Military Review

Torture democracy

67
How is President Obama different from President Bush Jr.? Attitudes towards torture.


The fact is that George Bush, with his penchant for political outrage, made torture a worthy occupation, approved even by high-ranking lawyers, but Obama separates torture from democracy, praising the second and condemning the former.

By the way, Bush became famous not only by torture, but also by a reverent attitude to the death penalty. At one time - in those years when Bush was President of the United States - I even collected notes about this outstanding man, whom the Americans entrusted to manage their country and who treat criminals, as well as suspects, as sternly as they can apply to them. probably only the leader of the country - the world hegemon.

Bush Jr. showed his somewhat unusual attitude towards violators of the law while still being governor.

A small clipping from the old issue of the Vlast magazine: “But recently, under pressure from Governor George W. Bush (now the President of the United States), a law was passed in Texas according to which the offender must verbally or in writing warn the victim of an impending crime no less than 24 hours before it is committed. In addition, the warning should describe the upcoming crime. Violation of this rule is considered by the court as an aggravating circumstance. ” (Belash V. The most foolish laws of the world // Kommersant Power. February 6 2001. No. 5. C. 39).

But an excerpt from the book by R. Dawkins: “... in the eyes of the absolutist religion, abortion is evil, no different from murder. I do not know how, then, to regard the observations I received from my own experience: many of the most ardent opponents of killing embryos show increased enthusiasm for committing this action in relation to adults. ... George W. Bush is a typical example of modern religious rulers. He and his ilk fiercely protect human life as long as it is in an embryonic (or incurably sick) state, not stopping at the ban of medical research that can save the lives of a huge number of people. ... more than a third of executions in 50 US states occurred in Texas. And, as you know, Bush led a large number of executions in Texas - about one every 9 days - than any other governor in stories of the state. Maybe he was just doing his duty as governor and state law? But then what about the famous CNN journalist Tucker Carlson's reportage? Being himself a supporter of the death penalty, Carlson was nevertheless amazed at how “ridiculous” Bush teased the executed woman who implored the governor to postpone the execution. “Please,” the future president sneered mockingly, squeezing his lips in fake despair with mockery, “do not kill me.” (Dawkins R. God as an illusion. M .: Kolibri, 2008. S. 409-410).

It is not surprising that later, as president, George W. Bush declared that “God commanded him to seize Iraq ...” (Dawkins R., same edition, p. 129).

On this remarkable man in 2004, a special book was written: “Bush on the Psychiatrist's Couch: Inside the Presidential Mind”. Its author is American Justin Frank, a psychoanalyst, who found in George Bush dyslexia, paranoia, megalomania, a number of violations of thought processes, and in addition a tendency toward sadism.

It was George Bush, who was still in 1996, who said: “We must speak about the illegality of actions as if we don’t have it” (one of Bush’s comments from the Umberto Eco collection). Sure, Bush has long followed this rule.

There is just as much evidence that torture indicated to the US intelligence agencies the way to bin Laden, as well as the fact that the Lord ordered Bush to send American soldiers to Iraq.

The torture with water (drowning), which Bush loved so much, connects the recent US President with Iraq, with a fierce dislike for which he has kindled since the sad date - September 11 of 2001.

Well-known lawyer John Yu, a US Department of Justice official who worked under Bush, is still proving to the world (for example, through the Wall Street Journal) that the use of water torture and other torture is appropriate. This same John Yu, currently teaching at the University of Berkeley Law School, is one of the signatories of two memorandums of torture dated 1 August 2002. The second signature is written by Jay Beibi, now a judge of the US Court of Appeals. “Who are the judges? ..”

Condoleezza Rice is another torture buff. It was she who, after an exciting conversation with Tseerushny lawyers and NSA advisers, ordered the CIA to interrogate Abu Zubaydah, who was considered to be the main al-Qaida recruiter, so to speak, with a special predilection. The CIA made videotapes of torture with imitation of drowning, but subsequently destroyed it.

Donald Ramsfield, the former head of the Pentagon, should also be attributed to supporters of "enhanced interrogation techniques." And the famous H. Rodriguez, the famous zeerush fighter against Al-Qaida in 2002-2005, recently condemned President Obama for refusing the latter to use “enhanced methods”.

The fate of Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri, a native of Saudi Arabia, is known. This man, accused of undermining the American destroyer Cole in 2000, served nine years in secret CIA prisons. He was caught in 2002, and since then he spent 4 of the year in CIA prisons, and then was transferred to Cuba, in Guantanamo. Abd al-Rahim al-Nashiri, like many others, was also tortured by drowning. He also tried to drill his head with an electric drill. It is believed that there were dramatization of the prison sentence. The trial over al-Nashiri will begin on November 9 of 2012 of the year. It is not yet clear whether the judge’s attention will be paid to the use of illegal methods of inquiry, not approved by President Obama, but favored by Bush.

The scandals that arose several years ago around the Abu Ghraib prison in Baghdad are also widely known. In May, 2004, photos appeared in many newspapers of the world, where scenes of mockery of Iraqis imprisoned in their cells were captured. Eight of the US military on the results of the investigation was accused of "abuse of official authority." Americans, however, this not only did not scare, but did not stop. After all, at the helm of America - a man who said: "We must speak about the illegality of actions as if we do not have it." For another three months at Abu Ghraib, American guards continued to mock the prisoners by the Iraqis. The methods of bullying, however, were not as sophisticated as in the CIA. The Iraqis were just tritely beaten, raped, pushed into cells, passed a current through their bodies, hung up by handcuffs, and doused with icy water. In 2006, this prison passed to the Iraqi authorities.

And here is one of the personal tragic stories. In 2002, therefore, also under Bush, in New York, Maher Arar, a Syrian by birth, a Canadian citizen, an engineer by profession, was arrested. Erroneously suspected of being involved in Al-Qaeda Arar, the Americans interrogated as many 13 days, but fortunately did not torture. But then he was transported not to Canada, but to ... Syria. The Syrians held Arara 10 for months in the cell area of ​​90x180, see and beat them with their fists and electric shocks. The interrogation of a Canadian in a Syrian prison lasted for eighteen hours. Only then, when it became clear that the accusation was false, Arar was sent to Canada. And the Canadian government, regretting its involvement in the terrible mistake, paid 10,5 million dollars to the victim, and Prime Minister Harper apologized to the citizen of Canada. The Americans, of course, did not admit their mistakes and did not apologize to anyone. I remember the famous film "Transition" 1979 of the year, in many countries at the time forbidden - but not in the Soviet box office. (Be sure to look, if you have not looked, you will not regret). In one scene, an SS officer says to an anti-fascist prisoner: “I admit that the Germans may be wrong. But not the SS officers. ” Here are American intelligence agents and counterintelligence agents of all stripes and shades — they too "cannot be wrong."

Now, in March, 2012, Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, and other "top people" of America are daily talking about horror, torture, and bloodshed in Syria. It seems that the successors of the Bush Jr. case cannot be called. Especially B. Obama, who banned "enhanced methods of inquiry" in 2009 year. Apparently, it is the custom of the American presidents: the next president does everything the opposite of the previous one.

