Military Review

Media: "Russian Defense Ministry is going to abandon the Tu-154"

155
The Kommersant publication, citing sources in the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, writes about the plans of the main military department to abandon the further operation of Tu-134, Tu-154 and Il-62М aircraft. These planes have been used by the ministry for passenger transportation for a long time. The publication also refers to the management of aircraft manufacturers.


Based on published "Kommersant" Information can be said that the corresponding order was given by Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu this month. It is known that the moment the Russian Ministry of Defense has 64 aircraft of these models, including 12 Tu-152B-2 (1975-1989 of release years) and 7 Tu-154М (1986-2012 of release). It is noted that the Ministry of Defense, updating the fleet of military aircraft, almost did not update the fleet of passenger airliners.



It was about the possibility of abandoning the Tu-134, Tu-154 and IL-62М aircraft due to the tragedy in the Sochi region, where a passenger plane of the Ministry of Defense of the country fell on December 25. In that tragedy, 92 people died. Until now, the search operation continues at the scene of the tragedy, as well as the investigation into the causes of the disaster.

According to some reports, the Russian Defense Ministry can update the passenger aircraft fleet by aircraft Dry Super Jet 100 и Tu-214. The new order is able to guarantee capacity utilization at the plants in Kazan and Komsomolsk-on-Amur. The release of these aircraft are engaged in "Tupolev" and "Sukhoi Civil Aircraft."
Photos used:
sky Corner
155 comments
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  1. Orel
    Orel 20 January 2017 06: 03
    +3
    Thunder will strike - the peasant is baptized ...
    1. Alex_Rarog
      Alex_Rarog 20 January 2017 06: 13
      +8
      Yes, it seems to me that these old men will serve for another ten years while new sides will be built! It's still not a car for a week you can’t spend a full assembly cycle ....
      1. Titsen
        Titsen 20 January 2017 06: 41
        +3
        Quote: Alex_Rarog
        Yes, it seems to me that these old men will serve for another ten years while new sides will be built!


        Saw the budget notably!

        It is necessary to change undoubtedly, but not also in large quantities!
        1. insular
          insular 20 January 2017 07: 02
          +15
          Quote: Titsen
          but not also massive!

          Massively - bad.
          Single - bad.

          Experts, what do you need? Would you even have voiced the optimal plan in detail and numbers?
          1. pv1005
            pv1005 20 January 2017 07: 09
            +3
            Quote: insular
            Quote: Titsen
            but not also massive!

            Massively - bad.
            Single - bad.

            Experts, what do you need? Would you even have voiced the optimal plan in detail and numbers?

            Sound the option of replacing TU-134Sh and UBL, and we will give you the plan in detail and numbers. Is going? If not, then what do you need?
            1. megavolt823
              megavolt823 20 January 2017 07: 30
              +4
              Plans and figures are possible even for the whole day. It may not be without meaning. 154mu place in museums and on a pedestal. 134 there in places. Whether you like it or not, new planes are not a whim. Have to . Though with numbers, even with letters. Good luck in verbal drawing. hi
              1. pv1005
                pv1005 20 January 2017 07: 44
                +1
                Quote: megavolt823
                Plans and figures are possible even for the whole day. It may not be without meaning. 154mu place in museums and on a pedestal. 134 there in places. Whether you like it or not, new planes are not a whim. Have to . Though with numbers, even with letters. Good luck in verbal drawing. hi

                But on the merits of the question asked (Sound out the option of replacing TU-134Sh and UBL) have something to say? If not, then you
                Quote: megavolt823
                Good luck in verbal drawing
                1. megavolt823
                  megavolt823 20 January 2017 10: 44
                  +2
                  again . for paratroopers.
                  Whether you like it or not, new planes are not a whim. Have to
                  (Sound out the option of replacing TU-134Sh and UBL), as I understand it, it's about a simulator? Seriously ? I’m wondering when the next fighter writes about the fact that you need to deal with 40 summer equipment. necessary. Does he ride an 40 summer car? what persistence? at worst, you can borrow. if we can’t do it ourselves. China lives like this. and in the USSR they did so more than once. and patching pants has a limit. hi
              2. PHANTOM-AS
                PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 10: 55
                +2
                Quote: megavolt823
                154th place in museums and on a pedestal. 134 there in places. Whether you like it or not, new planes are not a whim. Have to

                The thing is that in the USSR there were no such problems, in the sense of replacing one series with another, since any civilian aircraft was also considered from the point of view of using its MO.
                Now, for 25 years of capitalism, the replacement of MO aircraft seems an insoluble task.
                1. megavolt823
                  megavolt823 20 January 2017 13: 49
                  0
                  with the will of the state, everything has always been done. if you don’t have the will, you can use numbers, graphics, any diarrhea can be justified. if necessary, they will find everything, give birth, and with commune. Now, if Stalin reasoned: the country is hungry and deprived. we already spoke German was der Besitzer will (what the owner wants). so do not start around the corner. hi
                  1. PHANTOM-AS
                    PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 17: 27
                    0
                    Quote: megavolt823
                    with the will of the state, everything has always been done

                    Do you now discover WILL at the state?
                    1. megavolt823
                      megavolt823 20 January 2017 19: 15
                      +1
                      I remember 90. I have something to compare.
                    2. megavolt823
                      megavolt823 20 January 2017 19: 17
                      0
                      and Stalin had the will. the rest ................
          2. AUL
            AUL 21 January 2017 22: 36
            0
            Massively - bad.
            Single - bad.
            Experts, what do you need? Would you even have voiced the optimal plan in detail and numbers?
            Well, I had to choose a topic, one of three - either "Hurray!", Or "Drank the budget!", Or about diapers. Well, I chose the topic by typing.
        2. avt
          avt 20 January 2017 09: 27
          +4
          Quote: Titsen
          Saw the budget notably!
          It is necessary to change undoubtedly, but not also in large quantities!

          wassat
          Quote: insular
          Massively - bad.
          Single - bad.
          Experts, what do you need?

          Laurels of a corruption fighter do not let anal sleep. bully Or fool sluggish something. Interestingly different - An-148 with a creak finish and probably still removed from the run, On Tu-204/214 cooperation was killed, and yet Marshal Sergeev planned on their base to make an anti-submarine, an analogue of Poseidon. Tu -334 rotted away, remains from the available series and ... Superbudget from imported components with imported engines, which the French prohibit to force. request Ah! Yes! adherents of the Poe sect will say that type engines are made in Russia! But they will not tell you one detail - the hot zone too ?? bully Well, the IL-114 could be pulled up, but it certainly won’t replace the Tu-154, and even more so the IL-62.
          1. Stas157
            Stas157 20 January 2017 10: 45
            +4
            Quote: avt
            An-148 will be finished with a creak and probably taken off the run

            Quote: avt
            On Tu -204 / 214 cooperation is killed

            Quote: avt
            Tu-334 rotten

            Quote: avt
            he definitely won’t replace the Tu-154

            Do not cry, wipe away the tears!)) Forget about the junk you listed! Progress does not stand still, we have absolutely stunning, ultramodern and safe SSZh-100 and MS-21 aircraft (on the way)!
            A, Tu-154 and Il-62 are wonderful planes, they have adequately served their age and it is time for a well-deserved rest, for storage (in force majeure). By the way, 154 Pak flew on the Tu-92, which is just the SSZ-100 dimension. And everyone would be whole and happy! And, to offer Khokhlyatsky lithaki An-148 - this is generally bad manners!
            1. PHANTOM-AS
              PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 10: 50
              +4
              Quote: Stas157
              Progress does not stand still, we absolutely have absolutely stunning, ultramodern and safe SSZh-100 and MS-21 aircraft (on the way)!

              Are you joking now? what
              1. avt
                avt 20 January 2017 10: 58
                +4
                Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                Are you joking now?

                Noooh! This is the creed of the sect ,, Superbyudzheta " bully
                1. PHANTOM-AS
                  PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 11: 05
                  +4
                  Quote: avt
                  Noooh! This is the creed of the sect ,, Superbyudzheta "

                  "After Poghosyan"? laughing
                  1. avt
                    avt 20 January 2017 11: 20
                    +3
                    Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                    "After Poghosyan"

                    And According to the guru of the sect. bully
              2. Stas157
                Stas157 20 January 2017 12: 03
                +5
                Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                Are you joking now?

                Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                "After Poghosyan"

                Forgive my colleague, but perhaps we disagree on this issue. I am not a supporter of Poghosyan, but I like our new planes. I try to follow them as far as possible. This is a completely different, new level. Superjet is the first aircraft in the digital. New technologies of design and production. New engine. Ah, the MS-21 has a black wing in general! I like the principle by which new aircraft were built - to take all the best that is in the world, and only then gradually localize it at our own enterprises.
                1. PHANTOM-AS
                  PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 15: 18
                  0
                  Quote: Stas157
                  Forgive my colleague, but perhaps we disagree on this issue.

