"Ferdinand" - the worst SAU?

81
The Germans had the best in the world ACS or not - a moot point, but the fact that they managed to create one, which left an indelible memory of all Soviet soldiers, is for sure. This is a heavy self-propelled gun "Ferdinand". Things reached the point that, starting from the second half of 1943, almost in every combat report Soviet troops destroyed at least one such ACS. If we sum up the losses of the “Ferdinands” according to the Soviet reports, they were destroyed during the war by several thousand pieces. The piquancy of the situation lies in the fact that the Germans fired their entire 90 units for the entire war, and also 4 BREM based on them. It is difficult to find a sample of armored vehicles from the Second World War, released in such a small number and at the same time so famous. In the "Ferdinands" recorded all German self-propelled guns, but most often - "Marder" and "Stugi". Approximately the same situation was with the German "Tiger": the medium tank Pz-IV was often confused with the long gun. But there was at least a similarity of silhouettes, but what a similarity with Ferdinand and, for example, StuG 40 is a big question.

"Ferdinand" - the worst SAU?

So how was “Ferdinand”, and why is it so widely known since the time of the Battle of Kursk? We will not go into the technical details and design development issues, because it has already been written in dozens of other publications, and pay close attention to the battles on the northern face of the Kursk Bulge, where these extremely powerful machines were massively applied.

The conning tower was built from sheets of forged cemented armor transferred from the stocks of the German Navy. The frontal armor of the wheelhouse was 200 mm thick, and the side and aft were 85 mm thick. The thickness of even the side armor made the self-propelled guns practically invulnerable to the fire of almost all Soviet artillery of the 1943 model at a distance of more than 400 m.The self-propelled guns armament consisted of an 8,8 cm StuK 43 gun (in some sources its field version PaK 43/2 was erroneously given) with barrel length 71 caliber, its muzzle energy was one and a half times higher than that of a heavy gun tank "Tiger". The Ferdinand cannon pierced all Soviet tanks from all angles of attack at all distances of actual fire. The only reason that the armor was not broken when hit was a rebound. Any other hit caused penetration of the armor, which in most cases meant the destruction of the Soviet tank and the partial or complete death of its crew. Here is such a serious weapon appeared to the Germans shortly before the start of operation "Citadel".


The formation of units of the ACS Ferdinand began on 1 on April 1943. In total it was decided to form two heavy battalions (divisions).

The first of them, who received the number 653 (Schwere PanzerJager Abteilung 653), was formed on the basis of the 197 division of assault guns StuG III. According to the new state, the division was supposed to have 45 ACS Ferdinand. This part was not chosen by chance: the personnel of the division had extensive combat experience and participated in battles in the East from the summer of 1941 to January of 1943. By May, the 653 Battalion was fully staffed according to the state. However, in early May 1943, the entire material part was transferred to the recruitment of the 654 th battalion, which was formed in France in the city of Rouen. By mid-May, the 653 Battalion was again staffed almost statewide and had 40 SAU, after passing the course of exercises at the Neuseydel training ground, 9 – 12 on June 1943, the battalion went to eleven echelons on the Eastern Front.

The 654 heavy tank battalion was formed on the basis of the 654 anti-tank division at the end of April 1943. The combat experience of his personnel, who had previously fought with the PaK 35 / 36 VET, and then at the Marder II SAU, was much less than that of the colleagues from the 653 battalion. Until April 28, the battalion was in Austria, from April 30 in Rouen. After conducting final exercises, in the period from 13 to 15 June, the battalion of fourteen echelons departed on the Eastern Front.

According to the wartime state (K. St.N.№ 1148c from 31.03.43), a heavy battalion of tank destroyers included: battalion command, staff company (platoon: command, sapper, sanitary, anti-aircraft), three companies "Ferdinands" (in each company 2 vehicles of company headquarters, and three platoons of 4 vehicles; i.e., 14 vehicles in company), repair and evacuation company, motor transport company. Total: 45 SAU "Ferdinand», 1 Sanitary BTR Sd.Kfz.251 / 8, 6 zenith Sd.Kfz 7 / 1, 15-track traction Sd.Kfz 9 (18-tonnes), trucks and cars.


The staff structure of the battalions was slightly different. We should start with the fact that the 653 th battalion included 1,2 and 3 companies and 654 9 companies - 5,6 and 7 companies. 4-i company somewhere "fell". The numbering of the cars in the battalions corresponded to German standards: for example, both machines of the headquarters of the 5 company had the numbers 501 and 502, the machine numbers of the 1 platoon from 511 to 514 inclusive; 2-th platoon 521 - 524; 3 th 531 - 534, respectively. But if we carefully consider the combat composition of each battalion (division), we will see that in the "combat" number of units of the entire 42 SAU. And by the state of 45. Where are three more self-propelled guns from each battalion? This is where the difference in the organization of improvised tank-wrecking divisions affects: while in the 653 battalion of the 3 battalion the vehicles were relegated to the reserve group, then in the 654 battalion of the 3, the “extra” vehicles were organized into a headquarters group that had non-standard tactical numbers: II -01, II-02, II-03.

Both battalions (battalions) became part of the 656-th tank regiment, whose headquarters the Germans formed another 8 of June 1943 of the year. The connection turned out to be quite powerful: in addition to the 90 SAU Ferdinand, it consisted of the 216 th battalion of assault tanks (Sturmpanzer Abteilung 216), and two companies of the Bogward-controlled BIV "313-I and 314". The regiment was to serve as a ram of the German offensive in the direction of Art. Ponyri - Maloarkhangelsk.


June 25 "Ferdinands" began to move forward to the front line. By 4 July 1943, the 656 th regiment was deployed as follows: to the west of the Orel - Kursk railway 654 th battalion (Arkhangelskoye district), to the east 653 th battalion (Glazunov district), three companies behind them 216-th battalion (total 45 "Broombarov"). Each battalion of the "Ferdinands" was assigned a company of radio-controlled winches B IV.

July 5 The 656 Tank Regiment launched an offensive, supporting parts of the 86 and 292 of the German Infantry Divisions. However, the ram strike failed: the 653 th battalion on the very first day was stuck in the hardest battles at the height of 257,7, which the Germans called Tank. Not only were the Thirty-Fours dug to the top of the tower, but the height was also covered by powerful minefields. On the very first day, the 10 SAU battalion exploded on mines. Heavy losses were in the staff. Having blown up on an anti-personnel mine, the commander of the 1 Company, Hauptmann Spielmann, was seriously wounded. After finding out the direction of the strike, Soviet artillery also opened hurricane fire. As a result, 17: 00 5 July is the only Ferdinand 12 left to go! The rest received injuries of varying severity. For the next two days, the remnants of the battalion continued to fight to seize Art. Darlings.

