"United Russia" - armored train of the White Guard

The fate of our country is amazing. At the beginning of the century, liberals and Bolsheviks, foaming at the mouth, argued that "the country is heading for the abyss," "people are starving," but ... the data of assigned commissions clearly showed that the growth, weight and muscle mass of recruits grow from year to year. But on the other hand, every fifth person received criminal experience, and there was also a high percentage of syphilis and juvenile prostitutes. That is, there were ... problems in the social sphere. But Russia had the largest fleet of motor ships in the world, although it lagged behind in the field of technology in many other ways. Then there was a “revolutionary zigzag”, well, just according to George Orwell: the tops went bad, lost their grip and could not be held where they were. And then representatives of the middle class went to representatives of the lower, who worked hard, did not have knowledge, but in which naive hopes for justice and dreams of a “better share” roved, and told them: “We know how to fulfill your dreams!” they themselves became superior, some lower ones made their way into the “red professors”, the “red engineers” and the “Stalinist commissars”, but on the whole, the improvement of their lives remained in the hands of ... scientific and technological progress. Otherwise, there would be a completely different flag flying over the Kremlin today, and the parties in our country would also be completely different ... By the way, about the parties. The leader among them (I don’t know for good or for bad) is the United Russia party. But ... that was the name of the famous armored train of the White Guards. So ... we can say that, at least through the years, and let them be purely nominally won! Well, and the fate of this armored train is also interesting in its own way, and it is worth getting to know it in more detail.

"United Russia" - armored train of the White Guard

United Russia, under Tsaritsyn, June 1919.

And it was like this that after the stubborn fighting of 1 July 1918, the White Guards took the station Tikhoretskaya, and this was a major railway junction where evacuation of property from Ukraine was carried out, which was handed over to the Germans and Austrians. On the basis of captured trophies, and among them were cars, and locomotives, sheet metal, and armor, and the first heavy armored train of the Volunteer Army, which was first called the “ranged battery”, was built. Then she was given the name 5 Armored Train, but it somehow didn’t sound, and at the end of 1918, it was called United Russia. With a clear allusion to the theory of "non-determinism", zealously supported by General Denikin. Its essence was that it was necessary first to restore Russia in its original form, and only then decide what and how. He was a fool, God forgive me, speaking with this slogan after Lenin gave independence to Poland and Finland, and the slogan about the rights of nations was universally declared by the Bolsheviks. Well, who then would want to start all over again? Nobody supported Denikin then: neither the Highlanders, nor the Cossacks, nor the Finns, nor the Poles!

But the flag of an armored train. And where do we see it now? So, sooner or later, but a higher social organization overcomes the less high. In China, the Genghisids lasted, it seems, for two centuries? And then just 74 year, four years longer than the lives of two generations, because sociologists consider the century a conditional lifetime of three generations. And now this flag is flying over the Kremlin ...

Armored train turned out just cool! Wikipedia reports that it was armed with two 105-mm guns, one 120-mm and 47-mm cannon, which was a significant fighting force. However, it should be noted that in Russia there were no 105-mm guns as such, they were 107-mm, reground from Japanese 105-mm and "four-inch" guns from destroyers that had a 102-mm caliber. So, most likely, these were precisely these guns, taken from destroyers of the Novik type. As for the 120-mm, then there were guns of this caliber of the Obukhov plant and the firm Vikkers. In any case, judging by the photos, these were long thumb guns, which means sea or coastal. That is, the armored train was armed very well, the guns on it were long-range, so it is not surprising that whites used it as a fire ram in the directions of the main attack.

Typically, an armored train of this type had as many armor sites as there were heavy guns on it. And still to it clung the carriage sheathed by bulletproof armor for the team. United Russia also had a combat armored car with two machine-gun turrets on the roof and six on-board machine-gun installations. That is, on the board, he could fire immediately from five machine guns!

"United Russia" twice participated in the capture of Armavir, and also participated in the attack on the city of Stavropol. It is interesting that so many armored trains, both white and red, came together in a hot fight, the railway tracks were so often blown up here, that at the end of the Civil War this section remained not restored. In August, the armored train was damaged, and its mechanic was killed and his commander, Colonel Skopin, was injured.

But the inside of a single machine-gun armored car that operated in Ukraine in the area of ​​Dnipropetrovsk in 1918. Cramped, of course, but how many "maxims" and even one "Colt"!

