The new pistol of the Vektor family has passed preliminary tests.

101
In the near future, the next rearmament of the army may begin, this time concerning the infantry weapons. One of the well-known projects for the development of a self-loading pistol went through the next stage, which brings it closer to a possible start of serial production and supply to the army. According to the latest data, the serial production of weapons of the new modification may start as early as next year. If the decision is made, the military will be able to get a new CP-1MP pistol.

Dmitry Semizorov, General Director of the Central Research Institute of Precision Engineering (TsNIITochmash), spoke about the recent successes of the new pistol development project in mid-August. In an interview with the TASS news agency, published on 16 in August, the general director of the institute said that by now the preliminary tests of the pistol, carried out in the interests of the Ministry of Defense, had been completed. Completion of this stage of inspections allows you to start new tests, the results of which will determine the fate of the new development.



The new pistol of the Vektor family has passed preliminary tests.
Early Release CP-1 Pistol. Photo World.guns.ru


According to D. Semizorov, state tests of the new pistol should begin in the fall. Complete them by the end of this year. After that, the military department will have to study the results of all the tests carried out and make its decision. In the case of receiving approval and the appearance of the order, the company is ready to manufacture and transfer to the army the first batch of new pistols next year.

As specified by other domestic media and the press service of the state-owned corporation Rostec, this is a new self-loading pistol CP-1MP, which is another modification of the well-known product CP-1 "Vector". The basic design appeared quite a long time ago, and over time, it has undergone noticeable changes, which led to the development of several different modifications. In addition, there have been several orders for the supply of serial weapons to various customers.

The development of the pistol, later known under the designation CP-1, was launched in the early nineties. Initially, the work was carried out in the framework of the army competition "Grach", the purpose of which was to create advanced weapons for the armed forces, differing from the existing models with enhanced characteristics. Employees of TsNIITochmash PI Serdyukov and I.V. Belyaev developed a draft of the new pistol complex consisting of the pistol itself and the new design cartridge A. B. Yuriev. The proposed design of the gun did not suit the customer, because of which the project dropped out of the competition.

However, soon the new development was interested in the leadership of other security agencies. So, in 1993, the processing of an existing project began in accordance with a new technical task issued by the Federal Security Service. It was at this stage of development that the project received the designation "Vector". The interest of the special services in the project, first of all, was due to the main characteristics of the fire. The parameters of the newest cartridge proposed by the authors of the project made it possible to hit the enemy using personal protective equipment. Weapons with such capabilities were of great interest for special units.

In 1995, the developers of the Vektor pistol complex received a patent number RU2049977. In addition, several prototypes of weapons needed for testing were manufactured. Also several pre-production batches were released. According to reports, prototypes of the gun "Vector" were designated as РГ055. In 1996, the first public demonstration of the new development took place. In this case, the gun was positioned as a product for export deliveries under the name "Gurza". By this time, on the basis of the original cartridge 9х21 mm РГ052 a new ammunition РГ054 was created with different characteristics.


The scheme of the gun from the patent 1995.


At the end of 1996, the Vector pistol was adopted by the special forces of the FSB and FSO. The product received a new designation CP-1 ("Special development, the first"). Together with the gun, they adopted the cartridge РГ054 / SP-10 (“Special cartridge, tenth”). In the future, based on the cartridge 9х21 mm SP-10 were created several other ammunition, differing in the main features of the design and purpose. The shooter had the opportunity to make ammunition from ammunition with an armor-piercing, shell low-bowing, expansive or armor-piercing tracer bullet.

In 2003, a government decree appeared, according to which the Vector gun was put into service by special units of the armed forces. In this case, the weapon received another designation - ATP ("Serdyukov self-loading pistol"). At the same time, production of an upgraded pistol for special services under the designation CP-1M was launched. The start of the production of new weapons did not stop the design work. In the future, specialists of the Central Research Institute of Precision Engineering created new versions of weapons.

Despite all the changes introduced in the new modernization projects, pistols of the “Vector” family retain common structural elements and principles of operation. Automation of this weapon uses recoil barrel with a short stroke. From the point of view of the overall layout, the Vektor product is a typical modern pistol. The frame with fastenings for all main units, and also mobile a trunk and a casing of a lock is used. The store is traditionally located inside the handle. In order to facilitate the construction of the frame of the gun is made of metal and plastic. Metal parts are used at the top of the product, subjected to high loads. Other units can be made of plastic.

The gun is equipped with a barrel caliber 9 mm long 120 mm (13 calibers), with the possibility of reciprocating movement to implement recharging. Locking of the trunk is done with the help of a larva swinging in a vertical plane. During the operation of the automation, the larva must interact with the guides of the frame and move in the right direction, ensuring the connection of the stem and the gate, as well as their uncoupling. Recent actions in the recharge cycle are provided by a return spring placed on the barrel. Due to the use of a rolling barrel, a special stop for the rear end of the spring had to be introduced into the weapon design. This decision was subsequently patented.


Cartridges 9x21 mm SP-10. Photo Dokwar.ru


The gun is equipped with a trigger type trigger with an open placement of the trigger. The double action mechanism allows firing both with and without a preliminary platoon. In this case, the self-input is possible only with a preliminary statement of the trigger on the so-called. safety intermediate platoon.

