Military Review

The main engine for the PAK FA will be developed by 2020

108
OCD (development work) on the main engine for the T-50 fighter is planned to be completed by 2020 g, reports RIA News the message of the general director of JSC United Engine Corporation Alexander Artyukhov.




So far, the prototypes of the PAK-FA fly with the engine of the "first stage" - the "117 product", which has already been launched into mass production, while the main engine of the "second stage" is still being developed.


This year we plan to begin testing in the flight laboratory. It is planned to complete OCD by 2020 year,

- Artyukhov told reporters at the presentation of the MiG-35.

The engine of the “second stage” will significantly exceed the “117 product” in fuel efficiency and specific performance, and in terms of design and technological performance and level of achieved parameters will fully correspond to the world level of the fifth generation engine

- He said.

Recall that the first flight of the T-50 took place in 2010 g, and the first public show in 2011. This year the first batch of the newest aircraft is expected to be delivered to the VKS.
Photos used:
Vladimir Vorobyov / www.airforce.ru
108 comments
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  1. Monster_Fat
    Monster_Fat 27 January 2017 17: 14
    +5
    I remember that the first serial delivery of the new fighter was planned for the 2015 year ... recourse http://rusplt.ru/policy/izdelie_129.html
    1. Odysseus
      Odysseus 27 January 2017 17: 26
      +6
      Quote: Monster_Fat
      I remember that the first serial delivery of the new fighter was planned for 2015 ... http://rusplt.ru/policy/izdelie_129.html

      Take more, initially the "defense managers" even chatted about 2013.
      Really, in combat regiments by 2019-2020 with the engine of the first stage. And somewhere from 2021-2022 with the second stage. This is at best.
      At worst, all planes with an engine of the first stage can be sent to training centers, and wait for the second stage.
      1. FID
        FID 27 January 2017 17: 30
        +15
        Quote: Odyssey
        And somewhere from 2021-2022 with the second stage. This is at best.

        You inattentively read the note .... OCD will be completed in 2020, then tests, then launching into a series ... By then, there will already be other requirements for motors ...
        1. bouncyhunter
          bouncyhunter 27 January 2017 17: 41
          +14
          I join the previous speaker! A new engine for the T-50 was needed yesterday ...
          1. Zaurbek
            Zaurbek 29 January 2017 22: 04
            +1
            even 9 women will not be able to give birth to one child in 1 month .... there is some time for the development and launch of a new engine .. and this is about 10 years.
        2. Samaritan
          Samaritan 27 January 2017 18: 36
          +4
          Bring Poghosyan back!
        3. AID.S
          AID.S 27 January 2017 19: 46
          0
          Quote: SSI
          further tests, further launch into a series ... By then, already other requirements for motors will be ...

          Alas, life makes its own adjustments and will make ... but we can’t be removed from the race, even if the leader has completed his race.
        4. Dormidont2
          Dormidont2 27 January 2017 19: 58
          +1
          with the engine of the first stage, t50 set a climb rate of 384m \ sec
      2. Zheka40
        Zheka40 27 January 2017 23: 04
        0
        Laid out, answer?
    2. Samaritan
      Samaritan 27 January 2017 17: 32
      +6
      YES YOU ARE TAKING ABOUT ...

      And what does all this mean to complete OCD by 2020 ... OCD - KARL ...

      And what to do with all the talkers before that ???

      1. Samaritan
        Samaritan 27 January 2017 17: 36
        +1



        [media = https: //youtu.be/vn_HcOcmSOo]
      2. alexmach
        alexmach 27 January 2017 20: 59
        +2
        It seemed like he was really, really on the way ... Sad.

        ... So you need to use what is and build aircraft with the "engine of the first stage"
    3. Homo
      Homo 27 January 2017 17: 32
      +10
      Quote: Monster_Fat
      I remember that the first serial delivery of the new fighter was planned for 2015 ... http://rusplt.ru/policy/izdelie_129.html

      How much can you carry nonsense? What happened after the announcement of the term 2015? Or, as always, "shevsepropalo" and the global crisis, sanctions, problems in the economy are out of the question! am
      1. vanek77
        vanek77 27 January 2017 17: 48
        +4
        I already wrote posts in our VO. The engine is not a glider, there all nodes and then the engine as a whole must work on the stands, and this time, jumping over which you take responsibility for incidents that could occur at the stand, but occurred during the flight of a fighter. All the set time, the engine and its components should work out at the stands, and this approximately indicates the above terms. That's right, that they decided not to take risks, but to conduct full-scale engine tests. I already forgot where I read about it, but the engineers there were talking there. Most likely at the "Airbase", but there those get lost.
      2. Mordvin 3
        Mordvin 3 27 January 2017 18: 05
        +6
        Quote: Homo
        and the global crisis, sanctions, problems in the economy are out of the question!