The 654 th battalion attack was even more disastrous. The battalion 6-I company mistakenly hit a minefield of its own. Within just a few minutes, most of the Ferdinands had been blown up by their own mines. Finding monstrous German cars, barely crawling on our positions, Soviet artillery opened fire on them. The result was that the German infantry, which supported the attack of the 6 th company, suffered heavy losses and lay down, leaving the SAU without cover. Four “Ferdinands” from the 6 Company were still able to reach the Soviet positions, and there, according to the memoirs of the German self-propelled guns, “they were attacked by several brave Russian soldiers who remained in the trenches and armed with flame throwers, and from the right flank, from the line of the railway opened artillery fire, but after seeing that it was ineffective, the Russian soldiers withdrew in an organized manner. ”

5-I and 7-I companies also reached the first line of trenches, losing about 30% of vehicles on mines and falling under heavy shelling. In this case, the commander of the 654 th battalion, Major Noack, was mortally wounded by a shell fragment.

After occupying the first trench line, the remnants of the 654 th battalion moved in the direction of Ponyri. At the same time, some of the vehicles were again undermined by mines, and Ferdinand No. 531 from the 5 Company, being immobilized by the flank fire of the Soviet artillery, was finished off and burned. At dusk, the battalion reached the hills north of Ponyri, where he stopped for the night and regrouping. In the battalion on the go left 20 machines.

July 6 because of problems with fuel 654-th battalion went on the attack only in 14: 00. However, due to the strong fire of the Soviet artillery, the German infantry suffered serious losses, stepped back and the attack choked. On this day, the 654 Battalion reported on "a large number of Russian tanks that arrived to enhance defense." According to the evening report, the crews of the self-propelled guns destroyed 15 Soviet T-34 tanks, 8 of them were recorded at the expense of the crew under the command of Hauptmann Lüders, and 5 - Lieutenant Peters. 17 machines left on the move.

The next day, the remnants of the 653 and 654 battalions were drawn to Buzuluk, where they made a corps reserve. Two days were devoted to repairing machines. On July 8, several “Ferdinands” and “Brummberovs” participated in the unsuccessful attack on art. Darlings.

At the same time (July 8), the headquarters of the Soviet Central Front receives the first report from the chief of artillery of the 13 Army on Ferdinand exploded on a mine. Two days later, a group of five officers from the GAU KA arrived from Moscow to the front headquarters specifically for studying this sample. However, they were not lucky, by this time the area where the damaged ACS was occupied was occupied by the Germans.

Major events developed 9 – 10 July 1943 of the year. After many unsuccessful attacks on the station. The Germans changed the direction of the strike. From the northeast, through the state farm "1 May", an improvised battle group under the command of Major Kall struck. The composition of this group is impressive: the 505 battalion of heavy tanks (about 40 Tiger tanks), the 654 and part of the 653 Battalion machines (total 44 Ferdinand), the 216 battalion of assault tanks (38 SAU Brummbar "), The assault guns division (20 StuG 40 and StuH 42), 17 tanks Pz.Kpfw III and Pz.Kpfw IV. Directly behind this armada were the tanks of the 2 TD and the motorized infantry on the BTR.

Thus, on the front in 3 km, the Germans concentrated around 150 combat vehicles, not counting the second echelon. More than half of the cars of the first echelon are heavy. According to the reports of our artillerymen, the Germans for the first time here used a new attacking line-up construction - with the Ferdinands, who were ahead. The 654-th and 653-th battalion machines operated in two echelons. In the line of the first echelon, 30 machines advanced, in the second echelon another company moved (14 machines) with an interval of 120 – 150 meters. Company commanders were in a common line on staff vehicles carrying a flag on the antenna.

On the very first day, this group easily managed to break through the state farm “1 May” to the village of Goreloye. Here our gunners made a truly brilliant move: seeing the invulnerability of the newest German armored monsters for artillery, they were let into a huge minefield filled with anti-tank mines and bomb mines from captured ammunition, and then opened a hurricane fire at Ferdinand "дами". tanks and assault guns. As a result, the entire strike team suffered significant losses and was forced to withdraw.

The next day, July 10, Major Kall's group struck a new powerful blow and some cars broke through to the outskirts of Art. Darlings. Broke through the machines were heavy ACS "Ferdinand".

According to the descriptions of our soldiers, “Ferdinands” attacked, firing guns from short stops from a distance of one to two and a half kilometers: a very large distance for armored vehicles of that time. Subjecting concentrated fire, or finding a mined area, they retreated to some kind of shelter, trying to always be turned to Soviet positions with thick frontal armor absolutely invulnerable to our artillery.

On July X, Major Kall's strike group was disbanded, the 11 heavy tank battalion and the 505 TD tanks were deployed against our 2 army in the area of ​​Kutyrki - Teploe. In the area of ​​Art. The drones remained only units of the 70 battalion and the 654 battalion of assault tanks, attempting to evacuate the damaged materiel to the rear. But the 216-ton Ferdinands failed to evacuate during 65 – 12 in July, and on July 13 the Soviet troops launched a massive counterattack from Ponyri station in the direction of the state farm 14 in May. By the middle of the day, German troops were forced to withdraw. Our tank crews supporting the infantry attack suffered heavy losses, mostly not from German fire, but because the company of T-1 and T-34 tanks jumped out onto the same powerful minefield, on which Ferdinand had been blown up four days before. 70 th battalion.

On July 15 (that is, the very next day), the German equipment, destroyed and destroyed at the Ponyri station, was examined and studied by representatives of the State Aviation Administration of the Spacecraft and the NIBT of the test site. Total on the battlefield northeast of Art. Ponyri (18 km2) left 21 SAU "Ferdinand", three assault tanks "Brummbar" (in Soviet documents - "Bear"), eight tanks Pz-III and Pz-IV, two commander tanks, and several radio-controlled tankettes B. IV "Bogvard ".

Most of the "Ferdinands" was found on a minefield near the village of Goreloye. More than half of the inspected vehicles had damage to the chassis from the effects of anti-tank mines and land mines. 5 vehicles had damage to the chassis from hitting 76-mm projectiles and above. Two "Ferdinand" had shot guns, one of them got 8 hits in the gun barrel. One car was completely destroyed by a bomber hitting a Soviet Pe-2 bomber, one was destroyed by hitting an 203-mm projectile into the cabin roof. And only one “Ferdinand” had a shell hole in the left side made by 76-mm armor-piercing projectile, X-NUMX T-7 tanks and ZIS-34 battery fired at him from all sides, from a distance of 3-200 m. And one more “Ferdinand”, without external damage to the hull, our infantry was burned with a bottle of KS. Several "Ferdinands", deprived of the ability to move under their own power, were destroyed by their crews.

