The system of space reconnaissance "Liana" is operating in pilot mode

For the first time, Russian Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu publicly announced the development of a highly secret new-generation Liana space reconnaissance system. Work on the project has been going on since the 1990s. In 2013, the trial testing of the system was completed, and the debugging of its components began. Currently, she is working in pilot-duty mode, supplying the command post with data for subsequent processing. Separate segments of the system, according to information available to some sources, were used during the Syrian campaign in the exploration of targets and their destruction by cruise missiles.

Machine-building plant "Arsenal"

The key element of Liana is a network of satellites of the Lotos-S and Pion-NKS families, which are assembled at the Arsenal Machine-Building Plant (St. Petersburg). Their primary function is intelligence and target designation. For example, the “Peony” is able to follow armored vehicles from a height of thousands of kilometers, acting as a gunner in a missile attack of objects. The first satellite of the system went into space in 2010 year.
The key to effective operation of the Liana system is the timely launch of satellites into orbit in order to maintain the orbital grouping of military spacecraft. Currently, the entire constellation, including the Liana satellites, has at least 140 devices for various purposes.

Comments

[shlang25]

acting as a gunner in missile destruction of objects

that is, satellite guidance is still there .. Or, again, a bike of journalists?

[bouncyhunter]

Shake America, Shake Europe!
Since now you surely - the ass!

[cniza]

Quote: shlang25

acting as a gunner in missile destruction of objects

that is, satellite guidance is still there .. Or, again, a bike of journalists?

This is the future, but they will try to destroy this system in the first place, I hope it is well protected.

[shlang25]

Yes, of course. It’s just that there was so much debate about the fact that we don’t have a satellite guidance system, that I don’t already know how to perceive this information

[Sterlya]

Quote: shlang25

acting as a gunner in missile destruction of objects

that is, satellite guidance is still there .. Or, again, a bike of journalists?

Rather, there is. Without this, the Caliber would hardly have launched. GLONASS is still not that.

[opus]

Quote: shlang25

we don’t have a satellite guidance system

Yes


Only the article is not about GLONAS.
And about:


Still far from happiness

Quote: Sterlya

Without this, Gauges would hardly launch

Gauges have nothing to do with 14Ф138 (Cosmos-2455) and 14Ф145 (Cosmos-2502) ..
SN KR 3М14 “Caliber” ISN + missile guidance on a ground contrast target (possibly by the method of extreme navigation on the target’s radar image), supplemented by a satellite navigation channel.
ARGS-14 *

TSU by objectives (geographical coordinates) were given intelligence either by Iranian or by Assad’s army.

Quote: demchuk.ig

on carrier groups at its maximum range, more than 2 thousand km!

will not be able to. This is pointless for their flight speed.

[fzr1000]

Is the adjustment of the control unit during the flight of the Caliber impossible? Dilentant asks.

[mav1971]

Quote: fzr1000

Is the adjustment of the control unit during the flight of the Caliber impossible? Dilentant asks.

Not yet.
Maybe in the second or third modernization, the retargeting and transmission of the correction will turn out.

[opus]

Quote: fzr1000

And the adjustment of the control unit during the flight of the Caliber

BTsVK ZM14 and 3М-54-yes. But this is the correction of the ANN error (wind, precession, differential thrust, sensor error, etc.) along a given path.

This is a correction for reference radio contrast points.
tercom or DSMAC


The entire flight path of a cruise missile over land is divided into 64 of the correction area with a length of 7-8 km and a width of 48-2 km. The accepted quantitative characteristics of the cells and correction areas, according to American experts, ensure that the cruise missile is brought to the target even when flying over the flat terrain. The permissible error of measuring the height of the terrain for the reliable operation of the TERCOM subsystem should be 1 meter.
On the external channel, NO.
It simply does not exist.

Change flight program (retarget), our so far can not (Americans are testing).
Loading flight program (For ЗМ-14) = several tens of minutes and it does not fly along an arbitrary trajectory.

[Rus2012]

Quote: opus

On the external channel, NO.
It simply does not exist.
Our program is not yet able to change the flight program (retarget) (Americans are testing).
Loading flight program (For ЗМ-14) = several tens of minutes and it does not fly along an arbitrary trajectory.

Colleague, "there are no external channels at all and ours are not yet able to", do you mean this in relation only to the ZM-14 "Calibers"?

[opus]

Quote: Rus2012

Do you mean this in relation only to the ZM-14 "Calibers"?

well ...
except for some missiles, RVV, RVP and the famous "Voevoda" / "Satan" .... yes.
Lagging behind.

If you have not forgotten 36M2 (in the variant "6000.00."), You can get a tsu, after the start (reply)
Well, except for the signals for forced erection (the buses are equipped with antennas for receiving it)
Threat by rumors because of the first massive salvo of ZM-14, even the problems were with EM compatibility.
The warriors google that fell a little

However, the Americans had the same rake in Yugoslavia and Iraq

[ohtandur]

You have a lot of pictures not uploaded in the message, unfortunately. Solve the problem of downloading images, otherwise you have interesting comments, and often your images do not load.

[opus]

Quote: ohtandur

Solve the problem of downloading images, otherwise you have interesting comments, and often your images do not load.

HZ how.
Everything is loading.
something with the site

[bk316]

Only the article is not about GLONAS.

GLONAS satellite guidance system?
I always thought that there are 2 basic systems: satellite reconnaissance (detect targets and give out their coordinates), geography (determine the coordinates of an object of a part of the system)
Based on satellite intelligence data, a guidance system (target designation) has been made.
A navigation system is made on the data of the map.
Is not it?

[opus]

Quote: bk316

GLONAS satellite guidance system?

GLONAS itself does not induce of course (it is not tied to a specific consumer of the signal)
The 24-channel receiver-indicator of satellite navigation systems (SNS) "GLONASS" / "Navstar" PSN-2001 uses an FDMA signal (protected), and of course an open one and CDMA, which ensures the accuracy of determining the coordinates and speed of the ammunition in relation to the target.