After the repair, two armored platforms with even more powerful 152-mm naval guns of the Kane system appeared at the armored train. Installations, as before, were tumbovymi. The gun in the center of the site, and in front and behind the U-shaped armor cover for ammunition and calculation. However, because of the strong recoil, the armored train could not shoot through the beam. That is, he had, of course, supports on which the ground could be supported when firing. But to install them was a troublesome job, depriving the armored train of mobility. Therefore, they tried not to use. That is, to shoot so that the guns would have only a small “course angle” in relation to the railway line, otherwise there could be “troubles”. The ideal was shooting from a radial branch, on which the "armored car" cruised back and forth, but this did not happen often.

Armored train "White Czech" "Orlik", who fought in Siberia. Had two tower installations with 76,2-mm guns and 10 machine guns on each armored car.

Already at the beginning of 1919, the repaired "United Russia" participated in heavy positional battles, and then supported the rapid attack of the Denikin army in the Donets Basin with its fire.

Then, “United Russia” was sent to support part of General Wrangel in the Tsaritsyno direction in order to connect with the troops of Admiral Kolchak. It was here, near Tsaritsyn, that the white armored trains were especially active. Moreover, in conjunction with tanks and armored vehicles, and the Reds used them together with the Volga’s armed steamers flotilla. Later, Wrangel recalled that his regiments were dressed in brand new English khaki uniforms and metal helmets ... Heavy artillery of armored trains was used very actively, as well as tanks ... also English. And in 1919 the whites managed to take Tsaritsyn, which they could not do a year earlier, and among the trophies they even captured two red armored trains with the non-original names “Lenin” and “Trotsky”. And United Russia was transferred to a new direction, to Moscow.

The “Officer” armored train belonged to “light type” armored trains, as it had 76,2-mm guns in service.

General Denikin, commander-in-chief of the White Armed Forces of the South of Russia, who published the so-called “Moscow directive” on the march on Moscow, already considered himself “the savior of Russia and the second Minin”. But ... he forgot that success lies in striking from different directions. He turned to the Poles and ... they did not support him, on the contrary, they assured the Bolsheviks that they could not worry. The Finns were also inactive, so his blow turned out to be much easier than he could have been ...

White Guard recruitment poster.

On the night of September 20, the United Russia armored train and the Officer light armored train broke straight into the Kursk city railway station and was captured, after which the Reds left the city. The days of the Bolsheviks, it seemed, were already numbered, but here, in the rear of the white armies, peasant uprisings began under the leadership of Makhno, whose 1919-thousandth army arose in October 100, literally in two weeks. Just at that time, the whites took the Eagle and approached Moscow for a minimum distance. However, it was unthinkable to go further, having a mass uprising in the rear, and the whites threw all their strategic reserves against Makhno, including the armored train United Russia. 1919 November 8 of the year under the city of Aleksandrovsk (the current name of Zaporozhye) on the left bank of the Dnieper a battle took place that greatly influenced the outcome of the civil war and, of course, Soviet historians did not mention it wisely later. Then two white cavalry and two infantry divisions, instead of attacking Moscow, along with three heavy armored trains (United Russia, Ivan Kalita and Dmitry Donskoy) launched an offensive against the peasant army of Makhno.

During the Civil War in Russia, armored trains very often changed their owners.

And he had at his disposal the chief of staff of 26-year-old Viktor Belash, a professional railroad worker with all the ensuing consequences. He understood that two improvised armored trains of the Fear could not stand up against White's long-range naval guns, showed sharpness and ingenuity.

Meanwhile, United Russia was fighting at the Sofiyivka station, supporting with its fire the 1-I Native division of the Chechen general Shkuro's cavalry corps, which had just raided the rear of the Reds in Tambov and Voronezh. Unable to withstand the disastrous fire from an armored train and Chechen attacks, the 3-th Crimean regiment, commanded by the Bolshevik Polonsky, began to retreat. And here, on the order of Belash, the Makhnovists let the Makhnovists meet United Russia, having dispersed the locomotive!

Another heavy armored train VRU.

The blow of a steam locomotive rushing under steam was of such strength that it immediately brought the armored train down and had to be urgently sent for repairs to the rear. And then the whole thing was decided to attack the whole regiment of the famous Makhnovist tachanok (700 machine guns!) With the inscription in front of the tar - “Get the fuck out!”, And in the back - “Fuck you catch up!”