But this year in America is an election. And if the opponent of torture, Obama for a second term in the White House does not pass, then his successor will consecrate the work of the shoulder masters again.
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  1. domokl
    domokl 3 March 2012 09: 08 New
    +6
    There is a double impression from the article .. On the one hand, it seemed to amuse me at the beginning .. But in the end it became scary ... Democracy with the face of a fanatic ... Why is such democracy needed at all? Russia ...
    1. Sergh
      Sergh 3 March 2012 10: 01 New
      +3
      America is one big advertisement for an expired, rotting product that needs to be urgently sold. In this regard, as in good, professional commercials, this advertisement must be periodically exposed, although the product is really just fresh calf manure, you need to use the most chic packaging for it, where it is desirable to mention that 20% is free. And then people from all over the world will reach out and be sure that this is just a new Snickers that will weaken their health.
      1. admiral
        admiral 3 March 2012 11: 57 New
        +2
        Imagine what kind of film can be shot about George W. Bush based only on the materials of American journalists, and the film is an art, blockbuster! Hitler's mixture with Dracula !!! That's where the real counter-propaganda is! Spectacular, affordable, effective, and most importantly massively! Still, few people read articles, especially from the young ones!
    2. Arc76
      Arc76 3 March 2012 23: 55 New
      -4
      Of course, it’s better to make the type of power North Korean.
    3. Uralm
      Uralm 4 March 2012 23: 35 New
      0
      domokl
      so is Democracy.
      So the same crap! In short, they went all this crap after Vietnam,
      WELL YOU see Heroic Footage How THEY KILLED THE CHILDREN. HUNDRED.
      So that in Hell all burned. AND GLORY TO THE VIETNAM PEOPLE. I’m always good with Knim, True, we have enough. and they are learning.
      By the way, America does not want there against Vietnam? If we help the Vietnamese a little bit. We have S-400 appeared. What is there S-75 and 3 aircraft? I'm afraid Amers there at gunpoint can not drag! Well done Vietnamese!
      Many complain. That the S-300 is not even tested in battle.
      So we are like a pider ... you don’t attack everyone who doesn’t give us oil for free!
      1. Ruslan67
        Ruslan67 5 March 2012 03: 36 New
        +1
        when attacking the s-300, arekanders are useless
  2. DementeFF
    DementeFF 3 March 2012 09: 46 New
    +4
    The witch hunt has proved that people confess anything under torture. This is used (as it is not terrible) to this day
    1. domokl
      domokl 3 March 2012 11: 29 New
      +2
      A generation of computer players and Rambos has grown in the USA ... They believe that someone else’s blood is worth nothing more ... But anyone will answer for American ... In general, just in the American society there has been a reassessment of values ​​... Life for money, this the principle has replaced .. Money for the sake of life ... That's what they sell, buy everything and everything ... They are not people already ... Americans .. in short ...
      1. Sniper 1968
        Sniper 1968 3 March 2012 21: 58 New
        -2
        domokl,
        I agree absolutely and unconditionally, Comrade Lieutenant General. A consuming nation that has burnt its soul, pride and conscience. A star-striped stomach. They are soon vomiting ... Respect.
      2. Ruslan67
        Ruslan67 5 March 2012 03: 40 New
        +1
        if you read the first blood of morella, you must remember its direct and very tough anti-war orientation at that time, therefore it is not entirely correct to consider a new generation as a generation of rimbaud
  3. RUSmen
    RUSmen 3 March 2012 10: 14 New
    0
    CIA = histapo.
    1. VIKING
      VIKING 3 March 2012 12: 06 New
      -9
      Quote: RUSmen
      CIA = histapo.

      The worst Gestapo is the Russian police department.
      The CIA’s “torture” is childish pranks compared to cop sadists.
      1. Ziksura
        Ziksura 3 March 2012 13: 12 New
        +2
        Quote: VIKING
        The worst Gestapo is the Russian police department.

        This is considered a crime in our country, and the president and senior officials do not call for this. This is not government policy. Do not distort the essence of the facts.
        1. Isr
          Isr 3 March 2012 23: 44 New
          +7
          among Americans, this is also considered a crime, and the president and senior officials do not call for this. and this is government policy. in my opinion the author perverted the facts
      2. Yars
        Yars 3 March 2012 14: 51 New
        +1
        VIKING You're like a CIA lawyer here, huh? You are a buddy and have no idea what methods they torture Arabs. These are the same fascists, only not much in a different guise. After all, it was the West that raised Hitler at the time and poisoned him against the Slavs in order to completely destroy this people. The most interesting thing is that you write from Ukraine about the Russian police department. you kind of got it wrong, better tell me how much you get paid for it ...
        1. VIKING
          VIKING 3 March 2012 22: 52 New
          +2
          Quote: YARS
          VIKING You're like a CIA lawyer here, huh? You are a buddy and have no idea what methods they torture Arabs.

          First, I’ll ask you not to poke am
          Secondly, I strongly recommend reading more not only pro-Kremlin propaganda muddies, but also independent media, and objectivity may increase.
          It has long been written that the CIA deliberately spread the rumor of "torture in its dungeons," so that the terrorist creatures would be afraid, the expectation of torture, as well as the expectation of death are worse than torture and death themselves. But by what methods they tried, there was already an unauthorized leak. These methods have been described in detail. So, they, in comparison with the methods of cop executioners-interrogators, are innocent pranks. Only newborn babies have not heard of torture in the police department dungeons.

          Quote: YARS
          After all, it was the West that raised Hitler at the time and poisoned him against the Slavs in order to completely destroy this people.

          Impudent, vile lie! am It was Stalin who brought Hitler to power! am It was Stalin who helped revive the military power of Germany! am It was Stalin who set Hitler on the rest of Europe! am
          But what to talk to you ... The Stalin-Communist ideological fooling has not outlived itself; as I see it, it is still valid. Alas...
          1. son of the fatherland
            son of the fatherland 3 March 2012 23: 42 New
            -2
            Give an example, independent media.

            Refute this here http://rus-policy.ru/trebovanie-vremeni/ot-kogo-zavisyat-nezavisimie-smi-i-obsch
            estvennie-organizatsii.html If you want, also a link.
            How many sources of "independent" information http://pics.livejournal.com/kholmoden/pic/00007k0s But the hosts will not be confused good

            I would like to hear (see the link) how exactly Stalin helped revive Germany, and set Anglophile Hitler on Europe.

