DRLO Aviation (part 10)

45
DRLO Aviation (part 10)


The Soviet military leadership was greatly impressed by the effective use by the Israeli Air Force of American DRLO E-2C Hawkeye aircraft during the Lebanese 1982 war of the year. At that time, the Soviet Union had a limited number of heavy Tu-126, which had already become fairly outdated. To replace outdated machines built in the middle of the 60-x, the development of the aircraft A-50 with the innovative for the USSR radio complex "Bumblebee" was conducted. However, at the design stage of the DRLO aircraft based on the IL-76, it was clear that it could not become inexpensive and massive. In addition to the “strategic” heavy aircraft of the radar patrol and control, the Soviet Air Force needed a tactical vehicle with a flight duration of 4,5 — 5 hours and the possibility of detecting low-flying and unobtrusive targets at long ranges.



In 1983, the command of the Air Force and Air Defense, with the participation of research organizations and industrial enterprises, agreed on the requirements for a new DRLO middle-class aircraft. The airborne radar complex was to provide detection of low-altitude targets at a distance of at least 200 km and simultaneous tracking of 120 targets. In the passive mode, with the help of an electronic reconnaissance station, it was envisaged to detect operating ground (sea) radars and air defense missile systems at a distance of up to 400 km. The data transmission equipment was supposed to provide multi-channel control and guidance of both those in service and advanced fighter-interceptors, as well as the transmission of radar information to ground command posts in real time.

For a promising front-line aircraft, AWACS provided two options for radio systems: decimeter (with the traditional location of the radar antenna in the fairing above the fuselage of the aircraft) and centimeter (with the separation of the antennas in the nose and tail of the fuselage). As aviation platforms were considered: An-12, An-32, An-72 and Il-18. By that time, the An-12 and Il-18 aircraft had already been discontinued, but there were many fairly new and well-maintained vehicles that could easily be converted into AWACS aircraft. The promising medium transport An-32 with the new AI-20D-5M turboprop engines has only been tested. The project based on the light transport An-72 with two double-circuit turbojet engines D-36 seemed very promising. An important advantage of the An-72 was the high location of the engines, which allowed it to be operated from poorly trained field airfields. The use of the so-called Coanda aerodynamic effect seriously increased the lift and reduced the take-off run. Specialists of the OKB Antonov Design Bureau managed to very carefully work out the project, and the military unequivocally spoke out for the option based on the An-72. Thanks to deep preliminary research, it was possible to go directly to the detailed design, bypassing the stages of outline design and construction of a full-sized wooden layout.


An-71


The need to accommodate a disc-shaped antenna for a radio-technical complex predetermined the aerodynamic layout. The large dimensions of the rotating antenna did not allow optimal placement of it on a relatively small plane according to the traditional scheme. In this case, the antenna had a great influence on the tail, and there were zones of radar shading elements of the airframe. In addition, when installing with the help of pylons “on the back”, the antenna inevitably fell under the influence of jet jets of highly located engines. In this regard, after analyzing all possible schemes, the developers stopped at the option of installing an antenna at the tip of the vertical tail, which gave the aircraft a very exotic look. The rotating antenna of the surveillance radar was located inside the fairing, structurally consisting of a metal caisson part and fiberglass shells.



To do this, we had to redo the rear part of the fuselage and the new vertical tail, which had a reverse sweep, as well as a large chord and thickness. To reduce vibration loads, the rear part of the fuselage was raised upwards, which made it possible to increase the height of the stabilizer by half a meter. But even so, despite all the efforts, the handling of the An-71 was noticeably different from the An-72 for the worse. The unusual layout led to the need to solve a number of problems, among which were insufficient stability and control in the lateral and longitudinal channels, and the forced installation of a large-area steering wheel, which complicated management and significantly reduced the effectiveness of the steering trimmer.

To improve the take-off performance on the An-71, more powerful D-436K engines were used with a load of 7500 kg. However, at the request of the military, in order to realize the possibility of taking off from a shortened runway or with one main engine not working, an additional RD-36А engine with 2900 kg was installed under the rear fuselage. Since the power consumption of onboard equipment increased significantly instead of the two GP-21 generators used on the An-72, four GP-23 generators with a total power of 240 kW were used.


Tail part of An-71


Compared with the transport An-72, the internal volume of the An-71 has undergone a reconfiguration. Designers had to go to a number of tricks to accommodate all the necessary equipment and the fuselage was now divided into three compartments. Immediately after the pilot's cabin, there were operators' workplaces with equipment racks and information display screens. In the middle compartment, isolated from the habitable space, there was the computing equipment of the radio-technical complex and the aircraft equipment. The third compartment contained the radar equipment, the upper stage engine, cooling systems and elements of the control system. A metal shielded partition with a door was installed between the first and second compartments.

