Tender for 7.3 billion dollars given by Russian manufacturers of the fifth generation fighter without a fight

According to the newspaper "Izvestia", the fifth-generation T-50 fighter manufacturers did not fight with foreign competitors for a lucrative tender for 7.3 billion dollars, which was announced by South Korea. As the representatives of the Russian aviation industry explained, there are several reasons for this. The first is that Russia does not want secret developments to fall to South Korea’s American allies. The second is that manufacturers do not hope to win. And the third is that the mass production of widely publicized T-50 has not yet been fully launched.


Rossiyskaya Gazeta notes that South Korea plans to acquire 60 fighter units that will guard the skies over Korea for the next thirty years as part of the completion of the third phase of the FX project aimed at rearming the Air Force. This transaction has already been called the “contract of the century” due to its unprecedented scale of procurement for South Korea.

Reception of applications to the organizing committee of the tender was stopped at the end of last week. According to the results, it turned out that Eurofighter Typhoon from the European concern EADS, the Gripen fighter from the Swedish SAAB, and two representatives will fight for Korean billions aviation US industries - F-35 (Lightning-II) from Lockheed Martin and F-15SE (Silent Eagle) from Boeing. Earlier in the newspaper The Korea Times, citing the Defense Procurement Agency of South Korea, information appeared that the Russian OKB Sukhoi was planning to compete with its T-50 fighter (PAK FA).

However, now it became known that the leadership of the United Aircraft Corporation was not even going to put up the Russian fighter jets for the competition. According to the source "Izvestia" in the KLA, the practices used in the T-50 are classified. While only three prototypes of this aircraft have been created, there is no export option among them yet. In addition, he noted that South Korea is an ally of the United States, so it was hardly worth expecting that they would choose Russian aircraft, not American ones.

But the main reason for the refusal of the Russian manufacturer to participate in the tender, according to the director of the Institute for Strategic Evaluations and Analysis, Alexander Konovalov, is that the developers are not yet ready to present a competitive version of the fifth-generation fighter to the court of experts. According to him, so far there is only a hint of this development, and the requirements in international tenders are very high - their onboard systems must be able to receive and process a huge amount of information, be equipped with a very powerful computer, be able to develop supersonic speed and remain invisible to radars.

The expert added that Americans use small copper rings in fighter coatings to reduce radio sight, but for now we do not use it. In addition, Konovalov noted that the mass production of T-50 has not yet begun at any of the aircraft manufacturing plants.

The T-50 was developed as a Russian response to the American F-22 and F-35 fighters. By the end of the year, flight test machines must be completed. And in 2013, they plan to start testing new missiles for it. It was shown to the general public last summer at the MAKS-2011 air show.

In addition, the Director of the World Trade Analysis Center weapons Igor Korotchenko believes that at the moment the T-50 project does not need financial support from Koreans. According to him, Russia has plans to sign a large contract with India, which has already expressed a desire to acquire 250 new T-50 fighter jets. Therefore, the loss of a hypothetical seven billion will not be critical for the project. He also mentioned that Russia already had experience in fighting for South Korean tenders, which showed that they were still betting on the United States.

Most likely, the suspicions that the tender is just an empty formality, and the preferences already given to partners from the United States, are by no means groundless. The Korean TV channel MBN made public the information that Seoul had already paid about a million dollars for the documentation of one of the American applicants F-35 before the tender was announced. This suggests that the political decision to purchase the F-35 has already been made, although, according to experts, in an honest competition, at least one more aircraft, the Eurofighter Typhoon, can compete with the American fighter.

Russia took part in a tender for the South Korean Air Force back in 2002. The Su-35 then lost the F-15 manufactured in the USA. However, it is worth noting that the purchase of Russian military equipment for the South Korean army was still made. Armed with them now stand Tanks T-80U and BMP-3.