            Refute this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX0Yc9C3y2c

            If you just answer that I'm "Surkov propaganda." Or give a link to the works of Rezun-Suvorov, I understand. yes
          2. Steering wheel
            Steering wheel 4 March 2012 01: 14 New
            -2
            Quote: VIKING
            It was Stalin who brought Hitler to power!
            Jewish propaganda in order to confuse the traces of the Rhodeshelds. VIKING if you are such a wise guy then tell me why the West freed Germany from paying reparations in the course of World War I precisely in 1, right after Hitler came to power, not in order to have enough money to restore the Wehrmacht?
          3. sichevik
            sichevik 4 March 2012 20: 00 New
            +3
            "Yes, what to talk with you ..." And you do not talk. Go to some Tyagnibok site and talk there with your like-minded people about how your idols, Bandera and Shukhevych, sucked a member of Hitler.
          4. OSTAP BENDER
            OSTAP BENDER 5 March 2012 01: 02 New
            +2
            Dear VIKING! Is the Russian police department worse than our Ukrainian ones? Remind you of the death of a student in the police! As for the CIA, we have the whole orange-orange zavorushka from their supply! Lost in! It's time to stop them !!!!
          5. Sandov
            Sandov 5 March 2012 18: 38 New
            0
            Yes, Stalin with the current fascist lamb states. How many amers destroyed the people from Japan, Korea, Vietnam, further through the Near and Middle East, through the Maghreb countries to South and Latin America. am am am
        2. Isr
          Isr 3 March 2012 23: 49 New
          +1
          but I thought that Hitler found and raised Stalin. who gave him money and signed the contract? oil, chromium, manganese, copper sold for technology? Poland shared? West fought with Hitler, and not brought up. learn fast, and not by training manuals
          1. son of the fatherland
            son of the fatherland 4 March 2012 00: 50 New
            -2
            "but I thought that Hitler found and raised Stalin." - Will there be proofs?
            "who gave him money and signed contracts? oil, chrome, manganese, copper sold for technology?" That is, the whole world could trade with Germany, but we do not? And yes. I believe that the purchase of the USSR technology from Germany (and not only). It helped to catch up with the technological lag that happened due to the revolution and the subsequent civil war. Resources, there would be (and were) someone to supply Germany, and without the USSR. You know the concept of "buffer state" Knowing why they brought up Hitler. Why did they literally feed him Europe. Stalin, knowing that Poland will also be surrendered, did the right thing. Pushing the border west. The West tried to bleed, both the USSR and Germany. And only after he realized that the USSR was almost single-handedly bending Germany (together with all of Europe, which worked for Germany), the "allies" joined.
            "learn fast, and not by training manuals" - It will be stronger than "Surkovian propaganda". I washed, what can I say. sad
          2. Steering wheel
            Steering wheel 4 March 2012 01: 20 New
            -4
            Quote: Isr
            but I thought that Hitler found and raised Stalin. who gave him money and signed the contract? oil, chromium, manganese, copper sold for technology? Poland shared? West fought with Hitler, and not brought up. learn fast, and not by training manuals
            Again, Jews think that people are stupid and look like CNN smart guy, and you tell us about the lawsuit in the USA against George W. Bush’s grandfather regarding the financing of Nazi Germany, or the Rodsheld tankers who supplied oil to Germany after the beginning of World War II, or who financed the NSDAP until 2 because Stalin funded the communists of Germany
          3. Sandov
            Sandov 5 March 2012 18: 40 New
            0
            Rare earth metals went from America to Germany until the opening of a second front. This cannot be denied.
        3. Steering wheel
          Steering wheel 4 March 2012 01: 09 New
          -3
          VIKING is not a CIA lawyer he is just a Jew wink
      3. ekzorsist
        ekzorsist 3 March 2012 18: 08 New
        +3
        You will excuse me of course ... but just like that, for information: "... Where did you work in the" dungeons of the CIA "or in the" ROVD cells "?
        Or I rephrase the question: "Where did you get your hand in?"
        It is not enough honor to cheat your country out of the blue ... - Specify specifically the names of surnames, places, etc.
        1. VIKING
          VIKING 3 March 2012 22: 55 New
          -1
          Quote: ekzorsist
          You will excuse me of course ... but just like that, for information: "... Where did you work in the" dungeons of the CIA "or in the" ROVD cells "?

          Read my post above.
          1. Steering wheel
            Steering wheel 4 March 2012 01: 22 New
            -4
            Quote: VIKING
            Read my post above.
            Jewish technology evade the answer is a translation of the arrows in the hope that the goyim are stupid
            1. Isr
              Isr 4 March 2012 17: 51 New
              -4
              Well, judging by the posts, there is something to it. not these comments convince me, but the fact that the USSR, and now Russia, continue to hide documents about the beginning of the war (for example, the lie about the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was revealed only thanks to Gorbachev)
      4. Sandov
        Sandov 5 March 2012 18: 33 New
        0
        Regrettably, one has to admit that the North American states have slid to the likeness of a fascist state, well, you can probably compare it with Nazi Germany.
  4. Tugarin-zmey
    Tugarin-zmey 3 March 2012 10: 22 New
    +2
    It is clear why the States were so intensely interested in the Gulag in the former USSR in order to build a second in Guantanamo Bay.
  5. wolk71
    wolk71 3 March 2012 10: 29 New
    +3
    The army of Satan is the United States with its population. Russia against the USA, it is LIGHT against DARKNESS. White versus black.
    1. Tatanka Yotanka
      Tatanka Yotanka 3 March 2012 10: 35 New
      +4
      It is not surprising that later, as president, George W. Bush declared that “God commanded him to seize Iraq ...” (Dawkins R., same edition, p. 129).
      no wonder we know their god
      1. Yars
        Yars 3 March 2012 14: 53 New
        +1
        Yes, he’s a sick man, God would have been afraid to say such things, his IQ level has long been known to everyone, a fascist !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !
        1. Yars
          Yars 3 March 2012 15: 15 New
          +4
          Guys, pay attention to how the corrupt members of our forum passionately minus the bulk of the messages that talk about the truth !!! AMERICAN BOTTOM AND THE DISINFORMATION AMONG YOURSELF !!! AMERICA ALWAYS WAS AND IS A Fascist STATE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
          1. Isr
            Isr 3 March 2012 23: 51 New
            +1
            never been! she is a bastion of democracy in the world today!
            1. Steering wheel
              Steering wheel 4 March 2012 01: 24 New
              -2
              Quote: Isr
              never been! she is a bastion of democracy in the world today!
              great anecdote, democracy built on the bones of redskins
            2. /
              4 March 2012 07: 29 New
              -4
              Quote: Isr
              never been! she is a bastion of democracy in the world today!

              Are you joking yes?
      2. Sandov
        Sandov 5 March 2012 18: 43 New
        0
        Lord of the Rings? Looks like however.
  6. basal
    basal 3 March 2012 10: 34 New
    +3
    And none of the human rights activists care. Where is the outraged advanced public? What will Granny Alekseeva, a US citizen, tell us on this subject?
    1. Ziksura
      Ziksura 3 March 2012 13: 16 New
      0
      Quote: basal
      Where is the outraged advanced public?

      On the Swamp. Mote in the eyes are looking.
  7. sergo0000
    sergo0000 3 March 2012 10: 46 New
    0
    Oleg should be advised that his archive about Bush is far from hidden (so as not to be forgotten). Perhaps soon it will come in handy for the tribunal!: - D
  8. lewerlin53rus
    lewerlin53rus 3 March 2012 10: 47 New
    +3
    whom the Americans entrusted to rule their country

    If memory serves me right, then A. Gor won in all the polls, calculations and ratings, and Bush won in the end. The whole American electoral system is aimed at ensuring that the White House is the one who pleases the shadow ruling elite, and not the one whom ordinary Americans will choose. Therefore, there is not even close to the democracy that they boast about to the whole world. It’s only the screen under the cover of which they create in the world that chaos that we are witnessing now
  9. UI-Spb
    UI-Spb 3 March 2012 11: 01 New
    +5
    In America, one more law needs to be passed: a presidential candidate must provide a certificate from the international psychiatric commission.
  10. Magadan
    Magadan 3 March 2012 11: 13 New
    +5
    Quote: domokl
    I’ll do everything to prevent the American type of power in Russia ...

    I had the same desire after living there in 1993-1994
    1. domokl
      domokl 3 March 2012 11: 31 New
      0
      I understand you perfectly ... I also know not from publications .. Thank you for your support smile
      1. admiral
        admiral 3 March 2012 12: 01 New
        -1
        Magadan, it would not be a bad idea to set out personal experience in more detail, life examples are much more expensive than inferences, and you should not even talk about visualization !!! We wait!!!
        1. Ziksura
          Ziksura 3 March 2012 13: 20 New
          0
          Quote: Admiral
          Magadan, it would not be a bad idea to set out personal experience in more detail, life examples are much more expensive than inferences, and you should not even talk about visualization !!! We wait!!!

