Stop looking with old eyes at the new Russian army

125
After the publication of an article on the new Arms Program of the Russian Army, it became necessary to narrow the topic somewhat. Agree, reading in all seriousness that the new Program will be adopted in this form because there is not enough money in the country, it’s quite difficult without a smile. It is strange that we do not know this ... Just like reading about the need for new tanks, guns, planes. For some reason, some people absolutely do not want to "remember" what they themselves have repeatedly written and talked about. In particular, about the generals who are preparing for past soldiers.





Alas, but conservatism in thinking, about which our proverbs and sayings constantly remind us (including, by the way, the one I wrote about above), is so deeply embedded in us that we no longer consider ourselves conservatives. No, we think in a new way ... Only in the old categories.

For a start, I want to ask a simple but important question to readers. It is clear that the question from the area (God forbid) fiction, but still. Dear, you are going to fight where? Purely geographically? “The old fashioned way,” as suggested by our former brothers from one of the southern countries? When should the enemy "enter your house", and then you will arrange the St. Bartholomew night from caches and other dugouts? And it does not matter at all that even after your victory, if it comes, which is doubtful, your house will turn into ruins. The main thing is victory.

Or are you still going to win so that your house, family, your town remain intact? You are going to protect what you must protect! Protect, but not destroy. As it is written in the military doctrines of most countries. By the way, "by age" both points of view on the "future war" are probably "same age".

Here is an example of our thinking. Very often, and this is probably correct, we compare our tanks with Western ones. Especially often we write about the Israeli tank and our promising. Just because colleagues from Israel really "own the material" and adequately argue their statements. The argument is endless ... Endless simply because the tank of Israel and the tank of Russia were originally designed for different purposes. Throw the "Israeli" in our forests or on the roads of the Baltic, for example. After how many minutes you need a tractor to save him. Conversely, the same tank in defense. Yes, and prepared. The conclusion is simple. Our tanks - this weapon is not so much defense as a breakthrough. And able to act independently. The "Israelis" were originally defensive machines. The concept of such in them was laid in the design. The main thing is to protect the crew ...

I do not want to, but let me remind you again the beaten truth. The army should possess weapons and military equipment in sufficient quantities. This is the concept of necessary sufficiency. In modern war, no one will give you a new production "beyond the Urals". And the war itself will not be measured in years. We must repel the enemy and strike back.

And now that some of our readers do not want to notice. About the new weapons, which are already known. Not about those who "came to us from the USSR", but about truly Russian developments. After all, it is in the future armament of the army and fleet we will find the answer to my question. Not in theoretical debates about the advantages of a particular strategy, not in scientific disputes about the possibility of using WMD. The answer is weaponsthat we have or will have. Are US aircraft carriers designed to defend the country? Or submarine missile carriers? Anyway, the Strategic Missile Forces? And what about new air defense systems for attack?

Let's start with the first part of the combat mission, which the Armed Forces of the country are required to perform - repel the enemy attack. What do we see today in this direction? Look at our latest generation of anti-aircraft missile systems. Almost all of them significantly increased the range. Why?

For a military man, the answer is obvious. The Russian army should be able to repel a strike at the far approaches to its borders. And have time to respond to their blow. Do not let the enemy to the troops. Moreover, developing this idea, such a concept speaks about one more feature of the “Russian” strategic thinking. Such a strike response does not imply the use of a WMD! Will be used conventional weapons.

Many today talk about Russia's critical lag in the production of unmanned aerial vehicles. And not only aircraft. We do not brag about our drones. From this, some conclude that they do not exist. Okay, but if you look carefully?

The land drones of Russia are quite competitive with any Western ones. And combat vehicles, and special. The Syrian war showed the successful use of some of them. But the main reproach is still to the UAV. We do not have expensive shock drones. And even about the development of such machines can not be heard.

It seems to me that here again it is worth talking about the concept of the development of this "branch of armament". Initially, we went different ways with the West. For the Western armies, the drone is nothing more than a substitute soldier. Thanks to Hollywood. From here, these drones will develop along the same lines, as was shown in a series of films about the terminator. In the beginning, just a machine that is controlled from a distance. Then the machine with the possibility of "independent thinking". Well, then "artificial intelligence". Simply put, a dead end. And the cost of such smart machines is exorbitant.

And we have? And we are developing quite cheap, one might even say disposable, machines for reconnaissance and adjustment of artillery fire. And they are often used for tactical purposes. And the number of such UAVs is growing at a pace worthy of a good sprinter. With the appearance of “artificial intelligence”, creating a mechanic is not a problem ...

From the same part of our combat mission and the development of new EW systems. Talk about the capabilities of modern Russian EW systems is not necessary. Those who closely follow the publications in the press know what these systems are. "Cap invisible" in action. Well, and sometimes, a means for "losing consciousness" of modern "smart ammunition."

There is another topic. But to talk about it today, I can not. Not because the topic is closed. Not. Just because what they are talking about on this topic is most often the thoughts of specialists or the speculations of "specialists." I'm about cyber weapons. Therefore, it will be enough to express the opinion of Western analysts and specialists. Russia today can quite effectively confront the West in cyber warriors.

Probably enough to describe the capabilities of our army in the field of protection, I am sure that the "narrow" experts will be able to expand the list of these "opportunities." My task is different. Let me remind you, the conversation about the concept of development of the new Russian army.

So, the second part. The response of the new army to the attack. Amazingly, I am again observing "thinking from 80's." Remember our last “Hurray!”? Precisely in terms of the use of weapons? How did Russia surprise the world with NK Caliber? How many words have been said about our "defenders." Well deserved. The rocket did not fail. But where did this rocket come from? And she flew in from 80's ... It was then that the idea and embodiment came about. Then just a revision. In the same way, one can write about Iskander-M.

And what do we see from 2000's? In particular, in Syria? And we see surprisingly good and productive work of our HQ. Unlike Western airstrikes, the Russians are much more accurate. At the same time, judging by the picture from the TV reports, the Western coalition uses high-precision weapons, and we are ordinary. How is it going? Pilot skill?

And this too. Only, it seems to me, there is another explanation. It's all about the quality of ammunition. Most recently, our southern neighbor had another Peremoga. Tested a new "high-precision" rocket for the MLRS. I took the high-precision word in quotation marks simply because, according to the test results, the deviation from the target of this rocket to 15 meters ... In terms of field application, taking into account the mass of explosives, it is quite "high-precision". And on the equipped positions? Where is an accurate hit required? Similarly, in Syria. Americans "high-precision" bombed on the squares.

I repeat, in my opinion, I do not have exact data and cannot be, we use precisely high-precision weapons. A single bomb or rocket is enough to destroy an object. The rest, already really ordinary, destroy the infrastructure. It is here that affects the skill of the pilots. Fully their merit.

So, in the new Russian army great attention will be paid to precisely precision weapons. In a situation where an opponent’s salvo immediately follows an otvetka with an accurate hit on the battery, it is doubtful that the fighters of the next battery will gladly work off their volley. A peculiar tactic of intimidation of the enemy with the subsequent destruction ...

Let's look further. And then the C-500 SAM ... Next hypersonic "Zircon" ... Next PAK FA and PAK DA ... Next Armata with the company ... If you look at the line of future weapons, not in terms of the possibilities of its production and creation, here Our engineers and designers have proved many times that almost everything can, but from the point of view of application, a completely clear picture is obtained. We will fight outside the country ...

Yes, it is outside ... We, I think, Russia is forced, but rightly so, to change the approach to its army. We will not smash one and all. Release those who then again "forget" everything. We reserve the possibility of a response to a group strike. For this, the necessary and sufficient mass of weapons will be saved. But we will, and in many ways we can already, be able to deliver single, but accurate, strikes against the enemy.

Today, nuclear weapons are no longer deterrent weapons. If you look at the statements of some politicians, you can see complete indifference to the consequences of a nuclear strike. We will strike and all. And there are already problems of the enemy. Yes, and ordinary people have become somehow disregard for the WMD. He recalled how one of the highly respected Israeli military experts had recently responded to the transmission of our TV to the question of a nuclear bomb in his country. "Maybe there ... Maybe not ... But I do not advise you to try to take it away from us ...". The quote is not literal. But the meaning is exactly that.