                  My friend, our differences on this topic are just a misunderstanding. hi
                  The fact is that an aircraft with a localization of 30-40% can not serve the needs of the Moscow Region. That’s what it is about.
                  and until MC 21 we still have, as before Berlin.
                  In this sense, my message that there are already certified machines, it remains only to start, but ...., "there is no money, but you hold on here"
            2. avt
              avt 20 January 2017 10: 55
              +1
              Quote: Stas157
              Do not cry, wipe away the tears!)) Forget about the junk you listed! Progress does not stand still, we absolutely have absolutely stunning, ultramodern and safe SSZh-100 and MS-21 aircraft (on the way)!
              laughing fool
              How are you serving the king to the petition, serf ?!
              Once again, an encore, although not a horse feed
              The Italian industrial company Leonardo (formerly the Finmeccanica holding) has finally withdrawn from the shareholders of the Russian company Sukhoi Civil Aircraft, which produces the regional Sukhoi Superjet 100 (SSJ 100) aircraft. The document posted by the SCAC on the information disclosure site on January 9 says that the Sukhoi Aviation Holding Company now owns 100% of their shares. She was able to become the sole shareholder by purchasing 5,53% from Leonardo's subsidiary, World's Wings SA, which has now ceased to be affiliated with the SCAC.
              The Italian partner's withdrawal from the SCAC is explained both by his dissatisfaction with the financial performance of the project and by the increase in Sukhoi's share.
              Well, if the brain has not sat out at all, then try to comprehend
              Quote: avt
              Ah! Yes! adherents of the Poe sect will say that type engines are made in Russia! But they will not tell you one detail - the hot zone too ??

              it actually is for the engine manufacturer. Well, about "import substitution" and the reaction of the DAMA with his demand to substitute import for the serial production of Tu-204SM, well, this
              Quote: Stas157
              Forget about the junk you listed!

              "Suddenly" it turned out
              Just look: There’s nothing to fight at the Twenty-seventh,
              There is no cooperation - it is killed, it can only be collected from the remaining reserve. But this is for intellectuals, not for sectarians - "Superbudget Witnesses"
              1. PHANTOM-AS
                PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 11: 11
                +2
                Quote: avt
                There is no cooperation - it is killed, it can only be collected from the remaining reserve. But this is for intellectuals, not for sectarians - "Superbudget Witnesses"

                Now the government has come up with a new type structure "board" (the name should be specified), which will be above the KLA and ostensibly coordinate dvizhuhi m / s from industrialists, money and science.
                But in general, you, unfortunately, are right, the aviation industry must be built if not again, then situevina is somewhere nearby. hi
              2. Stas157
                Stas157 20 January 2017 11: 16
                +4
                Avt, do you seem to be lost in time somewhere? Although it is clear that for many, life is hard and full of disappointments. Sometimes it becomes a relapse. That’s why you poke Italians for the tenth time in two days? Ah, I already answered that in the second round! Calm down, everyone who is interested already knows this news. I am glad! The Russian share in the project has become more!
                And why are you all procrastinating about our, albeit worthy, but old planes? Maybe you like everything old? Retro? Then do not impose your style on others who prefer technological progress!))
                1. avt
                  avt 20 January 2017 11: 25
                  +1
                  Quote: Stas157
                  . That’s why you poke Italians for the tenth time in two days? Ah, I already answered that in the second round!

                  laughing
                  Oh, it's hard for me! Say again, are you not a demon?
                  Maybe just
                  U, stupid serf ...
                  bully
                  I'm busy, call later!
                  bully
                  Quote: Avis
                  Do not confuse development with production.

                  Be it your way, but the fact remains - the French do not allow anything to do with engines - prohibited by agreement.
                  1. Reviews
                    Reviews 20 January 2017 12: 43
                    +2
                    Quote: avt

                    Be your way

                    This is not "in my opinion", but in fact.
                    And the lie about the "do not give" is also not necessary. For LR, the thrust of the SaMu was increased, the cooperation continues. Will be difficult - you can copy and certify anew like some "Saturn-2018" and modify for fun.
            3. KVIRTU
              KVIRTU 21 January 2017 23: 25
              0
              "absolutely stunning, ultra-modern and safe aircraft SSZH-100"Sarcasm?
              Transferred to him at Sheremetyevo in Krasnoyarsk (from Simferopol).
              "Dear passengers, technical problems, we turn off the power supply for 5 minutes." This is about 23.00. Okay. We sat in the dark. We turned on the power. Disabling the next - already at 20 minutes. Does not start. All back to the terminal. The delay was extended 6 hours per hour. They gave out food coupons 350 rubles. As a result, they flew on it.
          2. Reviews
            Reviews 20 January 2017 10: 46
            +3
            Quote: avt
            Tu-334 rotten

            But they will not tell you one detail - the hot zone too ??

            The "hot zone" is near a nuclear reactor. The GTE has a "hot part". Also. Don't confuse development with production.
          3. Alex_59
            Alex_59 20 January 2017 14: 26
            0
            Quote: avt
            On Tu -204 / 214 cooperation is killed

            No, it’s not that bad until it’s been killed. The new 204-s small batches collected in Kazan and at the Aviastar in Ulyanovsk. Last at present laid down in 2015. Now in various stages of readiness in the construction of about 10 aircraft based on the 204-th. Basically, their orders, "the presidential group" and the Air Force. In particular, under construction in Kazan 4 aircraft for the Air Force, just as the replacement of Tu-154B-2.

            http://russianplanes.net/planelist/Tupolev/Tu-204
            final match.
      2. Baloo
        Baloo 20 January 2017 08: 33
        0
        Until now, the search operation continues at the scene of the tragedy, as the investigation into the causes of the disaster continues.

        http://новости-россии.ru-an.info/новости/крушение
        -tu-154-like-ruined-liner-using-drones /

        An interesting version. To a layman and an amateur, this version with the UAV found under the anapa does not seem fantastic to me. Let the investigation continue until the end, until there is clarity with this version. What is the range of this UAV? Were there really NATO ships, even in neutral waters, from which this UAV could be launched and how it happened that it ended up near Anapa. How reliable is air defense in this area? Any plane requires correct control, is the machine to blame for the death of people or "external influence"? hi
        1. Reviews
          Reviews 20 January 2017 09: 28
          +1
          Quote: Balu

          Curious version.

          Rave. This is a target, not an all-weather interceptor.
          If not limited to the target found, then, all the same, nonsense. It is necessary to reprogram some UAV with an onboard radar so that it rams the Tu-154. In fact, this is a point target, you need to get the needle into the needle. For the sake of some Tu-154, it makes no sense to mess with the artists.
          1. Baloo
            Baloo 20 January 2017 09: 33
            0
            Maybe I don’t understand something, but mass X is the speed squared = energy, or are we bad at school taught physics badly? I am an ignoramus and amateur, but is a two-meter-long object with a jet engine and a mass of at least half a ton when it hits a plane, even if it couldn’t have a large mass, could tear off the landing gear gondola with all the consequences? The main question is different, how did he get so far from the coast of Ukraine? And will there be a comment from air defense? hi
            1. Reviews
              Reviews 20 January 2017 10: 11
              +2
              Quote: Balu
              Is a two-meter-long object with a jet engine and a mass of at least half a ton when it hits a plane, even if a large mass could not tear off the landing gear gondola with all the consequences?

              Are you talking about a target or a hypothetical UAV with a radar capable of seeing high-speed air targets? If the first, then how do you point it in complete darkness at a point target, which is a plane in three-dimensional space?
              What does the "chassis gondola" have to do with it? Look where it is located on the Tu-154 and understand that tear her frontal impact is impossible. How, indeed, any other - its just somnot, but it did not come off.
              And, most importantly - the target is absolutely not damaged.

              The main question is different, how did he get so far from the coast of Ukraine? And will there be a comment from air defense?

              Sea exercises Sea Breez from the summer of 2016.
              1. Baloo
                Baloo 20 January 2017 10: 18
                +1
                This target could be more than one. Say the one that passed by. However, you convinced me.
      3. donavi49
        donavi49 20 January 2017 08: 44
        0
        Well, CSOs can produce 30 + cars / year, and now they are raising 16-19.

        The carcass - yes there, as long as the cycle, while the pace to increase from 0 to at least 6 per year.
    2. jovanni
      jovanni 20 January 2017 08: 59
      +2
      Quote: Orel
      Thunder will strike - the peasant is baptized ...


      Why baptized then! Maybe it's better to control equipment and people? Won on Discovery several times showed the Yu-52 still pre-war construction in Switzerland flies. Carries people. In the mountains!
  2. Comrade Stalin
    Comrade Stalin 20 January 2017 06: 12
    +1
    Dry Super Jet Raw Plane. http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/587f5f549a794795362
    76b7a
    1. insular
      insular 20 January 2017 07: 01
      +3
      Quote: Comrade_Stalin
      Dry Super Jet Raw Plane.