          I join this proposal. The need for such a publication from an eyewitness is long overdue.
    2. Arc76
      Arc76 3 March 2012 23: 53 New
      +4
      In Harlem lived on social programs? Actually, the first time I meet a man who lived in the United States and is so unhappy. With all the shortcomings of the American economy, a working person lives there better than the average Russian and this is a fact.
      1. ytqnhfk
        ytqnhfk 4 March 2012 02: 32 New
        -2
        The statistics of America at the moment in the country is 1.5 ml of people who, after payments, have $ 2 per day left! I don’t even say working day and retirement !!!!!!
      2. /
        4 March 2012 07: 32 New
        -4
        Quote: arc76
        In Harlem lived on social programs? Actually, the first time I meet a man who lived in the United States and is so unhappy. With all the shortcomings of the American economy, a working person lives there better than the average Russian and this is a fact.

        Is not it. If I borrowed 100 million rubles, I would also live much better than you. Just how long?
        Soon it's over ...
        1. Arc76
          Arc76 5 March 2012 10: 32 New
          -1
          You see, the entire economy of the United States is built on high-tech companies, a simple example of which OS you work on. maybe in Russian? And while the dollar will be the reserve currency, the US army is the strongest in the world (for conventional weapons), and you will use Apple products and Microsoft nothing will end. The question of payments, but not union members, unemployed people live poorly there, in black areas generations give birth to children in order to increase their allowance, but now no one really cares about them, do I really need it? Leontiev I still remember seven years ago shouting that the US is saving kirdyk and she is a smoking smoker. In the end, they have a way out in isolationism, and that with us. As you know, hydrocarbon prices fluctuate even with the beginning and end of the heating season in the United States and the temperatures of their winter. Now imagine what will happen if the world's largest economy starts to squander, oil prices fall to the level of 50-60 dollars, and what's next ? Russia is one of the largest exporters of food, a logical question arises, what will we eat?
  11. Норд
    Норд 3 March 2012 11: 19 New
    +5
    In its foreign policy, America has long outdone its British “teachers” with cynicism, licorice, cruelty and arrogance. And what is the torment for tortured prisoners for them, when hundreds of thousands of old people, women and children have died and continue to die under their "exclusively democratic" bombing? Well, the statements of half-fool Bush Jr. only confirm the long-known - America, this is WORLD EVIL. Well, with evil only one method is effective - it must be crushed.
    1. Yars
      Yars 3 March 2012 17: 14 New
      +1
      Nord, they are not teachers, they are one team. The Queen of England is one of the richest women on earth. The royal family controls the entire drug traffic of the globe, which is why after the Americans (fascists) entered Afghanistan, drug production in this country increased several times.
  12. Alexander_Sergeich
    Alexander_Sergeich 3 March 2012 11: 23 New
    +4
    The Americans themselves understand, and are trying to fight against such rulers and "healers of heaven." But they only do it too democratically - they try to write books, articles, protest .... As a result, this sadist safely unwound TWO terms as president. And now such a monster is eager for power - Mackain. Or maybe this will be worse - years of captivity without antidepressants, and a family psychologist sadly affected the vulnerable democratic psyche
  13. Georg Shep
    Georg Shep 3 March 2012 11: 30 New
    +5
    The blue world of liberal democracy is bursting at the seams.
    This system spews out the most inhuman and perverted forms of human and social life, and as a result - a global human crisis.
    As the famous thinker and philosopher said: it's time to push the falling.
  14. Alexander_Sergeich
    Alexander_Sergeich 3 March 2012 11: 52 New
    +6
    Quote: domokl
    A generation of computer players and Rambo has grown in the USA ...

    Let Rimbo 3 look again, as the rebels with guns on horses fought against the malicious Soviet occupation)) And how the valiant son of America helped them. There is not that the Soviet troops built roads, bridges, tunnels, hospitals and schools. And what is there now - the same rebels drove the same sons to the bases, and do not allow their nose to stick out. And this is without the help of the "big brother" from
    1. Isr
      Isr 3 March 2012 23: 53 New
      +7
      Well this is a movie. has nothing to do with real life. so big, but you believe in fairy tales!
      1. Steering wheel
        Steering wheel 4 March 2012 01: 26 New
        -7
        Quote: Isr
        Well this is a movie. has nothing to do with real life. so big, but you believe in fairy tales!
        attack on the vile and cynical Jews in their lies
        1. Isr
          Isr 4 March 2012 17: 56 New
          -1
          how mean and cynical you are in your lies, or maybe just limited, stupid and illegible in expressions. judging by the fact that they do not refute me reasonably, I’m right
      2. /
        4 March 2012 07: 35 New
        -5
        Quote: Isr
        Well this is a movie. has nothing to do with real life. so big, but you believe in fairy tales!

        This is a means of mass manipulation of consciousness, capable, or rather, designed to create certain worldviews.
        1. Isr
          Isr 4 March 2012 18: 01 New
          -2
          Do you like conspiracies? others think for you? do you feel small, manipulated? poor thing
  15. 755962
    755962 3 March 2012 11: 53 New
    +8
    Perverted laws for two-faced democracy are commonplace. Now, democracy has finally come to the United States. Now, not only around the world, but also in the states themselves, it is officially allowed to detain any citizens on the slightest suspicion of "terrorism", to keep unlimited time in prisons, including secret ones and at military bases, and this can be done without trial. behind the scenes, and this can be done not only by the police, but also by other law enforcement agencies, including the military. Moreover, the official American channels such as FoxNews are now called protesting Americans as internal terrorists.
    A new era of neo-fascism has officially begun. No, of course, fascism was before - but hidden. The bombing and massacre of hundreds of thousands of civilians in Libya - is not fascism? And the bloody suppression of protests in Bahrain? What about the war in Iraq? What about Yemen and Pakistan? What about Afghanistan? What about Yugoslavia? What about Vietnam? What about Korea? And Texas, Mexico and the genocide of the Native American population? And dozens of other American colonial wars. And hundreds of military bases that occupied most of the planet, and secret CIA prisons, and torture and violence around the world? American democracy has always been colonial imperialism, and a latent form of fascism. For many, it became real fascism only in the past 2011 - for someone in the spring, for someone in the summer, for someone in the fall. And for some, it still remains a democracy.
    Well, congratulations to them on Total Democracy!
    1. KAV
      KAV 3 March 2012 18: 27 New
      +1
      Perverted laws for two-faced democracy are commonplace
      I completely agree with the comment, I just want to add I stumbled across the Internet, In the United States in the summer of 2010 a law was introduced according to which citizens are forbidden to grow vegetables in household plots. All this is tied to sanitary standards, but the meaning is more clear when you read the discussion. Put their citizens in the queue in the store, God forbid it will not be dependent. As far as I remember, someone has already been convicted of a tomato plantation. I can’t find the link quickly, but if interested I’ll try
    2. Isr
      Isr 3 March 2012 23: 56 New
      0
      a heap of lies, you can refute every letter, but if you like it, then believe it! the Internet will stand and not that.
    3. /
      4 March 2012 07: 41 New
      -1
      755962Moreover, these "democrats" are in full control of their population: drones, the so-called "smart lights" that can not only write video, but also sound, but there’s nothing to say about the many cameras and intelligent systems for recognizing people by biometric parameters.
      FEMA camps are ready to receive new guests.
  16. Alexander_Sergeich
    Alexander_Sergeich 3 March 2012 12: 04 New
    +5
    Some lover of torture minus all. He would be sent to Guantanomo for a session of genuine democracy
  17. Rodver
    Rodver 3 March 2012 12: 06 New
    +4
    The USA is a prison of peoples, the world liberal system is a blue plague!
  18. FiremanRS
    FiremanRS 3 March 2012 12: 22 New
    -9
    Phew, I read the comments and wonder how much ... Gentlemen, why is everything so primitive? It is clear that in their own country the amers want to turn back on, and their position in the world allows them to do the same everywhere as at home .... We let this article and the like into battle, excellent material for information warfare. But then suck it ..... well, just fu! Our cops are no better; I’m generally silent about prisons. So nothing new, nothing important was said. As information and nothing more.
  19. Alexander_Sergeich
    Alexander_Sergeich 3 March 2012 12: 31 New
    +6
    Quote: FiremanRS
    Our cops are no better; I’m generally silent about prisons. So nothing new, nothing important was said.