A completely different "pugalka" came to the fore today. This is an opportunity to really get in response to the exact same bomb ... Not hypothetically, but real. No options. And the Russian army will soon be ready to provide such an opportunity to a potential enemy ... Even without using nuclear weapons. On the American "mother of all bombs" there is always a "dad". And to treat our army today, as in 90, is already silly.

In general, today we cannot be drawn into the arms race. There is no money, but we hold on ... Changes in world politics, breaking the old system of relations between states, almost always ended in military conflicts. So, the possibility of such a situation today, no one denies.

However, for the third time I will remind readers that it’s not the amount of weapons that determines the capabilities of the army. Possibilities are determined by the necessary sufficiency of armaments ... Not only the world is changing, but also the derivatives of this world. Including such specific as war. It is important to notice such changes in time. And take steps to eliminate the backlog from rivals and opponents ...
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  1. +18
    2 June 2017 06: 48
    Not so much to the article, but nevertheless the following thought came to my mind: if you open our newspapers in the mid-30's, then there will be similar articles word for word ... laughing However, there are a number of rational ideas! And in general, I want to say that over the past decade, a lot has been done to modernize the Armed Forces, but there is still very little to calm down! Moreover, we all began to do this in our own, in Russian: "To the base, and then ...!"
    1. +8
      2 June 2017 07: 21
      feel If you mean a certain delay in the production of ships, tanks, aircraft and some other types of weapons, then this is caused not so much "to the base ...", but so far due to a technical lag ... Well, it’s not so easy to create new engines for PAKs .. .
      And about the 30's ... Previously, you have to look .. Yet Alexander Nevsky did not let Germans and Swedes into the Russian land .. he drowned in the lake bully
      1. +3
        2 June 2017 07: 25
        In the complex, I had everything in mind - from structure and military education to the mobilization component! I am more calm for armament! hi
      2. +6
        2 June 2017 10: 24
        07.21. Domocles! And if you look at the 80-90s of the last century, the country's leadership surrendered the country with an army, aviation, fleet, nuclear weapons. Precision weapons are certainly good. But there is still such a weapon as a donkey loaded with gold. What weapons are against him?
        1. +3
          2 June 2017 10: 54
          Quote: Region 34
          the country's leadership surrendered the country

          Further develop the thought ... After all, no one knew about the state of the army then ... So what next?
          Want to help? According to your logic, “Let’s go! ..” or “All social programs in the furnace! Everything for the front, everything for the victory” After all, right? Do you agree that this is so? And will this not mean losing in a non-waged war?
          1. +1
            2 June 2017 11: 09
            10.54. Domocles! By my logic, we still need to look at who holds key posts and what he is doing for the country, and not against it. hi But the current leadership acts just according to your logic. The entire social network in the furnace, you must have your own safe and alternate airfield. This is called the capture of the enemy (partner)?
            1. +6
              2 June 2017 11: 16
              Quote: Region 34
              But the current leadership acts just according to your logic. The entire social network in the furnace, you must have your own safe and alternate airfield.

              So show your civic position. File a lawsuit and present evidence. We all scream - “Stop the thief!”, Including me unfortunately, and then it turns out that from the evidence we have a message from the OBS agency from the nearest shop. Like Navalny ...
              Name the social program that was adopted and closed today ... No ... There are those where I would like more and faster ... But they keep promises. You again, sorry, ruined the air ..
              1. 0
                2 June 2017 13: 52
                11.16. Domocles! And without ships, can you decide? Either we scream, wrote denunciations and knocked, then we propose to write, write, write! At work, we decided to ask for some extra pay. In response, the surprise of the authorities. Why is that? Why did you arrange yesterday, but not today? What is the rationale for the increase?
              2. +2
                2 June 2017 18: 17
                domoki: File a lawsuit and present evidence.

                RAVE! More stupidity is hard to find .... again, sorry, spoiled the air..
                1. +7
                  2 June 2017 18: 43
                  About the army. The meaning of the article is “Stop looking with old eyes at the new Russian army”
                  Enough is enough! Why in the new army was rear, sucking is enough (all the time I confuse these new slangs, whether suctioningwhether outsourcing) and Putin's cook.
                  Why is there a mobilization system and material resources in the new army?
                  Why medicine with clear evacuation steps?
                  Why technical support with the organization of evacuation and repair. DSPMs, MRA, etc. - nonsense. EVERYTHING IN THE CENTER!
                  Why 61 military school, enough 10.
                  Why hundreds of airfields, just a couple of dozens.
                  Why are there so many units and formations, military camps? 60 brigades and trembling enemy! Shoigu alone will replace 10 combined-arms armies! The main thing is to show the exercises more often on TV. MOE is resting.
                  To complete happiness, there are not enough drones.
                  Modern war - quickly pulnul and Hurray!
                  1. 0
                    3 June 2017 01: 45
                    you, too, mixed everything in a bunch ....
                    why do we need hundreds of airdromes if they don’t have infrastructure? (even the USSR didn’t have much money ...) let there be a dozen but with cover, and everything necessary, and the “jump system” for which these airdromes were built is no longer needed, for there is a refueling in the air ...
                    Why do we need tens or hundreds of thousands of tanks \ bmp rusting in the open? let it be several thousand but really capable of being stored for decades and after that be ready for battle ...
                    Why do we need "partial" who need months to gather and "remembering" what and how to do ...
                    1. +2
                      3 June 2017 10: 41
                      I do not agree) hundreds of airdromes, say, so every peasant seeks at least one spare and yes, and here - a whole army;)))
                      No, except for jokes: refueling in the air is certainly good, but not a single aircraft in the world has yet learned to replenish ammunition in flight, not to mention maintenance and repair. Plus, the factor is that no matter how perfect the defense is, there are no invulnerable objects. Therefore, reserve positions are needed.
                      And a reserve of equipment is also needed. As in a big war to compensate for losses - so for small wars and to help fraternal peoples)
                      1. 0
                        3 June 2017 15: 50
                        an aerodrome is not only a runway, but primarily infrastructure, even the USSR had problems maintaining it, either they didn’t get fuel, then the vehicles were dead, the new radar was not delivered and the old one was broken, then there is no fuel to highlight the runway, stories a lot on the internet on this subject ...

                        for replenishment of ammunition and maintenance there is a base airfield, if there is refueling, modern fighters can bomb Libya when basing in England. Bombers do around the world around the borders of the United States ...

                        As for the "reserve positions", the runway is repaired in a couple of hours (it’s simply not needed faster), there isn’t enough ammunition to destroy the concrete runway, and even if they destroy it by blocking the landing of the plane, that is, the refueling station and the sea of ​​civilian airfields ...
              3. 0
                14 October 2017 11: 48
                I agree with you, there are a lot of screeches, especially after the elections, but there is no evidence and no lawsuits either. So, according to social programs, yesterday my wife, a disabled person, was brought home two pairs of shoes, completely free of charge. But it’s not customary to talk about this, it’s a positive example, it’s imperative that you something to cajole, then you will be satisfied by itself.
    2. +5
      2 June 2017 07: 29
      Quote: Finches
      to calm down

      It’s not a matter of reassurance, but of crying and devaluing our army and armaments wink
      1. +4
        2 June 2017 20: 03
        Quote: You Vlad
        It’s not a matter of reassurance, but of crying and devaluing our army and armaments

        ... absolutely true ... and the most interesting thing is done intentionally ... comments and even publications are written by the same people, and in one tone “everything is lost, the station has left, the client is removed with a cast” ... hi
    3. +2
      2 June 2017 09: 56
      Quote: Finches
      Not so much to the article, but nevertheless the following thought came to my mind: if you open our newspapers in the mid-30's, then there will be similar articles word for word ... laughing However, there are a number of rational ideas! And in general, I want to say that over the past decade, a lot has been done to modernize the Armed Forces, but there is still very little to calm down! Moreover, we all began to do this in our own, in Russian: "To the base, and then ...!"

      I’ll add, if you will, the mass slope from the army has stopped. Young people, not all of course, but already in most sowing they go quietly to serve.
      1. +2
        2 June 2017 10: 54
        Yes, there are many factors, but this is the place to be! hi
      2. +2
        2 June 2017 21: 52
        Quote: Wend
        Young people, not all of course, but already in most sowing they go quietly to serve.