Independent Military Review recalled that Russians, Europeans and Americans had recently taken part in a tender announced by India, which involves the delivery of a multi-purpose aircraft under the MMRCA program. Russia introduced the MiG-35, which, however, did not become the winner. The leaders were the French Rafale and the European Typhoon.
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  1. esaul 1 February 2012 08: 11 New
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    First, Russia does not want secret developments to fall into the American allies.
    And the third - the serial production of the widely publicized T-50 is still not completely finished.
    These two, of the three given in the article, are most likely the most likely! I doubt very much that the hashs abandoned the struggle only out of fear, a priori, to be defeated! What people make fun of - when our combat aircraft immediately got the stigma of "bad" ?!
    1. gor
      gor 1 February 2012 09: 33 New
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      in fact, in order to exhibit something, you need to have this something. And the T-50 is just a glider, and until it is a full-fledged combat aircraft, it still has to step and step
      1. dmitri077
        dmitri077 1 February 2012 13: 01 New
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        "in fact, in order to exhibit something, you need to have this something. and the T-50 is just a glider and he still has to step and step before a full-fledged combat aircraft" - I completely agree! with a “pork snout in the ranks.” ... for today the t-50 is still a bluff! and it’s not a fact what else to do ... but customers need HERE AND NOW "... and the quality of our wonderful copies is often" lame "... it's obvious lol , such an impression, is secret from his taxpayer rather ... storytellers
        1. подводник 2 February 2012 12: 01 New
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          With what fright did you begin to consider Russian planes yours.
          Ukraine has again become Little Russia? Our border guards are in the Carpathians? Your President Medvedev?
        2. knight 77
          knight 77 2 February 2012 21: 00 New
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          while Serdyukov is engaged in the "reform" of our aircraft and military-industrial complex from PAK-FA, only the French Mirage can be obtained - this is in the best case, and in the future can repeat the fate of the Su-47, there was also a promising project
      2. SSR
        SSR 2 February 2012 21: 15 New
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        gor,
        well, there’s one moment ... they are promoting the Pindos .... although they don’t sell ...... (for almost 10 years, they have sold Sikoka for a “hillock?” they didn’t even put a single impudent .. and yes .. blah show ... and yes
        and so yes .. nefig to sell unlucky.
    2. nokki 1 February 2012 09: 52 New
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      By the way, if our developments were bad, all countries would simply have turned off espionage activities against us. And on the contrary, it is getting stronger! The same Koreans are chasing both our specialists and technical innovations in the field of electronics, they are inviting graduates of our universities to work in South Korea ...
      1. dmitri077
        dmitri077 1 February 2012 13: 02 New
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        "all countries would simply wage espionage activity against us" - intelligence is ALWAYS ALWAYS and CONTINUOUS! this is the law!
        1. Regularis
          Regularis 1 February 2012 23: 26 New
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          Quote: dmitri077
          "all countries would simply wage espionage activity against us" - intelligence is ALWAYS ALWAYS and CONTINUOUS! this is the law!

          Yes, this law is as true as the fact that you are a victim of abortion is a mistake of nature fellow
      2. knight 77
        knight 77 2 February 2012 21: 11 New
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        our developers are excellent, but officials are not clear on whose side, the campaign on the side of the one who will pay the most, so I won’t be surprised when PAK-FA will appear in India ahead than in Russia
    3. Krilion 2 February 2012 02: 46 New
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      It’s ridiculous to talk about the reasons for refusing to participate in the tender at a time when there is not a single copy of the equipment proposed for sale in Russian aviation ... so there’s nothing to do with “failure” ...
    4. Genry 2 February 2012 13: 19 New
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      Why are journalists so greedy? They are trying to show. that we are stupid people and we shit ourselves. Lies. How could PAK-FA be put up for sale if we do not even know its name (SU- ??). He is born but not yet born. What kind of sales can we talk about?
  2. Alexey Prikazchikov
    Alexey Prikazchikov 1 February 2012 08: 17 New
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    EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE, DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA BATTERINGYEREATING WE ARE WE LUUUUCHIIIIIIIIIIII !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  3. kPoJluK2008
    kPoJluK2008 1 February 2012 08: 17 New
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    Well, in general, the MiG-35 and Su-35 (T-10BM) - it was NECESSARY to exhibit!
    Not so much for victory, but for advertising.
    Although the Su-35 there would have every chance to win.
    1. Drcoks
      Drcoks 1 February 2012 08: 36 New
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      Hm, I agree. It was not mentioned exactly about the fifth generation. On the other hand, I doubt that the same su-35 would have won, would have bought f-35 or a typhoon anyway.
      1. Desert Fox
        Desert Fox 1 February 2012 09: 36 New
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        What are the questions about equality? South Korea sucks at the pendostan for a very long time, in the hope of saving help, in the event of an attack by their northern neighbor. Therefore, the bias of the tender can be judged almost surely. So that our side’s desire not to participate in this farce is fully understood.
        1. Pendosa hater
          Pendosa hater 1 February 2012 10: 59 New
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          Farce what is there to argue. Yes, and why shoot new technologies and design solutions? Few of them flowed out in 90?
          1. kubanec 2 February 2012 15: 02 New
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            login super good
      2. Deniska 1 February 2012 11: 05 New
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        I agree. Koreans amerskie jo% oliza ....
        1. alexander hjcnjd
          alexander hjcnjd 1 February 2012 12: 28 New
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          I do not agree with you. South Korea has a very strong economy. It is actually a union where America is the first among equals.
          1. Desert Fox
            Desert Fox 1 February 2012 12: 45 New
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            I’m neither trying to lower the technical achievements of South Korea as a country, but the first among equals is overkill.

            Quote: alexander hjcnjd
            first among equals


            The first among equals do not buy weapons, but produce it themselves.
  4. Sergh
    Sergh 1 February 2012 08: 18 New
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    Strange article, talking about nothing. Some kind of sharing the skins of a dead bear. Lish, to talk about what doesn’t matter!
    1. Pendosa hater
      Pendosa hater 1 February 2012 11: 00 New
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      Do not just talk, but earn extra plus am
  5. timhelmet 1 February 2012 08: 50 New
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    Here is the nefiga. Money can not buy happiness. Squander technology should not be.
    90s was enough.
  6. predator
    predator 1 February 2012 08: 52 New
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    no need to run ahead of the engine, let them first launch into the series, equip their own air force, etc.
    1. esaul 1 February 2012 09: 10 New
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      Quote: predator
      no need to run ahead of the engine, let them first launch into the series, equip their own air force, etc.