Quote: bk316

Based on satellite intelligence data, a guidance system (target designation) has been made.

No, the RTR spacecraft cannot (due to the orbits) transfer the target data directly to the ammunition, neither we nor the Americans (as yet), all through the center (through a garland of satellites and ground-based relays to the center).
Ammunition receiving modules are not yet available.

Quote: bk316

A navigation system is made on the data of the map.

so this is the most important and is:
-there are target coordinates
- there are coordinates and speed (vector, value) of the carrier
- the ammunition flew, its trajectory is affected by: the Sun, the Moon, wind, humidity, different forces, the error of traction, lift, etc.)
getting the EXACT coordinates of your location in space / time = the problem of accurately hitting the target (target coordinates) for the 7 class.
ARGS or IR GOS for the final section, or for a moving target

[bk316]

everything through the center (through a garland of satellites and ground-based repeaters to the center).

Thank you, I understand you. Of course it is.
It’s just that in those same minimum 45 minutes, the AOG leaves for at least 30 km, the target can no longer be captured, moreover, the homing head can be suppressed.
And of course, the satellites do not transmit the coordinates of the target directly to the ammunition (I did not even know that such work was ongoing).
And there are no receiving modules on the ammunition, but this is so far, it just wasn’t necessary.
It is necessary (at the same time) that the RTR satellites transmit target designations (albeit not directly), the ammunition can take them, and the carrier has sufficient power to hit any target along various trajectories.
Creating one component of the system is pointless.
That's why I say that it looks very logical
Liana + PC-28 + U-71

[opus]

Quote: bk316

And of course, the satellites do not transmit the coordinates of the target directly to the ammunition (I did not even know that such work was ongoing).

are underway. Americans with their SG do not even get real-time on even every carrier. from 25 minutes.


it was like that

NNSS: 1 - satellite position at time t1; 2 - satellite position at time t2; 3 - satellite position at time t3; 4 - satellite orbit; 5 - Doppler signals from the satellite to the tracking station; 6 - data received from a satellite in a discrete form comes from a tracking station to a computer center; 7 - signals of the orbit parameters and time correction from the data entry station are received in the satellite receiving equipment; 8 - the computing center sends the updated data of the orbit parameters to the data input station; 9 - data input station; 10 - computer center; 11 - tracking station; 12 - received coordinates of the object (longitude, latitude); 13 - computer; 14 — receiving equipment of an object; 15 - navigation signals, satellite orbit parameters, time and other information are received by the receiving equipment of the object.

Quote: bk316

It is necessary (at the same time) that the RTR satellites transmit target designations (albeit not directly),

RTR satellites are not GEO. All the time they "shift", go into the shadows, to the other side.
Need a complete communication system, global, satellite + wide channel.
It's funny, but GLONAS is 50-100kbps, and the superframe is 10

Quote: bk316

Liana + PC-28 + U-71

I doubt that Yu-71 will accept anything (and transfer to it)
1. Pointlessly too fast.
2. It’s technically very difficult (all antennas on the launched KAWS are CLEANED), on the Shuttle the same Ku-ant was hiding in a pot in order to receive something on the ammunition should be narrowly targeted.
How to realize and not burn / lose speed

[Rus2012]

Quote: shlang25

Or again a bike of journalists?

... this, according to your "bike", is distributed by the authorized Press Service of the RF Ministry of Defense!
Do you want you to be told and shown everything in a personal conversation and at the MCC?
How much honor?

[Rus2012]

Quote: mav1971

At least in Samara (where I live and where Peonies are made), people know about each satellite sent from the shops.

... sorry, where are "Peonies" made? :)))
Trolling is hard!
Wiki -

The satellite was created by the cooperation of TsNIRTI (Moscow), the Arsenal Engineering Plant (St. Petersburg) and TsSKB-Progress (Samara).

If there is a share of "Progress" in "Peonies" - then only docking with the carrier ...

[mav1971]

Quote: Rus2012

Quote: mav1971

At least in Samara (where I live and where Peonies are made), people know about each satellite sent from the shops.

... sorry, where are "Peonies" made? :)))
Trolling is hard!
Wiki -

The satellite was created by the cooperation of TsNIRTI (Moscow), the Arsenal Engineering Plant (St. Petersburg) and TsSKB-Progress (Samara).

If there is a share of "Progress" in "Peonies" - then only docking with the carrier ...

I don’t know about wikis.
About the assembly of Peonies at Progress at conferences they spoke back in 2000.
From there, my legs grow.

[Rus2012]

Quote: mav1971

About the assembly of Peonies at Progress at conferences they spoke back in 2000.
From there, my legs grow.

Who said Where is the confirmation? OBS ...
Once again, any information on VO requires evidence or references to reliable sources!
If they are NOT, it is recognized by gossip and rumors ...

[opus]

Quote: Rus2012

... sorry, where are "Peonies" made? :)))

Pion-NKS was created by FSUE Arsenal Design Bureau.
ABOUT ENTERPRISE
The main activities of the Arsenal Design Bureau are:
conducting research and development work on the creation of space systems, complexes and apparatuses for various purposes and their constituent elements;
conducting research and development work on the creation of naval automatic artillery and missile launchers;
development and manufacture of technological and testing equipment.
The production of spacecraft and other products developed by Arsenal Design Bureau is carried out by the Arsenal Engineering Plant www.mzarsenal.spb.ru under the technical supervision of the Design Bureau.
Since the beginning of the 2000's, Arsenal has been working to create a new generation of spacecraft designed for remote sensing of the Earth and to study the physics of the propagation of electromagnetic waves in near-Earth space.

Quote: mav1971

About the assembly of Peonies at Progress at conferences they spoke back in 2000.

"Rocket and Space Center" Progress "makes
The Resource-P space complex with the Resource-P spacecraft:

for high-detailed, detailed wide-angle and hyperspectral optical-electronic observation of the Earth’s surface and radio data transmission to ground-based information reception centers, planning QC targeted use, reception, processing and archiving of received information taking into account consumer applications: MPR, MES, Ministry of Agriculture, Rosreestr, Roshydromet , Rosrybolovstva.