But the Makhnovists did not forgive the Bolshevik Polonsky anyway. Even though he was a countryman and an old friend of Makhno himself, he was accused of trying to ... the “Bolshevik coup” in the army of the Batko and quickly shot. His beautiful wife, repulsed by Polonsky in the Crimea with some white colonel, was given to the Makhnovist commanders. Well, the outcome of all these Shakespearean passions was the departure of the Chechen cavalry to the Caucasus. True, the Makhnovists also inherited from General Slashchev, but ... "got" late, when the front near Orel and Tula had already collapsed!

For some reason, they could not repair an armored train at Yenakievo Station and 10 of December were sent to repair United Russia to Sudostal plant in Novorossiysk. But they did not have time to repair it before the escape of the whites from Novorossiysk, and the armored train, or, let's say, the fact that it was left, fell into the hands of red.

Gun platform of the Grozny armored train.

However, this armored train was then “revived” in the Crimea. It is possible that the whites managed to transport the weapons of the old armored train, and perhaps they found the guns on the spot. Anyway, he continued to fight until the very end of October 1920. And on November 1, before leaving the Crimea, “United Russia” was destroyed by a collision head-on with an armored train “George the Victorious”. On this story One of the most powerful armored trains Denikin's army over.
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  1. +6
    6 September 2016 15: 35
    Is it just about history? no reason for suspicion?
    1. +2
      6 September 2016 15: 50
      Whoever likes it, he understands this way: those who like pop, those who love poppy, and those who like popov’s daughter, said the devil, took off his underpants and sat down in the nettle!
    2. +9
      6 September 2016 15: 51
      Of course, of course, only about history. smile
    3. +22
      6 September 2016 16: 19
      Beautiful story 11 days before the election wink
      And what is most touching is how, after the surrender of Ukraine to the Germans and Austrians, the whites were taken out there and out of this, they assembled a powerful armored train, and if it were not for the Poles and Finns, who refused help and the dashing "commander" Makhno in tachanka cars, it would be necessary they would have taken both Moscow and Petrograd.
      Duc, and they took it, only then and without armored trains and completely different characters.
      But about this in the next story: "Misha and Borya are like a mirror of the Russian counter-revolution"
      So you don’t know, sometimes, to cry or laugh ...
      1. +1
        6 September 2016 18: 10
        So after eleven, not the day before ...
      2. 0
        16 March 2021 21: 58
        for the first time about the armored train "United Russia" I read about 20 years ago in the book of the lieutenant S.I. Mamontov's "Hiking and Horses". It was interesting to fight. With inspiration.
    4. +2
      6 September 2016 18: 00
      somehow very symbolic laughing
    5. +1
      6 September 2016 18: 44
      Yeah, no. Only with what "armored train" to push EP now?
      1. +2
        6 September 2016 20: 42
        up the wall to push everyone.
      2. +1
        9 September 2016 16: 55
        The Communist Party of the Russian Federation-there is no other, so small fry like Makhnovskaya and Savinkov’s ....
  2. +6
    6 September 2016 16: 59
    The armored train turned out just cool! Wikipedia reports that it was armed with two 105-mm guns, one 120-mm and 47-mm cannon, which was a significant fighting force. However, it should be noted that in Russia there were no 105-mm guns as such, there were 107-mm, regrind from 105-mm Japanese and "four-inch" guns from the destroyers, which had a caliber of 102-mm.

    In fact, in Russia there were 107 mm guns of their manufacture:
    - "42-line corps and siege cannon, model 1877" (licensed by Krupp);
    - "42-line field heavy cannon, model 1910" (developed at the Putilov plant, modified by Schneider).
    1. +1
      6 September 2016 18: 11
      Yes, there were guns. But look at the photo. They clearly 102-mm guns Obukhov plant. ! 07-mm looked completely wrong ...
      1. +1
        7 September 2016 13: 01
        For starters, the 107mm was a FIELD implement. Thanks, Cap.

        And in the photographs here, by the way, the guns are not 105 mm, not 107 mm, and not 102 mm. This is a 152 mm gun, and the pictures were taken after they were installed on an armored train instead of the previous ones, whatever they were.
    2. +1
      7 September 2016 13: 11
      The author of the article became entangled in calibers and guns, as in three pines.

      Instead of the generally accepted 105 mm caliber in the world, we have introduced a 107 mm caliber, more precisely 106,7 mm, or 42 lines.

      During WWII, faced with a shortage of virtually any weaponry, RI began to feverishly buy everything that came out abroad.