The main part of the 653 th battalion operated in the defense zone of our 70 army. Irrecoverable losses during the battles with 5 through 15 in July amounted to 8 machines. And one of our troops captured completely serviceable, and even together with the crew. It happened as follows: in the course of repelling one of the German attacks in the village of Teploe 11 – 12 in July, the advancing German troops underwent a massive artillery bombardment of the corps artillery battalion, the battery of the newest Soviet SAU SU-152 and two IPTAPs, after which the enemy left the battlefield 4 Ferdinand. Despite such a massive shelling, not a single German self-propelled gun had armor penetration: two cars had shell damage to the chassis, one was badly damaged by large-caliber artillery fire (perhaps Su-152) —the front sheet was moved from its place. And the fourth (No. 333), trying to get out from under the shelling, moved backwards and, hitting the sandy area, simply “sat” on the belly. The crew tried to undermine the car, but then attacking Soviet infantry of the 129 Infantry Division fell on them and the Germans chose to surrender. Here we are faced with the same problem, which has long been the minds of the command of the German 654-th and 653-th battalions: what is this edifice to pull out of the battlefield? Pulling the "hippopotamus out of the swamp" was delayed right up to August 2, when, with the efforts of four C-60 and C-65 tractors, Ferdinand finally pulled onto solid ground. But during its further transportation to the railway station one of the gasoline engines of the ACS failed. The fate of the car is unknown.

With the beginning of the Soviet counter-offensive, “Ferdinands” fell into their element. Thus, the 12 – 14 July 24 self-propelled guns of the 653 th battalion were supported by units of the 53 th Infantry Division in the Berezovets area. At the same time, reflecting the attack of Soviet tanks near the village of Krasnaya Niva, the crew of only one Ferdinand, Lieutenant Tiret, reported on the destruction of the X-NUMX T-22 tanks.

July 15 The 654 Battalion repelled the attack of our tanks from Maloarkhangelsk - Buzuluk, while the 6 Company reported on the destruction of Soviet military vehicles 13. Subsequently, the remnants of the battalions ottyanuli in Eagle. By July 30, all Ferdinands were withdrawn from the front, and by order of the 9 Army Headquarters were sent to Karachev.

In the course of Operation Citadel, the 656 Tank Regiment reported daily on the availability of combat-ready Ferdinands on the radio. According to these reports, 7 “Ferdinands” were in the ranks of 37 July, 8 July - 26, July 9 - 13, July 10 - 24, July 11 - 12, July 12 - 24, July 13 - 24, 14 July - July 13, July 653 - 654, July 19 - 4, 656 July - July 23, July 21 - XNUMX, July XNUMX - XNUMX, XNUMX July - July XNUMX, July XNUMX - XNUMX, July XNUMX - XNUMX, XNUMX July - July XNUMX, XNUMX, July XNUMX, XNUMX These data do not correlate well with the German data on the combat strength of the attack groups which included the XNUMX and XNUMX battalions. The Germans recognize the Ferdinands XNUMX irretrievably lost, and in addition, XNUMX machines were lost "because of a short circuit and a subsequent fire." Consequently, the XNUMX regiment lost XNUMX machines. In addition, there are inconsistencies with the Soviet data, which photographically indicate the destruction of Fernand's XNUMX ACS.


It is possible that the Germans tried, as it often happened, to write off several cars as irretrievable backdating losses, because, according to their data, since the Soviet troops launched the offensive, irrecoverable losses amounted to Fernands’s 20 (apparently 4 burned machines for technical reasons). Thus, according to German data, the total irretrievable losses of the 656 regiment from July 5 to August 1 1943 of the year amounted to 39 Ferdinands. Whatever it was, this is generally documented, and, basically, corresponds to the Soviet data.

If the losses of “Ferdinands” in both German and Soviet coincide (the difference is only in dates), then “unscientific fantasy” begins. The command of the 656 regiment states that for the period from July 5 to July 15, the regiment disabled the 1943 of the enemy tank and SPG, the 502 anti-tank and some 20 other guns. Especially distinguished in the field of destruction of the Soviet armored vehicles 100-th battalion, recorded himself in the destroyed 653 Soviet tanks, as well as a large number of guns and vehicles.

Let's try to deal with the losses of the Soviet artillery. During the period from 5 to 15 in July, 1943, the Central Front, under the command of K. Rokossovsky, lost all types of 433 guns. This is data on the whole front, which occupied a very long strip of defense, so the data on 120 destroyed guns on one small patch seem to be clearly overestimated. In addition, it is very interesting to compare the declared amount of destroyed Soviet armored vehicles with its real loss. So: by July 5, tank units of the 13 Army numbered 215 tanks and 32 SAUs, 827 armored units were counted in 2 TA and 19 TC, which was in the front reserve. Most of them were brought into battle in the 13 Army’s defense zone, where the Germans delivered their main attack. The losses of 2 TA from July 5 to 15 amounted to 270 T-34 and T-70 tanks burned down and destroyed, 19-T TC losses - 115 machines, 13-th army (taking into account all replenishments) - 132 machines. Consequently, among the 13 tanks and self-propelled guns involved in the 1129 army, total losses amounted to 517 vehicles, more than half of which were restored during the fighting (irretrievable losses amounted to 219 vehicles). If we consider that the defense zone of the 13 Army on different days of operation ranged from 80 to 160 km, and Ferdinands acted on the front from 4 to 8 km, it becomes clear that so many Soviet armored vehicles in such a narrow sector it was just unreal. And if we also take into account the fact that several tank divisions were operating against the Central Front, as well as the 505 th heavy tank battalion "Tigers", assault gun divisions, self-propelled guns Marder and Horniss, and also artillery, it is clear that the results The 656 regiment is shamelessly bloated. However, a similar picture is obtained when verifying the effectiveness of the heavy tank battalions of the "Tigers" and "Royal Tigers", and indeed of all German tank units. For the sake of justice, it must be said that with such “truthfulness” the military reports of the Soviet, American, and British troops sinned.

So what is the reason for such fame "heavy assault gun", or, if you like, "heavy tank destroyer Ferdinand"?

Undoubtedly, the creation of Ferdinand Porsche was a kind of masterpiece of technical thought. In a huge ACS, many technical solutions were applied (a unique undercarriage, a combined propulsion system, the location of the BO, etc.) that had no analogues in tank construction. At the same time, numerous technical “highlights” of the project were poorly adapted for troop operation, and phenomenal body armor and powerful weapons were purchased due to disgusting mobility, low power reserve, machine complexity in operation and the lack of a concept for using such equipment. This is all true, but it was not the cause of such a “fright” before the creation of Porsche that the Soviet artillerymen and tankmen almost every battle report saw the crowd of “Ferdinands” even after the Germans took all the surviving ACS out of the eastern front to Italy and right up to the battles in Poland they did not participate on the Eastern Front.

