... I do not see the positive in such activities. Well, people rejoice at statements by officials about the success of the military-industrial complex. The successes of the military-industrial complex are reality. Well, what’s the positive joke on these people? Yes, not him. Pointing out errors is one thing. And to make fun, to mock is the work of worms, mental parasites.
  27. aKtoR
    aKtoR 9 August 2017 04: 06
    +8
    The misunderstanding of many members of the forum on the use of new technology in the army is killing. There will be a squadron or a regiment of these planes and we will be happy and the adversary will immediately be frightened. Also the situation in the topic about 1941 year ...
    Even when the aircraft will be adopted, it will take years for it to become a real combat aircraft. And then you can drive a large series.
    Why? This has already been written many times.
    Need a guide to the flight operation of this aircraft. It is necessary to develop and test the tactics of this aircraft. It is necessary to register hundreds of types of weapons and equipment. It should be a year through .... Learn how to fly head.
    All this was not done in 1940-41gg. And lost a huge amount of aircraft. We must be glad that we have smart military and are doing everything as it should.
    And we restrain the enemy with the help of Yao.
  28. jonhr
    jonhr 9 August 2017 07: 20
    0
    Operator,
    well you have yes. are absent.
  29. ver_
    ver_ 11 August 2017 05: 09
    0
    Quote: Seryoga Gord
    the dispute is useless, this device will not go into series, max. 50-60 dryers will be blinded and they will be blown in, all resources will be thrown to the 6th generation, so as not to overtake mattresses, but ahead of the board, because after 2020 drones will come to the fore and pilots will not be in demand ...))

    ... it’s already 6 generations .., they’re not just flying - the algorithm is being worked out - without a flyer .. For this, the glider is stronger, and the modes are more * aggressive * .. the engine will reach and ... everything will be hockey ..