        They forgot about oil.
        1. Homo
          Homo 27 January 2017 18: 35
          0
          Quote: Mordvin 3
          They forgot about oil.

          These are also "problems in the economy."
      3. jonhr
        jonhr 27 January 2017 21: 05
        +2
        sanctions for benefit if not mistaken. and the global crisis touched everyone in one way or another. here, even in America, the printing press troit
    4. NEXUS
      NEXUS 27 January 2017 18: 32
      +4
      Quote: Monster_Fat
      I remember that the first serial delivery of the new fighter was planned for the 2015 year ...

      Or shout Hurray! , or vote, the CHEF EVERYTHING FALLS! ... And let's wait at least until the beginning of 19 year ... statements, because they are statements that speak of plans, taking into account the problems for today. And this means that the terms will be reviewed and adjusted many more times and not necessarily to the right.
      You need to end with these screams, and finally start turning on your brains.
      1. Dormidont2
        Dormidont2 27 January 2017 20: 00
        +1
        with the engine of the first stage, the t50 set a climb rate of 384 m / s, which means it is already faster than f22!
      2. Peacemaker
        Peacemaker 28 January 2017 09: 01
        0
        Hooray - it's all gone! Everything is gone - cheers!
      3. sharp-lad
        sharp-lad 29 January 2017 04: 05
        0
        And turning on the brains put both hands to the case.
  2. CRONOS
    CRONOS 27 January 2017 17: 18
    +8
    Wait! But didn’t we all be promised 100500 PAK FA by the 20th year of the year when they were completely ready and serial? For what I hate our talkers from MO, it is for their weaving with their tongue and then the constant demolition of dates and dates. And this is not punished in any way, no consequences go after non-compliance with promises for their future career and work, that would keep their mouth shut and not boast if they are not sure to fulfill what was stated. That's how we live...
    1. VadimSt
      VadimSt 27 January 2017 17: 24
      +15
      Quote: CRONOS
      For what I hate our talkers from MO

      But how many talkers appeared on VO!
    2. ADmA_RUS
      ADmA_RUS 27 January 2017 17: 26
      +11
      They didn’t promise you anything.
      You voiced plans. And 100500 is not who was not going to do because so much is not needed.
      And if you want to change the situation, then you have a great opportunity. Start releasing them. In the meantime, there is only an empty thrill that you seem to hate so much.
      1. CRONOS
        CRONOS 27 January 2017 17: 41
        +7
        Are you Release? To me? Fighters ???! My post was aimed at constant promises from the Moscow Region and this concerns not only the PAK FA, but the entire defense industry as a whole, including the notorious armature, which was promised by the first statements before the 20th year 2k. About the unfortunate AK-12, let's recall that it has been tested for how many years, and the output turned out to be the same 74th, but only in the body kit, of which there are millions in our warehouses (only body kits can be purchased from Zinit) Yes, there’s a lot more that can be remembered for these promises piss off. You do not need to scream gop from year to year if you can not jump in time.
        1. Voyager
          Voyager 27 January 2017 18: 07
          +4
          You should take the habit of operating with real facts, if you are already bringing charges. Firstly, tanks on the armata platform were promised to be put into mass production until 2020. This was discussed by the Moscow Region and UVZ more than once. For what period will the production of 2300 tanks be calculated, no one said or promised. Just about the necessary amount was announced, which should be guided.

          Quote: CRONOS
          the output turned out to be the same 74th

          As for the AK-12, it's generally funny. There is still no way out, in principle, because problems have been discovered and questions are being solved what to do with the new main trunk. The fact that they didn’t accept it was wonderful at all - excellent quality, to be able to give up on time that you are not comfortable and not take it, "since we arrived at the store." That is why old trunks are being modernized for the transition period. You just have to criticize everything and everyone in a row.
          1. alexmach
            alexmach 27 January 2017 21: 05
            +1
            The fact that they didn’t accept it was wonderful at all - excellent quality, to be able to give up on time that you are not comfortable and not take it, "since we arrived at the store."


            This is the only thing that in all this situation can please. If you don’t take it for a long time, then they accept it responsibly.
        2. ADmA_RUS
          ADmA_RUS 28 January 2017 00: 36
          0
          You. Everyone can wag their tongues. But do things weakly?
          And there are two ways:
          1. Kambinizonom. The main thing is to have a useful profession, straight arms and hard work.
          2. A bathrobe. Here you already need a tower and a bright head.
          And again, no one promised anything.
          1. Mordvin 3
            Mordvin 3 28 January 2017 01: 02
            +2
            Quote: ADmA_RUS
            And there are two ways:

            There is also a third way - kastum. Tut must be able to do the most important thing - to drive with your hands and voice plans.
            1. ADmA_RUS
              ADmA_RUS 28 January 2017 09: 11
              0
              Do not even count. Kastums are either former overalls or bathrobes.
              1. Mordvin 3
                Mordvin 3 28 January 2017 09: 48
                +2
                Quote: ADmA_RUS
                Kastums are either former overalls or bathrobes.