Unlike other modern pistols, the products of the Vector family do not have manual fuses. The safety of handling weapons is controlled by automatics. The gun has two automatic fuses that monitor the correct grip of the weapon and the pressure on the trigger. The first automatic fuse is made in the form of a key, which is brought to the rear surface of the handle. His task is to lock the sear: when you press a key, it is released. The second fuse is an additional lever on the trigger, which does not allow to make a shot when the last button is pressed incorrectly. The design of the fuses is such that it allows to execute a shot only by simultaneously pressing both devices.

The gun is equipped with a fairly simple sights in the form of an open rear sight and front sight, placed on the upper surface of the casing of the shutter. Sighting range declared at the level of 100 m.


Incomplete disassembly of the CP-1 pistol. Photo Dokwar.ru


For ammunition of weapons was developed detachable box store, placed in the receiving shaft of the handle. In the two-row store managed to place 18 cartridges. Submission is carried out by means of a spring. Fixing the shop in its place is provided with a latch, placed at the base of the trigger hook. Interestingly, the design of this site is different for different versions of the gun. Thus, the CP-1 product had latch buttons on both sides, while the ATP has only one button on the right surface.

In the early versions, the Vector gun had a total length of 195 mm and weighed 0,9 kg without cartridges. A magazine with 9X21 cartridges mm added to the total weight of about 300 g. Depending on the type of cartridge used, the gun could show the initial speed of the bullet at 400-425 m / s. Muzzle energy reached 635 j.

Since the mid-nineties, TsNIITochmash specialists have developed several modifications of the “Vector” pistol, which have some differences from each other. First of all, the changes concerned the ergonomics of products. Given the operating experience and feedback shooters who used such weapons, some changes were made to the design of individual units. At the same time, however, the overall architecture and principles of action of the weapon remained the same.

The first version of the pistol family "Vector" are prototypes and pre-production products РГ055. Their characteristic feature is the rounded edges of the casing of the shutter, subsequently replaced by straight lines. On the basis of РГ055, an export version of Gurza was created. From the original sample, this version of the weapon was distinguished by a more accurate “exhibition” finish, as well as an engraving on the side of the casing, depicting an attacking snake.


CP-1M pistol. Photo of Wikimedia Commons


The CP-1 pistol, which was mass-produced and intended for the FSB and FSO, was given a casing with pronounced straight edges and a handle of a modified appearance. In addition, to improve ergonomics, the trigger bracket was modified, the front part of which received support for the finger of the second hand. It is known about the existence of the product GGNUMX "Gyurza", which was the export version of CP-060. The differences between the base and export versions were only in the exterior. According to reports, the production of pistols for special services was conducted from 1 to 1996, after which it was stopped due to the fulfillment of all existing orders.

In 2000, the release of ATP Army pistols began. From the previously manufactured CP-1, these products differed in the newly modified handle shape and one-way magazine latch button. Sights were also subject to some changes. Production of ATP pistols in the interests of army special forces continued for several years.

By the mid-2000s, the production of CP-1M pistols, representing an improved version of existing weapons, was mastered. Taking into account the operating experience of pistols by all former customers, a new modification was created, which was distinguished by some design features. The CP-1M received a frame from the ATP with the corresponding shop handle and latch, as well as an updated sight. In addition, for the first time in the “Vector” family, a slide delay appeared. Its design is such that the filing of the cartridge when replacing the store is done automatically.


CP-1MP pistol with a silent shooting device. Photo World.guns.ru


More recently, another modification of the gun called the CP-1MP was presented. All the basic mechanisms of this product remain the same, and the innovations of the project affect only external units. On the front of the frame, it is now proposed to install a special block, on the bottom surface of which there is a Picatinny rail for mounting various additional equipment, such as lamps of the corresponding dimensions, sights or laser target indicators. Also, the upgraded pistol can be used with the original silent shooting device. The silencer has a special design that provides quick installation and disassembly, as well as compatible with the movable barrel of the gun.

According to the latest domestic media reports, the CP-1MP self-loading pistol has not yet been adopted, but has already made significant steps in this direction. Not so long ago, these weapons passed preliminary tests for the Ministry of Defense. This fall, the development organization and the potential customer represented by the military department intend to conduct state tests necessary for making a final decision. In accordance with the existing estimates, which are distinguished by a certain optimism, the mass production of a new pistol and the delivery of finished products to the troops can begin as early as next year. To achieve such success, the perspective CP-1MP pistol needs to pass the final test phase and interest the customer in the person of the Ministry of Defense.


On the materials of the sites:
http://tass.ru/
http://rostec.ru/
https://rg.ru/
http://world.guns.ru/
http://armoury-online.ru/

Patent number RU2049977:
http://findpatent.ru/patent/204/2049977.html
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  1. The comment was deleted.
  2. +6
    7 September 2016 07: 03
    As I do not collect, it turns out a Kalashnikov assault rifle. that is, PM, Ugh! Walter.. wink
    1. +2
      13 September 2016 11: 36
      You yourself are a Walter. I would rather be glad that the Israeli cartridge 9x21IMI was taken as the basis
      1. +2
        14 September 2016 20: 18
        Quote: Dinko
        based on the Israeli cartridge 9x21IMI

        Our patron and Israeli bear no resemblance. Judean is a weakened pair with an elongated sleeve for use in countries where the use of military calibers on civilians is officially prohibited. Our - reinforced 9makarov. I suggest google the characteristics of these cartridges ...
    2. 0
      17 November 2016 04: 26
      Quote: Maki Avellievich
      As I do not collect, it turns out a Kalashnikov assault rifle. that is, PM, Ugh! Walter..