In order to increase the reliability of the radar complex and reduce the harmful vibration effect, the equipment installed in the third compartment was located on a single cushioning platform, which also served as the air duct of the cooling system. A part of the equipment was placed in the underfloor space of the fuselage, under the chassis and around the wing wings. Thus, the installation density on the An-71 was significantly higher than on the much larger A-50 aircraft. To get to a failed electronic unit, it was often necessary to dismantle several neighboring ones. But it was still necessary to ensure acceptable working conditions for the three operators.

Based on the operating experience of the first Tu-126, great attention was paid to measures to ensure bio-protection and normal crew living conditions. In order to prevent the penetration of harmful high-frequency radiation, the glazing of the cockpit with protective metallized spraying was used, as well as pipelines, electrical cables and bridges through partitions and airframe elements of the aircraft were carried out with compulsory compliance with the requirements of radio hermeticity.

After the final approval of the project, construction of three experimental machines began. Two planes were supposed to be used for flight, and one for static tests. The first An-71 came from the fourth experienced An-72. This machine, which had a large plaque and one emergency landing was before the alteration is not in flying condition. The second and third copies were also not rebuilt, but were reworked from second-hand An-72. 12 July 1985, the experienced An-71 first took to the air.


The first copy of the An-71 while jogging


If the re-equipment of the aircraft themselves went strictly according to the schedule, then there were problems with the radio engineering complex. The first version of the radar and computing complex created in the NGO "Vega" showed unsatisfactory results in terms of detecting air targets against the background of the earth. This led to a radical alteration of radar and computing equipment. However, by that time, the requirements of the customer in terms of interaction with fighter and attack aircraft had changed. It was necessary to increase the number of channels of guidance, to ensure interaction with long-range air defense systems, to increase the degree of automation of operators and to work effectively on ground and surface targets, which led to the creation of a third set of equipment.



Tests of An-71 were carried out not only in Ukraine, but also in other regions of the USSR, including the Caucasus, the Volga region and Central Asia, in various weather conditions and over different landscapes. During the tests, the hardware of the radar complex was brought to a high level of reliability. In this case, An-71 for a month could act in isolation from the main base, doing the minimum maintenance. According to the military and specialists of the Ministry of Aviation Industry, who participated in the tests, the use of An-71 could increase the effectiveness of the actions of fighter aircraft in 2,5-3 times.

On tests, the aircraft with a maximum take-off weight of 32100 kg developed a maximum speed of 650 km / h. Cruising speed - 530 km / h. Practical ceiling - 10800 meters. Time spent on patrol is 5 hours. That is, according to flight data of An-71, at least not inferior to the American E-2С Hawkeye. According to information published by Global Security, a radar installed on the An-71 could detect targets against the background of the earth at a distance of more than 200 km, with an altitude patrol of 8500 meters.

You can often hear the opinion that the An-71 was originally designed as a deck-mounted AWACS aircraft, but this is not the case. In 1982, after laying a heavy aircraft carrier cruiser, 1143.5, on the stockpile of the Black Sea Shipbuilding Plant in Nikolaev, the question arose of forming its wing. If everything was more or less clear with fighters and anti-submarine and rescue helicopters, at that time there were no ready-made candidates for the role of deck-based AWACS aircraft.

In the 1983 year, after the start of work on the front-line DRLO plane, the An-71 deck modification was developed. However, it soon became clear that, due to the great height of the An-71, basing it on an aircraft-carrying cruiser is extremely difficult. If the wings to save space could still be folded, then what to do with high tail feathers, topped with a bulky radar antenna, was not clear. However, the main obstacle was the absence of a catapult on the ship. This made it impossible to take off An-71 from the deck due to insufficient thrust-to-weight ratio. For a short take-off from the strip with a springboard section, at least three booster engines were required, for which it was necessary to redesign the entire aircraft. Taking into account these circumstances, the customer in the person of the Ministry of Defense decided to abandon the order to develop the carrier-based AWACS aircraft based on the An-71 and concentrate efforts on another model.

For the first time, the new Soviet DRLO aircraft in the West were talked about in 1986, after visiting M.S. Gorbachev of the Kiev Mechanical Plant, where at the Gostomel airfield, promising aircraft models were shown to the General Secretary of the CPSU Central Committee. At the same time, the tail end of the aircraft carrying the symbolism of Aeroflot with radar radome fell into the lenses of cameras and camcorders.



The economic difficulties that the economy faced in the late Soviet period had a negative impact on the fate of An-71. In 1990, work on the An-71, which reached a high degree of readiness, was frozen, and after the collapse of the USSR, in the conditions of loss of financial and economic ties, they were not returned. Although from the point of view of common sense, relatively inexpensive DRLO airplanes of the operational-tactical link are even more necessary for our country than the heavy A-50, mostly idle at the airfield. Having good take-off and landing characteristics and acceptable operating costs, the An-71 could be used as an operational means of enhancing control over the air situation during a “special period” or during local conflicts. During the two Chechen campaigns and the armed conflict with Georgia in 2008, extremely expensive ARLO A-50 aircraft had to be used to guide the actions of combat aviation.