                Looks like graduate student Rogozin (who’s the son) has a very bright head. It’s time for our grandchildren to be determined (words of Rogozin-papa).
                1. ADmA_RUS
                  ADmA_RUS 28 January 2017 10: 58
                  +1
                  Argument of kindergarten level.
                  1. Do you personally know Ragozin’s son? Do you know what and how he does it? His contribution? Its benefit or harm?
                  2. In the country, hundreds of companies working in a koperation to create the t-50. For the sake of interest, find out the biographies of their leaders and the heads of workshops, laboratories and design bureaus. And build a Poretto chart at their start in their careers.
                  In the meantime, I see idle talk and resentment of a small child whom the parents did not buy the desired toy.
                  1. Mordvin 3
                    Mordvin 3 28 January 2017 11: 02
                    +2
                    I know his contribution to the development of a chemical enterprise. Zero.
              2. sharp-lad
                sharp-lad 29 January 2017 04: 11
                0
                From not such a distant time, kastumi were born on their own, first a normal baby, then a good student, and at the end (at the exit) a professional boltologist and despised by both bathrobes and overalls.
        3. ver_
          ver_ 28 January 2017 07: 10
          0
          ..and about VNEU on submarines ..
          1. sharp-lad
            sharp-lad 29 January 2017 04: 14
            0
            Do not rash salt on an open wound! We will hope for the best, and since we ourselves can’t do it (I have nothing but a vague concept of VNEU) we will wait.
    3. Voyager
      Voyager 27 January 2017 17: 27
      +9
      As always, Watson, you look, but do not notice (s)

      It is said that the engines of the first stage are already being produced serially. This is a call to the fact that, as promised, the first batches of PAK FA will go with the engines of the first stage, they are quite worthy. In turn, this means a high probability that deliveries will begin to 2020. And about a huge number and 100500 in general, no one has ever promised anything like this. They were calculated on the budget until the 20s by the force of a dozen or two, that actually pah as a little and at the moment will not affect the defense capability.

      And by the way, I have repeatedly said that regular verbal PR of achievements for the future is a consequence of modern economic realities in the world and here, and at the same time a necessity: you need to PR yourself and promise in order to receive support and funding.

      And one more moment. For all critics of the MO about torn dates. Most of the promises even since 2013 were made in a completely different economic situation. At the moment there is no money (s), it is necessary to save and slow down almost all processes. Qualitatively; cheap; quickly. - You always have to choose two out of three. Guess which is better.
      1. MPK105
        MPK105 27 January 2017 17: 38
        +9
        There is no money in the country? Oh, how to swear hunting, when you read such comments ... ..
        1. Voyager
          Voyager 27 January 2017 17: 59
          +4
          And you express your thoughts in the usual literary language, I understand, do not worry.
          1. sharp-lad
            sharp-lad 29 January 2017 04: 17
            0
            Small bonuses to the sole engines of economics and progress!
      2. EvilLion
        EvilLion 27 January 2017 17: 57
        +2
        In fact, the Su-35 uses a simpler version with slightly less traction.
        1. Voyager
          Voyager 27 January 2017 18: 00
          0
          I am aware, but this does not mean that they are unified and produced only because of the conveyor for the Su-35
    4. kepmor
      kepmor 27 January 2017 17: 27
      +6
      Do you really still believe the promises of our government ?????
      Well, you, my friend, "gudgeon idealist" ... everything is as if by the fable, "grandfather Krylov" it turns out .....
      1. CRONOS
        CRONOS 27 January 2017 17: 45
        +3
        Yes, I do not take our word for power, by nature I am more realistic.
        In reality, when this aircraft goes into series with the engines of the second stage, it will have time to become obsolete and will not make such a furore like the same Khryapa in due time.
        1. ADmA_RUS
          ADmA_RUS 28 January 2017 00: 41
          0
          I will upset you. T-50s do not create furore. And it will become obsolete when it lags behind competitors.
    5. Homo
      Homo 27 January 2017 17: 33
      0
      Read above!
    6. uhu189
      uhu189 27 January 2017 17: 45
      +1
      So, why punish something if there is no technical possibility to create something intelligible earlier? For the fact that there is no one to work in factories and nothing? Moreover, they quarreled with Ukraine and the Zaporizhzhya plant fell away. Well, you can always talk about this topic ...
      1. CRONOS
        CRONOS 27 January 2017 17: 57
        +2
        Punish - for talk and not give reasons for the media to brag and speculate. Bragging - always comes sideways when something fails.
        What does the Zaporizhzhya plant making turbines for helicopters have to do with it, when it comes to PAK FA? You have a broken logical chain.
        1. uhu189
          uhu189 27 January 2017 18: 04
          0
          I agree with the boast, there are a lot of it lately.
          Well, if it’s violated - it’s so violated, you know better what the Zaporizhzhya factory did ... hi
        2. ADmA_RUS
          ADmA_RUS 28 January 2017 00: 41
          0
          Base?
      2. alexmach
        alexmach 27 January 2017 21: 08
        +1
        And what does the Zaporizhzhya plant have to do with it? Was he developing an engine for PAK FA or something? and when did they start replacing the products of the Zaporizhzhya plant? In 2009?
        1. uhu189
          uhu189 27 January 2017 23: 09
          +2
          Yes, really? A simple chain - if you stopped making engines for helicopters - then you probably need to take measures to establish their production at existing plants in Russia. And the resources of these factories are far from unlimited, so you need to curtail the production of something else and begin to master the production of helicopter engines. It is possible and necessary to increase production capacities, but this is not necessary for the 3 of the year, and not the 5, but all this time some products have to be sacrificed in order to meet current needs. If you have part of the production capacity switched to products that you did not do before - do you think promising engines will be a priority, or those that are needed here and now, without which planes and helicopters will not be able to fly now? Of course, they will try to find a compromise, to sacrifice the development as little as possible, but this will inevitably lead to delays in the release of new products. If I'm wrong - then correct me
          1. alexmach
            alexmach 28 January 2017 00: 14
            +1
            Something is probably right. The only thing is that helicopter engines and engines for fighters are still produced at different plants. But of course, the country's total resources, both labor and financial, are not infinite at all. I don’t understand whether the initial expectations and statements were too optimistic, it happens with the bosses, or we really understood something wrong, or the sanctions actually work.