Despite all its imperfections and “childhood diseases”, the Ferdinand self-propelled guns proved to be a terrible opponent. Her armor did not make it. Just did not make it. Totally. Nothing. You can imagine what the Soviet tankers and artillerymen felt and what they thought: you beat at her, you release a shell after a shell, and she, like a conspiracy, rushing and rushing at you.

Many modern researchers as the main reason for the unsuccessful debut of "Ferdinands" called the lack of anti-personnel weapons of this ACS. Say, there was no machine gun and ACS were helpless against the Soviet infantry. But if we analyze the causes of the loss of the ACS Ferdinand, it becomes clear that the role of the infantry in the destruction of the Ferdinands was simply insignificant, the overwhelming majority of the vehicles were undermined in the minefields, some more were destroyed by artillery.

Thus, contrary to popular belief that the Ferdinand self-propelled gun system is to blame for large losses at the Kursk Bulge, the model, who allegedly “did not know” how to use them correctly, can be said that the main reasons for the high losses of these self-propelled guns were commanders, resilience and courage of our soldiers and officers, as well as a bit of military luck.

Another reader will say why we are not talking about the battles in Galicia, where since April 1944 have been involved slightly modernized Elephanta (which were slightly different from the previous Ferdinands, like a machine gun and a commander's turret)? The answer is: because there their fate was no better. Until July, they, summarized in the 653 Battalion, fought local battles. After the start of a major Soviet offensive, the battalion was thrown to the aid of the German SS division "Hohenstaufen", but ran into an ambush of Soviet tanks and anti-tank artillery and 19 vehicles were immediately destroyed. The remains of the battalion (12 machines) were consolidated into the 614-th separate heavy company, which took the battles of Wünsdorf, Zossen and Berlin.

SAU number Type of damage Cause of damage Note
731 Destroyed caterpillar Undermined on a mine ACS repaired and sent to Moscow for an exhibition of captured property
522 Destroyed caterpillar, damaged track rollers. It was blown up by a land mine, fuel ignited. Car burned.
523 Destroyed caterpillar, damaged skating rinks Blown up on a land mine, set on fire by the crew The car burned down
734 Destroyed lower branch of the caterpillar Undermined on a land mine, fuel ignited The machine burned
II-02 The right caterpillar was torn down, the track rollers were destroyed. It was blown up by a mine, set on fire by a bottle of KS. The car burned down.
I-02 The left track is broken, the track roller is destroyed. The mine was blown up and set on fire. The car burned down.
514 Destroyed caterpillar, damaged skating rink. Undermined on mine, set on fire. Machine burned.
502 ripped sloth Undermined on a mine, the car was tested by shelling
501 Torn out caterpillar Undermined by a mine. The machine is repaired and delivered to NIBT landfill
712 Destroyed right drive wheel. Projectile hit. Crew left the car. Fire extinguished
732 Destroyed the third carriage. A projectile hit and set fire to the CS bottle. The machine burned.
524 Caterpillar ripped Undermined on mine, set on fire Machine burned
II-03 Caterpillar destroyed Destroyed hit, set fire to a bottle of CS The machine burned
113 or 713 Both sloths are destroyed. Snapshots. The gun is set on fire. The car burned down.
601 Destroyed right-wing caterpillar Snapshot, gun set on fire outside The machine burned
701 Destroyed combat compartment hit 203-mm projectile in the commander's hatch -
602 A hole in the left side of the gas tank 76-mm projectile tank or divisional gun Machine burned
II-01 Gun burned Burned with a bottle of KS Machine burned
150061 Destroyed sloth and caterpillar, shot through gun barrel Projectile hit in the chassis and gun Crew taken prisoner
723 Destroyed caterpillar, gun jammed shell hits in the undercarriage and mask -
? Complete destruction Direct hit from a Petlyakov bomber


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  1. Region71
    +22
    2 March 2012 08: 43
    A serious opponent of our tankers. It is worth noting that this technique is more suitable for defense than for an offensive. A powerful gun, good armor and weak chassis.
    1. +3
      2 March 2012 13: 25
      Yeah, and 0-th maneuverability and non-acidic visibility. And when defensive battles take place, maneuverability is needed no worse than during defense.
    2. George IV
      +12
      2 March 2012 13: 32
      The general concept is aimed at "superweapons".
      The war showed that you do not need "over" you just need good conventional weapons and experience. Harsh realism without romance-Germanic romance.
    3. 0
      6 January 2023 03: 11
      Not so powerful, rather with high armor penetration. Due to the long barrel, the high-explosive projectile was very weak. We did not immediately begin to mess around with high-ballistic guns, but switched to 122 mm. There, a landmine could have been fatally applied.
  2. -1
    2 March 2012 09: 09
    The best Sau among the Germans was Hetzer.
    1. tauras
      +7
      2 March 2012 17: 48
      The best sau among the Germans was Hetzer.)) I disagree with this statement. Most of the "tank experts" put Jagdpanther in the first place. And Ferdinant, a noble beast, but the 90pcs series speaks volumes.
      1. +1
        2 March 2012 21: 19
        tauras, thing - this is a beast that drank a lot of blood from our tankers !! wink
        1. tauras
          +9
          2 March 2012 23: 24
          I agree without options. The simpler soldier deserves more respect that such a beast turned its neck.
      2. Neighbor
        +2
        April 30 2012 20: 47
        Quote: tauras
        The best Sau among the Germans was Hetzer.

        Oh, come on.
        Hetzer is like our Su-85B. Lightweight, maneuverable tank destroyer.
        But Fedya and Su / Isu - 152 - these are cars of a completely different class - more powerful and heavy.
        For example - a shot from Isu-152 - tore off the tower from the Tiger with meat, with a root and cast it a few meters from the tank.
        But the hatzer - this is so - light tanks are full of holes. A machine - cover or reconnaissance - at best.
  3. schta
    +6
    2 March 2012 10: 08
    Despite all its imperfections and "childhood illnesses", self-propelled guns "Ferdinand" was a terrible enemy. Her armor did not break through. Just did not break through. Absolutely. Nothing.