    "Our" cops do not advertise themselves to the whole world, do not hide behind the fact that their God created for this, and do not teach this to all the countries of the planet
    1. Rodver
      Rodver 3 March 2012 13: 19 New
      0
      Alexander_Sergeich,

      Tooting.
  20. sergskak
    sergskak 3 March 2012 13: 14 New
    +1
    How is President Obama different from President Bush Jr?Yes, nothing. Only with color. But that is not the point, but that they put ticks there for a tick. It doesn’t matter who comes to "power" there, there are forces that are pulled back by the sleeve: that is ("- you oh. ..l? What a reload in the ass ?!! ") That's about from this angle.
  21. lewerlin53rus
    lewerlin53rus 3 March 2012 13: 36 New
    +3
    It’s interesting that Mr. McCain hasn’t registered a case on this site? There are a lot of minuses. And again, not a single comment. Apparently there is nothing to say, it can only be minus.
  22. Barba ross
    Barba ross 3 March 2012 17: 56 New
    +2
    Well, Duc. In the United States, perversion is legalized at the legal level. It is not surprising that they torture and beat someone, but that they have not eaten anyone yet.
  23. FiremanRS
    FiremanRS 3 March 2012 18: 23 New
    -3
    Quote: Alexander_Sergeich
    "Our" cops do not advertise themselves to the whole world, do not hide behind the fact that their God created for this, and do not teach this to all the countries of the planet


    And their cops like a specialist remove everything and show on the box? Do not tell my horseshoes !!! You try to call our cops to justice for the lawlessness and how they do it all. This is about ordinary citizens. If the question of "national security" is at least somehow touched, then of course figs will achieve what. This is what we are talking about. We have not yet heard what would be taken for politics and imprisoned. For amers, this is already in practice.
    And they naminusovat that)))))) as an enemy of the people))))) Let's be objective, and not drool on every amer miss. They squint decent without your saliva. I'm waiting for everything when they are punished already for it ....
  24. Oleg0705
    Oleg0705 3 March 2012 20: 33 New
    -1
    Kaczynski was killed by the Americans themselves

    Russian intelligence agencies found out how the president of Poland, Lech Kaczynski, was actually killed. The crash near Smolensk on April 10, 2010, a Tu-154M aircraft with a Polish government delegation occurred due to a malicious reorientation of a US-made satellite navigation system installed on board an airliner. GPS gave false geographical coordinates and implausible distance data to the landing site. Because of what, the pilot in bad weather conditions did not have time to react and pull the plane out of peak.

    A plane with a Polish delegation on board was shot down by a CIA satellite

    When examining the crash site, the specialists were most surprised by why the pilot had taken the plane off the glide path. After all, the liner unexpectedly for the crew was in 500 meters from the runway and five meters from the ground instead of 60! According to experts, the Americans locally changed the “ground level” in the presidential plane’s GPS system.
    No one except the US intelligence services can produce local displacements of the GPS coordinate grid.
    This feature is designed for use during the conduct of hostilities. For example, while repelling Georgia’s attack on South Ossetia in 2008, Russian gunners faced the problem of a shift in civilian GPS signal. The Americans shifted the coordinate field to 300 meters in this zone, deliberately distorting the civil channel. As a result, Russian fire spotters could not use civilian GPS devices. The assumptions were confirmed when the staff "Hummers" with hard drives with backup software for managing GPS on board were captured from the Georgian side.
    Kaczynski was a faithful ally of the White House in all things related to military cooperation against Russia. But at the same time, he 18 once imposed a presidential veto on the laws of the Sejm and the proposals of the government to liberalize the economy of Poland.
    An ardent nationalist, Kaczynski blocked foreign capital from buying up enterprises and banks in Poland, and prevented businesses from taking out capital from the country. The pinnacle of his economic conflict with Washington was the veto of the liberals' pension reform. According to it, hundreds of millions of dollars were to be spent on the purchase of US government bonds and sent to custody in US banks. And in the end they got the Polish old men.
    The classic way of punishing the leaders of such countries is a temporary collapse of their economy. But how can the economy of the “main country of the sanitary cordon” collapse? Kaczynski was a stubborn supporter of the sovereign economy of Poland. And for this he paid with his life.
    The catastrophe near Smolensk, the Yankees intended to finish off two birds with one stone: to remove stubborn Lech from their path and drive another wedge into Russian-Polish relations.
    By the way
    Recently, former Polish Deputy Prime Minister Andrei Lepper was killed by US intelligence agencies. The deceased headed the “Self-defense” party, the only pro-Russian party in the Polish parliament. Just like Kaczynski, he did everything to protect the economic independence of Poland. Lepper was an ardent supporter of Belarusian President Alexander Lukashenko.
    1. putinfob
      putinfob 3 March 2012 21: 20 New
      -5
      Quote: Oleg0705

      Kaczynski was killed by the Americans themselves

      Russian intelligence agencies found out how the president of Poland, Lech Kaczynski, was actually killed. The crash near Smolensk on April 10, 2010, a Tu-154M aircraft with a Polish government delegation occurred due to a malicious reorientation of a US-made satellite navigation system installed on board an airliner. GPS gave false geographical coordinates and implausible distance data to the landing site. Because of what, the pilot in bad weather conditions did not have time to react and pull the plane out of peak.

      A plane with a Polish delegation on board was shot down by a CIA satellite


      Bullshit! Raziyansky intelligence services all fall from a sick head to a healthy one. They themselves soaked him cleanly, neatly, without podkapaeshsya. But indirectly, everything points to the FSB, its doing.
    2. Isr
      Isr 3 March 2012 23: 59 New
      -2
      Judging by how much heaped up here, the stigmas themselves in the cannon. unclean with the plane, oh unclean. felt the handwriting of the Volodina office
    3. Uralm
      Uralm 7 March 2012 23: 39 New
      0
      Kachinsky Russia needed a fifth leg as a dog. Well Vyakala but did not interfere. How can a dog interfere with Russia?
      Yes, we need the Poles. Georgians. Zap Ukr. and the Baltic states. Why does everyone think so. Since no one needs so much Russia needs?
  25. Alexander_Sergeich
    Alexander_Sergeich 3 March 2012 21: 32 New
    +1
    Quote: putinfob
    Bullshit! Raziyansky intelligence services all fall from a sick head to a healthy one. They themselves soaked him cleanly, neatly, without podkapaeshsya. But indirectly, everything points to the FSB, its doing.