            On the other hand, the defense industry now faces enormous challenges, so is there anyone to answer these challenges - a question.
  3. Knight Rider
    Knight Rider 27 January 2017 17: 19
    +2
    It turns out that until 2020 we will not see this aircraft in combat units.
  4. Voyager
    Voyager 27 January 2017 17: 22
    +5
    But we will have time for the Su-35 and now it is already possible to buy more Mig-35s. Also excellent, decent and strong cars.
    1. Aaron Zawi
      Aaron Zawi 27 January 2017 18: 13
      +1
      Quote: Voyager
      But we will have time for the Su-35 and now it is already possible to buy more Mig-35s. Also excellent, decent and strong cars.

      MiG-35 in the Russian Aerospace Forces is absolutely not needed. This machine is exclusively for export. A very successful export product.
      1. Voyager
        Voyager 27 January 2017 20: 23
        0
        Argument please.
        1. Aaron Zawi
          Aaron Zawi 27 January 2017 20: 53
          +4
          Quote: Voyager
          Argument please.

          In the Russian space, a heavy fighter is always preferable to a light one. Once the main line of confrontation was mainly in the center of Europe, where the distances from a possible collision to airfields were much shorter. There was a place for a light car.
          1. iConst
            iConst 27 January 2017 21: 52
            +2
            Quote: Aaron Zawi
            Quote: Voyager
            Argument please.

            In the Russian space, a heavy fighter is always preferable to a light one. Once the main line of confrontation was mainly in the center of Europe, where the distances from a possible collision to airfields were much shorter. There was a place for a light car.

            Voyager, our "friend" Aron hints that now the maximum that Russia can claim is to fend off NATA in the Urals region. Bo as the European part in terms of distances has not changed.

            Do not listen - the second message is that he, the son of a God-chosen people, is one hundred times smarter than, for example, the entire Russian government, as well as all expert councils.

            There is a heavy fighter, which means there must be a light fighter - each performs its functions. Everything is fine.
            Mercosa proclaimed the end of the era of "dog dumps" - stealth and missile weapons are at the forefront.
            We will see ...

            Dogs: although timid voices are being heard now because of the "hillock": have we not got excited with this new thing as with Star Wars?
            1. Voyager
              Voyager 27 January 2017 22: 35
              +1
              Dear, I won’t get personal, but I’ve heard everyone. In this case, I am interested in the strange approach that once a country is big, then the fighter must be appropriate. What is the point?
              In the first regions, we have many and diverse ones, as far back as the USSR, the 29th was built, because in some places their placement was more convenient and simply more economically advantageous. Now the situation has not changed much. Apart from all the other Mig-35s, it will be economically more profitable in the same way.
              Secondly, I have said it before, and I will repeat it now - if Mig understands that he can supply fighters to the domestic market, then there will be some kind of “struggle” with Sukhoi for a more promising option. And this is always progress and technological stimulation of each other.
            2. Parsec
              Parsec 28 January 2017 01: 39
              +1
              Quote: iConst
              Mercosa proclaimed the end of the era of "dog dumps" - stealth and missile weapons are at the forefront.