    Howitzer artillery level A-19 / ML-20 just did not penetrate? Or does the word "nothing" mean only the standard anti-tank missile and tank guns?
    1. Net
      Net
      +6
      2 March 2012 10: 35
      In the 6th photograph, the inscriptions in chalk may be deciphered as 152Br - Armor-piercing 53-BR-540, and D 1200 - the distance in meters. After getting from the ML-20, the frontal sheet cracked and shifted.
      1. Tyumen
        +3
        2 March 2012 20: 13
        In my opinion, these were firing range with a captured F. Traces from hits are visible on the site of the gun’s mask already removed. Therefore, the distance is indicated, and the projectile.
        1. +3
          2 March 2012 21: 35
          this is the shooting of a captured trooper to test the effectiveness of our artillery.

          and didn’t want to post this photo.
          1. Kibb
            -1
            3 March 2012 00: 02
            Luke is open, which leads to more positive thoughts, although who knows ...
            1. Kibb
              0
              4 March 2012 14: 33
              HATCH, three options open
              1Crew or part of it got out
              2. The Germans opened the hatch, but it does not seem
              3. The crew kept the hatch open in battle
              I am more impressed with the first option, and you?
              1. +1
                4 March 2012 16: 06
                The crew is of course very important, but why didn’t they set fire to the sau when they left.
                And it is very likely that this is the same sau after some time
                1. Kibb
                  +1
                  4 March 2012 17: 26
                  Judging by the hole there, no less than 88 mm flew in, and there’s no one who knows why they didn’t set it on fire? Maybe there’s three options ... well, then you understand yourself. But we don’t have to judge them for it
                  1. +3
                    4 March 2012 17: 44
                    There are 4 hits. And why they didn’t set it on fire, we really don’t know. But the fact of a poor disguise as a haystack on the face.
                    1. Kibb
                      0
                      4 March 2012 17: 57
                      Still looks like a rebound on board, below, only it’s strange some kind of incomprehensible angle from which they shot?
                      1. +2
                        4 March 2012 18: 07
                        that's what on board is I don’t know.

                        but I have another photo that I think will be interesting to you --- a nosole when I rummaged through the photo of captured German tanks (I brag - I have more of them 1600 pcs)
                      2. Kibb
                        +1
                        4 March 2012 19: 54
                        Well MK4 or 5 chassis? otherwise, are there any details very interesting?
                      3. 0
                        4 March 2012 21: 13
                        Of the more than 300 light tanks MKVIB and MkVIC (combat weight - about 5 tons, armor thickness - 14 mm, speed - 56 km / h, machine gun weapons, crew - three people), only a few dozen vehicles were used. At the Alfred Becker factory, 12 and 10,5 cm howitzers from World War I were openly mounted on 15,0 from them. And six more - in a lightly armored cabin without a roof


                        http://www.achtungpanzer.eu/captured.php


                        and there are about five photos.
                      4. Kibb
                        +1
                        4 March 2012 21: 57
                        Well, I was a little mistaken with the chassis, but on the whole I guessed, the gun in the armor could not be recognized at all, but it’s clear that it’s not 33? I’m more interested in the forehead logo,
                        you're a modeler, you should know MGBtl.10 like?
                      5. -1
                        4 March 2012 22: 09
                        Quote: Kibb
                        you're a modeler, you should know MGBtl.10 like?


                        I don’t know.
                        but that is not 33 it is visible, too long
                      6. Kibb
                        0
                        4 March 2012 22: 23
                        I'm talking about the logo, and let's tie .... for now))
                      7. +1
                        4 March 2012 22: 27
                        Quote: Kibb
                        Well, a bit wrong with the chassis,
                        wink Here are the Germans with the chassis in questions .... laughing
                2. +1
                  18 February 2015 01: 48
                  ____________
          2. +1
            3 March 2012 11: 48
            Kars, I'm sorry, are you sure that the picture is "Ferdinand" ?! It seems to me a little "not like" .... wassat
            1. +3
              3 March 2012 12: 25
              I am sure that this is a Su-152, and the Germans are inspecting it ----- it was later towed and this self-propelled guns fought for the Germans
          3. SIA
            SIA
            +2
            3 March 2012 12: 42
            What is posted here is clearly not "Ferdinand". In my opinion, this is our SAU-152.
          4. Neighbor
            +1
            April 30 2012 20: 51
            Quote: Kars
            this is the shooting of the captured ferdinand

            This is our Su-152. I give a tooth! The 37-year-old cannon is 152 mm. - Cigarette butt laughing 671 car was released.
            What a Ferdinand. You probably wanted to say - Ferdinand - they shot our anti-tank guns to test the effectiveness of German anti-tank guns.
            Quote SVV:
            What is posted here is clearly not "Ferdinand". This is our PT-ACS-152
            That's right !!!
            And the second photo is Sau - self-propelled Art. Installation - Grill or Vespe.
            1. 0
              April 30 2012 20: 58
              Quote: Neighbor
              I give a tooth!

              Following,
              read the branch carefully, and you will understand that they shot at the photo about which we are talking
              Quote: Neighbor
              And the second photo is Sau - self-propelled Art. Installation - Grill or Vespe.

              And neither one nor the other.
    2. Kibb
      +1
      2 March 2012 21: 17
      Quote: schta
      Howitzer artillery level A-19 / ML-20 just did not penetrate
      This is not howitzers, and the forehead might not have made its way, although after hitting such a shell, in general, it didn’t care whether it struck or not, the main problem was
    3. Pessimist
      +3
      April 8 2012 19: 53
      There were only 20 self-propelled guns with the ML-36 gun on the Kursk Bulge. Moreover, the ML-20 IS A HOWBIT GUN, the direct firing range is less than that of the Ferdinand's cannon, the SU-152's frontal armor (based on the KV) is 75mm versus the Ferdinand's 200mm. In addition, the Ferdinand is a purely anti-tank SPG, which explains its advantage. The A-19 cannon belongs to the corps artillery, weighs more than 7 tons, what kind of anti-tank gun is it ??? The use of these guns in the Battle of Kursk against tanks is an act of despair, from the lack of powerful anti-tank guns at that time. It is very difficult to maneuver such weapons in a changing combat situation! The victory of the Red Army looks all the more heroic against this background. It was after the Battle of Kursk that a real "St. John's wort" was created - 100mm anti-tank gun BS-3! From 1500 meters, the impact of an armor-piercing projectile put Ferdinand out of action by breaking off the armor from the inside, and - guaranteed!
    4. +3
      21 May 2014 22: 49
      Quote: schta
      Or does the word "nothing" mean only standard anti-tank equipment and tank guns?
      Probably. And so, as you know, every poison has its own antidote.
  4. +1
    2 March 2012 10: 44
    Worthy opponent!
    1. 0
      2 March 2012 12: 33
      Yeah, and the more this UG would be let out the better.
  5. chess player
    +4
    2 March 2012 13: 05
    Very interesting article
  6. SenyaYa
    +8
    2 March 2012 15: 17
    Absolutely useless contraption from all points of view .... instead of 90 ferdinads, it would be better to rivet 100 T4 in modification (H), there would be much more sense ... the whole problem of the Germans was in suffering GIGANTISM! It was necessary to launch into mass production at all capacities more T4, and not to master the miracle monsters. After all, all these STUG 3, MARDER, Ferdinand, Jagdpanther and other crap just "OVERLOADED THE CONVEYOR" Recently, a really excellent T4 tank has been produced in large volumes.
    1. +1
      2 March 2012 15: 24
      following your logic, the USSR would be obliged to produce only the T-34?
      And the troops would not have got the KV IS Su --- 76-85-100 152?

      And especially probably the German conveyor was overloaded with marders.