        - And now they don’t call everyone, they call the right amount, - about half of the draft contingent, - that's why there are enough people.
    4. +4
      2 June 2017 13: 07
      And what has been done in the modernization of hospitals, education, the elimination of judicial corruption and the total theft of budgets? Or is it less important than the armata and the T-50?
      1. +8
        2 June 2017 13: 17
        Quite a lot is being done in the field of healthcare and education, I have not heard about judicial corruption for a long time, and I would not exaggerate the total budget plunder ... You and your comment were 15 years late ...
      2. +4
        2 June 2017 15: 10
        In order. And only specific facts.
        1) Hospitals. 2015 year. Hero City Sevastopol. On a business trip, my colleague and I visited 8 healthcare facilities, mainly clinical hospitals. They were shocked by their current state. That is, we saw in the context that in 91 it was the same throughout the country, and in 14 the year came in a very different form "under the strict guidance of the country 404" in our hero city of Volgograd. For 2 of the year, only by ventilation systems, we tracked 38 government purchases at healthcare facilities in Sevastopol and the Republic of Kazakhstan. This is to what is being done now.

        2) Education. Not to the issue of the quality of the education system - this is a separate issue. On the issue of modernization and investment. The main higher education institution of my region, the technical university during the 14-16 years, completed the construction of the high-altitude building in the 82 and gaping loopholes, repair was done in half of the classroom, over the past 5 years, training and production equipment for 12 billion rubles was purchased. I’ll clarify again, my region is far from the richest and the university too.

        3) Judicial corruption. The topic is interesting. Why judicial. Maybe, of course, because of the hillock, I know better, but somehow there’s more bribe-taking in other areas. Subversion of the laws, and indeed the essence of Jesuit Roman law itself, "for which there is nothing obvious," is rather a philosophy, today, it’s real, not before that. And so that direct bribes to the judges, but totally total, something is not a very hot topic. Corruption was generally born when commodity-money relations were born. Where is she not? If only in paradise ...

        4) Theft of the budget. Yes, it’s being done, and a lot is being done. The last plantings of groats, and smaller fish - they are talked about well once a week, at least. Well, is it a joke - the whole minister was closed, the head of the Federal Penitentiary Service was closed, yesterday the deputy head of the Treasury was closed, generals of all kinds of policemen and others were already lost) Under Stalin they put him to the wall - they stole, in China they put him to the wall - they steal. There is no panacea. But the struggle is on, which was not the case in 90.
      3. Matak 4 b --- you have nothing to do in Russian affairs with a Jewish passport in the document folder. If there is also a Russian passport in the same folder --- then all the more out of here, first decide who you are a citizen of, and after that think where to stick your nose.
    5. 0
      3 June 2017 01: 58
      Zyablitsov Yesterday, 06: 48
      Not so much to the article, but nevertheless the following thought came to my mind: if we open our newspapers in the mid-30's, there will be similar articles word for word ..

      If you are talking about the military strategic concept of Deep Strike by Vladimir Triandafillov, then during the Cold War it formed the basis of the American Airborne Operation ...
      If you look at the line of future weapons, not from the point of view of the possibilities of its production and creation, then our engineers and designers have proved many times that they can do almost everything, but from the point of view of their application, a completely clear picture is obtained. We will fight outside the country ...

      I completely agree with the author, the Russian Federation will be forced to create expeditionary formations in each of the strategic areas (ter. Former. LVO and PrimVO), i.e. where the time for the deployment of General Purpose Forces is limited, we cannot do without WB in the territory of the Republic of Belarus and the DPRK.
      Sooner or later, it will be necessary to disband the Airborne Forces Command and transfer paratrooper and airborne assault units of the NE of the Russian Federation, form mountain jaeger and mountain parachute units as part of the mountain units, form jaeger units and units to combat the enemy DRG as part of the Russian Guard.
      Russia needs to move away from the multiplicity of weapons.
      Disband all airborne divisions and switch to the brigade system, and all airborne brigades (Airborne Forces. And DShBr.) And GSBr. Distribute into separate buildings in the main areas, for example: ZVO - VDK; Southeast Military District-VDK and GSK; BBO - VDK and GSK.
      Combine the Airborne Forces and FGPs to give AA helicopters.
      As part of the CSF of the Russian Federation, three Arctic brigades should be formed (in principle, so many were going to form them initially).
      On remote theater of operations (Armenia, Tajikistan, Abkhazia, South Ossetia, in the future SAR), form motorized rifle units without heavy weapons but saturated with PTS and capable of being used as tactical assault from helicopters (i.e., serve as a mobile reserve and units to combat the second echelons of enemy troops).
      Parts and connections of AA will again be transferred to the CB RF.
  2. +8
    2 June 2017 07: 24
    There is nothing abundant in a great war. Reserves, reserves, industry capacity. This alone determines success in a big war. The army is unable to recover its losses in people, equipment, and supplies quickly. It is doomed to defeat. And no literacy and training, at the beginning of the military conflict, will save the situation.
    1. +2
      2 June 2017 08: 44
      Quote: Herman 4223
      In a great war there is nothing abundant

      And how long will this big war last, provided that everyone is ready to use WMDs?
      1. +6
        2 June 2017 10: 36
        08.44. Domocles! After the surrender of the USSR, wars began around the world. But they are not advanced high-tech weapons. The same ISIS. Is his weapon technologically newer? The seizure of property and accounts is also a weapon and very effective. The enemy arrested your accounts and that’s it! What will you do? Gaddafi had money, a lot of money. Was he able to use them after his arrest? But don’t arrest the accounts of ISIS sponsors. Do not arrest the accounts of Poroshenko. But they impose sanctions against Cuba, Iran, North Korea, and Russia. Or sanctions do not hit the economy at all? Is membership in international financial and economic organizations not a war? But they also destroy your economy, even the IMF, even the WTO. As you can see, the war is going on today. But she goes with a slightly different weapon. The foreign army does not even enter the territory of the condemned country. But the country is in ruins. Do we have weapons against such a war?
        1. +1
          2 June 2017 10: 59
          Quote: Region 34
          After the surrender of the USSR, wars began around the world.

          laughing Very childish naive look. Where do serious powers fight among themselves? where is the army fighting, for example, NATO or the USA against Russia or China?
          The second comment, which causes only a smile, a colleague ... Or do you prefer to consider conversations from the southern ex-brothers as a war?
          1. +3
            2 June 2017 11: 12
            10.59. Domocles! Smart people do not fight themselves. There are others for this. And given the level of poverty in the world and the religion of money, there are enough people who want to fight. Or does Domocles think that in Syria there are purely domestic disassemblies?
          2. +3
            2 June 2017 11: 39
            Quote: domokl
            Very childish naive look. Where do serious powers fight among themselves? where is the army fighting, for example, NATO or the USA against Russia or China?

            In, your naivety goes off scale. In your opinion, the influence of one state on another can be produced only through a direct military clash? You probably live somewhere in parallel reality.
            1. +1
              3 June 2017 02: 03
              Let us dwell on the fact that both are wrong, the modern war is therefore called hybrid because it operates not only in the military sphere but also in the military-civil and civil spheres. Therefore, not the "army and navy" are fighting, but the "state and economy" and these same "army and navy" are only a small part of the state ...
        2. +2
          3 June 2017 02: 07
          34 region

          I completely agree that in conflicts of low intensity that go around the world, weapons produced during the Cold War are used and there are a lot of them ....
          The seizure of property and accounts is also a weapon and very effective. The enemy arrested your accounts and that’s it! What will you do? Gaddafi had money, a lot of money. Was he able to use them after his arrest? But don’t arrest the accounts of ISIS sponsors.

          This is not feasible, ISIS is fighting for the most part with old weapons of the Cold War period, how do you imagine the arrest of Bulgarian companies that supply the old Soviet B and BT to ISIS and probably even who the hell is Bulgaria a NATO member and what are its senior comrades doing from the EU and NATO are well aware ...
          The foreign army does not even enter the territory of the condemned country. But the country is in ruins. Do we have weapons against such a war?