      Ok ..... at the forefront is an ergonomic design (maximum result prt minimum accessories)
  3. +4
    7 September 2016 07: 08
    The gun has two automatic fuses that monitor the correct grip of the weapon and the pressure on the trigger.

    The correct grip of the weapon is certainly good, but if it doesn’t work out, the first one needs to be fired ?!
    1. +9
      7 September 2016 07: 54
      Wind up with electrical tape)))
    2. +1
      7 September 2016 07: 57
      I think there are also no fools and everything will be taken into account
      1. +6
        7 September 2016 08: 15
        Of course there are no fools, therefore, as far as I know, people have been wrapping this button on the handle for a long time.
    3. +2
      8 September 2016 19: 07
      In general, this is being worked out as well as on the glocks. With any weapon, especially your workers need to train and know its features at a subconscious level.
  4. 0
    7 September 2016 07: 57
    Khe ... The army ate up with Yarygin's pistol, I suppose? And in order to push through the well-known "Gyurza" / SPS now, it was necessary to completely fill up the much better "Strizh"?
    1. +7
      7 September 2016 08: 25
      "Strizh" may be a good pistol, but we must look to the future, and with the development of SIBs and the saturation of troops with them, the 9 * 19 cartridge no longer fully meets the requirements for penetration. And I'm talking specifically about army weapons, not anti-terrorist special forces weapons, where a meeting with a protected bulletproof vest by a terrorist is unlikely, although it is possible, namely about army units, where the saturation of SIB in the modern army is close to 100%.
      1. +4
        7 September 2016 08: 45
        And with this, as well as a lot of talk, something was quiet.
        1. 0
          13 September 2016 21: 00
          In general, at the Army-2016 forum in the Kalashnikov pavilion there was a PL-15 with a silencer;)
      2. +2
        7 September 2016 20: 59
        9x21 mm is a bit more powerful than NATO 9x19 mm, but the construction of the bullet itself plays a much larger role. The gun will still not be able to break through the modern army body armor of the 5th protection class, so you should not chase only the power of the shot. To defeat a protected target, you need a powerful cartridge with a high-speed small-caliber bullet.
        1. +1
          8 September 2016 19: 47
          Quote: mr.redpartizan
          9x21 mm is a bit more powerful than NATO 9x19 mm, but the construction of the bullet itself plays a much larger role.

          As far as I know, the existing 9x19 + p + are equal in power, and sometimes even surpass 9x21.
          And to insert a bullet of the desired design there is not a problem at all.
          So I don’t understand this passion for non-standard calibers - the existing Para cartridges allow the same thing, and at the same time they are unified, and their export potential is incomparable.
          1. +1
            8 September 2016 21: 34
            The power of the cartridge is determined by the amount of gunpowder IMHO.
            In 9x21 it is more than in 9x19. I do not see the point of delving into quality and, as a result, the cost of gunpowder. Mass weapons are mass weapons.
            For some reason, there is silence about the submachine gun. Type H&K MP-5. I'm waiting for the information to erupt ...
            9x21 is an ideal cartridge for such a weapon. According to the set of parameters. Although ACP .45 and FN 5,7 mm have their advantages.
            Bullets for different tasks for 9x21 have already done.
            So it will not be necessary to drag the AKSU to the police.
            1. 0
              8 September 2016 22: 21
              The .45 ACP has no advantages over 9 mm pistols. The capacity of a single-row magazine is small, the penetration ability of a bullet like that of a PM, the recoil momentum is large. Not for nothing that most power structures around the world use pistols chambered for 9x19 mm PAIR or 9x18 mm PM. The weapon under the 5,7 mm cartridge is quite interesting, but it has its own subtleties. For example, a high stopping effect is achievable only when using cartridges with an expansive bullet.
              1. +1
                9 September 2016 10: 00
                Regarding .45 ACP: I had the pleasure of using the Mk-23, developed by H&K for SOCOM.
                12 rounds, almost no recoil (no more than that of Makarov), silencer, flashlight, laser.
                The benefits of a heavy subsonic bullet are convincingly demonstrated in our silent 9mm Vintorez and Shaft. The mass of the bullet there and there is about the same.
                One hit is enough for a stopping effect - be sure!
                After 45 years, they returned to the caliber after several years of operation of the 9 mm Beretta in the army.
                It is clear that the supply of these cartridges in the US is unmeasured, but my personal choice is the Mk-23.
              2. 0
                13 September 2016 11: 47
                Probably the representatives of the American special operations forces do not know that there is such a prominent couch theorist as you and that is why the SOCOM pistol uses the cartridge 45 ACP + P +
            2. +1
              8 September 2016 22: 49
              Quote: Alex777
              The power of the cartridge is determined by the amount of gunpowder IMHO.