According to American sources, at the beginning of the 2000s, Ukraine was negotiating with India on the possible supply of upgraded An-71 at a price of $ 200 million for one aircraft. At the same time, the Kiev enterprise "Kvant-Radiolocation" undertook to develop a new radar "Kvant-M" with a range of detection of low-altitude targets to 370 km. At the same time, the number of goals followed was to reach 400 units. However, the deal was never concluded. Most likely, the Indian representatives failed to obtain assurances that Ukraine is indeed capable of fulfilling its obligations.

Since 1979, in OKB AS Yakovlev, where traditionally engaged in vertical takeoff and landing of sea-based aircraft, studies were conducted on the DRLO deck aircraft. The main difficulty in creating such a machine, based on the peculiarities of the Soviet aircraft carriers, was the rise of the aircraft into the air in the absence of a catapult on the deck. For this purpose, the thrust of the aircraft, which could spend on patrols 4-5 hours, had to be very high. Initially, the aircraft, designated Yak-44E, provided for the installation of four additional take-off turbojet engines and two cruise missiles. According to the technical task, coordinated with the Navy, the radio-technical complex was to detect air targets at a distance of 150 — 200 km and direct ship fighters at them. The detection range of surface targets - more than 300 km. When stored on a ship, the wing wings folded. The number of crew Yak-44E in the original version - 4 person.

However, the placement of four lifting engines and additional fuel did not leave room for the cumbersome radio engineering complex and normal operating conditions for operators. Yes, the very onboard radar and communications equipment was created with great difficulty. It soon became clear that this version of the DRLO deck aircraft is a dead end, and the project has undergone processing.

On the plane of the updated project, they decided to abandon the additional lifting engines, which were in flight a “dead” cargo. The thrust of the aircraft was increased by installing two new turbofan engines D-27 with 14 000 hp. The choice of this type of engine was due to the fact that at a sufficiently high subsonic cruising speed it had a significantly better fuel efficiency than the available turbojet engines. In addition, in comparison with the turboprop engines on take-off mode, it provided the best traction characteristics, thrust-to-weight ratio and increased lifting force due to the blowing of the wing.


Comparative dimensions of DRLO E-2 Hawkeye, Yak-44 and An-71 aircraft


We decided to use the prospective E-700 radar with an antenna in a disk-shaped rotating radome 7,3 with a meter on the pylon above the aircraft fuselage as an onboard circular radar. At the same time, the Soviet carrier-based DRLO aircraft began to resemble the American Hokai very strongly, but at the same time it was somewhat the largest.


Full-size model of the Yak-44E


In the summer of 1989, work entered a phase of practical implementation of the project. The first step was the manufacture of a full-size constructive-technological model of the aircraft and a reduced model for radio engineering research and preparation for the construction of prototypes.


Yak-42LL


For flight tests of aircraft engines D-27 prepared flying laboratory Yak-42LL. The construction of prototypes Yak-44E and its mass production was to be conducted at the Tashkent Aviation Plant. In the future, it was planned that this machine will also be supplied to the Air Force.


Photo for memory. After completion of testing the Yak-44E on the Tbilisi-carrying aircraft cruiser

In order to assess the possibility of deploying the Yak-44E on the flight deck and in the hangar of the Tbilisi-carrying aircraft cruiser, a full-size mock-up of the aircraft in August 1990 was taken by barge aboard a ship that had been tested in the Sevastopol area. During testing, the possibility of placing the aircraft in the inner hangars, rolling out of the lift and lifting out of the inner hangars, towing and mooring the aircraft on the flight deck and in the hangar, and connecting the aircraft with technical support posts were checked. After the evaluation program was completed, the model was returned to the assembly department of the Yakovlev Design Bureau. After testing the layout of the first prototype took place.

According to design data, the aircraft with a maximum take-off weight of 40 000 kg could reach a maximum speed of 740 km / h. Cruising speed - 700 km / h. Landing speed - 185 km / h. Practical ceiling - 12 000 meters. The duration of patrols at a distance of 300 km from the aircraft carrier in the 500-650 km / h speed range is 5-6 hours. Crew: 2 pilot, 2 RTK operator and guidance officer. Compared with the An-71, the deck Yak-44 was distinguished by a very dense layout.


Layout Yak-44


In the future, to increase the duration of stay in the air, the plane had to get a refueling system. On the basis of the Yak-44E glider also designed deck anti-submarine aircraft and tanker.

E-700 radio complex provided stable detection of air targets against the background of the underlying surface at a distance of 220-250 km, depending on the ESR. Surface targets could be detected at a distance of up to 400 km. The Yak-44 equipment could simultaneously accompany 150 targets and direct 40 fighters at them.