      Link to BC to give a bad taste. But still better than Rain or Echo ...
    2. Reviews
      Reviews 20 January 2017 14: 31
      +1
      Quote: Comrade_Stalin
      http://www.rbc.ru/rbcfreenews/587f5f549a794795362
      76b7a

      Awesome "authoritative" source! :) But even there it is not written that the su-jet is "raw".
      It’s interesting why they didn’t consider raw 767, which in the 30th year from the beginning of the production of pressure locks cracked? And due to the destruction of the hem and the tail can tear. And simply - what the hell didn’t reveal the problem in the first N years of operation?
      So, the conclusion is 767 crude aircraft!
  3. faiver
    faiver 20 January 2017 06: 14
    +5
    clowns, why rush from one extreme to another? Americans still have 707s in operation, and to add the same 154 or ILNXX to the most emergency aircraft due to accidents in Africa or Iran is utter nonsense ...
    1. Nix1986
      Nix1986 20 January 2017 07: 04
      +1
      They, that is, the United States, have been using it for so long, because the service is appropriate. And here, everyone knows what kind of service, you don’t have to go far, there are enough documents on YouTube. Films on criminal cases about theft and replacement of parts for routine repairs of passenger ships.
      1. pv1005
        pv1005 20 January 2017 07: 13
        +4
        Quote: Nix1986
        They, that is, the United States, have been using it for so long, because the service is appropriate. And here, everyone knows what kind of service, you don’t have to go far, there are enough documents on YouTube. Films on criminal cases about theft and replacement of parts for routine repairs of passenger ships.

        Well, of course, there are some bright elves in the same place, and here we are all savages, we can’t distinguish a key from a cotter pin.
        1. Nix1986
          Nix1986 20 January 2017 08: 52
          +1
          There are criminal cases, of which there are many, there are doc films on them - these are facts, leave Tolkien to the elves and orcs, but what about your emotions, well, I don’t know who needs them at all.
          1. Reviews
            Reviews 20 January 2017 09: 38
            +5
            Quote: Nix1986
            There are criminal cases, of which there are many, there are doc films on them - these are facts, leave Tolkien to the elves and orcs, but what about your emotions, well, I don’t know who needs them at all.

            And what your opponent saw from you, besides not even emotions, but simply masochistic cries "everything is bad with us, just by definition!" ? :)
            However, your opponent is right and you write nonsense. There may have been criminal cases, and so what? Everywhere and always have offenders who ogrebayut for it, and "us" and "them".
            So unloved by you "b / u spare parts", this repair units, the normal practice in any country.
            Well, and for a snack - about "the culture of TE in the USA". A Starlifter wing broken during normal refueling. They forgot to open the drain. And how many APs are left behind the scenes?

            That's it for that matter.
            1. Nix1986
              Nix1986 20 January 2017 09: 54
              +2
              What masochistic screams, come to your senses, I just cited data on the existence of criminal cases in this area. In fact, there are statistics of military transport aviation disasters, well, let's say from the beginning of the 2000s, compare our number of disasters and mattresses and human losses, given the fact that mattresses drive their aircraft many times more. The result will not be in our favor. I don’t have a star-striped flag in the toilet or a screensaver on the desktop with Trump, there are just facts.
              1. Reviews
                Reviews 20 January 2017 10: 16
                +1
                Quote: Nix1986
                What masochistic screams, come to your senses, I just cited data on the existence of criminal cases in this area.

                So what? There are criminal cases of pickpocketing. Your conclusions?

                In fact, there are statistics of military transport aircraft disasters, well, let's say from the beginning of the 2000s, compare our number of disasters and mattresses and human losses

                I'm too lazy to dig. You seem to have it. Bring. "Since the early 2000s," I remember only two disasters in the Air Force / VTA - the Il-76 in Makhachkala and the Il-18 in Tiksi. In both, not the technical condition and not the fuel cell are to blame.

                taking into account the fact that mattresses drive their aircraft many times more.

                Then they have it worse than we do. For when he works every day, skills are not lost. Result - see above about the "Starlifter.".
                there are just facts.

                I haven’t seen one yet.
                1. Nix1986
                  Nix1986 20 January 2017 10: 22
                  0
                  I have no goal here to create the feeling that oh, how everything is crappy with us, and someone's over the hill is great. Since the start of the Iraqi campaign, I have not heard that the mattress covers buried the plane and more than 100 people at once, there were losses in helicopters and transport helicopters, but they were shot down, but I don’t remember that a global master or hercules flew and collapsed with a hundred people, although the scale of the transfer of personnel and personnel to participate and support companies in Iraq and Afghanistan can be imagined. And my opinion, purely from myself, about "that used parts in aircraft repair is normal." If you find out that your children will be flying on an airplane with used power plants and chassis replaced, then you will show the same calmness and say "it's okay, let them fly."
                  1. Reviews
                    Reviews 20 January 2017 10: 53
                    +3
                    Clearly, you do not have the facts. Why killing 100 people on this Tu-154 say the investigation, but you, I see in advance all investigated through a seance. Share the results of the investigation - tell it was there that broke due to old age and "bad TE". Do not torment.
                    Quote: Nix1986
                    And my opinion, purely from myself, about "that used parts in aircraft repair is normal." If you learn that your kids fly on an airplane which has been replaced / used power units and chassis - that you show the same calm and say "it's okay, let them fly."

                    You from the first time that it was in my post was not clear what? Except for those that just left the factory, all aircraft of any operator in any country in the world fly with repair parts, components and assemblies: chassis, power plants, systems ... Everywhere you can find a repair ("used" in your language) unit.
                    No need to judge aviation with t.z. your car.
                    1. Nix1986
                      Nix1986 20 January 2017 11: 24
                      0
                      But you also, without waiting for the investigation, concluded that you don’t need to do anything, let everything continue this way. It’s not my task to provide a detailed excerpt of facts with links to sources, I’m not writing articles here and I’m not defending a candidate’s case, but mattresses didn’t have any facts of the crash of aircraft with more than 100 casualties since the company’s start in Iraq. In any case, any catastrophe is the result of human error - designers, pilots or maintenance personnel and to do nothing with it as you suggest, in my opinion, this is not an option. I just gave an example of mattress covers, because they have a high load on flying equipment with fewer accidents, that's all. There is nothing seditious in the chain - I do not see any analysis of the situation, conclusions and corrections.
                      1. Reviews
                        Reviews 20 January 2017 11: 31
                        +2
                        Quote: Nix1986
                        But you also, without waiting for the investigation, concluded that you don’t need to do anything, let everything continue this way.

                        Where did I write this? No wagging only.
                        The rest is your stream of consciousness - no comment.
    2. Vladimir Postnikov
      Vladimir Postnikov 20 January 2017 08: 43
      +2
      Never believe what they say. Think. There was a tragedy. Something must be said. There is also a link to the original to which this article refers.
      Sergei Shoigu instructed to work out the possibility of replacing passenger aircraft Tu-154, Tu-134 and Il-62M with new Russian counterparts, sources close to the leadership of the Defense Ministry, as well as several top managers of the aviation industry, told Kommersant. According to them, this issue was raised in the course of one minister from departmental meetings in the beginning of January, after which it took up his deputy's Arms Yuri Borisov. "Now consultations are underway with the industry, the best options are being selected," the military department added. The press service of the Ministry of Industry and Trade told Kommersant that "no documents in this regard have been submitted to the Ministry from the Ministry of Defense."

      No deadlines. No specific plans. Nothing but talk.
  4. Mavrikiy
    Mavrikiy 20 January 2017 06: 21
    0
    Tu-154 will be handed over to the Syrian Air Force?
  5. Mikhail m
    Mikhail m 20 January 2017 06: 45
    0
    Due to the tragic accident, we will abandon the aircraft. Submarines and missiles in line? In the Moscow Region extra money appeared, nowhere to go? The approach of a typical official.
    1. alexx-fenix
      alexx-fenix 20 January 2017 10: 58
      0
      Maybe it’s right. You can load the manufacturer’s defense capacities with an order of mines. And there, looking at new airplanes and civilians they order. I think few serious companies will immediately want to buy very cheap new models of Russian aircraft construction. This is because you need to retrain Boeing pilots. So the military gives A new chance for domestic passenger aviation.
      1. Reviews
        Reviews 20 January 2017 13: 39
        +1
        Quote: alexx-fenix
        Maybe it’s right. To load the manufacturer’s power defense with an order of mines of defense.

        military give a new chance to domestic passenger aircraft.