      And it's the same thing right, predator! But, besides this, there is one more important moment! If you transfer the latest development into the hands of an ally of a potential enemy, you can ease the efforts of a sworn friend aimed at developing countermeasures! Do we need it? Let the South Koreans be satisfied - “Now Boeing, EADS, Lockheed Martin and Saab will fight for the right to supply sixty combat vehicles for the South Korean Air Force. Moreover, Saab intends to introduce its Gripen fighter, which initially does not meet the criteria for South Korean Air Force aircraft. As a result the real contenders for the victory are the American F-15SE, F-35 and the European Typhoon, "WHICH ARE LESS TO THE DOMESTIC T-50. (PAK FA)!
      1. gor
        gor 1 February 2012 09: 36 New
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        I’m wondering what makes the planes superior to the fa fa. Besides the words about superiority, I haven’t heard anything else. At the air show, the pack fa fa also did not impress. So what is being transferred from empty to empty?
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk 1 February 2012 09: 54 New
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          Quote: gor
          I wonder what the pack fa these aircraft are superior.

          But how to google it? :))) Honestly, it’s already a little tired for me to explain to everyone and everyone what PAK-FA is now, and how much the “PAK-FA is just a glider” bike is not true. And also why at the MAX experimental models of T-50 were exhibited.
          1. gor
            gor 1 February 2012 10: 29 New
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            requirements are still highlighted and the fact that on paper this is not a reality. These requirements must also be materialized and that they work together.
            But it would be, as you say, then Pak-fa would go, it’s already in series and would be mass-produced
            1. DYMITRY
              DYMITRY 1 February 2012 11: 12 New
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              Any combat vehicle begins to be mass-produced only after adoption. At the moment, state tests have not been conducted. Russian on white said will be produced in 2012. What serial issue can we talk about ??? For export, even to the Allies, a castrated version of the machine is in service, or not accepted in service. So, about Sukhoi Design Bureau’s plans to participate in the Korean tender is nothing more than a journalistic duck, which was confirmed.
              1. gor
                gor 1 February 2012 12: 00 New
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                so I’m talking about this. and when it’s taken into service it’s also unknown. They will be carried out in 2012 but the state tests have not been carried out. Statements contradicting one another. As for example, they will be produced if for example it does not pass the state tests. For example, there will be some technical difficulties?
                1. DYMITRY
                  DYMITRY 1 February 2012 12: 18 New
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                  So Sukhoi Design Bureau never announced its participation in this tender. A typical duck of journalists. Even after taking the machine into service, the T50 will only be exported to India for at least 10 years.
          2. urzul 1 February 2012 10: 34 New
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            Well, they live information from the media, what can you do with them !!!
        2. Urcom
          Urcom 1 February 2012 19: 13 New
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          Pak FA is still a pre-production test copy, and it is still incorrect to compare it with serial aircraft, maneuverability at the air show was not an end in itself, the plane simply demonstrated that we have complete order with the development of combat aircraft. So far, only experts judge his POTENTIAL fighting qualities. The time will come and the airplane will really declare its advantages, of course, within the framework of our military censorship bully
        3. подводник 2 February 2012 12: 06 New
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          It is enough that their word in the fact that the T-50 is superior to competitors was said by specialists in this area. And what exactly, well, you make me laugh!
  7. Uralm
    Uralm 1 February 2012 09: 25 New
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    As for the tender, everything is clear. For example, a large enterprise has announced a tender for the supply of a large batch of equipment. Who won? It is known in advance. The one with whom they have been working for a long time, the one who gives kickbacks.
    Countries are like people.
  8. J_silver
    J_silver 1 February 2012 09: 33 New
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    Clear business - while there is nothing to represent!
    A couple of prototypes, no matter how wonderful properties they possess, do not allow us to hope for a successful commercial supply to a serious buyer - then they can also make a serious forfeit, and the person has a great chance to lose ...
    Do not rush, right? It is important to give society a full-fledged citizen (see Caucasian captive, words of Comrade Saakhov) ...
  9. Mujahiddin777 1 February 2012 10: 38 New
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    Correctly! I wouldn’t sell it either, it’s still a prototype ... It’s still being tested. Let others push their bullshit pieces of iron, and we still have time, the good goods on the counter never lie fellow
  10. Vrangel
    Vrangel 1 February 2012 10: 38 New
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    They did the right thing, that they refused, it would be a waste of time and money. The T-50 would “fly out” of the tender, as it was in the past, the Su-35 with the vague wording “about the complexity of maintenance and combat use” of our aircraft.
  11. Freedom eagle
    Freedom eagle 1 February 2012 10: 39 New
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    Russia does not want secret developments to fall to American allies

    India is actually an ally of the United States. Russia must urgently (!!!) break all contracts with India, and first of all the joint development of the Five (FGFA).