          Unfortunately you want too much, we are just starting to gain strength, but we are already starting to use soft power and transient MTR operations (Crimea example), however, the lack of such operations, preparation and secrecy in its preparation should take the main role ....
  3. +4
    2 June 2017 07: 47
    Who else would know where she is, this reasonable sufficiency?
  4. +5
    2 June 2017 08: 30
    Those who served know that the picture on TV and the real state of affairs in the army are far from the same.
    1. +7
      2 June 2017 12: 31
      I agree. Staver's author seems to be objective, but the article smells like a great positive. And I have questions in this case. Why is the long-range interception and destruction of the training target by the S-400 system still not demonstrated? After all, this is exactly the weapon whose “far arm” it is necessary to demonstrate so that it is not disastrous. What is the case with long-range missiles for this air defense system, they either are absent or catastrophically small. Then what's the point of writing about the S-500? Which is not, and it is not known when it gets into operation. Further “Caliber”, the presence of such a missile is certainly pleasing, but this weapon is not new, and its price is more than 6 times more expensive than the latest modification of the American “Tomahawk”. An alarming ambiguity with a marine nuclear shield regarding the Bulava missile. And eulogies about our handsome PAK FA and T-14, in general, look like inadequacy. These vehicles are not in the army, they are not accepted for service, and they have not been tested by our military, we rejoice too soon. These problems must be solved, and I wish success to our defense industry and the economy, but comrades are already sick of populism.
      1. +3
        2 June 2017 12: 42
        Reread the article .. Judging by the comment, you just looked at it ... The point is completely different ... You are a classic representative of Russian conservatism, as mentioned in the article ...
        1. +1
          6 June 2017 09: 17
          Besides the fact that I am a "classic representative of Russian conservatism", I have not heard anything from you. But I asked questions in my comment.
  5. +9
    2 June 2017 08: 38
    Israeli tank and Russian tank was originally designed for different purposes. Throw the "Israeli" into our forests or off-road the Baltic states, for example. After how many minutes you will need a tractor to save it.
    Not after how much. The specific ground pressure of Merkava-4 = 1,07 kg / cm2 For comparison, T-90 = 0,98 kg / cm2
    Merkava’s problem is not in cross-country ability, but in the fact that it cannot be moved across the Russian (and European) theater of operations using the available transport infrastructure. For this, it is too heavy. And moving tank units under their own power over long distances is a long time (much longer than on railways, since the marching speed of the caterpillar equipment column is 11 km / h) and consumes mileage. In addition, this tank is too heavy for existing bridges.
    That is, the problem is not at all the patency of a single tank, but the lack of the ability to move tank units with this tank in service on a theater.

    And vice versa, the same tank is on the defensive. Yes, and prepared. The conclusion is simple. Our tanks are not so much defense weapons as a breakthrough. And they are able to act independently. The "Israelis" were originally defensive vehicles. Such a concept was laid in them during the design. The main thing is to protect the crew ...
    the air was smelled by the famous "storyteller" Viktor Suvorov. So far, I have met only heartbreaking conclusions in his genius only with him. The whole paragraph is delusional nonsense. And about the "breakthrough tanks", and about the ability to act independently, and about much more.
    The author, listen, if Soviet designers did not impose VERY severe restrictions on mass and size characteristics during the design, Soviet / Russian tanks would also be similar to Merkava. This is a clean economy, by the way. The most expensive thing in the tank is the crew. Even from a purely financial point of view.
    As for the independent action of tanks in a breakthrough ... This, excuse me, is beyond the scope of a reasonable discussion. Maybe you confirm this statement with something? Quote from a document of some kind or something else?
    1. +1
      2 June 2017 09: 14
      that is, you say that the merkava will easily and simply go along the swampy intersection like sand? and that the only problem will be the bridges and roads (transport) that will not hold it? Excuse me, do you have the results of such tests of a merkava or is this another nonsense in a vacuum?
      1. +9
        2 June 2017 09: 45
        Quote: ututyulkin
        that is, you say that the merkava will easily and simply go along the swampy intersection like sand?

        I affirm that Merkava's cross-country ability is comparable to that of the T-72 and T-90. Well, with the T-64 - too. Because the patency of the technique is determined by very specific parameters - this is the specific pressure on the ground, specific power, and geometric patency. According to these characteristics, Merkava has no significant differences from Soviet / Russian tanks. therefore, if the terrain is tank-accessible in terms of its characteristics, Merkava will not significantly lose in the passability of the same T-90.
        Quote: ututyulkin
        and that the only problem will be the bridges and roads (transport) that will not hold it?
        Well, this is a VERY significant problem. We look how the Abramsians showed themselves in the Baltic states and rejoice. Merkava will have even more problems - she has 70 tons ...
        Quote: ututyulkin
        Excuse me, do you have the results of such tests of a merkava or is this another nonsense in a vacuum?

        1. As far as I know, no one has conducted such tests in the Baltic, because no one has ever brought Merkava there.
        2. The phrase "next nonsense in a vacuum" is too impudent for such a well-deserved participant. I’ll ask you to either somehow change the wording - or look in my comments for something that gives you the right to use the word “next”. Simply put, justify your statement.
      2. +3
        2 June 2017 10: 42
        09.14. Utyutyulkin! We have the results of such tests. They were carried out with the help of our truckers. As a result, they introduced PLATO. If Merkava will be carried on a tractor, then the weight of the tractor plus the weight of the tank! How much will it cost to pay? wassat
      3. +8
        2 June 2017 13: 15
        How tired of these nonsense about Merkava, who supposedly can fight only in the conditions of a mountainous desert





        1. +3
          2 June 2017 19: 12
          Quote: matak4b
          ak Tired of these nonsense about Merkava, which supposedly can fight only in the conditions of mountainous desert


          tanks are not movable in the photo, which means this is a photo of stuck tanks tongue
          1. 0
            3 June 2017 02: 10
            "tanks are not movable in the photograph" belay

            give GIFs good
        2. What does Merkava have to do with ???? Do you still remember the title of the article or not ????
    2. +1
      2 June 2017 09: 33
      Quote: Mik13
      As for the independent action of tanks in a breakthrough ... This, excuse me, is beyond the scope of a reasonable discussion


      Well, you said stupidity. To judge with a smart mind that you do not understand. Tank divisions and tank armies are introduced into the breakthrough, not independently operating tanks.
      The author by default also meant it.
      1. +5
        2 June 2017 10: 49
        Quote: chenia
        Well, you said stupidity. To judge with a smart mind that you do not understand. Tank divisions and tank armies are introduced into the breakthrough, rather than independently operating tanks.
        The author by default also meant it.

        I do not know what the "Author" meant - but it was the Author who wrote the stupidity, and not me. We look at the article and see:
        The conclusion is simple. Our tanks are not so much defense weapons as a breakthrough. And they are able to act independently. The "Israelis" were originally defensive vehicles. Such a concept was laid in them during the design. The main thing is to protect the crew ...

        Moreover, judging by the context in which the phrase was used, the author had in mind precisely “tanks”, since he compared precisely the qualities of individual tanks, and not the OSh, and tank and combined-arms units.

        Moreover, if the Author had bothered to get acquainted with the practice of the combat use of tanks in the IDF and compared it with the experience of using tanks, for example, in Syria, then he would inevitably come to the conclusion that the "Israelis" are much more adapted to actions in isolation from their infantry - since they are much better able to withstand shelling from ATGM / RPGs. In any case, I have not seen reports of Merkava, which, after the cumulative ammunition hits the board, is disintegrated into small bounce along with the crew. At the same time, Soviet tanks with AZ / MZ and charges in combustible shells are extremely sensitive to the use of RPGs on board and require reliable cover by infantry.

        Regarding understanding - or misunderstanding. Dear, I have nothing to be ashamed of. I gained my knowledge not in WOT, but in the corresponding educational institution. So if you want to arrange a meeting of the qualification commission here, we can easily organize it. Through the representatives of the administration. Want to?
        1. +1
          2 June 2017 11: 01
          So, where are the Israeli tankers? We seemed to have them. Let them tell us for the "Merkava"!
        2. 0
          2 June 2017 19: 42
          Quote: Mik13
          I do not know what the "Author" meant - but it was the Author who wrote the stupidity, and not me. We look at the article and see:


          The author, in clumsy language, wants to show the changes in the technical re-equipment of the army in the new concept of the use of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation. As we know, most weapons come from the USSR.
          But the Soviet military doctrine is - the country's defense tasks can be achieved by decisive Offenses..
          Well, from here, all the OSH and equipment were sharpened on this.
          Eleven TAs (some cunningly "combined arms" with 2-3 APs each) stood guard over the peace and tranquility of Soviet citizens.