        In theory, this looks attractive, but the military specifics over the past 20-30 years have greatly diverged from the civilian. There is a two-member crew, a "glass cockpit" and much more.
        For example, VTA for the Il-76MD-90 never ordered a full-fledged "glass". They just replaced the EMI on painted instruments and left the crew without changes - and a radio operator, and navigator, and bortach.
        In general, they went as far. like marine and land mammals.
        It will be very difficult to introduce the same Su-jet in military aviation. How are things going with replacing the An-26 with the An-140?
  6. Alex_59
    Alex_59 20 January 2017 06: 46
    +13
    A strange decision. The equipment must be operated as it is, and, unfortunately, accidents happen to any aircraft. You might think they will replace them with something new and this "new" will not fall?
    I can still understand the meaning of abandoning the Tu-154Б-2, the planes are not very new, yes. But Tu-154M ... this is strange. The last aircraft for the Moscow Region were assembled in the 2010-2012 years - new, the fly did not sit.
    And Tu-134 is the most reliable aircraft. What to change it to? SSJ - strange replacing half of imported components. But what about the demand "for the military - only their own"? While this SSJ is flying from Domodedovo to all sorts of Adlers, okay, but how will it behave when landing in all sorts of holes like Luostari near Murmansk or somewhere on Sakhalin? Where the stripes are not always perfectly cleaned, where the weather will not allow you to land softly without overloads, etc. Or will be large and expensive Tu-214 to drive a short distance? To the commander of the army from Ekaterinburg to Chelyabinsk flew too will be half empty Tu-214 drive?
    In general, I do not approve. One has already made similar statements here. After the Yak-42 disaster in Yaroslavl. Which is "no money." He said - like, since our planes fall often we will only buy imported ones ... At least stop, at least fall ...
    1. yuriy55
      yuriy55 20 January 2017 06: 56
      0
      and how he will behave when landing in all sorts of holes like Luostari near Murmansk


      I don’t remember that the Tu-134 regularly landed in Luostari ... No. So, if once a commission from LenVo flew in ...
      1. Alex_59
        Alex_59 20 January 2017 07: 02
        +2
        Quote: yuriy55
        I don’t remember that the Tu-134 regularly landed in Luostari ...

        Well, I express so much faith in the best. The airfield seems to be reconstructed - you look and start to land regularly. laughing
        We have enough complicated airfields. Not necessarily this one.
    2. alekc73
      alekc73 20 January 2017 15: 50
      0
      I agree. Tu and Eli are still flying. It is necessary to look at those conditions, not age. Superjet is not our plane. This is a "screwdriver" for 80% of imports. The engines are French. If the sanctions were fully included, we would be left without planes. (Superjet) The MO wanted to change the park at once is a beautiful fairy tale. There is not enough money for combat aviation (with transport in general Shvakh - 40-year-old ANy-12,24,26. That's what needs to be changed immediately). So the old people still fly.
    3. Vadim237
      Vadim237 20 January 2017 17: 29
      0
      Yes, and let half-empty drive - to us what is before.
  7. pv1005
    pv1005 20 January 2017 06: 47
    +5
    And what will replace Tu-134Sh and Tu-134UBL? Or now the navigator and long-range pilots became unnecessary?
    1. Iline
      Iline 20 January 2017 08: 14
      +7
      Listen, you got it already with Tu-134Sh and Tu-134UBL. He himself served in YES, tell us what the pilots flew to in TVVAUL and in Chelyabinsk the navigators before these aircraft? And nothing - then the youth taught. That's the same ...
      Nothing stands still, everything develops. And your planes, cited as an example, are not suitable for training in their equipment bundle. And they are used in the bulk not for training, but for flying commissions to distant garrisons.
      There are new aircraft that can be successfully adapted to new realities.
      1. pv1005
        pv1005 20 January 2017 12: 02
        +1
        Quote: Iline
        There are new planes

        What kind? Superjet? Not a flying MS?
        Quote: Iline
        which can be successfully adapted to new realities.

        That's when they adapt to the new realities, then let the old ones be written off.
        Quote: Iline
        Listen, you got it already with Tu-134Sh and Tu-134UBL. He himself served in YES, tell us what the pilots flew to in TVVAUL and in Chelyabinsk the navigators before these aircraft?

        I don’t have to tell you what they fly, I live 3 km from the Shagol runway.
        Quote: Iline
        And they are used in the bulk not for training, but for flying commissions to distant garrisons.

        Then I watch three times a week, one commission after another in ChVAKUSH and from CHVAKUSHA flying around in a circle. Probably checking something. hi
      2. Alex_59
        Alex_59 20 January 2017 14: 06
        0
        Quote: Iline
        and in Chelyabinsk navigators to these aircraft?

        They flew on Tu-124Sh.
    2. megavolt823
      megavolt823 20 January 2017 19: 24
      0
      the simulator can be made from any base. believe me. hi
  8. Alexander 3
    Alexander 3 20 January 2017 07: 01
    +1
    It’s easy to say, but how to do it? Where’s the money coming from? Many cars can work for a long time. Of course, it’s necessary to plan but not with one swipe of the finger. We count the fighting machines on the fingers, but in this case. What will the Mixed squadrons fly on? generals, cargo, l composition.?
  9. Portuguese boat
    Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 07: 15
    +7
    You can’t buy a superjet for the Russian Air Force, there are too many foreign-made units that can repeat the fate of the Mistral, and the Tu-204 will not be able to replace the Il-62M truckers, so if Shoigu isn’t out of his mind, they will buy Il -96 and Tu-204. Tu-204 will be able to replace Tu-134 and Tu-154, and only IL-62 can replace IL-96M today.
    1. Reviews
      Reviews 20 January 2017 09: 42
      +1
      Quote: Portuguese boat
      Tu-204 will not be able to replace truckers IL-62M

      Already replaced: Tu-204-300 "Vladavia" went without landing "Vladivostok-Moscow" and, EMNIP, "Vladivostok-SPb". It is relatively easy to modify the "long" Tu-214 with additional tanks (in the luggage compartment). They have a range of under 6000 km even without dopbaks.
      1. Portuguese boat
        Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 09: 46
        0
        The maximum flight range of the Il-62M is slightly more than 11000 km, so the Tu-204, and even more so the Superjet, with a bunch of foreign nodes in it, the Il-62M is not a replacement
        1. Reviews
          Reviews 20 January 2017 10: 39
          +1
          Quote: Portuguese boat
          The maximum flight range of the Il-62M is slightly more than 11000 km, so the Tu-204, and even more so the Superjet, with a bunch of foreign nodes in it, the Il-62M is not a replacement

          What does a su-jet have to do with it?
          The IL-62m range is less than 10000km.
          Qmax = 85t. 6t remains on the payload. This is only 60-80 pax depending on the situation.
          For Mvzl = 160t at a distance of 9800km, the Il-62m will burn 81t of fuel; for 167,7t - 82t; for 17t - 83 tons. Well, technically the range (up to full production), yes,> 11000km ...
          Minus 5% on navigational lengthening. And it is calm. And airplanes fly not only to the east.
          Tu-214 carries its 210 passengers for 5+ thousand km. With a full refueling, he carries 12t, which is 100-160 passengers. Range of approximately 7000km. In order to reach the range of 9000 km of the IL-62, you need to add a tank of 8 tons of fuel. This is 10 cubic meters., Less than half of the rear trunk.
          1. Portuguese boat
            Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 10: 44
            0
            Tu-204 is not a long-range aircraft. If everything was so simple, then the USSR would not have made the IL-62, but would have limited it to the Tu-154 with additional tanks ... Do not write nonsense, no tanks can replace the IL- 62, replacement for him IL-96
            1. Reviews
              Reviews 20 January 2017 11: 28
              +2
              Quote: Portuguese boat
              Tu-204 is not a long-range aircraft.

              Come on? :))) What other discovery will you "please" with? However, see below for range.

              If everything was so simple, then the USSR would not have made the IL-62, but would have limited it to the Tu-154 with additional tanks ...

              Did you understand what you wrote?
              Do not write nonsense

              Hold your tongue, not too zealous. You yourself write nonsense about replacing the Tu-154th IL-62nd, not knowing the performance characteristics of these aircraft. These are originally different planes. IL-62 was made to replace the Tu-114; Tu-154 - Tu-104th and IL-18th.
              You are writing nonsense about the Tu-214 is not a long-haul aircraft. What exactly do you understand by this term? Okay, do not push, otherwise you will write nonsense again. Dalnemagistralnik this aircraft with a range of> 6000km. That the Tu-214 is quite able to provide for a small (much smaller than that of IL-62 th) Limitation pass.zagruzki.
              What are the tasks for the IL-62m today? Transfer of 100 ... 150 people within the Russian Federation? IL-214, even without additional tanks, will cope with this. From Moscow to Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky, for example (6800 ... 7000 km). How much further? Well, before the Cam Ranh, yes, one industrial landing will have to be done in order not to sit on the lights. Although, it is technically possible. The remainder will be somewhere for 30 ... 45 minutes of flight.
              The IL-96 can no longer be a substitute for anything but the IL-78. This is a morally obsolete aircraft, by its very concept. A modern aircraft of this dimension should not have as many as 4 engines. Three is the maximum.
              1. Portuguese boat
                Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 12: 03
                0
                If you claim that the Tu-154 was made to replace the IL-18, then you are a tree in aviation. The conversation is over.
                1. Reviews
                  Reviews 20 January 2017 12: 16
                  +1
                  Quote: Portuguese boat
                  If you claim that the Tu-154 was made to replace the IL-18, then you are a tree in aviation.