              I certainly respect the opinions of others, but the power of the cartridge is determined by the Joules, and not by a weight of gunpowder hi
              And this is definitely not IMHO, but an established fact.
              And the fact that our industry cannot master the production of high-energy propellants in any way does not justify the existence of an "extra" cartridge in the line of pistol calibers (yes, I am for unification, we are not that rich).
              The media have been reporting to us for several years about supposedly new and innovative gunpowders, and if it’s not a duck, I see no reason to continue using the aforementioned 9x21 - all its characteristics are easily repeated in the dimensions of the sleeve and bullet 9x12 Para.
              1. 0
                9 September 2016 10: 07
                Some cartridges already use liquid propellant charge instead of gunpowder. Energy is mad. And what, everyone to switch to such?
                As one friend of mine says, in a difficult moment it is better to have a knife in each hand for 10000 rubles than in one for 20000 rubles.
                1. 0
                  17 November 2016 04: 47
                  Quote: Alex777
                  Some cartridges already use liquid propellant charge instead of gunpowder. Energy is mad.

                  and imagine using them in the Arctic, in the jungle or in the desert .... It will freeze or not, issues of expansion of the sleeve when the temperature changes, internal and external corrosion resistance, resistance to the occurrence of weak currents in the electrolyte arising from changes in the physical conditions of use and storage
                  1. +1
                    17 November 2016 13: 37
                    So I am for proven and not the most advanced solutions for the army.
                    As a result - 9x21 - a very good cartridge IMHO.
                    And let the state guard use high-tech cartridges. hi
              2. 0
                17 November 2016 04: 38
                Quote: psiho117
                And the fact that our industry cannot master the production of high-energy powders in any way

                cotton is the basis for gunpowder, but where did you see it? in the days of the ussr, cotton was supplied by uzbekistan and turkmenist, where are they ..... they just developed and launched a new line of powder powder
          2. 0
            13 September 2016 11: 40
            Did you decide that the couple allows you to do the same? Probably the Israelis were dumber than you when you developed the 9X21IMI cartridge, which was taken as the basis when developing the cartridge for this gun!
            1. 0
              17 November 2016 04: 50
              Quote: Dinko
              Perhaps the Israelis were dumber than you when they developed the 9X21IMI cartridge which was taken as a basis when developing the cartridge for this gun!

              do not forget that in addition to pistols there are also submachine guns and in the same sleeve under them you can modify the cartridge
      3. +1
        8 September 2016 10: 37
        Well, if the development pistol of the early 90s, this is a look into the future ...
  5. +1
    7 September 2016 08: 15
    It’s interesting, but the police, PPS, DPS, ESD and district police officers will continue to walk with Makar? Of course I’m not complaining, the gun is excellent for its tasks, but ....
    1. +1
      7 September 2016 11: 04
      And this question has a million comments. Each service would be good to have a highly specialized weapon. No problem. Where is Zin's money? (C) DPS with AKSU is a prime example. He from AKSU will beat on the pursued car?
      1. +1
        7 September 2016 17: 11
        AKS-74U in the traffic police because "you need to equip something, just nothing." But in my opinion, the best option is like the police in the USA. Each person has a pistol, plus a smooth-bore gun with special ammunition and a self-loading carbine for the crew.
        1. 0
          17 November 2016 04: 52
          Quote: the47th
          AKS-74U in the traffic police because "you need to equip something, just nothing."

          what does it mean nothing? we have cedars, cypresses, chestnuts, heathers .... - take and stamp
          1. 0
            17 November 2016 09: 44
            He talked with some militiamen who fought in Chechnya, all of them have an extremely low opinion (to put it mildly) about the Cedars and Cypresses, but they did not see Chestnuts and Heathers in the eye. They walked with the AK-74 and AKS-74. And I believe that in their daily activities in patrols, automatic weapons are not needed at all, only self-loading.
            1. 0
              24 November 2016 23: 59
              Now every second "evil bearded man" AK, but of course the police don't need him.
              1. 0
                25 November 2016 09: 22
                Evil bearded men must be fought by specially trained people who should have good weapons, and not ordinary PPS nicknames and DPS nicknames.
      2. +3
        7 September 2016 21: 15
        The police need a compact pistol with a plastic frame and a large magazine. Ideal - S&W MP9 or Glock-19. As a replacement for the AKS-74U submachine gun, you can offer the CP-2 "Veresk" or small-sized submachine guns SR-3 "Whirlwind" / 9A91 chambered for 9x39 mm. The bullet of this cartridge is capable of penetrating a bulletproof vest or car body and does not give strong ricochets.
  6. +5
    7 September 2016 08: 18
    Quote: Maki Avellevich
    As I do not collect, it turns out a Kalashnikov assault rifle. that is, PM, Ugh! Walter.. wink

    It is necessary to collect more carefully, Walter means, as I understand it, PPC, the only way to disassemble the PM is with the PM, and then, he was not invented by Walter wink
  7. +2
    7 September 2016 08: 24
    Quote: BARKAS
    The gun has two automatic fuses that monitor the correct grip of the weapon and the pressure on the trigger.

    The correct grip of the weapon is certainly good, but if it doesn’t work out, the first one needs to be fired ?!