      In particular, about a dozen Japanese 105-mm Type 38 cannons were purchased (Sample 1905), regrind under Russian 107-mm ammunition.

      The result seemed good, and in 1916. 120 guns of 107 mm were ordered in Japan, i.e. 105 mm Type 38 cannons. Re-milled under Russian ammunition by the Japanese. They were delivered to Russia several. dozens since 1917.

      There were also reports for which I could not vouch for the fact that a certain number of Japanese 105-mm Type38 guns were purchased by Russia without modification, along with Japanese ammunition.

      In addition, Schneider decided to use for themselves the blanks made during the execution of the Russian order. The result was a very popular subsequently 105-mm Schneider gun arr. 1913 year. They were also bought during Russia during the WWII, some were reassigned, some were used as is.
  3. +1
    6 September 2016 17: 10

    Quote: Alexey RA
    In fact, in Russia there were 107 mm guns of their manufacture:
    - "42-line corps and siege cannon, model 1877" (licensed by Krupp);
    - "42-line field heavy cannon, model 1910" (developed at the Putilov plant, modified by Schneider).

    But is it really important, provided that the steamer is called "edro"? wassat
  4. +9
    6 September 2016 17: 29
    only 74 years old
    The capitalists lasted for the first time only half a year. And the fact that from the second attempt of the Communists will surpass this is still written with a pitchfork on the water. Also, a third of this is not rewound but already show off !!! The country and people were plundered as if they had accomplished a feat.
    1. xan
      6 September 2016 22: 35
      the Communists brought the people to the point of ruining such a country for chewing gum and jeans. In my opinion, we need socially oriented capitalism based on national forces. And now it’s more honest than in the 70s and 80s.
      1. +8
        6 September 2016 23: 02
        It was not the Communists who brought the country, but we were drained by the Cold War, the one that began immediately after World War II, if you do not suffer from sclerosis. Here, anyone would lose, only much earlier than under the Communists.
      2. +1
        9 September 2016 09: 20
        are communists? labeled, ebn, etc. your most socially oriented capitalists. speak honestly now? in the union, people didn’t die in thousands, they could both study and work, there were no collectors.
      3. 0
        12 September 2016 10: 40
        . And now it’s more honest than in the 70s and 80s. ,,
        and then, to hold the colonels under the bed of the milliards.
  5. +7
    6 September 2016 17: 45
    "United Russia" - armored train of the White Guard