                  1. Portuguese boat
                    Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 13: 50
                    0
                    Yes boy, everything is sad with you. Even Wikipedia writes that the Tu-154 is an airplane for medium-haul flights, and the IL-18 is an airplane for long-haul airlines, but you consider yourself smarter than everyone, including Wikipedia and people directly related to aviation. fool
                    1. Reviews
                      Reviews 20 January 2017 14: 15
                      +1
                      Quote: Portuguese boat
                      Yes boy, everything is sad with you. Even Wikipedia writes that the Tu-154 is an airplane for medium-haul flights, and the IL-18 is an airplane for long-haul airlines, but you consider yourself smarter than everyone, including Wikipedia and people directly related to aviation. fool

                      And who wrote "the conversation is over" above? :) really like to keep the brand, whether that ... But, if anything, will continue.
                      Is it you, perhaps, "a person related to aviation"? :) Do not be a shame, referring to the "wiki". However, even without this link, it is clear that you see the planes only in the pictures.
                      For your reference, the Il-18 was created according to TTZ precisely as a medium-range aircraft and, despite the fact that the "D" -modification had the range increased to 6+ thousand km, the absolute majority of them were operated precisely at medium ranges (up to 3 5 thousand km - between cities with a population of over one million, well, and more resorts).
                      Now for the sake of interest I looked - IL-18D is only 1/4 of the total release of IL-18. And they, of course, also flew at medium ranges, because it was at such ranges (up to 3-5 thousand kilometers) that 3/4 of all traffic in the USSR took place.
                      One Swiss airline used the Airbus-319 with additional tanks for direct flights to Zurich-New York, but this did not make the 320-fam a long-range aircraft. As well as using the 747th to jump on the Japanese Islands does not make it an airplane of local (up to 1000km) lines.
                      The long-haul lines under the USSR are the patrimony of Tu-114 and Il-62, but not the Il-18, which was used on such lines only forcibly.
                      1. Portuguese boat
                        Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 14: 43
                        0
                        Your name is probably Vanya, but it's useless to argue with such. You and Wikipedia are not a decree, but I am with my diploma at all ... I asked you not to write to me, so you write yourself, causing bewilderment even in my sneakers ... From 1958 to 1959, 18 world flight range records, this is for the information of such `` experts '' as you ... there was not a single range record on the Tu-20, because its range for 154, in which it began its commercial flights, did not meet the increased requirements long-range aviation ...
              2. Roman Skomorokhov
                Roman Skomorokhov 20 January 2017 12: 04
                +1
                Let us calm down in the discussion. Do not go to the individual.
                1. Reviews
                  Reviews 20 January 2017 12: 17
                  +1
                  Quote: Banshee
                  Let us calm down in the discussion. Do not go to the individual.

                  Yes, I started quietly.
            2. Vadim237
              Vadim237 20 January 2017 17: 31
              +1
              So they will buy IL 96 - 400M, instead of IL 62.
              1. PHANTOM-AS
                PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 17: 33
                0
                Quote: Vadim237
                So they will buy IL 96 - 400M, instead of IL 62.

                And where will the 96th come from? what
                1. Reviews
                  Reviews 20 January 2017 17: 49
                  +1
                  Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                  Quote: Vadim237
                  So they will buy IL 96 - 400M, instead of IL 62.

                  And where will the 96th come from? what

                  Already the 96th - like dirt. If you are not satisfied with 96-300, you can extend the fuselage with inserts. A 96T is already elongated.
                  If there aren’t enough of those who are on conservation, then VASO is for what?
                  1. PHANTOM-AS
                    PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 18: 16
                    0
                    Quote: Avis
                    If there aren’t enough of those who are on conservation, then VASO is for what?

                    Can you clearly say how many planes are being mothballed? How much VASO can produce per year?
                    1. Reviews
                      Reviews 20 January 2017 18: 49
                      +1
                      Quote: PHANTOM-AS

                      Can you clearly say how many planes are being mothballed? How much VASO can produce per year?

                      Ten pieces on conservation.

                      Now two pieces a year. Just orders for a larger number is not. They will close the production of An-148 - they will accelerate according to Ilyushin.
                      1. PHANTOM-AS
                        PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 18: 58
                        0
                        Quote: Avis
                        Ten pieces on conservation.

                        There, in my opinion, 4 pieces stood against the wall, there were still aeroflot ones, but to 10! what
                        I can’t believe it even. It’s necessary to clarify.
                        And what prevents the 148th from releasing the 96th, there is enough space there.
                2. Portuguese boat
                  Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 18: 52
                  +1
                  It’s not too late to produce IL-96 in Voronezh before the plant is completely destroyed ... It's time to revive it ... Then it will be too late. Moreover, tankers on the basis of IL-96 have just bought it, which means that it is possible to buy military transport and passenger ones, it will be easier to supply spare parts, because most of the units are the same ...
    2. avt
      avt 20 January 2017 12: 23
      +1
      Quote: Portuguese boat
      only IL-62 can replace IL-96M today.

      what IL -96 in general that shirokofyuzelyazhnik and our response ,, 747 " request But here it is all the same .. That type 214 replacement with the original range planned at 6500km.
      Quote: Avis
      They have a range of 6000 km without additional tanks.

      At maximum load, 6200 is claimed.
      1. Reviews
        Reviews 20 January 2017 13: 19
        +1
        Quote: avt

        At maximum load, 6200 is claimed.

        This is calm. I take for the most likely headwind. This is for every hour of flight minus 50km range.
      2. Portuguese boat
        Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 13: 53
        0
        The Tu-204 is a medium-range aircraft, and the IL-96 is a plane for long-haul airlines. Or do you also consider yourself smarter than Wikipedia ?!
      3. Alex_59
        Alex_59 20 January 2017 14: 18
        0
        Quote: avt
        IL -96 in general that shirokofyuzelyazhnik and our response ,, 747 "

        Yes, IL-96 was not the answer to anything. IL-96 is a development of IL-86. The latter was created as a wide-body aircraft of large capacity in addition to the Tu-154 on the most passenger-loaded lines. So that Leningrad-Moscow does not drive a dozen 154's - replace with five IL-86. Benefit? There are fewer crews in 2 times, and in 2 times the load on air hubs. And in the future they decided to make a long-range version of the IL-86, because a successful plane turned out. IL-96 - as an addition to IL-62M.
        But the analogue of the B-747 was not threatened. Although both of these aircraft are long-range wide-body ones, they are still of a different weight category. IL-96 - 250 tons, 747-th - 450 tons, almost doubled. The USSR did not have airlines requiring the mandatory presence in the GA line of such an aircraft as the 747. The distances we have are of course suitable, but the passenger flow Moscow-Vladivostok is not such as to create the 747-th for it. All the same, in the USA, passenger traffic on America-Europe lines is higher.
        1. Reviews
          Reviews 20 January 2017 14: 59
          +1
          Quote: Alex_59
          long-range version of the IL-86th, because a successful plane turned out. IL-96 - as an addition to IL-62M.

          Let's say better "replacement of the Il-62, based on the experience gained on the Il-86". All the same, the Il-96, in addition to the general layout, is absolutely new: the wing, the power plant, the fuselage, the tail and the avionics.
          Airlines at 747, still, were the United States and the Soviet Union--Yu.Amerika. Our only went there with promposadkami. Not for nothing was negotiated 747 and whether the "Tristar", or DiSi-10. I think the 310th in Aeroflot-RMAL did not appear just like that, but was a by-product of these negotiations.
        2. Portuguese boat
          Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 15: 13
          0
          I know perfectly well this topic, so if you're interested, read, write right now, but if not, you can continue to argue, but with Wikipedia because I'm tired ... Yes, IL-86 was created as a large-capacity aircraft, but with the beginning of his commercial flights, it became clear that he lacked range. At that time, Il-62s were already flying, with which everything was fine with the flight range, but they did not take many passengers, only 168 people. At that time what that figure occurred to me that there is nothing such as a wise and simply extend the IL-62 to more passengers climbed into it. So they did by creating the IL-62M, in which they were able to cram not 168 passengers, as before, but 186-195. But since the `` comrade '' was a high-ranking, but stupid and not educated, they did not take into account that a pressure effect of the tunnel arises in the long cabin ... IL-62M passengers began to complain of discomfort and pain in the ears, after which it was messy with the Il- 62 finally ended. As a result, the USSR had three headaches: 1) Tu-144, which did not have enough range and was somehow not smart designed it so that passengers could not take their luggage with them and they were taken next to An-12, which forced passengers to wait after arrival baggage for hours or come to him another time ... from the Tu-144 production eventually abandoned altogether ... 2) IL-62M with a decent range, but failures in the design, because of which he was most suitable for trucks and not for passenger transport. The passengers in it suffered from pain in the ears ... 3) The Il-86, which lacked the flight range ... So they decided to combine the Il-86 and Il-62M in one plane, and the Il-96 became it. The Il-96 has a range of 400 km, which is slightly less than the Il-10000M, with its 62 km, but significantly more than the Il-11040, with its 86 km of flight range. As for passengers, the Il-3800M takes a maximum of 62 people, the Il-195 takes a maximum of 86 people, the Il-314-96 400 passengers, and the Boeing-436-747 takes 8 passengers on board and can fly 581 km. But Americans are different in that they need a longer runway.
          1. faiver
            faiver 20 January 2017 17: 02
            0
            how many flew on il-62m there were no pains in the ears ...
            1. Portuguese boat
              Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 17: 08
              0
              Everyone has different ears. Someone did not get the Spanish flu, despite the epidemic.
          2. Alex_59
            Alex_59 20 January 2017 20: 15
            0
            Quote: Portuguese boat
            At that time, some kind of figure came up with the idea that there’s nothing to be smart and just lengthen the IL-62 so that more passengers get into it.

            good Did they lengthen a lot?
            1. Portuguese boat
              Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 20: 26
              0
              They flew IL-62M with a fuselage elongated by 3,5 meters ...
              1. Alex_59
                Alex_59 20 January 2017 22: 23
                0
                Quote: Portuguese boat
                They flew IL-62M with a fuselage elongated by 3,5 meters ...