          And they brought extraordinary peace to our Western partners (or potential opponents - underline what is necessary).

          So that the author had in mind the actions of mobile operational associations that were not burdened with significant formations of combat and rear support, and, accordingly, the equipment for this.

          I don’t know about you, as I understand it.

          Tank “breakthrough” - forgive the author, he had in mind just another - tanks entered into the breakthrough. For Merkava is more consistent - a breakthrough tank.




          Quote: Mik13
          The Israelis "are much more adapted to operations in isolation from their infantry - since they much better tolerate shelling from ATGM / RPGs.


          Well, here we need a war at least the level of 1973 .. I think he would have managed (but here the depth of the operation is not great). Yes, and he would have been (absolutely certainly) with the appropriate cover.

          Quote: Mik13
          So if you want to arrange a meeting of the qualification commission here, we can easily organize it. Through the representatives of the administration. Want to?


          Well, in principle, this does not scare me, but where does the administration?
        3. 0
          2 June 2017 19: 51
          Quote: Mik13
          but it was the author who wrote the stupidity, not me

          The author wrote everything correctly, the tank is a weapon of maneuverable warfare, not positional
    3. +2
      2 June 2017 13: 25
      Tanks move on their own only in battle. And over long distances traveling on tractors


      1. +1
        3 June 2017 02: 25
        Mik13 it’s just about this that the tractor + trailer + tank cannot pass through many bridges, there are even bridges where only the tank itself cannot pass ...
        1. +1
          3 June 2017 09: 36
          Quote: ProkletyiPirat
          Mik13 it’s just about this that the tractor + trailer + tank cannot pass through many bridges, there are even bridges where only the tank itself cannot pass ...

          Absolutely.
          But there is one more thing. Under Israeli conditions, it is possible to move the tank brigade on tractors. In the conditions of Russia - hardly. The thing is that the average speed of the column of wheeled vehicles on the march is 30 km \ hour. Rail transportation is much faster. In addition, the train can go around the clock, unlike a convoy.
          It should also take into account the specific features of Israel - this is a small theater area, a high population density and a developed road network. AOI can quite afford to throw a brigade with a small outfit of tractors along the elements (such shuttle transportation). In the conditions of the Russian theater of military operations this will not work - the distances are different.
          1. 0
            3 June 2017 15: 55
            Well, the weight of the tank is not a limitation for the railway, platforms under 150t are already used there ...
            1. 0
              3 June 2017 20: 17
              Quote: ProkletyiPirat
              Well, the weight of the tank is not a limitation for the railway, platforms under 150t are already used there ...

              The question is how many such platforms are available.
              As far as I remember, the most common platforms have 45 and 60 tons restrictions.
              But Merkava 4 also has a width of 3720 mm. As far as I remember, such a cargo on railway in Europe / USSR can not be transported. Although, I'm still not a railroad worker - there is a very complicated system for accounting for oversized goods, transportation methods and all that.
              But the usual T-72 has a width of 3370 along the tracks with the side screens removed - and in this form it is already oversized and has some restrictions during transportation.
              1. 0
                6 June 2017 22: 33
                Quote: Mik13
                But Merkava4 also has a width of 3720 mm.

                at t90 the width of 3780 is somehow transporting it wink
                Quote: Mik13
                As far as I remember, such a cargo on railway in Europe / USSR can not be transported. Though,

                It’s possible, there’s just confusion over the journalists, there are three sizes! one about 3000-3400 is the width of the platform; everything that goes beyond is “oversized” (the rollers should not go beyond the platform, but part of the truck can), and the second two are the dimensions of the cargo in sections A-B-S-D-E Each section has its own "maximum permissible" and "maximum permissible" sizes, the first one has a restriction "should not interfere with the oncoming train along the adjacent line" the second has only one restriction "should not concern stationary objects located along the road." All hemorrhoids begin due to the fact that there are sections of doctrine, and each has its own sizes, and there are also different terms for the same meanings, especially in different countries, and the funniest thing is in our north where the railway goes over floating soils and where everything objects change their position every year laughing
                1. 0
                  7 June 2017 08: 10
                  Quote: ProkletyiPirat
                  at t90 the width of 3780 is somehow transporting it

                  Somehow - this is with the side screens taken, as in the photo. In this form, it has the width of 3370.
  6. +7
    2 June 2017 08: 43
    The author seriously believes that if we hadn’t had powerful Strategic Missile Forces, we would not have been attacked, a naive young man ... we would have been destroyed as a country back in the 90s! We are several times inferior to the United States by conventional weapons, and NATO led by the United States is even multiple !! ! Without the use of nuclear weapons, we have no chance in a war with amers, the war’s courage and courage will not save the Russian people here, they will stupidly throw us at us with a hundred axes, a thousand will fly ... Therefore, we have powerful strategic nuclear forces, a very serious factor against aggression on They are crushing us, with various political levers, and militarily they are very good aware of our doctrine wink !!!
    1. +3
      2 June 2017 12: 40
      The author seriously believes that all readers are amateurs. And on this simple basis, you can write anything that comes to mind.
      Although, good theses of speech before the eighth graders on the occasion of the Defender of the Fatherland Day.
    2. 0
      2 June 2017 19: 52
      Quote: igorka357
      Without the use of nuclear weapons, we have no chance in a war with amers; the war’s courage and courage will not save the Russian

      We had no chance in 1700, we had no chance in 1812, we had no chance in 1941, and nothing has changed.
      1. +1
        3 June 2017 02: 29
        victories of the past do not guarantee victories in the present, look at least at Poland, Spain, Portugal, and where is that "empire" over which the sun never sets? So it is very necessary and WMD and WMD and other "uncivilized" methods of war.
  7. +1
    2 June 2017 08: 55
    Author: Alexander Staver again on top. Against the backdrop of all the propailers, a "point-wise" brings a sound idea. Well, everything is all right with humor ..... "The Americans" accurately bomb the squares. "," There is no money, but we are holding on. "
    1. +6
      2 June 2017 10: 28
      Quote: Astarte
      Author: Alexander Staver again on top. Against the backdrop of all the propailers, a "point-wise" brings a sound idea. Well, everything is all right with humor ..... "The Americans" accurately bomb the squares. "," There is no money, but we are holding on. "

      There was an idea that the author is either trying to pass off poverty as a benefactor, or he is an infantile hipster who has read articles about “hybrid-preventive network-centric” wars. But I think the first is more likely. No need to keep people for idiots, telling them songs about the new army and reasonable sufficiency. It’s enough to see how many Apache’s were knocked out in statistics in Iraq and Afghanistan, and compare with the amount of Mi-28 that we now have. and then to sing songs that a pair of tanks and one helicopter would be enough for the new army. Even "Desert Storm" showed that quality does not replace quantity.
      1. +1
        2 June 2017 10: 45
        You have clearly demonstrated what the author wrote "No, we think in a new way ... Only in old categories." The fact of the matter is that Russia is not going to wage a “desert storm” or the Afghan war of the 80s (although we are called very much, but we all do not come)
        Quote: tomket
        Even "Desert Storm" showed that quality does not replace quantity.