    Raziyansky intelligence probably every day urinate the leaders of democratic countries ??? How many have died in recent years ??? And how many leaders died who fought only for independence, and only on their own territory ??? Have you heard such names as Hussein and Gaddafi? Do you know anything about Serbia? Do you understand what awaits Syria and Iran in the near future if true democrats seize power there ???
    I’m sure that you don’t know a damn thing, and you haven’t seen anything
    1. putinfob
      putinfob 3 March 2012 22: 01 New
      -6
      Quote: Alexander_Sergeich
      Raziyansky intelligence probably every day urinate the leaders of democratic countries ??? How many have died in recent years ??? And how many leaders died who fought only for independence, and only on their own territory ??? Have you heard such names as Hussein and Gaddafi? Do you know anything about Serbia? Do you understand what awaits Syria and Iran in the near future if true democrats seize power there ???
      I’m sure that you don’t know a damn thing, and you haven’t seen anything

      Slow down your revolutions! Don’t shout like that! Very smart huh?
      I know who Hussein, Gaddafi, these are executioner dictators and they got what they deserve! And for Serbia, finally, little! Now this country is tearing into the EU and it will be there!
      1. /
        4 March 2012 08: 18 New
        0
        Quote: putinfob
        And for Serbia, finally, little! Now this country is tearing into the EU and it will be there!

        Who told you that? In the EU, the top of the traitors paid by the West is tearing, which not so long ago literally stood at the reception at the American embassy. This is wildness: the ministers in the current line for a “blessing” to the American ambassador.

        Quote: putinfob
        I know who Hussein is, Gaddafi

        And who brought Hussein to power in Iraq in the late 70s? Don’t you ... do you? And who helped him fight with Iran? Although it would be more accurate to ask: who sent him to the war with Iran? With whose tacit consent did he attack Kuwait?

        And to ask who is guilty of the deaths of hundreds of thousands of civilians in the countries of "introduced democracy" is generally superfluous.

        About the executioner Gaddafi. If we compare the situation in Libya before the "implementation of humanitarian initiatives" and after, the issue of executioners becomes inappropriate.

        Now these "democrats" support bandits and terrorists in Syria, they, in fact, ended up in the same boat with Al Qaeda, which allegedly committed the September 11 terrorist attack.
  26. raptor_fallout
    raptor_fallout 3 March 2012 22: 06 New
    -3
    Quote: putinfob
    And for Serbia, finally, little! Now this country is tearing into the EU and it will be there!

    If Serbia is in the EU, then the price of Kosovo? And for example, Ukraine then what?
  27. Alexander_Sergeich
    Alexander_Sergeich 3 March 2012 22: 37 New
    +1
    Quote: putinfob
    Now this country is tearing into the EU and it will be there!

    You say it’s like they are eager for paradise. Everyone has their own idea of ​​paradise. Like everything else. Only before you get to any paradise you need to die first. You can die in different ways too. I didn’t give a damn about Gadaffi, but since this MAN died, not a single democratic leader is capable. The path of your leaders to the "Euro Paradise"))) - kill your country, culture, economy
  28. FiremanRS
    FiremanRS 3 March 2012 23: 43 New
    +3
    Quote: putinfob
    I know who Hussein, Gaddafi, these are executioner dictators and they got what they deserve! And for Serbia, finally, little! Now this country is tearing into the EU and it will be there!


    Is that all you know about them ???? And Nitsche that under your "democratic" government, all the people live on a leak ?! And under the rule of these "dictators" there were no civil wars in their countries, nor did they kill or rape anyone, that the people lived more normally than you now and your compatriots for the most part ?! No need to shove topics here about what your "shit-bucks" are repeating to you.

    Quote: raptor_fallout

    Quote: putinfob
    And for Serbia, finally, little! Now this country is tearing into the EU and it will be there!

    If Serbia is in the EU, then the price of Kosovo?



    Was the country of Yugoslavia, what did you know about it? In addition to the good and not expensive resorts .... And now two or more specific "princedoms" who hate each other and those who kill, respectively. Now tell me now that it was not the Amers who tried, but they themselves ....
    1. Arc76
      Arc76 4 March 2012 00: 08 New
      0
      Hussein didn’t poison the Kurds like cockroaches.
  29. Steering wheel
    Steering wheel 4 March 2012 02: 00 New
    -10
    http://mr-lernor.livejournal.com/tag/C%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%B8%D1%8F
  30. Steering wheel
    Steering wheel 4 March 2012 02: 19 New
    -7
    http://gidepark.ru/user/3548645175/content/774326
    1. Steering wheel
      Steering wheel 4 March 2012 11: 10 New
      0
      They didn’t like the truth, especially with weighty arguments in the form of links to their own articles in the press, which was useless to argue because he was telling the truth when he had parabellum at his temple.
  31. SL.Kocegar
    SL.Kocegar 4 March 2012 05: 15 New
    -2
    Now, in March 2012, Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and other "upper people" of America daily talk about the horrors, torture and bloodshed in Syria.
    Representatives of the US State Department say their country has never sold weapons to Syria and is trying to convince Russia to reconsider its position for 10 years, especially after the outbreak of the political crisis in this Arab country and the fighting in the city of Homs. According to representatives of the State Department, Russia should use its influence to end the armed conflict in Syria. Answering a question about the role of Russia in the conflict, the State Department appealed to Moscow with a request to influence the outcome of the conflict.

    “The issue of arms deliveries should be considered separately from other issues. Russia has long been engaged in these deliveries. And speaking of the fact that Russian arms are used, they are small arms,” says Gumer Isaev, head of the St. Petersburg Center for the Study of the Modern Middle East. “Arms in Syria, like in any other country in the Middle East, are enough. Russia today supplies air defense systems and anti-tank mines, which are useless in the fight against rebels. The State Department’s statement is an attempt to put Russia in an unfavorable light.”

    Apparently, the topic of Russian weapons is painfully perceived by the United States and its partners - the EU and a number of Arab countries. It is also known that these countries themselves supply weapons to Syria through illegal channels, across the Lebanese border. However, this topic does not arise.

    The US State Department does not mention this side of the problem, shifting emphasis to the impending economic catastrophe. So, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton recently expressed the hope that Russia, for the sake of humanity, morality and humanity, will do everything possible to prevent a humanitarian catastrophe.
    However, experts see Clinton’s statement as a hint that the United States wants to shift the responsibility for the Syrian situation to others.

    "The situation in Syria is influenced by a large number of different players. And even if the Americans make conciliatory statements, Europeans and Arabs will continue US policy. The supply of weapons to Syria is an old good practice, and there are enough people who are interested in overthrowing the Syrian regime - the same Qatar or Kuwait, "says Gumer Isaev.

    Analysts recall the US policy in Libya, in which the Americans allegedly did not take any part. Now such pacifist statements are perceived only as an imitation of something peacekeeping by Obama and Clinton before the election.

    "The State Department’s statement is primarily caused by opportunistic reasons, because elections will be held in Russia and elections in the USA are coming. For this reason, Americans are eyeing the new foreign policy of our country," says a senior researcher at the IMEMO Center for International Security and the Middle Department. and the Middle East of the Institute of Oriental Studies of the Russian Academy of Sciences Vladimir Sotnikov. “The harshness of the statement is due to the fact that Obama does not want to go to the polls against the backdrop of several military conflicts in which the US is participating. There’s simply no desire to get into another one. Obama would like to be elected in the wake of peacekeeping or at least a stable international situation , from the point of view of the United States. And it is entirely possible that he will take the detached position that was chosen with respect to Libya. "

    Experts emphasize that Russian weapons are being delivered to Syria under old contracts that were signed before the uprising began. They agree that a humanitarian catastrophe will erupt in the country in any case. Syria is dependent on fuel and agricultural supplies, and a weakening economy will ultimately undermine the socio-political situation and could lead to the overthrow of Assad.
  32. Magadan
    Magadan 4 March 2012 05: 34 New
    0
    Quote: Admiral
    Magadan, it would not be a bad idea to set out personal experience in more detail, life examples are much more expensive than inferences, and you should not even talk about visualization !!! We wait!!!