      Fedya is the curiosity of the tender for the Tiger 1
      1. Arc76
        +7
        2 March 2012 16: 26
        Transmission is revolutionary, was easy to manage., Difficult to maintain. I think the wrong application, at least on the Kursk arc. In defense was very good, the long-arm principle could knock out your opponents before they reach the defeat distance, add excellent optics to this.
        1. +1
          2 March 2012 17: 15
          no and no again.
          The luck of the Ferdinands on the Kursk Bulge is due to the shockingly tactical training of our tankers at all levels of command.
          You see see the armor and caliber of the gun, forgetting about such parameters as tactical and strategic mobility and secrecy.
          1. +2
            2 March 2012 17: 47
            Quote: leon-iv
            Luck of Ferdinands on the Kursk Bulge


            what do you mean?
          2. Arc76
            +10
            2 March 2012 18: 24
            I just think that the use of ferdinand on the Kursk Bulge is not successful. This is not a means of breaking the PTO, but a heavy tank destroyer. Put it at a dominant height and in the conditions of an advantage in aviation (German) try to do something with it. It will blow you apart before you reach the distance of destruction on any tank of allies.
            1. Kibb
              +1
              2 March 2012 21: 00
              Quote: arc76
              It will blow you apart before you reach the distance of defeat, and on any allied tank.

              So the question is who used something wrong tactically, the tactical hamotness of the Germans is also very striking
              Quote: leon-iv
              The luck of the Ferdinands on the Kursk Bulge is due to the shockingly tactical training of our tankers at all levels of command.

              What is the luck of Ferdinands near Kursk? Only because of this battle did they become famous?
              And yes,
              gun balistics + 200mm forehead thing serious
              But it’s not with the Ferdinades that they broke through our defense on the arc, and with the usual T34 and T60,70 potm they liquidated this breakthrough and gave them a request ..
              1. Arc76
                +6
                2 March 2012 21: 36
                So of course they are, what, military geniuses. and they had enough, especially at the end of the war among the generals, another thing is that in the middle part of the company-battalion their officers were usually very experienced and competent, and most importantly German tanks were designed for relative longevity, the T34 crew on average went on the attack three times, as a rule, crew members constantly changed. And Whitman spent his entire war with one gunner, hence the success.
          3. Pessimist
            +2
            April 8 2012 20: 13
            Oh well! Bad preparation! Interestingly, but with good preparation, probably all the "Ferdinands" would be put ??? laughing Despite the fact that the 76mm armor-piercing projectile did not even penetrate the German armor from a distance of more than 400 meters into the side! And "Ferdinand" ANY of our tanks in that battle made holes from 1500 meters !!! And even on the forehead, even on the forehead !!! Should they (our tankers) wear an invisible hat, especially in an offensive?
          4. mvg
            0
            30 October 2015 18: 26
            . sorry god
      2. Kibb
        +1
        2 March 2012 17: 00
        Just a plus, I wanted to add, but it seems like there’s nothing
      3. +1
        2 March 2012 18: 03
        You're right. And then the IS appeared, the line continued until, if I am not mistaken, the 70s
    2. -1
      2 March 2012 17: 13
      my friend, are you aware of such a concept as the power of a shell?
      If so, rethink your post.
      1. 0
        6 March 2012 21: 27
        And what kind of concept is the power of a shell? Please flip in PM
    3. Pessimist
      +1
      April 8 2012 20: 05
      Quote: SenyaYA
      instead of 90 ferdinades, it would be better to rivet 100 T4 in the modification (H

      "Ferdinands" were riveted on an ALREADY MADE chassis for the future "Tiger" designed by Porsche! BUT Porsche was let down by self-confidence, the competition was won by the Henschel tank! And the finished chassis with accessories, what, to cut into metal ??? So they attached a wheelhouse with a powerful cannon! For Porsche, it was with the turret of the tank that the problems arose.
      1. 0
        28 October 2018 14: 50
        ferdinands showed sufficient efficiency; changing them to t4 almost 1 to 1 is not profitable.
      2. +3
        6 August 2021 13: 44
        Quote: Pessimist
        For Porsche, it was precisely with the turret of the tank that the problems arose.

        The Porsche was just fine with the turret.
        It was the Porsche tower that was installed on the Henschel Tiger.

        Frightened by the high cost and unusualness of the electric drive of the Porsche chassis.
        Therefore, we chose the Henschel chassis, despite the fact that its characteristics (cross-country ability, etc.) were worse.
  7. sazhka0
    +6
    2 March 2012 18: 27
    The more respect and awe our warriors. Who fought with such monsters. With one bottle of the mixture
  8. GRU Special Forces
    +3
    2 March 2012 19: 08
    And I know where we have 1 ferdinand buried in Zaporozhye bully
    1. +1
      2 March 2012 20: 51
      sell. shipment at own expense ....
    2. +1
      2 March 2012 21: 22
      Special Forces GRU, wow, let's dig it out together - the money will be !!!!!! wink laughing lol
    3. Kibb
      0
      2 March 2012 23: 41
      Still to understand where he came from in Zaporozhye?)))
      1. 0
        2 March 2012 23: 52
        A photo to view the article carefully?

        but I personally do not believe.
        1. +1
          3 March 2012 00: 31
          I actually about this photo

          khotyaminus understandable --- professor announced
          1. Kibb
            +1
            3 March 2012 09: 45
            Yes, that's just with the number of 90 cars something I did not see in their losses
            And this is a joke that we will really discuss)))
            1. +2
              3 March 2012 12: 23
              Well, the question was this
              Quote: Kibb
              Still to understand where he came from in Zaporozhye?)))



              and so on the Zaporizhzhya-Nikopol bridgehead, 4 were lost (i.e. destroyed) according to other 8 Ferdinand data ------ so theoretically they can be somewhere somewhere ----- but the presence of Zaporizhstal blast furnace makes this unlikely. tanks remelted en masse until 1960's, they played on them - they shot triplex-re-scopes.
        2. Arc76
          +3
          3 March 2012 00: 36
          By the way, I’ll go to Moscow in a month, I would like to go to Kubinka, maybe someone will write how the museum works. They say that only excursions.
          1. +1
            3 March 2012 00: 55
            Kubinka has a decent site --- and yes there is a strain with a visit especially not an excursion.
            1. Arc76
              +1
              3 March 2012 01: 19
              Thanks for the info
  9. +1
    2 March 2012 20: 50
    "Gloomy Teutonic genius" gave birth to a good car ... for defense ..
    The same genius decided to use it in the offensive, through minefields .. part of his own.
    Well .. genius - he is a genius. That we should discuss it, shaggy.
    So we hit them in the face ... as we could .. shaggy so they gave.