        The fact of the matter is that not quality and not quantity, A new approach, based on new opportunities
        1. +1
          2 June 2017 13: 13
          Quote: Astarte
          The fact of the matter is that Russia is not going to wage a “desert storm” or the Afghan war 80x (although we are called very much, but we all do not come)

          And they will ask us, when it comes to the big war, do we want or not?
      2. 0
        2 June 2017 11: 38
        In Iraq and Afghanistan, the Yankers mainly lost black hawks, the Apaches were tracked from 4-5 km, and were not engaged in active fire support (there were no military losses). And the result of the Apache regiment was knocked out 60-70% of Iraqi tanks, mostly hit 72, 55 and 62 Abrashi butchered. This is just an example of the effective use of a limited number of weapons. But in Syria, there is no task to bomb terrorists (among the Yankers), the task is to destroy the country's infrastructure (as in Yugoslavia), and therefore they work on areas.
        1. 0
          3 June 2017 02: 36
          honestly, I’m already tired of these slogans "they destroyed 80% of enemy tanks", first they say about helicopters, then about tanks, then about ravings, and everywhere "they destroyed 60-80% of enemy tanks", It’s obvious nonsense! I remember that German pilots in the Second World War also beat Soviet aircraft 10 times more than they were produced, so here you need to look "how did you think that" ...
          1. 0
            6 June 2017 16: 51
            Here is an off-topic answer, unfortunately. There are statistics (an unpleasant thing), at least on the official website of the Moscow Region, the Americans, and our materials are full, the British described this operation in detail (how many books and scientific works were scribbled). And by the way, we were disassembled this operation at the university with data from different sources.
            P.S. Do you even know how many airplanes of all types we produced and received under Lend-Lease?
            1. 0
              6 June 2017 22: 07
              Quote: K-612-O
              P.S. Do you even know how many airplanes of all types we produced and received under Lend-Lease?

              and why this question?
              1. 0
                7 June 2017 12: 33
                Quote: ProkletyiPirat
                I remember that German pilots in the Second World War also beat Soviet aircraft 10 times more than they were produced,

                Yes, actually to this. In Germany, any damaged plane was considered to be shot down once, Germany really had a lot of high-class assassins prepared in the pre-war period at the beginning of the war. The statistics, of course, were strained, but at the initial stage of the war the losses were really wild.
                1. 0
                  8 June 2017 02: 15
                  look for books and articles on the theme of "inflated victories of the Luftwaffe" there the process of counting the shot down is clearly compared, for example, Luftwaffe pilots wind up "shot down" on the Soviet front ...
      3. 0
        2 June 2017 19: 54
        Quote: tomket
        It’s enough to see how many statistics Apache beat out in Iraq and Afghanistan, and compare with the amount of Mi-28 that we now have

        This is generally beyond the scope of mathematical analysis, maybe it is necessary to compare the presence of machines on both sides?
        1. 0
          3 June 2017 02: 38
          Quote: Setrac
          maybe you need to compare the availability of cars on both sides?

          Is it the Taliban’s helicopters? laughing can still compare the number, quality and duration of sorties in comparison with the number of shot down? and even better the number and quality of attempts in comparison with the downed?
  8. +14
    2 June 2017 09: 04
    Looking out the enemy somewhere beyond the horizon, you should turn around once. He is behind him. He sits in the offices of government agencies, in the chic offices of corporations, in the capital, Moscowbad, he is especially numerous. His name is not a legion, but a bureaucrat and an oligarch. As well as a businesswoman and other such words.
    Here rockets, airplanes and Armats cannot beat him. And the new S-500 does not shoot. And this vorog is more dangerous than all the others combined.
    And if all of a sudden when the “airarm” barks, this particular enemy will not let Caliber and Yars fly, will not let Yaseni and Varshavyanka enter the sea. It will not allow you to break away from the take-off of the T-50 and PAK YES. And the queen of the fields will remain in the barracks.
    Russia did not learn to fight this enemy (and unlearned at the same time) because of this, it loses every battle. And this look is not even from the 80s, but from the 30s.
    1. +2
      2 June 2017 11: 01
      Comment of the day ...
    2. +1
      2 June 2017 11: 30
      Quote: erased
      And this look is not even from the 80s, but from the 30s.

      I agree with each comma. In the 30s, this evil was crushed, and therefore they won the war. Now "our" government does not have global contradictions with the West. It’s just that liberties want “there” even with a carcass, even with a scarecrow, and “patriots” - only with a carcass, unchipped. And it’s time for the West to “cut and cut”. That’s the whole dilemma.
    3. +1
      2 June 2017 11: 39
      Then from 1917, then it was this enemy who ruined the country.
    4. +2
      5 June 2017 16: 11
      You either know something secret for everyone, or, as it were, more polite, a person far from the world.
      Turn on the brain, imagine the situation. The adversary launched his missiles, for example, in the Kaliningrad region, received a signal from the Special Operations Command, confirmation was received from the air defense, duty officers at various levels performed the simple prescribed actions, the calculations automatically received commands. And WHERE "bureaucrat and oligarch" may intervene in this very quick and closed exchange of signals and commands and actions. Yes, and how could he have done it at all, he will recognize the attack by the howling of sirens at the same time as non-Muscovite residents.
  9. +2
    2 June 2017 09: 44
    Uh, no, my friend, not so.
    More precisely, everything would have been like this if the collective west had the task of "crushing-pushing" us, well, or "bombing in the Stone Age." Unfortunately, the West will not repeat its mistake of the 90s, now they will kill us, that would be with a guarantee, and the third Reich in comparison with the Anglo-Saxon world ...
    1. +1
      2 June 2017 10: 17
      What for. You would have thought. Well, let's say they won and occupied. So, what is next. Huge costs and risks and what is the use.
  10. +1
    2 June 2017 10: 14
    I wonder why the author thinks that shock drones with AI are such a dead end. Bots in military computer toys are this AI. Identification of the enemy and his attack using standard tactical schemes. Or defense of the site on the same principle.
    1. 0
      2 June 2017 11: 07
      The cost of such a drone is not comparable with the military effect of its use. Impact drones, at least in the form in which they exist today, are comparable in value to aircraft. and knock them down the same way.
      An UAV will be good when scientists develop materials that would allow these devices to do what today's cannot do, without self-destruction of course ...
      What about a dead end? Do you believe in the creation of artificial intelligence for the army? In the coming years, not even. Decades?
      1. 0
        3 June 2017 02: 46
        AI has already been created, there’s just a different AI, what they don’t show in the films so far, but there are automation AIs, AI autopilots, image recognition AI, and much more
    2. +5
      2 June 2017 11: 59
      Because the author, like that shkolota, knows nothing, but crawls everywhere. A dead end in his brain. The need for a particular form of drone depends on the problem that needs to be solved. And sitting naked ... in terms of having its own UAVs, it’s “very clever” to talk about the stupidity and dullness of some of the most advanced armies in Israel, the USA and China, even China already makes and sells shock UAVs and buyers buy for some reason, they probably don’t know about the comparable price of the REAL airplane and the “dead-end” UAV. Or do they know? And what proportion of the cost in the pilot-plane system is spent on the pilot and how much time is required for this? And how much time and money will be spent on training the operator or developing an autopilot UAV? And many more such questions. But the iksperdy have already diagnosed the impasse, and they have presented their own exceptionally true development path, somewhere I’ve heard about exclusivity somewhere, can you tell me?
      1. 0
        2 June 2017 12: 48
        laughing That's right ... Youth road lol And how much time will it take to prepare the operator? Year? Two? Three?
        The talk is not about whether drone drones are needed or not. We cannot talk about spending money on creating these UAVs. We don’t have so much money. Yes, and initially, if you are of course an expert on how you position yourself, Russians follow this very path, different from the West. Hmm ... It's hard to see what is far. What is easier to see underfoot ... That is the basis for conservatism of thinking ...
        1. +2
          2 June 2017 18: 47
          The operator is preparing much faster and harder to lose. In a modern airplane overload, the weak point is man. The drone will twist a living pilot
    3. 0
      2 June 2017 19: 57
      Quote: Ken71
      Bots in military computer toys are this AI. Identification of the enemy and his attack using standard tactical schemes.