    Yes, I would write an entire article about it, but how to do it? Briefly, I posted in the posts ... right now I'll try the most basic:
    1. The USA really like 1 for two weeks, everything shines, everyone smiles. And then they also had hypermarkets, to-ryh was not in the Russian Federation.
    2. Then you begin to quietly go nuts over the stress in which the Americans live. The first surprise is the experience for every dollar with their then earnings in 3000 per month (slightly above average) Well, you won’t worry in Russia for 10 rubles with 30000! Everything turned out to be simple - they pay 3000 and then take 2500 (minimum). I can also pay this way - I will give the 100000 employee and select 80000 under all pretexts. And on every corner I’ll yell that I’m crying 100000. I gave the layouts, see our Forum "Everyone who watched ...." (I think so) In general, if you minus the mortgage (for 30 years) communal apartment, gasoline (there are no options without a car, they live for 15 km from the city , there are no buses) kindergarten, insurance, taxes ... then less than a thing remains from family income in 5000 dollars / month. Keep in mind that tooth repair then cost 700 dollars (now 2000); Studying at the institute - 14000 dollars (without books and without a hostel) In short, such an average American family of two children who will no longer have enough to study will get a loan
    3. Savings reached ridiculously. I am already silent about the shower for 5 minutes (because water and electricity are expensive), we somehow couldn’t stop in the toilet on the way, because at the next gas station, gas cost 0.5 a cent per gallon (3.8 liter) cheaper !!! Almost ...
    4. There is absolutely nowhere to walk there - sidewalks as such do not exist at all. I am silent about parks with benches - for the first time I met this in San Francisco in their Central Park.
    5. There is no mention of any social protection, the employer simply dismisses without explanation. Holidays - 7 days a year, and then, far from all companies. Working day is not guaranteed. My wife worked at McDonald's. So, on Monday, she worked from 9 to 11, on Tuesday from 12 to 17 and stuff like that. Payment is hourly. I got to work with us in the morning and walked around 6 hours in the hypermarket. Then she waited until we took her in the evening. Earned in a month as much as 300 dollars!
    6. Homeless people and beggars seen as much as desired. People who have been renting their whole lives, who are unable to "afford the will of children", also as much as they like.
    It was amazing when they came to friends, and they live in some kind of carriage (about 5X8) with two adult children. Near the house is hefty. We asked whose, it turned out. that the husband’s parents and they surrender him, but they can’t help their son with anything, because he is not able to pay the equivalent price for renting this house. They also told how no one is friends with their son Justin, because he is from a poor family, and studies (with the money of some sponsor) in a more or less “decent school” (he dragged something well in computers). Further, we noticed that the Americans are friends somehow "caste". Poor with poor, middle-middle class (income up to 40000 per year) with middle-middle, middle-high with medium-high ..... Then we heard that it is not possible in another way, because you invite the poorer to a restaurant, but he cannot pay for himself. There, by the way, even the husband and wife pay separately for the restaurant. Waiters directly bring 2 different bills! In our family, the truth was not like this, thank God.
    7. New Year: gathered 5-th families in someone’s house. We sat in the jacuzzi. Cool. Then I wanted to eat. I was invited to the table. The table was 1mX1m, it had lettuce, some bread, slices of sausage and cheese. There was a stake in the refrigerator. It was a New Year's table. A year later he was again in the states, at Christmas. They gave "hay-stax" (beans, chips, salad, onions, tomatoes, mayonnaise, everything is mixed). Each took a plate and went who had a quiet meal.
    8. Again about the money. The most stress is the end of the month, you have to pay different bills, there were about 40. The wife, like a victim yelling at her husband, who had spent 50 bucks somewhere, and now it’s problematic to pay a loan for a sofa. This family had an income of almost 90000 per year! That is two times higher than average. Before that, a wife in another, poorer family really cried, because they laid out to the veterinarian 100 bucks for treating the dog.
    Guys, it’s true here to write and write. You tell me where I can put it at a time, I promise to roll memories with all the numbers, names and examples.
    1. /
      4 March 2012 08: 25 New
      -8
      Magadan,
      It would be very interesting!
    2. A_B
      A_B 4 March 2012 09: 38 New
      0
      weeping and howling of losers. About celebrating holidays - it’s different for them. Just for another - it doesn’t mean good or bad, it’s just not so. (By the way, in Europe it’s the same as in Russia) They’re just different. About taxes it’s not true ( maximum tax 25%) and the fact that your friends have earned loans. So for the senka and the caftan, one must live by income (which is relevant for any country) Lack of sidewalks - yes, just because they are not needed - everything is on cars. Classification - like everywhere else (the Russian Federation is no exception), there are schools, shops, etc. , but basically it depends on paradise (agree the schools in barvikha and in southern butovo are different and I don’t think the children are especially friends). The problem is not new for the apartment, parents bought and paid the house, maybe letting it in is the only income. they earn money and it’s right (by the way, as the problem of housing for the Russian Federation is nonsense and there are no problems between parents and children.)
      In America, it’s not easy for those who don’t want to work, for people with ambitions and desire - the opportunities are huge. And believe me, I can give no less than numbers.
      1. Colonel
        Colonel 4 March 2012 12: 34 New
        0
        Thanks, Magadan. About the New Year's table in general - a song !!!
  33. son of the fatherland
    son of the fatherland 4 March 2012 10: 50 New
    +2
    Someone from the local, ideological / personnel minus-minders, sucked here a group of 5-6 people. Is the topic (s) such (s) relevant (s)? Or did you have, in connection with the elections, canceled the weekend, and transferred to a 20-hour working day?
    1. Steering wheel
      Steering wheel 4 March 2012 11: 17 New
      0
      Quote: son of the motherland
      Someone from the local, ideological / personnel minus-minders, sucked here a group of 5-6 people. Is the topic (s) such (s) relevant (s)? Or you, in connection with the elections, canceled the weekend, and transferred to a 20-hour working day
      Moishe is a folk of a perverted mind most likely they go the same under different nicknames and minus, but they don’t work with their hands, they live purely according to the instructions of the "Old Testament"
  34. Magadan
    Magadan 4 March 2012 11: 09 New
    +3
    Quote: a_b
    crying and howling losers

    Well, I don’t know, I had 20 bucks there an hour then going beyond the carpet flooring. More fortunate than many with the "green card".
    Quote: a_b
    By the way, kakbud the problem of housing for the Russian Federation is nonsense and there are no problems between parents and children.)