    Duc was originally wrapped with insulating tape on the handle, it was self-cocking, pulled out, pulled-shot
  8. +7
    7 September 2016 08: 29
    The practical range of a pistol is 20 meters. The real one is up to 10. On horseradish, to say that the aiming is up to 100? Like, a bullet will fly and hit the target? Well, it’s amazing if it is a growth target, and not an enemy. But what's the point?
    This is the same as with a gun - sighting range of 1000 meters. And did someone get from Kalash to the enemy at least 600 meters? Only in the target at the shooting range.
    1. +5
      7 September 2016 09: 35
      Yeah. Shoot your pistol 100 meters! It will be almost like a quote from "In August XNUMX": "He didn't even shoot at me, but in my direction."
      1. +3
        7 September 2016 10: 30
        At training firing from the Bulgarian PM hit targets at a distance of over 100 meters. But that was test shooting. In a shootout further than 10 meters, it is often better not to peel, especially if the enemy maneuvers or hides.
    2. +2
      7 September 2016 10: 55
      Plus. On chest on 25 m. Got (ten-eight) single. I had an APS, it is heavier than the PM, the recoil doesn’t hit that well. I tried on automatic fire - the first bullet in 9-ku, the second to the edge of the growth target, the rest into space. They didn’t shoot at 10 meters.
    3. +3
      7 September 2016 13: 56
      For good shooters, such an aiming range will not be superfluous, especially since the 9x21 cartridge allows it to be used. And if you shoot no more than 20 meters, then do not "cut" the same characteristics of the weapon.
    4. 0
      7 September 2016 16: 12
      I’m sure hit, but by accident! What an enemy 600 meters from Kalash, only hit a target at a training range of 25%, but the enemy will not stand! And if you hit PMa 20-30 meters, then you are a great shooter!
    5. +1
      7 September 2016 21: 55
      Quote: erased
      On horseradish claim that the sighting is up to 100?

      Because the aiming range of 100 m. The truth is easy and pleasant to say.
    6. 0
      17 November 2016 04: 56
      Quote: erased
      The practical range of a pistol is 20 meters. Real - up to 10

      my company from PM laid nursing for 120 m. Everything rests on the skill-work on the base and you will be William Tel
  9. +3
    7 September 2016 09: 05
    Clumsy made, heavy and bulky gun. I can understand the interest in him from the special services because of the high energy of the cartridge, but why should the army team carry such a piece of iron? State requirements In my opinion, it’s time to test the gun tests for a long time in the direction of mitigation, no one has been shooting from the trenches for a long time, there is another weapon for this. Mitigating the requirements will allow adopting modern ergonomic, lightweight and accurate pistols like Lebedev (PL) or Swift.
    1. +2
      7 September 2016 10: 59
      I think it's time to remove the gun from the army. Replacing their PP with something like an ultrasound.
      1. +3
        7 September 2016 14: 42
        The controversial issue is whether the army needs a pistol or not. As the main weapon (for mechanized drivers, gun crews, etc.) - I think it's not relevant, for this role it is better to PP. But as a secondary weapon, even very much, especially if we are talking about a professional contract army. Possible options for the use of a pistol by a soldier are to destroy / scare away the enemy in the event that the magazine in the machine is used up. pulling out a pistol is faster than changing the magazine. Of course, this option works only at close distances, and again depends on the training of the shooter. The second option is to clean up buildings and other "confined" spaces.
        1. +1
          8 September 2016 19: 50
          Well, yes, in the main campaign the pistol serves as the last argument to the officer in two cases - the first when sabotaging, the second when exposing the spouse in infidelity.)) Nowadays, there is no need to run the company in front of the company screaming for Stalin with a gun, to value life there were a bit more commanders.
    2. 0
      17 November 2016 05: 01
      Quote: Slon1978
      Clumsy made, heavy and bulky gun. I can understand the interest in it from the special services because of the high energy of the cartridge, but why should the army team

      officers’s standard weapons, right up to the battalion commander, are Kalashnikov’s, and the gun is like a dagger near the sea (to the very edge)
      1. 0
        25 November 2016 00: 06
        Yes Yes. If there is a chance to clash in short, then I would prefer not one "clumsy manufactured", but even two. And the weight of the "piece of iron" is not very embarrassing, but the soul is calmer.
  10. +5
    7 September 2016 09: 10
    Attention is drawn to the "rough" external finish and disgusting quality bluing and oxidation. My good old "Makarov", which was in my service, produced back in 1963 and passed not "only hands", looked much better than this type of "newest" weapon, in any case it did not have such worn out " bluing ".
    1. +1
      7 September 2016 10: 42
      Much depends on the conditions of use. I took my personnel APS from weapons only for cleaning. He still has a perfect look, I guess.
    2. +2
      7 September 2016 12: 48
      Attention is drawn to the "rough" external finish and disgusting quality bluing and oxidation. My good old "Makarov", which was in my service, produced back in 1963 and passed not "only hands", looked much better than this type of "newest" weapon, in any case it did not have such worn out " bluing ".
      Glocks too quickly scratch and overwrite
  11. +8
    7 September 2016 10: 05
    Quote: Monster_Fat
    Attention is drawn to the "rough" external finish and disgusting quality bluing and oxidation. My good old "Makarov", which was in my service, produced back in 1963 and passed not "only hands", looked much better than this type of "newest" weapon, in any case it did not have such worn out " bluing ".

    I fully agree - I had a PM of 1961 wink
  12. +2
    7 September 2016 10: 08
    the mass production of the new pistol and the delivery of finished products to the troops can begin as early as next year. To achieve such success, the perspective CP-1MP pistol needs to pass the final test phase and interest the customer in the person of the Ministry of Defense.