                Let’s specifically. Here is a list of all that ever existed in the nature of IL-62: http://russianplanes.net/planelist/Ilushin/Il-62
                Can you name which sides were "elongated" and which were not?
                1. Portuguese boat
                  Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 22: 27
                  0
                  Board numbers I will not name, but versions for 220-230 and 250 passengers were tested ...
                  1. Alex_59
                    Alex_59 20 January 2017 23: 45
                    0
                    Quote: Portuguese boat
                    Board numbers

                    I will tell you a little secret. There were no elongated IL-62. There was an increase in passenger capacity due to a rearrangement of the cabin and a change in the pitch of the seats. smile
                    1. Portuguese boat
                      Portuguese boat 21 January 2017 08: 08
                      0
                      It goes without saying, but there was an attempt to lengthen the plane. And so that you no longer write that I'm stupid and stupid, see the series Wings of Russia, there is about IL-62
    3. alekc73
      alekc73 20 January 2017 15: 55
      0
      There is a Tu-214 with extra. tanks. The range is comparable with IL-62M. The aircraft is serial and fully domestic. There will be an order, money from the Moscow Region - Kazan will make as many as they ask. As long as they produce 1 -2 Tu-214 per year, there are no orders.
      1. Portuguese boat
        Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 16: 39
        0
        Additional tanks on the plane just do not put. There is a maximum take-off mass of the aircraft and it depends on its glider, wing span and engine power. The maximum take-off weight of the Tu-214 is 110750 kg, and the maximum payload is 25200 kg. Additional tanks you can deliver only by reducing the load. The flight range with a maximum fuel reserve of Tu-214 is 6890 km, but its flight range from 25200 kg of cargo is only 3460 km. You can take either more cargo or more fuel, otherwise the plane will not take off, it will take exactly as much cargo as motors and wings can lift. For comparison, the Il-62M with 25000 kg of cargo can fly up to 8800 km, against 3460 km at the Tu-214, and with the maximum fuel supply, the Il-62M flies at 12000 km, against 6890 km at the Tu-214 ...
  10. gukoyan
    gukoyan 20 January 2017 08: 35
    +1
    Well, that’s good, because it’s high time to update the park, but the choice towards Surreget is also not clear, it seems not so good ...
    1. Muvka
      Muvka 20 January 2017 09: 45
      +2
      Of course not so good. 1000 Tu-152 killed 3300 people, and 100 SSZh 45, and that was the fault of the pilots who entered the mountain during the demonstration flight. And on the lost sides in general a fairy tale. 72 vs 1.
      1. Alex_59
        Alex_59 20 January 2017 14: 20
        +1
        Quote: Muvka
        And on the lost sides in general a fairy tale. 72 vs 1.

        And if you don’t fly at all - there will be zero accident rate - a fairy tale of fairy tales! Yes?

        God grant these SSJs fly as many billions of passenger-kilometers as the 154s fly. Then we’ll see what a fairy tale this SSJ is
        1. Reviews
          Reviews 20 January 2017 16: 01
          +1
          Quote: Alex_59
          Quote: Muvka
          And on the lost sides in general a fairy tale. 72 vs 1.

          And if you don’t fly at all - there will be zero accident rate - a fairy tale of fairy tales! Yes?

          God grant these SSJs fly as many billions of passenger-kilometers as the 154s fly. Then we’ll see what a fairy tale this SSJ is

          Flies. The Tu-154 also once had a zero attack. And, by the way, the very first years of its operation were marked by several disasters related precisely to the design. So-jet in the sixth year so far not a single one.
  11. kaschey
    kaschey 20 January 2017 08: 57
    +1
    Quote: Portuguese boat
    You can’t buy a superjet for the Russian Air Force, there are too many foreign-made units that can repeat the fate of the Mistral, and the Tu-204 will not be able to replace the Il-62M truckers, so if Shoigu isn’t out of his mind, they will buy Il -96 and Tu-204. Tu-204 will be able to replace Tu-134 and Tu-154, and only IL-62 can replace IL-96M today.

    Dear, you are close to the truth. In the meantime, a large carcass will serve more than one year.
  12. keeper03
    keeper03 20 January 2017 09: 46
    +3
    Replacement on the SSJ - is imprudent, as a maximum - a provocation! Tu-204, 214 - time-tested, completely domestic airliners, with modern avionics! The Il-62M is a reliable machine, however, like the Tu-134, Tu-154M, and if you want to reduce the human factor, then make modern avionics for them, add a couple of additional onboard computers and you will have a modern, new plane !!! This reduces the quality requirements for pilots, who are already suffering in our time, due to the small number of flight hours and other related factors. Modern, new aircraft undoubtedly need to be built, especially now, when an urgent need has long been ripe for this, but there is no need to cut the budget for what this leads to, everyone knows. Therefore, it is not necessary to reinvent the wheel again, everything has already been invented, collect all the development to "heap", bring to mind a couple of planes, and in accordance with modern requirements and will be for all of us happy!
  13. Prince of Pensions
    Prince of Pensions 20 January 2017 10: 46
    +1
    to abandon the further operation of Tu-134, Tu-154 and Il-62M aircraft.
    What year?
  14. Nix1986
    Nix1986 20 January 2017 11: 38
    0
    Reviews,
    "There may have been criminal cases, and so what? Everywhere and always there are offenders who punish both" us "and" them "for this.
    So "second-hand spare parts" that you do not like are repair units, a normal practice in any country. "
    I can't understand what the fuss is about, I just expressed my opinion that "writing off planes is not an option, mattress mats fly on their own for many years, and taking into account we have criminal cases, it makes sense to dig in the direction of aircraft maintenance, especially with more active operation, mattress mats do not have such accidents with so many victims. " You just saw the word "mattress" and rushed, and the whole speech boiled down to "nothing is true, everything is decay" and did not give any opinion. It's not fun to play like that;)
    1. Reviews
      Reviews 20 January 2017 11: 45
      +1
      Quote: Nix1986
      Reviews,
      "There may have been criminal cases, and so what? Everywhere and always there are offenders who punish both" us "and" them "for this.
      So "second-hand spare parts" that you do not like are repair units, a normal practice in any country. "
      I can't understand what the fuss is about, I just expressed my opinion that "writing off planes is not an option, mattress mats fly on their own for many years, and taking into account we have criminal cases, it makes sense to dig in the direction of aircraft maintenance, especially with more active operation, mattress mats do not have such accidents with so many victims. " You just saw the word "mattress" and rushed

      But do not lie. Reread what I latched on, and do not listen to their "voices" in his head.
      1. Nix1986
        Nix1986 20 January 2017 11: 48
        0
        The life of me, but your thoughts about the news I heard, only one - "wait for expert conclusions" and "Nothing is true."
        1. Reviews
          Reviews 20 January 2017 12: 50
          +1
          Quote: Nix1986
          Though kill, but I did not hear your thoughts on the news

          And I wasn't going to. I just reacted to the statement of 'nix1986' that "the USAF has an excellent TE, but the RF Air Force is bad."
          According to the news - "if there is a decision to stop the entire fleet of Tu-134, 154 and Il-62, this is nonsense."
  15. pv1005
    pv1005 20 January 2017 12: 06
    0
    Reviews,
    Quote: Avis
    Quote: Nix1986
    But you also, without waiting for the investigation, concluded that you don’t need to do anything, let everything continue this way.

    Where did I write this? No wagging only.
    The rest is your stream of consciousness - no comment.

    Do not waste your nerves dear on this tro lo lo. You see, it revolves around one point, and will not move anywhere from it.
    1. Reviews
      Reviews 20 January 2017 12: 51
      +2
      Quote: pv1005
      tro lo lo. You see, it revolves around one point, and will not move anywhere from it.

      I am creating a counterbalance. Suddenly someone will buy his statement to say: "No one objected, so the truth writes."
  16. Reviews
    Reviews 20 January 2017 14: 52
    +2
    Portuguese boat,
    You don’t have any diploma, do not lie.
    1. Portuguese boat
      Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 16: 47
      0
      Well, which one of you is special I already see ... Zero ...
      1. Reviews
        Reviews 20 January 2017 17: 24
        +1
        Quote: Portuguese boat
        Well, which one of you is special I already see ... Zero ...