              Another round of the spiral.
              It was in the late 50s when they decided that a radar on board and a missile with a radar or infrared seeker solves all issues of air combat.
              F-4 breakthrough aircraft, for the first time able to find air targets beyond the pilot's view, is armed only with missiles, air combat, consider it won in advance! The time for dog dumps has passed! Start from afar and cheers!
              MiG-21, initially with two guns, then with one, then you need to go to the forefront of progress - remove the guns, missiles will do everything!
              The war showed that the concept was erroneous; But its adoption was justified by successes in radiolocation, rocket science, electromechanics, miniaturization, and they saw prospects ...
              1. Zaurbek
                Zaurbek 29 January 2017 22: 09
                +1
                on the MiG-21 of the later series, in the end they put the GSh-2-23 under the fuselage
          2. Zaurbek
            Zaurbek 29 January 2017 22: 07
            +1
            Europe attacked Russia on a large scale 4 times, what will prevent it from doing it again?
  5. Banishing liberoids
    Banishing liberoids 27 January 2017 17: 25
    +2
    What kind of nonsense the engine is ready, it’s already being done right away, it’s undergoing tests, it’s just being worked out, you already have to decide what exactly to lie to us. The hike with the engine hovered, and the plane turns into unfinished building.
  6. Yeraz
    Yeraz 27 January 2017 17: 26
    +1
    How many throats tore here .....
  7. erased
    erased 27 January 2017 17: 26
    +16
    MIG-35 and SU-35 praises are the other side of the problems with the PAK FA T-50. The glory of the T-90M / AM, as well as the hosanne choir for the T-72B3, is still unprepared for serial deliveries of the T-14 Armat (for various reasons, including financial). The joy of the BTR-82 and the combat modules for the BMP-2/3 is the absence of Kurganz -25 and Boomerang. Together with the problems (theft, E!) With engines for rockets, all this is called in one word - a complete and unconditional ass! In education, science, control system, search and punishment system of criminals. And if shorter - the inability of the state to fulfill its duties! The owners of the Russian Federation have considerable ambitions. But apart from this, they have nothing. Only sawing, stealing, taking out and ... destroying the Russian people.
    Nowhere to get quality production and proper financing. Just out of nowhere. Alas. Or cheers. To choose from ...
  8. Vita vko
    Vita vko 27 January 2017 17: 36
    +2
    The tendency to delay mass production is very alarming. By the 20th year, the USA, Japan, Israel, some EU countries will already have several hundred F-35s of various modifications. But you still have to do the export version of the T-50. I am sure that by the 20th year in the USA, the next generation of aircraft will be tested in full.
    1. uhu189
      uhu189 27 January 2017 17: 52
      +4
      We must proceed from realities, and not from desires. We do not have the technological capabilities to do something earlier. This is a complex problem, and to solve it only by investing in the development of the engine, but without investing in anything else is not possible. The country has created such conditions that industry is not commercially profitable. Since industry is not profitable, there is none. There is only one that works for state. orders where the commercial component is not so strong, but the RFPs are not at all competitive there. There is no industry - there is no demand for qualified engineers, there is no demand for engineers - there is no need for education, and there is no education - there is no future, there are not so many people in such a primitive economy, therefore, well-developed healthcare is also needed ... This is a very primitive logical chain, but she explains a lot
    2. Blackmokona
      Blackmokona 27 January 2017 18: 53
      +3
      They already have several hundred F-35s.
      1. Aaron Zawi
        Aaron Zawi 27 January 2017 19: 14
        +1
        Quote: BlackMokona
        They already have several hundred F-35s.

        No more than 200 and only 48 in combat units.
        1. Blackmokona
          Blackmokona 27 January 2017 19: 26
          +2
          200 as of January 2017

          Now more.
        2. sharp-lad
          sharp-lad 29 January 2017 04: 31
          0
          At the same time, combat readiness is in question.
    3. sharp-lad
      sharp-lad 29 January 2017 04: 24
      0
      If everything goes along the path of F 35, then the sixth generation Americans will finish thirty years after adoption, and then upgrade for another half century.
      1. Zaurbek
        Zaurbek 29 January 2017 22: 10
        0
        the 5th generation will have a longer life than the 4th ... 50-70 years. there will be no such generational change.
  9. VladimS
    VladimS 27 January 2017 17: 40
    +2
    Quote: kepmor
    Do you really still believe the promises of our government ?????
    Well, you, my friend, "gudgeon idealist" ... everything is as if by the fable, "grandfather Krylov" it turns out .....