    A masterpiece, not an article.
    A ton of advertising about the well-known pistol, nothing new from 90, and as a result, it remains for the customer to like it. So do the TK of this customer and you will be happy.
    Or TK was not given, go in it something else is written? request
    Sincerely, colleagues.
  13. 0
    7 September 2016 10: 12
    - As long as there are no intelligible methods for the preparation of pistol shooters in the Army, all these developments are in the box ...
    - Even if you search through the Network, there are hardly a dozen articles about using a pistol in the Army, in battle ... I have not heard about their use in Syria or Ukraine.
    - At us, leaving on guard, the nachkar and the assistant left pistols in the safe, and went with AK guards from the resting shift.
    - If the approach to the use of a pistol in battle is not revised in the Army, any most successful development is a piece of iron ... It may be worth replacing the pistol with PDW (personal defense weapon) ...
    1. 0
      7 September 2016 10: 33
      The gun in the modern army has already outlived itself as a military weapon. All carry machine guns or submachine guns (if you need to have small-sized weapons). Again, it’s easy for a sniper to calculate an officer from a pistol holster. My opinion is that the gun is a weapon of police and citizens, but not an army one.
      1. +8
        7 September 2016 10: 55
        Don't tell. For me personally, it was the gun that saved my life. The fact is that it is not always and not everywhere a submachine gun or submachine gun is convenient to take, especially in the "front-line" zone, where there seem to be no "real" "military actions", but you can always, so to speak, "run into". This is the first thing. Secondly, the pistol is convenient in close combat, in hand-to-hand combat, in confined space combat, etc. The pistol itself is your "last line of defense".
        1. +1
          7 September 2016 11: 19
          - Only here in the Army, en masse, no one teaches this - they carry this "piece of iron" as a symbol of being in the service ...
          - It is understandable - to stir up such a colossus is not easy, and the pistol, all the same, is a secondary weapon for the military.
          - But there is a real opportunity to practice the techniques! Take the very same NGOs to train the guards. Thousands of people go through them every month! And all the preparation - at the expense of the students! The state does not spend a dime! It is enough to organize the collection of information on the results of training and applied methods ... If there were a huge number of training centers, during the year it was possible to develop an adequate training system ... But, either laziness, or no one needs ...
      2. +2
        7 September 2016 10: 59
        “Perhaps ... but so far no army in the world has refused the pistol ...”
        - And, (stereotypes work) wink it will be strange to see a duty officer on a regiment or a checkpoint with an automatic rifle behind him ... it's almost a war!
        “A gun as a ritual weapon?” Like a dagger, or a saber of an assistant standard bearer?
    2. +3
      7 September 2016 16: 20
      In your unit, the commander and assistant, rudely violated the UGiKS! If you raise the guard, your commander and assistant will safely go to the tribunal!
      1. 0
        7 September 2016 18: 44
        - It's unlikely ... Already. And, I would be back at that time - even under the threat of a tribunal! request
    3. 0
      17 November 2016 05: 04
      Quote: saygon66
      As long as there are no intelligible methods for training pistol shooters in the Army, all these developments are in the box ...

      the methodology is being worked out for the sample is the principles of training and improving the skill. How will you learn to fly on a broomstick if it is not already
  14. +8
    7 September 2016 10: 59
    Quote: Andrey77
    Much depends on the conditions of use. I took my personnel APS from weapons only for cleaning. He still has a perfect look, I guess.

    I don’t know how intensively my PM was used before me, but with me: twice a week training firing (firing range / shooting range), followed by cleaning plus a day after two - a guard (rested in a holster). Appearance - as if yesterday from the assembly line.
  15. +2
    7 September 2016 11: 47
    Carry almost 1 kg on the belt. Is it possible to make parts out of composites?
    1. +6
      7 September 2016 16: 08
      Quote: Prince of Pensions
      Carry almost 1 kg on the belt. Is it possible to make parts out of composites?

      Composites and polymers are not used in systems with a powerful cartridge. And SP-10 (9x21) is a powerful cartridge.
      1. +2
        7 September 2016 20: 47
        Glock 20 chambered for 10mm Auto. looks at you with bewilderment. At the same time, the 10mm Auto cartridge in the weakest version is more powerful than the SP-10 by a minimum of 130-150J.
    2. +4
      7 September 2016 21: 25
      Polymers are not good friends with freezing temperatures. Glock could not pass our standard tests for small arms precisely because of cracking plastic in the cold. The army pistol must have a frame of steel or other durable alloy.
      1. 0
        7 September 2016 21: 45
        The Bundesians of the HK USP do not "cough".
        1. +8
          8 September 2016 09: 05
          Quote: BORMAN82
          The Bundesians of the HK USP do not "cough".

          So they used N & K-36 until recently and did not "cough" ...
      2. +7
        8 September 2016 09: 03
        Quote: mr.redpartizan
        Polymers are not good friends with freezing temperatures. Glock could not pass our standard tests for small arms precisely because of cracking plastic in the cold. The army pistol must have a frame of steel or other durable alloy.

        I subscribe to every word! I wrote specifically about army pistols.
        The Bundesians of the HK USP do not "cough".

        There is no need to compare US SOCOM and the meadows with the army - the tasks are too different ...
        PS mr.redpartizan - respect, comrade drinks
        1. 0
          8 September 2016 10: 02

          There is no need to compare US SOCOM and the meadows with the army - the tasks are too different ...