Although the full-scale Yak-44E mock-up was successfully tested on board the 1143.5 aircraft-carrying cruiser, it was clear that on this ship, which also did not have a catapult, the carrier-based AWACS would be too crowded. In total, the wing of the aircraft carrier should have been up to 4 AWACS aircraft and 2 refueling aircraft. Therefore, the design of the deck "radar picket" before the program was closed was mainly carried out in relation to its placement on the nuclear aircraft carrier pr.1143.7 Ulyanovsk. This modification, designed to launch from a catapult, received the designation Yak-44RLD. Unlike the ship now bearing the name Admiral fleet Soviet Union Kuznetsov ”,“ Ulyanovsk ”was to become a full-fledged aircraft carrier with roomy internal hangars and a steam catapult. Its planned commissioning was planned for 1995.

The nuclear aircraft carrier of the Ulyanovsk type could become the first Soviet aircraft carrier, not inferior in size and capabilities of the air group to the American atomic multi-purpose aircraft carrier of the Enterprise and Nimitz types. Installation of steam catapults and the ability to raise DRLOiU aircraft significantly expanded the functions of the ship in comparison with the previous Soviet aircraft-carrying cruisers. In the option of providing air defense of the squadron onboard the Ulyanovsk, it was planned to deploy the 36 Su-33 and 8 Yak-44.


So could look atomic aircraft carrier "Ulyanovsk"


However, after the collapse of the USSR, the construction of the aircraft carrier Ulyanovsk at the shipyard in Nikolaev stopped, and with a readiness level of about 20% the ship's hull was dismantled in 1992 year. At the same time, the government of the “new” Russia stopped funding the Yak-44 program, and this very promising DRLO aircraft was never built. Since the enterprise engaged in the creation of the “front-line” An-71, turned out to be in a “independent” Ukraine, and with the refusal to finance the machine that has become foreign, one can somehow agree, the Yakovlev Design Bureau remained in Russia, and in our country there were all opportunities for the construction of prototypes and fine-tuning to mass production of the Yak-44. Without a doubt, this universal aircraft would be in demand not only in the navy, but also in the air force.

If the An-71 reached the stage of building prototypes, and the Yak-44 was built in the form of a full-size mock-up, then the P-42 aircraft developed by the GM Design Bureau. Beriev in Taganrog, has not left the project stage. This universal aviation platform superficially resembled the American deck-based anti-submarine aircraft S-3 Viking. On the basis of the P-42 was supposed to create an aircraft PLO, tanker, search and rescue, transport and AWACS. Such an approach could save production costs and accelerate the development of flight and technical composition. Like the Viking, it was a monoplane with a top wing of moderate sweep. Two TRDD D-36 located under the wing, the console which could be folded. The keel of the project was also foldable. The plane was supposed to be launched using a ship's catapult and land using an arresting vehicle. It was a fairly compact aircraft with a maximum take-off weight of 29 000 kg and a crew of three people. Its maximum speed was to exceed 800 km / h. Patrol time at a distance of 300 km from the ship - 2,5-3 hours.


The design appearance of the aircraft DRLO P-42


The construction of the prototype was scheduled for 1976 year. It was assumed that the P-42 will be part of the wing of aircraft carriers with a nuclear power plant, etc. 1160 "Eagle". The development of this project was conducted from the end of 60-s in Nevsky PKB. By the middle of the 80-x of the Soviet Navy was to receive three such ships. However, the construction of aircraft carriers with a nuclear reactor was considered too costly, and in 1973, all work was curtailed in favor of the further construction of ships 1143 Ave. Work on the aircraft family P-42 on the paper stage is not advanced.

To be continued ...

Based on:
http://www.yak.ru/DOCS/yak-44.pdf
http://coollib.net/b/166009/read
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/an-71.htm
http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-673.html
http://www.telenir.net/transport_i_aviacija/otechestvennye_samolyoty_i_vertolyoty_drlo/p14.php
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45 comments
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  1. +6
    April 6 2017 15: 23
    These are the workhorses our Air Force needs. I think that the current state of the electronic industry already makes it possible to make such an aircraft with an AFAR locator. It remains to master the base plane. So far, none of the promising for such tonnage is suitable. IL-112 and 114 are rather weak, but a less powerful AWAC can be made. You can also consider the "civilian" version of the AWACS-100 with a log on the roof.
  2. +8
    April 6 2017 15: 45
    Sergei! Thank! I read this article and it became gloomy at heart that they could not bring to the adoption of these aircraft for a simple banal reason, the collapse of the economy, tied to the export of raw materials.
    The article is interesting and you can see the prospects for the development of aviation in this direction.
    1. +7
      April 6 2017 16: 26
      Sergey, welcome hi Everything is more interesting and interesting.
      Nikolay, the prospects are visible, but will this be done with our crumbling economy?
      1. +4
        April 7 2017 06: 17
        Quote: EvgNik
        Sergey, welcome

        Hi Eugene!
        Quote: EvgNik
        Everything is more interesting and interesting.

        Thank! I try, as far as possible.
        Quote: EvgNik
        prospects are being seen, but will it be done with our crumbling economy?