        Dityatko, tell me honestly - how old are you?
        1. Portuguese boat
          Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 19: 00
          0
          at 40, and I doubt that you suit my fathers ... Although age and education are different and if you don’t understand that additional tanks are not put up just like that and any aircraft is still limited by the maximum take-off weight, Tu-214 and IL have it -62M is simply incompatible, as is the maximum flight range with 25000 kg of cargo ... What is there to talk about with people like you ?! You picked up the tops somewhere and think that you are smart ... Tu-214 with a maximum payload of 25200 kg cannot fly further than 3460 km, and the installation of additional tanks is possible only by reducing the weight of the payload and nothing else ... Il-62M with 25000 kg of cargo it is capable of flying 8800 km ... and that’s it ... Any aircraft is limited by the maximum take-off weight, and then either the maximum load or the maximum fuel supply, but it is impossible to squeeze both into the plane at once, will not take off. ..
          1. Reviews
            Reviews 20 January 2017 19: 12
            +2
            Quote: Portuguese boat
            at 40, and I doubt that you’re good for my fathers ....

            God forbid such an ancephalous son ...
            However, you lie and about age, and about education. Never an adult who understands what it will not write, "I know very well this subject." These things say the children in the sandbox at the age of ... well, until about the third grade.
            Secondly, a specialist will never write "are you smarter than Wikipedia?"
            Well, and most importantly, the specialist knows at least something about the subject under discussion, and does not broadcast someone's nonsense about the "elongated Il-62m". Boy, the Il-62m has exactly the same dimensions as the Il-62. The rest of your infant delirium of the same kind, including, I will not waste time analyzing it.
            All of all, learn better and enjoy the folder with your mom.
            1. Portuguese boat
              Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 19: 22
              0
              The Il-62M was tested with a fuselage lengthened by 3,5 meters compared to the conventional Il-62, but they did not go because of the discomfort in the cabin ... And Wikipedia is for people like you, who themselves do not know anything and do not listen to others. .. I was thinking where to poke your nose, because you won't take your word for it, you are like the smartest here. So, watch the series `` Wings of Russia '' there is about the Il-62 ...
              1. Reviews
                Reviews 20 January 2017 19: 41
                +1
                Quote: Portuguese boat
                The Il-62M was tested with an elongated 3,5 meters compared to the usual Il-62 fuselage, but they did not go because of the discomfort in the cabin ...

                I tell you, repetition will say it again - there was no "Il-62M elongated" in the metal. Maybe it was in the drawings. As mentioned above, according to the branch you're talking about the Il-62M wrote something else. Listen, third grader, even though when you lie, write down how you lie, otherwise in memory, I see, it does not hold.
                Teach materiel, son, teach. Otherwise, you’ll be so foolish and grow up. And thou shalt cause a noise of their unfriendly type of knowledge about the fact that "turned outthat the Il-86 did not have enough range "; like, it was calculated for a different one. And even the 314-seat Il-86. And you also confuse the technical range and the practical. Yes, you confuse a lot, and you do not know. But you climb with your own . ideas, podchorpnutymi in the sandbox read that IL-18 was used on long-haul routes and all - IL-18 dalnemagistralnik.
                Well, you give, loser ...
                Learn, boy, study.
                1. Portuguese boat
                  Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 19: 48
                  0
                  1) You’re a loser and you’re not like me as a father, but you are not a son too ... You remind me of my classmate, his name was Vanya, he was just as impudent and stupid, of a high opinion of yourself ... 2) Il- 18 flew since 1959 and it set 20 world range records, for that time. Over time, the car became obsolete, it was transferred to medium-haul flights, replacing the IL-62 ... But this does not fit in your head, because it was not given to you to think ...
                  1. Reviews
                    Reviews 20 January 2017 20: 13
                    +1
                    Quote: Portuguese boat
                    Over time, the car became obsolete, it was transferred to medium-haul flights, replacing the IL-62 ...

                    Boy, would you at least have watched the year the IL-18D and IL-62 began production (without a letter). They appeared at the same time. :) They were operated in parallel, and not to replace each other. IL-62 appeared to replace the Tu-114. The only thing you can say with a stretch is that the IL-62 replaced the IL-18, is that on some flights they switched from 1-2 industrial landings to non-stop flights. And all these industrial landings were required precisely because the medium-range IL-18 was forced to put in the Siberian and Far Eastern directions, and they lacked the range.
                    And about the records - see what kind of records they were and in what conditions. This has nothing to do with everyday linear operation.

                    Well, honestly, you are already tired of your frivolity and militant amateurism.
                    1. Portuguese boat
                      Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 20: 34
                      0
                      IL-18D is a modification of the aircraft for extra-long flights ... You are stupid to the point of horror ... Tu-114 did not go at all and were quickly written off due to: too much noise in the cabin, too high landing gear, which required not standard but higher ladders for loading and unloading passengers and the fatigue cracks of the wings ... They simply did not begin to be repaired, it was frankly not a successful aircraft, not commercially efficient, based on a bomber .... IL-18 was originally created as a commercial vehicle. In addition, the IL-18 did not require large airfields, and the Tu-114 could be received only in the capitals ... and there were difficulties with it, including the ramp ... The medium-range IL-18 became only at the end of his career .. . That's it, girl ...
                      1. Reviews
                        Reviews 20 January 2017 20: 44
                        +1
                        Quote: Portuguese boat
                        IL-18D is a modification of the aircraft for extra long flights ...

                        The medium-range IL-18 was only at the end of his career ...

                        This is a 3,14-cent ...

                        You are really incredibly crowded.
  17. Reviews
    Reviews 20 January 2017 19: 57
    +1
    PHANTOM-AS,
    there were still aeroflot ones, but to 10! what

    "More" ... :) He had five of them. Or six. And everyone is messing around now.

    And what prevents the 148th from releasing the 96th, there is enough space there.

    The staff is not enough. This is not a stool, it’s impossible to dial from the street and it will not work in a week. And for a year it will not work either. Therefore, only release from other projects, alas.
    1. PHANTOM-AS
      PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 21: 33
      0
      Quote: Avis
      "More" ... :) He had five of them. Or six. And everyone is messing around now.

      The respected SSI set out this whole story about VASO, incl.
      Quote: Avis
      The staff is not enough. This is not a stool

      If you read my comments carefully, then I said that it’s unrealistic to launch a mass production!, Implying a lack of personnel and workers and engineers, disruption of production chains and links with subcontractors, aging equipment, etc. etc.
      1. Reviews
        Reviews 20 January 2017 21: 41
        +1
        Quote: PHANTOM-AS

        If you carefully read my comments, then I said that it’s unrealistic to establish a mass release!

        What is "mass" in your understanding in relation to a wide-body aircraft? Russia (in general - both the Civil Aviation and the military) needs less than a hundred Il-96 class aircraft. Moreover, all this quantity is needed not "in a straight hour", it will last a year until 2025. This is not mass production, it is just mass production. One board in 1-2 months, the pace is quite sufficient, especially considering that it is possible to simultaneously modify the already finished -400T and -300. Also, of course, a large amount of work, but, at least, it is not necessary to rivet the glider from scratch and pull the general aircraft systems.
        1. PHANTOM-AS
          PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 22: 42
          0
          Quote: Avis
          This is not mass production, it is just mass production. One side in 1-2 months the pace is quite sufficient, especially considering that you can simultaneously modify the already-ready -400T and -300. Also, of course, a large amount of work, but at least you do not need to rivet the glider from scratch and pull the general aircraft.

          Your words and the government used in the ears! I am only FOR, even if at least one a month, only so that the production is not "frozen", and then later it's like clothes that you don't wear, or the moth will beat or go out of fashion.
          Only I can’t understand why "Aeroflot" doesn’t fly on the 96s, because it’s a great car, I flew several times personally !!!
          1. Reviews
            Reviews 20 January 2017 23: 01
            +1
            Quote: PHANTOM-AS

            Only I can’t understand why "Aeroflot" doesn’t fly on the 96s, because it’s a great car, I flew several times personally !!!

            IL-96 in the embodiment transporter tanker (a'la kc- *) ordered military.
            And civilian operators do not fly due to obsolescence (for 300 passengers, 4 engines instead of 2-3), and of the prohibitive cost of overhead costs per fleet unit: the Il-96 fell into the timelessness of the 1990-2000s, when traffic fell across the country at times, so the Il-96s were released nothing at all. And the fact that the plane went through the "raw" stage for more than ten years is also connected with the small number of flying sides. And during this time his niche was filled by relatively inexpensive classmates - "Airbus" and "Boeing".
            However, this sad question is sucked to the bone in all aviation and near-aviation communities.
            1. PHANTOM-AS
              PHANTOM-AS 20 January 2017 23: 58
              0
              Quote: Avis
              However, this sad question is sucked to the bone in all aviation and near-aviation communities.