          You haven’t messed up anything - the Bundeswehr is an army.
          Regarding the peremptory statement of the respected bouncyhunter about the fact that: "pistols for powerful cartridges are not made with a polymer frame", I recommend looking at the power of 9para + P + cartridges, it is not much inferior to the "racially correct" 9 * 21, while the haunted Glocks digest it regularly.
          1. +6
            8 September 2016 10: 28
            You haven't messed up anything - the Bundeswehr is the army

            Dear Boris! Let me ask you a couple of questions: did you shoot a pistol? If so, from which ??? And about your post on Bundeswehr - it’s not necessary to equalize ... It’s fraught, you know ...
            1. +1
              8 September 2016 13: 28
              In a dash at the Ministry of Internal Affairs I have the opportunity to shoot from PM and MC. The main shot from the MC about 200-250 rounds per month. With PM occasionally, since the cost of ammunition is not conducive to increased firing. If it’s not a secret, what does my experience of shooting from a pistol have to do with the comparison between the Bundeswehr and the police (I must say that it was not me who started comparing.)
              Yes, and what the comparison is fraught with, I ask you to clarify.
              Sincerely, Boris.
          2. +1
            8 September 2016 17: 06
            The use of a longer sleeve compared to 9x19 mm PAIR gives more opportunities for cartridge modernization. In the future, it is possible to create a cartridge with a sub-caliber bullet.
  16. 0
    7 September 2016 13: 28
    Centennial chisel with terrifying ergonomics
  17. +4
    7 September 2016 15: 47
    Quote: Slon1978
    Clumsy made, heavy and bulky gun. I can understand the interest in him from the special services because of the high energy of the cartridge, but why should the army team carry such a piece of iron?

    Weight without loaded magazine - 900 g, Makar weighs 850 g. For 50 grams it became "heavy and bulky"?
    Ridiculously simple.
    PM and in the 80s did not differ in quality. One PM fell into our sea water - despite drying and cleaning for several days, it became completely unusable and was decommissioned. And the AK-74 rusted simply from the sea air.
    1. +6
      7 September 2016 16: 22
      C'mon, I haven’t heard such nonsense yet! Listen, have you tried to clean and lubricate your weapons?
  18. 0
    7 September 2016 18: 34
    He may be good, but his eyes are not happy ... sad
    1. 0
      8 September 2016 20: 09
      And he should not ... he should serve without complaints.
      And, it seems, it was to him - there were no special complaints.
      Yes, make him a polymer frame and a 9mm Para caliber and take it easy, because it’s fully working automation, and has already been tested with time.
      Haven't you gotten a taste of "new and unparalleled" frankly raw samples of pistols?
  19. +3
    7 September 2016 20: 37
    Quote: igorka357
    C'mon, I haven’t heard such nonsense yet! Listen, have you tried to clean and lubricate your weapons?

    Wow, wow - "clean and lubricate weapons" ... Did you carefully read what I wrote? If you don’t want it, don’t believe it, I can’t show only that hardware. Perestroika weapons, set in southern Vietnam.
    1. 0
      7 September 2016 20: 45
      - In our unit, several officers and midshipmen served in Kamran Bay ...
      - They said that to prevent corrosion, the machine was wrapped with copra soaked in engine oil ... it seemed to help.
  20. +4
    7 September 2016 21: 34
    ATP is powerful, ergonomic, has no sharp corners. I consider automatic fuses a drawback, especially on the handle. For safety, it is enough for safety to have a dual-action trigger with a lever for safe trigger release and a pointer to the presence of a cartridge in the chamber. The self-cocking force itself is a safety measure against an accidental shot. The pistol does not need a separate fuse and can even let the arrow down in a stressful situation.
  21. The comment was deleted.
  22. 0
    8 September 2016 01: 10
    Why make some kind of idiotic adapter for PBS, as in the photo? Is it really impossible to do like HK USP or like APS?
  23. 0
    8 September 2016 11: 23
    Fastening the pads to fasten the body kit is a ridiculous idea.
    The return spring around the barrel is also an unpleasant moment, especially with intensive shooting.
    The tilt of the handle is small, probably the legacy of the idea that reliable supply of cartridges is more important than convenience.
    Cartridge 9x21 is by no means our invention - there are several varieties on the market.
    The fact that a core hardened into a bullet is inserted is not bad.
    The result is archaic, ugly, difficult to modify - nifiga magical.
    And for a hundred meters to shoot and hit is quite possible.
    1. 0
      8 September 2016 20: 02
      Quote: nasiliev

      The result is archaic, ugly, difficult to modify - nifiga magical.
      be that as it may - this is our only more or less modern domestic model, from which users do not spit without exception (there is also Berdysh, but there are too few of them in total).
      The rest of the samples have not been tested by operation, you will find hundreds of angry reviews about the PYa or GSh, but about Gyurza / SP-1 - somehow silence, except for "heavy" and "wrap a pimp with electrical tape" - somehow there are no more complaints ...
  24. +2
    8 September 2016 23: 52
    At all times, the gun was a melee weapon. Shooting at 100 m - this option is acceptable at the shooting range in the presence of a heap of ammunition, not a combat situation. what are the options for using a pistol in the army? (not talking about the police, special forces, cool, etc.). I apologize, in terms of the implementation of the BZ in the mountainous-wooded area, they walked mostly under a bush? With a gun this is very inconvenient, with a gun - just right. And when working in the city, a short barrel is also necessary, it’s inconvenient to automatically climb the rooms with a machine gun, and submachine guns are also not enough for all fighters. I can’t say anything about the 9X21 cartridge, but 9X19 cartridges are not bad at all, 7N21 in particular, even the 3rd-class bulletproof vest does not pierce, but otherwise not bad, not bad. Yes and no need to shoot a pistol at an armored target.
    1. 0
      17 November 2016 05: 13
      Quote: pavlikakapavlik
      the gun was a melee weapon. Shooting at 100 m - this option is acceptable at the shooting range in the presence of a heap of ammunition, not a fighting situation