        In addition to problems with the economy, over the years after the collapse of the USSR, many key technologies and personnel were lost.
        1. +3
          April 7 2017 06: 43
          after the collapse of the USSR, many key technologies and personnel were lost

          Sergey, personnel and technology are lost throughout the industry. And many that survived are simply not in demand. There are no jobs for them in our economy.
        2. +2
          April 7 2017 11: 37
          Quote: Bongo
          In addition to problems with the economy, over the years after the collapse of the USSR, many key technologies and personnel were lost.

          Technology, yes, and most importantly, the subtleties of the profession. How much I read and even in my life I came across such nuances. And without this, it is not always possible to do quickly and efficiently. How did one turner ask us? Are you fast or high quality? This is the salt of the profession.
        3. +3
          April 10 2017 15: 40
          Sergey, huge thanks for the material and for the photos and for the analysis hi these 3 planes are very exciting wink lovers of aircraft carrier topics soldier
          I read about the option with two antennas, and unfortunately also without details request what was the idea there?
          it’s still not very clear - as a result, all 3 variants of AWACS aircraft assumed the same radar option (E-700 aka Quantum ...)?
          1. +3
            April 10 2017 16: 15
            Quote: A1845
            I read about the option with two antennas, and unfortunately, also without request details, what was the idea there?

            This option was functionally similar to the British Nimrod AEW.3 AWACS aircraft (the line will reach it too). The British decided to use two antennas in the nose and tail of the fuselage. According to British experts, this arrangement significantly reduced weight, improved the aerodynamics of the aircraft and eliminated the presence of “dead zones” resulting from shading from the fuselage, wings and tail. The main element of the British radar complex was the AN / APY-920 radar with two dual-frequency antennas 2,4x1,8 m in size.
            1. +2
              April 10 2017 16: 36
              Look forward to laughing
  3. The comment was deleted.
    1. +6
      April 6 2017 18: 40
      Quote: mvg
      Quote: Zaurbek
      These are the workhorses our Air Force needs. I think that the current state of the electronic industry already makes it possible to make such an aircraft with an AFAR locator. It remains to master the base plane. So far, none of the promising for such tonnage is suitable. IL-112 and 114 are rather weak, but a less powerful AWAC can be made. You can also consider the "civilian" version of the AWACS-100 with a log on the roof.

      ZaurBek, maybe all the same to the mountains, and sheep with goats to graze? Anything more interesting!

      Why are you rude? Zaurbek’s idea is quite sound, based on the availability and prospects in transport aviation. A-100 is not cheap, and the range of tasks will often be redundant.
      1. +7
        April 6 2017 18: 41
        To the author + and respect for an interesting article.
    2. 0
      April 6 2017 19: 51
      I can get you ... did you miss the herd?
  4. +2
    April 6 2017 19: 10
    I would like to ask the author to cover also the AWACS of other countries, Israel, Sweden, etc. Thank you for the excellent review. I have a dream that, like this wonderful series, it would be scrupulous for both airborne and ground-based radars and with the history of creation to the present day, I know this is hard work but it’s all the same.
    1. +5
      April 7 2017 06: 22
      Quote: merkava-2bet
      I would like to ask the author to cover the AWACS of other countries, Israel, Sweden, etc.

      The turn will certainly come to this ...
      Quote: merkava-2bet
      Thanks for the great review.

      You are welcome! Glad I liked it! hi
      Quote: merkava-2bet
      I have a dream that, like this wonderful series, it would be about aviation radars and ground-based radars, as well as meticulously with the history of creation to the present day, I know this is hard work but it’s all the same.

      I'm afraid that I will not pull such a voluminous work ... request Publishing articles on VO is just a hobby to which I cannot devote more than 2-3 hours a day. And the proposed by you, certainly an interesting topic for a narrow circle, the bulk of readers will not be interested. On average, 6-7 thousand people read articles on AWACS.
    2. +3
      April 7 2017 13: 35
      Quote: merkava-2bet
      I have a dream that, like this wonderful series, it would be about aviation radars and ground-based radars, as well as meticulously with the history of creation to the present day, I know this is hard work but it’s all the same.

      Quote: Bongo
      I'm afraid that I will not pull such a voluminous work ...

      I understand Sergey and I want to recommend the books of M. M. Lobanov
      http://www.vixri.ru/d/Lobanov%20M.M.%20_%20Razvit
      ie% 20sovetskoj% 20radiolokacii.pdf
      "We are military engineers"
      http://www.vixri.ru/d/Lobanov%20M.M.%20_Nachalo%2
      0radiolokacii% 20.pdf
      At least, you will learn a lot from the history of the creation of air defense technology. Sergey’s articles are a very good addition to the foundations of history that M.M. describes in his books. Lobanov. He is one of those who stood at the origins of our radar.
  5. +3
    April 6 2017 21: 18
    Such aircraft would revolutionize the combat use of the tactical level air force and increase their export potential.
  6. +1
    April 6 2017 23: 55
    Aircraft AWACS - FSO bully