Spacecraft Bion-M
Spacecraft Photon-M
Spacecraft "Bion"
Small spacecraft "AIST"
Experimental and technological small spacecraft "Aist-2D"

[Boa kaa]

Quote: mav1971

not a single peony over the past 7-8 years has passed ...

Maybe they are taken out at night when you sleep, you are our suspicious! In addition to the author, whom you clearly do not trust, there are other sources of information that say the following:

Among the variety of military and dual-use satellites, the newest and most technically equipped are the Lion satellites Pion and Lotus, which are part of the Liana space reconnaissance and targeting system. In 2013, Roscosmos and the Ministry of Defense completed the experimental creation of Liana and began to debug its systems. The system consists of four satellites, the last of which joined the group in 2015, which allows us to confirm the completion of the main part of this truly unique project in the history of Russian space exploration. The Lotosov tandem (Lotos-S 14Ф145) is responsible for radio intelligence and intercepts data, including negotiations of the enemy through any, even closed, communication channels. The Pionov tandem (PION-NKS 14F139) monitors the movement of military equipment on earth, aircraft in the air, ships in the seas and oceans. At the same time, these satellites are based at an altitude of about a thousand kilometers above the planet’s surface and scan all visible space on earth . The Liana system receives information, processes, "calculates" the enemy and transfers the coordinates to the command post where a virtual real-time map is formed. In the event of hostilities, precision targets can be fired at these targets. Compared with the MRSK Legenda-Tselina, the accuracy of Liana has grown more than 100 times - up to three meters. The new system has increased by an order of magnitude the capabilities of the Russian Armed Forces to detect and destroy enemy targets. By 2018, it is planned to completely complete the creation of the Liana system. Most likely - due to an increase in satellite constellation. At least now, the Arsenal machine-building plant has begun mass production of satellites of the new system. The total number, for obvious reasons, was not disclosed.

http://tvzvezda.ru/news/forces/content/2015091009
01-4r1o.htm

[opus]

Quote: Boa constrictor KAA

Maybe they take them out at night,

not everything is right.
"Pion-NKS" 14f139 is launched ONLY "Soyuz-2-1V" launch vehicle (with A-type fairing)

launches "Soyuz-2-1V"

FSUE Arsenal Design Bureau developed but the Arsenal Engineering Plant www.mzarsenal.spb.ru
not yet passed
"The Russian military orbital space group includes, according to official data, about 140" space reconnaissance "."

This is in theory and in presentations.
In fact, there is hardly 40% of the declared
1,5 "Lotos" (one can say that 1-n6-th radar reconnaissance spacecraft (11F688 - 2 pcs, 17FHH - 4 pcs) and 6 radio-technical reconnaissance spacecraft (Celina). Plus three dozen photo reconnaissance spacecraft and one spacecraft 11F664 optical-electronic reconnaissance "Araks" + double + on trifles
the author is simply not correct (or Shoigu )

Quote: Author

The key element of Liana is network of satellites of the Lotus-S and Pion-NKS families, the assembly of which is carried out at the Arsenal Engineering Plant (St. Petersburg). Their primary function is reconnaissance and target designation. For example, "Peony" is able to monitor armored vehicles from a height of thousands of kilometers, acting as a gunner in missile destruction of objects. The first satellite of the system went into space in 2010.

"network" - NO
1. 14Ф138 "Lotus-S" Cosmos-2455 in 2009, partially earned in 2010, consider lost
2.14Ф145 "Lotus-С1" Space-2502


3. PION-NKS 14f139 will be displayed (hopefully) in 2017

[OLD FART]

Quote: shlang25

acting as a gunner in missile destruction of objects

that is, satellite guidance is still there .. Or, again, a bike of journalists?

I think we have something that is called a "surprise" for those who want to check Russia again "by the teeth" ... It is not for nothing that Putin is so confident in foreign policy (of course, he bluffs somewhere, and yet ...) Hurray to shout it's too early for the men, but quietly go nuts, I think ...

[Sterlya]

Quote: STARPER

Quote: shlang25

acting as a gunner in missile destruction of objects

that is, satellite guidance is still there .. Or, again, a bike of journalists?

I think we have something that is called a "surprise" for those who want to check Russia again "by the teeth" ... It is not for nothing that Putin is so confident in foreign policy (of course, he bluffs somewhere, and yet ...) Hurray to shout it's too early for the men, but quietly go nuts, I think ...

Well, I'm the same Starper rather like YOU! Hooray I do not scream. but you are right. there is something. judging by the confidence of the Commander in Chief.

[cap]

Quote: STARPER

Hurray to scream too early while men, but quietly goofy with glasses you can think ... drinks

++

[OLD FART]

Quote: cap

Quote: STARPER

Hurray to scream too early while men, but quietly goofy with glasses you can think ... drinks

++

Well, for our Kulibins ...
Thank you very much for surviving in the 90s and not betraying mother Russia ..!

[Boa kaa]

Quote: STARPER

we have what is called a "surprise" for those who want to check Russia again "by the teeth"

Premonitions did not deceive him !!! (from)
Vitaly, you probably look into the crystal ball of Zhirinovsky!

Already under development fifth generation satellites, capable of, figuratively speaking, not just looking beyond the horizon, but also “digging” into the holy of holies of any general staff - in maps and electronic documents with the highest security stamp.

[Mystery12345]

this is really a cool thing from the future ....

[demchuk.ig]

If I am not mistaken, it was previously stated that when this system starts to work, then "Calibers will be able to work on aircraft carrier groups at their maximum range of more than 2 thousand km!"

[Rus2012]

Quote: demchuk.ig

, then "Calibers will be able to work on aircraft carrier groups at their maximum range of more than 2 thousand km!"

... and not only the Kyrgyz Republic.
This will allow to give target designation and BPCR

[mav1971]

Quote: demchuk.ig

If I am not mistaken, it was previously stated that when this system starts to work, then "Calibers will be able to work on aircraft carrier groups at their maximum range of more than 2 thousand km!"