    Quote: kPoJluK2008
    Although the Su-35 there would have every chance to win.

    Have you read the article carefully? And it says: - Russia took part in a tender for the South Korean Air Force back in 2002. Su-35 lost then the F-15 is made in the USA.



    Quote: nokki
    if our developments were bad, all countries would simply have turned off espionage activities against us.

    Is logical. So American and European weapons can be SUPER! If the GRU and the FSB are actively hunting for Western military developments.

    Quote: esaul
    WHICH ARE PASSING TO DOMESTIC T-50. (PAK FA)!

    Blah blah blah blah ...
    Flying layout could not be better than a combat aircraft.



    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    I’m already a little tired of explaining to everyone and everyone what PAK-FA is now,

    Do you have the most? direct relation to this plane? belay

    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    "PAK-FA - it's just a glider"

    You don’t want “just a glider”, let there be a “flying layout”. wink

    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    And also why on the MAX exhibited prototypes of the T-50.

    PR, however. bully
    1. Passing
      Passing 1 February 2012 15: 49 New
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      Quote: Freedom Eagle
      Russia took part in a tender for the South Korean Air Force back in 2002. The Su-35 then lost the F-15 manufactured in the USA.

      Do not confuse the Su-35 of the nineties and the modern Su-35, these are two fundamentally different machines. The first is something from the category of marketing tricks, the second is from the category of the best aircraft in the world.
    2. FREGATENKAPITAN 2 February 2012 11: 44 New
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      India is actually an ally of the United States. Russia must urgently (!!!) break all contracts with India, and first of all the joint development of the Five (FGFA).
      ..Yes, I also read ..... and also the Oreburg and Saratov regions .....
      However....
    3. urzul 2 February 2012 22: 13 New
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      not ssy boiling water, in the original mentioned participation in the tender T-50 Golden Eagle
      Do you have the most direct relation to this plane?

      Paralay has, you are welcome to the site of the stealth machine http://paralay.iboards.ru/
  12. Deniska 1 February 2012 11: 13 New
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    Regarding participation in the tender: If you are really afraid of information leakage, then yes you do not need to exhibit it. From another point of view, it was possible to set not PAK FA. And personally, my opinion initially needs to develop 3 versions of military equipment. The best and completely classified for Russia. The second is for real real partners. And finally, the third is simply an export option offered to the entire world community. The pluses are that the option for Russia will be only ours. And everyone else will want and are interested in the second option. Which in turn will probably translate many from potential buyers into real ones. And this, of course, with the competitive ability of our technology;)
  13. DYMITRY
    DYMITRY 1 February 2012 11: 21 New
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    And what actually was a fifth generation aircraft supposed to participate in the tender for the supply of four plus generation aircraft ???
    We were also pleased with the words “expert” - about copper rings in the casing, which we do not use. Ah-wunderwafel apparently guaranteeing complete radio stealth! Also, according to this character, I conclude: the T-50 flies on manual control, on a dial-up, plus everything else also has a phonit in all ranges !!! I don’t know how anyone, but I wouldn’t even let such an expert evaluate coffee grinders.
  14. Andrei from Chelyabinsk 1 February 2012 11: 23 New
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    Oh, well, I'll have to again, for the umpteenth time ...
    The first bike - on the T-50 there is no 5-generation engine, it flies on old engines. refutation here http://www.redstar.ru/2010/03/24_03/2_03.html - an interview with the most direct participant in the work on PAK-FA - Chief Designer of Sukhoi Design Bureau, T-50 program director Alexander Davidenko :))))) )
    In fact, the T-50 are equipped with the latest AL41F1, which are fully consistent with the concept of the 5 generation engines. On older models (Su-30, etc. are powered by AL-31F engines), the Al-41F engine was designed for the 5 generation fighter MiG 1.44, and the Al-41F1 (117 product) is for PAK FA. Dvigun, by the way, in terms of thrust-weight ratio surpasses those that are on the American F-22. Where did the old bike come from? During the design process, the AL-41F1 decided to adapt it also for the Su-35, introducing some simplifications. As a result, the engine AL-41Ф1С (product 117С) appeared which is better than AL-31Ф but worse than AL-41Ф1. There is information that on the first (or even on the first and second) T-50 installed precisely them - whether this is true or not - is not known for certain. And also, it must be said that Al-41Ф1 is inferior to American Pratts / Whitts in a number of characteristics (our engine is lighter, but has weaker traction, although it has a higher thrust ratio). So Al-41Ф1 gives us approximate equality with Ф-22 and superiority over Ф-35. Therefore, a new dvigun is being developed for the future (the EMNIP product is called 129). In an interview with the developers, it slipped through that this engine might already be ready for 2013-2014.
    Second bike - T-50 does not have avionics
    The main part of the avionics of a modern fighter is its radar. So, the bike was based on the fact that for a long time, absolutely nothing was known about the T-50 radar. The fact is that the radar-AFAR for the T-50 under the H036 index was shown only as a layout. And then silence.
    However, in 2011, H036 was already installed on PAK FA prototypes :)))) The third prototype, by the way, is being created in order to most fully test the capabilities of the new radar :)))
    The F-22 flies with the AN / APG-77 radar, and its simplified version is placed on the F-35. We had an analogue of AN / APG-77 - this is the so-called Irbis N035 :))) N036 is better than Irbis :))) Draw your own conclusions.
    As for the rest - an automated flight control system, gun control systems, etc. - all this is. The same SLAs from the T-50 EMNIP even managed to get into the Mig-35 :))) Then what kind of avionics does the T-50 have? But what - firstly, on the T-50 the principle of "smart skin" is implemented when the skin of the aircraft itself is the surface of the radar. But the management of this innovation has not yet been brought to mind. And on the T-50, a system is planned that will make useless IR cameras and optical weapon guidance, implemented by the Americans in the F-35. This is unfinished, yes. Only maaaaalenky nuance - no one in the world now has such systems at all wink Including the Americans. And the T-50 can fly without these systems, just with them its superiority over the same F-35 will become completely overwhelming. wink wink
    And the last - why was the T-50 prototype exhibited at MAX? Yes, because after his appearance a crowd of "experts" came up screaming that it was only a glider, that he had no avionics, engines, and in general the T-50 - it was a spreading cranberry. That's why ours presented the experienced T-50 as well - the "experts" joyfully screeched on the subject of the engine surge, seeing this as confirmation of their "expertises", but the experts who were enough at the MAX saw that the new engine was on, N036, etc. d. etc. REALLY exist in iron.
    1. DYMITRY
      DYMITRY 1 February 2012 11: 29 New
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      In avionics, I can confirm that I worked on this topic. Three copies should have arrived at the state. tests in 2009.
      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk 1 February 2012 11: 33 New
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        Thanks ! Can you tell me something that I don’t know? :)))
        1. DYMITRY
          DYMITRY 1 February 2012 11: 42 New
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          Unfortunately, by subscription, I can’t. Unless in a couple of years, and then in person)))
          1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk 1 February 2012 12: 26 New
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            very sorry:)))
    2. gor
      gor 1 February 2012 16: 39 New
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      when it will be accepted into service and I will believe your bike and I will doubt about any superiority.
      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk 1 February 2012 18: 04 New
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        Quote: gor
        when it will be adopted, and I will believe your bike