    Full-angle Chinese ZGRLS on the artificial island of Subi of the Spratly archipelago in the South China Sea

    1. +4
      April 7 2017 03: 52
      So mattresses "vNidYmki" - FSE? Not to mention even the thought of using AUG against the Chinese. laughing Is it possible to “suddenly” bomb this radar from submarines, only the Chinese can count on such a thing as “they declared war” and melt what is at sea and Japan at a cost. So I think the mattresses - got it finally. soldier
    2. +4
      April 7 2017 06: 54
      Quote: Operator
      Full-angle Chinese ZGRLS on the artificial island of Subi of the Spratly archipelago in the South China Sea

      And with what efficiency and accuracy is the ZGRLS capable of measuring the speed, altitude and range of an air target? What is the noise immunity of overseas stations? There is no point in talking about mobility and vulnerability. One way or another, it is a means of observing mainly naval peacetime targets, and it is at least strange to contrast ZGRLS to AWACS aircraft.
      1. +2
        April 7 2017 07: 27
        Quote: Bongo
        contrasting ZGRLS with AWACS aircraft is at least strange.

        An operator, such an operator ... smile
      2. 0
        April 7 2017 10: 31
        Bongo

        In FIG, with "accuracy" to measure the speed, altitude and range of an air target with the mandatory (in the case of over-target designation) the use of anti-aircraft missiles with active RGSN? It is enough to determine the coordinates of the target with an accuracy of 1 km. The speed of the target is measured by the Doppler effect with an accuracy of 10 km / h.

        How do you imagine setting a decameter interference against a ZGRLS with a power of several hundred megawatts and an antenna area of ​​a hundred hectares - in the form of building the same ZGRLS?

        What does the radar mobility have to do with the case of object-based air defense of islands in the ocean?

        But is a low-maneuverable and luminous Christmas tree like a DRLO aircraft less vulnerable than a ground-based radar covered by an air defense and missile defense system?

        What is a wartime radar - resistant to electromagnetic radiation and air ionization after a nuclear explosion? laughing
        1. +3
          April 7 2017 10: 44
          Quote: Operator
          And in fig, with "accuracy" to measure the speed, altitude and range of an air target with the mandatory (in the case of over-target designation) the use of anti-aircraft missiles with active strategic missile forces? It is enough to determine the coordinates of the target with an accuracy of 1 km. The speed of the target is measured by the Doppler effect with an accuracy of 10 km / h.


          You are again overly optimistic, in no country are ZRLSs used as a means of issuing target designation of air defense systems. It would also be interesting to me, and probably many others, to learn about Chinese and Russian anti-aircraft systems with serial SAM on which an active strategic missile defense system is installed.
          Quote: Operator
          How do you imagine setting a decameter interference ZGRLS with a capacity of several hundred megawatts - in the form of building the same ZGRLS?

          Andrei, you are well aware that the interference immunity of ZGRLS is low. The interference can be set in any range, and what does the power of the radar transmitter have to do with it?
          Quote: Operator
          But is a low-maneuverable and luminous Christmas tree like a DRLO aircraft less vulnerable than a ground-based radar covered by an air defense and missile defense system?

          You want to say that ZGRLS is not lit? But the AWACS aircraft does not stand in one place, has countermeasures, can go to low altitude and is accompanied by cover fighters. And in general, it’s somehow strange to compare ground-based stationary bulky stations with aviation RTKs ... don’t you?
          Quote: Operator
          What is a wartime radar - resistant to electromagnetic radiation and air ionization after nuclear explosions?

          And what about military operations conducted only with the use of nuclear weapons? Did not know... wassat
          Quote: Operator
          What does the radar mobility have to do with the case of object-based air defense of islands in the ocean?
          How did you get the idea that this ZGRLS is designed for object-based air defense?
          1. 0
            April 7 2017 11: 05
            Why conduct a discussion at the level of personal opinion: "in no country are the ZGRLS used as a means of issuing target designation of air defense systems" - they also showed you photos of the Chinese ZGRLS.

            The Chinese HQ-9B air defense system is equipped with missiles with an active strategic missile system.

            Interference with any radar is possible only with the help of a signal source of comparable power and antenna gain - in the case of island ZGRLS, a ship with a large deck area for deploying the antenna and a powerful electric generator must be fitted. The ship will need to be protected from the counter-actions of the islanders with the help of an escort from destroyers and carrier-based aircraft. Those. to the AAG will need to add another AG to protect the source of interference.
            In addition, the interference will be exclusively sectoral - in the azimuth of the location of the ship, which unmasks the possible direction of the attack before it begins.
            What other ways to interfere with ZGRLS are you talking about?

            Departure of the AWACS aircraft at low altitude - this also means its conclusion from working condition. In addition, after launching anti-aircraft missiles, maneuvering in height to a low-maneuverable aircraft will not help.
            How will fighter cover aircraft for early warning aircraft help in the event of its attack by anti-aircraft missiles?