The Liana system will work only with "its" ground communication stations.
Information transfer to other recipients is not currently provided.

[Rus2012]

Quote: mav1971

The Liana system will work only with "its" ground communication stations.
Information transfer to other recipients is not currently provided.

..it’s you otherwise Shoigu himself or the Commander-in-Chief Bondarev whispered ?;))))))))))

PS: if you affirm something, please be kind enough to provide the honorable public reading VO proofs or links to reliable sources, do not be compared with the OBS ...

[mav1971]

Quote: Rus2012

..it’s you otherwise Shoigu himself or the Commander-in-Chief Bondarev whispered ?;))))))))))

PS: if you affirm something, please be kind enough to provide the honorable public reading VO proofs or links to reliable sources, do not be compared with the OBS ...

Learn to search for information yourself.
Look thoughtfully and most likely you will find phrases like:

principle of the system:
real-time object detection
transfer of coordinates to the CCP
Formation of a card card on the CCP in Ril-time (possibly virtual with augmented reality elements)
deciding on the CCP strike
Targeting from CKP to ships for striking

Those. the system is formed centralized.
The issuance of target designation bypassing the CCU - is not currently provided by the system.

[Rus2012]

Quote: mav1971

Learn to search for information yourself.
Look thoughtfully and most likely you will find phrases like:

... so, mister good, I did not ask to poke YOU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
About -

Quote: mav1971

principle of the system:
real-time object detection
transfer of coordinates to the CCP
Formation of a card card on the CCP in Ril-time (possibly virtual with augmented reality elements)
deciding on the CCP strike
Targeting from CKP to ships for striking
Those. the system is formed centralized.
Issuance of target designation bypassing the CCP - currently not provided by the system.

your citations without references to TK, TU and RE, especially your personal fabrications YAZ - unproven flooding and Trolling topics!

[dauria]

PS: if you say something, please be kind enough to provide the honorable public who read VO

Well, how can I tell you ... If this comrade knew something, then with such a talkative language the verb "knew" will be so in the past tense. Those who know are silent, and for a very long time. Those who have just heard out of their ears are chirping, and even then, until they are really shocked.

[Rus2012]

Quote: dauria

e, who knows, they are silent, and for a very long time. Just heard by the edge of the ear are tweeting, and even then, until they are truly scolded.

+ 1!
I agree!
The only thing I can add
A lot of things have been revealed since the collapse of the Union, especially after the Maidan. When many of our colleagues from Ukraine put on subscriptions and decided to untie the languages ​​and talk about the Past ...

[ghby]

Quote: mav1971

The Liana system will work only with "its" ground communication stations. Information transmission to other recipients is not provided at the moment.

It’s always fun to read a discussion of the technical characteristics and capabilities of secret technology. Someone constantly appears and confidently asserts the presence or absence of any possibility, well, or the size of any parameter. Yes, and justifying information from the Internet. (there should be a smiley beating his head against the wall)

[Serg4545]

Honestly, I don’t understand why use such a system to detect AUG?
In the 70s of the last century there was no other way out, but now! Passive detection has made a huge leap forward. An aircraft carrier, even with its radars turned off, emits in the electromagnetic spectrum thousands of times more than even the most powerful radar on a satellite can reflect from its hull. Sources of radiation: two nuclear reactors, a large number of electronics, hundreds of electric motors, hundreds of thousands of kilometers of cables and wiring, etc. All this "fonites" with such an intensity that the radar on the satellite, compared to this, is like a flashlight against a ship's searchlight. But soon they will use electromagnetic catapults!
Type in Yandex: passive detection and you will see a large number of such systems.
The advantages of passive detection systems are enormous: there is no radiating antenna, therefore, a powerful source of energy (reactor) is unnecessary. As a result, a multiple decrease in weight and dimensions. At the same time, a significant expansion of the controlled space. After all, the width of the radar beam is limited by the power of the emitter, and at the same time it scans the empty ocean most of the time, hoping to find the carcass of a ship in it. Passive systems do not have these restrictions, the ships themselves signal their location by their "vital activity".

[bk316]

Honestly, I don’t understand why use such a system to detect AUG?

AUG is in progress, somewhere in the New Zealand area it is necessary to place passive tracking devices there (and around the world), they must transmit data in real time, they must be protected. Well, along our coasts it is clear that passive systems form the basis. In general, passive ground (underwater) means complement the system and do not replace it.
Well, you need to understand that AUG is a very easy target for such a system, a full-fledged system for an instant global strike really should detect a target like a separate car. And AUG is already a bonus.

[Serg4545]

So, you can place passive systems on satellites and have been placing them for quite some time!
In fact, most reconnaissance satellites collect information passively.
And since a simpler solution was found to detect the same AUGs, the grouping of satellites with active sensing is not increased. No reason.

[bk316]

And who told me, we have nothing like garbage, lotuses and peonies about two times and miscalculated?
And what did I answer? That's right: no one here knows what components of the systems are installed on civilian satellites (which are not at all civilian) and on the military, which would seem to be completely non-targeting satellites.

And I do not know, but the analysis of what was launched and most importantly it was planned to be launched in the USSR gives a very definite answer.
And in the near future, after adopting the PC-28 with the Yu-71, all US aircraft carriers with their missile defense destroyers and hundreds of axes are just rubbish, or a mass grave (whatever)

In fact, this is what it is, what the mattresses talked about (global disarming strike): 45 minutes and AUG, wherever it is no longer.

[Rus2012]

Quote: bk316

In fact, this is what it is, what the mattresses talked about (global disarming strike): 45 minutes and AUG, wherever it is no longer.

... Inna AUG, for Russia it is almost safe.
Here is the Peony system, as stated "able to monitor armored vehicles from a height of thousands of kilometers, acting as a gunner in missile destruction of objects", which means that it is capable of keeping "on sight" and giving target designation for timely destruction and
boards "number one" in a jogging parking lot, limousines of first persons ... and similar mobile targets - at "intercontinental range and hypersonic speeds" :))))))))))))))))))))

[bk316]

and similar mobile targets - at "intercontinental range and hypersonic speeds" :))))))))))))))))))))

This is not the next stage, and then every little thing is a separate snipers, drones there ......
By the way, you’re wrong at the MCC, they won’t show anything like that, it’s a bit wrong, but you can look elsewhere with the appropriate clearance.