    What does your government and the functionaries of the MO have to do with it? Yes, and they say something, not from the ceiling, basically.
    As well as the fact that such statements and "announcements" are based on a double / triple purpose ...
    And not your mind, business!
    Take a look around ... Remember the PR masters from other states ...
    Yet again! Tell me everything, but show me ...
    Not your holiday! Relax.
  10. VladimS
    VladimS 27 January 2017 17: 45
    +2
    Quote: Exorcist Liberoids
    What kind of nonsense the engine is ready, they are already doing it with might and main, then it is undergoing tests, it’s only being worked out, decide already what exactly you are going to lie to us.

    In order not to angrily spit, you need to monitor the necessary information regularly.
    And do not put everything in one heap with shouts: delirium, deceived, decide ...!
    1. Banishing liberoids
      Banishing liberoids 27 January 2017 18: 28
      +2
      Vladimir, I’m in Russian, I think this isn’t scary? Look at the latest articles on this topic here, on the VO-wagon of statements that he’s sure tomorrow .... It seems like this year at least 5 serial promised to the troops ... Also from the category of fairy tales obviously ... And, most importantly, I do not spray my saliva, a pretty balanced and calm person!
  11. VladimS
    VladimS 27 January 2017 17: 58
    +1
    Quote: Vita VKO
    I am sure that by the 20th year in the USA, the next generation of aircraft will be tested in full.

    Exactly, exactly! And not from a good life.
    F 35 in a series, with the intended amount will not go!
    Stock up on popcorn and patience.
    1. Sidak
      Sidak 28 January 2017 00: 26
      +1
      There is no popcorn ... Khrushchev is over. Neither in the USA nor in the Russian Federation there will be breakthrough serial engines and, accordingly, X-generation aircraft .. F-22, this is a PR move ... F-35 .. unsuccessful PR move. T-50 .. from the same series. Noodles on the ears of the layman .. Such aircraft are redundant and do not need anyone in real value. The 5th generation aircraft is still not in nature in anyone. Who will prove the presence of cruising supersonic in the F-22 ..... ????
  12. Just a man
    Just a man 27 January 2017 18: 37
    +3
    Do not escalate the situation and your nerves. In the last 4 years, colossal work has been underway to develop new military equipment. Of course, we are often justly unhappy with the timing and scale. But in this case, everything is normal and not critical. In fact, the main engine for the pack has been developed and several copies undergo the necessary verification steps. The other day, designers, developers and managers of a number of revolving enterprises and design bureaus received big bucks ... from Putin and Rogozin with a hint of the possible development of a chopper for hilling reindeer moss in the tundra. The main issue was quality, organization and money-grubbing. Priority was designated in favor of quality and reliability with the consent to some postponement of serial production of individual samples. I also often and harshly criticize our government, but here now we are not at all bad and the prospects are good. So everything will be almost on time. Of course, it would not hurt to hang a few effective managers, but so is democracy, freedom, European values, etc.
    1. sharp-lad
      sharp-lad 29 January 2017 04: 27
      0
      it would be nice to hang some effective managers,
      At least just to shoot .... Introduce real responsibility for the "headbanging" and rampant unjustified ambitions!
  13. Vadim12
    Vadim12 27 January 2017 18: 41
    +4
    By then, it will be easier to buy from the Chinese. Just by that time learn. Then it will be postponed to the 2025th, and so on.
    1. sharp-lad
      sharp-lad 29 January 2017 04: 42
      0
      So far, the Chinese are buying advanced equipment from Russia, and not a turn. At the expense of the electronic base - thanks to the collapsed USSR, here you are buying the fruits of Western developers in China, but they could be at the level, or even higher (I recall the Soviet Elbrus and not only).
  14. Großer feldherr
    Großer feldherr 27 January 2017 18: 46
    +6
    That feeling)
    How much dirt poured out on me in an article about the T-50, in the subject that the engine will not be ready for the series in 2016.
    I did not comment on similar topics in the horse of 2016, but I saw how the local inhabitants simply exhausted everyone who did not believe that the engine simply could not go into production in 2017.
    And here it is .... at first I also thought to pass by, but could not resist.
    1. okko077
      okko077 27 January 2017 19: 53
      +10
      Is that all, just dirt? I've been banned forever 3 times. I feel like MacLeod on the forum.
      You want to be torn, very simple. Two replicas: UAVs, as an element of an information system, cannot be bought .... A country that does not have an information field closed by a modern information field cannot create a full-fledged 5th generation aircraft, let alone strike UAVs ... You can only create a platform for a 5th generation airplane. What are China and other countries doing now. This fully applies to the T-50.
      This is not understood not only by 99% of the forum users, this is not even understood by our General Staff .....
      1. Monster_Fat
        Monster_Fat 27 January 2017 20: 16
        +3
        ABOUT! at last! A "closed information field" is the foundation of all military construction in the future and the foundation of the entire "battlefield" in the future. We have no one to understand it there, there even perceive UAV “pilots” as boys playing obscure toys ....
        1. okko077
          okko077 27 January 2017 20: 33
          +4
          We have the level of the 41st year with the introduction of information technology in the army. And the consequences are shining the same. Is that nuclear weapons saves. And from this it is very sad and a feeling of complete defenselessness and insecurity. You look at what is happening in Syria, and alas, you are convinced that you are right. And this is against the background of those who are screaming about our success and that we have everything .... It is very nice to meet a like-minded person on this issue ...
          1. Parsec
            Parsec 28 January 2017 12: 05
            0
            Quote: okko077
            .Very nice to meet like-minded people on this issue ...