      Here the dog rummaged, with recognition of the problem. Still, the unit drawn on the computer screen is not a drone, and its programmed opponent is not an enemy disguised on the battlefield.
      1. +2
        3 June 2017 05: 06
        Identification systems did not come up yesterday. And not even the day before yesterday. And living people scoff at their drones like never dreamed of.
  11. +2
    2 June 2017 10: 33
    And of course, as always, talking about 2 a little blood, but on someone else’s territory, the trouble is that in addition to your plans, the enemy also has his own plans.
    1. 0
      2 June 2017 11: 10
      These type of "Russian stupid initially"? Americans, British, even Europeans can fight like that, but we don’t? Why? All else being equal? Only due to their own underdevelopment, probably crying
  12. +6
    2 June 2017 10: 53
    Gentlemen, comrades, there will be no war in the classical sense with the conditional "West." And there will be a collapse of the information systems of banking, aviation, energy, etc. sectors. Let me remind you that we buy the server from them, and not they from us. The entire telecom and communications sector is almost entirely imported iron. Yes, and why the "west" to fight with Russia ??? Russia readily gives up its natural and human resources for green papers. Some excesses such as Syria and Crimea, this is just an attempt to sell these resources at a higher price. Improve your bargaining position.
    1. 0
      2 June 2017 11: 28
      In general, the thought is correct. You just did not dare to call the actions that you described as war. This is exactly what the article was written about.
      Today it is necessary to look at the war differently. Not the quantity of weapons, and not even the quality, determines victory. The one who will be ready in all directions will win.
      An outdated look just pushes us to the race of completely useless weapons. I remember 5000 tanks in the field near my city. In excellent condition, from the GSVG ... In the field .. Under the rain and snow ...
      1. 0
        6 June 2017 10: 07
        domokl
        Who are you? What right do you have to evaluate - is this idea correct, but this one is not? Do you have such a position - "ASSESSER"? How many have taken on themselves? Do not overdo it.
  13. 0
    2 June 2017 11: 06
    If it weren’t for the financial and economic bloc of the Government chewing mantras about the “free market”, “creating investment attractiveness” (I wonder how they present it under the conditions of political pressure and sanctions?), “Inflation targeting”, “budget deficit”, then Russia would be in 5 years created the most modern industry, in 10 years the most modern education. There are opportunities for this, there is a capacious market, there are still personnel. Accountants do not understand that the creation of new industrial clusters would have a huge multiplier effect in everything. Or they understand, but they want to crush us with artificial hunger.
    1. 0
      2 June 2017 11: 34
      sad Long live the EBN! Long live built capitalism! Long live the oligarchs!
      Very democratic ( am ) the country to return stolen by the oligarchs in 90 ... It was stolen according to the law ... And, it’s not a secret, who has a better lawyer is right. And better, he’s definitely with the oligarch. Can pay more ...
      Comment to the point ...
      1. +3
        2 June 2017 11: 44
        Quote: domokl
        sad Long live the EBN! Long live built capitalism! Long live the oligarchs!

        Putin will leave tomorrow and you will be the first to write that what he built was in the interests of the oligarchs and not the people. You will, you will - do not even doubt it. The whole history of the USSR / Russia is like this - at first they praise those in power, and then they themselves are watered.
        The saddest thing is that in Russia they are not able to admit their mistakes, draw conclusions from this and correct these very mistakes. Someone else is always to blame but not him. Therefore, there will be calls for a long time to "tolerate a little" because "the whole world is going to war against us." hi
        1. 0
          2 June 2017 12: 50
          Quote: analgin
          Putin will leave tomorrow and you will be the first to write that what he built was in the interests of the oligarchs and not the people. You will be

          Can you give an example of when I changed my attitude to something radically? Or so, talk and slop drench? laughing It’s not in my rules to get involved in stupid polemics ... But .. It’s indecent somehow for an adult ...
          1. +3
            2 June 2017 15: 07
            Quote: domokl
            Quote: analgin
            Putin will leave tomorrow and you will be the first to write that what he built was in the interests of the oligarchs and not the people. You will be

            Can you give an example of when I changed my attitude to something radically? Or so, talk and slop drench?

            For example, I can give your statements five years ago about Rogozin. How cool, businesslike and promising he is ... What can you say about him now after Vostochny, his son in a warm position and the like?

            Quote: domokl
            It’s not in my rules to get involved in stupid polemics ... But .. It’s indecent somehow for an adult ...

            It is indecent for an adult to constantly remember how a bastard EBN ruined the country and put all dogs on it. Especially when you yourself admit that at that time I was sitting on the couch and watching how they were breaking up. hi
            1. 0
              2 June 2017 16: 31
              Quote: analgin
              For example, I can give your statements five years ago about Rogozin.

              What am I talking about him now? I can’t say, but I’m saying ...
              Quote: analgin
              Especially when you yourself admit that at that time I was sitting on the couch and watching how they were breaking up.

              Where and when did I admit to sitting on the couch and watching? Again, a lie ... I wonder if it's all your lie? Or so, troll? I am not a specialist in counterpropaganda. But I know this technology perfectly .. I won’t take it ... And I won’t take it to the side, and I can also get it out of myself ... You can’t defeat the truth ...
              1. +3
                2 June 2017 19: 54
                Quote: domokl
                Quote: analgin
                For example, I can give your statements five years ago about Rogozin.

                What am I talking about him now? I can not saybut I say ...

                So you have not changed your mind about Rogozin, or simply do not say this?

                Quote: domokl
                Quote: analgin
                Especially when you yourself admit that at that time I was sitting on the couch and watching how they were breaking up.

                Where and when did I admit to sitting on the couch and watching? Again, a lie ... I wonder if it's all your lie?

                Who wrote this?

                or is it not considered because the word "sofa" is not here?
                Quote: domokl
                I am not a specialist in counterpropaganda. But I know this technology perfectly .. I won’t take it ... And I won’t take it to the side, and I can also get it out of myself ... You can’t defeat the truth ...

                You are too high on yourself hi
    2. +1
      2 June 2017 13: 24
      Yes, for 5 years. As you already lifted up. For example, in aviation, the USSR, with its infinite resources for the army, reached technical parity with the United States in aviation only at the turn of the 70-80-ies. This is how many years it turns out, if you remember that Vladimir Ilyich was still alive, but they were already trying to tackle the planes.
  14. 0
    2 June 2017 11: 16
    "And on enemy land we will smash the enemy with small blood with a mighty blow" Uh-hm ... In my opinion, the image of the war that will certainly await us in the near future is the South-East of Ukraine. That’s what really will be. Plus the air component and essno air defense. No "Armat", UAVs only those that we see now. And ... betrayal, betrayal in the cube. How did the states wholesale Saddam officers? We don’t have to buy officers from us and it won’t work out, they are just the people of the flesh. We have worse. Most of the top was bought and sold. The destruction of industry continues. Who and what can stop all this? I dont know. I have nowhere to run and I don’t want to. It will remain to sell your life more expensively, with a Kalash in hand and a grenade. That's all
    1. +1
      2 June 2017 13: 21
      What is bought from you, I have no doubt that you are the first to give up and run. Before supposedly bought.
  15. +4
    2 June 2017 11: 39
    Our tanks are not so much defense weapons as a breakthrough. And they are able to act independently. The "Israelis" were originally defensive vehicles. Such a concept was laid in them during the design. The main thing is to protect the crew ...
    That is, for a “breakthrough”, crew protection is already a secondary factor? And when defending, tankers need more life to save than during an attack?
    Dear forum users, tell me where I did not find the logic in the reasoning of the author of the article?

    There is no need to talk about the capabilities of modern Russian electronic warfare systems. Those who closely follow publications in the press know what these systems are. "Invisible hat" in action. Well and, sometimes, a means for "loss of consciousness" of modern "smart ammunition."

    And where at least once did these EWs prove themselves. About "Donald Cook" you can not write - these are fairy tales for the kindergarten.
  16. +1
    2 June 2017 13: 19
    I cannot understand this stream of consciousness. "Enough" is how much? Let's imagine that the Red Army in 41 is one and a half times more. Or, for example, Soviet industry had twice as many capacities for the production of armored vehicles, how much easier would a victory have been? For example, the Red Army did not even receive such weapons as a self-propelled howitzer, an analogue of Vespe or Hummel, by the 45, and they used everything possible as armored personnel carriers. To begin to understand some particular elements, so there you will conquer a wolf, especially when compared with richer states.

    Where are we going to fight? Yes, actually all over the CIS, and a couple of thousand kilometers from the borders. This is in real-life scenarios when our army can even make contact with the enemy. When it is really possible to go and land a contingent of at least a couple of divisions. We’re already fighting in Syria, if we throw airplanes and thugs out of special forces for which the concept of peacetime does not exist, then there is a rather large contingent of marines and land soldiers, who, although they don’t go on the attack, still incur losses from time to time. Where is the guarantee that in a couple of years it won’t break out in Central Asia? There is a "mighty" Tajikistan, for example, its entire "army" is weaker than the Russian contingent deployed in it. Only Kazakhstan can represent real power in the region except Russia.