            And what, military operations with the Armed Forces of the People's Republic of China are possible without the use of nuclear weapons?

            Why did you get the idea that the Chinese ZGRLS is intended solely for the detection of surface targets - see TTX ZGRLS "Sunflower".
            1. +4
              April 7 2017 13: 47
              Quote: Operator
              Why conduct a discussion at the level of personal opinion: "in no country are the ZGRLS used as a means of issuing target designation of air defense systems" - they also showed you photos of the Chinese ZGRLS.

              Operator, how do you understand this? How is a ZGRLS photograph a confirmation that a CC is issued from it? Is it really so bad with logic?
              Quote: Operator
              Interference with any radar is possible only with a signal source of comparable power

              Sit down, deuce. Mathematicians, engineers, and me, the humanist, to teach you the basics of physics ....
              The power of the radar signal decreases in proportion to the square of the distance from the source, accordingly it is enough that the interference has an equal or greater signal power IN THE AREA OF THE PURPOSES PROTECTED BY IT! am Those. in proportion to the square of the distance ...
              Operator, if you had deigned to go beyond the views of the “ZGRLS Witnesses” even a little, then you would have realized that if you were right, then the interference would be fundamentally unattainable to the most powerful ground-based radar systems (I’m silent about the ship’s) of the ship.
              Quote: Operator
              In addition, after launching anti-aircraft missiles, maneuvering in height to a low-maneuverable aircraft will not help

              Interference is placed on the radar, leading the missiles to the target and the rocket should be in the "milk". What do you think, if on an AGSN rocket, you don’t need to bring it from the launch site or what? Do you even know a little bit of hardware?
              Quote: Operator
              It is enough to determine the coordinates of the target with an accuracy of 1 km.

              And the coordinates of the ROCKET for its correction and guidance, who will determine - the old man Hottabych? So nailed, Khattaba
          2. +3
            April 8 2017 02: 53
            Quote: Bongo
            Andrei, you are well aware that the interference immunity of ZGRLS is low. The interference can be set in any range, and what does the power of the radar transmitter have to do with it?

            Sergei! Hello! It’s useless to argue with a man; he ran into ARGSN, which “doesn’t eat” interference. Even as it eats and sighting interference leading the rocket aside even as it eats. And a conventional noise generator can serve as a decoy for the attacker. This is a electronic warfare book: http://booksee.org/book/537790
            And the equipment is the “understudy”. It also serves the purpose of radio fighting by covering the subject with false work.
            Appearance was the same as for the S-75, that for the S-125.
            1. +2
              April 8 2017 04: 41
              Quote: Amurets
              Sergei! Hello! It is useless to argue with a man ...

              Hi Nikolay! I understood this a long time ago, therefore, I did not continue to continue the discussion ... it is a pity to waste time in nothing! A man lives in his illusory, parallel world, where American aircraft carriers packs of hundreds of Tu-22М3 and Su-34 carrying Caliber and X-32 in batches, missiles with ARGSN are massively delivered to the VKS, and ZGRLS with unique noise immunity provide high-precision detection with high accuracy long range at all heights. Why argue? In the parallel universe, this is all for sure. wassat
              1. +2
                April 8 2017 06: 19
                Quote: Bongo
                Hi Nikolay! I understood this a long time ago, therefore, I did not continue to continue the discussion ... it is a pity to waste time in the empty

                Sergei! Before writing the comment above, I really diagonally flipped through the literature on interference. And the last book of Siberian University and today I posted the address of the library where there is an interesting book on electronic warfare. Here is the address of the library
                http://booksee.org/book/537790 и по цифровым помехам есть материалы. А ЗАРЛС собирает весь мусор и от надёжной работы фильтров и чёткой работы ЭВМ зависит чёткость сигнала.
            2. 0
              April 8 2017 12: 40
              Amurets, but you do not know how doubles were a mass phenomenon? And then somewhere (in my opinion in VKO.ru) it was alleged that they were delivered very little - just a few dozen
              1. +2
                April 8 2017 13: 36
                Quote: sivuch
                Amurets, but you do not know how doubles were a mass phenomenon? And then somewhere (in my opinion in VKO.ru) it was alleged that they were delivered very little - just a few dozen

                Definitely not in the know, but under the Doubles, during factory repair, the SNR of the first issues which were used for its intended purpose did not make sense
                1. +2
                  April 8 2017 15: 59
                  Thanks, I haven’t even heard of this.
                  1. +2
                    April 8 2017 16: 21
                    Quote: sivuch
                    Thank you, I didn’t even hear about this

                    We had one in the regiment and in another regiment, there a friend served.
  7. +2
    April 7 2017 08: 49
    About the MiG-110 project will not be?
    1. +4
      April 7 2017 10: 25
      Quote: Alex_59
      About the MiG-110 project will not be?