[Rus2012]

Quote: mav1971

And you carried nonsense.
and the author of the local little article also bears nonsense, for the first satellite of Liana for the last 10 years began to be collected in the 2015 year and has not yet been collected.

the answer to the rampant and evil storyteller -

"Liana" did not bent and currently there are at least three spacecraft in orbits (and as in fact, only VKS specialists know) three spacecraft:
14F138 "Lotus-S"
14F139 "Pion-NKS"
14F145 "Lotus-S"
This is not counting the 6 te-ka radar reconnaissance ...

and they are launched, from the information in the I-net -
20.11.2009 13:44:00 14Ф138 «Лотос-С» Космос-2455
25.12.2014 06:01 14Ф145 «Лотос-С1» Космос-2502

[mav1971]

Quote: Rus2012

the answer to the rampant and evil storyteller -

The lotuses are not operational at the moment.
There is no infrastructure. no grouping.
One is lost for control precisely, the second is controlled but alone cannot do anything.

Well, take a question at least a little deeper than Wikipedia.
There is information, only learn to dig deeper ...
About Liana for the last 3 years I am writing here for the third time ..

[Rus2012]

Quote: mav1971

The lotuses are not operational at the moment.
There is no infrastructure. no grouping.
One is lost for control precisely, the second is controlled but alone cannot do anything.
Well, take a question at least a little deeper than Wikipedia.
There is information, only learn to dig deeper ...
About Liana for the last 3 years I am writing here for the third time ..

o5 - 25!
Where is the confirmation?

Shoigu claims the opposite.
And whom to believe?
IMERYAK or to the Minister, who did not give an occasion to doubt his competence and words? :))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

And by the way, from the same wicked Wiki -

Lotus-S (GUKOS index - 14Ф138, 14Ф145) - a series of Russian radio intelligence satellites being one of the components of the new generation Liana electronic intelligence system (RTR).

[bk316]

And whom to believe?

Yes, a person wants to believe in what he says no matter what, let him believe.
What does the Minister of Defense say to him, he knows more, and what he does not know, he will further analyze.
Fanaticism (blind faith) is not only religious or ideological. If he doesn’t bother anyone, well, for God's sake.

And about "Liana" I can guess how the next piece of information will be delivered. Recently, it has become the corporate identity of the Ministry of Defense: somewhere in the next report from the NTSUO in the background, purely by chance, the Liana control console will flash from which it will become clear that the satellites are not 2 or 3, but those 140, well, maybe 100

[Boa kaa]

Quote: mav1971

not a single ground station has been set up for working with a liana.

What for? Our experts in Krasnoznamensk have been engaged in monitoring and managing existing facilities (Space Testing and Control Center - GITSIU CS named after German Titov).

[Vlad5307]

In light of the statements of the SGA officials about the need to modernize their nuclear potential and efforts to put pressure on the Russian Federation, Shoigu's statement sounds like a warning - we have something with a “screw” for your "cunning moves"! So be careful!

[Former battalion commander]

All this is wonderful, BUT! How about disabling such a satellite with a laser beam? All such things have a very weak spot in the form of a CCD matrix, which is easy to burn with a laser beam. To provide protection against laser attack, VERY SERIOUS work is required. I'm not sure that it was done by making these satellites, and therefore the whole system is operational BEFORE THE FIRST SERIOUS BREATH. And there most likely she will be blinded, even the satellites do not need to be shot down ...

[Muvka]

And how do you determine that a given PION satellite?

[mav1971]

Quote: Muvka

And how do you determine that a given PION satellite?

Easily.
1. this http://www.n2yo.com/satellite/?s=31792 Russian new generation satellite "Renewed Celina". Radio-technical intelligence
2. this https://www.n2yo.com/satellite/?s=38101 nuclear strike warning satellite. Built 5 years ago, but junk is as ancient as a mammoth. But due to the lack of new projects, they built the old one. It seems to cope with the work.
and such examples, where are the satellites, which satellites are a million.
Even what NORAD cannot identify is determined very quickly with the help of tens of thousands of "civilian amateurs" ...
Something like this.

[Rus2012]

Quote: Former Combat

All this is wonderful, BUT! How about disabling such a satellite with a laser beam? All such things have a very weak spot in the form of a CCD matrix, which is easy to burn with a laser beam. To provide protection against laser attack, VERY SERIOUS work is required. I'm not sure that it was done by making these satellites, and therefore the whole system is operational BEFORE THE FIRST SERIOUS BREATH. And there most likely she will be blinded, even the satellites do not need to be shot down ...

... protection options are known:
- pre-protection of matrices with quickly cloudy disposable nozzles, similar to "anti-nuclear shutters" of pilots
- satellites activated according to the schedule, the rest of the time the "eyes" are closed and protected.
- spacecraft launch after the "first wave".

In the end, the SA was ready to fight with weapons of the previous generation (for example, WWII weapons) ...
After all, by that time the enemy would also have neither the WTO nor GPS

[just exp]

Not sure,

this is the main thing in your post.
and so the military knows that there are losses at the front, moreover, they are not ready for them. second, the satellite can be protected from optical radiation, starting with filters (there are such filters on new MANPADS that protect MANPADS missiles from President-S type stations), ending with the design of the optical system that does not allow any radiation to enter from the side. that is, only the "light" that is directly under the lens will enter the lens, the simplest design is a tube. and if a 100-100 km square is visible in the tube, then it is possible to radiate only from this square. but what shines on the side of the tube does not hit the lens.

[opus]

Quote: Former battalion commander

All this is wonderful, BUT! How about disabling such a satellite with a laser beam?