            So that's where "Hug and Cry Together" ...
            Yes sweeter than pure tears there is nothing in the world! (with)
  15. Alexandr2637
    Alexandr2637 27 January 2017 19: 56
    +1
    By the time, he will no longer be a masterpiece
  16. Monster_Fat
    Monster_Fat 27 January 2017 19: 56
    +4
    And, it turns out that http://warfiles.ru/show-142444-vks-rf-zhdut-istre
    bitel-shestogo-pokoleniya.html
    It turns out that the fifth-generation aircraft is no longer particularly interesting, they are immediately waiting for the "sixth generation." I am afraid that with the “sixth” generation it will be the same as with the “fifth” -NIKAK. If you read the requirements for the "sixth" generation, then the idea immediately arises - why should you spray yourself "in the little things" - you need to immediately design the "death star", what can be done about it ... wink laughing
  17. Kent0001
    Kent0001 27 January 2017 19: 58
    +1
    Without a new engine, we don’t have a 5th generation airplane, that is, all blah blah blah ......, and the Raptor and F 35 have long been flying.
  18. couch but smart general
    couch but smart general 27 January 2017 19: 59
    +1
    okay .. left behind forever ...
  19. Bronevick
    Bronevick 27 January 2017 21: 53
    +1
    In 2020, the pack fa will have to be written off.
  20. Former battalion commander
    Former battalion commander 27 January 2017 23: 28
    +3
    Again, the same song "about 2020" ... According to the promises of Russian and officials and developers and the government and everyone who is not too lazy to promise something (2020) this year will be a fantastic breakthrough in all areas ... Everyone understands the absurdity of this, but for some reason they pretend to believe ...
  21. Orionvit
    Orionvit 28 January 2017 00: 29
    +5
    Quote: SSI
    By then, already different requirements for motors will be

    What are the new requirements? Aircraft engines, like other internal combustion engines, have almost completely exhausted the reserve for modernization. There is nothing fundamentally new in this area. The engines for the development and production of the 50-60s are still flying and still relevant. At this stage, it is only possible to introduce new materials into the design, in order to reduce weight and increase resource, fuel systems, in order to improve fuel efficiency. Well, new electronic control systems. What do you mean by "new requirements" is not clear to me. Now in the world, if in the process of engine modernization, it is possible to improve its performance by at least a few percent, then they are already shouting about an unprecedented breakthrough. Until they come up with something fundamentally new, they will pass off the well-made old as the new.
    1. Großer feldherr
      Großer feldherr 28 January 2017 00: 41
      +1
      It would be funny ...
      With similar mass dimensions
      Thrust: R-13-300 4100 kgf
      Thrust: AL-41F1 9500 kgf
      At the same time, efficiency is not near.
      The difference in 40 years is even.
      1. Orionvit
        Orionvit 28 January 2017 08: 07
        +2
        Well, what am I talking about. Now make the AL-41F1 two times lighter with the same traction, or two times more powerful with the same mass dimensions, and I'll see. This was possible at the dawn of aircraft engines, but not now.
  22. viktor.
    viktor. 28 January 2017 01: 25
    0
    and in terms of the achieved parameters it will fully correspond to the world level. NOOS our designers, as always, are a cut above bully
  23. 23424636
    23424636 28 January 2017 12: 16
    0
    it’s time to invoke the spirit of the LDP to check the vigilance of some counters from the UEC too numbers are already written freely
  24. stas
    stas 28 January 2017 15: 01
    0
    Quote: Monster_Fat
    I remember that the first serial delivery of the new fighter was planned for the 2015 year ... recourse http://rusplt.ru/policy/izdelie_129.html