      The project, of course, was interesting, but I did not hear that this machine would be considered as a platform for an AWACS aircraft. request
  8. +4
    April 7 2017 13: 34
    An-71 and Yak-44 even somehow purely visually produce a very favorable impression. It feels like cars could fly. Ehhh ....
    And the article, of course, is a big plus for the author - thank you very much! By the way, I did not know that the An-71 radar was supposed to see up to 200 km against the background of the underlying surface.
    1. +2
      April 8 2017 02: 01
      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
      An-71 and Yak-44 even somehow purely visually produce a very favorable impression. It feels like cars could fly. Ehhh ....
      And the article, of course, is a big plus and

      The readiness of the An-71 was very large, and the Yak-44 could certainly be brought to mind ...
      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
      And the article, of course, is a big plus for the author - thank you very much!

      Thank you! drinks Andrey, you are doing great too!
      They were the first: the landmark ships of the Navy of the world
      Today I read it with great pleasure! good
      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
      By the way, I did not know that the An-71 radar was to be seen against the background of the underlying surface up to 200 km.

      So the developers write, and by and large there is no reason to distrust them, the radar of the Soviet machine was at least as good as the Hokaya radar in terms of energy potential, and by that time we had the means of signal processing.
  9. 0
    April 7 2017 13: 58
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    And the coordinates of the ROCKET for its correction and guidance, who will determine - the old man Hottabych?

    Do not write to me anymore, humanities.
    1. +4
      April 7 2017 14: 10
      Quote: Operator
      Do not write to me anymore, humanities

      I feel sorry for the nonsense. It hurts her. And you flog it and flog it from comment to comment. So you have to tolerate my writings :))
  10. +2
    April 7 2017 22: 13
    There is a bike about Ulyanovsk. Young CIA employees, graduates of Harvard economists, at the request of Reagan, prepared a report for him. That with the inflated pace of armament of the USSR and its weak finances, bankruptcy is inevitable. And the most reliable factor of ruin is a large navy. And the CIA decided to help: through the pseudo-spy-traitor in the USSR, they threw quite real drawings of an aircraft carrier, including drawings of a steam catapult. For Ulyanovsk. But the reality was even ahead of the CIA forecasts, the aircraft carrier did not have time to complete ...
    1. +4
      April 7 2017 23: 55
      Quote: voyaka uh
      There is a bike about Ulyanovsk

      The bike is. And so ... for children :)
      1. +1
        April 8 2017 01: 35
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        The bike is. And so ... for children :)

        In one I do not agree with you that she is "Children's". I read about the fact that she appeared in 1946-1947, when the Americans began to reduce their fleet after WWII and "According to the Marshall Plan" to present one aircraft carrier of the USSR. Once I read a similar bike when our military destroyed the unfinished German aircraft carrier "Count Zippelin," although during the division he got into a group of ships that could be restored and used for its intended purpose.
  11. +1
    April 8 2017 16: 00
    Sergey, do you want to write about military air defense? I can throw off some material
    1. +1
      April 9 2017 03: 41
      Quote: sivuch
      Sergey, do you want to write about military air defense? I can throw off some material

      Igor, the idea is interesting, especially since you have some developments on this topic. But I am very poorly versed in military air defense. You can do a comparative analysis of the S-75 and the Circle or the C-125 and the Cube together. The defeat ranges of these complexes are close, but they are fundamentally different constructively.
      1. 0
        April 12 2017 11: 25
        Sergey, m. , you know, I published an article about the Circle with Murakhovsky, so this is actually a detailed comparison with С -75 (the funny thing is that, in fact, a draft is printed)
        In this case, I had an idea to write about the air defense of a standard Soviet MSD and TD at the beginning of the 90s. That is, first, what was the MSD and TD of that time and how many were there and what were the air defense options at the divisional and regimental levels. Separately, highlight the management and air defense control systems, including mention the maneuver, i.e. its air defense component.
        And only then to compare with the air defense of Iraq (fluently and with obvious neglect) and the air defense of the Amer’s division. I collected more or less material, and then the case got stuck for reasons known to you.
        1. +1
          April 12 2017 14: 58
          Quote: sivuch
          Sergey, m. , you know, I published an article about the Circle with Murakhovsky, so this is actually a detailed comparison with С -75 (the funny thing is that, in fact, a draft is printed)

          I read it and I liked it. good
          Quote: sivuch
          In this case, I had the idea to write about the air defense of a standard Soviet MSD and TD at the beginning of the 90's. That is, first, what was the MSD and TD of that time and how many were there and what were the air defense options at the divisional and regimental levels. Separately highlight the management and air defense control systems, including mention the maneuver, i.e. its air defense component.

          The topic is interesting, but unfortunately it is not a VO format, not many people will read it here, and they may not accept it at all. I would love to participate in this, but this work should be published as a book.
          Maybe you should briefly compare the C-75 with the "Circle", the C-125 with the "Cube", the C-300P with the C-300В?
  12. +2
    April 11 2017 19: 37
    Thank! Great series.

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