              Il-96-300 74393201001 1990 RA-96002 ru Ilyushin Design Bureau (Aviation Complex) in storage 3-6 years ago (f)
              Il-96-300 74393201002 1991 RA-96005 ru Aeroflot - Russian Airlines in storage 6-12 months. back (f)
              Il-96-300 74393201003 1992 RA-96006 ru Domodedovo Airlines - DAL (AirUnion) in storage 3-6 years ago (f)
              Il-96-300 74393201004 1992 RA-96007 ru Aeroflot - Russian Airlines in storage 1-2 years ago (f)
              Il-96-300 74393201006 1994 RA-96009 ru Domodedovo Airlines - DAL (AirUnion) in storage
              Il-96-300 74393202012 1995 RA-96015 ru Aeroflot - Russian Airlines in storage 6-12 months. back (f)
              Il-96-300 74393202013 1999 RA-96013 ru Domodedovo Airlines - DAL (AirUnion) in storage
              Il-96-400T 97693201001 1997 RA-96101 ru Poljot AK (Voronezh) in storage 1-2 years ago (f)
              Il-96-400T 97693201003 2009 RA-96103 en VASO in storage
              Here are all the sides in storage!
              5 pcs. In operation, in operation in the Russian Federation 9 pcs., In Cuba 4 pcs.
              It's all.
              1. Reviews
                Reviews 21 January 2017 09: 41
                +1
                Quote: PHANTOM-AS

                Here are all the sides in storage!

                If I didn’t go astray, I got nine. Well, one mistake, it happens. Plus one burned out. So ten would have happened.
                Are you few already ready for alteration boards? :)
                1. PHANTOM-AS
                  PHANTOM-AS 21 January 2017 09: 56
                  0
                  Quote: Avis
                  Are you few already ready for alteration boards? :)

                  I specially laid out boards with serial numbers and years of release.
                  Of all these, doubt, perhaps only one does not cause, namely the one that is stored at VASO. hi
                  1. Reviews
                    Reviews 21 January 2017 10: 03
                    +1
                    Quote: PHANTOM-AS

                    I specially laid out boards with serial numbers and years of release.

                    AND?..
                    1. PHANTOM-AS
                      PHANTOM-AS 21 January 2017 10: 17
                      0
                      Quote: Avis
                      AND?..

                      Well, what are we fooling around for you, provided that everyone understands everything.
                      Yes, the fact that they are all over 20 years old and the conditions of their storage cause great concern, and then one of those who are really ready for alteration
                      Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                      IL-96-400T 97693201003 2009 RA-96103 en VASO in storage
                      1. Reviews
                        Reviews 21 January 2017 10: 34
                        +1
                        Quote: PHANTOM-AS
                        they are all over 20 years old and their storage conditions are of great concern

                        Well, firstly, there is fault detection for this; secondly, "doubt" is not "knowledge." Thirdly, AFLovskie do not stand so long. In the late 90s and early 2000s, we raised aircraft that stood for 5-7 years. Some are still flying.
          2. Portuguese boat
            Portuguese boat 21 January 2017 08: 13
            0
            IL-96 takes more than 400 passengers, and there are two problems. Domestic after-sales service is inferior to the western one, and the necessary spare parts in ports are sometimes expected, and this is simple and loss-making. In the 90s, when everything was OK with the service, there was such an activist Shapashnikov who liked to receive bribes from Western companies and specially bought decommissioned planes in the West pushing them to Russia for the purpose of wrecking. It was profitable for the West to give bribes to such rotten ones as Shapashnikov because by giving off the decommissioned planes they received a market for the sale of spare parts ... and crowded out competitors.
            1. Reviews
              Reviews 21 January 2017 10: 05
              +1
              Quote: Portuguese boat
              IL-96 takes more than 400 passengers

              Dap-Dap? Standing, or what, like in a minibus? Also in the "wings of Russia" said?
              Well, you and the ram ...
  18. Portuguese boat
    Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 20: 51
    0
    Reviews,
    IL-18D is 3 aircraft for flights to Antarctica, with a cabin for only 20 passengers ... This is exactly what I wrote to you. Either a lot of fuel, or a lot of cargo, otherwise it does not happen. The take-off mass of an aircraft is always limited by the lift of its wings and motors ...
    1. Reviews
      Reviews 20 January 2017 21: 13
      +1
      Quote: Portuguese boat
      Reviews,
      IL-18D is 3 aircraft for flights to Antarctica,

      Listen !!! Well, seriously, you can not be such a ram. Do you, at least, look into something other than your "wiki", before messing with your nonsense.
      "3 planes for Antarctica", you see ... IL-18D built service station onboard, these are ordinary linear aircraft. Write on your forehead, cuffs and palms. For Antarctica, "Veshki" were altered.
      Well, you and tuupoooy ...
      1. Portuguese boat
        Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 21: 19
        0
        This is you about IL-18I, which in the series was renamed IL-18D, so IL-18 was not considered medium-range before it, and only a few cities of the USSR could take the Tu-114, due to the fact that it required large airfields and special ramps ...
        1. Reviews
          Reviews 20 January 2017 21: 47
          +1
          Quote: Portuguese boat
          This is you about IL-18I, which in the series was renamed IL-18D

          I'm talking about IL-18D. Which at the experimental stage was called Il-18I.
          IL-18 and before it was not considered medium-range

          He did not count. He appeared. Both before and after. And in time.

          Tu-114 could take only a few cities of the USSR

          IL-62 - also a "few". It has a required runway of 3400m. But you don't understand this term. I wrote it this way, by inertia.

          special ramps ...

          High ladders are such a trifle that they are not the problem. but you too are not able to understand this.

          You are already tired of your stupidity, well, really. Tie already, is it really not tired of disgrace?
          1. Portuguese boat
            Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 21: 51
            0
            High ramps are not a trifle, it came to the point that there weren’t such ramps in the ports where Tu-114 flew in and then tin began ... That’s why the IL-18s fly longer than the Tu-114 and will probably be left behind 62 that they don’t need big airfields ... and special ramps too ...
            1. Reviews
              Reviews 20 January 2017 21: 57
              +1
              Quote: Portuguese boat
              High ramps is not a trifle, it came to the point that there were no such ramps in the ports where Tu-114 flew in and then tin began ...

              Gangways, against the background of other aspects in organizing a regular flight, is a trifle. And there were no more overlays on single flights than with any other new aircraft. Tu-114 was not created for one-time flights at exhibitions.
              In short, and in logistics you are zero. Absolute.
              1. Portuguese boat
                Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 21: 59
                0
                I do not think the passengers down the ladder is a small thing, but you know better ,, ''
                1. Reviews
                  Reviews 20 January 2017 22: 08
                  +1
                  Quote: Portuguese boat
                  I do not think the passengers down the ladder is a small thing, but you know better ,, ''

                  Storm traps, pop my ass, storm traps ...


                  Could I tell you distribute these pictures, "Strom-traps", but you again or you will not understand what it was about, or you will start to play up both the IL-18 D / E.
                  Well stop already disgrace, CHYUDO. Well, do not you disgust yourself?
                  1. Portuguese boat
                    Portuguese boat 20 January 2017 22: 29
                    0
                    Even my cat laughs from you ... If only extra tanks could be dispensed with, then in the USA we would fly Boeing 727 now and do nothing new and bigger ...
                    1. Reviews
                      Reviews 20 January 2017 23: 03
                      +1
                      Quote: Portuguese boat
                      If only additional tanks could be dispensed with, then in the USA even now they would fly on Boeing 727s and do nothing new and bigger ...

                      I can only repeat the same picture.
  19. PHANTOM-AS
    PHANTOM-AS 21 January 2017 10: 53
    0
    Reviews,
    So I’m only for it, if all of these boards rise to the sky, I will say more, at one time the Americans took out flying coffins of museum antiquity from the dumps, at a pretty cost, and flew charter flights to the Russian Federation.
    Now it’s fundamentally interesting to me whether they will fly or not, and what opportunities exist for this. Unfortunately I have lost the info from the SSI, but he is really up to date on the 96th, as he worked with them here and in Cuba.
    I’m not going to ask him for detailed information on this issue.
    From myself I can say that many boards of the same years of production have already been cut.
    But no matter how it is, I will forcibly return to this topic. hi
    1. Reviews
      Reviews 21 January 2017 11: 05
      +1
      Quote: PHANTOM-AS
      Reviews,
      Americans dumped coffins of museum antiquity from landfills, at a pretty cost, and flew charters to the Russian Federation.

      For the most part, these are fairy tales.
      1. PHANTOM-AS
        PHANTOM-AS 21 January 2017 11: 11
        0
        Quote: Avis
        For the most part, these are fairy tales.

        It was, already the 70-80s. release yes Here I am absolutely sure. I will try to provide evidence in the evening, infa on another medium. hi
        1. Reviews
          Reviews 21 January 2017 11: 13
          +1
          Quote: PHANTOM-AS
          Quote: Avis
          For the most part, these are fairy tales.

          It was, already the 70-80s. release yes Here I am absolutely sure. I will try to provide evidence in the evening, infa on another medium. hi

          I did not say that this was not at all.
  20. Diviz
    Diviz 22 January 2017 16: 13
    0
    Long overdue!