      Yes, well, you see your orderly extra. brings to you, and the meaning of the words, I'm empty, does not suit you
  25. 0
    9 September 2016 07: 51
    and what for in the army a gun? what should they do?
    1. 0
      9 September 2016 09: 22
      How what for? And to crack nuts? And hammer in a nail if there is no hammer at hand? A cigarette if there are no matches and a lighter? The pistol in this case is an irreplaceable thing ...
    2. +1
      9 September 2016 10: 48
      The gun is a personal weapon of attack and defense, designed to defeat the enemy at short distances, no matter how trite it may sound
    3. +1
      11 September 2016 10: 04
      and what for in the army a gun? what should they do?
      To emphasize the status of an officer and not to carry an assault rifle during exercises. Well, shoot the unfaithful wife / chop nuts.
    4. 0
      17 November 2016 05: 17
      Quote: Perseus
      and what for in the army a gun? what should they do?

      work in urban conditions, personal self-defense weapons for military units of a number of military specialties ......
  26. +1
    9 September 2016 17: 39
    Why would a pistol under such a powerful cartridge muffler?
    1. 0
      13 September 2016 11: 51
      A muffler needs a special subsonic cartridge and not that powerful one.
    2. 0
      17 November 2016 05: 19
      Quote: martin-159
      Why would a pistol under such a powerful cartridge muffler?

      and you try to work even pm in a closed volume ....
  27. RRR
    0
    22 October 2016 15: 20
    It was even pleasant to read people who used pistols in the army. Everyone has their own practical opinion. And how funny they looked against their background "sofa ananics".
    Guys! WRITE!
    And to be honest - here is a simple competition between design bureaus - everyone wants to surprise and get money (a lot).
  28. +2
    26 October 2016 19: 47
    "The history of weapons is the main base on which creative thought in the field of weapons technology can grow" -Griner.
    So, the principle of locking the "Vector" is from Walter R-38, but instead of two compact and non-heated return springs on the sides of the frame, a voluminous spring is "patented" on the thin-walled barrel (when shooting with such a powerful cartridge), which is guaranteed " will sit down "and will cause delays when sending the cartridge into the chamber, then it is worth moving the spring under the barrel, this will provide it with a more acceptable temperature regime, and you can work freely with diameters, sections, the number and configuration of return springs - there is generally a wide range of design solutions opens, up to perversions, such as LCC in the guide tube or pneumatic (hydro) brake rollback-rollback? And with the "automatic ramming of the cartridge" when replacing the store, haven't you "played enough" in the first "Makarovs" so as not to step on the same sad "rake" again ?!
    Yes, and "tracking automatic fuses" of this type in army weapons are of very dubious value, although, perhaps, VIP guards like them? IMHO-fuse should be non-automatic, in the "PR" position, providing locking of the shutter casing, striker-striker and safe trigger release, in the "OG" position allowing self-cocking and with preliminary cocking of the trigger by hand, as in "Makarov", all other functions (including blocking the drummer's body until a certain moment of pressing the trigger) will be superfluous for an army pistol - in a combat situation, a pistol is usually worn with a cartridge in the chamber and a trigger pulled, with a fuse in the "OG" position, ready for immediate self-cocking. .. By the way, about the self-cocking something that is implemented in the trigger "Vector" - "self-cocking from the trigger pre-cocking" - is this really a self-cocking, what should it be?
    The Tokarev-style decision to place the mainspring inside the trigger is considered disastrous - this misfire "good" was overeat in the war by the tank-infantry operators of the standard TT, and for this reason, too, who strove to change it to more reliable captured pistols. But for "Tokarev" such a constructive decision was forced due to the blockiness of the trigger and the initial (TT arr. 1930) imitation of the "tracking automatic fuses" of Browning pistols, although the designer refused the "tracking back" in the TT model 1933, but the overstressed mainspring left there ...
    It is unclear how reliable the jaw clips are during operation, how efficient and durable the mini-guides of the shutter are visible in the back of the frame ...?
    The shape of "Vector" and its individual parts speaks eloquently to me about the technological difficulties of manufacturers and about the fact that the designers "consulted" with anyone, but not with direct army "users" of pistols ?!
    Shl Personally, I think an army pistol should be designed for the widespread cartridge 9x19 Pair, especially since the Russian defense industry produces good armor-piercing bullets for these cartridges, and in war there will be no problems with replenishing the ammunition with captured ammunition wink !
  29. 0
    17 January 2017 23: 45
    I don’t know how he shoots, but there is no desire to take him in his hand, he’s a kind of clumsy chtoli ... He shot a lot of things, and this one, when he first saw it, he somehow immediately compared it with a macar, and thought - it’s so prettier .
    I am not going to impose my opinion on anyone, but all my life I have been guided by the saying of A.N. Tupolev - "ugly planes do not fly well", and this device, in my opinion, is a so-so flyer, and he was given non-standard cartridges, that is, if something happened, you will still look ...
    More like a concept.
  30. 0
    22 January 2017 20: 39
    It is strange that such a good gun and without an optical sight. Even in the Middle Ages, crossbows with optical sights could be seen, as shown in the documentary Hollywood and K-00.

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