    Therefore, we are now discussing - Ferdinandov - because we defeated ... the most terrible, juvenile, horror, self-propelled gun.
    It turns out that Russian soldiers and equipment-turned out to be better ... As a result.

    surprised only by the tank battalion - like our regiment - 40 vehicles. and further the same proportion. What do we, to raise our own spirit - battalions called regiments? and brigades - divisions? Or vice versa after all?
    1. Arc76
      +2
      2 March 2012 21: 54
      the divisions of heavy tank destroyers were a separate Wehrmacht compound, like the heavy battalions with tigers, there were quite a few of them, hence the number. Tigers, for example, apart from individual heavy battalions, were only one company each in the ss tank divisions. Well, what about equipment, you turned down, there were fewer German tanks, but they were definitely better in quality. The advantage of the T34 is not just in its combat qualities and build quality, but in the fact that industry was able to produce 60000 of them.
  10. Sergl
    +1
    2 March 2012 21: 08
    Partaigenos Porsche found how to tap into the Wehrmacht a series of his self-run experimental crawler-driven electric vehicles.

    IMHO, the first modification can generally be recognized as almost a marriage due to the lack of defensive weapons (machine gun).

    And those destroyed in excess of those produced in the reports of "Fedya" ... That is how the reports are written. The same Goering reduced the reports of his Luftwaffe aces when filling out the financial statement almost three times :)
    1. +3
      21 May 2014 23: 05
      Quote: SerGL
      IMHO, the first modification can generally be recognized as almost a marriage due to the lack of defensive weapons (machine gun).
      Yes, this machine gun was given to you, the infantry practically did not fight with them. But the fact that later welded the gazebo with two or three foot soldiers - it’s not getting into any gates.
  11. AlexMH
    +2
    2 March 2012 22: 14
    They forgot to add that the "Fedya" had 4 engines (two gasoline and two electric motors) and 2 generators, 6 in total. In a way, a record for a tank, and clear evidence that the Porsche should have been tied up with alcohol at the drawing board. In wartime, making a car with 6 (!) Engines, using scarce copper .... It is not surprising that only 90 of them were produced and the production was not continued. By the way, the jagdpanther with the same cannon was never invulnerable compared to the ferdinand, but it was considered much more effective.
    1. +4
      3 March 2012 18: 57
      About 90 Ferdinands were released only because they released the same number of chassis participating in the Tiger competition. But Henschel won and based on the Tigers F. Porsche created Ferdinand. It was the complexity and the large number of innovations that did not allow to win the Porsche Tiger, especially the electric transmission brought about great problems.
    2. +4
      21 May 2014 23: 51
      Quote: AlexMH
      In wartime, make a car with 6 (!) Engines, using scarce copper ...
      In the last years of the war, Porsche generally fell for electric transmissions - "Mouse" also did it with the same bells and whistles. How much extra weight all these generators with electric motors added is beyond the reach of the mind.
  12. laurbalaur
    0
    3 March 2012 02: 09
    Thank God that they were collected from what was! It would be this technique at the Seelow Heights and from the West. side of Berlin, no matter how many more of our soldiers were put by the marshals of "victory" - Zhukov and Konev!
  13. +3
    3 March 2012 09: 49
    I visited the museum in Kubinka. For the quality of the photo I immediately apologize. During my visit there was a mess - there were no information signs, so where this "Fedya" came from.
  14. +1
    3 March 2012 09: 51
    Thanks to the author, I really liked the article! I don’t know which PT the Germans have better, but "Fedya" is definitely the most legendary
  15. farhad
    +1
    3 March 2012 11: 34
    ... how the Germans took out all the surviving self-propelled guns from the eastern front to Italy and until the battles in Poland they did not participate on the eastern front. As far as I know, in 1943, in the fall, only four unforgettable tankmen and Sharik dreamed about Poland
    1. -1
      3 March 2012 12: 30
      I would advise you to study (if you need it of course) in more detail this question. I can recommend a monograph
      1. Arc76
        +1
        3 March 2012 13: 00
        Yes, I read an interesting, beautiful book.
  16. +1
    3 March 2012 11: 58
    Kars, I'm sorry, are you sure that the picture is "Ferdinand" ?! It seems to me a little "not like" .... wassat
    1. farhad
      +1
      3 March 2012 12: 36
      to confuse "ferdinand" with "St. John's wort"? Dear Bear52, I fully share your bewilderment, "I didn’t want to post this photo," and I didn’t have to. Kars, no offense, you even have a look at any reference book! bloopers are not desirable. regards
      1. +1
        3 March 2012 13: 00
        Of course, I understand here all the geniuses have gathered, but for a start read the dialogue completely before inserting your five cents.
        This photo is discussed, and the Su 152 photo is shown to show that the carriers of the 152 mm guns are also vulnerable. And with 2000 m
        1. farhad
          +1
          3 March 2012 15: 35
          dear, there was a remark: "no offense"! more constructivism, because judging by your comments, you fall into the Truth in this matter, you and the cards ... add yourself how to be with them.
          1. +1
            3 March 2012 15: 39
            Who should I be with? And before the remarks, it also does not hinder to find out what is the matter.
            Quote: farhad
            because judging by your comments you fall into the Truth