    You should always remember - you have to rush when catching flies.
    So do not raise a storm. Everything has its time.
  25. gridasov
    gridasov 28 January 2017 15: 47
    +2
    You listen to Mr. Artyukhin and you understand that all the engines of previous generations were laid down with parameters previously reduced. And now, suddenly, they opened up opportunities to increase both traction and profitability. They took it and could! Nonsense, and only. Engines have always been created at the limit of their potential capabilities. Therefore, knowing the problems of improving these engines, it is easy to see a dead end in the search for solutions. In other words, this means that we need fundamentally new principles of engine operation, and we still need to come to an understanding of this.
    1. Zaurbek
      Zaurbek 29 January 2017 22: 15
      +1
      modern engines (military and civilian) have a number of points that have only recently become available to us: titanium in construction, all-crystal blades, composite blades, plasma ignition, digital engine control system, etc. the AL-31 didn’t have all of this, something appeared on the AL-41. The new motor is a big% of new technologies and this must be given to the mind
      1. gridasov
        gridasov 29 January 2017 22: 21
        0
        In modern engines, the wrong general concept of harmonization of centrifugal processes of rotor rotation and air flow motion vectors .. I have now become more accurate in statements. Therefore, I will say that expensive materials can be replaced by the fact that the process will occur according to other development algorithms. Elementary complex blades are replaced not by the search for technologies to create heat resistance, but this process already speaks for itself that it is ultimate and destructive, but by a fundamentally different approach
        1. Zaurbek
          Zaurbek 29 January 2017 22: 24
          +1
          It seems to me that everything that could be done in modern engines with the help of bypass technologies has already been done. Now it is necessary to master new technological processes and new materials. An example is automobile engines. Do you propose to immediately implement photonic technology?
          1. gridasov
            gridasov 29 January 2017 22: 58
            0
            I propose applying those technologies that are the next step that is accessible to understanding and the level of technological capabilities. In any case, the level of sonoluminescent processes in hydro-gas-dynamic flows is already the initial level of photon technologies. At the same time, the totality of those real physical processes that you get as a result will be sufficient so as not to disrupt the development algorithms. You see, the conversation is not just about a turbine, but about a mechanical device that harmoniously combines the functions and generator of an ultrahigh variable magnetic field, but also a propulsion device in any medium. Therefore, in this device there are solutions to complex processes and how and where the potential derives from the generator, how and where to derive the hydro-gas-dynamic flows, if the dominant function is as a mover. BUT!!! And the most interesting thing is the reactor zone, which is the basis of fundamentally new fusion reactors. In principle, nothing that a person of a modern level of perception would not understand.
            1. Zaurbek
              Zaurbek 30 January 2017 07: 34
              0
              As I understand it, they did just that ... they didn’t make the turbine blades out of composites and made everything out of titanium ...
              1. gridasov
                gridasov 30 January 2017 11: 18
                0
                I admit that I have few prerequisites to be in Russia under the program for the reception of aircraft designers. Therefore, I will try to explain the concept of our idea of ​​a promising aircraft engine.
                Modern aircraft take off creating lift on the wing, dispersing the "body". At the same time, it is elementary to understand that if you create a sufficient speed of air to the wing without accelerating the body. then it will take off. This is understandable. Therefore, this idea is to create an ultrahigh speed of air movement, but at the initial stage, not with respect to the body of the entire aircraft, but with respect to the blades, like wings on the rotor shaft. ". Thus, we solved the problem of a whole complex of issues that are related to the destruction of the wing in the aerodynamic process of air outflow along the surface of its outflow, but in this connection we also examined the processes and causes of the destruction of the blades in the engine. The solution is the simplest. The combustion chamber needs to be removed from the surface the contact with the blade and this contact should only be in a certain area. Everything is exactly the same as in the induction coil when it is connected. But this coil is also a blade. Therefore, the currents of the same direction induced in it by the fact that ionization occurs at its surface at high speed the air flow creates magnetic fluxes that create not only longitudinal vectors, but also spins.This allows the processes of blade polarization to be transformed in such a way that they do not need to be isolated from high temperature, but work in an adequate reaction to polarization processes. There is a scheme and methodology of anal from the processes that lead to the destruction of the blades and the correct formation of processes. Therefore, the conclusion Modern engines do not use the potential dimension of the radius of the rotor. That is, they fight destructive centrifugal processes, and we use them in that it is the radius that contributes to the process of accelerating the flow and converting the air flow. But these are conditions of a reactor in which water or air is transformed as a substance. That is, the conversation is in this aspect as a reactor for converting a substance of a stream of water or air in an open system or closed loop. Therefore, there is an objective reality of talking about a fuel-free process during turbine operation. This is not to say that if the turbine blades are made of a certain material and everything happens in the environment of transformable material of a mobile medium, then this simply repeats the experiments of other physicists seeking to obtain cold nuclear fusion. But we have it in the engine. We have solved not only the dramatic increase in speed, but also the increase in air flow at the inlet and outlet. The issues of how they should work and what bearings should be in the form of new bearings have been resolved. In general, a set of complex issues has been resolved, which can already be embodied in reality and individual elements can be used on modern engines.
                1. gridasov
                  gridasov 30 January 2017 11: 36
                  0
                  In general, that is completely obvious. that modern solutions force us to deal with negative phenomena in centrifugal processes, and for our engine we use this as a very positive aspect. Therefore, the concept of a ramjet engine is not just not productive. but actually makes it impossible to use a whole complex of physical phenomena and effects.