        The superiority of T-50 over imported aircraft does not need your faith :))) You do not want to KNOW - it is your business. And you can believe in anything, I respect religious freedom and do not interfere in religious issues :)))
        1. gor
          gor 1 February 2012 19: 39 New
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          planes on faith do not fly
          1. Doctor
            Doctor 2 February 2012 19: 19 New
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            Quote: gor
            planes on faith do not fly

            On the topic, is there anything sensible to say, or is there another show waiting for us to be dragged down by dragons? wink
  15. Andrei from Chelyabinsk 1 February 2012 11: 39 New
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    Quote: Freedom Eagle
    India is actually an ally of the United States.

    belay Since when?
  16. dred
    dred 1 February 2012 13: 19 New
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    Quote: Freedom Eagle
    India is actually an ally of the United States. Russia must urgently (!!!) break all contracts with India, and first of all the joint development of the Five (FGFA).

    I haven’t read a more stupid nonsense in my life. Tell me also that China and Iran are friends of America.
    1. DYMITRY
      DYMITRY 2 February 2012 07: 29 New
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      And why did they blame the guy? I wrote it right! Purely out of habit for a negative rating? Or is it comrade seropogonniki indignant at the "traitor")))?
  17. Kyrgyz 1 February 2012 13: 19 New
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    To enter a tender with advanced development in South Korea is really the same for us as the states to enter a tender with advanced development in Belarus, after how many minutes will Belarus receive in a research institute in Moscow?
    The quality and characteristics of the T-50 is ridiculous to discuss and argue about them, opponents know about them as much as supporters
    1. SSR
      SSR 2 February 2012 21: 20 New
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      Kyrgyz,
      You are not the right Kyrgyzstan))))) Respect.
  18. 755962
    755962 1 February 2012 14: 25 New
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    However, it has now become known that the leadership of the United Aircraft Corporation did not even intend to submit Russian fighters to the competition. And what does the Korean side say? The T-50s will still be brought to mind, it’s clear as day, moreover, rockets will be created for it only by 2014.
  19. SoVIet ZiMBo_O
    SoVIet ZiMBo_O 1 February 2012 14: 33 New
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    The leaders were French Rafale and European Typhoon.

    Eyes are cutting!
  20. dobrik10 1 February 2012 18: 03 New
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    What tenders can there be until the own Air Force is provided with these machines ?!
    In pursuit of profit, it can turn out as in the well-known phrase "shoemaker without boots."

    Special thanks “Andrey from Chelyabinsk” enlightened a bit.
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk 1 February 2012 18: 17 New
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      You're welcome !
  21. Freedom eagle
    Freedom eagle 1 February 2012 18: 08 New
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    Quote: Passing by
    Do not confuse the Su-35 of the nineties and the modern Su-35, these are two fundamentally different machines.