Derive ... if you find a suitable laser.
These are only BUT satellites

and only at a certain latitude / longitude of the searcher

Quote: Former battalion commander

All such things have a very weak spot in the form of a CCD matrix

14F145 "Lotos-C1" is a satellite electronic intelligence

photoelectronic devices are not critical for him
.
Yes (you must) get into the CCD-matrix

with 1000 then km, for an object with V = 8 km / s

[Boa kaa]

Quote: Former battalion commander

I'm not sure that it was done by making these satellites, and therefore the whole system is operational BEFORE THE FIRST SERIOUS BREATH.

Here you are - a former battalion commander ... And you were puzzled by this problem.
So do you really think that the "uncles of designers", who have devoted their whole life to the development of space systems, have never come to their attic? And they, realizing the full measure of responsibility for the country's defense, brushed it off and continued to sculpt a hunchback !?
Well, delirium is pure water! Himself not ashamed?

[APASUS]

I personally am not surprised, although it is the merit of so many, but still.
We made one order for Shoigu on construction, when he was just starting his work in the Russian rescue corps. Then it was already clear that he was very versed in all kinds of electronic gadgets and then the programmers office worked for him. And most importantly, he implemented a lot in this area, which is very unusual for our officials of those times.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

An article in a series of rampant optimism

Some segments of the system, according to some sources of information, were used during the Syrian campaign in reconnaissance of targets and their destruction by cruise missiles.

According to some sources ... well, not funny. Generally speaking, at least some reconnaissance satellites could be used to destroy STATIONARY targets (against which cruise missiles were used) - this is not an achievement.

For example, "Peony" is able to monitor armored vehicles from a height of thousands of kilometers, playing the role of a gunner in missile destruction of objects.

Yes, and that’s wonderful. In principle, as I understand it, for that Liana was done. But here's the thing

The key to the effective operation of the Liana system is the timely launch of target satellites into orbit in order to maintain the orbital constellation of military spacecraft

And where to get it?

At the moment, it has at least 140 devices for various purposes.

More precisely, 2 pieces of Lotus-S (only one is fully functional) and, it seems, one Peony-NKS

[Mestny]

Ufff ... Well, finally, he came and explained - that again everything is rusty and in the amount of one and a half copies.
And I’m already worried about the beginning that all-round dancemen are not visible.

[OLD FART]

Quote: Mestny

Ufff ... Well, finally, he came and explained - that again everything is rusty and in the amount of one and a half copies.
And I’m already worried about the beginning that all-round dancemen are not visible.

The same feeling was ...! And now I’ve calmed down, then the truth is still there .... Dollars and shekels are credited to them at the expense of hope ..))) Just kidding, of course .. While we hold on and this is important!

[Mestny]

Oh well. Calm, calm.
People forever before the battles tried to cheer themselves up with a word or good news. So difficulties are easier to overcome, and in general the mood is better.
Conversely, whiners and all-wearers have never been in honor. And in especially serious cases they happened and in general, that ...
It is better to "boast on the army walking" rather than vice versa, crawl into the nearest ditch wrapped in a sheet with bitter lamentations about "we are telling the truth."

[Senior manager]

Mav1971. Grind further, Klava to help you.

[Boa kaa]

Quote: mav1971

Everyone is trying on the merits of their ancestors to go on a goat to paradise ..

Respected! You are so kind as to decide!
If to leave (on a goat, of course!) - then From Paradise..
Well, if you still want to To heaven - that’s better, as usual, on someone else’s ... uh ... (well let it be!) hump whether! The goat is clearly not suitable here!

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Mestny

Ufff ... Well, finally, he came and explained - that again everything is rusty and in the amount of one and a half copies.

Unlike you, I track the news on Liana very closely. And a little bit aware of the fact that according to the plans that existed earlier by 2014, "Liana" was to be partially deployed in the amount of as many as 4 (FOUR) satellites. 2 Lotus and 2 Peonies. But ... difficulties arose.
And the squadron of star-destrovers mentioned by the author, consisting of 140 units, is simply a stupid fantasy that never had anything to do with reality.

Quote: Mestny

But I’m already worried about the start of the fact that the traditional round dance

Well, believe in the 140 satellites of Liana :))) Do you even compare the number of flights into space with the number of 140 satellites :))) Or do they multiply in space by budding? :)))

[OLD FART]

Quote: mav1971

Tell the dealer’s phone, I also want such grass ... :)

Everything was gone, I’ll shoot myself ... and I will betray the Homeland!
Here is a respected telephone number 8 [phone] .... (just don’t mention my name and nickname ...)

[OLD FART]

Quote: mav1971

Go sleep better ... with your wife ...
otherwise you will start "threatening" in PM again ...
You’re our special forces soldier.

You are rude in vain ... Okay, write, in Vick they always write the truth there ..

[mav1971]

Quote: STARPER

Quote: mav1971

Go sleep better ... with your wife ...
otherwise you will start "threatening" in PM again ...
You’re our special forces soldier.

You are rude in vain ... Okay, write, in Vick they always write the truth there ..

I do not take anything from Wikipedia.
I don’t need it.

To write one or two lines here - I once read thousands and thousands of pages of documents ...
Only when it was necessary, for example, to remember about the "secret civilian" satellites, did I go online, but ...
the search engine received a slightly different phrase from me, and it didn’t even show me the wikipedia.

You need to be able to use the Internet - there are hundreds of times the correct information. than wikipedia ...

[opus]

Quote: mav1971

What kind of detection are we talking about?
A satellite from a height of 900km will be able to see the tank? Are you out of your mind then?

maybe maybe
They are with SAR, which allow to receive new geoproducts in a short time - digital elevation models, maps of soil displacements and displacements, maps of moving objects with an estimate of the speed and direction of movement, oil spills, vessel movements, ice conditions, etc.
In magnifying glass mode, the maximum resolution is less than one meter.
PALSAR counterparts but improved


Because there are few of them (SC RTR), and we do not have a "normal" communication system SC-KP yet, then
for this reason, the received data is first buffered on the satellite. The satellite memory is limited to *** GB, which allows receiving no more than ** images per day (it is possible that this limitation also arises due to the energy consumed and the bandwidth of the communication channel).