    I do not know. Mom left me a hut, and they gave her the "damned commies"
    Quote: a_b
    So on senka and caftan, on income it is necessary to live

    Only somehow it turns out stressful when 80% of your income has already been paid to all sorts of accounts, taxes, insurance .... Here you lose your job, and you still need to take 3-4 dollars from somewhere. And this is not stress in your opinion?
    Quote: a_b
    .About celebrating holidays - yes they have a different way. Just differently - this does not mean bad or good

    Yes remarkably simple. Only here, even in poor families, the New Year's table breaks. And husband and wife in a restaurant do not bring separate bills
    Quote: a_b
    Classification - as elsewhere

    Only it would never occur to me to end a friendship with a classmate, because he has less money. And in the restaurant, if I pay for it myself
    Quote: a_b
    Lack of sidewalks - yes, just because they are no longer needed - all on cars

    Yes, and we kind of like cars. I just prefer to have a choice, sometimes hunting and walking. And at 400-500 dollars per month for gas that would not have to be spent from the village to down town.
    In short, everything is wonderful, only in the wonderful States everything is somehow under stress. In secret, their men told me that they have sex for about a month. Their wives are so ... I think these are the consequences of such a life, do not you think? And why do children in schools urinate each other almost every month? Why is there so much fat? Yes, not just thick, but I can’t find the words either. I have not even seen such king-size sites in Russia. I see that they’re stuck, I can’t think of anything else.
    In short, I like living in 15 km from the nearest store, celebrating New Year with sandwiches, dreaming about vacationing every 10 years, clutching my heart while waiting for a bunch of bills at the end of the month, making friends exclusively with people of my own wealth, not having a park in my town even the sidewalk, to pay 30 years for a house if you don’t get kicked from work ... in short, you like to live under the eternal sword of Damocles and make love to 10 wife once a year, then go ahead. I just wouldn’t want to see Russia like that. Therefore, I write.
    1. A_B
      A_B 4 March 2012 13: 08 New
      -2
      Quote: Magadan
      Well, I don’t know, I had 20 bucks there an hour then going beyond the carpet flooring. More fortunate than many with the "green card".

      and what does this prove? You yourself lived better than the local income? This is the answer to my question - you need to live on income
      Quote: Magadan
      I do not know. Mom left me a hut, and they gave her the "damned commies"

      And as I understand it on the basis of this, and in America there should be full chocolate with apartments? But in Russia there are no problems with housing? I know one thing, all my friends in the states live either in their own homes or take pictures, and no one (mind you) lives with their parents.
      Quote: Magadan
      Only somehow it turns out stressful when 80% of your income has already been paid to all sorts of accounts, taxes, insurance .... Here you lose your job, and you still need to take 3-4 dollars from somewhere. And this is not stress in your opinion?

      and where is wrong? any normal family leading the budget is normal, expenses are scheduled and even more than 80%. And in order not to be left without money in case you lose a district, do you have to save for a rainy day / or is it wrong in the Russian Federation?
      Quote: Magadan
      Yes remarkably simple. Only here, even in poor families, the New Year's table breaks. And husband and wife in a restaurant do not bring separate bills

      What is the connection? In another way, they mark everything. In America you can’t find a family where 3 generations live in a 2-room apartment, and there is no communal apartment there. So what ?
      Quote: Magadan
      Only it would never occur to me to end a friendship with a classmate, because he has less money. And in the restaurant, if I myself have paid for it

      They simply will not meet in America (as in the Russian Federation) (they live in different regions) Well, the problem of children's friendship is not new and often the income of parents influences this implicitly
      Quote: Magadan
      And in the restaurant, if I pay for it myself

      you are so well done. Not all of them (and all over the world) Can you guarantee that in the Russian Federation everything is like you?
      Quote: Magadan
      In short, I like living in 15 km from the nearest store, celebrating New Year with sandwiches, dreaming about vacationing every 10 years, clutching my heart while waiting for a bunch of bills at the end of the month, making friends exclusively with people of my own wealth, not having a park in my town even the sidewalk, to pay 30 years for a house if you don’t get kicked from work ... in short, you like to live under the eternal sword of Damocles and make love to 10 wife once a year, then go ahead. I just wouldn’t want to see Russia like that. Therefore, I write.

      All this is in the Russian Federation. Open your eyes. With a vacation in the states, there really is a problem, 2 weeks maximum. But they have it. In Belgium, up to 50 days. Local features.
  35. Steering wheel
    Steering wheel 4 March 2012 11: 35 New
    0
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHGoq1RcK_I http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qrf3LcZVx0, смотрите добавить тут нечего
  36. Steering wheel
    Steering wheel 4 March 2012 12: 15 New
    -1
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HxbORrgeP4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HxbORrgeP4
  37. Magadan
    Magadan 4 March 2012 23: 05 New
    0
    Quote: a_b
    In short, I like living in 15 km from the nearest store, celebrating New Year with sandwiches, dreaming about vacationing every 10 years, clutching my heart while waiting for a bunch of bills at the end of the month, making friends exclusively with people of my own wealth, not having a park in my town even the sidewalk, to pay 30 years for a house if you don’t get kicked from work ... in short, you like to live under the eternal sword of Damocles and make love to 10 wife once a year, then go ahead. I just wouldn’t want to see Russia like that. Therefore, I write.

    All this is in the Russian Federation. Open your eyes ..

    What are you smile Well, look, if I lose my job in Russia, I need to find somewhere 6000 in a month to pay for a communal apartment and that's it! Food, clothes, smart phones and other Pribluda is for everyone in the "optional quantity"
    Yes, I, according to an ad in a newspaper in Magadan, will find work for 20000. Those. my "obligation" - even if I work as a watchman in the parking lot, it is 25-30%! And you, my friend, look for 3000-3500 bucks a month, consider, food, clothes, etc. I do not take. I'm talking about your mortgage, communal apartment, gasoline (because you simply don’t have bus options and options for walking along the sidewalk), insurance. I am already silent about the obligation for this child, be it a school or a kindergarten.
    So it turns out that you are financially enslaved, and you shouldn’t lose your job. Hence your stresses, American. Although the people there are used to hauling such a yoke, one cannot deceive a heart.
    Yes, we don’t have all the huts from the “sworn commies”, but those in the Russian Federation who haven’t received anything from relatives are much less than those in USA who never have a chance to buy their own home.
    1. A_B
      A_B 5 March 2012 09: 12 New
      -2
      Quote: Magadan
      Well, look, if I lose my job in Russia, I need to find somewhere around 6000 a month to pay for a communal apartment and that's it

      Well, if the communal apartment is housing, I'm sorry. For such housing in America (and even taking into account the Magadan), in general, almost no need to pay. Well, let's get back to our sheep. For 5 rooms (K-ra) I pay a mortgage (or rather I paid because I already paid) 700 bucks, 2 cars with all insurances another 300 per month (with gasoline), daughter's school + son's university - 300 per month, meals + utility bills + clothes another 1000 per month. Only 2500-3000 per month. Total income of 8500 (enough for everything) + to postpone retirement, etc. This made it possible to pay the mortgage for 7 years (instead of 17. Am I in financial slavery? Homeless people are generally independent, so it's better to be a homeless person ? I’m afraid to lose my job (but not because I can’t find such an income), but because it’s cool. In the case of a loss, unemployment payment is 9 months (75% of the salary) + severance pay, more than enough time to find what something else (but for those wishing to work, this is not a problem).
      Д
      well, we don’t have all the huts from the “damned commies”, but those in the Russian Federation who haven’t received anything from their relatives are much less than those in the USA who never buy their own home

      I’m not going to give my son an apartment, I learned it let him make money, die, he will get it all the same, but for now I’m worthy of a normal life too, in the normal way why should I give, I earned it and it will work, but how will it work in future life if I teach it to live on tips ? It’s generally not very customary for us to support children, they gave education and go on into adulthood. We can help but not contain, no one needs lazy people.

      So that you can safely continue to live in your communal apartment until the end of your days (because I understand the option to take a mortgage is not worth you), feel free from the financial yoke and you can even work as a watchman. Good luck