    I am aware that these are different planes.
    Quote: Passing by
    The first one is something of a marketing ploy,

    What nonsense is this? The Su-35, also known as the Su-27M, it was also the T-10M that they began to develop back in the USSR, when there was no question of any export of T-10 family aircraft. Then the words of this - "marketing" - did not know.

    Quote: Passing by
    the second - from the category of the best aircraft in the world.

    Who defined him in this category? Current marketers?
    So far, he is the best only in the fantasies of his creators and fervent patriots.
    And regarding participation in international competitions, now this Su-35 (T-10BM), the first and with a bang flew out of the Brazilian tender. And in the Republic of Korea, if he participated there, the result would be the same.




    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    Since when?

    Ever since the Indians began to actively purchase American weapons. India and the United States will be brought closer by sharply worsened relations between the Americans and the packs.

    Quote: dred
    More dumb nonsense in life did not read.
    Tell me more that China and Iran are friends of America.
    No, you say that Russian and Chinese are brothers forever. lol
    Dumb nonsense mosque YOU. angry
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk 1 February 2012 18: 27 New
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      Quote: Freedom Eagle
      Who defined him in this category? Current marketers?
      So far, he is the best only in the fantasies of his creators and fervent patriots.

      She's like :))) And who is superior to him? In general, the Su-35 is clearly superior to the F-15C. And F-15SE Silent Eagle, for the time being, is only being tested, so there is nothing to compare. And who then remains in the weight category 4 + and 4 ++? SU-30MKI? wink wink wink
      Quote: Freedom Eagle
      Ever since the Indians began to actively purchase American weapons. India and the United States will be brought closer by sharply worsened relations between the Americans and the packs.

      And after that you still reproach dred eh ?!
      Then the Hindus are friends of the French - they won the tender for 126 fighters :)))
      In fact, the Indians will never make friends with the United States, for the United States, like Britain at the time, "has no permanent allies, but only permanent interests" and the Indians understand this - everyone has seen enough of Iran. Plus, friendship with America is now so expensive that even for wealthy Indians it is unbearable
      1. DYMITRY
        DYMITRY 2 February 2012 07: 34 New
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        Andrey, I’ll add objectivity for the sake of forgetting about the F-35, it seems like 4 ++ too. Although he is even compared with the Geyropei eroplans full g.
  22. King 2 February 2012 06: 23 New
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    let's remember the words of the Russian cosmanaut from the movie Armagedon- American technology, Russian technology, one x * y everything is done in China.))) most of the parts supplied by Russia are made over the hill))
    1. DYMITRY
      DYMITRY 2 February 2012 07: 37 New
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      No more than 10% of parts are imported. And while you agree on even one replacement, you can go crazy. Imported microcircuits are mainly used, and then only in secondary blocks. In addition, in some places they use imported plastic. Although there is a tendency to increase the growth of imported element base.
  23. Ramses_IV 2 February 2012 07: 49 New
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    7,3 billion dollars .... I'm bastard .... When, finally, our manufacturers of military equipment will be sold for gold, and not for empty green candy wrappers?
  24. 916-th
    916-th 2 February 2012 08: 55 New
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    Returning to the topic of the South Korean tender. I want to remind you where the legs grow from - the Korean war of the 50s. We are on the side of North Korea, the Yankees are for South Korea.

    It is ridiculous to imagine that then, after the end of the war, the southerners would ask the Union to put them MiG-15/17 to the peak of the American F-86. Although the MiGs kicked the ass "Sabers" over the heads of the South Koreans. Modern political developments have not changed at all. Offering T-50s to South Koreans is the same as participating with a T-50 in a tender for the US Air Force. laughing
  25. Eugene
    Eugene 2 February 2012 11: 23 New
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    Well, actually there was parity with "Sabers."

    Quote: Freedom Eagle
    No, you say that Russian and Chinese are brothers forever.

    This makes sense only in the case of a 2-polar world - the enemies of our enemies are our friends, and the Chinese now have their own far-reaching interests, in which both the Russian Federation and the USA cannot be considered as allies. Another thing is that with China we do not have at the momentsuch political tension as with the United States.
    1. FREGATENKAPITAN 2 February 2012 12: 21 New
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      ..Well, there was parity with "Sabers."
      ..... I show about parity-
      BATTLE LOSSES.

      US Air Force USSR Air Force

      pilots -1.176 people. -120 people.

      airplanes - 1.444 pcs -335 pcs

      The following is a list of asses-

      The first ten aces. Comparison by the number of victories.
      Surname / Aircraft ..... Surname / Aircraft

      1. Sutyagin N.V. 22 ............. 1. Joseph McConel (ml) 16
      2. Pepelyaev EG 20 ........... 2. James Jabara 15
      3. Smorchkov A.P. 15 .......... 3. Manuel Fernandez 14
      4. Schukin L.K. 15 .............. 4. George Davis (ml) 14
      5. Oskin D.P. 14 ............. 5. Royal Baker 13
      6. Ponomarev M.S. 14 ........ 6. Frederick Bless 10
      7. Kramarenko S.M. 13 ....... 7. Herald Fisher 10
      8. Sheberstov K. 12 ........... 8. Vermon Harrison 10
      9. Bakhaev S.A. 11 .............. 9. James Johnson 10
      10. Dokashenko N.G. 11 ........ 10. Lonnie Moore 10

      We go further ....