    That says it all, especially before the upcoming elections ... Is it like a commercial from our past history? It is known how the "namesakes of our United Russia" suffered defeat, because they were alien to that Russia, no matter what slogans they used (although there were quite a few true patriots of Russia among them). It looks like our United Russia party will end up with the same ending (maybe not now, but soon ...) it is not for nothing that they are secretly called PP&V, especially the latest mass known criminal stories with prominent members of the United Russia party, whom Russia serves as a means of enrichment at the expense of the same Russia ...
  6. +14
    6 September 2016 17: 50
    It’s a good story, but I don’t follow the path with united Russia. Yes, and in that troubled time I would be for the Red wink
    1. +4
      7 September 2016 04: 08
      As a child, I supported the Reds, and now I hate them. Only for whites. Although I respect the communists of the Second World War, they really believed in their ideas and were patriots.
      1. +5
        7 September 2016 14: 39
        And I, as a child, for the Reds, and now against the whites of all stripes and colors. It is a pity that now the Communists have degenerated - have capitalized. Only one name from them remains. And the communists were patriots not only in the Second World War, but also during the time of the Great Patriotic War, and after the victory over Hitler. It is a pity that with the advent of corn, more and more began to take care not of the country but of their own well-being.
      2. +2
        9 September 2016 09: 24
        well, good luck with throwing. "Whites" have never been patriots - they brought the Entente colonizers to our land. and after the defeat, running away from the country, they also tried to take out everything more valuable.
  7. +3
    6 September 2016 18: 37
    And where does any name, these land cruisers, deserve to be mentioned, and it’s interesting how their fate happened, it’s not about the names, but about people who fought for armor and who are against ... And if there are any associations with edrom this is an accident, although natural ...
    1. +1
      7 September 2016 11: 43
      I agree! They made some pre-election debates in the comments ... There is another page on this site for discussions about politics, and this is the "Armament" page. Let's talk about weapons ... At the end of the 80s, in the magazine "Modelist-Constructor" I came across articles about armored trains of the Civil War with descriptions and diagrams of armored cars and armored locomotives, and with schemes of their location on the train. The topic is rarely covered (which is a pity!) And therefore I read the article with great interest.
  8. +3
    6 September 2016 19: 10
    Intriguing article. Just like a cavalry charge. Eh "boyars boyars".
    Judging by the description and photographs, in the center of Ukraine there are serious mixtures of left, right, white red green. Wedding in Robin.
  9. +11
    6 September 2016 20: 20
    Later, Wrangel recalled that his shelves were wearing brand new English khaki uniforms and metal helmets.
    .. And of course .. it was received free of charge .. that is. for nothing .. The selfless help of the Entente ... to leave Russia within its former borders and give the Dardanelles ... smile ..EP would be against the background of this article .. to slightly rework the song "Kakhovka" and make the anthem of the party ... smile
  10. xan
    6 September 2016 21: 40
    I would like to ask the author for a link to the battle between the Makhnovists and the Whites, where he dug it up. The two thousandth corps under the command of Shkuro, who had the talented Slashchev as the chief of staff, infuriated Makhno so much that Voroshilov sent a famous telegram to Moscow: "Makhno was smashed to pieces by Shkuro. Where Makhno himself is unknown, the makhnyats are asking for help and protection from the Soviet government. The Whites removed everything they could from other sectors, including Ukraine, in order to pressurize Moscow. Practically only white patrols remained against Makhno; Petliura, together with all his Svidomo army, drove a detachment of White Cossacks in only seven hundred sabers beyond Zbruch. But it did not help. The Whites rolled from under Tula and Orel, and Makhno gathered his scattered detachments and struck at the bare rear of the Whites. All this was taken by me from the modern Ukrainian book "12 Wars for Ukraine" by Savchenko. Makhno did not win a single battle with regular troops, neither white nor red. He only had successful raids. Where the victory of the Makhnovists over the Wild Division came from is not clear, it is clearly a legend.
    1. +1
      7 September 2016 12: 56
      The "wild division" were also those warriors, it seems to me a stretch to consider them regular troops.
      1. +1
        7 September 2016 18: 31
        Quote: murriou
        The "wild division" were also those warriors, it seems to me a stretch to consider them regular troops.

        It looks like you have no idea what to write about! Here, I advise you to look
        1. +2
          7 September 2016 20: 25
          Well, you found something to refer to!
          "documentary" project of Russian TV, dedicated to the praise of all White Guard units in a row! And all-all-all of them are knights without fear and reproach, aha-aha! lol

          Maybe also the film "Admiral", which is almost completely a lie, offer it as a historical reference about Kolchak? laughing

          I had to repeatedly see references to the "Wild Division" in materials about WWI and GV, and everywhere they were characterized as a crowd of savages: they willingly slaughtered a weak and demoralized enemy, but they could not withstand the battle against normally organized units and scrambled themselves, and in the rear they were constantly engaged robbery and violence.
  11. +5
    6 September 2016 22: 21
    "United Russia" - armored train of the White Guard

    How does this correspond to our time.
    Perhaps, only one thing is missing - the white pantaloons of a service person. And so, everything else has already been shaken off ... from mothballs.
    1. 0
      7 September 2016 10: 39
      Yeah ... it just wouldn’t have ended like last time:
      - Nice to go!
      - The intelligentsia ...
    2. 0
      7 September 2016 12: 54
      it remains only to shake out naphthalene and play again something like a shame in the Russo-Japanese war.
  12. +4
    6 September 2016 22: 43
    I have not believed in coincidences for a long time. All the more so. Everything is in "color".
  13. +8
    6 September 2016 23: 22
    The author is clearly not in himself. Spread this in the country of the descendants of the victorious Red Army))). It is also successful, as follows, alas, the still living trend is to shoot films with us where the most beautiful woman goes to a foreigner. The audience can and will look once, but will send it to the forest again))).
  14. +10
    7 September 2016 05: 54
    That's interesting what the Reds did to the author, maybe they robbed him in a dark alley. No, it seems to have learned under the Soviet regime. Received education, profession and title. No author needs to kick a dead lion. Please write the author about what you know, and not about red ghouls. And the passage is interesting as to how everything was perfect in tsarist Russia, and why everything would have collapsed.
  15. +2
    7 September 2016 06: 01
    Vyacheslav, bravo ... what a passage ...
  16. +3
    7 September 2016 12: 51
    The author does not suffer from an excess of literacy in military technology. Well, to rewrite a couple of articles from Wikipedia and at least compile them, maybe he succeeded. Still, trying to deal with the tools, I found a publication in LJ, from which a considerable part of the article was taken to a significant extent, especially its beginning: http://stomaster.livejournal.com/1857064.html