We are waiting for the VRLK "Kasatka-R" (2017)


Digital Beam Forming Technology (DBF-Digital Beam Forming) + Broadband Polarimetric Digital Active Phased Array (AFAR).
It will make it possible to receive large-size radar images of the Earth’s surface from high orbit with high spatial resolution up to 0,3-1,0 m

[midshipman]

I remember photos taken from space, where all the goals are different. I have the honor.

[Aleksey_K]

Quote: mav1971

At least in Samara (where I live and where Peonies are made) people know about every satellite sent from the shops :). not a single peony over the past 7-8 years has passed ...

But this "message" of yours to the prosecutor's office will be very useful. You look and stop divulging military secrets for many years to come.

[mav1971]

Quote: Алексей_К

Quote: mav1971

At least in Samara (where I live and where Peonies are made) people know about every satellite sent from the shops :). not a single peony over the past 7-8 years has passed ...

But this "message" of yours to the prosecutor's office will be very useful. You look and stop divulging military secrets for many years to come.

The whole city or something to plant together with the prosecutor?

it feels like you have nothing to say, and you're just trying to scare me ...
Intimidate a city of one and a half million ...
Come and start scaring!
Personally!
Straight from the station!

Threat, kindergarten!

[Aleksey_K]

Quote: mav1971

so the author of the article lied to everyone. Wishful thinking.
Fantasy turned into reality.
Ordinary demonscale-winged ...
Afftoru count aspen for a lie.

I cannot assert the veracity of the article and vice versa - I cannot, I don’t know. But I will tell you one example from my "secret" life. It was half a century ago and information is out of date. Working at a military plant, he was holding a special purpose MPP (multilayer printed circuit board) in his hands. The hardware developer said that a few of these boards would be enough to stop America in 20 minutes. But even in our time, everyone "swears" that it takes 30-40 minutes to get to America. I wonder if he was lying? I think not! The country does a lot in the strictest secrecy, but what it gives out to the press is true for its enemies. As with Calibers. Everyone thought their range was of the order of 300 km, but it turned out that they could fly at 2500, and even further with a land base.

[mav1971]

Quote: Алексей_К

I can not argue about the veracity of the article and vice versa - I can not, I do not know.

And you try to turn on the brain and double-check this article.
Try it, because it’s really easy.
Spend an hour of your life searching for truly reliable information.
For you, initially there will be an hour or two.
Then forty minutes, then 20.
When you learn search algorithms, everything will take 5-10 minutes.

What do you get?
You will receive reliable information in which you will be sure that you did not lie, that you viewed the situation from several angles and points of view.
You just learn how to create

analysis

.
It is very useful in life.
Even the household ...
Try it.
It's never too late.

Maybe then you will learn to understand the types of missiles and their characteristics. start to understand what they have a difference in and stop writing about Caliber what you are writing now and maybe even you will be a little ashamed of what you wrote earlier ...

[Aleksey_K]

Quote: mav1971

Quote: Алексей_К

Quote: mav1971

At least in Samara (where I live and where Peonies are made) people know about every satellite sent from the shops :). not a single peony over the past 7-8 years has passed ...

But this "message" of yours to the prosecutor's office will be very useful. You look and stop divulging military secrets for many years to come.

The whole city or something to plant together with the prosecutor?

it feels like you have nothing to say, and you're just trying to scare me ...
Intimidate a city of one and a half million ...
Come and start scaring!
Personally!
Straight from the station!

Threat, kindergarten!

We have several military factories in Yekaterinburg, but something nobody really knows what they produce. But traitors and talkers, it’s necessary, it’s necessary to the wall, and at least 1.5 of a million, you’re traitors and talkers, such as you are not needed by the motherland, well, except for amnesty - use it in logging and in mines

[mav1971]

Quote: Алексей_К

We have several military factories in Yekaterinburg, but something nobody really knows what they produce. But traitors and talkers, it’s necessary, it’s necessary to the wall, and at least 1.5 of a million, you’re traitors and talkers, such as you are not needed by the motherland, well, except for amnesty - use it in logging and in mines

How absurd you are ...
And do not tell us tales here ...
I’ll tell you the story of my then 1 department.
One enterprise in the region made military-space products.
Piece.
By order.
Secret.
But the thing was that the transportation of this product was arranged so that all 220 kilometers of the way - everyone knew that he was traveling.
For 20 years this very product was transported on a trailer in a "rag garage". At the same time of the day.
In the same rag imitation of an iron garage.
All the inhabitants of the city in which they produced knew, the inhabitants of the villages knew. past which we drove.
Every dog ​​knew.
The first department puffed out its cheeks in public, but did not publicly "swear" from the stupidity of the situation.
So.
What I'm talking about,
Modern means of searching for information do not need talkers at all.
And the same satellite is being tracked in orbit much better than you can even imagine.
And tens of thousands of lovers do this better. than the GRU and the CIA combined.
They calculate the orbits, they intercept and even try to decrypt the radio.
Yes Yes.
In the world, a huge number of extravagant specialists. Specialists, especially extravagant, whether they are on duty. or simply "at the behest of the soul" a terrible force.

You are just a man divorced from reality.
If you personally do not know. what is being done in your E-burg is your personal misfortune.
The rest know it.

Are you generally familiar with the system of public procurement and government contracts?
Do you know what each purchase. required to go through a public contract?
of course, they are "veiled" - but they are public !!!
They can be found for anyone who wants and then pulling one string, a second, a third, comparing another ten, hundred, or a thousand third-party parameters - just to clarify everything!
This is called analytics.
You are simply a chap with a saber!
without knowledge, skills and understanding of realities!

[Old26]

Quote: bk316

And in the near future, after adopting the PC-28 with the Yu-71, all US aircraft carriers with their missile defense destroyers and hundreds of axes are just rubbish, or a mass grave (whatever)

Wow ..... Damn, but is the fuss already completely sickened? What, RS-28 has already become an anti-ship missile? And the Yu-71 has a powerful radar for aiming on ships ???