      During the three years of the war in Korea, internationalist pilots of 64 IAK (fighter aviation corps) conducted 1.872 air battles, shot down 1.106 US-made aircraft, of which 650 were Sabers. MiG losses amounted to 335 aircraft


      Here is such parity!
      1. подводник 2 February 2012 12: 25 New
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        Thanks for the information.
  26. rekrut
    rekrut 2 February 2012 11: 41 New
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    Only in ballet are we now the first.
  27. подводник 2 February 2012 12: 17 New
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    So that's it in everything !!!
    1. Freedom eagle
      Freedom eagle 2 February 2012 19: 12 New
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      Such pictures are only morons. lol You would also compare the characteristics of the Tu-144 and the 757th Boeing, but what? both of these passenger planes.
      1. Doctor
        Doctor 2 February 2012 19: 17 New
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        Quote: Freedom Eagle
        Such pictures are only morons.

        Yes, you are straight Julius Caesar! Not only a Jew, but also a parrot! A rare and even more interesting phenomenon wink
      2. подводник 2 February 2012 22: 00 New
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        Bird, do you get personal?
        Well then you yourself DEEBil! laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing
  28. Freedom eagle
    Freedom eagle 2 February 2012 12: 41 New
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    Quote: 916
    MiGs kicked ass "Sabers" over the heads of South Koreans.

    Sovkovskayacrapa lie! Moreover, a double lie am
    -firstly, “sabers” were a very dangerous and difficult opponent for the Moments, the bulk of victories were won over other types of airplanes
    - secondly, the “Migi” never fought on the heads of South Koreans, they were strictly forbidden to cross the 38th parallel.
    1. подводник 2 February 2012 12: 45 New
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      And the bird woke up !!!
      I have a present for you !!!
      wink wink wink wink wink wink
      Have a nice feathered day!
      1. FREGATENKAPITAN 2 February 2012 13: 05 New
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        ..... You know, this bird in the fleet is called the cormorant, there are a lot of screams and galde - no good, it feeds on garbage!
        1. подводник 2 February 2012 14: 16 New
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          Yes already seen enough! wink
    2. FREGATENKAPITAN 2 February 2012 13: 13 New
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      What did not like? Well, bring your Pindos statistics ..... it doesn’t work because they have long recognized all this ... even in Hollywood films this information slipped ...
      1. подводник 2 February 2012 14: 17 New
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        THEY ARE AT WORK
    3. gor
      gor 3 February 2012 23: 05 New
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      and I can add that because of the limited fuel supply, the MiGs could not conduct long air battles and the maximum of what they could appear was to shoot and hit and did not get out of the battle. and the MiGi again because of the limited fuel supply appeared only near the border with China and this zone called the avenue of twigs, but only for the reason that they only appeared there. Sabers had a more perfect sight, and twigs had better climb, but when a Saber appeared with a 2,7-ton engine thrust, this advantage disappeared
  29. dred
    dred 2 February 2012 13: 04 New
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    Quote: Freedom Eagle
    No, you say that Russian and Chinese are brothers forever. Dumb nonsense mosque YOU.

    Sorry. This time I agree. The Chinese are not only not friends to us in the back in the form of the Chinese in Khaborovsk.
  30. Freedom eagle
    Freedom eagle 2 February 2012 17: 35 New
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    Quote: submariner
    I have a present for you !!!

    I also procured a present for you fellow
    Here is your coat of arms mutant mutant good

    Quote: submariner
    Have a good day

    When you wrote this, it was already night. Well, okay, it’s already morning, the day is ahead, I will give myself the installation that this is your sincere wish wink

    Katste, Mr. Podshkonochnik, I congratulate you on being awarded the title of "Junior Ensign of the Navy." fellow
    1. Doctor
      Doctor 2 February 2012 19: 18 New
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      Quote: Freedom Eagle
      atste, Mr. podshkonochnik, I congratulate you on conferring the title of "junior warrant officer of the Navy

      Learned many terms, albeit with spelling errors
      Oh, how famously wrapped up! Bravo! Bis! laughing
    2. подводник 2 February 2012 22: 08 New
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      AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA bird, I wanted to sting !!!!!!!!
      Half a fool !!!!! Learn the charter !!!!!!!!! This is Rear Admiral !!!!
      Well, for the gift, I won’t say thank you.
      But for trying to please --................. I won’t beat you
      laughing laughing laughing laughing
      Well, the rest-burn!
  31. Admiral_N
    Admiral_N 2 February 2012 22: 26 New
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    Quote: submariner
    Half a fool !!!!! Learn the charter !!!!!!!!! This is Rear Admiral !!!!