    Now about the guns.
    "Wikipedia reports that he was armed with two 105-mm guns, one 120-mm and a 47-mm cannon, which represented a significant combat force. However, it should be noted that Russia did not have 105-mm guns as such, there were 107-mm , re-sharpened from 105-mm Japanese and "four-inch" guns from destroyers, which had a caliber of 102-mm. So, most likely, these were precisely these guns taken from destroyers of the "Novik" class. As for the 120-mm, there were guns of this caliber from the Obukhov plant and the Vickers company. "

    The author understands little in artillery and apparently believes that the caliber is the only and comprehensive information about the gun. What else can the length of the barrel and the magnitude of the powder charge, he does not know.
    In fact, 107-mm (more precisely, 106,7 mm) guns were developed with the participation of Schneider engineers at the Putilov plant in 1910. Later, faced with a shortage of weapons in the WWII, the tsarist authorities bought up weapons anywhere, including they bought Japanese 105-mm Type38 guns (i.e., model 1905) and re-mowed them to our caliber.

    But 105mm is a very popular caliber in the rest of the world, captured or imported guns of this caliber could be - and were - in Russia in sufficient quantities. During the WWII, a number of German 105-mm howitzers were captured. 1909 and 1916, which were listed in reserve storage until the Second World War; there were Czech guns, there were Japanese ones mentioned above, some of which were never converted to the Russian caliber.

    There could be other sources. Could be including Schneider’s guns 105mmm arr. 1913 - the development, used for the Russian order, the French considered suitable for themselves. They, like the Japanese, were also bought by Russia during the WWII and also did not manage to reassign them all.

    The author, however, argues that all of the guns of the armored train were on the stand installations, i.e. of marine origin.
    But the author’s competence, judging by the passage that has already been cited, raises serious doubts.
    It is unlikely that the author crawled deeper than looking at the photographs attached to the article - and they were all made, as you can see, after replacing the 105-mm guns, whatever they were, with 152-mm guns (Kane system, production of the Obukhov plant).

    Variants are also possible with sea guns - German naval guns, for example, had 105mm caliber.
    The version of the 102-mm guns is not excluded, but it is doubtful to me that EVERYTHING that mentioned the guns of this armored train, for no particular reason, should confuse 102 mm and 105 mm.

    By the way, the author showed incompetence here too: 102-mm guns developed at the Obukhov plant with the participation of Vickers engineers and on the basis of an earlier Vickers gun of the same caliber, starting in 1910 (i.e. 2 years before they were installed on the first " Novik ") were installed on the Volunteer-class destroyers, i.e. they did not have any special ties to Novik-class destroyers. Yes, and I do not know of situations that during the Civil War "noviks" were dismantled.

    The 120mm gun is most likely the Kane system, we had a lot of them: in addition to those bought from the French, they were made according to French drawings and here. Vickers’s guns could also be - very unlikely, but not impossible.
    1. +1
      8 September 2016 11: 20
      Quote: murriou
      Variants are also possible with sea guns - German naval guns, for example, had 105mm caliber.

      And the German naval guns of 105 mm were definitely in Russia. A dozen 105-mm were removed from the Magdeburg and traveled around the ships and batteries of the BF.
      1. 0
        8 September 2016 19: 49
        You are certainly right, although it is doubtful to me that these guns hit the Baltic from the south. However, what doesn’t happen in real history ...
  17. +2
    7 September 2016 12: 57
    Quote: scorpion-sss
    As a child, I supported the Reds, and now I hate them.

    and what callus did they come to you after childhood? lol
  18. +3
    7 September 2016 13: 06
    Quote: murriou
    Quote: scorpion-sss
    As a child, I supported the Reds, and now I hate them.

    and what callus did they come to you after childhood? lol

    Probably found out that his grandfather's property had been expropriated.
  19. 0
    30 January 2017 19: 21
    The symbolic name. It may not be entirely in the subject, but it is very similar: the United Russia party is a virtual armored train of the so-called elite (bureaucrats, commerce, "creative" pseudo-intelligentsia and other opportunists) with a pseudo-patriotic bias. And this virtual armored train is waiting for the same finale.

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