Quote: Rus2012

Here is the Pion system, as it is stated, "is able to monitor armored vehicles from a height of thousands of kilometers, performing the role of a gunner in case of missile destruction of objects," which means that it is capable of keeping "on sight" and giving target designation for timely destruction and

Guys! What tanks !!!! In fact, the Liana system is MARINE SPACE EXPLORATION AND TARGET SYSTEM. I will repeat MARINE... For the coming years, there is no need to talk about any workable system. The minimum "set" is two satellites of the "Lotus" type and 2 satellites of the "Pion" type. The first "Peony" is planned for 2017. When the second is generally unknown, but not earlier than 2019 (there are no materials for 2019 on the network yet). Three "Vines will be launched, as they usually write in 201x. But for 2017 and 2018 they are also not observed

[Rus2012]

Quote: Old26

"Liana" is a MARINE SPACE INTELLIGENCE AND POINTING SYSTEM. I repeat MARINE.

...Yes? Mb once wanted to do so.

But! There are indirect rumors that it will be interspecific. And provide the necessary data to all interested ...
That is why it takes a long time to "harness"
Otherwise, naf to each his own garden to fence ?;)

[Old26]

Quote: mav1971

Do you know what each purchase. required to go through a public contract?
of course, they are "veiled" - but they are public !!!

Several years ago, the same analysis could be done about the reconstruction of mines for launching products under the 4202 program. Moreover, the analysis of that information crossed out all this bullshit with the publication both in our media and in the Western designations of this "glider". But who cares to read this? yes, rarely to anyone.
Just above, one comrade has already repeated the designation Yu-71 with reference to the RS-28. To him, the truth is probably unaware that the designation of "payload" in the Strategic Missile Forces is completely different. and the RS-28 simply physically cannot have a product with the designation Yu-71. It will be completely different

[mav1971]

Quote: Old26

Quote: mav1971

Do you know what each purchase. required to go through a public contract?
of course, they are "veiled" - but they are public !!!

Several years ago, the same analysis could be done about the reconstruction of mines for launching products under the 4202 program. Moreover, the analysis of that information crossed out all this bullshit with the publication both in our media and in the Western designations of this "glider". But who cares to read this? yes, rarely to anyone.

I read maybe this open source "research" ...
Very informative for spies and other Chapaevites ...
You mean this example: http://www.vpk-news.ru/articles/24407 ?

[Old26]

Quote: Алексей_К

We have several military factories in Yekaterinburg, but something nobody really knows what they produce. But traitors and talkers, it’s necessary, it’s necessary to the wall, and at least 1.5 of a million, you’re traitors and talkers, such as you are not needed by the motherland, well, except for amnesty - use it in logging and in mines

Sorry, but repeating the words of Stanislavsky I’ll say: I DO NOT BELIEVE. They may not know the details, but there are so many unmasking factors that to say that no one knows anything is sorry stupidity.
I’ll give a couple of examples, as I brought just above the comrade mav1971. Our Soviet system of secrecy sometimes went wild.
City N-sk. In the city was KB, which produced some products for the CPC them. Gagarin. And the 1st department secreted it terribly. A legend was developed that the design bureau is doing something completely different, and this is finding a different application in schools ... But what about the astronauts who were quite frequent guests in this design bureau? And the whole city not only knew the main thing - KB works for space, but also laughed at these attempts to secret.

The second insanity from the series of secrecy. We had a department in the corresponding firm near Moscow that looked through western technical magazines and mercilessly removed from them everything that related to Soviet military equipment. The whole world knew that we were "no way".
Moreover, in such reference books as "Space Flight" in each issue were published data from NORAD and NASA, indicating the satellites, their mass and size characteristics and what kind of satellites they are, their purpose. The information was terribly secret .... Terrible.

A similar situation, though less senile, was with Western military-technical reference books. Such a magazine as "Foreign Military Review" often published materials from the reference book "Jane". But you could get your hands on the reference book in the Public Scientific and Technical Library (Moscow). The directory was in a closed fund. a letter from management was required. But if you got it in your hands - that's it. You can copy any pages for money or make a photocopy of the pages. At the same time, for some of the key enterprises of our military-industrial complex, there were satellite images and a description of what they were doing. so this is the "open secret". Try to hide the products of the same Uralvagonzavod, proving to the residents that the plant is exceptionally peaceful and produces only wagons ...
And you say in the city no one knows anything ... You got excited about my friend with such a statement

[Old26]

Quote: mav1971

Do you mean this example: http://www.vpk-news.ru/articles/24407?

Well, this is far from the worst example.

[Zomanus]

Great news. And with the development of tracking technology, you can reduce
losses among gunners and scouts.
Here are some more good news. On the line about Ukraine, pay attention ...
http://rusnext.ru/news/1484244730

[Old26]

Quote: Rus2012

..Yes? Mb once wanted to do so.

But! There are indirect rumors that it will be interspecific. And provide the necessary data to all interested ...
That is why it takes a long time to "harness"
Otherwise, naf to each his own garden to fence ?;)

This could be believed if the number of satellites were large. But, sorry, a satellite in a sun-synchronous orbit plus 2 on a circular 900-km will hardly be able to provide even 100% of the time coverage of the oceans, let alone land. No, technically they can also inspect the land, but after all, it is in the maritime surveillance and target designation system that we have a "failure"
Do not assume that we will launch a couple of satellites and that's it. This will be a panacea. It's like now with "Tundra". One was launched and screams .... Even some do not understand that at least 6-8 satellites are needed for normal coverage. Half geostationary, half high elliptical orbit

[Arameev]

great!

The key to the effective operation of the Liana system is the timely launch of satellites into orbit in order to maintain the orbital constellation of military spacecraft. At the moment, it has at least 140 devices for various purposes.

Ahrenet! 140 devices only one system. cool! well done ...

[Aleksey_K]

Quote: Boa constrictor KAA

Vitaly, you probably look into the crystal ball of Zhirinovsky!

Usually, fortune tellers look into a copper basin with water.