    And you, the youngest ensign - pots. Do not you understand that the eagle deliberately "made a mistake" in the rank - lowered you? You do not deserve even a “midshipman” - “junior ensign” - that’s who you are!
  32. подводник 2 February 2012 22: 39 New
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    WELL AS SAME AS SAME !!!
    Bird, well, have I really not cut through your dvizhuhi !!!!!!!!!!!!!! laughing
    I told you a bird that you are a fool, having changed your nickname, you have not deceived anyone !!!
    Well why !!!! I already have a stomach ache from you !!! Half a fool !!
    RZHUNIMAGU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  33. Admiral_N
    Admiral_N 2 February 2012 23: 22 New
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    Quote: submariner

    WELL AS SAME AS SAME !!!
    Bird, well, have I really not cut through your dvizhuhi !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    I told you a bird that you are a fool, having changed your nickname, you have not deceived anyone !!!
    Well why !!!! I already have a stomach ache from you !!! Half a fool !!
    RZHUNIMAGU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    And you mlp.prap - a real pots. Everything is simpler than usual - Freedom Eagle is on quiche now because of goblins like you. He asked me via Skype to answer you for him. I and Freedom Eagle are not the same thing, we are different people and even from different continents, but we are friends, and we have the same views on today's Russia and Russian degenerates. Well, if you’ve got it, you can shield me with an eagle clone, I’m fuck ...
    1. подводник 3 February 2012 00: 31 New
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      Well, a bird, well, a comedian !!!
      Well, can you now be an "eagle"? No!
      I killed your nickname!
      Now you are the admiral ................... RZHUNIMAGU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      Admiral Nelson!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      One eye was already glued !!!!!!!!!!!!
      laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing
  34. подводник 3 February 2012 00: 34 New
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    I checked - this nickname is not banned !!
    AHAHAHAHAHA !!!!!!!!!!!
    BIRD YOU'RE FUN !!!
  35. Admiral_N
    Admiral_N 3 February 2012 00: 49 New
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    Quote: submariner

    I checked - this nickname is not banned !!


    Citizen junior warrant officer, you turn to the site administrator with the question - why can't the Eagle leave comments? And for how long?
    1. подводник 3 February 2012 01: 37 New
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      Citizen ensign is in the zone! laughing
      Learn a fool the charter !!! laughing
      And why the "Eagle" can not leave comments, so this is your bird's problems.
      Well half a fool !!! For a long time I did not have so much fun! laughing
      It’s good that you live there! I wouldn’t envy you here!
      EAGLE! laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing
      RZHUNIMAGU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      Do you have the time now?
      After all, you are waiting for my comments, aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bird!
      1. 916-th
        916-th 3 February 2012 06: 40 New
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        Submariner, with all due respect to you - stop being with them. They are not worth it, the bet is higher than the free eagle.

        I want to remind (or tell? To the free Eagle and Admiral N) a famous joke:

        A well-very free cowboy (in our opinion a shepherd) Joe rode across the prairies. He was free, not because no one could lasso him, but because nobody needed him on x @ y. I’ll add from myself - not only on the prairies, but also on this site. Will you skip past - skip past.
  36. Grin
    Grin 3 February 2012 08: 18 New
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    The replica about not allowing military secrets is not justified, because we are developing the PAK FA together with India, and it, in turn, is striving for a military alliance: America, South Kareya, Australia.
  37. Admiral_N
    Admiral_N 3 February 2012 08: 51 New
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    Quote: submariner

    Citizen ensign is in the zone!

    Your place is the YOUNG ENTREPRENEUR just in the zone, under the broom, smelly crucian carp.


    Quote: submariner


    Now you are the admiral ................... RZHUNIMAGU !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Admiral Nelson!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    One eye was already glued !!!!!!!!!!!!

    Here it is, the poverty of your brain !!!! You do not know other admirals on "N"! Ganba !!!!!


    Quote: 916
    Will you skip past - skip past.

    Do not wait! I will pass by, I will surely catch, I am not an Eagle, I will not play politeness and tolerance in the open rudeness with mududy.
    1. подводник 3 February 2012 15: 14 New
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      Bird fool !!!!!!!!!!! laughing laughing laughing laughing
      Learn the charter !!! There are no warrant officers in the Navy, in the midshipman’s fleet !!!!
      I told you that you are an illiterate fool !!! laughing laughing laughing laughing
      That's just you redneck and eat! laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing
  38. Andrei from Chelyabinsk 3 February 2012 09: 23 New
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    Quote: Admiral_N
    Do not wait! I will pass by, I will surely catch, I am not an Eagle, I will not play politeness and tolerance in the open rudeness with mududy.

    Listen, you are our tolerant, where did you start communication from? to remind?
    Quote: Admiral_N
    And you, junior prapor - pots.

    Are you so polite and tolerant understand?
    In general - it is better to sgin himself, and then cross laughing
  39. Krasnoyarsk 2 May 2019 15: 47 New
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    What is there to comment on? 2012 article!