            Well, Ferdinand from Su 152 I will distinguish it for sure.
        2. Kibb
          +1
          4 March 2012 17: 46
          But you don’t know how to read? How can I confuse ferdinand with isu152? See the context in which the photo of the ISU was given will be clearer, then minus, Professor Mlyn
          And by the way, if we notice that there is no penetration of 152 mm in the photo of Ferdinand, but that would have changed little for his combat effectiveness (if it were in the field conditions)
  17. +1
    3 March 2012 12: 11
    The fact is that considering the question of "Ferdinand", you need to delve into the history of the design of a heavy tank in Germany. On the instructions of the armaments department, the projects of the heavy tank were provided by the companies Porsche and Henschel. Moreover, Ferdinand Porsche was so confident in the victory of his tank that he ordered the Nibelungwerke 90 chassis of his VK4501 (P) tank in advance. And the project of the Henschel company won, the same Tiger! It was on the basis of these 90 chassis that the Ferdinand ACS was built. The main advantage of Ferdinand was, of course, a very powerful 88mm. a semi-automatic gun, which was directed towards the stern of the chassis, while it had small ranges of horizontal and vertical fire. In the chassis of the ACS, an electric transmission was used, operating according to the following scheme: two carburetor engines powered two electric generators, and the electric current they produced was used to operate traction motors, which ensured a maximum speed of only 30 km. After an unsuccessful debut in the Battle of Kursk, the Germans used these self-propelled guns only from ambushes, using their advantages for warfare at long distances, so even in March 1945 they still had 28 installations of this type.
  18. SIA
    SIA
    0
    3 March 2012 12: 28
    The 2nd photo is not "Ferdinand", and not even "Tiger". But why are the drive and driven wheels toothed? What kind of model is this? The "Tigers" have 2-row rollers, and there it is impossible to understand what kind of unit.
    1. +4
      3 March 2012 13: 17
      This is a heavy tank Porsche VK4501 (P), which never went into production. It was on its chassis that the Ferdinand ACS was built.
      1. SIA
        SIA
        0
        3 March 2012 13: 27
        I understood it. But as far as my memory serves me, the "Tigers" always had 2 rows of 4 rinks per side, and in the photo there are 6 rinks. So I'm wondering what kind of unknown animal is this?
        1. Bener
          +4
          3 March 2012 13: 39
          The Henschel Tigers, who went into the series, had the chess (in 2 rows) suspension, and this is the Porsche Tiger with its own suspension for 6 rinks on board.
          1. Kibb
            0
            4 March 2012 13: 15
            A photo of a Porsche tiger in Galicia would not hurt
    2. Bener
      +3
      3 March 2012 13: 21
      In the second photo there are the very same Porsche Tigers. One of them, by the way, took part in the battles, as one of the staff vehicles of a heavy self-propelled regiment.
      1. SIA
        SIA
        -1
        3 March 2012 14: 31
        Clear, thanks for the info!
  19. +1
    4 March 2012 06: 55
    Well, as far as I understand, Ferdinand in its dampness corresponded to our T-34 model of the 40th year. A couple of years of war, and this car could become a really terrible enemy. Eternal glory and the same memory to those who did not allow the "treatment of childhood diseases"
    1. +3
      21 May 2014 23: 58
      Quote: KBACYPA
      Well, as far as I understand, Ferdinand in its dampness corresponded to our T-34 model of the 40th year. A couple of years of war, and this car could become a really terrible enemy. Eternal glory and the same memory to those who did not allow the "treatment of childhood diseases"
      So they had it for a couple of years. Yes, that's just no use. So the admiration of the Germans is enough to mask with words about the worship of the feat.
      1. 0
        24 October 2018 14: 32
        Ferdinand was technically ready. but after the Kursk he was made a machine-gun turret on the roof and a nest in front, so that the infantry had something to fight back. And they called an elephant
  20. Sergeev
    +2
    15 March 2012 13: 34
    Eternal glory to the heroes who stopped this BEAST!
  21. Alien
    +1
    April 2 2012 11: 39
    “Fedya” is good in defense. art she and in Africa art god of war in one word.
  22. +1
    9 September 2012 22: 01
    I play it in the world of tanks. Cool Fri Demolishes other tanks at a time. Plus, if you stand with your forehead to the enemy and do not substitute the sides, penetration is minimal. smile
  23. agermanu
    0
    9 August 2013 20: 37
    Friends despite the country and distance and political views Help to understand and find ends. It is 100% known that after Operation Citadel the lion's share of the Ferdinants was evacuated for repairs and sent to the west. But here are interesting facts, in addition to the battles on the Nikopol bridgehead in the winter of 43rd, there is information about the participation of these vehicles in the defense during the battle for the Dnieper. So there is a copy of the award list http://www.warheroes.ru/hero/hero.asp?Hero_id=16437 which clearly states that Fedorov knocked out "Ferdinand".
    At the same time, on the diorama of the battle for the Dnieper in the village. New Petrivtsi (Lutezhsky bridgehead) in the National Museum, in the central part of the canvas there is a burning "Ferdinant", although, as you know, neither "Fedek" nor "Tigers" could be on the Lyutezhsky bridgehead and documents could not be. If anyone has any information please write[email protected]
    1. +2
      9 August 2013 20: 52
      Most likely they were not there. Nikopol, Zaporozhye, Kryvyi Rih and then went to Austria.
  24. +2
    9 March 2017 19: 32
    the grandfather in the war was an artilleryman, a gun commander (a 76-mm field gun, pre-war, short-barreled), said that they were simply forbidden to open fire on the Tigers and Ferdinand, but also repeated that Ferdinand had never seen, even though he proceeded from beginning to end end of war ...
    it’s understandable: even a gun couldn’t have been able to penetrate either the Tiger or Ferdinand on board ... but he said that at the beginning of the war they somehow lobbied a German convoy, sat in the swamps, waited for the Germans, they ate their horses, thought - everything ... they waited for the convoy, attacked, smashed, went, said, look what was there ... how they found food, the biscuits were tasteless from them ... then they found some sawdust in the bags, they used these bags instead of mattresses .. ... and they said among themselves that they supposedly lied to us, that the Germans were doing what kind of mattresses they could — so that they could sleep normally on cold land, that means they were ready for winter ... then they accidentally threw those sawdust into hot water and it turned out ... mashed - ate , said from the belly, but thought that the mattresses ...
  25. +1
    26 May 2017 08: 08
    Quote: tauras
    Ferdinant, a noble beast, but the 90pcs series says a lot.

    Actually, not Ferdinad, but Elephant. (Ferdinand is a soldier’s name by the name of designer Ferdinand Porsche) Porsche (Hitler’s favorite) participated in the competition for the development of the Tiger and was so sure of the victory that he even began making the hulls of his tanks, but ... he lost to the competitor. And the backlog of hulls (90 pcs.) Was used for self-propelled guns Elephant. That is the "secret" of such a small series.
  26. 0
    27 May 2017 16: 08
    Quote: schta
    Despite all its imperfections and "childhood illnesses", self-propelled guns "Ferdinand" was a terrible enemy. Her armor did not break through. Just did not break through. Absolutely. Nothing.

    Howitzer artillery level A-19 / ML-20 just did not penetrate? Or does the word "nothing" mean only the standard anti-tank missile and tank guns?

    I mean - it didn’t strike my forehead, even the A-19.
    1. +2
      2 August 2017 16: 19
      And let me not believe it. Already A-19 had to, if not penetrate, break through the armor simply due to the power and weight of the projectile. There is never and never was anything absolutely invulnerable in this world.
  27. +1
    28 May 2017 08: 40
    The Germans widely advertised their new equipment. That's why they saw Ferdinand in each self-propelled gun. Moreover, if he has a little similarity with the rods, then the “Marders” from afar cannot be distinguished from the “Ferdinands”. And they also looked great to him, "Nashorn." From afar, try to figure it out in battle.
  28. +1
    2 August 2017 16: 17
    The author, well, do not tell my slippers .... What does it mean you didn’t break through anyone and nothing? What, 122-x or 152-mm shells would not have taken the frontal? So write clearly: they didn’t break through regular anti-tank weapons in the forehead. In this form, the characteristic is accepted. And then no one, nothing, nothing .... Reminds similar stories about the “absolutely invulnerable” HF in 1941. In reality, the invulnerability was only from the standard anti-tank artillery of the Wehrmacht and for tank guns.
  29. 0
    24 October 2018 14: 28
    in my opinion the frenchman is so ugly that there is nowhere else to go

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