    How does the PAK FA relate to war on foreign territory? No way in general. As soon as the planes became something more serious than plywood with an engine, the possibility of mutual bombardment appeared, and if Napoleon 200 + years ago walked across Russia a narrow strip of kilometers maybe in 300, and the rest of the territory was quiet, but the surface was calm, then now 1000 km from the line front do not guarantee that you will not crash a cruise missile, or an air bomb. Already in WWII they did not guarantee, and moreover, bombs were strewed with thousands of tons per raid.

    It’s true that they will shoot for long with air attack means, and in order to minimize the return arrivals, the most radical solution is tank columns rushing to the enemy capital. They could also bomb Iraq in 2003, well, would they kill a thousand 10 soldiers, but rather less, destroy something, and what's the point? Until the boot of his soldier leaves an imprint, all this is just punitive raids without decisive goals. So PAK FA is one thing, and no one has yet canceled the study of the most effective ways of burning an “Abrams” or a “leopard” from a grenade launcher somewhere near Smolensk. And you can not drive the “Abrams”, not even a legionnaire to spend, when the various kinds of local auxiliaries are full, the Romans understood this, and in the same Libya and Syria they fully realized this principle, and before them in countless colonial wars.
    1. 0
      2 June 2017 20: 05
      Quote: EvilLion
      Let's imagine that the Red Army is 41 times one and a half times larger. Or, for example, Soviet industry had twice as many capacities for the production of armored vehicles, how much easier would a victory have been?

      To do this, you need to have twice as much population. And yes - if it were not for the Wehrmacht’s one and a half numerical advantage over the Red Army - there would simply be no defeat in the border battle.
      Now we are not losing on the battlefields, nor in industry, and not even in cyber and financial wars. We lose in maternity hospitals, in the egoism of our women. not wanting to give birth to children.
      And when the dark-skinned invaders and her come, they will put the woman on her knees in front of some Turkish woman, let all the women know that it is their fault, they have not given birth to sons, defenders.
      In fact, we have already lost, but we still do not realize it.
      1. Setrak, do you personally have children? Or are there no other women around you, some selfish ones? I assure you, good girls, the sea, you just need to leave the house and your fantasies.
        1. 0
          2 June 2017 23: 38
          Quote: For the Motherland, your mother))
          Setrak, do you personally have children?

          I have two children, maybe I can persuade my spouse on a third.
          Quote: For the Motherland, your mother))
          I assure you, good sea girls

          I have no doubt about this, the younger generation is better than us at their age and they will raise this country.
      2. 0
        3 June 2017 00: 34
        Quote: Setrac
        We lose in maternity hospitals, in the egoism of our women. not wanting to give birth to children.

        Well, actually, what kind of women men want, so they become. I don’t understand, did the triumph of matriarchy in our country come about?
      3. 0
        5 June 2017 09: 18
        No matter how large the number would be achieved, it is possible to use greater industry productivity for this, the main thing is that the striking ability of the troops increases, which means the enemy breaks out faster, their losses are lower.

        I don’t care at all about the black people, because the machine gun made any mass of infantry easily destroyed, and to build tanks and planes as we can do, you need to have an appropriate culture, and not just women working hard 3.14 ****. Although I have not yet met women who would not want to give birth, and very rarely give birth to just one.

        Because Israel is black and bent over and over again.
        1. 0
          5 June 2017 11: 51
          Quote: EvilLion
          Because Israel is black and bent over and over again.

          Make no mistake, Israel bent the Arabs once, at the dawn of their existence, but then they had completely different people in the army - World War II veterans. Now they do not have such a resource.
  17. +2
    2 June 2017 14: 02
    Old trick: patch up the holes with cheers. Defense can be estimated indirectly: by the level of pensions and salaries in the real (rather than ostentatious) segment of the economy, where a simple person works, and also by the content of television programs, where agitators-defeatists and “Svidomites” like Sytin aggressively perform.
    1. +1
      2 June 2017 16: 34
      But is the task of evaluation? The task is to ensure defense capability for the money that the state can give to the army and defense industry. And this is not so much ... It means that it is necessary to fundamentally change the approach to ensuring defense ... Getting involved in an arms race is like death for us ...
      And the majority, alas, did not understand this simple thought ...
      1. 0
        2 June 2017 18: 12
        A simple thought: if the “tops” bring the matter to the collapse of the system, as in 1985. 91, then the West will “love” us again and “protect” itself.
    2. 0
      5 June 2017 09: 21
      And in 41, do you think we lived better than now?
  18. +1
    2 June 2017 15: 23
    Why do we expect a hot war? ...
    This is the most incredible scenario of all possible, much worse than the long economic stagnation, stretched over the years. (What actually happens).
    Least of all I am afraid that tomorrow NATO will attack my city.
  19. 0
    2 June 2017 17: 51
    A kind word is always better with a gun and no liberals behind.
  20. 0
    2 June 2017 17: 57
    Man controls all these army nishtyaks. And if we ourselves do not advance evolutionarily, then the country will collapse again.
  21. +3
    2 June 2017 20: 48
    Quote: nils
    About the army. The meaning of the article is “Stop looking with old eyes at the new Russian army”
    Enough is enough! Why in the new army was rear, sucking is enough (all the time I confuse these new slangs, whether suctioningwhether outsourcing) and Putin's cook.
    Why is there a mobilization system and material resources in the new army?
    Why medicine with clear evacuation steps?
    Why technical support with the organization of evacuation and repair. DSPMs, MRA, etc. - nonsense. EVERYTHING IN THE CENTER!
    Why 61 military school, enough 10.
    Why hundreds of airfields, just a couple of dozens.
    Why are there so many units and formations, military camps? 60 brigades and trembling enemy! Shoigu alone will replace 10 combined-arms armies! The main thing is to show the exercises more often on TV. MOE is resting.
    To complete happiness, there are not enough drones.
    Modern war - quickly pulnul and Hurray!

    good
  22. +1
    3 June 2017 05: 29
    We are really looking forward to launching a new program! the current program has brought a lot of positive! The Russian army has become completely different! And whoever does not see this is simply blind! Well, or a purchased liberalist! hi
    1. 0
      3 June 2017 07: 33
      The photo in the article, by the way, is quite old, - 2010, this is the reconnaissance battalion of the 34th mountain brigade,
      the son served in this battalion in 12-13, then the army already looked different,
      the people in Crimea and Syria saw this.
  23. +1
    3 June 2017 15: 29
    Article ... In general ... timely and correct ...
    In details ... There are ... inconsistencies ..
    For example..
    "Russia today can quite effectively confront the West with cyber warriors."
    Just a joy ... to my Russian heart!
    But in fact?
    What happened in Russia ... After the attack of the "WannaCry" virus?
    Activity was paralyzed ... Ministry of Internal Affairs! State bodies management!
    What is it like?
    Where is our .. domestic operating system?
    We are so ... They can crush ... and without ICBMs ....
    What has been done ... For our protection?
    1. +1
      3 June 2017 22: 30
      Who told you that the activities of the Ministry of Internal Affairs and government bodies were paralyzed? Why are you spreading a panic?
      1. 0
        6 June 2017 10: 23
        turbris
        State bodies our controls are paralyzed even without the "WannaCry" virus, since everything is decided by one person.
  24. +2
    3 June 2017 22: 27
    I agree that our “Experts,” mostly retired or reserve military men, think mainly based on the experience of building the USSR Armed Forces. Few people read the military doctrine of Russia and therefore do not understand that the tasks of the development of the Russian Armed Forces are significantly different from what was during the USSR. There is no task to protect socialism all over the world, but there is a task - to guarantee the security of the Russian Federation. Therefore, it is not necessary to compare the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation and the US Armed Forces, they are developed to solve various problems, although of course we need to study individual weapons and combat experience. It is necessary to stop these moaning - but in the Soviet army it was ....... so much, and now so much; but the Americans have so much, but we have so much .... etc.
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